Sacred Connection & Keeping the Flame Alive ❤️‍🔥✨ | w/ Jonathon Aslay

Relationship expert warrior for love, Jonathon Aslay, shares insights, secrets and tips for zoning in on the perfect partner, and the ability to be radically authentic as a sexy, soul mate attracter. We have a blast discussing not only dating but exploring how to fortify relationships of all kind through compassionate communication. This one's a game-changer. 

• Curiosity + Intentionality are the doorways to secure connection.
• Attachment spotting: ask about past relationships; listen for ownership.
• NVC in 3 steps: what happened → how I feel/need → are you willing…?
• Appreciation daily: aim for ~80% positive acknowledgments—tiny, specific, frequent.
• Micro-rituals: 20–120 second hugs, “I see you when…,” bedtime check-ins, weekly “state of us.”
• Friendship first: prioritize liking each other—rabbit-hole chats, shared curiosity, play.
• Requests from love: trade criticism for clear, kind asks.
• Grief alchemized: asking “What would love do?” creates meaning and gentleness.

Try this tonight

• “When you did ___, I felt ___ because I need ___. Are you willing to ___?”
• Give three appreciations (specific!) before bed.
• 30-second hug, slow breathing, no words.
• Schedule a weekly connection date (phones away): one curiosity question each.

Guest

• Jonathon Aslay — Relationship coach; host of What Would Love Do?; author of What the Heck Is Self-Love, Anyway?

Chapters

• 0:00 Welcome & Intention 🕊️
• 3:10 Grief → Devotion 💞
• 9:56 Dating Intentionally 🧭
• 19:56 NVC in Practice 🗣️
• 23:37 80% Appreciation ✨
• 32:40 2-Minute Hug 🤗
• 38:19 Games for Intimacy 🎲

Transcript

0:06

Hello dear friends and welcome to another episode of Life of Love. We explore what love means to us today, however it looks, and we look with curiosity into ways we can ascend to a higher vibration or we can rise up when we might feel like we got hit in the knees. And we're here for each other and we're community already. So thank you for sharing the episodes, tuning in. I appreciate your ears. and your heart's tuning in. And today we're really excited to connect with Jonathan. Jonathan Aslay is gonna share with us some beautiful tips. But first I'm gonna set our intention and I invite you to settle in. If you're driving, please don't close your eyes. But if you're just listening and you're in a safe place, just feel free to just settle in, feel your feet on the ground, connect to your heart with a breath. And I just, welcome you. I thank God for giving me these resources to connect. And I ask our creator to support us and bring forth a message for the highest good. Help us to clear away any clutter so we can present ideas with clarity and enjoy and love and support each other in this road. And I just, offer I offer my heart and my inspiration and sometimes my struggles and I honor Jonathan's path and his quest for his highest vibration of love and expression. And I honor his authenticity and his wonderful works that he's put forward. And I ask Holy Spirit to infuse this. this episode to reach the people that need to hear it and soften the hearts which wish to soften as we help each other create this grid of light around the world, around the earth, so that we can all be more happy and have our needs met and have love and compassion, communication and understanding. And with that, I thank you, I thank my guides, I thank Jonathan's guides, I thank the universe for the synchronicity of this. this beautiful time we have to create this container. And so it is. Thank you. Thank you. So it is. Hey! Hey Jonathan, thanks for being on the show. Yeah, thanks for having me. I'm looking forward to this. Yes. So guys, Jonathan is a relationship expert. He is specialized in midlife connections. And he's he lost a child. And that also gave him a little more insight into how he wanted to live his life of love. And he's he's dating. He has a girlfriend now. He's he's shared with me a little in the pre interview about this journey he's on. And so it's really exciting. So he's walking the walk. He's not just talking the talk. He has a great podcast called What Would Love Do? And he also has a book, a book, What the Heck is Self-Love Anyway? So that is a great question and valid. So yeah, thanks, Jonathan, for showing up and saying yes to Life of Love. It probably wasn't too hard for you to consider. Well, I appreciate the opportunity. You know, it's interesting because you shared my relationship and I've been on this and I'm going to kind of lead with this for a second. I know you have questions to ask, but you know, I began this journey 20 years ago after going through a divorce, losing my high-end corporate job and then getting wiped out in the market crash of 2008. financially and my identity was pummeled. And for years I was in the dark tunnel, if you will, the pit of despair for years. And it wasn't until I began examining love and relationships and started to, and I'll be frank with everyone, I got a little addicted to online dating, not a little addicted, a lot addicted to online dating as a coping mechanism. But it also led me to a profession of helping people, particularly in midlife, particularly helping women understand divorce men and the emotional effects of divorce and that sort of thing. And so I've been on a long journey and I've had a few relationships along the way. And they're beautiful experiences. think if you were speaking to several of the women that I was in significant relationship, they would speak positively. I had lots of dates that wouldn't have spoken positively about me because I was rather unconscious. But why I'm sharing this is it took me an evolution of almost 20 years to experience a very healthy love in my life. But I had to experience love in different forms, both losing my son, as you mentioned, going through these relationship experiences. And most importantly, learning to love myself in the last 20 years. And so, you like you think, gosh, it took you 20 years to find a life partner. And I genuinely believe I have my life partner, you know, if we can, you know, signify it as the one kind of thing. But it's been a 20 year journey to really discover what does love really mean? What, how do I love myself? How can I show up in the world differently? How can I give from overflow? I'm still, and by the way, let me just say this, every day I'm still learning something new about this word we call love, or experience we call love. let's start with attachment, attachment style and what you've learned. how can you innocently or non-interview-like find out somebody's attachment style? something you said first because it relates to what we're talking about. And you emphasize two words that mean so much to me and that's curiosity and intentionality. So to piggyback on that and for those listening, it's almost imperative that you write those two words, put it on your refrigerator. and embody what those words mean, really really embody them because you know, from a curious place coming back to attachment. So, and I'm going to try to give you the Reader's Digest version, something known as Love Attachment style. We either attach to someone in a secure way or an insecure way. And within insecure, there's a couple modalities within that. Now, Here's the thing, Julie, most people will go online, take a test to determine what their love attachment style is. But here's the tricky part. Our ego has a sophisticated way of, for lack of a better word, gaslighting ourselves or brainwashing ourselves. So we oftentimes answer these tests coming up as secure, okay? And I'm not saying that there isn't a percentage of the population that's secure, but the reality is, is most of us, Actually, our default is insecure, whether we like it or not. And within insecure is anxious and avoidant and within those there are subcategories. Okay, just put that in a box for a second. Since we oftentimes, you know, coming back to how do you find out a person's love attachment style is you have to pay really attention, pay really close attention. to what they say, particularly about their past relationships, asking questions about past relationships. Now, first off, it's good to know your own attachment style. That's called self-awareness, know thyself. But if you determine you're anxious, you believe it or not, whether you like it or not, you are a subconscious electromagnet for the opposite. So just know that going in. You're literally an electromagnet for the opposite, whether you think it or not, it happens on a subconscious level. So you wanna listen about their past relationships. And usually people who point the finger at the other person being the problem, there's a good chance they've done little or no healing in their childhood wounds and adult traumas that make them even capable of being. in a secure relationship. Find out about their past relationships and listen closely. Do they take any ownership on their part of the ending? that can give you a ton of information. You can find out if they tend to have narcissist behaviors. They never do anything wrong. They don't self-reflect. You could understand that that's a red flag. oh a man or woman, you know, it's interesting. Women have a propensity of pointing the finger at men and men point the finger at women. You know, I mean, it's very simple. that, and everybody thinks they're the exception and not the rule. If you can't self-examine your past relationships and take ownership, even if it's 3%, believe me, you're going to have problems later on down the road, whether you like it or not. Because there'll be a conflict that you need to work through and you need to take responsibility for how you contributed because there's always two people. It doesn't happen in a vacuum. I love that. that's what I was, when I was thinking about this whole topic, I was like, you have to start from where they began and just having a casual conversation about, know, where's your family live and see what... what comes up around family and then, yeah, you know, long have you, when was your last relationship or I don't know, I guess I haven't dated in a long time. I've been married for 20, 23 years, like, no, 24 years actually. I had to do the math. Yes, there was no online, there was no swiping. I don't know how I would have done with that. Well, and for a lot of people that are entering the dating marketplace today, particularly midlife folks, which I say is after baby making years and before retirement, many people haven't experienced that, you know, digital form of connection. now online connections or cyber connections or digital connections represent 65 % of all new relationships. know, so many people are fish out of water. if they were coming off a 20, 30 or 40 year marriage, whether they ended in divorce or sadly, when you get to midlife, there's a lot of folks who are widowed or widowers. And just even navigating this space can be really challenging. I know, like creating a profile and all that. It's like, who, and also during these big transitions, even if you're not separated, but when the empty nest happens, you almost have to recreate your relationship. And that's sort of what Mitch and I are going through is like, we have so much more time together and we don't have the dynamics of the bouncing off the kids. And so we have to decide how we want to spend our time. And the communication is becoming more and more important because it's easy to, I find myself, it's easy to just be busy instead of sitting and being really connecting because we've been so busy, but we get this chance to start redefine our relationship because it's not centered around raising kids anymore. So it's almost like you date your husband. yeah, this is a challenge because, know, and I'm a tail end baby boomer. So, and I get the sense you're a Gen Xer. um Although you could be a millennial for all I know, because you look so young. uh So, you know, for those of us who are tail end baby boomers, Gen Xers, we were raised with, you know, a script. was, go to college, get a job, meet someone, get married, buy a house, start a family. And that was the blueprint we followed, particularly make babies and raise a family. And in that blueprint, it wasn't really connecting with a partner outside of the performative nature of a relationship. And what I believe is so critically important is that whomever we choose to mate with, You are really, really, really, really good friends. Like you really, really like this person, not love them, you like them. Like you like talking with them, you like getting their opinion, you like going down rabbit hole conversations. And sadly what happens in a lot of marriages, that gets so focused on the children. that the friendship begins to wane, or worse, they just start going in two different directions. He's got her hobbies, she has his hobbies, and they lack a foundation of friendship. Other than there's care, there's this long-term care there, but when you've lost the friendship, boy, I mean, that's the most imperative piece, along with the physical connection. I can't even begin to stress the importance of a physical connection with a partner because like then what's the point of being in relationship with someone? mean, it's the difference between friends and lovers is the sex piece, you know? Right? And we don't even understand what's communicated. I always talk about the grid of light. I mean, it's a subconscious energetic that is exchanged. I was just reading about, it's the Chinese Five Elements book, and they were talking about the heaven and earth, and we're the conduit in between. I forget what it's called, the yin. No, it's the shin. Anyway, I was just reading about that's ancient Chinese. philosophy and these things are hard for us to put our finger on, but they're very important energetically. And also if you're not feeling like you want to have a connection with someone, there's always something underlining that whether you're not feeling seen or you don't feel safe. oh I looked up the 10 universal needs and maybe we'll get into those, but it's very, very powerful and especially read them to me real quick because I'm familiar with six core needs but I haven't heard 10. Can you read them real quick so I know them? so I went on a deep dive on chat. was like, chat, can you please pull up 10 Universal Needs? And this was asked after I asked chat about the book that we're going to talk about with the nonviolent communication, which is so pertinent to everything going on in the world. It's like so gooey. So this is what chat came up with. Okay, number one was safety and stability. you know, your physical safety and your financial safety. Then physical well-being, you know, shelter, sleep, good water, good food. Then number three is connection and belonging. So feeling part of the group, feeling seen. Fourth was love and intimacy, warmth, closeness, affection. And these, didn't have them listed in order of importance or anything, but this is just how it came up. Five was respect and recognition. Okay. Six, autonomy, freedom, consent. And seven was, gosh, I don't have my glasses on. How did I write this? It's, oh, competence and growth, like continually learning. And then eight was meaning and purpose. Nine was peace and harmony. And 10 was play and joy. And I think you put play and joy, from what I listened to you, play and joy would come up a lot sooner on the list. Well, I mean, yes, but all of those are certainly really important. And the recognition, particularly the safety, to some degree, certainly as we age, we have a fear of death that starts to creep into our lives. Particularly, I'm 60. For those of you in our 60s, 70s, and even 80s. But more importantly, safety around our environment too, because certainly the world, particularly if you watch the news and other things going on in the world, you know, it could feel like we're not safe. So, you know, and even in a relationship, we may not be safe, we may not feel safe to be ourselves, we may not feel safe to speak our truth, we may not feel safe in that this person's gonna stay, you know, versus, I mean, I'm talking about abandonment. or rejection and those sorts of things. So to me, we oftentimes operate on an unconscious level trying to get that need being met. But now some people will put play and fun at the top of the list because that's what the ego wants, but really, truthfully, the ego also on a subconscious level wants that core safety more than anything and it kind of messes with us because our ego can play against one another. Right? Like you're not, you wouldn't be safe if you're vulnerable with your need for a cuddle or your need, I don't know, like whatever comes up. And that's what I really would love to talk about how... you know, your observation and your vulnerability that if you're not feeling seen or you're trying to figure out how to love yourself, but you have to know exactly what you need to love yourself. And we're not exactly taught this. We're not taught to... to stand up for our feelings in a way. Most of the time, I believe we're taught to make our parents happy, survive, and like, you know, not so much stir the waters, but in the stirring of the waters is when your self-care comes in because you're setting boundaries in these things. So, oh yeah. So, you it occurs to me that we human beings oftentimes are focused on the doing of life, particularly supporting ourselves, you know, from that base need, that second need of physical survival and that sort of thing. There's almost a lot of attention there and not really... examining all those other needs you just talked about. men have a propensity to stuff their emotions. They focus on, and this is a generalization, so it's not an absolute, but they focus on that provider protector piece. Particularly men focus their identity on what they do for a living and not who they are being, okay? And when I talk about being is all those other needs and really examining your feelings and emotions around those needs. And men oftentimes don't give themselves permission to do that. Women on the other hand, and please forgive me if it sounds like I'm insulting women, that's not my case. They're usually all over the map on all those feelings and they're not really identifying what they actually are feeling at the core level, they're thinking it as a surface level, usually pointing the finger at their partner going, you're not meeting my needs, but they're like, they're not describing what their need is, you know? their needs are, pick, women tend to pick apart the men instead of saying, I feel insecure when you drive too fast. I don't feel safe. And you know, and I've asked you to not drive like this before, but you took it as an attack because you're supposed to be perfect. And if you weren't perfect, your mom would be mad at you. So if I criticize your driving, you're a horrible person. Like, that's a good ghost. did was something known in the book called nonviolent in the book, nonviolent communication. You were, you were offering identifying what the need is and then making a request. Well, then ultimately you'd make a request to your partner. Is it okay that you slow down? Because I feel unsafe in this moment. And by the way, folks, if you're, if you've heard this book only for the first time, I know it sounds ominous, nonviolent communication by Marshall Rosenberg. Ideally, he should have titled it, compassionate communication. How can we communicate with someone from a compassionate point of view? And the only reason why it was called nonviolent, piggybacking on the word you said, we oftentimes attack in communication unbeknownst to us. It's fascinating. If you ever watched, the TV show Couples Therapy on Showtime, you'll see attacks on each other partner instead of coming from a place of genuine love and compassion. And when I was going through these 10 universal needs, I was considering the ones that I feel like I'm in a wheelhouse and the ones I'm like, uh. And I was thinking, well, what would my husband say if he went through these and gave him a rank of one to 10? Does he feel seen? Does he feel autonomous? Because a lot of times I say what I would want because I've thought about what I want and need. And he hasn't because he focuses on producing. And so since he doesn't have He hasn't reflected on what his freedom or his respect and recognition would look like that I know at first, so I tend to get my way. And I'm like, I would be scared for him to pull out some of these. Because I've I've done the work and he hasn't had time or taken the time. you have to honor where somebody is and what they're willing to do. But then also you you can use this communication as a playground to find out more about yourself instead of an attacking. And it changes dynamics. And I would love to go into the three steps of the nonviolent. yeah, so like the first is what happened? And it's not attack, it's just what happened. And the classic one is you were late. Okay. Okay, we didn't start on time, which I now want to go into the positive affirmation of this too, because I think that's more powerful than the there's a problem we need to talk about it. Because if you can catch someone doing what you like and tell them good job, that's so much more bonding, it builds trust. It's a beautiful state to be in recognition versus how can we stop this from happening again? But yes, I guess we always start with the negative. We always start with what's lacking. you know, and let me dovetail from this for a second, because you talked about like what someone does right or like, or that sort of thing. What I oftentimes see couples spend very little time is in actual appreciation for their partner and verbalizing that appreciation. And quite frankly, and I'm making this up as I'm saying these words out loud, It should feel like 80 % of the time you are in a state of appreciation for your partner. And ideally, it would be really fantastic if couples just continually express appreciation. I'm gonna tell you, that's like taking a multivitamin every day for your relationship. And I know it sounds voluminous to say 80 % of the time, but to say thank you, You know, it's like, okay, we look at thank you like we'd say thank you to the barista at the coffee shop, but really using the words appreciation, gratitude, grateful, really be coming back to that word you used before, intentional. Like if couples actually were intentional about appreciation, then these things that we're talking about, these things that are differences or dislikes would have a lot less weight to them. The problem is the dislikes or the differences is 80%. There's very little acknowledgement or validation for the appreciation, okay? And so, just simply right off the bat, if couples just were intentional about appreciation for every little experience, now you might be thinking, well, I've been married for 23 years, I don't need to do this. I'm saying that's what healthy couples start with and they continue with that as a daily practice. And it comes down to gratitude for that person being in your life. And as you get to middle age and then, you know, health concerns and everything like that, feeling of stability and security becomes more more important. So actually, it's think it's more important as you get older and you realize you have less energy to do things. So, you know, maybe you don't need a fancy vacation. You just need to show some positive recognition and you could take the universal needs. I'm just going to pull out one. You know, like you say, thanks for listening to me complain about my family member who's having trouble. It really helps me feel seen and it brings me closer to you. You know, and that's I love that one in particular because we all, and when I think of the word complain, I also think of a word vent, okay? know, it's like, you know, like in other words, like a volcano that has like a venting to release steam, you know? And just say, hey, thanks for allowing me to vent about my family. I just needed to vomit, you know, just get it off my chest, you know? and then move on from it. You sometimes we get too wrapped up in the weeds of the issue instead of just, hey, I need to get it off my chest. so acknowledging that's a perfect example of just acknowledging what your partner did, validating for what they did, and also making sure that you do it together. It's not the woman leading the charge with oftentimes is the case. It's also the man contributing in that intentional way. And you said earlier, you know, there might not be enough energy or not enough time. That's BS. Okay. That is so, and please forgive me. I didn't mean, I'm just saying it's BS to say you don't have time. I guarantee you when someone looks at how much time they invest in things, a lot of time is, can be redirected, and please forgive me, this sounds like a judgment. You waste time in so many ridiculous areas when you can redirect that into your relationship. And for the men and women listening this, is, I'm gonna say when you are in a relationship that's secure, that's healthy, that's playful, that's safe, I said secure, but all those other needs being met, this is where, real true joy and happiness exist. it's not, know, what's that saying, you know, on the epitaph, you know, it wasn't like the next car you bought that brought you joy. It's the, you know, it's not the things that you left, you know, the toys you left in life. It's the experiences you have with the people you love that I believe matter the most. And it's not even reserved for your romantic partner. It's also like every relationship. If you show recognition to your parents, to your children, to the person who helps you at the bank, I mean, everybody needs recognition. Like you're saying, we watch the news and we think the world's falling apart and it's not. There's a strong sense of community and it's up to us to reinforce it. I think, thank you for saying that because I believe gratitude is the antithesis of love, is beyond compassion and empathy. And that's just my vantage point is that when a human is in a state of appreciation, it is one of the highest forms of love. And And I'm grateful that your podcast, Life of Love, you your book is about love. My book is about love. It's the idea that I believe this journey, this soul experience journey we have is to magnify love, like to really be in that space and give yourself permission to love and starting. no, yeah, I used to have a feeling like there's a cap to it. Like, you've got to be a little stingy with it because something's going to fall apart. But that's not true. That's not true. It's absolutely the opposite. The more you love, the more you're vulnerable, the more you connect, the more it magnetizes to you. So yeah, that's a myth. That's a myth of scarcity. I... I talk about myths a lot, but yeah, I'd like to emphasize that you just really struck a chord with me, that scarcity myth. in the course of miracles, which I did a study of it for three years, the concept of a miracle is how can we shift to love? So when we're even in our worst state of anger or maybe something horrific happened, you I lost a child. know, most parents would look at me going, my God, I'd never want to experience that. the most terrific thing. And, and I chose to redirect that loss into writing a book about love to grieve with love. Like I said, okay, how I can grieve with suffering, I can spend years in suffering, or I can choose to grieve with love. And I'm like, and I'm still exploring what that means, please, you know, I am not here to diminish anyone else's experience of loss or pain. But the question is, I want to explore even just like the littlest things that happen that I don't like. How can I redirect that to love? And it's coming back to a question. I don't always have the answer. I'll be candid with you. Half the time I don't have an answer, but I lead with that question. What would love do in every circumstance? And I know it sounds cheesy and for some people it's going to be, yeah, that's a crock and all that kind of stuff. But I'm going to tell you something. You know, I believe this is where it's at. just life is about figuring out love. And if your heart feels hard, and I always say soften your heart, but you can feel it and you ask your heart like what really needs to happen? like you say, what would love do? It's a perfect question. It gets you out of your ego and it's like, no, I don't wanna be right. I just wanna feel connected to this person again. I just want the situation to be over and how can I get past it? And it's not... ignoring or pushing something down with the emotional trash compactors. It's being authentic and saying how you feel. And maybe that person's not supposed to be there for you, but if you authentically share, things are gonna work out for you. And then, you know, have faith, have trust. So yeah, you're right, it's not easy, but it's so gooey and it's so worth it when it connects and you're like, yeah, this is what love would do. And I got through that. Now onto the next one. Okay, okay. You know, can I share something though? um So my girlfriend and I, my beloved, I should say, it feels like sophomoric to say girlfriend. And I do believe we'll be married at some point. We were at Farmer's Market the other day and there was something she just did that looked so cute. So I walked up to her and I just started to hug her. But it wasn't like a three second hug. wasn't a six second hug. It wasn't even a 20 second hug. I like held her for probably two minutes, maybe three minutes. Now, just to give you some context, that's a really long time, okay, to stand there. And it was just one of those moments where I wanted to connect. And she mentioned something later. She said out of corner of her eyes, she saw some people looking at us, like almost like this is weird, but also like, I want what they're having. And it's amazing how simple a hug is one of the most amazing expressions of love and care. And I say this because my last physical memory of my son before he passed away when we were together, we always made it a practice, a hug, a kiss, I love you to each other. Like that was our last. physical connection when we'd hang out. And then he went about his day and did his things. And then whenever I'd see him again, that was our kind of our routine. And I now, every single person that matters to me in my life, if we're going our separate directions, whether it's work or this or that, it's an absolute ritual to do it when we leave each other and when we visit each, when we see each other. And again, A lot of times in seasoned relationships, people take this for granted. I want to encourage everyone, make that a ritual. That's a mandatory and not just a hug like this, but a real embrace that lasts for 20 or 30 seconds. By the way, it calms your nervous system. know, cortisol levels drop, anxiety drops, all the, there's so many health benefits. You live. longer by doing this. And so I'm sorry, I just couldn't resist sharing that. no, and it's funny because that was my episode this week that I released was this woman who went across the country hugging. And she had a Facebook page. And so it's very timely. And so it's definitely on my radar. And she talked about 20 second hug. Yeah, she actually lives in Atlanta now, which I'm like, she picked Atlanta to end up. But yeah, so. She's just south of where I live. um So it's just beautiful. And yeah, it's about connection. your book is amazing too, but also the nonviolent communication, they go through conflict resolution using the three steps. it's not about blame, it's about sharing how you feel and then suggesting. Are you willing? And I love that phrase. Like, what did you think about that? Or do you have a better one when you have a, you know, something that it's a conflict and you could say, are you willing to take more time so we could not rush to leave the house? Or if it's... Well, the idea is to make a request from love, make a request from love and coming from that place of curiosity, know, from make a request from love. And so whether it's you're willing or can we do this or how do you feel about this come from that energy of love. And honestly, know, we bids for connection, you know, we can look at our relationships from a performative transactional perspective. And to some degrees, relationships are transactional. And to some degrees, they're even a little bit conditional to some degree. I don't mean it fully. just mean there are, you know, like we don't wanna be in relationship with people that are, you know, if you're out of integrity, if you're. If you have a call a doctor or an attorney or a policeman, then there's something wrong with that relationship, okay? And the condition is, I feel safe, you know? That's okay, but always coming from love. And this isn't easy to do. And I almost wanna say, we weren't taught relationship skills. We just weren't taught it. And oftentimes we were witness. to unhealthy dysfunctional relationships growing up. Not intentional. mean, our parents didn't intend to emotionally hurt us, okay? They didn't intend to be, that was just what they learned from their parents and their parents and their parents. But if you're listening to this, you literally can put a thumbnail in your life and you can do something radically different going forward. And partners should, you said growth. was one of the human needs. I believe individual growth, but relationship growth is imperative for if you want a healthy, happy, long-term relationship. And you can stuff this all and you can say, don't wanna do this, or you can say, you know what, bring it on. I wanna learn how to be in a better relationship. Let's go to a workshop together next weekend. Let's go to... you know, a retreat center, you know, instead of going on vacation to Disneyland, let's go to Costa Rica and a retreats couples retreat center and really get to know each other at a deeper level. You can even buy a game called the and game, which is wonderful because it asks you to ask your partner, what do you think of me? Kind of questions, you know, what do you think I think? No, it's questions like, what do you think I think of you? You know, and I mean, it's a fascinating game, you know, and you get to the nitty gritty because intimacy is into me see. I think it was Esther Perel who said that or Brene Brown. I'm not sure who coined that phrase into me see. And for the guys and ladies listening, the real juice of a relationship is to be really, as you said earlier, vulnerable, authentic, transparent, you know, with your partner and. and to be in that space of curiosity. I'm just here to, I love on love. So I'll keep talking about this till I my last breath. same. It takes years off your life and makes the years in your life better. So it sucks. Wait, can we reframe that? It adds years to your life. Oh, God, it got to God. Makes you look younger. I love that. Exactly. It takes the aging process off your face. Well said, well said. really does. And you can feel it's a release, it's a freedom. I think, yeah. Oh, Jonathan, this has been a delight. I appreciate all your insight. It's just been so much fun exploring and sharing this. And I hope everyone else had as much fun as we did listening. thanks so much, Julie.