{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"startTime":0.184,"endTime":3.994,"body":"He was living a double life. What moments"},{"startTime":0.184,"endTime":3.994,"body":"were real and what moments were planned?"},{"startTime":4.314,"endTime":9.152,"body":"At what point did he decide"},{"startTime":4.314,"endTime":9.152,"body":"that he was gonna pursue at all costs"},{"startTime":9.153,"endTime":10.554,"body":"achieving the money?"},{"startTime":10.613,"endTime":13.415,"body":"Was it from the very beginning"},{"startTime":10.613,"endTime":13.415,"body":"or did he start to get"},{"startTime":13.416,"endTime":15.774,"body":"the idea as things got rolling?"},{"startTime":16.864,"endTime":20.888,"body":"I'm Kerry McAvoy and this is the Breaking"},{"startTime":16.864,"endTime":20.888,"body":"Free from Narcissistic Abuse podcast,"},{"startTime":20.889,"endTime":22.938,"body":"where we expose toxic and abusive"},{"startTime":22.939,"endTime":25.793,"body":"relationship dynamics"},{"startTime":22.939,"endTime":25.793,"body":"so that you can spot them early."},{"startTime":26.143,"endTime":30.214,"body":"This is for educational purposes"},{"startTime":26.143,"endTime":30.214,"body":"and is not a substitute for mental health care,"},{"startTime":30.215,"endTime":32.824,"body":"medical care, legal advice,"},{"startTime":30.215,"endTime":32.824,"body":"or crisis support."},{"startTime":35.03,"endTime":36.302,"body":"When does rumination,"},{"startTime":36.303,"endTime":37.516,"body":"that mental looping,"},{"startTime":37.517,"endTime":38.73,"body":"hit you the hardest?"},{"startTime":39.04,"endTime":42.291,"body":"Is it when you're driving alone,"},{"startTime":39.04,"endTime":42.291,"body":"doing some household chores,"},{"startTime":42.292,"endTime":44.4,"body":"or just about when you're"},{"startTime":42.292,"endTime":44.4,"body":"ready to fall asleep?"},{"startTime":44.62,"endTime":46.05,"body":"Thank you so much for joining me."},{"startTime":46.22,"endTime":49.352,"body":"This is gonna be a Q\u0026A where"},{"startTime":46.22,"endTime":49.352,"body":"I hang out with you and take"},{"startTime":49.353,"endTime":53.586,"body":"your questions around a topic,"},{"startTime":49.353,"endTime":53.586,"body":"and this week it's on rumination."},{"startTime":53.587,"endTime":58.53,"body":"I got out of that relationship"},{"startTime":53.587,"endTime":58.53,"body":"and was so preoccupied with what happened to me."},{"startTime":58.76,"endTime":61.438,"body":"That's why I wrote Love You More,"},{"startTime":58.76,"endTime":61.438,"body":"frankly, to be honest with you,"},{"startTime":61.439,"endTime":64.378,"body":"is because I needed to make sense"},{"startTime":61.439,"endTime":64.378,"body":"because the gaslighting was so severe"},{"startTime":64.379,"endTime":67.715,"body":"that I didn't know what was real,"},{"startTime":64.379,"endTime":67.715,"body":"and I replayed everything,"},{"startTime":67.716,"endTime":68.989,"body":"and I felt so badly"},{"startTime":68.99,"endTime":73.565,"body":"about what happened that I kept trying"},{"startTime":68.99,"endTime":73.565,"body":"to process it to make it make sense,"},{"startTime":73.566,"endTime":76.879,"body":"and also to process my shame"},{"startTime":73.566,"endTime":76.879,"body":"because I just felt really, really broken."},{"startTime":77.549,"endTime":80.04,"body":"But let's first talk"},{"startTime":77.549,"endTime":80.04,"body":"about rumination for anybody"},{"startTime":80.041,"endTime":82.09,"body":"who doesn't actually know what it is."},{"startTime":82.091,"endTime":83.826,"body":"I think we need to start there,"},{"startTime":83.827,"endTime":87.721,"body":"and then we can get"},{"startTime":83.827,"endTime":87.721,"body":"into the nitty-gritty of why it happens,"},{"startTime":87.722,"endTime":91.929,"body":"what is it trying to solve, why"},{"startTime":87.722,"endTime":91.929,"body":"it doesn't seem to get ever get better."},{"startTime":92.219,"endTime":93.789,"body":"We can get into all of that."},{"startTime":93.889,"endTime":98.86,"body":"So rumination is actually"},{"startTime":93.889,"endTime":98.86,"body":"kind of a process similar to OCD."},{"startTime":98.879,"endTime":101.607,"body":"Now, just because you ruminate"},{"startTime":98.879,"endTime":101.607,"body":"doesn't mean you have OCD,"},{"startTime":101.608,"endTime":104.109,"body":"but they have some similarities"},{"startTime":101.608,"endTime":104.109,"body":"between the two of them."},{"startTime":104.419,"endTime":108.939,"body":"It's a mental replaying"},{"startTime":104.419,"endTime":108.939,"body":"of something that bothers you."},{"startTime":108.99,"endTime":114.776,"body":"It usually is pretty loaded and feels"},{"startTime":108.99,"endTime":114.776,"body":"very disturbing, and you go over"},{"startTime":114.777,"endTime":119.539,"body":"it and over and over in an effort to solve"},{"startTime":114.777,"endTime":119.539,"body":"it or to come up with some answers,"},{"startTime":120.23,"endTime":122.672,"body":"to find maybe some closure or process"},{"startTime":122.673,"endTime":126.68,"body":"the emotions that you're having around"},{"startTime":122.673,"endTime":126.68,"body":"whatever it is that's bothering you."},{"startTime":126.69,"endTime":129.059,"body":"So it's not rehearsing."},{"startTime":129.099,"endTime":131.459,"body":"It can be. Sometimes we often rehearse."},{"startTime":131.69,"endTime":134.894,"body":"Somebody just said, \"Hey,"},{"startTime":131.69,"endTime":134.894,"body":"I'm trying to get ready to exit.\""},{"startTime":134.895,"endTime":138.362,"body":"Yes, you may ruminate around a big"},{"startTime":134.895,"endTime":138.362,"body":"decision that you're about to make"},{"startTime":138.363,"endTime":139.629,"body":"that's really scaring you."},{"startTime":140.05,"endTime":142.279,"body":"That's more called mental rehearsing."},{"startTime":142.519,"endTime":146.572,"body":"So it's similar to that,"},{"startTime":142.519,"endTime":146.572,"body":"but usually rumination is after the fact,"},{"startTime":146.573,"endTime":149.529,"body":"where we do it when it's"},{"startTime":146.573,"endTime":149.529,"body":"all over with and we're"},{"startTime":149.53,"endTime":151.82,"body":"trying to make sense about something."},{"startTime":152.309,"endTime":153.979,"body":"And it may not even be logical."},{"startTime":154.05,"endTime":157.749,"body":"It may be a question that you have"},{"startTime":154.05,"endTime":157.749,"body":"that you in your head say to yourself,"},{"startTime":157.75,"endTime":161.548,"body":"\"You know, I know I'm never gonna get"},{"startTime":157.75,"endTime":161.548,"body":"any really good answers about this,\" or,"},{"startTime":161.549,"endTime":164.304,"body":"\"I know that if I was to approach"},{"startTime":161.549,"endTime":164.304,"body":"whoever it is that hurt me,"},{"startTime":164.305,"endTime":167.266,"body":"they're not likely to answer"},{"startTime":164.305,"endTime":167.266,"body":"me squarely around this.\""},{"startTime":167.267,"endTime":170.059,"body":"Or maybe it's even how you feel"},{"startTime":167.267,"endTime":170.059,"body":"emotionally and you think,"},{"startTime":170.06,"endTime":171.909,"body":"\"I don't know if I'll"},{"startTime":170.06,"endTime":171.909,"body":"ever feel better about it."},{"startTime":171.91,"endTime":174.96,"body":"I feel really bad, and even though"},{"startTime":171.91,"endTime":174.96,"body":"I'm going over it over and playing"},{"startTime":174.961,"endTime":176.498,"body":"it like a mental loop in my head,"},{"startTime":176.5,"endTime":179.358,"body":"I still don't know if I'll get"},{"startTime":176.5,"endTime":179.358,"body":"the kinda answers that I need,"},{"startTime":179.359,"endTime":183.024,"body":"and if I'll ever feel any better despite"},{"startTime":179.359,"endTime":183.024,"body":"all that's happening in my life.\""},{"startTime":183.025,"endTime":185.94,"body":"So I want you to hear that it doesn't"},{"startTime":183.025,"endTime":185.94,"body":"have to be logical."},{"startTime":186.129,"endTime":190.879,"body":"It doesn't have to have any clear"},{"startTime":186.129,"endTime":190.879,"body":"direction or purpose or, like,"},{"startTime":190.88,"endTime":195.464,"body":"goals, but it's something that you're"},{"startTime":190.88,"endTime":195.464,"body":"doing as a way to sort of make what's"},{"startTime":195.465,"endTime":196.819,"body":"happened make sense."},{"startTime":197.429,"endTime":200.898,"body":"And I think most of us do this when we get"},{"startTime":197.429,"endTime":200.898,"body":"out of these relationships,"},{"startTime":200.899,"endTime":202.191,"body":"and the reason I think"},{"startTime":202.192,"endTime":206.099,"body":"this is because these relationships"},{"startTime":202.192,"endTime":206.099,"body":"are filled with gaslighting."},{"startTime":206.45,"endTime":207.546,"body":"There's an enormous"},{"startTime":207.547,"endTime":210.979,"body":"amount of deception that's going"},{"startTime":207.547,"endTime":210.979,"body":"on and things that are being played out."},{"startTime":210.98,"endTime":215.251,"body":"Because you're living with somebody"},{"startTime":210.98,"endTime":215.251,"body":"who's both a Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde"},{"startTime":215.252,"endTime":216.582,"body":"type of a personality."},{"startTime":216.583,"endTime":219.856,"body":"There's the good side of them"},{"startTime":216.583,"endTime":219.856,"body":"and then the bad side of them,"},{"startTime":219.856,"endTime":222.168,"body":"and you don't ever"},{"startTime":219.856,"endTime":222.168,"body":"really know which side's real."},{"startTime":222.438,"endTime":226.66,"body":"So then you start to wonder about all"},{"startTime":222.438,"endTime":226.66,"body":"the nuances of all that subtlety,"},{"startTime":226.661,"endTime":227.798,"body":"the play on words,"},{"startTime":227.799,"endTime":231.887,"body":"and why did they select that word"},{"startTime":227.799,"endTime":231.887,"body":"in that moment versus that word?"},{"startTime":231.888,"endTime":235.717,"body":"And you start to wonder"},{"startTime":231.888,"endTime":235.717,"body":"how meaningful all of this is."},{"startTime":236.097,"endTime":239.207,"body":"And it really can get very disturbing."},{"startTime":239.218,"endTime":242.478,"body":"It starts to become"},{"startTime":239.218,"endTime":242.478,"body":"something that you just…"},{"startTime":242.897,"endTime":244.987,"body":"It's like an itch that you can't scratch."},{"startTime":244.997,"endTime":247.667,"body":"It just becomes extremely troubling."},{"startTime":248.108,"endTime":252.988,"body":"I think for me, what really bugged"},{"startTime":248.108,"endTime":252.988,"body":"me was I wanted to know two things."},{"startTime":253.038,"endTime":254.256,"body":"I wanted to know when he…"},{"startTime":254.257,"endTime":258.279,"body":"Because those of you that know my story,"},{"startTime":254.257,"endTime":258.279,"body":"maybe that you've read Love You More,"},{"startTime":258.28,"endTime":260.567,"body":"it's a marriage scam."},{"startTime":258.28,"endTime":260.567,"body":"That's what I got into."},{"startTime":260.578,"endTime":261.628,"body":"This guy was…"},{"startTime":261.657,"endTime":265.354,"body":"It wasn't like, you know"},{"startTime":261.657,"endTime":265.354,"body":"how romance scams happen to get the money,"},{"startTime":265.355,"endTime":268.325,"body":"so they try to develop the relationship?"},{"startTime":265.355,"endTime":268.325,"body":"They don't ever intend to meet,"},{"startTime":268.326,"endTime":270.399,"body":"but they're trying to build"},{"startTime":268.326,"endTime":270.399,"body":"enough trust with you,"},{"startTime":270.4,"endTime":272.367,"body":"so when they call you in a crisis,"},{"startTime":272.368,"endTime":275.737,"body":"then you are willing to forgo"},{"startTime":272.368,"endTime":275.737,"body":"the money in your bank."},{"startTime":276.297,"endTime":278.637,"body":"This wasn't that."},{"startTime":276.297,"endTime":278.637,"body":"It was like that, but not that."},{"startTime":278.667,"endTime":281.814,"body":"This person got into the marriage"},{"startTime":278.667,"endTime":281.814,"body":"with the intent of seeing"},{"startTime":281.815,"endTime":284.454,"body":"what he could get"},{"startTime":281.815,"endTime":284.454,"body":"away with of the inheritance,"},{"startTime":284.455,"endTime":287.407,"body":"my life insurance policy"},{"startTime":284.455,"endTime":287.407,"body":"that I had gotten from being widowed."},{"startTime":288.027,"endTime":289.977,"body":"So he didn't get into the relationship"},{"startTime":289.978,"endTime":292.537,"body":"because he loved"},{"startTime":289.978,"endTime":292.537,"body":"me or in order to be with me."},{"startTime":292.538,"endTime":296.388,"body":"This is a person who had pretty"},{"startTime":292.538,"endTime":296.388,"body":"clear plans probably from the start."},{"startTime":296.407,"endTime":299.537,"body":"After all, he told me on the first"},{"startTime":296.407,"endTime":299.537,"body":"date that he'd been researching widows,"},{"startTime":299.907,"endTime":304.448,"body":"which I was naive enough not to realize"},{"startTime":299.907,"endTime":304.448,"body":"that he was identifying his target."},{"startTime":304.817,"endTime":306.228,"body":"He wanted a widow, you know?"},{"startTime":306.229,"endTime":308.29,"body":"And we all know why widows are a target,"},{"startTime":308.291,"endTime":310.984,"body":"because we end up thinking"},{"startTime":308.291,"endTime":310.984,"body":"they came into money,"},{"startTime":310.985,"endTime":312.045,"body":"and maybe they're"},{"startTime":312.046,"endTime":315.258,"body":"grieving and not thinking clearly,"},{"startTime":312.046,"endTime":315.258,"body":"and maybe they're very vulnerable."},{"startTime":315.267,"endTime":317.951,"body":"So I think what he indicated"},{"startTime":315.267,"endTime":317.951,"body":"when he said that,"},{"startTime":317.952,"endTime":321.049,"body":"that I had been a part"},{"startTime":317.952,"endTime":321.049,"body":"of his target audience."},{"startTime":321.05,"endTime":325.061,"body":"So I wanted to know"},{"startTime":321.05,"endTime":325.061,"body":"at what point did he decide"},{"startTime":325.062,"endTime":330.466,"body":"that he was gonna pursue at all costs"},{"startTime":325.062,"endTime":330.466,"body":"achieving the money?"},{"startTime":330.515,"endTime":333.308,"body":"Was it from the very beginning,"},{"startTime":330.515,"endTime":333.308,"body":"or did he start to get"},{"startTime":333.309,"endTime":338.055,"body":"the good idea as things got rolling"},{"startTime":333.309,"endTime":338.055,"body":"and I suggested that we move to Mexico?"},{"startTime":338.095,"endTime":339.456,"body":"That's what I wanted to know."},{"startTime":340.325,"endTime":344.906,"body":"And I also wanted to know what moments,"},{"startTime":340.325,"endTime":344.906,"body":"because he was living a double life,"},{"startTime":344.907,"endTime":348.006,"body":"what moments were real"},{"startTime":344.907,"endTime":348.006,"body":"and what moments were planned?"},{"startTime":348.015,"endTime":353.725,"body":"So those are some of the big questions"},{"startTime":348.015,"endTime":353.725,"body":"that I had that was really bothering me"},{"startTime":353.745,"endTime":356.065,"body":"that motivated me to write Love You More."},{"startTime":356.776,"endTime":359.956,"body":"We just need to be able to look"},{"startTime":356.776,"endTime":359.956,"body":"at the situation and say,"},{"startTime":359.957,"endTime":361.595,"body":"\"Hey, this wasn't about me at all."},{"startTime":361.615,"endTime":363.408,"body":"This was about this person's pathology,"},{"startTime":363.409,"endTime":366.447,"body":"and now that I know that,"},{"startTime":363.409,"endTime":366.447,"body":"I can then relax and let"},{"startTime":366.448,"endTime":370.22,"body":"go of really rehashing"},{"startTime":366.448,"endTime":370.22,"body":"all of this for myself.\""},{"startTime":370.221,"endTime":371.635,"body":"Coach Stacy said,"},{"startTime":371.636,"endTime":375.469,"body":"\"Part of my rumination had to do with why"},{"startTime":371.636,"endTime":375.469,"body":"no one else in the community I was a part"},{"startTime":375.47,"endTime":378.842,"body":"of could see how a business coach"},{"startTime":375.47,"endTime":378.842,"body":"could scam me and others,"},{"startTime":378.843,"endTime":381.535,"body":"and also never saw it,"},{"startTime":378.843,"endTime":381.535,"body":"but continued to support them.\""},{"startTime":381.785,"endTime":384.55,"body":"And I think that's a really good"},{"startTime":381.785,"endTime":384.55,"body":"point that you're making, Coach Stacy,"},{"startTime":384.551,"endTime":386.039,"body":"is that these individuals,"},{"startTime":386.04,"endTime":389.328,"body":"and I think this is a very troubling"},{"startTime":386.04,"endTime":389.328,"body":"part for a lot of us,"},{"startTime":389.329,"endTime":391.592,"body":"these individuals"},{"startTime":389.329,"endTime":391.592,"body":"have types of personalities"},{"startTime":391.593,"endTime":397.684,"body":"in which they are so charming and filled"},{"startTime":391.593,"endTime":397.684,"body":"with so much confidence that people become"},{"startTime":397.684,"endTime":403.765,"body":"invested in their approval in a kind"},{"startTime":397.684,"endTime":403.765,"body":"of a weird way that goes beyond normal."},{"startTime":403.875,"endTime":407.005,"body":"This is not a normal"},{"startTime":403.875,"endTime":407.005,"body":"dynamic in any shape or form."},{"startTime":407.465,"endTime":413.226,"body":"And they then quickly learn at some"},{"startTime":407.465,"endTime":413.226,"body":"level that if they lose that person's"},{"startTime":413.227,"endTime":414.334,"body":"high regard or,"},{"startTime":414.335,"endTime":416.098,"body":"like, access of some kind,"},{"startTime":416.099,"endTime":421.175,"body":"that there's gonna be such ramifications"},{"startTime":416.099,"endTime":421.175,"body":"that they don't want to lose that."},{"startTime":421.596,"endTime":426.374,"body":"So they end up willing to turn"},{"startTime":421.596,"endTime":426.374,"body":"a blind eye in a way,"},{"startTime":426.375,"endTime":432.712,"body":"willing to ignore probably what's in front"},{"startTime":426.375,"endTime":432.712,"body":"of their face in order to maintain"},{"startTime":432.713,"endTime":435.206,"body":"the connection with that individual,"},{"startTime":435.207,"endTime":439.952,"body":"and they're willing to obliterate"},{"startTime":435.207,"endTime":439.952,"body":"your relationship in the process,"},{"startTime":439.953,"endTime":445.814,"body":"which is also disturbing 'cause how many"},{"startTime":439.953,"endTime":445.814,"body":"of us have thought that our relationship"},{"startTime":445.815,"endTime":450.386,"body":"was significant enough that the person"},{"startTime":445.815,"endTime":450.386,"body":"who's doing it to you would never do that?"},{"startTime":450.726,"endTime":456.248,"body":"That you thought that you had a unique"},{"startTime":450.726,"endTime":456.248,"body":"form of loyalty or connection,"},{"startTime":456.249,"endTime":458.813,"body":"or you've built"},{"startTime":456.249,"endTime":458.813,"body":"this sort of reliance on each"},{"startTime":458.814,"endTime":463.768,"body":"other that they wouldn't have twisted"},{"startTime":458.814,"endTime":463.768,"body":"it this way and turned on you in that way,"},{"startTime":463.769,"endTime":464.926,"body":"and yet it's sad."},{"startTime":464.935,"endTime":467.086,"body":"That's what I find is so painful."},{"startTime":467.095,"endTime":472.968,"body":"These relationships are so loaded"},{"startTime":467.095,"endTime":472.968,"body":"that the pathological person equates"},{"startTime":472.969,"endTime":476.401,"body":"it almost as if a competition,"},{"startTime":472.969,"endTime":476.401,"body":"like there's a choice,"},{"startTime":476.402,"endTime":480.469,"body":"and if you don't choose to support"},{"startTime":476.402,"endTime":480.469,"body":"them and buy into their line,"},{"startTime":480.47,"endTime":482.936,"body":"then they want nothing to do with you."},{"startTime":482.937,"endTime":485.176,"body":"So that person"},{"startTime":482.937,"endTime":485.176,"body":"then is faced with a choice."},{"startTime":485.445,"endTime":490.626,"body":"Either I align myself with them"},{"startTime":485.445,"endTime":490.626,"body":"and then harm this relationship"},{"startTime":490.627,"endTime":495.54,"body":"that I had valued and betray it,"},{"startTime":490.627,"endTime":495.54,"body":"or I lose this person and know they're"},{"startTime":495.541,"endTime":499.062,"body":"gonna do the same thing to me that they're"},{"startTime":495.541,"endTime":499.062,"body":"doing to this other individual,"},{"startTime":499.063,"endTime":502.136,"body":"and I don't want that,"},{"startTime":499.063,"endTime":502.136,"body":"so I'm not willing to go there."},{"startTime":502.137,"endTime":504.92,"body":"And Stacy,"},{"startTime":502.137,"endTime":504.92,"body":"you're making a really good point,"},{"startTime":504.921,"endTime":508.709,"body":"and that is that what made"},{"startTime":504.921,"endTime":508.709,"body":"this even harder is that you knew"},{"startTime":508.71,"endTime":511.996,"body":"this was a sales expert,"},{"startTime":508.71,"endTime":511.996,"body":"that she knew how to sell."},{"startTime":512.226,"endTime":516.206,"body":"She trained people how to sell,"},{"startTime":512.226,"endTime":516.206,"body":"so she sold her story really,"},{"startTime":516.207,"endTime":518.281,"body":"really well, I mean really well,"},{"startTime":518.282,"endTime":521.686,"body":"to the point that people"},{"startTime":518.282,"endTime":521.686,"body":"betrayed you in the process,"},{"startTime":521.687,"endTime":525.095,"body":"and that is really harmful"},{"startTime":521.687,"endTime":525.095,"body":"when that happens to us."},{"startTime":525.096,"endTime":526.144,"body":"Another person,"},{"startTime":526.145,"endTime":527.163,"body":"Sunny, writes in,"},{"startTime":527.164,"endTime":530.334,"body":"\"I think it's almost worse"},{"startTime":527.164,"endTime":530.334,"body":"having self-educated myself."},{"startTime":530.544,"endTime":534.197,"body":"The rumination continues to this day,"},{"startTime":530.544,"endTime":534.197,"body":"and now that I know the problem,"},{"startTime":534.198,"endTime":535.743,"body":"I still wanna fix it."},{"startTime":536.124,"endTime":538.89,"body":"I know that's partly"},{"startTime":536.124,"endTime":538.89,"body":"me and everything else.\""},{"startTime":538.891,"endTime":539.973,"body":"And that is true."},{"startTime":539.994,"endTime":544.572,"body":"See, what you're tapping"},{"startTime":539.994,"endTime":544.572,"body":"into there about rumination"},{"startTime":544.573,"endTime":548.113,"body":"is that this is a mental"},{"startTime":544.573,"endTime":548.113,"body":"looping that has no closure."},{"startTime":548.663,"endTime":554.203,"body":"There is no solution to it because we're"},{"startTime":548.663,"endTime":554.203,"body":"never gonna get the answers that we need."},{"startTime":554.204,"endTime":558.492,"body":"Think about the, the rumination"},{"startTime":554.204,"endTime":558.492,"body":"that I described to you that I often do…"},{"startTime":558.493,"endTime":560.203,"body":"At least I used to do."},{"startTime":560.204,"endTime":561.72,"body":"I don't do it these days,"},{"startTime":561.721,"endTime":565.044,"body":"but I used to wanna know"},{"startTime":561.721,"endTime":565.044,"body":"when did the double life begin?"},{"startTime":565.053,"endTime":566.363,"body":"Was it always there?"},{"startTime":566.704,"endTime":570.351,"body":"When did he decide that he was gonna make"},{"startTime":566.704,"endTime":570.351,"body":"this a marriage scam,"},{"startTime":570.352,"endTime":575.121,"body":"and then started aiming for that, knowing"},{"startTime":570.352,"endTime":575.121,"body":"that this relationship would never last,"},{"startTime":575.122,"endTime":578.294,"body":"and he was gunning for the inheritance,"},{"startTime":575.122,"endTime":578.294,"body":"gunning for the business,"},{"startTime":578.323,"endTime":583.034,"body":"and then possibly even willing"},{"startTime":578.323,"endTime":583.034,"body":"to cost me my life, if so be it?"},{"startTime":583.503,"endTime":589.743,"body":"At what point did his plan morph from,"},{"startTime":583.503,"endTime":589.743,"body":"\"Oh, I met a widow who has life insurance."},{"startTime":589.744,"endTime":591.634,"body":"Hmm, what could I get out of this?"},{"startTime":591.635,"endTime":593.04,"body":"What could I extract?\""},{"startTime":593.041,"endTime":598.613,"body":"To, \"Huh, I wonder if I can take her off"},{"startTime":593.041,"endTime":598.613,"body":"the chessboard and claim at least half,"},{"startTime":598.614,"endTime":599.981,"body":"if not all of it.\""},{"startTime":599.982,"endTime":603.863,"body":"I would like to know that,"},{"startTime":599.982,"endTime":603.863,"body":"and I know that I will never know that."},{"startTime":603.874,"endTime":606.997,"body":"That is not an answerable"},{"startTime":603.874,"endTime":606.997,"body":"question because I don't"},{"startTime":606.998,"endTime":608.673,"body":"even know if my ex really knows."},{"startTime":608.773,"endTime":611.404,"body":"Think about this,"},{"startTime":608.773,"endTime":611.404,"body":"because part of what's harmful"},{"startTime":611.405,"endTime":615.494,"body":"about these relationships is these people"},{"startTime":611.405,"endTime":615.494,"body":"are acting almost instinctual."},{"startTime":615.843,"endTime":618.462,"body":"Yes, there are parts"},{"startTime":615.843,"endTime":618.462,"body":"of it that are intentional,"},{"startTime":618.463,"endTime":623.611,"body":"but there's parts of it also"},{"startTime":618.463,"endTime":623.611,"body":"that are very, very planned,"},{"startTime":623.612,"endTime":627.743,"body":"but also parts of it that,"},{"startTime":623.612,"endTime":627.743,"body":"they've done it so often,"},{"startTime":627.744,"endTime":630.404,"body":"they've run these cons so often,"},{"startTime":627.744,"endTime":630.404,"body":"that they…"},{"startTime":630.443,"endTime":632.142,"body":"And they're good at reading the room,"},{"startTime":632.143,"endTime":634.727,"body":"good at reading you and reading"},{"startTime":632.143,"endTime":634.727,"body":"your insecurities,"},{"startTime":634.728,"endTime":639.497,"body":"that they're making the shifts almost"},{"startTime":634.728,"endTime":639.497,"body":"on the fly based upon their gut system,"},{"startTime":639.498,"endTime":641.533,"body":"which is really a terrifying thought."},{"startTime":642.023,"endTime":644.414,"body":"And as a result of it,"},{"startTime":642.023,"endTime":644.414,"body":"they often don't know"},{"startTime":644.415,"endTime":649.073,"body":"how the thought kind of got conceived"},{"startTime":644.415,"endTime":649.073,"body":"because they're highly impulsive, too."},{"startTime":649.413,"endTime":652.573,"body":"So they believe they're entitled,"},{"startTime":649.413,"endTime":652.573,"body":"that they deserve what they deserve,"},{"startTime":652.823,"endTime":656.074,"body":"and they'll justify whatever"},{"startTime":652.823,"endTime":656.074,"body":"because it just serves their end."},{"startTime":656.075,"endTime":657.13,"body":"And as a result,"},{"startTime":657.131,"endTime":659.553,"body":"things shift so rapidly in the moment."},{"startTime":659.554,"endTime":661.227,"body":"It's not like there's somebody"},{"startTime":661.228,"endTime":665.513,"body":"sitting back there with a pen and paper"},{"startTime":661.228,"endTime":665.513,"body":"and writing out a list of pros and cons."},{"startTime":665.514,"endTime":667.794,"body":"That's not often how these work"},{"startTime":665.514,"endTime":667.794,"body":"for these individuals."},{"startTime":668.173,"endTime":671.993,"body":"So it ends up being something that he's"},{"startTime":668.173,"endTime":671.993,"body":"never going to admit to that."},{"startTime":671.994,"endTime":673.233,"body":"Why would he admit to that?"},{"startTime":673.353,"endTime":675.375,"body":"First of all, it's damning evidence,"},{"startTime":675.376,"endTime":681.343,"body":"and second of all, it probably"},{"startTime":675.376,"endTime":681.343,"body":"happened in a morphing kind of a process."},{"startTime":681.374,"endTime":683.243,"body":"And so I won't get those answers."},{"startTime":683.244,"endTime":686.597,"body":"But it does bother us because we'd"},{"startTime":683.244,"endTime":686.597,"body":"like to know these things,"},{"startTime":686.598,"endTime":689.525,"body":"and we know that we won't know them."},{"startTime":686.598,"endTime":689.525,"body":"Somebody asked,"},{"startTime":689.526,"endTime":693.121,"body":"\"I daily ask if it was intentional"},{"startTime":689.526,"endTime":693.121,"body":"or an unconscious process of behavior,\""},{"startTime":693.122,"endTime":695.766,"body":"and I think the answer"},{"startTime":693.122,"endTime":695.766,"body":"to that question is it was both."},{"startTime":696.216,"endTime":699.231,"body":"And that's why it's so confusing"},{"startTime":696.216,"endTime":699.231,"body":"is because you won't know"},{"startTime":699.232,"endTime":702.456,"body":"the answer and that line probably"},{"startTime":699.232,"endTime":702.456,"body":"moved depending on the decision."},{"startTime":702.726,"endTime":704.926,"body":"Some decisions they may"},{"startTime":702.726,"endTime":704.926,"body":"actually have planned out."},{"startTime":705.276,"endTime":706.402,"body":"Mine, for example,"},{"startTime":706.403,"endTime":708.95,"body":"actually scheduled to meet up with people,"},{"startTime":708.951,"endTime":711.306,"body":"and he would know he had to plan that out."},{"startTime":711.365,"endTime":713.696,"body":"He had to have an excuse"},{"startTime":711.365,"endTime":713.696,"body":"to get out of the house,"},{"startTime":713.697,"endTime":715.095,"body":"an excuse that excluded me,"},{"startTime":715.096,"endTime":719.423,"body":"and then he had to be able to implement"},{"startTime":715.096,"endTime":719.423,"body":"it in a way that made me feel"},{"startTime":719.424,"endTime":721.545,"body":"like it was a justifiable,"},{"startTime":719.424,"endTime":721.545,"body":"legitimate reason."},{"startTime":722.386,"endTime":723.305,"body":"That took planning."},{"startTime":723.355,"endTime":726.896,"body":"But I also think that then the moments"},{"startTime":723.355,"endTime":726.896,"body":"he got caught on something,"},{"startTime":727.136,"endTime":732.136,"body":"he was just running with it or if a moment"},{"startTime":727.136,"endTime":732.136,"body":"sort of made itself available,"},{"startTime":732.326,"endTime":733.645,"body":"he would run with that, too."},{"startTime":734.215,"endTime":738.845,"body":"So I think it's this dynamic"},{"startTime":734.215,"endTime":738.845,"body":"between there is preparation."},{"startTime":739.026,"endTime":740.855,"body":"I mean, I, I saw his CliffsNotes."},{"startTime":740.856,"endTime":745.435,"body":"He actually had notes on his iPhone"},{"startTime":740.856,"endTime":745.435,"body":"where he'd log stuff."},{"startTime":745.436,"endTime":747.44,"body":"He had phrases he'd practiced,"},{"startTime":747.441,"endTime":750.302,"body":"and he had a list of women"},{"startTime":747.441,"endTime":750.302,"body":"and information about them,"},{"startTime":750.303,"endTime":751.975,"body":"so he definitely was doing some planning."},{"startTime":752.385,"endTime":755.486,"body":"But I think there was also a lot"},{"startTime":752.385,"endTime":755.486,"body":"of it that was being improvised,"},{"startTime":755.945,"endTime":759.801,"body":"and it makes it really hard because we'll"},{"startTime":755.945,"endTime":759.801,"body":"never know exactly where that line is,"},{"startTime":759.802,"endTime":760.936,"body":"and that can drive us nuts."},{"startTime":760.937,"endTime":763.166,"body":"If you end up thinking"},{"startTime":760.937,"endTime":763.166,"body":"you need to know the answer,"},{"startTime":763.167,"endTime":764.745,"body":"you're never gonna know that answer."},{"startTime":765.665,"endTime":766.998,"body":"A lot of us who've experienced"},{"startTime":766.999,"endTime":771.633,"body":"somebody who's been living a double life"},{"startTime":766.999,"endTime":771.633,"body":"has that as another source of rumination,"},{"startTime":771.634,"endTime":776.005,"body":"which is how much of any"},{"startTime":771.634,"endTime":776.005,"body":"event that we experienced was real?"},{"startTime":776.725,"endTime":780.284,"body":"Like that family barbecue"},{"startTime":776.725,"endTime":780.284,"body":"out on the 4th of July,"},{"startTime":780.285,"endTime":784.174,"body":"was that actually because he wanted"},{"startTime":780.285,"endTime":784.174,"body":"to get or she wanted to get everybody"},{"startTime":784.175,"endTime":786.614,"body":"together in the neighborhood"},{"startTime":784.175,"endTime":786.614,"body":"or because they planned to meet"},{"startTime":786.615,"endTime":789.675,"body":"up with somebody who's in the neighborhood"},{"startTime":786.615,"endTime":789.675,"body":"that maybe they're having an affair with?"},{"startTime":790.285,"endTime":793.235,"body":"This is the other thing that makes"},{"startTime":790.285,"endTime":793.235,"body":"this really hard to isolate"},{"startTime":793.236,"endTime":798.119,"body":"rumination is because sometimes for some"},{"startTime":793.236,"endTime":798.119,"body":"antagonistic people, the drama,"},{"startTime":798.12,"endTime":800.026,"body":"the conflict is the point."},{"startTime":800.625,"endTime":802.485,"body":"There isn't really actually"},{"startTime":800.625,"endTime":802.485,"body":"a bigger point."},{"startTime":802.495,"endTime":804.235,"body":"It's just not to agree with you."},{"startTime":804.875,"endTime":806.432,"body":"So as a result of that,"},{"startTime":806.433,"endTime":810.665,"body":"how do you then stop that"},{"startTime":806.433,"endTime":810.665,"body":"because there may have been no point at all?"},{"startTime":811.015,"endTime":813.255,"body":"He just wanted or she just wanted"},{"startTime":811.015,"endTime":813.255,"body":"to be difficult."},{"startTime":813.695,"endTime":814.928,"body":"Here's a question for today,"},{"startTime":814.928,"endTime":817.685,"body":"one of the questions that I had on my list"},{"startTime":814.928,"endTime":817.685,"body":"that I wondered about."},{"startTime":817.956,"endTime":820.893,"body":"Do you think you're gonna ever"},{"startTime":817.956,"endTime":820.893,"body":"understand why this person"},{"startTime":820.894,"endTime":823.666,"body":"did what they did and be able"},{"startTime":820.894,"endTime":823.666,"body":"to finally let it go?"},{"startTime":824.206,"endTime":826.707,"body":"Have you found that the rumination"},{"startTime":824.206,"endTime":826.707,"body":"that you've done around it,"},{"startTime":826.708,"endTime":828.915,"body":"has it brought you any"},{"startTime":826.708,"endTime":828.915,"body":"resolution around this?"},{"startTime":830.168,"endTime":832.268,"body":"I'd be super curious"},{"startTime":830.168,"endTime":832.268,"body":"if you guys found that."},{"startTime":832.738,"endTime":838.468,"body":"The answer for me was yes,"},{"startTime":832.738,"endTime":838.468,"body":"but not really because I was ruminating."},{"startTime":838.757,"endTime":841.948,"body":"It was because I did something"},{"startTime":838.757,"endTime":841.948,"body":"with the rumination that moved"},{"startTime":841.949,"endTime":843.458,"body":"it in a productive level."},{"startTime":843.459,"endTime":847.747,"body":"Because I found rumination"},{"startTime":843.459,"endTime":847.747,"body":"never got me anywhere helpful."},{"startTime":847.918,"endTime":851.907,"body":"It actually just made things worse,"},{"startTime":847.918,"endTime":851.907,"body":"and I got really, really upset."},{"startTime":852.258,"endTime":856.657,"body":"So here's how I found some"},{"startTime":852.258,"endTime":856.657,"body":"resolution to my rumination."},{"startTime":857.068,"endTime":858.204,"body":"I started to write,"},{"startTime":858.205,"endTime":862.844,"body":"and you may be surprised to hear this,"},{"startTime":858.205,"endTime":862.844,"body":"'cause it's not the first time I've ever…"},{"startTime":862.845,"endTime":863.897,"body":"You're shrugging."},{"startTime":865.358,"endTime":867.498,"body":"It's not the first time"},{"startTime":865.358,"endTime":867.498,"body":"I've said this out loud,"},{"startTime":867.499,"endTime":869.457,"body":"so bear with me if you heard"},{"startTime":867.499,"endTime":869.457,"body":"me say this before."},{"startTime":869.478,"endTime":872.818,"body":"But there have been research studies"},{"startTime":869.478,"endTime":872.818,"body":"looking at the impact of journaling."},{"startTime":872.858,"endTime":876.308,"body":"One of them had to do with people"},{"startTime":872.858,"endTime":876.308,"body":"who lost a job."},{"startTime":876.647,"endTime":878.547,"body":"They separated the groups into two groups."},{"startTime":878.548,"endTime":880.167,"body":"There's a subject group"},{"startTime":878.548,"endTime":880.167,"body":"and a control group."},{"startTime":880.588,"endTime":883.53,"body":"The subject group was to write"},{"startTime":880.588,"endTime":883.53,"body":"whatever they wanted about what it felt"},{"startTime":883.531,"endTime":885.28,"body":"like to lose a job, where they were,"},{"startTime":885.281,"endTime":887.476,"body":"how they felt about it,"},{"startTime":885.281,"endTime":887.476,"body":"what it meant to them,"},{"startTime":887.477,"endTime":890.44,"body":"the way it was impacting them."},{"startTime":887.477,"endTime":890.44,"body":"The other group, the control group,"},{"startTime":890.441,"endTime":893.217,"body":"was to write about something"},{"startTime":890.441,"endTime":893.217,"body":"like what the weather was like,"},{"startTime":893.218,"endTime":896.297,"body":"something silly, innocuous,"},{"startTime":893.218,"endTime":896.297,"body":"and had nothing to do with losing a job."},{"startTime":896.757,"endTime":900.048,"body":"And then they went back and looked at both"},{"startTime":896.757,"endTime":900.048,"body":"groups three months later and found"},{"startTime":900.049,"endTime":904.01,"body":"out that the group that was writing"},{"startTime":900.049,"endTime":904.01,"body":"about their impact of losing the job"},{"startTime":904.011,"endTime":907.789,"body":"had actually moved on and healed"},{"startTime":904.011,"endTime":907.789,"body":"and were more likely to have found"},{"startTime":907.79,"endTime":911.351,"body":"a new position than the group"},{"startTime":907.79,"endTime":911.351,"body":"that was just writing about nothing,"},{"startTime":911.352,"endTime":912.428,"body":"writing about weather."},{"startTime":912.978,"endTime":914.198,"body":"That's what I found, too."},{"startTime":914.199,"endTime":918.107,"body":"I found that writing Love You More,"},{"startTime":914.199,"endTime":918.107,"body":"which took me three years."},{"startTime":918.137,"endTime":920.62,"body":"I started writing"},{"startTime":918.137,"endTime":920.62,"body":"it as the relationship was breaking."},{"startTime":920.621,"endTime":924.162,"body":"Literally, I'm on the plane,"},{"startTime":920.621,"endTime":924.162,"body":"and I'm writing the first chapter,"},{"startTime":924.163,"endTime":925.368,"body":"and he's next to me."},{"startTime":925.397,"endTime":928.125,"body":"I actually showed it to him,"},{"startTime":925.397,"endTime":928.125,"body":"which was kind of a stupid thing,"},{"startTime":928.126,"endTime":930.687,"body":"which is one of the ways"},{"startTime":928.126,"endTime":930.687,"body":"he knew that it was happening."},{"startTime":930.688,"endTime":933.382,"body":"But I showed him the first chapter"},{"startTime":930.688,"endTime":933.382,"body":"that I'd already started,"},{"startTime":933.383,"endTime":936.259,"body":"which by the way is not the chapter"},{"startTime":933.383,"endTime":936.259,"body":"that got published,"},{"startTime":936.26,"endTime":940.024,"body":"because a lot changed from the first"},{"startTime":936.26,"endTime":940.024,"body":"rendition to the last one that I actually"},{"startTime":940.025,"endTime":941.447,"body":"put out there, self-published."},{"startTime":941.457,"endTime":944.628,"body":"But so that was July of 2019,"},{"startTime":944.629,"endTime":948.857,"body":"and I published it February 14th, 2022."},{"startTime":948.867,"endTime":951.147,"body":"So it was almost three years."},{"startTime":951.527,"endTime":954.947,"body":"Now, it took me nine months"},{"startTime":951.527,"endTime":954.947,"body":"of writing to write the first draft,"},{"startTime":955.478,"endTime":958.457,"body":"and then I started all the edits,"},{"startTime":955.478,"endTime":958.457,"body":"and it went through nine edits."},{"startTime":960.658,"endTime":962.158,"body":"I learned a lot about writing in that."},{"startTime":962.159,"endTime":964.933,"body":"But in that process of writing"},{"startTime":962.159,"endTime":964.933,"body":"it over and over and over,"},{"startTime":964.934,"endTime":968.077,"body":"and in some of these scenes,"},{"startTime":964.934,"endTime":968.077,"body":"you sort of really live in the scenes."},{"startTime":968.078,"endTime":972.527,"body":"Writing is a lot like watching a movie."},{"startTime":968.078,"endTime":972.527,"body":"That's what it feels like."},{"startTime":972.528,"endTime":975.508,"body":"It feels like when you put these words"},{"startTime":972.528,"endTime":975.508,"body":"down on paper and you're describing"},{"startTime":975.509,"endTime":978.867,"body":"what happened and you're setting up"},{"startTime":975.509,"endTime":978.867,"body":"the scene and then playing the scene out,"},{"startTime":978.868,"endTime":981.227,"body":"and it feels like you're sitting"},{"startTime":978.868,"endTime":981.227,"body":"there watching a movie when you do that."},{"startTime":981.228,"endTime":983.088,"body":"It's a very interesting experience."},{"startTime":983.089,"endTime":987.037,"body":"It's different than writing a paper"},{"startTime":983.089,"endTime":987.037,"body":"for English or trying to do a research paper."},{"startTime":987.038,"endTime":988.145,"body":"It just is very,"},{"startTime":988.146,"endTime":989.188,"body":"very different."},{"startTime":989.188,"endTime":991.599,"body":"And I found that as I would do that,"},{"startTime":991.6,"endTime":993.976,"body":"some of these moments"},{"startTime":991.6,"endTime":993.976,"body":"would stick in my mind,"},{"startTime":993.977,"endTime":995.93,"body":"and I would think, \"Why did he do that?"},{"startTime":995.931,"endTime":999.027,"body":"And what was going on there?"},{"startTime":995.931,"endTime":999.027,"body":"He used a really weird word,"},{"startTime":999.028,"endTime":1000.691,"body":"and he did a really bizarre thing,"},{"startTime":1000.692,"endTime":1003.859,"body":"and why would people"},{"startTime":1000.692,"endTime":1003.859,"body":"who did that thing usually do that?"},{"startTime":1003.86,"endTime":1005.689,"body":"What would lead them to do that?"},{"startTime":1005.89,"endTime":1008.428,"body":"What was he probably hiding"},{"startTime":1005.89,"endTime":1008.428,"body":"or feeling in that moment?\""},{"startTime":1008.429,"endTime":1009.625,"body":"And as a result of that,"},{"startTime":1009.626,"endTime":1013.25,"body":"I got to the place where things"},{"startTime":1009.626,"endTime":1013.25,"body":"started to click and make sense."},{"startTime":1013.579,"endTime":1014.963,"body":"A lot of times it would gut me,"},{"startTime":1014.964,"endTime":1017.039,"body":"and I would end up"},{"startTime":1014.964,"endTime":1017.039,"body":"crying for a while about it,"},{"startTime":1017.04,"endTime":1019.64,"body":"but it started to just kind of make sense."},{"startTime":1019.641,"endTime":1021.986,"body":"And in fact, I hear from people"},{"startTime":1019.641,"endTime":1021.986,"body":"now that when I talk about it,"},{"startTime":1021.987,"endTime":1024.627,"body":"it feels like it happened to someone"},{"startTime":1021.987,"endTime":1024.627,"body":"else a long time ago,"},{"startTime":1024.628,"endTime":1026.339,"body":"'cause that's frankly how it feels."},{"startTime":1026.8,"endTime":1029.147,"body":"So one of the things that helped"},{"startTime":1026.8,"endTime":1029.147,"body":"me with rumination,"},{"startTime":1029.148,"endTime":1031.639,"body":"I wanna talk about two different"},{"startTime":1029.148,"endTime":1031.639,"body":"mechanisms that's helped."},{"startTime":1031.989,"endTime":1033.69,"body":"There's one that you can do in the moment,"},{"startTime":1033.691,"endTime":1036.54,"body":"and then there's"},{"startTime":1033.691,"endTime":1036.54,"body":"one that you can do that takes time."},{"startTime":1037.149,"endTime":1041.581,"body":"So part of what's awful"},{"startTime":1037.149,"endTime":1041.581,"body":"about rumination is there's no solution,"},{"startTime":1041.582,"endTime":1045.287,"body":"and what it does is it reactivates"},{"startTime":1041.582,"endTime":1045.287,"body":"your nervous system,"},{"startTime":1045.288,"endTime":1048.029,"body":"so you actually get all stirred up again."},{"startTime":1048.399,"endTime":1050.22,"body":"It's as if you're living it again."},{"startTime":1050.55,"endTime":1052.267,"body":"So you become hypervigilant,"},{"startTime":1052.268,"endTime":1056.979,"body":"you're back scanning the environment,"},{"startTime":1052.268,"endTime":1056.979,"body":"you feel at threat, you don't feel safe."},{"startTime":1057.429,"endTime":1058.82,"body":"So here's a technique."},{"startTime":1058.821,"endTime":1059.974,"body":"If you're battling this,"},{"startTime":1059.975,"endTime":1062.42,"body":"this is a really great"},{"startTime":1059.975,"endTime":1062.42,"body":"technique that will help you."},{"startTime":1063.02,"endTime":1066.111,"body":"When you catch yourself doing it,"},{"startTime":1063.02,"endTime":1066.111,"body":"and that's the first tricky part,"},{"startTime":1066.112,"endTime":1068.61,"body":"when you first catch"},{"startTime":1066.112,"endTime":1068.61,"body":"yourself doing it, stop."},{"startTime":1068.859,"endTime":1072.989,"body":"Say something like, \"Stop,\""},{"startTime":1068.859,"endTime":1072.989,"body":"maybe even out loud to yourself."},{"startTime":1073.62,"endTime":1077.171,"body":"And then at that moment,"},{"startTime":1073.62,"endTime":1077.171,"body":"take five deep breaths"},{"startTime":1077.172,"endTime":1079.489,"body":"because you wanna reset"},{"startTime":1077.172,"endTime":1079.489,"body":"your nervous system."},{"startTime":1079.639,"endTime":1082.509,"body":"Nice five deep diaphragmatic breaths."},{"startTime":1083.05,"endTime":1086.229,"body":"And then you want to do something"},{"startTime":1083.05,"endTime":1086.229,"body":"that's completely distracting."},{"startTime":1086.23,"endTime":1088.925,"body":"It has to take up a lot"},{"startTime":1086.23,"endTime":1088.925,"body":"of attention and concentration,"},{"startTime":1088.926,"endTime":1091.787,"body":"which is hard because a lot"},{"startTime":1088.926,"endTime":1091.787,"body":"of stuff that we do,"},{"startTime":1091.788,"endTime":1094.127,"body":"if you have thought leakages around it,"},{"startTime":1094.128,"endTime":1097.0,"body":"then it's not really consuming"},{"startTime":1094.128,"endTime":1097.0,"body":"attention and concentration."},{"startTime":1097.001,"endTime":1098.485,"body":"It should be so consuming"},{"startTime":1098.486,"endTime":1101.719,"body":"you can't think of anything"},{"startTime":1098.486,"endTime":1101.719,"body":"else but whatever it is that you're doing."},{"startTime":1102.079,"endTime":1105.549,"body":"A great task is math."},{"startTime":1102.079,"endTime":1105.549,"body":"And I know a lot of us don't like math."},{"startTime":1105.919,"endTime":1110.0,"body":"But it needs to be challenging"},{"startTime":1105.919,"endTime":1110.0,"body":"enough that we can't do it just by rote."},{"startTime":1110.039,"endTime":1112.24,"body":"Like if you start to count,"},{"startTime":1110.039,"endTime":1112.24,"body":"you can easily lose track"},{"startTime":1112.241,"endTime":1114.029,"body":"because you start to think"},{"startTime":1112.241,"endTime":1114.029,"body":"about other things."},{"startTime":1114.309,"endTime":1115.439,"body":"That doesn't qualify."},{"startTime":1115.919,"endTime":1119.355,"body":"But it can't be so challenging"},{"startTime":1115.919,"endTime":1119.355,"body":"that you give up in frustration."},{"startTime":1119.356,"endTime":1121.543,"body":"And maybe you should pull"},{"startTime":1119.356,"endTime":1121.543,"body":"a pen and paper out,"},{"startTime":1121.544,"endTime":1122.599,"body":"but you don't need to."},{"startTime":1122.919,"endTime":1126.689,"body":"So you want it complicated enough"},{"startTime":1122.919,"endTime":1126.689,"body":"that you can do it anywhere at any time,"},{"startTime":1126.88,"endTime":1130.399,"body":"whatever you're doing,"},{"startTime":1126.88,"endTime":1130.399,"body":"like driving or in bed,"},{"startTime":1130.4,"endTime":1134.25,"body":"but it needs to be all-consuming enough"},{"startTime":1130.4,"endTime":1134.25,"body":"to eat up enough of your mental space."},{"startTime":1134.389,"endTime":1138.35,"body":"So one of the things I often do is I'll"},{"startTime":1134.389,"endTime":1138.35,"body":"count backwards from 5,000 by seven."},{"startTime":1138.82,"endTime":1141.99,"body":"Could be by eight."},{"startTime":1138.82,"endTime":1141.99,"body":"Don't make it by five, that's too simple."},{"startTime":1142.309,"endTime":1144.829,"body":"But make it a weird number"},{"startTime":1142.309,"endTime":1144.829,"body":"so that you have to work at it."},{"startTime":1145.109,"endTime":1146.62,"body":"So let's go back to the top."},{"startTime":1146.71,"endTime":1148.089,"body":"You catch yourself ruminating."},{"startTime":1148.109,"endTime":1149.749,"body":"Doesn't matter how long"},{"startTime":1148.109,"endTime":1149.749,"body":"you've been doing it."},{"startTime":1150.249,"endTime":1152.439,"body":"Say out loud or at least"},{"startTime":1150.249,"endTime":1152.439,"body":"in your mind, \"Stop.\""},{"startTime":1152.859,"endTime":1157.503,"body":"And then take five deep breaths,"},{"startTime":1152.859,"endTime":1157.503,"body":"and then pull out the activity that you've"},{"startTime":1157.504,"endTime":1160.219,"body":"planned to use the next time"},{"startTime":1157.504,"endTime":1160.219,"body":"you catch yourself ruminating."},{"startTime":1161.272,"endTime":1166.672,"body":"5,000, 4,993,"},{"startTime":1161.272,"endTime":1166.672,"body":"and you start working on that."},{"startTime":1167.272,"endTime":1170.652,"body":"And just keep doing it until you start"},{"startTime":1167.272,"endTime":1170.652,"body":"to feel better, and then you can stop."},{"startTime":1170.731,"endTime":1173.052,"body":"And then do it again"},{"startTime":1170.731,"endTime":1173.052,"body":"the next time you ruminate."},{"startTime":1173.071,"endTime":1177.188,"body":"Now, what happens is that people often"},{"startTime":1173.071,"endTime":1177.188,"body":"find themselves feeling silly or bad,"},{"startTime":1177.189,"endTime":1179.306,"body":"like,"},{"startTime":1177.189,"endTime":1179.306,"body":"\"I'm having to do this 50 times a day."},{"startTime":1179.307,"endTime":1180.341,"body":"What's wrong with me?"},{"startTime":1180.342,"endTime":1185.101,"body":"Does this mean that I'm really not well?\""},{"startTime":1180.342,"endTime":1185.101,"body":"It actually doesn't mean anything."},{"startTime":1185.211,"endTime":1187.311,"body":"It doesn't matter how many"},{"startTime":1185.211,"endTime":1187.311,"body":"times you have to do it a day."},{"startTime":1187.551,"endTime":1190.477,"body":"Just doing it every day,"},{"startTime":1187.551,"endTime":1190.477,"body":"every time that you do it,"},{"startTime":1190.478,"endTime":1194.371,"body":"is a really great way to stop"},{"startTime":1190.478,"endTime":1194.371,"body":"yourself from ruminating."},{"startTime":1195.001,"endTime":1197.235,"body":"That's a great way to be able to address"},{"startTime":1197.236,"endTime":1201.046,"body":"these symptoms in the moment"},{"startTime":1197.236,"endTime":1201.046,"body":"so that you can get your life back,"},{"startTime":1201.047,"endTime":1203.034,"body":"because rumination, as I said,"},{"startTime":1203.035,"endTime":1207.121,"body":"is activating the flight or fight system,"},{"startTime":1203.035,"endTime":1207.121,"body":"and as a result, you're stirred back up."},{"startTime":1207.521,"endTime":1212.53,"body":"Your body is back into kind"},{"startTime":1207.521,"endTime":1212.53,"body":"of an activated space that's"},{"startTime":1212.531,"endTime":1216.631,"body":"not healthy for you when you're trying"},{"startTime":1212.531,"endTime":1216.631,"body":"to relax and get calm and get clarity."},{"startTime":1217.081,"endTime":1220.505,"body":"Here's, though, what I would recommend"},{"startTime":1217.081,"endTime":1220.505,"body":"that you do over the long haul,"},{"startTime":1220.506,"endTime":1224.251,"body":"and that is to start to do something"},{"startTime":1220.506,"endTime":1224.251,"body":"like journaling."},{"startTime":1224.341,"endTime":1225.481,"body":"Get some coaching."},{"startTime":1225.491,"endTime":1228.341,"body":"Join an online community"},{"startTime":1225.491,"endTime":1228.341,"body":"where you can process this."},{"startTime":1228.721,"endTime":1231.204,"body":"But get the space where"},{"startTime":1228.721,"endTime":1231.204,"body":"you can start to make"},{"startTime":1231.205,"endTime":1234.687,"body":"sense and put it into perspective"},{"startTime":1231.205,"endTime":1234.687,"body":"and find the closure that you need,"},{"startTime":1234.688,"endTime":1237.199,"body":"not what you're gonna get"},{"startTime":1234.688,"endTime":1237.199,"body":"from this other person,"},{"startTime":1237.2,"endTime":1240.052,"body":"but some answers that you need"},{"startTime":1237.2,"endTime":1240.052,"body":"to make it make peace."},{"startTime":1240.061,"endTime":1241.087,"body":"And now for me,"},{"startTime":1241.088,"endTime":1245.181,"body":"one of them was, did I really harm"},{"startTime":1241.088,"endTime":1245.181,"body":"my family and can they ever forgive me?"},{"startTime":1245.192,"endTime":1248.383,"body":"It is important that we come"},{"startTime":1245.192,"endTime":1248.383,"body":"to some answers to put"},{"startTime":1248.384,"endTime":1250.361,"body":"it in perspective for ourselves."},{"startTime":1250.891,"endTime":1254.641,"body":"And for me, it was to put"},{"startTime":1250.891,"endTime":1254.641,"body":"it in perspective that he never loved me."},{"startTime":1254.751,"endTime":1257.682,"body":"That actually, I know that's"},{"startTime":1254.751,"endTime":1257.682,"body":"a brutal thing to say to myself,"},{"startTime":1257.683,"endTime":1259.111,"body":"but it actually helped me."},{"startTime":1259.581,"endTime":1263.38,"body":"It did help me to say to myself,"},{"startTime":1259.581,"endTime":1263.38,"body":"\"This was not love."},{"startTime":1263.381,"endTime":1264.814,"body":"This was predatory."},{"startTime":1264.815,"endTime":1269.665,"body":"It was an extraction, and he didn't"},{"startTime":1264.815,"endTime":1269.665,"body":"know you and he never cared to know you,"},{"startTime":1269.666,"endTime":1272.269,"body":"and that's why things went"},{"startTime":1269.666,"endTime":1272.269,"body":"the way that they did.\""},{"startTime":1272.27,"endTime":1275.546,"body":"So here's one of the ruminations"},{"startTime":1272.27,"endTime":1275.546,"body":"we haven't mentioned yet is,"},{"startTime":1275.548,"endTime":1276.811,"body":"am I the problem?"},{"startTime":1276.861,"endTime":1278.111,"body":"Maybe I made all this up."},{"startTime":1278.122,"endTime":1280.352,"body":"Maybe it has really been me"},{"startTime":1278.122,"endTime":1280.352,"body":"from the get-go,"},{"startTime":1280.353,"endTime":1282.138,"body":"and I just thought that it was them"},{"startTime":1282.139,"endTime":1284.326,"body":"because it was easier"},{"startTime":1282.139,"endTime":1284.326,"body":"for me to think that,"},{"startTime":1284.327,"endTime":1286.771,"body":"and I'm just blowing"},{"startTime":1284.327,"endTime":1286.771,"body":"all of this out of proportion."},{"startTime":1287.221,"endTime":1290.581,"body":"I have a feeling a lot of us"},{"startTime":1287.221,"endTime":1290.581,"body":"have thought that at one time or another."},{"startTime":1291.111,"endTime":1294.782,"body":"Here's the other thing I think is super"},{"startTime":1291.111,"endTime":1294.782,"body":"helpful to remember about rumination."},{"startTime":1295.271,"endTime":1300.552,"body":"Understanding what you've been ruminating"},{"startTime":1295.271,"endTime":1300.552,"body":"about gives you insight into yourself."},{"startTime":1301.294,"endTime":1306.304,"body":"It's actually s- sort of like an image"},{"startTime":1301.294,"endTime":1306.304,"body":"of the things that bother you."},{"startTime":1306.324,"endTime":1311.784,"body":"You can learn something about yourself"},{"startTime":1306.324,"endTime":1311.784,"body":"by processing what it is that bothers you."},{"startTime":1311.973,"endTime":1313.064,"body":"That says something."},{"startTime":1313.074,"endTime":1315.034,"body":"It gives you information."},{"startTime":1315.093,"endTime":1317.3,"body":"I don't know if we've"},{"startTime":1315.093,"endTime":1317.3,"body":"ever thought about that,"},{"startTime":1317.301,"endTime":1320.246,"body":"that you could use"},{"startTime":1317.301,"endTime":1320.246,"body":"your rumination sticking"},{"startTime":1320.247,"endTime":1325.549,"body":"points as places for you to then work"},{"startTime":1320.247,"endTime":1325.549,"body":"on in other locations,"},{"startTime":1325.55,"endTime":1330.443,"body":"like in online coaching"},{"startTime":1325.55,"endTime":1330.443,"body":"or therapy or with community."},{"startTime":1330.874,"endTime":1334.001,"body":"Think about, for example,"},{"startTime":1330.874,"endTime":1334.001,"body":"writing all your ruminations down,"},{"startTime":1334.002,"endTime":1336.303,"body":"each one,"},{"startTime":1334.002,"endTime":1336.303,"body":"the ones that are really bugging you."},{"startTime":1336.304,"endTime":1338.074,"body":"And I know that may"},{"startTime":1336.304,"endTime":1338.074,"body":"be kind of embarrassing,"},{"startTime":1338.075,"endTime":1339.993,"body":"because it's hard to look"},{"startTime":1338.075,"endTime":1339.993,"body":"at stuff like that."},{"startTime":1340.474,"endTime":1344.894,"body":"When I was doing therapy back in the day,"},{"startTime":1340.474,"endTime":1344.894,"body":"people would come into the office and say,"},{"startTime":1344.895,"endTime":1347.111,"body":"\"I don't even know"},{"startTime":1344.895,"endTime":1347.111,"body":"if I wanna say this out loud,"},{"startTime":1347.112,"endTime":1349.164,"body":"because there's so much"},{"startTime":1347.112,"endTime":1349.164,"body":"shame attached to this.\""},{"startTime":1349.183,"endTime":1350.233,"body":"And I understood that."},{"startTime":1350.833,"endTime":1353.423,"body":"But if you could hold onto the shame,"},{"startTime":1353.424,"endTime":1357.13,"body":"keep it under check so you don't"},{"startTime":1353.424,"endTime":1357.13,"body":"hurt yourself with it,"},{"startTime":1357.131,"endTime":1359.513,"body":"and then write down the ruminations."},{"startTime":1359.884,"endTime":1362.054,"body":"And then see if there's a theme to them."},{"startTime":1362.653,"endTime":1365.729,"body":"Like, is there a theme"},{"startTime":1362.653,"endTime":1365.729,"body":"of how people perceive me,"},{"startTime":1365.73,"endTime":1367.774,"body":"and do I have a place in the community?"},{"startTime":1367.823,"endTime":1368.984,"body":"That might be one theme."},{"startTime":1369.444,"endTime":1372.266,"body":"Maybe another theme is,"},{"startTime":1369.444,"endTime":1372.266,"body":"I don't trust myself,"},{"startTime":1372.267,"endTime":1376.227,"body":"and that's what's really bothering me,"},{"startTime":1372.267,"endTime":1376.227,"body":"is that I missed the signs,"},{"startTime":1376.228,"endTime":1380.261,"body":"and now I'm trying to process"},{"startTime":1376.228,"endTime":1380.261,"body":"my ability to rely on my own indicators,"},{"startTime":1380.262,"endTime":1381.404,"body":"my own discernment."},{"startTime":1382.194,"endTime":1383.748,"body":"Maybe another theme is,"},{"startTime":1383.749,"endTime":1388.479,"body":"I don't know if I'm lovable and why"},{"startTime":1383.749,"endTime":1388.479,"body":"somebody would choose me or not choose me,"},{"startTime":1388.48,"endTime":1391.283,"body":"and it really hurts to think"},{"startTime":1388.48,"endTime":1391.283,"body":"that somebody used me this way."},{"startTime":1391.974,"endTime":1397.064,"body":"But consider using it sort of almost"},{"startTime":1391.974,"endTime":1397.064,"body":"as psychological information that may"},{"startTime":1397.065,"endTime":1401.473,"body":"give you a lot of helpful direction"},{"startTime":1397.065,"endTime":1401.473,"body":"about where you're insecure."},{"startTime":1402.053,"endTime":1405.643,"body":"So it takes a lot of time"},{"startTime":1402.053,"endTime":1405.643,"body":"to heal from this."},{"startTime":1405.654,"endTime":1407.838,"body":"And like I said,"},{"startTime":1405.654,"endTime":1407.838,"body":"there's a short-term remedy,"},{"startTime":1407.839,"endTime":1411.162,"body":"which is you use that thought-stopping"},{"startTime":1407.839,"endTime":1411.162,"body":"and distraction remedy,"},{"startTime":1411.163,"endTime":1415.171,"body":"and then the long-term remedy"},{"startTime":1411.163,"endTime":1415.171,"body":"is to really have a safe space,"},{"startTime":1415.172,"endTime":1416.695,"body":"maybe journaling,"},{"startTime":1416.696,"endTime":1418.812,"body":"maybe coaching, therapy,"},{"startTime":1418.813,"endTime":1423.623,"body":"or joining an online community group"},{"startTime":1418.813,"endTime":1423.623,"body":"or all of them as a way for you to make"},{"startTime":1423.624,"endTime":1426.124,"body":"it make sense and find"},{"startTime":1423.624,"endTime":1426.124,"body":"some peace for yourself."},{"startTime":1426.173,"endTime":1427.978,"body":"I think those are the things"},{"startTime":1426.173,"endTime":1427.978,"body":"that are really,"},{"startTime":1427.979,"endTime":1429.273,"body":"really important in the healing."},{"startTime":1429.654,"endTime":1431.804,"body":"I can't wait to see"},{"startTime":1429.654,"endTime":1431.804,"body":"you back here next week."},{"startTime":1431.853,"endTime":1432.96,"body":"So you guys take care,"},{"startTime":1432.961,"endTime":1434.934,"body":"have a good week, and I'll see you then."}]}