The Black Med Connect Podcast

Integrative Medicine: A Holistic Approach to Healthcare with Dr. Shakira Sanchez-Collins

• Dr Jasmine Weiss/ Rev. Dr. Shakira-Sanchez Collins • Season 1 • Episode 16

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Dive into the world of Integrative Medicine in part two of this week's conversation with Rev. Dr. Shakira Sanchez-Collins. 🩺🎙️ As a primary care Internal Medicine physician and an Integrative Medicine specialist at Northwestern School of Medicine, she's a true healthcare trailblazer. Join us as she describes her daily medical practice, highlights her community connections as a minister and physician with a focus on wellness, and provides valuable insights as an early career faculty member. Don't miss out on this enlightening discussion at the intersection of medicine, wellness, and spirituality! Stick around to the end to check out the Bolus Round, our fun rapid-fire round, where she shares more about her dream vacation, go-to workout playlist, and more! Don't forget to visit drshakira.com to learn more about her upcoming wellness courses!

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Speaker 1:

So what is integrative medicine? How does an internal medicine doctor balance her practice and the practice of integrative medicine along with primary care? Well, if you heard our last episode with Dr Shakira Sanchez Collins, then you know that she is a primary care internal medicine physician and an integrative medicine specialist at Northwestern. In this week's episode we jump into what she does on a daily basis, how she bridges her expertise to bridge the community and her physician practice, as well as what are some things and tips for early career faculty members as we're all moving along this journey. If you liked part one last week, where she shared how she began in medicine, then you'll definitely enjoy part two. Let's jump right into the episode. Roll the music. So you mentioned that it sounds like you are able to integrate your physician background very well with your background and being clergy, and do you feel like what's the reception like from the physician side with you being clergy? Can you speak a little bit to how that overlaps? You know, in your day to day now?

Speaker 2:

So from other, from the perspective of other physicians, given that I'm a pastor in a Black church it's actually really well-welcome because it is a point of community outreach and so often when we work for these large organizations, they're always trying to figure out how to get better.

Speaker 1:

Yes, how do we do this?

Speaker 2:

And so it's often well received when they're because what? Why it's happening is that I'm a trust voice in both spaces and so often, when once one space wants a perspective or someone to speak, they're going to often go to me for that and for that opportunity. And the interesting other part is I've also had patients who don't necessarily, you know, identify as having a specific religious affiliation, and I've had patients that will go on YouTube and watch my sermons, and of all race and ethnicities, and for them they'll say like that they were inspired by those words and that also contributes to the trust that they have in me as a physician.

Speaker 1:

Yes, it's just an opportunity it sounds like to just really build that relationship in a way that is so unique. A lot of physicians, you know some shy away from the faith-based aspect of their patients. Others lean right into it. I've had similar experiences where you know a patient wants to pray, I'm ready, let's do it. You know, and, as you said, it doesn't matter the religious affiliation. But sometimes people just feel comfortable because they know that from your perspective, that's something you may share with them.

Speaker 1:

And so I think that's amazing, amazing what you do and how you integrate the care you provide as a physician with the community focus. Because, again, like you said, we're in a situation where we have to figure out how to connect with the community because a lot of times there is such a disconnect between, you know, perspectives on healthcare and perspectives on the system itself. So any opportunities we have to bridge that gap we really I'm glad we get to take advantage of and I'm so glad you're able to kind of bridge the gap for both of those as well, and so I love this conversation. I would love to know a little bit more, because we've talked about your experiences in residency, we've talked about your experiences as clergy and how you integrate that. But you also are a subspecialist in integrative medicine as well and I would love to know how did that part come together? And it seems like you're able to use that now as a wellness and as an advocate, but how did that kind of come together for you?

Speaker 2:

So, interesting enough, when we were actually in medical school, we were taken to the. Duke Center of Integrative Medicine at the time. Even then, you know, we were in our last year of medical school. We were ready to go. I think we had matched at that point.

Speaker 1:

It was just extra.

Speaker 2:

I was like yes, let's go Right, Like okay, you're going to take us to this place. And so I think, looking back, I think that was really important for me to go there. And so, even before I knew about integrative medicine, I was still thinking that my role as physician and pastor, coming together, was going to be to help people flourish in my body and spirit. That is, that is my motto of my life, my mantra, and so when I found my integrative medicine, I realized that it was a good segue to that. So let me talk about what integrative medicine actually looks like.

Speaker 2:

Integrative medicine is basically combining conventional and both alternative therapies and treatments together, and so it's not like one or the other, is actually both.

Speaker 2:

And so you, the way I practice medicine now, having done the fellowship, is, for example, if I'm dealing with a particular condition, it may be upper prescription medication, it may be also certain vitamins or supplements, it may be certain mind and body practices which will be like acupuncture, meditation, yoga, where I provide multiple recommendations for a condition, that's addressing it from an integrative perspective.

Speaker 2:

And so that path to do integrative medicine there's really like two paths there and they're kind of similar. You can either, after you finish a residency, you can do a full-time fellowship. That's typically two years, where you're a full-time fellow and often most of them are going to be sometimes more research-based institutions or maybe sometimes more clinical-based. The other way into integrative medicine is you're done with residency and you're in attending, and so there's a lot of fellowships where you use your medical education funds from your position amen, and you can actually do a fellowship that's more so part-time, so you're still working as an attending physician, but you're going to classes and you're learning alongside. So I actually did the second one and so now, as I have just finished my fellowship, I'm able to practice integrative medicine also with my primary care.

Speaker 1:

Fantastic. Do you have a separate subset of patients who are coming specifically for that, or do you work in the primary care setting and just try to incorporate that skill set as you go each day? How does the practice actually look for you?

Speaker 2:

That's a really good question and these are really great questions, because when you're in medical school or residency you don't really know what half of stuff is actually out there.

Speaker 2:

You don't know what it really means.

Speaker 2:

So I just want to first say in those first five-plus years of being attending, there's going to be so much more you're going to learn that actually exists out there.

Speaker 2:

I was a hospitalist first, which means that I was an internist, an intern-meds doctor that was taking care of patients in the hospital, and then I decided to try something different and I decided to do primary care at Northwestern and there's a center for integrative medicines called the OSHA Center for Integrative Medicine, and so they have primary care and then they have integrative medicine physicians who only do integrative medicine but they don't do primary care, so they're not your longitudinal, you know continuity physician and then you have, like, your dietitian, your acupuncture, your chiropractor, your massage therapist, all in one clinic, and so just by being in that clinic as primary care, we get patients who want both, even physicians who haven't done the primary care, physicians that haven't done integrative medicine, fellowship. They've been there long enough where they've picked up on things, and so that's what people come looking for, and so we're able to offer it. So it's not really a subset. I would say it's probably an 80% overlap.

Speaker 1:

Fantastic, fantastic Is there. Can you give an example, because for some people, this is truly probably the first time they've ever heard of integrative medicine. What's some? You can pick a diagnosis that you may see commonly. What would be the trajectory where you integrate some of your other colleagues, like your, you know, maybe your acupuncturist or your dietitian? We use dietitians regularly, but can you share an example?

Speaker 2:

Yeah, so a common complaint that I would get or concern would be insomnia or trouble sleeping. So even just my approach is really asking you know, not just what are their sleep behaviors before bed and things like that, but also asking what's going on in your life, because the integrative medicine is also like getting at the core of things, like well, the root cause of things. So like what's going on in your life, what is causing your body not to be able to come to a state of rest? Because you know, and sometimes the insomnia is like a secondary symptom of something that may be larger. So that's one thing.

Speaker 2:

Other things is often we'll start off with. We'll try different supplements that will be helpful for sleep, that are over the counter, and but the difference is is that instead of me just saying, oh, take this supplements, I specifically say this is how much you take when you take it. The next level of that would be, of course, talking about well, if you can really stress right now, why don't you also try some acupuncture? And to see which is when they place the little needles in your skin? You know, why don't we, why don't you try some acupuncture sessions right now to help you sleep, and then we also will talk about. Okay, what type of food are you eating? And also, you know, are you physically active? So really, you're looking at a lot of different parts of why someone is having a hard time resting. Well, and so it's still evidence based. It's not just random supplements, but you're picking what is the most common supplements that help in the case of insomnia.

Speaker 1:

I love that. I love that. It's so important. I feel like, let me ask it this way Do you feel like you have enough time to ask all of those questions? Because I know sometimes as an attending, it doesn't matter really what stage you're in, even as a resident. One big thing we have to balance most days is making sure we get to see all the patients in the most timely manner that we can. So how do you balance digging deeper? Or do you have that time allotted to you to kind of take the time to go through and take a deeper dive and figure out how do we best help the patient?

Speaker 2:

Yeah, so I think it also depends on the structure of your clinic. Yes, at Northwestern our appointments are 20 minutes for returns and typically 20 or 40 minutes for, like new patients, or sometimes for annuals. And so what I have realized that's the benefit of the relationship of a patient and physician continuity. I definitely by now, like I know how to address insomnia in a pretty quick fashion and ask the questions really quickly. It's still get to where I need to get, but then, like there's other things that we need to do. I do a lot of like okay, let's do this follow up and we only talk about that more specifically. So I haven't run into any issues. But I also I know there's some clinics that might do only 15 appointments. There is some reality here, based off of where you're, where you're working.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, absolutely. I love that and so that you just gave some really great advice to newer attendings. We're still newer, I mean honestly, but I think it bears repeating that. Like if you get into a situation where you feel like you don't have enough time, just ask the patient to come back so you can continue to explore whatever you're working through, and most people would want to do that because they want to be heard.

Speaker 2:

I maybe talk it to myself, give myself another reminder and I have found it okay where sometimes, if someone has a lot going on, I will meet with them more frequently and then, as things like simmer down, we space it out Exactly.

Speaker 2:

I love it and so, especially with now you have like telemedicine. I do a lot of telemedicine along with my in person and really I use my telemedicine for much more of those like integrative conversations. I use my telemedicine to do a lot of mental health. I feel like that's the great part of the different types of systems, because it's a lot easier to do it, because I'm doing telemedicine like in huge trunks versus it being always like integrated in between the in person.

Speaker 1:

Oh, that's fascinating. So do you have some days where you mostly do in person and then other days where you mostly do telemedicine?

Speaker 2:

I do. I got a day where I only do telemedicine. Okay, it's always great to ask questions to your colleagues because this is how you learn, like, what are the different possibilities out there. So for me, most people that are a Northwestern at this point in primary care are doing one full day of telemedicine. And so because I do integrated and primary care, I am doing a mix of both, but that's when I do more integrative medicine or I do it in my annual exams because they're longer.

Speaker 1:

Absolutely, that makes sense. That makes sense, you know. That's one thing that's come from the pandemic, I'll say the uptake and receptivity to telehealth visits and telemedicine visits, and figuring out how that's going to look now that we are in a different stage and what's going to look like in the future is something that we're all talking about as early career, faculty and beyond. It's always interesting to hear how different people have their practice set up, and so I just have a few more questions, and you've alluded to this a few times. We've talked about your experiences as a trainee. We've talked about your experiences, how you balance that and how you use your skills to kind of impact the community, and we've also talked about your integrative medicine career as well and how you're doing that.

Speaker 1:

Are you interested in taking a deeper dive with BlackMed Connect? Then join our BlackMed Connector newsletter. Each week you'll hear more about our guests and go behind the scenes to get a deeper dive into their careers. You will get the professional productivity word of the week and you'll get to see and learn more about amazing physicians doing wonderful things in entrepreneurship and innovation. So head on over to bmedconnectcom slash podcast and join the BlackMed Connector newsletter. Back to the episode. How do you see yourself? You mentioned that you are a wellness expert. What's next for you? How do you see yourself utilizing your skills?

Speaker 2:

That is a great question and you know, to all of those who are at different points of this medical journey, you know you continue to reinvent your goals.

Speaker 1:

Yes, yes.

Speaker 2:

Each year of life you learn more than you knew you know the previous year. So, in terms of where I'm going now, I definitely want to bring my, my work, both as pastor and physician, more into one cohesive concept, and so I definitely am working on creating wellness online courses on my website. So a lot of that is in the works too, because there's a, there's a need, there is a desire for people to learn how to live well mentally, physically and spiritually. So bringing that into together space in the entrepreneurial world, really honing in on my work as a public speaker also as someone who can speak to wellness from a very rich and wide perspective and so I really still figuring out how that's coming together, but I'm excited about the possibilities.

Speaker 2:

I think that we live in an era where being a physician can look different from the previous generations that have come before us. We're in this era of social media being so well used across the world, so that just creates more opportunities. I think that it's going to come together, you know, with just I love how, jasmine, how you have written your own books and things like that. I think there's space for us to explore the different parts of our talents and skills, that we are physicians, but we're also more than physicians.

Speaker 1:

Absolutely, and it's so great to you know, when we started together, we were all medical students, right, and so you almost have this idea that it has to be one specific way.

Speaker 1:

So I love, love the fact that you know you've gone along your journey.

Speaker 1:

I've gone along my journey and others have as well, and it's just so fascinating to see how we're making an impact in a variety of different ways. And I just want to say to those listening it may be you may not see how you're going to make that impact 10 years from now, but as long as you continue along the path and pursue what you're passionate about, I think one thing I've heard from you throughout this entire time is you've pursued things that you were passionate about, that were interesting to you, that felt right in the time. That speak to who you are as a person. It shapes up the way that it's supposed to win the right time and in the right moment, and I think our communities need that and our patients need us to be the passionate people that we are and then, on top of that, being the dedicated physicians that we are. So I'm excited to see what what you do next. Can you share your website and how people can learn more about the wellness courses that you're working on.

Speaker 2:

Yes, definitely so. My website is Dr Shakira Dr S-H-A-K-I-R-Acom, and you can also follow me on Instagram at Dr Shakira. On my Instagram, I'm constantly putting out wellness tips that are bridging my primary care and integrative medicine knowledge. Nice, great tidbits to help people sleep better, have more energy, eat better and just live well Mentally, physically and spiritually.

Speaker 1:

I love it. I love it, and we'll be sure to include your social media handles as well in the episode show notes, whether that be on YouTube or across platforms. This has been phenomenal. I think I'm excited to see where you go. And we're not done yet.

Speaker 1:

We got to hop into our bolus round, and so, if this is your first time watching or listening during the bolus round, it's a rapid fire round where I ask my guests some questions about themselves and just have some fun. But if you don't know what a bolus is, in medicine we give a bolus or we give a push of fluids a lot of times in emergency settings or in settings where a patient may be dehydrated or there may have been a trauma and there's a lot of blood loss. So there's a variety of reasons why we give this rapid push of fluids, but it's normally quick, and so we're going to get right into our bolus round now. So are you ready? Yes, let's go, all right, all right. So if you had to choose one self care activity to do for the rest of your life only one what would that be?

Speaker 2:

For me, it would be walking alongside water, because water is very calming and full of meditation.

Speaker 1:

Yes, oh, I love it. I love the ocean. So, along those lines, if you had only one vacation destination left in for the rest of your life, what would be the one place you go?

Speaker 2:

Wow, that was hard. Oh, it's any one vacation. It would probably somewhere on the continent of Africa or South Asia, I'm not sure where, but it would be.

Speaker 1:

That doesn't answer the question. You only get one choice I can't go with them. You can go with that. You can go with that, you can go with that you can go with that.

Speaker 2:

I'll go with that. That's because I feel like I'm yet to travel more. I need to do more travels.

Speaker 1:

Yes, I think, now that we have a little more freedom, it's time for all of us to get out there a little bit. Okay, so what if you only had to choose your favorite 90s TV show? What would be your choice? Living?

Speaker 2:

single. I was not old enough to be watching that, but I love that show.

Speaker 1:

Yes, we are living.

Speaker 2:

No, but what else would buy at nine Girl?

Speaker 1:

Absolutely, absolutely. I love it. I love it. All right. And then, if you are working out and you are going to turn on your playlist, what are we going to find on your playlist during your workout?

Speaker 2:

For workout purposes, I would say Megan Thee, stallion and Cardi B. Those to me are like the best for working out.

Speaker 1:

Yes, get you going there. Excellent, excellent, all right, and so you are in Chicago. So what is your favorite black owned restaurant to visit in Chicago?

Speaker 2:

Let's go with Virtue Restaurant that's in Hyde Park. He's one of my favorite neighbors at Chicago, a virtual restaurant. He was recognized for multiple awards Great place, upscale soul food. So if you're in Chicago you should check them out, and I know they did not sponsor me on this.

Speaker 1:

Right, Exactly. Well, you know if you're in that area. Now you know where to go to get you some good upscale soul food Awesome, Okay. Last question Well, maybe not Two more. If you wanted to rep any organization, I know one that we should both rep. But if you want to rep an organization, what would you like to rep?

Speaker 2:

So, yes, I am repping Delta Sigma, Theta sorority incorporated. Yes, and I'm also wrapping myself, dr Shakira.

Speaker 1:

Yes, I love it. I love it, dr Shakiracom. Yes, I love it. Well, thank you so much for spending time with us today, and I'm sure the audience will get so much out of this amazing, amazing episode. I always like to say I love to celebrate what you're doing, and I think it's important for those in the community and for those who are on along the medical journey to get to celebrate one another, because we work so hard and we take care of others. But I just want you to know we appreciate what you are doing and so, with that, thank you, thank you, thank you and to my audience, thank you again for listening and for rocking with us during these first episodes. As we get going here and so, drop a comment below about what stood out to you in this amazing interview with Dr Shakira Sanchez Collins, and until next time, always remember to dream without limits.

Speaker 1:

Bye, we hope you enjoyed this week's episode with the amazing Dr Shakira Sanchez Collins. We are so excited that she shared her journey with us to medicine and beyond. She's doing phenomenal things as an assistant pastor, as a internal medicine physician and an integrative medicine specialist. Don't forget to visit Dr Shakiracom to learn more about her wellness courses. If you haven't done so already, please like, share and subscribe the Black man Connect podcast to others. So hit that thumbs up button if you're watching on YouTube and share across all platforms. We are so delighted and want to say thank you to all of those who are listening and watching us each week on YouTube as we continue to grow. We hope you continue to share if you are getting value out of this podcast. If you're on YouTube, click below this video what was your favorite part of the episode and if you're listening on a podcast platform, don't forget to leave us a review for the Black man Connect podcast. Until next time, always remember to dream without limits. Bye.