What is Learning Mobility?

Learning rarely follows a straight line—and higher education is being challenged to move with it. In this episode of Transfer Tea, Quintina Barnett Gallion joins the conversation to break down what learning mobility is, why it matters, and what it means for today’s learners. We explore how learning mobility goes beyond transfer to include prior learning, workforce and military credit, and cross-institutional movement—and how AACRAO is leading the work to ensure learning is trusted, portable, and allowed to move.

Host:

Dr. Loida Gonzalez Utley

Director of Recruitment and Enrollment Services
Texas A&M University- Central Texas
loida.gonzalez@tamuct.edu

Guest:

Quintina Barnett Gallion

Associate Executive Director, Strategy Planning
AACRAO
gallionq@aacrao.org

FMI on Learning Mobility: https://www.aacrao.org/our-work/learning-mobility

Join us @ The Assembly this summer! FMI: https://www.aacrao.org/events-training/meetings/the-assembly

Email us at transfertea@aacrao.org

Transcript

0:13

Hi, you are listening to Transferte, a podcast for the Acro community sponsored by ACR, the American Association of Collegiate Registrars and Admissions Officers. My name is Lya and I am your host. Learning doesn't happen in straight lines anymore, and yet our system still expects it to. Today's learners move between institutions, careers, life responsibilities, credentials, and learning experiences that don't always fit neatly into a transcript or a traditional pathway, and when our systems can't move with them, opportunity stalls. In this episode of Transfer T, we're breaking down learning mobility, what it is, how it came to be, and why it matters now more than ever. We'll talk about what learning mobility looks like from the learner's perspective, what it encompasses beyond transfer, and how it challenges institutions to rethink credit, credentials, and trust. I'm joined by Incantina Barnett Galleon, whose work with ACR has helped shape how the field defines and advances learning mobility nationwide. Together, we'll unpack the language, the movement, and the responsibility we'll all share in making learning move because learning doesn't stop and neither should opportunity. Good morning from the not so icy Texas, but my guest has some, has some cold weather up there. By the way, guest, secret guest, who are you? Oh, Lorda, my name is Contina Barnett Galleon. Um, I am coming to you from Washington DC. Yes, it is, I think it was, like I said, 17 degrees this morning when I got up, but I don't mind the cold as long as there's snow on the ground. Um, let's see, I'm supposed to tell you my title, right? I'm the associate executive director of strategy and planning at ACR, um, which we love our titles. Um, all that means is that I think about How we sound, what we do to the field and coordinate all the things that we do internally, um, to our strategic plan, to our mission. I oversee, um, Our government relations department, um, our international department, our impact and engagement department, as well as our marketing communications department. Boss lady, got it. OK. All, all the things and very important work, by the way. Thank you for, for doing that for all of us at the membership. We're so thankful for all your work. No problem. Um, big question here and the reason why you're here, um, we've been tossing around this, uh, term. Learning mobility and um some of us are a little bit more familiar with it than others, but as it continues to make its way around higher education, um, Kind of explaining that to somebody else or to somebody that maybe doesn't even work in transfer to begin with is a little bit might be a little bit confusing or challenging, so I don't know what does acro mean when acro says learning mobility or uses that term. So, when ACR says learning mobility, we're talking about the work our members do. And I know that sounds real simplistic, but um I've been on the staff side of ACR collectively 17 years this month. Um, and I think for the longest time and probably preceding me, we've spoken about the ACRO members by their professions, right? Like you have your admissions operations site, you have your enrollment management, you have your registrars. Um, and one of the things that was asked of me early on in this position I'm in now is, what do, what do they do? How do they all go together? What is it? Why are they in this association? Um, and it seems so simplistic, but it's like, these are the folks who operationalize learning mobility. This is the work of learning mobility. So, uh, when you're talking about ensuring that learners can move accurately, fairly, and responsibly with, with their learning. Our members are the person, the persons, the people who do that. So if you're evaluating learning, applying policy, stewarding data, um, Maintaining academic integrity across systems, those are, those are the acro people. Those are all the things that relate to learning mobility and make sure that learning mobility is possible. So, if the outcome is a learner-centered. Um, practice in higher education, um, that practice is practitioner driven, and those are our members. So that, that's a simple way to talk about it, I think. Does that make sense? It does. Um, I think another higher arching question is like, how is it different than transfer or is it the same or connected, perhaps? No, so that's a perfect. So transfer is one of the most visible. Components of learning mobility, um, it's probably one that people know the most, um, and one that ACRA members probably know the most intimately, but learning mobility recognizes that members' work won't stop at a course to course equivalency, right? It includes interpreting prior learning, um, translating military or workforce experience, managing records across time and institutions, um, and so while learners experience mobility. Our members design and maintain and safeguard all of that, and the transfer is just one of those pieces when you're talking about The traditional 2 to 4 year or your um your reverse transfer from the 4 year back to the 2 or swirling transfer. All those pieces are just components of a larger conversation around learning mobility. It also seems more um learner-centered than institutional-centered. I know, and, and that kind of leads me to the next point. Uh, we have a lot of terminology and I think when ACR rolled out learning mobility for the first time or or that term, one of the things that came to mind was like, who is this term for? Is this term for students or is this term for institutions? I think it's for institutions. I know the work is learner centered. I don't think our learners are walking around like, what do you call this thing, right? But um, It's so that we can speak cohesively and be a better support for our members, at least from my perspective. Um, it's much easier to speak about the whole of our 18,000 membership when we can call it something and put principles around it and a framework around it and get the better, get better supports. Um, so the language is important because You know, our members need, they need support. We have more and more people exiting the field, you're being asked to do more and more, um. And I don't know, selfishly, I need an easy way to talk about getting people the things that they need and learning mobility. While it is semantics, it's, it's the truth, um, and it resonates with the field. And so while learners may not ever hear us saying learning mobility, the people that support that work, um, our connections to K-12, our connections to workforce, they understand that, um, and that makes you much more visible. And so if you had to explain learning mobility to a student in 30 seconds, what would you tell them? Um, I would say that it is the work to make sure that your learning stays with you, no matter where you go. Oh, that's perfect. And it was less than 30 seconds. That was like 5. OK, even better, because you only really have like 30 seconds at a recruitment table. I am, I'm all of the mindset. Why say sit down when you can say sit? Yeah, exactly. Awesome. Um, I'm curious though, how did this come to be, to begin with? Where, where did learning mobility come from? When did it, I, I know I've heard it in the past few years, but when was it officially released? When do we release it? It's probably been 3 years now, um. It came out of um. Conversations in the office, conversations with other associations, um, again, the The thought Internally from the staff side of making the work a bit more cohesive, um, and reflective of what our people are doing. There's this confusion around who our members are, um, how they may not actually matter to your provost or your president. It's sometimes often thought of as the plumbing, right? Like you just, as long as it's working, everything's good. We needed everyone to know that the plumbing was there. Um, and needs to be maintained and it's actually important infrastructure, um, if you want your institution to move forward and, and. Gosh, be, be relevant and, and survive in this fast changing world of enrollment cliff and decreasing staff. So, In the role or uh alluding to gaps and challenges, what was broken before or incomplete in the way we used to just address a learner as transfer or credit as just credit, um, that learning mobility helped to develop. Well, I would say it's helping fulfill. We haven't, say, achieved it, but, um, inconsistent policies, um, learners caught between systems, um, Institutional decisions that maybe make sense locally, but fail learners, um, across systems, um, across states, globally, um. Maybe sometimes across your own campus. So like speaking a bit more coherently about the work helps people think about making sure things move, um, and making sure that the process is easy for, for learners and quite frankly, making sure that it's learner-centered, right, as opposed to being focused on the objectives solely of an institution or, or a specific department. And then here comes Acro, and here comes your great mind and teams, and you give us learning mobility. So how is ACro? Uh, what is their role in in convening everybody and shaping this, this work now because it's, it's no longer a term, and we'll talk about it a little bit later, but it's no longer just a term, um, that we use. Now we've put it into action. Um, well, one, you said it, right? We have to convene, we have to educate, um, we can't just say it to ourselves. And so saying it across, um, other associations, seeing it in larger rooms, bringing in the people who do the things we, we were just speaking of, recognizing military credit, um, credit for prior learning, um, dual enrollment, all of the different people doing those different things. Um, so we're, we've been focused on shared language. Right? Making sure that we're speaking the same thing or at least understand what the other group is saying, um, building cohesive policies, interoperability of systems, um, bringing the right people into the right room to tackle some hard, sometimes just language problems, but policy issues, um, so. I don't know. Translating operational realities into a shared framework, right, that the whole field could use has been the work that we've been focused on. You talked about policies and other organizations. Have have they adopted this term already? Are they just barely warming up to it? I think it's, it's, it has legs. Quite frankly, sometimes it feels like it's speeding ahead of us because part of the work from my perspective is educating the membership. Um, and making sure that our members are getting the things that they need to persist and be successful in learning mobility, but it has resonated so well with some other groups, um, and with other associations that, yes, we are sometimes grappling to, like, we're not there yet, like people have taken the ball up and, and started running. So, no, it's, it's landing well. Uh, I know as a transfer professional, I'm so thankful for this term because, um, in earlier episodes of Transfer, I think in, in the first season, um, I, I said something like, um, Transfer is beyond transfer. It's multi-marginalized populations in one space. And so learning mobility, uh, encompasses all those things that you mentioned, adult learners, transfers, military, the 2.5 million dually enrolled students that exist in America right now, uh, credit for prior learning. So there is or there seems to be an urgency, uh, today for learners and for institutions. No, absolutely, I think. To our benefit and sometimes to uh I don't know, added stress in, in our work is that learning mobility has Outgrown siloed solutions. And so when you name all those different things and we have a framework that seems to work for all of those things, people, people have latched on, um. And so it's, it's moving along. What happens, so, uh, Contina, when mobility fails, and what happens when it works? When it fails, learners feel it, the way they feel it now. Um, but it also puts institutions at risk. You, you risk burning out staff, um, you risk inconsistent decision making, um. There's reputational harm, right? If, if things are not working as they should, um, you have policy drift, um, I don't want to be dramatic and say that you risk, you know, your institution closing, but those, those are the realities where we see closing institutions, um, and that's not necessarily a bad thing all the time, but it's, it's something to, to be aware of when, when policies aren't right and you're not serving the learners, specifically the learners in your community. There's gonna be impact to the institution and and the learners. Especially, I, I, you know, as a practitioner, especially there, there's no way to explain, uh, you know, what this, what this looks like every day is frustration really, when students come to you and they tell you, um, this happens a lot in my world. Uh, I'm a nurse. OK, what kind of nurse are you? I'm an LVN. Well, an LVN has technical credit and Uh, your associate's degree with an LVN, you know, doesn't transfer. What do you mean it doesn't transfer? Well, no, it, it doesn't, but I've been a nurse for 15 years. Why do I have to retake pharmacology classes or anatomy classes? Well, because policy says that your technical credits, uh, can't come to the academic side, you know, it just, that, that, that just looks like so much frustration to the learner, um. And disappointment and, and as I heard you talk, I, I wonder how many learners we've left behind. Unintentionally, uh, because we, we didn't know better or maybe the system, the system just wasn't ready because it's a very open-minded approach. There are still programs, uh, at institutions that are like, no, my program is gonna be traditional, in-person, no credit for prior learning, no technical courses. This is what it's been and it's been thriving. So I want to get your thoughts on that. I think that's. Learning mobility helps institutions. Um, Be more sustainable. And defensible for the professionals doing it. And I, and if your institution is 10 toes down on traditional frameworks. You may be OK. Like there are going to be a handful of institutions where it does not matter whether or not they're transferring in or transferring out or accepting credit for prior learning or your technical credits don't. That is a handful of institutions. is your institution that? Can you survive that? Can you be responsive? Or can you stick to or stick to the other ways. It's a decision people have to make, institutions have to make. Um, and I understand reputational brand and institutional brand, and, um, those are important things as well. It's not to be dismissive, but If your mission is to be here to serve the learners in your community, um, you are standing against your mission when you cannot respond to the needs of the learners who are there, um, and when you're insistent on not responding to the needs of the learners who are there, um. And I think it's, it's, it's really unfortunate when we're dealing with a consistent and persistent conversation that is questioning the value of higher education, um, that you can't participate in this conversation because you're looking backward instead of forward. Yeah, and that you brought up another point, the value of education is something that is, we're having to handle every single day and at institutions. We're having to explain to students why they should come when they have, they make six figures with a technical career, uh, you know, and then, and then to top it off, you can't bring that credit over to, to the academic, an academic degree, you know, so. Um, there are, I come from a regional institution. I've always worked at regional institutions, and it seems like I feel, in my opinion, uh, we are, um, the doorway to education for a lot of marginalized populations, um, but also the ones who have to keep. Hustling to uh get to those students because you're right, there are institutions that maybe they just don't have to and they never will have to adapt to um learning mobility for sustainability. No, I mean, it's fair. It's the reality, and it's, it's OK, but you just have to know which institution you are, um, and that still doesn't mean even if you're not going to change or don't need to change, that things like designing transparent rules, um, applying judgment with care, being flexible, having integrity, those are all still components of learning mobility. They're still learner-centered, um, frameworks, and they, they apply to all institutions. Yeah, and, and so it also validates a person and and their, their knowledge. I, I use, I use my mom as an example, like in previous episodes, but she um talked about, talked about not being open-minded with credit back then 30 years ago, 40 years ago when she came to America. Um, you know, she, she was a medical assistant. Uh, she got up to her senior year of medical school in Mexico, but her credits didn't transfer here, so she just, she's a medical assistant, right? Um, she has all this knowledge, um, um, she has, she knows medication more than I, I call her often and she's like, oh yeah, that's for this. Take it with this, don't take it with this one, you can't take your Tylenol, you know, and she gives me all the rundown. And yet she could only be a medical assistant because her experience and her previous uh knowledge just didn't count. And so every time that um we use a learning mobility, like those instances come to mind, just validating somebody's knowledge, uh, formal or informal, um, and being more open-minded about the fact like, what's, let's be real, like what is the difference. You know, between a technical pharmacology course and an academic pharmacology course, you know, is, is there a true, uh, difference and, and why do we set policies and systems up that just feel now like they're barriers for students? No, absolutely. Is, is there a difference is the real question and like where does credit for prior learning truly come into play, or Maybe something a bit more philosophical, like how much time does time in the field equate to um time in the classroom and how do you bring them all over, right? And so learning mobility encompasses all of those things. So, so, um, Accra has done a really good job at articulating the entire, the entire ecosystem of learning mobility. Um, what does that include? Oh man. Um, so transfer, yes. Um, credit for prior learning, dual enrollment, military learning, um. But it also includes roles. Um, so everyone does everything, and it sounds like we just slapped a name on all the things that could possibly be in higher ed, but, um, But it kind of is what we all do. So it translates across offices, um, we have the stewards of institutional memory. All of those things are a part of being in, in learning mobility, um, serving as a connective tissue between policy, data, people, and infrastructure. So. I don't know. Learning mobility recognizes and legitimizes. The role of the acrofessions, um, and so it's less of We have made something new. We're just putting a name to something that, that you already do. And in that aspect, where do institutions tend to underestimate the scope of learning mobility? Well, one, it's, do they even know about it? It's like, that's, that's the first, but um. I don't know, probably underestimating in the sense that just not understanding that they're a part of it and where their, their role is. And so part of that liaison acro, we called it this thing, so we have to do the work of making sure that people know what it is and where to find themselves in it. Um, and that's part of why I'm on this call with you today, is to start that conversation, right, and to think about Where is this not landing with folks? Um, how does this apply to my day to day work when I'm not thinking about learning mobility, but it's, you don't have to think about it for it to be there, like you're, you're doing it. And so, um, I'm rambling, but that, that's, that's how. Oh, so now we're getting to the fun, fun part. What is ACR doing and how to get involved? If somebody that is listening that uh wants to start or deepen their learning and uh learning mobility, where do, where do they start? What do we have? What are we doing? Well, I think the first thing we can do is think about our upcoming conference called the Assembly, um, If you did not know, we used to run two separate conferences, right? We had our technology conference, we had our transfer conference. They came together as tech transfer. Um, Pre-pandemic, that was an in-person conference. Um, post-pandemic, it was virtual. And then, you know, on the ground, you hear from folks like, well, when are you bringing back tech transfer? The reality was the fields couldn't support the conference. We couldn't support the conference the way it was before, and we knew things had changed. Um, I think we all felt the change coming back from, from COVID. And so ACRA put together a task force from people in the field, um, Practitioners in the field, other associations, uh, our technology, our vendor partners in the field to reimagine the tech transfer conference. Um, and they came back with this amazing report on What a future, um, conference around technology and transfer should look like, and the recommendation was that it should look like learning mobility, right? Learning mobility in principle encompassed everything that came forward in that report, um, but as opposed to having this conference where you do a lot of knowledge sharing and sessions, it should be a year-long platform, a year-long conversation around learning mobility with the yearly convening. Um, to celebrate wins, to help people grow, um, to push the field forward. And so that is what we are aiming to do this July, um, in Arlington right outside of, of, of DC, um, is have our first assembly. Um, the bringing the parts, assembling the parts of learning mobility is the name. Um, To see if we're able to get this off the ground. It's, it's a whole new thing. Um, it's not the sitting in sessions and having someone talk at you type of conference. It's supposed to be this, all right, bring your, bring, bring your problems, bring your big brains, get a notebook and a pen,-- and-- we want to hear all your problems. Yes, so like let's work this out, um. And then let's reconvene in 3 months and see how it's going, virtually, let's reconvene and let's see if we can apply some technical assistance here or just think with your, your colleagues, um. We've issued a challenge to the field this, this year, um, our learning mobility, uh, time to decision challenge, we'll probably issue more challenges, but we're, we're, we're taking this report seriously, um, and trying to Turn this conference on its, on its head to actually move things forward. So, there'll be more to come, but that's, that's probably all I'm, I'm comfortable talking about right now and that's It's pretty big. Yes, huge, and there is a whole website dedicated to learning mobility, which we will link at the bottom of this. Um, you can register for the conference, um, soon. Um, you don't have to be an ACCR member if you are somebody who is perhaps in other organizations that, as, as Contina said, it's Assembling together, bringing all the pieces and all of this is so out of the ordinary because for a long time we were just um We were just, uh, you know, inviting transfer professionals, people from the technological world, but now that uh learning mobility has expanded, um, we're excited that other, other components are coming in. So if you are listening to this and you are not an ACCRA member, don't be afraid. Come join us. We would be excited to see how your piece fits into our puzzle and how we can make it all work for students. Anything else to add, Katina? You know, I, I didn't plan on saying this, but maybe last week or the week before, I saw something on LinkedIn, um, From someone saying, you know, we go to conferences and there are 20 sessions and everyone's highlighting how they do it differently. Um, but there are over 4500 institutions and all these member organizations and like why is no one just bringing everyone together. To lay out a foundation for others to follow, to lay out um core fundamentals and internal governance, um, and it seems so timely because I'm like, oh my God, that is exactly what we're trying to do with, with the assembly. And so, I guess, um, I leave us with that, right? Like, I don't know. Learners, learners are experiencing learning mobility, but ACR and ACRO members make it possible. And so if we could all get on the same page, um, and apply. Fairness and and tackle the. Some of just the inefficiencies together, we could still all have our own flavor and our own brand, but we could definitely make the system work better. And we don't have to keep reinventing the wheel. We can, we can build a wheel together that everybody can use. Yep, yep. Wishful thinking, but those are my closing thoughts, I guess. That is wonderful. Thank you so much for your time, Cantina, for your work, um, and for helping us lead these really large, exciting things at ACro. Um, we, we are just, I'm, I'm excited. You can probably see it on my face, but I'm excited and I know everybody else is looking forward to it as well. Well, thank you for having me, Laura. I, I, you told, I told you I like to be in the background. Um, but I'm, I'm happy to show my face for, for something like this, for learning mobility, in the name of learning mobility. Have a great one. Thank you. Learning mobility asks us to be honest about one simple truth, learners are already moving. The question is whether our systems will move with them or stand in the way. This work isn't about perfection, it's about progress, alignment, and courage, courage to question long-held practices, courage to collaborate across silos, and courage to center learners not just in words but in design. ACR is creating a space for this work to happen, and there is room at the table for all of us. Whether you're just learning the language or already leading change, your voice matters. So here's a challenge. Take one step, learn more, join the conversation, and ask yourself where learning is getting stuck and what you can do to help it move. This is transferee, where learning mobility needs practice, where transfer is more than a process, it's a promise because learning doesn't stop and neither should opportunity.