E137. Downsizing your home

Downsizing isn't just about buying a smaller house. In this episode, Frank and Amelia unpack what actually makes a downsized home work, and it's rarely what people expect.

Most people planning their next move focus on bedrooms and floor plans. But Frank explains why one overlooked design detail determines whether you can comfortably stay in your home for the next twenty years, or whether you'll be forced to move again sooner than planned. We also get into the two very different types of downsizers Frank sees walk through his door, and why understanding which one you are changes everything about how you should design your next home.

Then there's the growing trend Frank says he's designing more of than people realise: granny flats, generational homes, and even some surprising living arrangements that go well beyond family. We talk about how much space you're actually allowed to build, what most people get wrong about combining living arrangements, and why designing for round-the-clock care doesn't have to mean designing something that feels like a nursing home.

Whether you're thinking about your own future, planning ahead for ageing parents, or just curious about smarter ways to use the space you've got, this episode reframes what downsizing can look like when it's done properly from the start.

Hit play to find out why the families who plan early end up with far more flexibility later, and why Frank recommends starting this conversation well before you think you need to.

Listen to the full episode now, and be sure to subscribe so you don't miss an episode. 

About us
Prime Design is a building design company locally owned and operated in Tasmania since 2004.  Our goal is to share as much valuable information as possible about the process of building design, extensions, and more. We will talk about a different topic each week. To suggest a topic you would like us to talk about contact us at info@primedesigntas.com.au

Disclaimer
The information provided on this podcast is for educational and informational purposes only and is not intended to be a substitute for professional advice, individual circumstances, or remedy. We strongly suggest you consult a qualified professional before taking any action based on the information provided in this podcast. The views, opinions, and information provided in this podcast are those of the hosts  do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of any other agency, organisation, employer, or company.  All content provided on this podcast is provided “as is” without warranty of any kind. We make no representations as to the accuracy, completeness, currentness, suitability, or validity of any information on this podcast and will not be liable for any errors, omissions, or delays in this information or any losses,  or damages arising from its use. We reserve the right to change content or delete any information provided on this podcast at any time without prior notice.

Transcript

E137. Downsizing your home

[INTRO] (0:08 - 0:24)

Hello and welcome to the Building Design, Prime Time Podcast, focused on providing valuable information for anyone looking to undertake a new build or extension project.

We'll share our tips, tricks and stories from a building designer's perspective.

[Amelia] (0:26 - 0:42)

Hello and welcome to the Building Design, Prime Time Podcast. I'm your host Amelia and once again we're joined by Frank Geskus.

[Frank] (0:42 - 0:46)

Hey Amelia, happy Friday. 

[Amelia]

Happy Friday. 

[Frank]

All right, let's jump into it.

[Amelia] (0:47 - 0:47)

Yeah.

[Frank] (0:47 - 0:48)

We're downsizing.

[Amelia] (0:48 - 0:52)

We're downsizing. We're going to talk about downsizing your home.

[Frank] (0:52 - 0:54)

Yes. So when do you think you should do that?

[Amelia] (0:55 - 1:03)

I don't know, about your age? 

[Frank]

Oh, for the record, I'm 56. 

[Amelia]

Oh, is that all?

[Frank] (1:06 - 1:08)

Oh man, I don't know where to go.

[Amelia] (1:09 - 1:12)

If I'm not back next week, everyone, you know why I've been sacked.

[Frank] (1:14 - 1:16)

Or given a stern talking to.

[Amelia] (1:16 - 1:18)

That's right. Yes, a little bit cheeky.

[Frank] (1:18 - 1:23)

But to be fair, even at 56, thinking about the future.

[Amelia] (1:24 - 1:24)

Yes.

[Frank] (1:25 - 1:39)

I haven't looked at downsizing my new house, but we are certainly thinking about making it more practical from a whole bunch of other places. We're staying there long term, but I know we'll go a smaller house probably in the next 10 years.

[Amelia] (1:40 - 1:43)

So that you can have more room for your cars.

[Frank] (1:43 - 1:44)

And other stuff.

[Amelia] (1:44 - 1:46)

Yes. All your projects.

[Frank] (1:47 - 1:49)

Yep. Maybe more whiskey bar.

[Amelia] (1:49 - 1:51)

Oh wow.

[Frank] (1:51 - 1:53)

Well, got to have your things.

[Amelia] (1:53 - 1:54)

That's right.

[Frank] (1:54 - 2:22)

And that's what we're going to talk about because when you're downsizing, there's two trains of thought that I've seen. People come to us, they want to build a normal four bedroom, two bath, three living area, double car garage and a big  ass shed and something to park the boat and the caravan because they can. That's what for them.

That's what they want to do. Then you get the other side where they literally want to downsize. They don't want a bigger house.

They don't want to have garden to maintain. They don't, they just want to go do stuff.

[Amelia] (2:22 - 2:23)

They want to travel more.

[Frank] (2:23 - 2:54)

Travel, even open a caravan, become a grey nomad, go volunteer, still working. I've seen other ones that go volunteer with great charitable organisations around the place and find great fulfillment doing that or giving back to the community, but they don't want to look after gardens. 

[Amelia]

Yes.

[Frank]

And I'm seeing it with my father-in-law and mother-in-law and they got a lot of nice manicured gardens around their house and they're in their early eighties and it's starting to get too much.

[Amelia] (2:55 - 2:56)

It does get to that point, doesn't it?

[Frank] (2:57 - 3:25)

And they're in a retirement village as well, not in assisted living. So it's really interesting going through watching them through that. And now they're rethinking things again too.

And I've seen other people, they moved closer to town. We're in Launceston, but it doesn't matter what city you are. You want to get closer to somewhere in town.

It could be near hospital shops, medical centres, your community, your church, your friends, schools, whatever you're into.

[Amelia] (3:25 - 3:26)

That's right.

[Frank] (3:26 - 3:32)

You know, it might be near where you volunteer or whatever, and it's just convenient. You walk, you don't have to drive.

[Amelia] (3:32 - 3:34)

Yeah. Makes it easy.

[Frank] (3:34 - 3:46)

And that's great for inner city living as well. You know, this doesn't change for any of this. So it's making the right choices, but there's one thing with all this that we're talking about that applies to all of them.

[Amelia] (3:46 - 3:46)

What's that?

[Frank] (3:48 - 3:49)

Accessibility.

[Amelia] (3:49 - 3:50)

That's a really good point.

[Frank] (3:50 - 4:25)

You know, from the point of, as we get older, doesn't mean we're, we stayed the same physically and you don't know what ailments, injuries, deterioration you're going to get. But if your place of your home is designed in such a way, you can stay there as long as possible before you have to go, you're forced to go to be in a home or something similar. And it's nice to be at home as long as possible.

You know, the government's pushing pretty hard on this too, because then they can have district nurses, people caring, coming, cleaning, helping and that type of stuff at minimal cost.

[Amelia] (4:25 - 4:28)

More support. 

[Frank]

More support, staying at home. 

[Amelia]

That's right.

[Frank] (4:28 - 4:35)

And for the government, it works better because they're not paying for a whole building and all the rest of it. And to be fair, who likes to be in their own little home that they know?

[Amelia] (4:35 - 4:37)

Yeah, exactly. Everyone.

[Frank] (4:38 - 4:54)

The problem is people, and I've seen this plenty of times where people have stayed in their homes for far too long. And we had Harrington Road, they help people transition from their home and they need to go to a facility and they help them transition by selling their homes, doing, you know...

[Amelia] (4:54 - 4:55)

Renovating them.

[Frank] (4:55 - 5:00)

Renovating and increase the value of it to get maximum return. It was a beautiful setup.

[Amelia] (5:01 - 5:01)

Yes.

[Frank] (5:01 - 5:12)

But that's also for people that don't, maybe don't have the family support, or they're not in the same city, state, country, and they can't support their family to be able to do all these transitional things.

[Amelia] (5:12 - 5:12)

That's right.

[Frank] (5:12 - 5:23)

And everyone should have that ability to be able to change their living circumstances, but you've got to have friends and family around you. Without that, that's really, really tough.

[Amelia] (5:23 - 5:26)

It's, yeah, it can be really overwhelming. 

[Frank]

And lonely.

[Amelia] (5:26 - 5:42)

Yes. 

[Frank]

And then potentially, if you stay too long, it becomes more difficult. Your decision's forced on you.

And a lot of times it is forced on people. And this is where talking about downsizing, start thinking sooner rather than later. Make your life easy. Try and make it an enjoyable process.

[Amelia] (5:42 - 5:43)

Yes.

[Frank] (5:43 - 5:55)

But if you want to stay, that's your choice. It's all your choice. Do whatever you like.

We're just giving you advice. Because if you can live in your house heaps more easier, less maintenance, stay in there longer, I think it's a good thing.

[Amelia] (5:56 - 6:16)

I mean, maybe thinking about this downsizing, maybe it's not even for people that are at that stage of life yet. Maybe it's just about considering those earlier accessibility options within your home when you're younger, so that you can stay in your house longer, so that you don't have to downsize as soon as you need to.

[Frank] (6:16 - 6:24)

Totally. And you plan for these things. But the problem with some of the houses, it's super expensive to do it too.

It's really tough.

[Amelia] (6:24 - 6:28)

Yeah. This day and age, it's definitely changed from 30 years ago.

[Frank] (6:28 - 6:39)

Oh, yeah. The newer houses are much better for this. And now we build a lot of these into the new homes.

The classic example is, you need to put some bars up in your bathroom, right?

[Amelia] (6:40 - 6:42)

Grab rails. 

[Frank] (6:42 - 6:45)

Grab rails. You might have a seat in there. You need to have the space to get in there.

[Amelia] (6:45 - 6:46)

That's right.

[Frank] (6:47 - 6:58)

So with the LH Livable Housing DS requirements under the National Construction Code, we have to put this into all new homes?

[Amelia] (6:58 - 6:58)

Yes.

[Frank] (6:58 - 7:03)

Big enough doors? Now, to be fair, big enough doors are great because you can get furniture through easier.

[Amelia] (7:03 - 7:04)

I agree.

[Frank] (7:05 - 7:21)

Somehow, 720 doors everywhere, 720 millimetres. And we personally, you can get away with 870 mil, we personally put in 920 millimetre doors. And I think, well, the sake of a little bit more, so what?

100 mil more, 200 mil more, great.

[Amelia] (7:22 - 7:26)

That's the difference of not having to try and stuff a couch through the door sometimes.

[Frank] (7:26 - 7:29)

Leaving your knuckle skin on the door frame.

[Amelia] (7:29 - 7:29)

Yes, that's right.

[Frank] (7:30 - 7:49)

So there are lots of benefits, even the spacing in your kitchen, your laundry, your bathroom. Bathroom is a big one, but even to get in and out of your bedroom into a bathroom. Now, you could be on a walker, you could be on crutches, you could be a knee walker, could be on a wheelchair, whatever.

Doesn't really matter. And you could just be, just think about if you get injured.

[Amelia] (7:49 - 7:50)

That's right. Yes.

[Frank] (7:50 - 8:15)

You know, and I've shared stories about that with my wife. So future-proofing your home, whether it's existing or you're going to downsize, I'd be looking at these things. Now, we've actually got on a discussion here to talk about one-level living, but I think it can actually apply for two-level because you put a lift in.

[Amelia]

That's a really good point. Yeah.

[Frank]

And there's so many choices for lifts now.

So I think the key thing is being clear what you want, and it's all your choice. If you want a big-ass house, go for it.

[Amelia] (8:15 - 8:28)

And here's a really good example. Let's say a lot of people, they like to retire down near the beach. 

[Frank]

Yep.

[Amelia]

And you want to have your really nice view of the beach. And sometimes you can't achieve that with a single-level home.

[Frank] (8:28 - 8:30)

That is 100% correct.

[Amelia] (8:30 - 8:41)

Okay. So you've got two choices. You either purchase existing, and you try and modify it to accommodate, or you find a block and then you build something new and two-story that will also accommodate.

[Frank] (8:42 - 8:46)

You know, the biggest problem with going on the coast, you're usually far away from medical.

[Amelia] (8:46 - 8:50)

Yeah, that's true. Especially here in Tassie, it's, you know, common.

[Frank] (8:50 - 9:09)

I'm sure it goes through in some of the other states as well. But it comes down to your lifestyle, where you, you know, maybe it's where your friends are, where your hobbies are. 

[Amelia]

What you love. 

[Frank]
Yeah, exactly. But consider when you downsize, not just location, but get the building right, make it comfortable. A great example of this, I've got to share a story, and I'm sorry, I'm going to throw my in-laws under the bus here.

[Amelia] (9:10 - 9:11)

Hopefully they're not listening.

[Frank] (9:12 - 9:15)

Well, they know how I feel. They needed a new car.

[Amelia] (9:15 - 9:15)

Okay.

[Frank] (9:16 - 9:21)

And I explained, look, you really want to get a small, soft-roader, you know, SUV. So it sits up a little bit higher.

[Amelia] (9:21 - 9:24)

So it's easier to get in and out of. 

[Frank] (9:25 - 9:38)

Exactly right. You know, and anyway, we went through all these possibilities of these cars. And in the end, they made a decision and they bought a Toyota Corolla. And there's nothing wrong with a Toyota Corolla.

They're a great car. 

[Amelia]

Yes. 

[Frank]

Except it's low.

[Amelia] (9:38 - 9:40)

They are quite low. Yes.

[Frank] (9:40 - 9:57)

They remembered what I said. They ignored what I said. And after a week, they understood what I said.

And they actually came back to me sheepishly and says, we made the wrong decision. And I've had this, like, helped my mum out looking for cars too. And we tried lots of cars.

It's also the size of the doors.

[Amelia] (9:58 - 9:58)

Yes.

[Frank] (9:58 - 10:05)

And it's also the rear hatch, because a lot of them go for these hatchbacks, SUVs. 

[Amelia]

Yes. 

[Frank]

Some people have problems with their arms and shoulders.

[Amelia] (10:05 - 10:06)

And lifting.

[Frank] (10:06 - 10:12)

They can't actually lift things. So you want one with a remote that opens. 

[Amelia]

The button. Yes.

[Frank]

But the problem is not all of them have a button to press it to go down.

[Amelia] (10:12 - 10:14)

That's right. That's rubbish.

[Frank] (10:14 - 10:29)

All car manufacturers, listen to this. Make sure the tailgate goes down as well for old people. Anyway, we're talking about houses though, even though I'm a car nut.

You've gotten a bit distracted there. Have a little bit. But this is all part of your living and your lifestyle.

[Amelia] (10:29 - 10:30)

It all ties in.

[Frank] (10:31 - 10:41)

You know, so there again, have a nice garage to put your car in. And it's all on the same level to go in and out of your house. And this again, that is that mobility thing.

The other thing is financial.

[Amelia] (10:42 - 10:43)

Yeah, that's a good point too.

[Frank] (10:43 - 10:44)

Running your house.

[Amelia] (10:45 - 10:47)

Yes. Maintaining it as well.

[Frank] (10:47 - 10:54)

Maintaining its fine, but also just everyday heating and cooling. If you get a more thermally efficient home, it's cost you less to run.

[Amelia] (10:54 - 10:54)

Yes.

[Frank] (10:55 - 11:08)

And it's generally a lot more comfortable. True. So those are the things to look at.

The lifestyle, we spoke about low maintenance and I highly recommend that. But some people out there are garden nuts and they just love it. Go for it.

Try and keep it on a flat piece of land.

[Amelia] (11:09 - 11:10)

Yeah, I'd recommend that.

[Frank] (11:10 - 11:20)

Yes. So you can't help when you buy stuff, you get emotional. And that's where if you have a fact sheet in front of you, you might be able to be clearer when you're looking at it.

[Amelia] (11:21 - 11:21)

That's right.

[Frank] (11:21 - 11:42)

So things to look for for easy living. Your door threshold. Make sure it's not a big step because you're going to trip over it.

So we call them these zero thresholds and nursing home sills. They're very, very flat. But with that, rain can potentially get through it because it's so flat.

So you need to have a roof over your exterior doors.

[Amelia] (11:43 - 11:43)

Yes.

[Frank] (11:43 - 11:56)

Sliding doors so the tracks are recessed in. All these things that you don't trip over. Even the difference between your carpet to your tiles, tiles to vinyl, tiles into the concrete in the garage.

You don't have big steps. Five millimetres they recommend.

[Amelia] (11:56 - 12:02)

These are all tied into the liveable housing principles.

[Frank] (12:03 - 12:14)

And they're very good. So you also want to think about some people want to entertain. Some people want to have the grandkids over.

They want to have the whole family over. That depends on the size of the building too, doesn't it?

[Amelia] (12:14 - 12:20)

It does, yes. Maybe you have family that are interstate and you want to have somewhere where they can come and stay.

[Frank] (12:20 - 12:37)

But sometimes it's not possible, you know. But these decisions you've got to make. And this is where lifestyle villages can be very good.

Certain retirement villages can be very good. But even like my mum, she went into an assisted living. Fantastic.

She's never been so social in her life.

[Amelia] (12:38 - 12:38)

Yes.

[Frank] (12:39 - 12:46)

There's happy hour every damn Friday. There's Christmas in July. There's every damn reason to have a party or a get-together. It is hilarious.

[Amelia] (12:46 - 12:48)

Often they'll have common areas and stuff.

[Frank] (12:48 - 12:49)

Oh, massive common areas.

[Amelia] (12:49 - 12:51)

Yeah, meet for drinks and chats.

[Frank] (12:51 - 13:00)

Oh, nibbles and put a barbecue on and all this. Or they all pop around each other's place for coffee on birthdays and whatnot. And it's just like, you want to head there now.

It's pretty cool.

[Amelia] (13:01 - 13:03)

Wouldn't it be nice to be retired?

[Frank] (13:03 - 13:05)

Well, I'd still be working.

[Amelia] (13:05 - 13:06)

Yeah, you would be.

[Frank] (13:06 - 13:16)

And I think a lot of people do. A lot of people do. Because that's the way they're built.

And I think that's a good thing. You know, each to their own. My mum didn't retire from being a relief teacher until she was 76.

[Amelia] (13:17 - 13:19)

She must have loved what she did. 

[Frank] (13:20 - 13:24)

Oh, she did. She just took it, you know, she just too it in her stride. She kept being asked to do it.

[Amelia] (13:25 - 13:25)

Yes.

[Frank] (13:26 - 13:36)

So, but I think this is the important thing. Whatever you do, you keep loving what you do. And you try and incorporate that into your house, whatever that may be.

Don't stop doing what you love.

[Amelia] (13:36 - 13:42)

Yeah, and I think that's one of the key takeaways of all of this is, you know, there's no right or wrong here.

[Frank] (13:42 - 13:54)

No, but planning for the future. And sometimes a designer can be really helpful with this. Because they can ask you lots of questions.

Have you considered this? Have you considered that? How long do you want to be in the house?

All these types of things.

[Amelia] (13:55 - 13:55)

Yes.

[Frank] (13:56 - 13:58)

But also you've got to consider what you're willing to give up.

[Amelia] (13:58 - 13:59)

Yeah, that's true.

[Frank] (13:59 - 14:01)

Downsizing the reality is, you've got to get rid of stuff.

[Amelia] (14:02 - 14:06)

Yeah, especially if you've come from, you know, a lot bigger house.

[Frank] (14:06 - 14:07)

Well, yeah.

[Amelia] (14:07 - 14:07)

With more storage.

[Frank] (14:08 - 14:13)

Yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, 10 cars in the garage. Caravan, boat, jet, skis, motorbikes.

[Amelia] (14:13 - 14:14)

Sounds like your place.

[Frank] (14:14 - 14:24)

Not quite. But there's plenty of case for that though. Because why wouldn't you keep caravanning for as long as you can?

Obviously, people who've got basically a silver house, they go caravanning for a couple of years.

[Amelia] (14:24 - 14:47)

The other thing I've seen a lot of is the family, the daughters, sons, whatever. They have a bigger block and they actually put a granny flat or they, you know, little unit on the back of their property if, you know, they're permitted and able to do that. And then, you know, mum and dad move in and, you know, they're a lot closer to family and there's a lot more support there.

[Frank] (14:47 - 15:03)

That's really interesting you say that because we didn't discuss this before. Because we're actually getting quite a number of inquiries on that basis. 

[Amelia]

Really?

[Frank]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. People like mums and dads coming back to Tasmania or moving to Tasmania to be closer to their kids. But they're actually granny flat.

[Amelia] (15:04 - 15:04)

Yes.

[Frank] (15:04 - 15:13)

Or part of the house gets extended for a granny flat or a separate granny flat, all those types of things. And they move in, in a sense, but they're independent.

[Amelia] (15:14 - 15:15)

Yes.

[Frank] (15:15 - 15:16)

But they're the built-in babysitter.

[Amelia] (15:17 - 15:21)

Yes, and they get family support. 

[Frank] (15:21 - 15:38)

And if you all get on great, how good is that? We're doing one at the moment. And it's actually a granny flat with a huge shed off it. So then he's still got his boat, still does his stuff.

He's got a big alfresco area. They love having the family around. He loves entertaining.

[Amelia]

Yes. 

[Frank]

Wonderful. And I love it. But they're on the property of one of his daughters and her husband.

[Frank] (15:39 - 15:42)

You know, and I just think, wouldn't that be cool? 

[Amelia]

Yeah, it's nice.

[Frank] (15:42 - 15:58)

You know, you still have your own space, still stick to your own stuff. You get together when you can. But it makes life as you're sharing the space.

And that's a really good possibility. And a lot of people are starting to look at doing it because then they don't have to go spend a gazillion dollars on a new build or a secondhand build.

[Amelia] (15:58 - 15:59)

Yeah.

[Frank] (16:00 - 16:05)

They can just move in there. And if it allows under the planning and building approvals, why wouldn't you do it?

[Amelia] (16:05 - 16:18)

I've definitely seen on a lot of project homes on the mainland that they're incorporating almost like a granny flat type of arrangement in an initial, like as part of a singular build.

[Frank] (16:18 - 16:24)

Yeah, we've actually done a few here you haven't seen. 

[Amelia]

Oh, really? 

[Frank]

Yeah, I kid you not. More than you realise.

[Amelia] (16:25 - 16:25)

Yeah, right.

[Frank] (16:26 - 16:31)

Yeah. And it makes so much sense if they all get on, let's be honest.

[Amelia] (16:31 - 16:34)

Not everyone wants to live with their parents or their in-laws.

[Frank] (16:35 - 16:49)

Exactly right. But if everyone keeps their own space and we all get together. But I think it's a very important thing of that family unit that when the parents get older, you have the younger family looking after.

[Amelia] (16:49 - 16:50)

That's right.

[Frank] (16:50 - 17:01)

You know, that's just family. 

[Amelia]

Yes. 

[Frank]

I know they drive you nuts sometimes, but you've got to look after your family.

You know, it goes both ways.

[Amelia] (17:01 - 17:02)

It does.

[Frank] (17:02 - 17:08)

And I think it's a beautiful thing because then if there's grandkids and all that with it, it's great. They learn off two sets of parents.

[Amelia] (17:09 - 17:09)

Exactly.

[Frank] (17:10 - 17:19)

And with today's day and age, we're both parents having to work. And if they're like retired or doing whatever, how good is that? Your kids get to be with your parents.

[Amelia] (17:20 - 17:22)

It's a nice thing, isn't it?

[Frank] (17:22 - 17:30)

I think so. I think it's wonderful. I think a lot can be learned from that in our society, you know, of this inclusion of the family to be able to just all work together.

[Amelia] (17:31 - 17:39)

It feels like a very European concept to some degree. Like, you know, you're Dutch, I'm, you know, Italian.

[Frank] (17:40 - 17:40)

Yep.

[Amelia] (17:40 - 17:43)

Very family orientated. 

[Frank] (17:43 - 17:51)

Oh, very much so. Yeah. Got to look after your own. So that opens up a whole possibility then of that downsizing component.

[Amelia] (17:51 - 17:52)

Yes.

[Frank] (17:52 - 17:57)

But also imagine if you've got your granny flat, you still have your friends around to do stuff and you've got your car and you rack off for six months.

[Amelia] (17:57 - 17:58)

Yeah.

[Frank] (17:58 - 18:01)

You know, it's all that flexibility, you know, and you haven't got a huge amount up in there.

[Amelia] (18:02 - 18:02)

That's right.

[Frank] (18:03 - 18:30)

So this thing is where the designers come in, you know, whether you're doing a house, renovating a house, building your house, renovating, and you're doing a granny flat or incorporating part of a house, extending a house. This is where we come into this and we can come up with a lot of good options for that. Now, we can also check for planning on that and building approval because that's all really important.

But the functionality of, you've got lots of vehicles on site now.

[Amelia] (18:31 - 18:32)

Yeah, very true.

[Frank] (18:32 - 18:48)

You know, so that has to be investigated really well from a building point of view. We do get asked a lot of people to convert sheds. 

[Amelia]

Yes.

[Frank]

Into granny flats or accommodation, which is very, very difficult. And I don't recommend you do it.

[Amelia] (18:48 - 18:50)

We have a podcast on that.

[Frank] (18:50 - 19:07)

Yes, we do. We do. We have to give people bad news a lot on those because it's very difficult to do.

But don't be discouraged. There are other ways of doing it. It's just what you think you can convert something you can't.

It's not that easy. So then you're designing for the next potentially 20, 30 years.

[Amelia] (19:07 - 19:08)

Yeah, that's right.

[Frank] (19:08 - 19:20)

You know, and I think it's a cool thing. When you, how else do you put it? Closing on the last stretch of your life.

And wouldn't it be great to be in a place where you've got support and, you know, from kids and family.

[Amelia] (19:21 - 19:22)

Oh, exactly.

[Frank] (19:22 - 19:29)

You know, but I also want to point out, why does it have to be family? Why can't it be a bunch of friends doing that?

[Amelia] (19:29 - 19:33)

I guess that's a good point. I've never heard of that before, but I mean, it makes sense.

[Frank] (19:33 - 19:52)

Well, you're building a community. So if you've got a reasonable sized house, you all have your own space. You could be granny flat, you're separated up.

But you all get together. You still do your own things. You have friends over, vice versa.

But you're pulling your resources together. Yeah, legally, you know, with all title ownership and that type of stuff. But it's living alone.

[Amelia] (19:53 - 19:54)

Oh, yeah.

[Frank] (19:54 - 19:58)

And so many people are living alone due to all sorts of circumstances.

[Amelia] (19:58 - 19:58)

Yes.

[Frank] (19:59 - 20:41)

So this is where we look at dual living homes. We've spoken about it. Now they're talking about triple living, whatever it's called.

It's basically three houses co-joined together. 

[Amelia]

Yes. 

[Frank]

What do they call it?

Trikey or something like that. Anyway, interesting idea. But I think I love the idea of community where you've got like-minded people living together.

And that could be another good downsizer. Because if you're alone, it's lonely. I know my mom, when my dad passed away, she's lonely at night, you know, by herself.

Now I'm not saying we've got to be in each other's pockets, but it's time you went out of your own space. But why wouldn't you maybe hook up with other people to be able to live in a singular place?

[Amelia] (20:42 - 20:42)

Yes.

[Frank] (20:43 - 20:49)

Yes. Interesting thought. Anyway, all of these, though, you need a designer to help you with, to go through those things.

[Amelia] (20:49 - 20:49)

That's right.

[Frank] (20:50 - 21:06)

But then you need a solicitor to be able to help you with all the legal side of things. But I've heard mums and dads doing it. They just pay for the renos and they don't care.

You know, get the granny flat on there. I've seen other ones where the kids are paying for the granny flat so they can move in and have their own independent space.

[Amelia] (21:06 - 21:12)

Yeah. Well, I guess for some of those kids, it's the only way they really get into the market and have their own space.

[Frank] (21:12 - 21:19)

Yeah, I've seen that too. Yeah, where they move out of the house and they move to granny flat and then the kids move into the house.

[Amelia] (21:20 - 21:27)

I feel like there's also been a bit more of a rise into smaller, modular, tiny-type homes.

[Frank] (21:27 - 21:36)

Yeah, look, in Tasmania, granny flat's 60 square metres. I'm pretty sure it's pretty similar around the country. They're talking about increasing it to 90 square metres.

[Amelia] (21:36 - 21:37)

I did read about that, yes.

[Frank] (21:37 - 21:55)

We'll see if that happens. But if you've got a large enough piece of land and you don't need the whole house, kids need a place, or potentially you could straddle it and you've got your granny flat at the back, do all the things you have to. You've still got your space, they move into that and they pay you off or whatever you choose to do.

[Amelia] (21:55 - 21:55)

Yes.

[Frank] (21:55 - 22:12)

I know someone who's doing that. They've got an acreage and they're able to do their own little house at the back. They went for a multi-residential because they wanted something like 120 square metres.

And they've got the house, they brought all the kids up. One of the kids, one of their children, has got like five kids struggling to get a home.

[Amelia] (22:12 - 22:13)

Yes.

[Frank] (22:13 - 22:18)

So they're moving into his family home, when he was a kid.

[Amelia] (22:18 - 22:18)

Wow.

[Frank] (22:19 - 22:21)

So they've got the space and they've got the means to do it.

[Amelia] (22:22 - 22:27)

So you can go bigger than 60, if you have a bigger block.

[Frank] (22:27 - 22:32)

But you're going through a multi-residential component then, which is a lot more complex.

[Amelia] (22:32 - 22:35)

Yes. Different rules, I think, with some things. 

[Frank] (22:35 - 23:02)

Yeah, very much so. But it could be well worth doing. We've got to be smarter in how we do this downsizing. Whether you just find a property for yourself, property for the future, for you and your kids or extended family.

[Amelia]

Or friends. 

[Frank]

Friends. As we said, there's multiple possibilities. But all of these require the legal side, as I said, but also the building designer to be able to, or architect, to be able to come up with a suitable design that's going to work and cost-effective design.

[Amelia] (23:02 - 23:02)

Yes.

[Frank] (23:03 - 23:29)

Be smart about it. But then that doesn't stop you putting up, you know, sheds, decks, carports, all that type of stuff, to make the space bigger for your granny flat. So you've got the core 60 square metres, and we did one where it had a triple garage, had a massive outdoor area.

But it's all class 10. It's not habitable. So then the core is 60, and the rest of it was, I think it was close to 150 square metres, the rest of it. It was massive. 

[Amelia]

Wow. 

[Frank]

But it's all legit.

[Amelia] (23:30 - 23:30)

Yes.

[Frank] (23:31 - 23:42)

So don't just think of a 60 square metres. Think of garage space, alfresco space, deck space, man cave, she shed, whatever you want to do. You can still do all that as well.

[Amelia] (23:42 - 23:43)

That's cool.

[Frank] (23:44 - 23:51)

Yeah. So there's all these different ideas on how you can downsize. And I recommend downsizing before you need to.

[Amelia] (23:52 - 23:54)

You don't wait till it's too late.

[Frank] (23:54 - 23:57)

Everyone does. Like, seriously, a lot of people do. You know?

[Amelia] (23:57 - 24:00)

I get it though. It's emotion. It's a lot of things.

[Frank] (24:00 - 24:01)

It is.

[Amelia] (24:01 - 24:01)

Memories.

[Frank] (24:02 - 24:09)

But downsizing is also, you need to downsize everything you own. That's the tough stuff, all these heirlooms and stuff.

[Amelia] (24:09 - 24:11)

You probably need to start that 10 years prior.

[Frank] (24:12 - 24:18)

Oh, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. How do you get rid of stuff that you really love and enjoy, but you've just got stuff?

[Amelia] (24:18 - 24:18)

Yeah.

[Frank] (24:19 - 24:19)

Can't take it with you.

[Amelia] (24:20 - 24:20)

Exactly.

[Frank] (24:21 - 24:22)

So, takeaways.

[Amelia] (24:23 - 24:23)

Yes.

[Frank] (24:23 - 24:26)

You need a designer if you want to do any of these things.

[Amelia] (24:27 - 24:27)

That's right.

[Frank] (24:28 - 24:48)

But I think you need a clear list of what you want to achieve at different stages of your life. And I understand it's going to change. Single level downsizing is a very good idea if it's designed to make your life easier, manueuvring, as we spoke about.

Two story can be done, but either has the provision or it has a lift built in. Has to.

[Amelia] (24:48 - 24:48)

Yes.

[Frank] (24:49 - 24:54)

Sharing the space with family, granny flat, down under the house or on the end of the house, or separate.

[Amelia] (24:55 - 24:55)

Yes.

[Frank] (24:55 - 25:00)

Lots of possibilities there. Or as we just said, a group home for friends.

[Amelia] (25:01 - 25:04)

Yeah. Something unique that you probably don't hear as much.

[Frank] (25:04 - 25:06)

No, but we've done generational homes.

[Amelia] (25:07 - 25:07)

We have, yes.

[Frank] (25:08 - 25:22)

Generational homes, that's a different thing again. So you've got three different generations within the home. And that's a really interesting thought as well, because you can build a really cool house and everyone has their own space.

Why couldn't that just be a friend's group home?

[Amelia] (25:23 - 25:27)

Yeah. It's like your own private nurse, not nursing home, but you know what I mean.

[Frank] (25:28 - 25:43)

But in all fairness, it could be because you could have a spare room with a bathroom and you have a carer that sleeps there. So the NDIS with a couple of the housing, they need to have someone 24 seven.

[Amelia] (25:43 - 25:44)

Yes.

[Frank] (25:44 - 25:48)

We're about to design a house for someone and they need to have a carer's room.

[Amelia] (25:48 - 25:48)

Okay.

[Frank] (25:49 - 25:57)

To sleep over because she has MS. So you've got to be smart about this. So why couldn't you do that with a group home and you've got a spare room and someone can sleep there?

[Amelia] (25:57 - 25:58)

Makes a lot of sense.

[Frank] (25:58 - 26:00)

So then you've got 24 hour care.

[Amelia] (26:00 - 26:01)

Yes.

[Frank] (26:01 - 26:02)

In your own house.

[Amelia] (26:02 - 26:03)

Wow.

[Frank] (26:03 - 26:08)

And it could potentially help two, three, four other people.

[Amelia] (26:08 - 26:09)

Amazing.

[Frank] (26:09 - 26:11)

That'd be an interesting one to design, I reckon.

[Amelia] (26:11 - 26:12)

It would be, definitely.

[Frank] (26:13 - 26:15)

So the possibilities are endless.

[Amelia] (26:15 - 26:16)

They are.

[Frank] (26:16 - 26:19)

Downsizing, don't think it's just one way.

[Amelia] (26:19 - 26:21)

That's right. Lots of options.

[Frank] (26:21 - 26:23)

Do your research. Come and see us.

[Amelia] (26:23 - 26:27)

Yes. What a great place to wrap up. Thanks for listening to the Building Design, Prime Time Podcast.

[Frank] (26:28 - 26:28)

Catch ya’s later.

[OUTRO]

You’re listening to the Building Design, Prime Time Podcast.