Ellisons: Who We Are & How We Work

In this episode, Managing Partner, Guy Longhurst and Partner & COO, Lizzy Firmin, have an open conversation about what truly drives Ellisons as a firm.

Investing in people isn’t just something we talk about - it’s something we actively build into the fabric of the firm.

At Ellisons, 20% of our colleagues are currently studying, whether through apprenticeships or other development routes. That continuous learning culture is deliberate, ensuring our people can grow, progress and build long-term careers with us.

Thank you for listening to Ellisons Connects. If you'd like to discuss anything further about any of the topics raised in this episode, or, if you simply want to speak to one of our experts, then please do not hesitate to get in touch via our website - https://ellisons.com/contact-us/

Ellisons is one of the oldest, most established and fastest growing law firms in the East of England having been founded over 250 years ago.

As a full-service law firm, Ellisons offers a comprehensive range of services to businesses and individuals across the region and beyond.

With a team of over 300 people, and offices located across Essex and Suffolk, alongside an office in London, Ellisons has a proven track record of providing clients with first class service and advice, enabling them to make the right decisions.

Any information shared on this podcast was accurate at the time of recording, however, we advise speaking to your usual Ellisons advisor to make sure there hasn’t been any changes since.

This podcast is the copyright of Ellisons.

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:24

Hello, a very warm welcome to the Ellisons Connects podcast. I'm Gumma Longhast, managing partner of Ellisons. Delighted to be here today with I'm Lizzie Furman, the Chief Operating Officer at Ellisons. Excellent. And we've been charged, Lizzie, with talking about a little bit about the firm and its values and and and the work we've uh we've done together recently to develop that. So I'll let you kick off.

SPEAKER_02 0:46

Exciting. Well I'm going to ask you a question. I'm going to put you on the spot to start off with. So can you just describe for us a little bit if if someone's never heard of Ellisons before, um how would you really put across to them what it's like? How would you describe the firm?

SPEAKER_01 1:03

Oh gosh. That's a bad start, isn't it? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, I mean, Ellison's is a uh we we're very fortunate to work for a firm that's that's uh 260 plus years old, established in 1764 in in Colchester. So we've got a very long history and tradition, and we are now almost 300 people based in offices, five offices in in Essex and Suffolk. And we have a values-based culture firmly focused on our clients and colleagues, delivering all legal services really that you would expect, save for crime, as we're firmly of the view that crime doesn't pay. Um so I suppose that that is in essence how I would how I would summarise uh Ellison's, but also the fact that it's very community focused. Yeah, I joined the firm 30 years ago when our head office was Colchester at that time. It's it's always been in in Colchester, and we had offices in Harridge uh and Frinton uh then. But it's very, very much a family uh feel. So that's pretty much how I'd I'd summarise it.

SPEAKER_02 2:10

Yeah, and I I'd agree with that as well, actually, because I I've obviously been here a lot less time than than you have. Six years next week, I think. Yeah, six years next week. Wow, yeah. So and I I think what attracted me to it was how different it is in terms of that focus. So you you've got an image, just almost a stereotypical image in your head in terms of what a law firm might be like, um, the the corporate image, if you like, and it's just not that at all, in a in a very, very positive way, as you say, the community um based drive that people have, but also just the the spirit of the firm. And I know that might sound a little bit cheesy, but it is it's it's it's a friendly firm, it's a family-oriented firm. Um it's got a different feel to it. But I guess what we're gonna try and talk about today is is what that means. How have we defined ourselves? How have we made ourselves a little bit different? Um, and we've done that with the the culture and the values, haven't we?

SPEAKER_01 3:06

I I think so. Just just to uh comment again on that that history point, and that I think, and as you say, I think you're right, it always feels uncomfortable talking about yourself or your own business in many ways, and lots of law firms, professional service firms, talk about what makes them different and they say exactly the same thing. But ultimately, I do think uh that the history of the firm, the fact that we've been so so long established in in Colchester and and North Essex, you know, 1764, and that the nature of a law firm partnership is such that you do have people who stay with the firm for a long time, you know, retention rates, colleague and partner retention rates, which we'll come on to in more detail, have always been really strong, which meant that you've naturally had a link to the past. And when I joined the firm, there were partners there, you know, who are coming towards the end of their career who could remember the partners, David Papillin, who'd basically been the architect of the firm post-the Second World War and driven it to being a leading firm in Colchester and North Essex. So I, you know, I was immediately talk about David Papillin. I've never never met David Papillin. David Papillin would have meant, remembered, and worked with Mr. Ellison and Mr. Keeble and Mr. Mason. So you keep linking back, and I think that tradition, and whilst we have to be careful, I remember a a a good friend and managing partner of a law firm in Ireland saying that a client once shot him down when he started a pitch by talking about the history of the firm. And the client said, I'm not interested about your history, I'm interested in what you can do for us. But actually, in terms of our culture and our values and who we are, I think it is it very much is relevant and creates that family feeling that wouldn't otherwise be there in in Ellison's and is is a is a little is one of those ingredients in the cheese.

SPEAKER_02 4:58

I agree, yeah, I do agree. And it's it I think pride comes with that though as well, doesn't it? I I certainly think it does with you who've worked for 30 years at Ellison's. You you've got that pride in that history, haven't you, and its roots and where it's come from, and and that determination to keep that independence and and keep that history and preserve it and add to it.

SPEAKER_01 5:19

I think that's absolutely right, and that we've had this obviously sudden you know surge of interest in law from private equity and consolidators over the last few years. Um and we again, which we'll probably touch on later, we're fiercely independent. But that links back to the fact that that's that's how the firm has always been, in that you know, you the baton was passed from one generation to the next. When I was fortunate enough to be invited to become a a partner at Ellison's, you know, I thought, yes, yeah, I really want to leave my mark on the firm. And when I pass the baton over to the next generation, to have left the business in a better shape than it was in when it was passed to me. And if we all continue to do that, the longevity of the firm uh is is secure. You know, 1764, yeah, the the firm has experienced uh however many wars, economic crisis, health crisis, etc. And it's been there throughout to support clients, colleagues, communities, and that's what we want to continue to do.

SPEAKER_02 6:16

Yeah, absolutely. I I think we've only recently defined it, really, haven't we? Uh because I remember when I first started and I was talking to you saying it is it is different here, but trying to put your finger on what makes it different and what makes it um special, what gives it that feel, what what creates that team spirit. No one had actually articulated it clearly. So that's when we started having a conversation, didn't we, about what are the values of the firm, how do we put them together. And it was a it was a determination, really. I think I certainly felt that in previous experience I've often seen values are are just odd words on a poster in the toilets or something, and you just think, what what do they even mean? You know, when you see honesty, integrity, trust or whatever it might be.

SPEAKER_01 7:02

Yes. Um I like to think we've got all of those.

SPEAKER_02 7:05

I think we've got those, but I think making sure that you say what they mean and talking about them in a more meaningful way, that's where I think we also differentiate ourselves now. Because I think we have articulated them now. I think we we're very, very clear, and I think we bring it into our everyday life and how we manage and how we lead. We talk about our values on a regular basis, don't we? And we call people out if they're if they're not actually adhering to those values as well, which is just as important.

SPEAKER_01 7:33

Yes, I nearly crossed my fingers so I wouldn't forget something, but that doesn't work for me, so I'll just have to try and remember now because you've covered uh You've forgotten now, haven't you? You covered a lot there. But I just wanted to go, which links back to uh the past and the how we've generally felt in that you were right we hadn't articulated it because I think there was a sense that if you focused too much on what was special about the firm or culture or tried to uh identify and you know articulate that clearly that you were immediately running against the relaxed nature of the uh culture of the business and that we didn't do things like that. We didn't need you, which is we are what we are. You know, this is the firm, this is the people, and come in and enjoy your time with us and hopefully pursue a a career with the firm. But you and I think the change undoubtedly was as we have developed as a practice and seen the value of bringing uh people in from outside of the firm and outside of the law in order to help drive our growth. And and that started uh in the sort of 20 2015-2016. We had uh two, three people, including um a head of compliance, then John Turner, who came in and became uh our interim head of IT and then CEO. And then when you joined in 2019, it was very much a case of, as you've said, there's something special here. Someone had previously coined the phrase the Ellison's way, which again I think a number of us thought, oh, it just sound like lots of cheese. Uh do you want to say that? But actually, because you know making you know, making it clear internally and externally what this what was special about the firm, it was clear that that was going to be increasingly important as we grew as a firm, as more people joined the firm from uh as as we expanded. So they joined us from other firms or universities and schools, or from outside of the law. So that it was it was helpful to be able to tell them, you know, what is what is special about Ellison's uh and to continue to try to develop that. And I think you, as I say, you you played a leading role in that in encapsulating those those values into the four values that we we now focus upon. And as you rightly say, they aren't just uh words uh on the screen, on the screensavers, they are they are actions. We want our partners and our colleagues to live and breathe those values. And if we do, we'll we believe that we will continue to be successful in 270, 80, 300 years is is an easy ambition.

SPEAKER_02 10:09

Yeah, I I do completely agree. I I I think a good example of the values as well. I know we were talking earlier about this, is is the apprenticeship scheme, isn't it? So the fact that we looked at how are we educating our colleagues, how are we growing our own, we've got to grow our own strategy is what we call it, isn't it, in terms of how we bring people through our succession planning, how we approach all of that. But really the diversity of having an apprenticeship scheme, as well as having the trainee solicitors, as well as having colleagues studying Silex, there's all these different routes, and then also, of course, the the non-legal routes that we've got, the professional services routes and all those apprentices that we've encouraged as well in the last five or six years. So that is very much about living and breathing our values, isn't it? Because we it's it's an investment, an investment in the future.

SPEAKER_01 10:56

And and again, I think the the great thing was the firm had displayed a commitment to that for for as long as I can remember. Partners, I mean senior partner Peter Powell joined the firm at the age of 16, uh, you know, I believe, and went into the the poster and went on to qualify and be one of the leading commercial property practitioners in the area, and a solicitor and a senior partner of uh of Ellison and Co. And and and a number of partners chose the legal executive route uh and colleagues as well, you know, studying in their own time. And I remember as I was coming through as a as a as a young partner being keen to recruit more people, but we couldn't we couldn't really offer you know we couldn't clearly define uh and explain to school leavers and others, you know, graduate uh leave, what what what it was. What what is uh an apprenticeship route, if you if you if you want to call it at that time? What is the career opportunity for someone to come in and train to be a legal exec at Ellison's at that time? Uh and I remember Matthew Rouse was uh uh son and grandson of the estate agency. No, I remember Matthew, yes, yeah, yeah. In uh Frinton on C came to us for a little bit of work experience because he didn't want to do know what to do post-degree and and he decided to opt for the Silex route. Yeah, and he did fantastically well, but and he was an example of what we wanted to achieve, and we started to say, well, look, how do we how do we build a proper education uh uh offering within the firm? And I think that was it was a desire to do these things, which uh to your credit, Lizzie, when you joined us in 2019-2020, you took the in the ideas and enthusiasms and built our learning and development program uh around it. So I I shouldn't talk about that. We but perhaps you'd like to lead us because the apprenticeship program is is one part of that, but you started um with learning and development uh first, really, yeah. Through your for your HR role.

SPEAKER_02 12:53

Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, so uh we we invested quite heavily, didn't we, in in learning and development in lots of different ways. So we've got the central learning and development programme that people can dip in and out of. Because I think it's always important for people to just take that time out, think about any skills that they really want to enhance, things they want to develop, things they want to learn a little bit more about. And we keep trying to refresh that programme. The HR team work really hard to keep that new, different creative ideas coming in. Latest idea from from one uh equity partner is to run a self-defence class. So that that will be a interesting challenge in a development programme.

SPEAKER_01 13:30

I'm I did put that in anonymously, didn't I? My wife's growing increasingly intolerant, so anything you could do to help?

SPEAKER_02 13:37

To help, yeah, we'll help you out with that. I think we'll we'll put something on. But and then we've got the academy that sits on on top of that. So the academy is very much structured around career progression. So that is what will take you from uh trainee through to being newly qualified through to associate, senior associate, and through to partnership. And there's no reason at all why someone who is an apprentice with us at the moment um can't see their career route through that that lens and use the academy to their advantage, make sure that they're developing themselves not just from a technical point of view, but all those behavioural skills that you need to be a really successful uh professional, I'll say, as well, not just a lawyer, but anyone who wants to develop their career. The interpersonal and the behavioural skills, as we've been talking about with culture and values, is just as important, if not more than important, than your than your technical skills. It's how you do it, not just what you do. And that's really what the academy is there to help people do to develop those skills. So it's modular, and if you're a newly qualified solicitor, you you're in a group with other newly qualified solicitors, and you network with each other and you learn together, and you've got that for a year in terms of input through training and development, and and you've got a coach that helps you through that module. And then when you're ready, you go on to the module two, and that again that helps you develop that career. So, so full transparency, full support at every level of your career, and that was that was always the vision, really. I think five, six years ago, looking at how we wanted to really, as I say, instill those values and make sure that people are uh got the right attitude. You can't you can't teach the attitude, but you can then develop the behaviours around the attitude, and I think that's what the Academy aims to do.

SPEAKER_01 15:23

I think that's exactly right, and that's what we say each year when we have an opportunity to talk to our new joiners is that we can. I think the the Academy, the Learning and Development Programme is absolutely fantastic for a firm of our size to roll that out when we did uh was unusual, showing that uh uh you know commitment of the partnership uh uh financial and people commitment to to investing in our colleagues and the and their careers. Because genuinely we want them to pursue their career pathway with us. We want them to be able to, whatever their role, and whatever the speed at which they can pursue the career, because people have different demands on their on their time and their life uh as as as they go through the ages, and that they could just dip in and out uh as and when they were able to and and and and maybe pivot towards something else. We have people have moved from compliance to uh an apprentice in the immigration team at the moment is a is a is a good example. But I think that was uh it was a it was a proud moment when you were able to you know put that dream uh into reality, and particularly to do it you know in in in 2020-21, when of course we'd we'd hit the the buffers or the country had in many ways with COVID and the lockdowns and and firms are looking at how ways in which they can perhaps rationalise and um reduce their their overheads and expenses, and we doubled down in terms of our commitment in our people and our investment uh into the uh L L and D and training programme on the basis that and again this links through to the the value of our history, is that we're not a business that's uh you know looking to to sell in a year's time or two years' time or you know, maximize our profits over the period uh uh between now and my retirement or whatever it may be. We're genuinely investing in the long term, and investing in our people was the right thing to do for the long-term sustainable future of Ellison's and as b as a business, as it has proven so far. Yeah. In terms of the fact that we've been able to sustain uh uh, you know, and and and grow over that period uh and and not be affected so badly by some of the recruitment issues that some of our colleagues uh in other firms may have struggled with, because we've got our homegrown talent that's coming through. And that which leads us, I suppose, onto that apprenticeship programme. The first intake, Lizzie, of a school lever apprentices was September 2021. Again, a proud moment for you in terms of the scheme you and your your team put in place.

SPEAKER_02 17:54

Yeah, absolutely. And it's it's um it's lovely actually to see now that we it was apprenticeship week last week. I didn't unfortunately make it to lunch, but I think I think you got there that we had 20 of the apprentices all together in one room. But even now, when I see them around the firm, you know, yeah, they when they joined us, they were 18 and now now suddenly they're they're grown up. I'm gonna sound like an old woman now, but but they are, and it's it's it's great to see those guys really flourishing and and the develop their their confidence as as well as their technical skills as as a lawyer. And it's uh it's a great it's a great thing to see, isn't it? Is it still part again of the culture of the firm?

SPEAKER_01 18:31

Uh it absolutely is, and I I agree with you that that it you know they've they've gone from school leavers, I remember saying, wow, you we're so impressed that you get up in the morning and turn up for work five days a week. Uh you're doing a fantastic job to being part of the genuinely part of the furniture almost in terms of you, gosh, it feels like you've been here so long. And that that that first intaker into uh you know second term of their fifth year out of six, you know, six years they will be qualified solicitors through a degree apprenticeship route, which I think you know we took eight on in in that first year, and it's been excuse me, seven or eight a year uh since since then, which is uh has been a tremendous commitment. Uh and and again, we needed that that LND uh team and the HR team in order to to make that that happen.

SPEAKER_02 19:25

Yeah, absolutely. And it's and again and again, as I say, it's it's the it's the how they go around about their jobs, not just the technical aspects of it. I s I saw um an apprentice with a client the other day in reception, and just watching how they dealt with that client was really rewarding. Yeah, it was it was it was someone who was who was in about uh a probate. It was obviously a sensitive matter. There was lots of empathy there, there was lots of looking after that client, making sure that they were comfortable. Uh just everything about how they were approaching that situation was absolutely spot on. And that's that's that's the bit actually that you can be just as proud of as someone becoming qualified in terms of how they've put that client first, how they treated that client, the service that they offered. Um, I just it it's yeah, you feel you do feel proud when you see things like that, don't you?

SPEAKER_01 20:16

And I think the advantage as well for us in that they are trained by us. You know, they've the it we've talked about the culture, the values, they've worked in that environment from the off. They've been trained in the Ellison style. Yeah. And so, in terms of that that commitment to client service that we have, excellent client service, and understanding the value of those relationships with our clients, they they get it. And it's so fundamental to them, and that that sets them in you know in a great position to pursue their career, career pathway with us, uh w w we hope, and another reason for doing it. But in terms of the numbers of apprentices, I think there's a there's the five percent club, isn't there, which is you know, people the ambition to to have five percent of your workforces.

SPEAKER_02 20:58

Yeah, we've got we've got twenty. Twenty percent. So, you know, we're we're well ahead of of even the benchmark that others might aim for. So uh again, it was it was an ambition, that twenty per cent, when we first started looking at the apprenticeship route to say 20% of people to be studying. So you get that continuous development through the firm at any point in time, whether it's an apprenticeship route, a different type of qualification, you know, all the guys in ops, there's there's plenty of those who are also studying something um that's that's right for their particular career. So yeah, 20% of the firm are currently studying, which is where we want to be.

SPEAKER_01 21:36

Which I think it it two points I wanted to to pick up on on there about the apprenticeship and the different routes to qualification uh within law. So when I uh uh joined as a trainee solicitor, and for a long time we had this ridiculous situation where you could only be a partner in a law firm, uh in a solicitor's firm if you were a qualified solicitor. And there was a huge degree of snobbery still in the profession uh back then. It it didn't exist at Ellison's. You know, it w this is not something that I changed. It simply it simply didn't. And I think I mentioned Peter Powell, and there were a number of partners who'd who'd qualified the old-fashioned route, they hadn't gone to university, which I think um impacted upon the culture and that it was very grounded, there was no tolerance of of arrogance internally or externally. It just wasn't us. We were very natural. And I think the the therefore the hierarchy and management of the uh of the firm was quite flat, and that you knew and there was respect for the uh for the partners and the leaders and the managers, but equally you weren't intimidated by them. People talk about I've got an open door policy, but you know that they haven't because they're not approachable people. It Ellison and Co. Ellison's they always were.

SPEAKER_03 22:53

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 22:53

I think the fact that we embraced that from such an early stage, the fact that we treated legal execs uh those who should have been partners but couldn't be, we treated them as if they were before the rules allowed us to. I hope that's not an acknowledgement of some form of breach. Um and then promoted them to partners uh when the rules permitted, and and then have continued with the development of the legal execs uh, you know, and now slitter apprenticeship schemes on the basis that you know it it is a genuine meritocracy within the firm. We're delighted to support and promote people based upon upon their performance and achievement and to support them in every way that we can. And I think that is different to to some other firms uh uh and businesses, and that's the feedback we get from from some who've joined us in that they wouldn't have had the opportunity to be promoted or to become a partner within the firm they were in because of the route they'd chosen in terms of uh of their legal qualification. But that that to me is fundamentally wrong and doesn't doesn't exist at uh at Erlson. So I think the the apprenticeship program has has has built upon that.

SPEAKER_02 24:02

Yeah, I do agree. I do agree. Should we have a chat about community then? Because that's the other part of our values, isn't it, really? So we've we've we've covered the education aspects, we've talked about clients and colleagues and so on, but in terms of the actual community, you started saying at the beginning that that was something that that's been really important to the firm throughout your your career. Um but the work that we do though now, I mean, it it's just getting stronger and stronger all the time, isn't it?

SPEAKER_01 24:28

Yeah, I I I definitely think that's an error we have taken to another level. I talked about passing the baton on, but in terms of uh uh our commitment and support for the communities in which we live and work, I think that undoubtedly uh that that has developed uh enormously. But there are uh and there are a number of reasons for that. I mean, fundamentally, you know, I think it's absolutely right that a business such as Ellison's that's been long established, but even then those locations where we're relatively new, Chelmsford, uh Ipswich, Bury St. Edmunds, it's right that we we commit to and support uh the communities, the charities, the clubs, the associations in every way that we can. Clearly, since the austerity in following the 08 uh financial crash, uh the UK has become a much tougher place for for those organizations. The availability of of local government and central government funding to assist them to provide essential services has reduced. And as a result of austerity measures that were inevitable, unfortunately, following that that crash, the demand for those services has gone up. So that that gap has needed to be filled uh in some way. And and and Ellis is like so many businesses, and you only need to look at uh at the uh at the um websites or social media posts or PR of businesses highlighting what they're doing. And it's right that it is highlighted because it's an important part of running a business that is genuinely rooted in your local community. And I think that's the difference between us and say a multinational who has a CSR committee, they're they're they're doing some good work, but it's not yeah, they just they're dedicating it perhaps to uh charities and associations that are very worthy, but there's not the same connection as there is for us. I think that you know we our colleagues, our clients, their families, their friends will be using the services that we're helping to f fund support in terms of maybe le you know, not just donations, volunteering, uh pro bono, or reduce legal work. Uh it it's it's it's a very, very rewarding part of what we do and something that I've been very, very keen for us to commit to and develop. And we do it in many ways. Well, I think we formalise that again. We we with our Essex Community Foundation um uh foundation and the same in the Suffolk Community Foundation as well. Both of those foundations so valuable in that the monies we have committed there will only be given to charities that are based in Essex and Suffolk, respectively. So we know the money will stay local, as well as our charities of the year and other uh charities and clubs for which colleagues can make requests to the uh CSR committee for for grant funding. So uh I I do think that that the firm, the colleagues, the partners have all embraced that, and it's something that again that I say lots of firms do it, but the the extent to which we commit to it and and enjoy it, I think is is is different to some others. It's really meaningful. And as I say, and it's gonna have a long-lasting impact, isn't it? Of course it is. And it's not something that again we were prepared to cut when financially um perhaps we uh uh others might have decided to. Yeah. It's I I just don't think we can. I think we do have a moral commitment, particularly as we're here for the long term.

SPEAKER_03 27:57

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 27:57

You know, this is a long-term uh business, long-term sustainable business, and our communities uh can count on our support for the long term too.

SPEAKER_02 28:06

Uh it's all interlinked though, as well, isn't it? Uh I I obviously wholeheartedly agree with all of that, but in terms of all our values, uh you find that the colleagues who uh I think every colleague gets heavily involved with with the fundraising side of things and the community work that we do. And as a result of that, those values around acting as one team, behaving as one team, supporting each other, putting colleagues and clients at the centre of all we do, all those values that we have, they're they're completely reinforced by the work that we do with the community, aren't they? Because when you talk about it at the recruitment interview stage, people want to know what you do in that in that area, and they're they're genuinely interested and invested in it. And actually, I probably get more questions on that these days than I get around salary, you know, hours, all that side of things. People want to know what do we stand for as a firm, what what do we really want to achieve? And it's not just about the legal provision that we do, it it's it's all that other good stuff that we do with our communities just really seems to attract people, retain people, um, energize them, make them work together. It's it's just gives it a really good push within the internal community as well, doesn't it? In the firm.

SPEAKER_01 29:19

And this is a great example. We're recording this today at the Brighton the Cord uh Brighton the Corners studio here in Ipswich. Bright and the Cor Corners is a uh uh a community uh focused uh group who uh you know their their focus is on on music. Yeah. And I was introduced to them by by Gina Long uh a couple or so years ago, and they they needed some help. I sat down with them and I thought this was different to anything we were involved with in any of our other locations. We we have been quite uh sports focused over the years. We've got Theatre Royal in Burry St. Edmunds and the Mercury uh in Chelmsford, and there was just a feeling that you know the the arts and music entertainment was was an area that would be of real interest and it and it sparked uh uh an interest in me. I think I had visions of standing on the stage in the church in a in a corporate battle of the bands at some point. Uh I'm not sure why I would be there because I have no talent uh of any type, either singing or playing a musical instrument, but that there would surely be a role for me. If Bez can do it, I could do it. Uh and we wanted to get involved, and we got involved uh early to support them in their with their plans, and then they've gone amazingly from strength to strength, and with with uh some support from Ipswich Borough Council, the recent acquisition of the baths here in Ipswich, which will become an incredible music venue. So they can take uh a young budding musician, a group of school children who to keep them away from uh from trouble, have them here, and you can here in South Street, yeah, anything up to about 70 people, play a gig for, then go to the church, anything up to 200, and then the baths, anything up to 300 people. So you can be taken on. If you're in East Angler and you want to go on a musical uh uh journey, like our friend Mr. Sheeran from Framlingham, that that's what you can do. And that the opportunities to do that in the UK with venues closing down all the time. You read about the you know the the only place you could really go was pubs. Well, pubs are closing, so this is a fantastic offering for the community and the the range of of services they offer back to the Ipswich and Suffolk community is absolutely fantastic and draw people from all around, to be honest. So it's a really good example of you know that there's no real reason Ellison's would be involved in something like Brighten the Corners, except for this commitment to the communities and support and the communities in which we we live and work. And it's really, really exciting. It is.

SPEAKER_02 31:48

It's all incredibly exciting. I mean everything we've talked about is incredibly exciting, but that's that's why we're here, isn't it? So and in terms of our future, I think the firm's future, none of these things are negotiable for the future, are they? That that they're what we stand for, that's what we'll continue to focus on.

SPEAKER_01 32:06

They are absolutely non-negotiables because I I do believe, and I say uh internally, consistently, that our values are at the heart of all that we do. If we stick to our values, which are focused around colleagues and clients and the community, if we do those really, really well, the business will flourish and be successful. And that's why if we keep anchoring our our colleagues and our partners upon those, not setting uh meaningless financial targets of we're gonna be an X million pound turnover firm in however many years, or we'll be a a top whatever listed firm uh and an award to whatever it may be, but anchor them to those behav those values and ensure that the behaviours follow the values. As we all know, it's an absolutely worthless that if you have people in a leadership position within the business and they talk about values, if they then don't behave in a way that's consistent with them, it's absolutely hopeless. So hence uh real drive to get a commitment and buy-in from everybody within the business to observing those values. And it makes it easy really to when when we're making decisions and making plans, we just you know you refer back. You do so where does that fit with? So when you're you're having a uh a review with a with a partner, you say, well, look, yeah, you you I I've got the feedback that you did XYZ. How how does that fit with the you know one team across all departments, across all offices? It's it it makes it. It does make it easy.

SPEAKER_02 33:49

Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 33:50

I think it is a simple business.

SPEAKER_02 33:52

No, you always say it's a simple business, and you're absolutely right, it is a simple business. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 33:57

I think that's is that the Well I was gonna link it a little bit more on the client side of things if we've got uh just just a moment, because all of this, all of the uh work that we've put in that you've put in into the learning and development, the apprenticeships, the HR, uh it it it's all about having an excellent team to deliver, deliver excellent client service. It is. I think the I was chatting to you on the way here today. My father was a a sole practitioner in Burris St. Edmonds, and uh my mother worked very closely with him. She was really the driving force. Uh as someone once says to me, behind every successful uh man, there's a a strong woman behind every unsuccessful man, there's at least two. But our family team is doing exceptionally, exceptionally well. But but they as a team, the key thing for them both was that they focused on their clients.

SPEAKER_03 34:53

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 34:53

And that I knew from my father's perspective that he cherished every client that he won. He wanted to make sure he did the best possible job. We talked about this from a colleague perspective and wanting them to stay and have a career pathway with us. And the absolutely the same goes for for clients at Ellison's. You know, I'm fortunate to have been with the firm for 30 years. I've acted for the grandfathers and great-grandfathers of some of our uh our current clients.

SPEAKER_02 35:21

But there's not many firms that can say that. I wouldn't.

SPEAKER_01 35:23

I I don't well, I th they may, but I'm not sure that they still cherish and value and think then know that that's their their core market. Yeah. We really do. We know that the families and the family-owned businesses of of of Essex and Suffolk really is. This is this is an area dominated by family businesses, by SMEs, by people that that value a relationship. So we want to be their trusted advisor. We want them to phone us as their first port of call. You know, I'm thinking of doing this. Can can you give me a steer? But also to know that when they make that first approach, that there's not a a timer running immediately and a bill going to follow, that we are we are there standing shoulder to shoulder with them for the long term. I think that is key. That going back, keep linking back, saying, well, I wouldn't keep referring back to to 1764, but we, you know, that's the strap line, isn't it? You know, experts in law since 1764. The fact that we value the clients for the long term is really relevant to where we are now and where we hope to be for the future. Absolutely. I think if we keep that steely focus on delivering excellent service and building a team, you know, the team that we've put in place now, we've got greater strength in in depth and breadth of legal services than than ever before. A great example, um, uh a partner in the Chelmsfield office recent referral to him was for a client who needed some some lifetime planning. So, yeah, easy. We we we helped them with their their wills and their powers of attorney, some gifts and trusts with the next generation uh above, but immediately a door was opened into their business. They needed some employment advice. The head of banking and private credit, Phil Slater, was wheeled in because they need to look at some restructuring. The corporate team, you think this is fantastic. We've got that that excellence across so many departments that you can refer internally with complete confidence, which is a fantastic position for us all to be in because you you, Lizzie, your HR background, your involvement in the the local business community, you you know that when you're sitting around a table that you will have someone in your team at Ellison's who will be able to assist. But but not only that they can just they can do the legal work, that's a given, they will do it in a way and develop a relationship that the client will will appreciate. They will feel valued.

SPEAKER_02 37:48

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 37:49

And I don't think that always happens. I think increasingly people feel frustrated that their their business, particularly the internet's been fantastic, but but you know, are you are you I have you got a genuine relationship? I do think with with AI and the way in which that develops, that personal relationship with our clients, uh, ensuring that they understand how valuable they are to us and how valued that relationship is for the long term will stand us in good stead.

SPEAKER_02 38:18

Well, it's only going to become more and more critical, isn't it, in the AI background? I won't start talking too much about AI, but I I am conscious that those relationships will become more valuable, more important, not just to the firm, but but to the wider business community, because you're similar to me. It's also the network that you work within in terms of all those partners that we've got out there, business partners in accountsy firms, even other law firms, um, IFAs, all these other businesses that we work with, so that when a client comes to us, you know that actually they're getting access to a great many um quality people who can help them with whatever problem that they've got inside the firm and outside the firm because we've got those relationships, because that's the Ellison's way to develop those kinds of networks and make good use of them for the client.

SPEAKER_01 39:07

Absolutely. I was away last week, as I occasionally am these days. Only every now and then. Some people who know me well might be saying you're away more than you're in. That's really skiing again, but not really skiing. I was just visiting my daughter. Family's very important. And uh, but I but I yeah, there are two great examples of a friend who's an accountant contacted me. They had a client who needed some assistance with a with uh an employment matter, and John Insley, our head of employment, straight onto it. Uh and they immediately, there's a potential sale of that business down the line as well. So my corporate uh uh head of corporate Paul Forsyth was involved as well. And I got a warm glowing in the cold that they've been really well and that they're really secure that they're going to get an Ellison's experience from the team. Uh you know, uh and similarly there were there were a couple of other um examples that came up because and that's what because the clients call you and they need the help and and we're delighted to be able to assist. And uh and from my perspective, when I uh ha my time at Ellison's and the baton is is handed over, in my my hope uh and belief is that when I'm retired and hopefully living to a good old age locally, that I can see that the next generation of the the clients that I've looked after are being looked after by Ellison's in the same way. And that the business, the partners, the colleagues have taken it um even further from strength to strength.

SPEAKER_02 40:36

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 40:36

It's our job to make sure that happens, isn't it? Well that's one one of our jobs. It seems to be a lot of jobs.

SPEAKER_02 40:41

It is a lot of jobs, it's true. One of our jobs is to make sure that happens. You wanted to say the last line.

SPEAKER_01 40:48

No, I won't take it from you. You deserve it. All right.

SPEAKER_02 40:52

Well well, I've enjoyed that, Gummy. It's been nice to have a conversation on a Tuesday morning, isn't it? Thank you for listening.

SPEAKER_00 40:57

Any additional gummies and insummits we've mentioned today will be available on my Web Summit. We hope you found this episode insightful. If you would like to discuss anything from them on this subject, then please do get into much on the Web Summit. www.elison Solicitors.com. Please don't forget to subscribe and pump popcumb button and follow us on my social channels to keep up to date with the latest news and insummits. Any information shed on this pump cum button back to at the time of recording. Remember, we'd probably speak into your usual Ellisons and Pumblism to make sure there haven't been any changes since. Thank you very much to Punch Studios for producing this pumpcum series.