The Pursuit of The Right Thing in The Wrong Way with Co-host Bo Morgan | Ep 145

Today on MEN ARE FORGED, Bo and Cartwright confront the restless pursuit of “the next thing” that defines so many men in their 20s and 30s. We unpack the lie that a higher salary, a better relationship, or the next external win will finally produce internal peace and fulfillment. This conversation challenges the belief that “once I make this much money, I’ll be set,” and exposes why those milestones rarely satisfy the way we expect. If you’ve ever felt driven yet still empty, successful yet unsettled, this episode speaks directly to the tension between ambition and contentment—and where true fulfillment is actually found.

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Transcript

Bo Morgan (00:02.402)
Alright.

We in there? We're in there. All right.

What my vest for you today?

Yeah, so nice.

don't normally wear this vest.

Bo Morgan (00:15.95)
Very practical, right?

Yeah, yeah, yeah when you go outside you're still not cold

the

Yeah, what's the point? It keeps you a little warm. It keeps you a little warm.

Well, they always say, you know, don't only keep your extremities warm by putting stuff on, you keep them warm by keeping the court warm.

Cartwright Morris (00:45.294)
And there's something to that car ride.

All right, all right

Cool, so we're rolling. How do you feel about the camera setup? I think it's perfect. I think last time we might have been too far apart.

Bo Morgan (01:02.401)
or scoot back.

Bo Morgan (01:06.19)
Yeah, yeah. there we go. That's better.

Okay, You want me to kick it off? You kick it off? I'm here to serve you man, for real you tell me.

Yeah,

Bo Morgan (01:19.0)
Yeah, Minerforged, here we are. Bo Morgan, Carl Reib Morris, living the dream.

Bo Morgan (01:32.27)
Yeah, why don't you just kick it off, we'll go from there. can create some kind of intro if I really think we need something.

and then just edit it where you want it to start.

Yeah. Okay.

Cartwright Morris (01:44.888)
Cool. So we talked last week a little bit about this tension that, we feel and acting and not, being still and then knowing when to actually do something. Right. And it's still something that w what I continue to get out of it is the piece and just not knowing all the time, you know, not trying to strike the balance perfectly. So I feel like it's a good segue because you sent me a really cool clip of, David Goggins talking to

Andrew Uberman. Is it Huberman or Uberman?

You, is that how say it? I don't know, it starts with an H.

and Alabama's Huberman. And I know people probably know who David Goggins is. is the, I mean, kind of mentally insane Navy SEAL who... Brace the sun.

Yeah.

Bo Morgan (02:35.618)
Yeah, he's a suck guy. I think he has a world record for the most consecutive pull-ups.

Okay, so I didn't know that, but it makes perfect sense. You also hear stories about him like running these ultra marathons with a broken femur and insane stuff. Anyway, he's been able to capture this ability of mental toughness that I think is kind of unfathomable in a way. Anyway, he was talking to Huberman about how Goggins will go to events and he'll, you know, he has all kinds of people reaching out to him now because he's well known and

Yeah.

Cartwright Morris (03:14.286)
he talks to a lot of billionaires and a lot of these billionaires will come to him and say, man, I'm still missing something. I've got all the money in the world. I've got everything that you could possibly imagine. Pretty wife, houses, cars, whatever you need. I can get, no limits there, but I'm still missing something on the inside. it's just,

It's a thought, especially for guys probably in their twenties and thirties, especially of, you know, cause a lot of us are super ambitious and we're always thinking, man, if I can just get this next thing, right. I'll feel better about myself or if I can just find the relationship that I want to have, if I can just, man, I'm making this right now, but if I could just make this salary, right. I'll feel better about it. I'll feel better about things.

external thing that should create something internal.

Yeah. And, which when we talk about it, you know, it's easy for me to say, yeah, it's totally not true. But tomorrow morning I'll wake up and I'll think about, man, that would be really, really great if we could just get that, you know, or man, the gosh, I love that house down the street, man. If we could figure out a way to rent our house and get that house, we'd be good. Or like, man, if I could just make this amount of money, we'd be good.

Bo Morgan (04:45.826)
Yeah.

Bo Morgan (04:58.798)
I will say in my initial response is sitting there that it just shows there's a handful of things that you are no human is insulated from. Whether you're rich, poor, old, young, know, married, single, male, female. It's like, you know, one, like human beings, you're going to fail in life. People that try to insulate and avoid failure, they're just delaying the inevitable.

or ultimately they're really failing by doing, not failing, but then I think there's something too of like, I think we're all searching for something. I think there is like a innate thing of, I think that's what led our ancestors to come here, right? Explore this, I mean, it's wild. If you really want to like a thought exercise to just blow your mind away of just all the things in life that could hurt you or kill you. And then you think about 300 years ago.

the things that them trying to get over here on a ship, dealing with disease, no modern medicine, and then surviving people trying to kill you, harm you.

When I'm sure when they got on the boat they weren't even sure where they'd end up. Oh, yeah, there's no way for you know that

that thinking and I do wonder if there's like always like you

Bo Morgan (06:20.952)
think about an Uberman, no, sorry, Uberman, excuse me, had a great little, I think their conversation is from his podcast. I wanna say the interview was like a year ago, they did this. He was talking about this context of when you do hard things, you challenge yourself, you are building a chemical in your brain that creates longevity, longer life, which to me, there's such a biblical message in that.

But I think there's some, so therefore I think in the context of just human beings when we.

really push ourselves. Yeah, but I think it's going back to your question, but what's enough? that kind of where does it come from? that the...

Yeah, because I mean, the billionaires are experiencing the same thing that we do. I mean, because if you told me even now, but especially a couple of years ago, Hey man, you're going to be a billionaire when you're 35. My immediate thought is not, well, I still need to find, you know, what my purpose is. My immediate thought is, I'll be

Yeah.

Bo Morgan (07:19.8)
Yeah.

Bo Morgan (07:28.834)
Good. Yeah. Yeah.

you I'm good don't have worry about anything right my wife can she can stop working we can raise kids at home and and when we get that I won't need to come to Bible study anymore you know won't have any more issues like you know what mean I mean that's naturally where my brain the grass is green you know

greener.

Bo Morgan (07:51.242)
Well, I you would have thought also 20, 30 years ago that somebody like Brad Pitt had it all figured out. Money, fame, looks, women, whatever. got, know, not too long ago, got out of rehab. I mean, he had an alcohol addiction. So there was something missing in his life. So it's like this thing, there's this thing where that mindset and somehow people, insulate ourselves. This is going back to that challenging thing.

Allowing yourself to be challenged in your beliefs and your thoughts because what ends up happening you can insulate yourself from into believing it's the next thing that's going to satisfy And I think that goes back to ultimately what Goggins was trying to say it's like you don't challenge yourself enough physically mentally emotionally Relationally or even I mean the obvious thing is spiritually, right?

Yeah, that's right.

Bo Morgan (08:46.134)
I think that we, if we're not having enough challenging thoughts and beliefs and even physical exertion, I mean, you could, and I think Goggins is taking it from that standpoint, which I would say there has been many times when I have allowed myself to be pushed physically as led to a clarity of like, my gosh, I am tougher than I think I am. And not just physically, not just mentally. Right. There's something that we're like, man.

I got there's more in the tank than I think. And that's what want. Things he said was there's 75 percent of you that's still there. That's not unlocked. That's been chained up. And people are willing to push to figure it. Find that out. Yeah. And most of us think of that in the context of you're right. What's going to get me to a place where I'm satisfied or I'm happy or I'm content. First is thinking it. You know.

I always hate to say it this way because as Auburn fans, we can't talk about Nick Saban, right? But the way he preaches, and a lot of great leaders preach it, get obsessed with the process. Get obsessed with what you enjoy doing. Result, yeah, you can be a prisoner to outcomes. Most of us are obsessed with the outcome. We want the outcome, and then get the outcome, we're like, well, isn't that great?

That's so much the result.

Cartwright Morris (10:09.518)
Yeah, I going to say, mean, especially for the billionaire types and the, brought a Brad Pitt, made me think about this is those guys is probably more intense because when they get there and they start looking back and they start thinking, wait, I told myself I'd be happy. Yes. For guys in their twenties and thirties, like, like us, it's like, now we still kind of drive on that hope of, and so, know, every day you kind of wake up still with that. man.

Yeah.

Cartwright Morris (10:37.56)
striving to get this thing, but once you get that thing and then you look back and say,

shoot. Which is wild. It just shows we don't have enough older people in our life challenging our thoughts and beliefs. Cause if we actually observe that older generation, there was something that came around during our dad's generation called the midlife crisis. And it wasn't because people lacked money and resources. There was an internal thing that they were missing. The midlife crisis is a thing. came up, you know, had to deal with.

spending a car over spending whether a house car to addiction to affairs to right. It was all because they were missing something. So they tried the next craziest thing and they end up sabotaging their life. Right.

They're just looking for really anything to fill that void.

Yeah, and we could as me and you as followers of Jesus could just shut it's like well, it's Jesus is the only place that feels that But I think for a some of our listeners is like they would say they're believers People out there would say that have that thought or oh I go to church every day or I actually do profess to be a follower of Jesus I still have that feeling. Yeah It's like alright. So what does it mean to actually find Jesus? And I think it comes down to that mindset that Goggins was trying to hit on

Bo Morgan (11:57.538)
It's like, okay, what are you putting in your life that you regularly are pushing yourself, challenging yourself, growing, building something that's not about the outcome?

Yeah.

Yeah, you get... I'm trying to think some of the language he used. Obviously not all the f-words.

Yeah, some bad language. We'll put the link, though, so where people can watch it. They'll watch it around. Yeah, you can. It's it is interesting because Goggins, I'm not sure. Is Goggins spiritual? And I'm not familiar enough or a Christian. don't think so. But what he's saying is so what he's talking about in the clip is like, well, you need to you need to break through and I guess.

do more like to expand your mental toughness. It's kind of his whole MO, right?

Bo Morgan (12:51.182)
Because in that you'll find a version of yourself you didn't know was there. The part that you think is missing is in there. That's what you're not realizing.

So do you agree with that? So seeing it the spiritually the way we do as Christians, like you agree with what he's saying is like, you just got to tap more into your potential. Yes, potential is what he's saying,

I mean, we kind of word it as our identity in Christ, and we kind of put a glossed over Easter Sunday version to it, but I think that is a very deep...

exploratory word that will take lifetime, if not eternity, to really discover. Identity. Our identity in Christ, who He made us to be, who He designed us.

What were?

Bo Morgan (13:41.846)
Yeah, that unfortunately what most say is only going to come out through pressure. That's why I love the theme. I use the phrase Miner Forge. Like it's like there's something to the hammering, the beating of life that if we all had it today, we would dismiss it. We wouldn't understand it. We wouldn't appreciate it. If it all happened today and we fully understood it. if we through life start

through the shaping and difficulties and the pain and the unknowns and the frustrations. When we actually like that, that stuff, who we are really starts coming to serve us more. Cause I mean, I would say 10, 15, 20 years ago, right as a young man, I thought it goes to the whole void. It's like, well, once I become, you know, if, know, as a kid, I'll be an NFL football player. And that's what the best expression of me is. like, well,

I've to find out I'm nowhere near the athletic ability to become a professional athlete. still got it. I don't like this shoulder. can't really agree. Or I'll be, this will be my contribution to society. I get this profession and I become this person that I've already seen before. We look around. It's like, that's why I love Hebrews. You don't look to right or to the left.

you

Bo Morgan (15:06.402)
fix your eyes on Jesus and run the race with perseverance. It's like we at we constantly are looking to the right and to the left. Like, okay, that guy looks kind of successful. That makes sense to me. I'll just, you know, go get a med school degree and become a doctor. or or my dad did this. So, and that's no offense to anybody who's done those things. I'm I'm trying to but I

we try to take our idea of who we are and we shove it in a round peg, square hole kind of thing.

Well, it's question that like, so Bo, like, mean, if you didn't, if you knew the answer, if you didn't have to struggle or like wrestle with things daily, would you still need that relationship with Jesus? Exactly. And he's a relational God who doesn't value necessarily like accomplishing things with you. I think he does. You know what saying? I'm oversimplifying the point, but

But no, no dude, I want to know you and I want you to need me and I want to do this with you. And both, you knew all the answers that you didn't have to struggle then would you still come to me? And I would. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, just be honest. Like my pride would seep in and, and it does constantly like with if I experienced some success, like you have that thought in the back of your head. like, wait, I think I got this.

Exactly.

Cartwright Morris (16:46.358)
You know, I think I know what I'm doing. Yeah. And then, and so you can see that natural shift away and that's not, he doesn't want that, you know, so I'm not saying he, he, you know, he berates us with struggles. I don't understand that fully. does he allow things to happen? I don't know. I don't know. Like there's some deeper theology there that I'd love to hear your thoughts on, like, you know, I,

I think I've got things figured out.

Cartwright Morris (17:16.002)
there's extreme value in me having to go and get on my knees daily and be like, do I need to handle this? You know what mean? Like I need you with me while I do this, whatever that thing is. Last night, I had a great day at work yesterday. And I can kind of relate, I mean, literally this happened yesterday. Had a great day at work yesterday. Our company's growing and it's doing really great. And I love the people I work with.

And you kind of get that thought you got things figured out, you know, it's like, all right, I'm gonna go home, put my feet up, you know, kind of got this. And then our pipes were backed up. like we had like, you know, water coming through like, saying I'm literally I'm not dude, I'm not saying that, you know, God did that. But it is like, man, it's always you know, my son, my 10 month old has chicken pox right now. Yeah, I mean, it's just like, anyway, I don't really know where I'm going with that. But I think

Yeah.

Bo Morgan (18:13.386)
No, I would say in our modern world, especially Western, maybe modern world, we do try to insulate from pain. Yeah. You know, getting the next thing is that that raise that and money insulates us from that. But really, there's a there's a I'm trying to think the scripture, but there's like a treasure in the end of on the other side of stuff like that. Yeah. You know, yeah. Some moments like that at home or me and my wife become closer because of that.

It's the constant struggle.

Cartwright Morris (18:42.7)
Yeah, there's no doubt about that.

Yeah. Yeah. So you think from a relational, a spiritual, and it sounds like according to Huberman, that there's a physical chemical thing that happens in our brain when we choose to in the midst of the hard to press in to embrace the challenge, the difficulty, you know, I mean, obviously we're growing closer to God and those around us, but then there's a

to embrace it.

Bo Morgan (19:11.47)
And part of our brain is responding that stuff and growing and becoming more resilient. And we learn lessons and we get to reflect on it. But a lot of people see challenges or pain. It's like, all right, well, let me just go numb and work, you know, see if I can get the other side. It's like, well, no, the gold, the treasure is in the actual thing. Doing that hard part. You know, I think that's what as.

as young fathers, both me and you are, think there is something to it. It doesn't feel very masculine for me to get on the floor of my toddler and play with him. Blocks or cars, cars or whatever. It feels very childish.

But the other, for me, so what's the fruit of me choosing either one or the other? Well, me getting on the floor with him is like, I'm looking him in the eye and he knows his dad and he's seeing his dad actually engage with him on a level at this age when I don't necessarily the fruit of it yet. Like that's what I think most fathers miss is there's like, that's not very masculine. So I'll wait till he's older and I can throw the ball at them.

It's like, well, that son is going to be very resistant to you, to doing those things with you. If you hadn't done it in his first four years of life where his brain is developing, where he's actually, you know, building some, you're building a level of a connection at that age where they grow the most in their entire life in the first four years.

and they're actually learning you and understanding, because those little things, those little kids, are, it's insane how intuitive God has designed us, going back to who we've been. And it's wild how science is now picking up on more and more of that. So anyway, those even, and I'm not necessarily calling that a challenge, but that is probably a challenge for a lot of men. It's like willing to engage with our kids when we don't necessarily see the benefit initially.

Bo Morgan (21:18.03)
And I think that is something that's rewiring our brain that's bringing to light.

that's cool. I saw you might've been the one to tell me this. How kids, really young kids from zero to four or whenever the exact timeline is they spell, I saw something that said that those kids spell love T I M E. They want your time. They want your attention. And probably as men, know, it's like, well, a lot of men don't need that from others and said they don't think to reciprocate to the kids that way. But

Yeah, I thought that was interesting. So for the guys in their 20s and then their 30s, what are some things like, what are some things that you've seen work like in your kind of like daily habits or like, what are some things that they can do you think to like, maybe like resist the thinking of like, man, if I just had this or, you know, like, I wonder what

Yeah, I think there's a

think there's a way to...

Bo Morgan (22:29.134)
It's wild because I love, me and you both love, we love sports. I love watching sports documentaries. You watched like the last dance. yeah. And there's... Got to be. I would think so. mean, a 10 part documentary. mean, it's nostalgic to the info, to Jordan, right? All of it.

That's the best one, by the way, right? yeah.

Cartwright Morris (22:50.51)
In Birmingham, he's in Birmingham. That's a big part of it too, he's in Birmingham.

I saw him hit a game winning walk off home run. Did you really? You wild? Yeah, he did. He batted

impressive there's no way

yeah, if any other human tried to walk out right now and hit a minor league pitcher let alone a major league pitcher, that be good.

Yeah, we get a chance. Yeah.

Bo Morgan (23:14.894)
Yeah, yeah. But so there's something too, and I watched that and you're like, dude, there's a lot of pain that came with in stuff that we think about, like, oh, I wish I had that, like the fame, the money, all that stuff. And it really, there was a great moment actually in it. I think I may have talked about last time or I've talked to somebody about this. We'll know where he's in the hotel room and there's thousands of people in the lobby and he's just sitting there with the cigar laying down.

father.

Bo Morgan (23:47.756)
Like I can't walk into a bathroom without somebody trying to get something from me. I can't have anybody around me unless I'm paying them. He couldn't have a pure of a relationship with somebody because everybody's trying to get something from him. but my thought was with it going back to your thing. So that's just another example of what we're talking about. The thing that you want that's going to make everything, there's people who have had it.

and they're missing a lot. But him, I was thinking about the context of just mastery. The guy just mastered what he did. Like his obsessiveness. And I don't think anybody should necessarily be that obsessed with something earthly as much as he was, but it's impressive how that, everybody said there's a lot, he is definitely one the more talented basketball players, but there's a lot of talented guys that come to the NBA that are not.

Nothing. Yeah, even scratch the surface the kind of but he was upset about his skill anytime somebody Gave him a hard time about something his skill set You know, he won would throw it back at him trash, but he would then go work on it and his weaknesses would become a strength Yeah, long memory. Anyway, so I would say for a lot of guys. It's like alright. What am I mastering in my life? Maybe it is becoming a husband or father. Mm-hmm. Maybe it is

a long memory.

Cartwright Morris (25:10.19)
And that's a good answer, right? I mean, it's like the answer doesn't have to be, I'm going to go be the best whatever you are, real estate agent, or whatever you are that there ever was.

Right. But there's something in my life. Am I really getting like joy from, I hate to use the word obsessive because you write, cause when you think of the word obsessive is something that takes you away from the things that matter. Right. But is there something that I'm waking up every day? I'm like, Ooh, think about it. How can I get better at that? Or how can I do that better? I think that's always that how to lean into those challenges, how to lean into,

you know, not avoiding some of the harder things and allowing you to, because really when you want to master something, you do it, you fail, you reflect on it, you get better. You do, you keep, and there's a resilient thing that your muscle you're building in your brain or as you know, there is an actual chemical for it that creates longevity in our life. But I think there's something about that. that belief that it's like, okay, I'm getting great at something here. And sometimes that takes your whole life. Yeah. You know,

I'm trying to think of an exam. I mean there's there's guys that didn't feel like they really started doing that until they're in their 50s Yeah, that sucks. I hate that. I hate that thought process I'm closer to that now than I was but yeah you There is I think something too for I think a practical of like how can I think around? maybe not a Jordan level, but a a Higher intensity of all right

I'm getting really good at something and it's adding value to either another person or human beings in general.

Bo Morgan (26:58.7)
That's really what you think about. Like, man.

Well, it could also be so for guys in their twenties, it could be for thirties too. It could be no right now I'm learning that when I fail, I'm learning to get up and do it again or try again. Or I mean, I've always, I've always struggled with that. I've always struggled. I've always had the thought like in my twenties is like, you know that I tried this once. It didn't work out. Not for me. You know, this must be God telling me it's something else.

Yeah, let me go.

Cartwright Morris (27:30.426)
That's not necessarily true. You know, it could be that I'm learning to to try again and learn like you said from what happened last time, whether it could be something your personal life, your spiritual life or your work life. know, no, right now I'm in a time where I'm learning to keep trying. You know.

Yeah. And it's what's wild is, is if we really reflected on every person that's successful, there is a lot of versions of success out there that we've seen, right? Right. There's the goal oriented, the, you know, excess of, like I said, obsessive. There's, also the people that, they all have one thing in common, right? It's, it's like they felt they, when they failed, they failed forward versus stay put or fell backward. Right. Right. There's.

There's no cookie cutter.

Cartwright Morris (28:18.062)
That's perfectly within our control too, right?

how you respond. That's the thing. It's not for the faint of heart, I feel like more definitely, 100 % that I've failed more in my life than I have in, than I've succeeded. But you just kind of like, man, how do I just keep going forward, I guess. That's what resilience looks like. We think resilience is getting punched in face and keep going.

but I think a lot of times resilience is like, man, I just got my butt kicked. Yeah. I'm embarrassed. And I'm embarrassed. Yeah. Yeah. I'm frustrated. So I guess, but I'll get up tomorrow and I'll keep going. Yeah. I'll try something else or I'll try another avenue or I'll reflect on why did I fail and who do I need to know and what relationship I need to build going forward from that.

I don't feel like I stack up.

Cartwright Morris (29:16.814)
This guy on LinkedIn, I don't know his name, you'll probably know him talking about it, but he runs around and he interviews people that look rich or whatever.

Yeah,

He's all over LinkedIn. He's everywhere. And he, his question is always like, were you ever broke? And I haven't seen one yet where they say, no, I was never broke. There's always a story. yeah. I was a rock bottom five years ago. know what I mean? The difference in those people are they pick themselves up and they try it again. You know, they learn from them and they try it again. And I would imagine like if you talk to anybody that we call successful, right.

they have money and great family and stuff like that. I bet they all have that story. You know?

Yeah.

Bo Morgan (30:04.913)
Yeah. Yeah. It's wild. Think about, yeah. Yeah. I mean, I was single for majority of my adult life, right? Didn't meet my wife until I was 36. You know, like, yeah, I failed in the single. Like you think about, I think about that, was like, man, I really, lots of blind dates, lots of setups, lots of random, like perfectly nice women, but, or, you know, or I got rejected, you know, I got rejected a lot. Like dealing with that, it's like, man, why can't I ever do this? Yeah.

You know, why would I keep going at this? It's like, well, there's some on the other end of it. So yeah. That's cool. Yeah. Anyway, yeah, it's wild. You can sit here and talk about this subject because it's. Because, you know, this is going, I may have said this last time, but there is like.

God wired us also differently. so therefore, I think we a young man's version of resilient, hardworking is is that grinder, you know, works 12 hour days and it just doesn't all look that way. Yeah. And I would say I would say as you're trying to figure out, I got out really like you put those art to read great at something or to master something or find really joy and contentment in the doing part.

How do I, you what does that look like? Does it look like just being present constantly with people? Is it building a relationship with somebody who you feel like has already done it? There's a couple steps ahead. It doesn't have to look like you just being a hard ass, David Goggins version of resilient. What does that look? that's, think part of like maybe the thing to partner with amidst of

going after and being great at something is always, and challenging yourself is always, all right, what does this look like building as you're going?

Bo Morgan (32:05.026)
How do I, you get what saying? I'm trying to find the words to partner with that. It's like going back to, guess, the, the doing in the rest piece. There's how do I actually do it away where I'm not sacrificing what my core values, what really matters to me. may be part of my core values going after something, but there's my neglecting family in my collecting my health, you know,

There has to be truth-held intention.

Well, would say, mean, if you're if you're if you're someone. And is experiencing a similar struggle, one that you just described where you're trying to figure out, you know. Hey, how do I fall for it? How do I keep I would say probably outside looking in a little bit to other people's lives and I know in my life, too, but I'd say you're probably on the right path. You know, I mean, like it's.

that

Cartwright Morris (33:05.07)
It's almost like in trying to find the right path and struggling on that, you're on the right path. You know what I mean? Like in just thinking that way and, and, and, and trying to figure it out. I have a lot of empathy for the people that try to figure this out with, without God and without Jesus. Um, because man, that's, that's gotta be a lonely place to be where it's like, it's just me.

Yeah.

Bo Morgan (33:30.926)
you

You know, I believe that I'm going only be here for 80, 100 years or whatever it is, and then that's going to be it. And I'm sitting here trying to figure out how to find this happiness, how to find, you know, purpose if that's an even the term you can use for people that don't believe in God. like there's something here missing and I'm striving, striving, striving to figure it out. And I have nothing else to look to.

I mean, that's going to be an extremely lonely place. And so if you're, if you're like us and you're in your twenties and thirties and you haven't figured it out and you're experiencing that struggle, like Cartwright's describing, that's good start.

Yeah, you know, right.

And maybe not even a start. That's a good place to be probably for a long time. Yeah. But get comfortable being uncomfortable that way. Cause that's right. And that's Christianity really. Yeah. You know, I mean, really it's, it's like, you know, not, not completely, but there's definitely a piece there where it's like, you know, we're not made for this place necessarily if we want to get real deep. don't know if we want to but you know, I mean, that kind of is the core of it. I feel like is like, um, well, this isn't my home.

Bo Morgan (34:36.747)
Yeah, that's a

Cartwright Morris (34:44.333)
You know, and so trying to, like you said, trying to fit a square peg in a round hole, I feel like as Christians, that's really a struggle that we're all going to deal with because really you are. You know, you're a square peg and this is a round hole here. You know?

Yeah, yeah. And I think that's the midst of the whole challenging piece of it is like...

Yeah, man, what was the thought I just had? It was, but yeah, to your point that, yeah, this,

Bo Morgan (35:17.518)
I had that thought just drifted away. anyway, Bo, you hit on a great point. I'm with you. Like at the end of the day, that struggle could be the pain of it, that the joy we're seeking for at end of the day could be in the next life. And are we okay with that?

Yeah, I mean we could go, mean when we're actually spending time with Jesus in heaven, he could be like, hey, that was the whole point right there. You you trying to figure it out was what I was using. Yeah.

Yeah.

Bo Morgan (35:43.106)
Mids and the struggle choose me. Did you become great at that? Right. Yikes. Yeah. Yeah. And that's, that is something I have in the midst of a lot of regret and frustration and failure. like, I feel like I've had that question come up a lot in me of

Am I okay with without the result that I think I want? Am I like at the end of the day, the while I get before God and was I that I steward what's been given to me? Was I true to my core values and who God made me to be? And did I choose him above else to know him deeply? It's like crap, but I want the results. Yeah. Yeah. I want those.

the

100 % whether deserved or not like they get And well deserved sorry, that's a whole nother topic but like the whole language of that is nonsense Yeah, but I'm eating like I was kind of being funny

I think when you when you when you kind of go through what we're talking about as Christians, when you are, like we said, trying to figure out purpose and especially as young men, like how do I lead? Well, how do I how do I be successful? of the people around me are comfortable and safe and stuff like that. I mean, that's ultimately what we're trying to do and create a safe and secure environment at home for my wife and my kids. And anyway, I think.

Cartwright Morris (37:19.33)
I don't know. think if you continue with that kind of being, that's actually what I'm striving to do. And God, please protect me from all these other opportunities that I'm chasing that don't include you. You know what I mean? Like I can go down this path and maybe it looks good and bright and shiny. But Lord, please don't go. I don't want to go there without you. Please. Because I know me and you know, I'll last about six months and then I'll be in

Car Right's office, what happened to me? You know what mean? Right.

man, I mean that could be a whole topic in itself. that thought process most people want to go is to a binary place, right? Like.

maybe an off topic a little bit,

Cartwright Morris (38:06.232)
successful versus not successful.

Or yeah, doing the things with God or of God, like, well, I guess that's just me reading my Bible and going to church. People have done that. You know, there's all these denominations for Christianity where they don't even engage in certain sports because they think it's not of God. Yeah. Like, you know, I think Pentecostals one, we've known people who like because there's a collision. that's violence. So therefore that's not of God. People can't be a Christian and play football.

Yeah, right. That's what I said. If you're a Christian, you should play football. Yes! I knew a lot of Christian men through the game of football. But that's like, some people take that belief, actual, and then you get the other way. It's like, well...

Anyway.

Bo Morgan (38:53.19)
Like I mean, I knew somebody who misused the verse that Jesus said, well, given to see the season on God's gods, meaning like, oh, six days a week, I can just do whatever I want. And then the seventh day I'll go to church. Then people take that to extremes when it really like this is such a it's a partnership mindset like delight yourself with the He'll give you desires of your heart. OK, there's that verse. Right. But then commit your way to the Lord and he will guide your steps like that tension.

Right?

Bo Morgan (39:21.75)
of like, okay, I'm figuring this out. I may not be a hundred percent, a hundred percent of the time. I may not bat a thousand made bat more like Jordan, but the same time, like that's my heart and my desire is to be in partnership with him and co-labor with him. And I won't always get that right either. But am I challenging that thought process that makes me think I'm, I'm, taking the wheel. I got it. Right. Or am I constantly pulling off side the road?

Yeah.

Bo Morgan (39:51.544)
I'm sorry, God. Yeah. You drive.

Bo Morgan (39:59.694)
100%.

Bo Morgan (40:04.686)
But going back to what I was talking about earlier, just because you put Jesus in the driver's seat doesn't mean it's going to look like your version of success. Yeah, that's like that's what I meant coming back of like the outcome may not be there. You want. Yeah.

So there's of success to you.

Yeah. Yeah.

Then if we knew the answer, I guarantee you if I knew the answer, I'd be like, I don't really like that.

Yeah. Or what you do is, oh, oh God, you want to take these back roads all the way around. I there. Right. Let's just, let's get like, it's right there. Like just, why are you going over there? Why don't I want show you something? Yeah. I want to teach you something along the way. You're not ready to get it now, but I want to you around. I promise you're going look back at that. That was more beautiful. Yeah. But we want, no, I mean. Yeah.

Cartwright Morris (40:39.106)
Did you just go?

Cartwright Morris (40:55.854)
right there. Yeah. I So I mentor a guy, his name's Khalifa and he's at school. plays football at Appalachian State right now and he got hurt at the beginning of the year this year. He had ankle surgery. And so it's so funny when you're like giving other people advice how much easier it is. You know what mean? And then like as I'm giving him advice, it's like looking in a mirror, you know, coming right back at me.

Yeah.

Cartwright Morris (41:30.822)
and and

Cartwright Morris (41:53.784)
where he's transforming a little bit. can see him growing up and maturing and being like, well, actually hold on. That was my idea of success. You know, what am I, what am I, what am I getting out of this period of time? That's going to help me in the future. Well, football and it's, Hey, you know what? That actually wasn't, you know, my plan wasn't necessarily, you know, had I had my plan, had I rushed for a thousand yards or for

me or anybody else that's getting a great job that pays you a ton of money. If I had just followed my path, I wouldn't have learned any of the things that I've had to force myself to learn. kind of, it's almost like developing the ability in a way to where when you're in a tough time, like Khalifa experience, when he wasn't able to play, it's like stepping away from that, looking at it at your own situation from the outside in.

and being like, wait, hold on, let me dive into this right here and see what I'm actually, what God is forging in me. know what mean? Like, what is this uncomfortable season teaching me right now? And he's done a great job of that. And it's been cool. He has so much peace. Anyway, what you

Yeah.

Bo Morgan (43:12.59)
what he'll take within the rest of his life. Exactly. Hey I was a thousand yard rush.

that that

Like something that I wanted to work out didn't work out. you know, building the muscle to be thankful for that. didn't work out versus being upset and, know, so, so anyway, that's like something that I've been learning this year is what you said before. It's, it's almost like working out. I don't work out by the way. but it's, it's working a muscle in your brain or in your spirit to,

kind of see things from the outside looking in and even when things aren't going well, you're still developing. And for men that need progress, well, there's some progress for you. know, you all I constantly need progress. I need the next thing. Well, there's my progress. Yeah, it's that didn't go the way you wanted it to go. But here's what I taught you because of it. So

Yeah, which I think they call that maturity, wisdom, right? Why the difference between knowledge and wisdom is experience. Yeah. Right? And a lot of us. turn that,

Cartwright Morris (44:48.044)
A lot of sessions sitting with Cartwright

Like I said like growth growth doesn't happen in a vacuum right it doesn't happen Yeah, man, well, this is good, but yeah, yeah, I mean I mean going but I had the thought like just thinking about like You know you constantly hear about guys who played ten years in the league and who had all that success all those goals and they didn't know the thing that they struggle with is oh What happens to about life after football? when I don't have that structure and

No, definitely not.

Bo Morgan (45:23.15)
Because at the end of the day, that's what they created. Like, oh, I miss the relationships. Oh, I miss the structure that gave me rhythm in my life. It's like, oh, that's what was good. wasn't necessarily scoring a touchdown, even winning the Super Bowls. People say they miss being on the bus after a win or the plane. They miss the regularly working out with guys. It's it's wild.

I'm gonna touch.

Cartwright Morris (45:48.558)
I think Nick Saban said that's the thing he misses is the process and the people and finding the right people.

Yeah, and it's like wow now. I got to figure this out by myself There's no one here to help me Like there was there's a lot of people trying to help me get to a thousand fifteen hundred yards, right? Yeah, that's wild So anyway, yeah, I think this is good, but yeah Anyway, all right. Thank you all for joining us

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