The Power of Seeing Yourself as a Faithful Son | FORGE Pillar #1 | Episode 157

Cartwright and Bo share how the “FORGE” framework—built on five crucial pillars—transforms chaos into clarity, especially in your 20s and 30s when burnout and identity crises threaten to derail you. You'll discover: the meaning of being a faithful son, not an orphan trying to earn love; how understanding your identity in Christ fuels real risk-taking and authentic leadership; and why embracing God’s love as your foundation unlocks the freedom to live fully and fearlessly.

Key Topics:

• The core of the "Forge Framework" and its role in personal transformation
• Understanding the "Faithful Son" pillar: identity rooted in God's love, not performance
• How the story of the prodigal son exemplifies God's unconditional love
• Moving from chaos in your 20s and 30s to purposeful growth
• How biblical adoption and sonship redefine your worth and purpose
• Practical steps: Take the Forge baseline assessment
• The significance of community, mentorship, and accountability in forging manhood

Timestamps:

• (00:04) - Welcome and introduction to the framework's purpose
• (02:52) - Overview of the "FORGE Pillars" and starting with "Faithful Son"
• (05:22) - Jesus' challenging words in John 6 and their significance for authenticity
• (06:43) - The tension of being forged—standing firm when it matters most
• (09:28) - The upcoming men’s development curriculum based on the framework
• (10:57) - Developing foundational faith personally, professionally, and spiritually
• (12:44) - The importance of co-laboring with Jesus in all areas of life
• (15:32) - The five pillars of the forged man: Faithful Son, Offensive Servant, Reflective Leader, Grounded Man, Enduring Man
• (16:13) - Deep dive into the "Faithful Son" as a foundation for all others
• (18:14) - Sonship and inheritance in biblical terms, and understanding our identity in Christ
• (20:31) - The virtue of faithfulness and trusting God with results
• (22:00) - The story of the prodigal son and the concept of living in sonship, not performance
• (25:10) - The analogy of parenting and God’s unconditional love
• (28:11) - The power of grace, adoption, and finding security in Jesus
• (33:36) - Discerning genuine desires from God’s place of redemptive purpose
• (41:13) - The thief on the cross as an example of faith at the last moment
• (45:38) - How God’s design and our passions can align for good
• (52:57) - Practical application: using the Forge baseline assessment to evaluate where you stand

Resources & Links:

• The Bema Podcast – Messianic Jewish Perspectives
• Men Are Forged Website & Baseline Assessment

Next Steps:
Take the FORGE Baseline Assessment with just your email to begin evaluating your spiritual health and clarity on identity. Join our upcoming men’s development pilot program to immerse yourself in this transformative journey.

Transcript

Cartwright Morris (00:04.009)
We're live? Okay, we're doing it live. Okay, no one panic. Don't panic. Act natural. All right, awesome. Hey everybody. Welcome back to Men Are Forged Thank you again for listening to us. Yeah. I think you said this last time, but man, you have so many different things to go to.

And if you're listening to us, really cool. Yeah, we appreciate that. Yeah, I don't want to be that guy who But it really does help if you do write a review it does Give us a star rating whatever or at least or just you know If it feels like it would be encouraged a friend just send it Share that episode with us with them if you get some out of it. Maybe somebody else does too Yeah, which is really the whole reason I'm here is because I've gotten so much out of this framework and stuff that you

you've built, you know what mean? That like I, you know, I love the idea of somebody else having a similar experience that I had. anyway, so kind of speaking in that same tune, Cartwright has, and a lot of times people will probably learn to, and I'm not here to obviously,

be it salesy or too markety or anything like that. I just truly have been through some of this stuff with you. And I'm passionate about it because I've learned so much about myself that man, I would love the idea of like some of my friends going through it too and actually learning more about themselves. And you know what I mean? And it's kinda, I think a lot of guys give maybe, you know, the coaching thing and we've gone through the coaching thing in another episode, but

It gets a bad rap sometimes because I think guys try to be so tough. But you ain't tough. You're home at night just like the rest was not sleeping. No, we know about you. anyway, so what I wanted to do with you today, Clark Wright, is go through this framework that you've built.

Cartwright Morris (02:15.679)
that's really, it kind of puts structure and a little bit of framework behind.

what you do here and how you for the last 10 plus years of your life and Doesn't just tell you or give you information, but it's getting information out of you, right? Right. And so it's called the four framework. I'm thinking maybe we do Maybe one for the next few episodes and just kind of dive in ask you questions Figure out how it works and then but the whole premise is Instead of us just I think us having conversations is great and it's amazing

know people are listening and it's awesome. But man if this is what it looks like to take the next step and really dive deep into what and how you think and how you view different things because a lot of what you'll learn here is I mean it's it's how you

It's how you view things, right? mean, a lot of our Christian faith and walk with Jesus is like, how do you, who do you say who Jesus is? Shaps a lot of what you, who you are. Right. And it's like defined.

pretty much every religion in the last 2,000 years, right? For good and bad of just who this person is, who this Jesus is. And it makes or breaks our existence and how we view others, how we view ourselves. And what's your interpretation of what Jesus says you are? Right. says you are. man, yeah. Yeah. I gotta work for this? Right. Jesus by boss? Right.

Cartwright Morris (03:53.681)
Is Jesus a father figure I had growing up or whatever?

Yes, he's this wise sage or prophet. There are certain religions that consider him just the prophet. mean, the modern day one that is, the more you look at it, is foolishness. He's the good moral teacher. But as Christians, as followers of Jesus, he was never that. I think this talked about last episode, CS Lewis, either a crazy person or he's a liar.

you're like a good moral teacher does not say if you want to follow me drink my blood and eat my flesh. It's like you know literally that's John's like John 6 is one the book of John's incredible because literally it's the entire book is Jesus basically goes on this long

rant, sermon, confrontation, and then they plotted to kill him. And then they sought to kill him. And then they, you know, like literally, so it's like this good moral teacher nonsense. He was actually, I love how Wes Huff says this in his interview with Joe Rogan. was against the moral teachers at the time. He was not a moralist. It's like, whoa. And so John Six is this turning point where every 21st century influencer, CEO,

Church pastor mega church pastor would have advised a hundred percent against because he had this massive following People love him. He's performed miracles through teaching you they were just absorbing it all and he looks around the crowd and he goes I Don't I you know, I got I got a crowd. I don't have followers. I got you know You know, I've got people that are just here for the feel-good. They're not here for the real thing. And you know what? I'm gonna Find out who's for real

Cartwright Morris (05:53.105)
drink my blood and eat my flesh and they all start leaving and he turns to the cyclops and goes, are y'all gonna leave too? Like basically, Peter in Peter's way steps forward and goes, no you're the Christ. It's like, whoo! That'll like makes the hair stand up on your arm. It's like that's the for real stuff.

When we talk about being forged, being the men are forged, this is what I'm talking about. Is when you feel that tension in you of like, this is who I say he is, this is actually true in my life. I've said this out loud, I professed this with my mouth, but do I believe it in my heart when it matters most? I'm in confrontation with my wife, when work is hard, when I have a family member die.

of cancer that I and love. when I experience the tension of life that happens, of bringing faith to life, when it's, when being, when I know what is right and good is in front of me, but I know there are consequences to it in the real world. This is what it means to be forged. Do I choose to step into it? And this is like, you know, and I will say the reason why I came up the men are forged.

in this framework that I feel like it's 10 years of accumulation and when I finally leaned into what this really means. Yeah, because it was in my own life. think I lived a life where I was trying to insulate myself from pain. You you avoid discomfort, you avoid hardship.

And you just kind of like squirming through life and you have no bad, you know, I keep saying this, but if the word, the quote comes up more and more in my life, the ablation of man, CS Lewis, like men without chest. was a man without a chest. And it's like, man, we got to be men with chests, man. Walking in the room. Like this is who I am. This is what I'm about. There's a humble confidence. Yeah. There's a line being drawn here. I'm going to be present. I'm going to love unconditionally, but there's a line I won't cross. These are my

Cartwright Morris (08:02.322)
convictions what mattered to me most and yeah that's hard that's hard when it's cool what's cool about this is it kind of it takes a guesswork out so when you take when you go through something like this framework that we're gonna talk about with car right or somebody like car right you can remove a lot of the guesswork on what that means because a lot think a lot of times guys were like what does that mean for me

You know what mean? Like what are those actual moments that you're talking about? Like if you want to, if you want help defining what those are, it takes going through something like this, filtering a lot of the things like I did for the last six years with you. Hey, this is something I'm going through. What does this look like within this framework? How do we define it and move forward? You know? So it's kind of, yeah, I view this course or

is a curriculum course like what would you call like what would you call the yeah I would call curriculum because I'm putting together and I'm hoping to launch it soon is you know I'm hoping in May to possibly maybe this is one that's come out before May is kind of create like a pilot group maybe take through for six eight weeks but really in the fall kickoff is it's like my young professional man development program yeah where we walk through this content as a

and you learn and get accountable through and discuss with your peers and there's scripture backed up to every one of these points. don't and we basically discuss it from that point but also I think there is a one-on-one mentoring aspect that I really want to get off the ground. There's a combination of the two and it just you know I mean right now I have like a year's worth of content but it's continually ongoing and you can jump in whenever but I'm really hoping to kind of

Yeah, the curriculum through this really development program. It's a most, and I always say it like this. anybody follows me on LinkedIn, I kind of changed some of my headline, but it's more and more I think about it is so many of young professional men are searching professionally, but they're really drifting personally and spiritually. And I want, how do you become that foundation, that foundational part of who you are so that when you step in professionally, you're not swayed, that you're more present.

Cartwright Morris (10:27.9)
that you become the leader, you're developing the right soft skills that really make you invaluable in a marketplace because of who you are, not because of what degree you have or skill set or position or how much money you make, but who you are. I would love, how do you get that foundation personally, professionally, spiritually that leads to professional? Yeah, that's resonant. I love that because it's as guys in our

20s and 30s, are constantly trying to develop and learn new things so that we can grow our career. Right? Well, if you, that's completely separate a lot of times from your home and your life, your Christian walk and stuff like that. So if you are only focusing on the development of your career, then you are, you're not neglecting, but it's almost like the idea. Like I keep having this thought in my mind where like, if you just,

If you're not developing one area of your life, then kind of the world's law is it will rot. Right? So like if something's just sitting still and nothing's happening, it will rot. Now again, not to be confused with the performance mindset that we always talk about, but it's like...

What are you doing to grow this area of your life, your Christian life and your walk with Jesus, how you understand how Jesus views you. And you kind of, you're learning really, what I love about this is you're learning to really co-work with Jesus or co-labor. That's something that you and I've talked about a lot over the years. These two things are not necessarily totally separate. How do you go through these things with, what does Jesus,

teaching me in this issue that I'm having at work. But if you view them completely separate then you're gonna, you know, you're just gonna try to figure it out on your own at work. Now, I mean that works for a lot of guys I guess because there's a lot of successful non-Christians but as Christians we're not.

Cartwright Morris (12:32.766)
We're not called for that. No. Yeah. Yeah. Cause I think, I mean, this goes back to, want to say it was the third episode we talked about just evaluating your motives in life and work.

But I think there is something to it. If career success is your chief goal, it could get muddy. It really gets like convoluted in just what is it that I'm really wanting? Is it just more money? Is it more security? Is it my identity attached to exposition? And I think when we build that foundation personally and spiritually, we then could really be a force in the workplace. We can really be in a place in our

career that we don't live and die off of what happens at work. And we really can actually be of value to people. that's where I'm kind of coming from. And I think going back to what you said of like, all right, how do we really work? What is it, co-laboring term?

It's like same thing, I think, with your wife. It's like you wouldn't just, you know, take a new position somewhere, completely different city, do all the, you know, so, you know, all for your own benefit and career and come home like, hey, this we're doing, pack it up. This is where we're going. Yeah. And your wife goes, uh, thanks for including me. Like, I think Jesus, there's a similar, like, like the marriage metaphor here that's really even with him is

like am I bringing him where he is lord of my life in these decisions in my career and my growth process? So anyway. Yeah, that's perfect. I think kind of to summarize, at least in my mind, it's...

Cartwright Morris (14:23.102)
just in the way we try and develop all the other areas in our lives. Hey, try to develop this spiritual side of your life too. You really need, and it takes effort. takes intention. It takes seeking that development just like everything else does. Right. And so don't, don't neglect this area. It's huge. I mean, it's everything. that's how you should view everything else. Really. And going back to some points that you've made before, and let, you know, it's like, this is not, can't happen in a vacuum. You know, I could probably,

email you all this stuff and you just go, I'm gonna work on it by myself. And it's just not, you're not gonna be challenged, you're not gonna really push, you're not gonna really grow. It has to be with other peers that are just going through the same thing and having, I'm not saying it needs to me, but a mentor to help you really walk through this stuff and work it out, you know, as well as your relationship with God. Like it's like there's the vertical and the horizontal. Like you just got to...

And then eventually you'll have a place where you'll start really helping others do it. And so there's kind of like a threefold to it. so. Yeah. Well, I love it. So what I want to do, so that kind of, that sets it up nicely, I think.

And one of your notes here that really kind of also sums up what we said is the framework this framework we're talking about about to start going into turns the chaos of your 20s and 30s into fuel for transformation and development and growth that we so desperately need so With that being said there's five pillars because forges spelled F O R G E, right? I did not

Check that for did that so that was risky But so obviously first letters F and what

Cartwright Morris (16:13.146)
You have as the first pillar out of the five is one is faithful son Defined as you are not an orphan trying to earn love your beloved son of the father. So It feels like this is almost because each of these Pillars build off the other one and this feels like as a baseline will like and we were saying before What's your perspective of this relationship that you have with Jesus and I'll just talk about mine for a second like and what you've helped me so much with over the

is may not so easily slip into, like we say every week, the performance mindset, where I'm acting like I have to do certain things so that I can earn Jesus' love. I'm not operating from love, I'm operating for love. And so when I understand the way Jesus used me, it's impossible for me to try and act for love.

He already loves me. He's already died for sins past, present, and future. Thank the Lord for that, especially this week with it being Easter. That's huge. with that being said, it feels like this is you come in and you really get an idea of how you truly view your relationship with how...

with Jesus and how he views you. Is that kind of... Yeah, think... Yeah, mean, I think the...

term that people talk about as faithful servant, but I'm kind of like faithful son. Like you're more than just a servant. I no longer call you slaves, call you servant, I call you friends. There's a level of sonship of, and that's the thing is we've kind of convoluted the word son in our modern era, but I think in biblical terms the word son was so rich and deep. this is the bestowing the inheritance, this is the next generation,

Cartwright Morris (18:14.728)
is the one that no matter what I am for and you know I mean Jesus being called the Son of God like that that context is he was he like a lot of that language is trying to help us understand what it means to truly be a son like me and the Father we are one so I think that is where yeah that's the

Cartwright Morris (18:44.574)
I started getting a little emotional there. it's, I don't know why that just hit me so hard. Yeah, I just.

I mean, this is what Christ died for, that we step into the family not earning our way. I think we all have been in that place where we feel like.

our life, our worth is based on what we do. And it's not real. It's so limited to what we can, and when I step into a place of like, my life is the accumulation of who he is and who he says I am, not what I can do, then there is such freedom and release and peace that without understanding, I don't fully get why he chose me, why he loves me, while he, you know, it's like,

But he does. And therefore, it's like out of that place, how do I be faithful what's given to me? That word faithful, it's like, man, I'm more and more, think about it, it's like, what does success look like? It's like, well, what am I faithful with today? Every man you probably, or even woman, like you believe that is faithful, that you look to as successful, they are being faithful for what they've been given. They're not.

And I think that is what at the end of the day I'm trying to build through this forged framework. It's like, are you faithful to little things so therefore you can be trusted with the big things? It's like that if too many men, look and we want to be trusted with the big stuff. We want the legacy, we want the title, the land, the building our kingdom. And it's like, you're not...

Cartwright Morris (20:31.716)
worthy of being trusted, that will crumble you. That will destroy you. That will lead to divorce, alcoholism, midlife crisis, separation from those things that you care about and value. But when you're faithful, that's when you can be trusted with it. And it's something like when I accept that as a son, like that's already mine. That promise is already mine. Then I can just

choose what's in front of me. I don't know. yeah. It's two big, really big words that it's hard to come up in a podcast setting, but I think that's the question we all gotta be like, man, what am I trying to gain from my own effort that I already have because of relationship? And then two, from that, how do I be faithful what's in front of me? You know, I think that's a...

mean, the story that Jesus is really trying to convey in the prodigal son, right? And the story is not actually the prodigal son story. It's the story of a father with two sons. That's how Jesus frames it, right? And they both have missed it. One wanted the benefits without the relationship, so he went off and and squandered it. It crushed him. And one had the relationship...

but miss the benefits, the older brother, right? He's like, I've been doing all this and you never fattened anything. like, and the father's like, looking around like, everything I have is yours. It's already yours. What are you so mad about with the outcome here? That I was trying to celebrate your brother. You you missed it that everything, all the other ones are yours. Yeah, I don't know. It's just, this is, I'm kinda.

feeling just overwhelmed by the two words that obviously the Holy Spirit has given me, but it's like, man, if we could just somehow marry being a son and being faithful to what's given to us.

Cartwright Morris (22:42.524)
But as men, what do we do? We get too excited. And unfortunately, we live in the modern age where we feel like the world's an oyster. We've seen all the pictures on Instagram. We've known all the people who've created so many great things, but we don't think about what's been given to us. It's like, how do I do this well? And I'm guilty of as anybody. It's like, how do I, yeah.

When it hits a little bit different when you have kids too, right? Yeah. I mean, one of the biggest, gosh, I don't know, is the right word, revelation, because I've spent the last...

I guess, well, I became a Christian when I was 17 years old and didn't have Eli until I was 33. So I spent, you know, what is that, 16 years of really truly not understanding the love you could have for a son. Yeah. Right. And because I never had a son. And but when I did, I remember, you know, one of the first nights of having Eli being with him at three thirty a.m. or something, I don't know. And just kind of the quiet.

of night being like, wow, okay.

It makes a little bit more sense now, in terms of just like, mean, he could do, I mean, Eli could do, he could screw up for the, you know, I he could, he could have things wrong for the rest of his life and I will never feel differently about him. Yeah. You know I mean? I will always invest into trying to build his character and instilling discipline and all these things. all the things that God does for us is things we talk about all the time.

Cartwright Morris (24:33.226)
It's like, he's not interested in the outcome, he's interested in the journey. I...

After having a kid, kind of makes a little bit more sense now. I mean, you kind of get a little bit, but I mean, what does he say in scripture? It's infinitely more. Oh, yeah. You know, I mean, it's yeah. So you still don't really fathom it, but you do kind of get a taste a little bit when you have a kid and it just hits different. Yeah. And I think for anyone who do have sons or children out there, I mean, think of, yeah, you probably could think about that. And really, it may help you really try to some way grasp this.

But I do, I mean I had this thought the other day, that really, I think every father, the worst of the worst and the best of the best, deep down they want their intent is never to make their children feel like their love has to be earned.

but what ends up happening is the opposite a lot of times. It's like, my love's conditional. Or I love you if you do this, this, this, and that. Where God, it's like, man, He is the subject of every sentence if you're reading the Bible. God created. For God so loved the world. He is the initiator. It's not like you do this and then it all comes.

And that's where I think when we read scripture we have to see it that way and that helps us. Because I think there is an as a father we could somewhat grasp of like if I can only the rest of my child's life truly convey to them how much I love them and accept them no matter what they do.

Cartwright Morris (26:21.032)
but there's always times of like, I still need you, you know, you know, it's like, I can already feel that now as having a two year old, right? And it's like, man. Yeah. Yeah. It's, it's wild. It's almost like God intentionally does make, know, you, you have kids as infants when they're helpless and you truly have to love them. You know, you really, it is just like loving unconditional training.

They need food, they need sleep, they need to be held, they need to be, you know, and then you get toddlers, right? And it's like, my goodness, you ride the roller coaster of that, right? But God is still like, and then there's the mirror part of that, Yeah. Where?

My God, it's made so hard with someone's like up and down so much. Yeah. And God's like, what about you, big dog? Yeah. You know, you, yeah, yeah. Yeah. You did. You were really praising me when you got that deal the other day, but, know, and then the next day, you know, you were cursing me when you spilled some ketchup on your shirt. So anyway, I don't know. It's, it's, uh, the, the framework of a son is

so wild and can it

Some days feel so attainable and some days it feels so distant because it is such a revelatory concept to grasp. I, as much as I'm on this journey, I want to help men on this journey of discovering being a son before a servant. What it means, like this foundational thing that's in the gospel that He died for us. Not because we did anything, but because of who He is.

Cartwright Morris (28:11.996)
period, the end. And we stepped into the covenant of Abraham as being a son. I'm know, like in Galatians, you are sons of God. That's insane. Well, I mean, it's, that's why it's so important. Like you talk about the, it is a roller coaster, right? Every day is a different day in terms of like how easily you can slip back into the performance mindset or not see yourself as a, as a son, but as a, an employee almost

in a way, you know? That's why it's so important to do this with somebody because you'll do it without even knowing it. Like, you and I have had this conversation over the last six years hundreds of times. honestly, it's kind of funny, but I remember when I was first coming to see Cartwright, probably the 20th time we met, and I remember...

like leaving and being like, gosh, I wonder if he gets tired of having to say the same thing to me every time. sometimes that's what we need it. Just like this repetitive, got to beat it in our head. Got to beat it your head. You got to have it consistently in your life. So it doesn't go anywhere. And this really like, again, it just helps you define it. then.

gives you a way to move forward. I think the worst places we can probably be as men in our 20s and 30s is not being, it's almost like you're going down a track and if you get a little bit off track not having the help to get back on it because if it were up to me, I'd go off track and then.

I'd look up in a year from now and I would be way off course instead of having somebody along the way kind of help you decipher, define things and get you back on to the right, at least mindset. It's not doing the right things, but it's getting you right back in the right mindset, which then in turn, you typically do better things. But one before the other for sure.

Cartwright Morris (30:23.196)
But yeah, anyway, so okay, so why it matters in your 20s and 30s, this is within the curriculum, but it defines it as most guys in their 20s and 30s experience burnout, they're people pleasing.

identity crises come from living as spiritual orphans. A faithful son rests and I am loved therefore I can risk. What do you mean I can I'm loved therefore I can risk? What do you mean by that?

Yeah, well, one, don't live and die off the opinion of others. Getting that ingrained in your 20s and 30s, really is like a, I always like to use this analogy because it's funny. I had a good friend of mine growing up and in high school and.

You know, he, could feel his insecurity a lot of times, especially around girls, girls he was interested in and he just felt that. And then he went off into the military and I think even went into, um, did some special forces stuff. And then I got around him after that and it was like, and I, next time I saw him was in a very public place where there's a lot of men trying to impress one another. It like, I have like a networking, a big event thing and he just was unimpressed. And there's just something to,

that I just kind of was like, yeah, I Christians we need to that almost like a special forces mindset. I've just like been there done that. Like I'm just not impressed. You know, it's funny because and he was a prime example because I remember him in high school. Like I remember how insecure he was and then I saw him on the other side. You know, he's a strong follower Jesus. I'm a you know, I know what he's doing right now. I'm like wow. Anyway, there is that I don't know there was just something that resonated me as a man.

Cartwright Morris (32:09.928)
It's like man, that's like how to

Cartwright Morris (32:15.763)
win.

Therefore if I don't if I'm not living and dying off the opinions of the fear of man as a terminology to use the opinions of other people around me But actually who God says I am then I can then step into places and go huh and take risk and people go well That's stupid. Don't do that. I think there's an episode. I talked about some of those Voices of the past and sometimes they could be like these nagging ghosts in our life. That's that like speak into our ear like why are you doing that? That's stupid

dumb, you know? That doesn't make any sense, you know? sometimes those are old voices or sometimes those are current voices in our life. And how do you then kind of, when I'm settled in who I am and who God says I am, those voices you don't live and die off of? You may listen to them. There could be some wisdom in some of them of like, you maybe think a little bit different and evaluate. But I don't live and die. I don't like question my motives. I don't question

who I am because of their opinion. But I can actually take risk in a place and go, okay, I'm taking risk from a place of knowing I'm secure. Knowing that God is leading me in this place. I'm not doing this out of my own ambition, out of my own...

frustration or doing this for some people pleasing adventure or some form of man's recognition. I'm doing this solely because this is what, know, truly why I believe God's called me to me being faithful what's given and therefore I can take the risk. So, but this is the thing about being a faithful son, I think I'm sure we'll get to in other ones, it's like...

Cartwright Morris (33:58.079)
doesn't mean the results are there, as I've learned the hard way. at the end of the day, that question has followed me in some of the risks I've taken the last five years. The question of, God, was I really following you? Was I really listening to you? And the question is always yes, because God's not necessarily interested in the result.

I think I was a lot like some other men. was drifting through life and I wanted to really grow and build something. So I took risks. I did it from a place of like following Jesus and there's so much that he honed that a lot of this stuff we're talking about came out of it. I was like, oh yeah, this is what God's building in me and helping me grasp and understand my ministry, my calling. So yeah.

Yeah, think that's at the end of that's what kind of what I mean. We're taking risks from a place of stability, of security that's not in the world and from a standpoint of just even money or, know, but a standpoint of our security in him.

that truly can be forged. Yeah. Tested. Tested. Forfined. Right? That really is like that stuff that you wouldn't know until you actually went out and gave a shot. Well, and I think there's probably, I mean, this is all over scripture, right? This, I'm trying to think back to like what Jesus actually said and, and,

things like that, you know, the one that we have here is Paul in his letter to Romans, so Romans 8, 15, 17, he says that you receive God's Spirit when he adopted you. Right? You receive God's Spirit when he adopted you as his own children.

Cartwright Morris (35:52.393)
Alright, so then we can cry out Abba Father, which Abba is like daddy, right? It's like, it's that intimate emotional connection. Not necessarily a title, but more of a relationship, right? Kind of displaying that. But again, you receive God's Spirit when He adopted you as His own children. I like how it's past tense. It's done. He did it.

You know what mean? He's adopted you. You're in the family. What Paul didn't say was, hey, after you say this creed and after you do this thing, whatever happens in religion, you know what mean? After you take this kind of communion or do whatever, then he'll accept you as his own children. No, he adopted you as his own children. already happened.

That's a, I don't know, man. I mean, it's like you were saying before. I mean, it's just like, it's the foundation of everything else we do here. mean, it's, it is who we are and how we view ourselves because of what's in scripture is.

It builds everything else which we'll get into and the whole point of the framework is You know this first one Faithful son, which is the F in Forge, you know, we get into the others which is offensive servant reflective leader grounded person an enduring man but none You can't really learn about the others until we get this one. Yeah until we get this one right and really understand all the other ones are just like

this guy it's like it's you're trying to fit a formula to fix yourself it just doesn't work unless until you get this this part it's the foundation of yeah really all of Christianity yeah yeah I mean in

Cartwright Morris (37:48.367)
good podcast, you know, that I've recommended before people is the Bema podcast. It's like this Messianic Jew, God. It's like this was the beginning, when even, you know, Moses writing Genesis 1, that here you have, you know, Moses taking the slaves, Jewish slaves, out of Egypt.

That was their framework. My worth was living and dying off of whether I could build.

make a brick, know, put a, you know, that was like, I was a slave. was purely what I could do was what my worth was based on. And then here, God says, no, you're created in my own image. You are because I created you because of how I see you are mine. Therefore you have value and worth. It's like that's in Genesis one, man, that we completely forget. Like the whole theme of just one is the God of rest. Like he is the God like rest in.

that, not in what you can do. And that's the conflict that he was trying to instill from the very beginning with the Israelites in the desert of like, this is what makes you valuable because you're mine, not because what you can do. And you think somebody, a generation of 400 years of slave, like, that's gonna be tough. So don't act, so I say that to encourage you, you're not alone.

One thing I, we mentioned this last week in last week's episode too, but man, one thing, I think I came last week with a similar thought of something that's just continuously rattling around in my brain and I keep thinking about it and it's kind of along the same lines you're talking about is,

Cartwright Morris (39:37.311)
the thief on the cross next to Jesus. just can't get it. It's just the coolest thing to me that I've never seen before in Scripture. But I heard somebody talking about it it just it just kind of helped click like truly this thief on the cross was he went from mocking Jesus to taking a step of faith to know Jesus. Yeah. And then when they died, you know a few minutes or hours later, I don't know where he was in the actual being on the cross.

But when the thief on the cross died, you know, he was like Jesus said, you're going to see me in paradise. So this guy shows up in heaven.

And he's done nothing. I mean, he's literally done nothing. He's been to zero church services. He's done zero, probably, study of Scripture. He's spent his whole life being dishonest and finally catching up to him. But he did one thing at the very end. He reached out and he...

sought Jesus in a way even at the last second of like just reaching out to get to know him and then seeking him and and Jesus said you'd be in paradise. He did nothing. He had nothing else to give. Nothing. Yeah. And here I am trying to perform. Yeah. You know what mean? Like I wake up every morning with this thought of I have to perform. And so anyway, I mean just the

I mean, I don't know. keep saying it, but he literally, he had nothing to offer.

Cartwright Morris (41:13.392)
You know what mean? He had lived this life of complete dishonesty. And he just in that one moment of just simply seeking him was in paradise the next few minutes. glimpse of who he is and then proclaiming it. And I love how the Alistair, I think it's Alistair Payne, I can't remember how to his name. Scottish guy. Scottish guy who brought this in. It's like he just, he shows up in heaven. People are like, how'd you get here? And he went, I just know that guy.

the guy in the middle cross.

Nothing about a creed, nothing about anything else. He probably saw Jesus in heaven and pointed at him and was like, I know that guy. I know who he is. You know what I mean? I wonder if along the way, he had seen Jesus, I don't know. We don't know. The thing is, we don't know. That's mystery of it that's so powerful. What? Anyway, that's been rattling around my brain all week long.

So, mean, you know, we are faithful sons, not because we chose that, but because God chose us, Jesus chose us. And so, stop, stop trying to, stop trying to work for this. Stop trying to work for this. Like when I get up and I, you know, say I have a bad few months with having my quiet time in the morning.

You know what mean? My mind immediately, and you know this, I've talked to you about this. My mind immediately goes to, well, this whole day shot. I didn't check that box. you know, we'll try again tomorrow. If I get it right, then I'll be able to have a relationship with you. You know what mean? Like it's just ingrained in us and it's ingrained in me. And even after six years of working with you and going through this framework, it's still there. But

Cartwright Morris (43:07.876)
I do now have the tools because I've gone through this with you to kind of combat that in real time. And be turned off. Yeah. It's like, well no, wait a minute. That's not true. Right. Whereas if I didn't go through something like this with you, would easily slip into it. Yeah. And I will probably would have created my own religion by now. Right. You know what mean? Which some people have.

without even knowing it. These are the things you have to do, You know what mean? Let me just say this for those who kind of resonate with Beau's story and have a similar personality. I would say God made you a doer. That's part of your personality. He designed you to, in some ways, think that way. But we always need the redemptive nature of the cross and who he is.

You said combat. think there is like, yes, that thought can lead to some horrible stuff and it's led some men to go that way, right? That, you I think it's wild. Like we see in scripture and we've seen it last 2000 years even before that, right? sorry, believing Jesus ain't good enough. Gotta do all this other stuff, right? They've added to it and that's probably that type of mindset. I think there is, like, how do we, you know, with how God designed us

you know, learn to shed what the stuff, like being made more into his image, the sense, you know, it's kind of the language in scripture, but it's like...

How do I take that desire, that good, that, okay, He designed me this way, but here's where it could go bad. But here's also where it's good. When I do this out of being a faithful son, out of knowing who I am in Him, is actually I can use it for good. And there's that tension of life, right? Well, yeah, and I think, yes, 100%.

Cartwright Morris (45:08.414)
And there's a way to think of that more. I think you're right. think I'm so resistant of being the doer sometimes, at least spiritually, that I don't see the value in it a lot. So you and I talked one time, I still remember this. But I was going through the season. So obviously, we've talked about it before, but I was a college football coach. so getting out of that, getting out of the college football life where it was 90 hours a week and

You know, and the whole purpose of getting out was so that I could really, so I could, you know, stay married and I've not, Carly would have stayed with me. I'm not saying that, but I'm just, you know, have a healthier marriage and be able to start a family and be at home and things like that. But when I got out, I had this natural thought of, now that I'm out, I still feel some guilt with how drawn I am to the game. You know, cause I'm a complete football nerd.

it all year long. It doesn't matter who's playing. I love the schemes and I've learned so much about it that it's like I get to like when I'm watching it I get it's something I truly understand you know what mean? And so I'm drawn to it. Well you told me one time you were like well hold on could God have put that in you? Yeah. And you know after I thought for probably 30 minutes to myself I was like well he had to.

I didn't put it in myself.

Anyway, I'm trying to speak to the, you know, having something in you like being a doer or, or, you know, something else that God really wants to use. Yeah. You know what I mean? And so it's not necessarily always bad, which I think that I always go to, well, if, it's led me to bad things before it must be bad. Right. You know what I mean? Or like, you know, it's not that simple, Beau, you know, it's just not that simple. Um, so anyway, do you remember saying that? Oh, a hundred percent. I remember having that conversation.

Cartwright Morris (47:10.524)
That was a good one because I think there is I mean this what we do as men and getting that permission to I'm sorry

Cartwright Morris (47:23.022)
Yeah, I think as men it's like learning There's I'm trying not to get too theological or philosophical here right because we think about we can be dualistic that there's a compartmentalization this is the bad and God, know, this is the good and when really like God is the whole being that we delight in ourself in the Lord and he gives us desires of our heart meaning there's like There's a way to

This is what I mean stepping in as a son. I could really start evaluating and therefore I have access Because then I could then ask God is this desire of you? This is something that you you gave me and therefore I can discern and Put it in its rightful place Because I think right. Yeah, I mean like the desire to be successful that Jesus was excellent in everything he did

Therefore, same way, we should be excellent in what we do. That's not like in our job, right? That's why we have a platform to speak in other people's lives as believers when we are excellent in what we do. That's what a lot of Christians miss because they do that thought process you staff. They compartmentalize. this is secular. This is the sacred, the spiritual.

Right? It's back to the co-laboring concept. And it's like, because I'm a son, I have access to ask, to process, to think, to learn, to discern. Like, all right, is this a true motive and desire of my heart?

that pulls me away from God or God this is something you gave me that I just need to learn how to steward and understand more. That's a part of being faithful what's been given to you. know? Anyway. Yeah. All things that come along a lot more naturally when in this first pillar you view yourself as a faithful son. To be able to go to your father and say hey what is this desire I have and how do I keep it from you know becoming something that I worship in a way. Yeah. You know like how can I

Cartwright Morris (49:32.273)
How can I, like what have you, so you use me again as the guinea pig, like with football, right? How can I, you've clearly put this love of this game inside of me. I love everything about it. I love the, I love practice. I love the off season. I love the workouts. I love the, I used to love the long hours, like trying to figure out a way to work together with a group of guys to win that week. You know what mean? That was, I loved it.

And I still, but I viewed, get to do some of that in my job now. That's beside the point. I'm going down a rabbit hole. but, it's the, Hey God, clearly you've put this in me. so how can I do it to where,

I can be part of in some way that honors you and it doesn't quickly skirt into something to where, you know, I say, well, God put this in me, so I have to do this every day on Saturday all day and not spend time with my family, right? There's two different roads there. anyway, so it's the co-laboring to figure it out. Right. And I think that's a real good example because you're right. think all men of us we have out there of like,

just different desires that really, if not held in tension, not held with this truth of a son, that we can easily, and I think what we've been trying to talk to in this podcast is kind of talk to those men and learn how to discern that it's not evil.

but out of your relationship with God, know its rightful place. And so, yeah, and that could, and that's where sometimes we don't know what does that redemptive, that desire, how it's redemptive in our life look like until we get there. It could be something that really connects you with your son. That could be talking about the game. It could lead you back to the coaching. could, there's a thousand different, but we don't know until we actually step in relationship and actually give it over. It's almost like,

Cartwright Morris (51:38.878)
Abraham and Isaac it's like until I this desire that I had for so long and you gave it to me You know, and then now I have to give him back to you as a sacrifice And God really testing do you do value me in our relationship over than what I've been what I've this desire that I've given you? it's like yikes Yeah, right and that's that's the tension that's the the forging yeah that God's really trying

into I think asking us all like is, you know, anyway. Yeah, I think to kind of maybe kind of put a bow on it. Yeah, it's kind of there's so many things like that in our lives. It's work. It's desires you have, you know, like, you know, use the football one for me, but that certainly is one for a lot of guys. Anything you are pursuing or that you really love or how do you do it?

How do you do it and co-labor with Jesus in that and kind of understand how it's, why he's put that in you, right? Things that, mean, at least for me, maybe there's some really, really smart guys out there that don't need help dissecting and doing it, but I doubt it. You know what I mean? Like, I just doubt it.

So I would just say, man, if you're interested in proactively doing something that's developing this relationship that we have with Jesus, right? Not in just, and not viewing it completely separate from everything that we do, but viewing it in how we do life every single day. Do this framework. Like go through it, learn about it, and then get with car right and figure out.

Hey, this is something that, or this is the way I view God because of this past or this history that I have and then allow that to kind of be.

Cartwright Morris (53:36.902)
worked and massaged and in conversation with Carl Wright to figure out, hey, well this, understand completely where you're coming from. Let me tell you why that's right and why that's wrong. And then work through the tension of that together. know what mean? Gosh, how valuable is that? But you have to do it with somebody that really knows and has spent the last 10 years coming up with this framework, right? And maybe call me biased, but this is definitely the way to go.

add to this, so maybe a good starting call to action here is one, MitterForge is live, the website, and something I'm putting on there that only costs your email address is the Forge baseline assessment. So that could be a starting place where you take the assessment, it's 20 questions, pretty simple. Oh, you can do the assessment online? Yeah. Oh, Nice. Yeah. mean, I might, if somebody asks

today I could email it to them. But I will have that up on the website of take the Minnerforge baseline assessment and it really kind of gives a breakdown and you could have that for your own value or whatever. It really helps you being honest. I promise only I will see it and it could be just a starting place to kind of evaluate and understand where we're at and where you're at and how I can help.

I think that was it. Is that kinda how we went into it? That's it. Alright. Thank y'all for listening. Yeah, send in your questions. Is that all we got? that's it. Or show up, be a live audience. Yeah, oh yeah. That'd be sick. That'd be sick.