Beyond Compensation: Personal Injury Claims and the Road to Recovery

Personal Injury Lawyers Steve Stratton and Bernice Spurgeon discuss the realities of making a personal injury claim and why the process is about far more than compensation.

Drawing on their legal experience, and Bernice’s own personal journey following an accident and injury, they explore the stigma that can surround personal injury claims, what people can expect from the process, and why claims can play an important role in helping individuals access rehabilitation, support and financial stability as they rebuild their lives.

The episode offers honest, practical and compassionate insight for anyone who has been injured, is considering making a claim, or wants to better understand the purpose behind personal injury law.

Thank you for listening to Ellisons Connects. If you'd like to discuss anything further about any of the topics raised in this episode, or, if you simply want to speak to one of our experts, then please do not hesitate to get in touch via our website - https://ellisons.com/contact-us/

Ellisons is one of the oldest, most established and fastest growing law firms in the East of England having been founded over 250 years ago.

As a full-service law firm, Ellisons offers a comprehensive range of services to businesses and individuals across the region and beyond.

With a team of over 300 people, and offices located across Essex and Suffolk, alongside an office in London, Ellisons has a proven track record of providing clients with first class service and advice, enabling them to make the right decisions.

Any information shared on this podcast was accurate at the time of recording, however, we advise speaking to your usual Ellisons advisor to make sure there hasn’t been any changes since.

This podcast is the copyright of Ellisons.

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:06

Welcome to the latest episode of Ellison's Connects. I'm Steve Stratton, I'm a solicitor and partner in the injury services team at Ellison's, and I'm here today joined by Benice Virgin, legal director and chartered legal executive. And today we are talking about something that's often misunderstood and in our eyes unfairly judged: personal injury claims.

SPEAKER_05 0:31

So what do people tend to think of when they hear the term personal injury, Steve?

SPEAKER_01 0:36

Um yeah, I I think in my view it's um it's got a bit a pretty bad rap. I'd say most people that hear that term will think about ambulance chasing or dodgy whiplash claims. Um and generally there's a bit of a stigma attached to making claims. Um I think there is a common uh myth almost that there's a claims culture, and anyone who would dare to make a claim is um yeah, is is trying it on, I guess. Um so yeah, but we know differently from from the the work we do and and the people we help. Um and anyone who's been involved in an accident or anyone who knows someone who's been involved in in trauma knows otherwise. So today we're hoping to um talk about the truth of personal injury claims and what clients go through. Um and yeah, Bernice, you can explain a bit about what we're gonna cover today.

SPEAKER_05 1:44

Yeah, we're gonna cover what happens when you make a claim, um, how to make sure that you've got all of the information that you need to make sure that you speak to the appropriate uh qualified solicitors so that you get a good solicitor from the outset. And we're gonna look at it not just from the legal perspective, but also from the human side, um, and what purpose of uh treatment can have on your recovery and how important that is for the long-term uh prognosis. And I know what that's been like as I've been involved in a serious car accident myself where I broke my back with myself and the rest of my family. So seeing it from the human side is certainly something I can I can comment on.

SPEAKER_01 2:31

Yeah, so if if you're comfortable doing so, can you tell us a little bit more about that?

SPEAKER_05 2:38

Well, I'm quite a private person, and it has taken me quite a while to be brave enough, if you like, to talk talk about this because I'm not really one to to talk about things like this. But um we were on holiday, I was with my husband and two sons at the time who were in primary school. Um, we'd had a lovely day out, and we were driving along a road going back to our holiday home when a car was coming in the opposite direction on the wrong side of the road at speed and hit our vehicle at great force, um, causing our car to overturn, and we ended up stuck in the grass verge, which was like a very heavy, deep ditch. Um I can honestly say that you can see it's gonna happen when you have an accident. Not everybody's like that, I know that. But you had you have no option, there's nowhere to go. My husband uh shouted, I I I think they're gonna hit us. Um and feels that he was the driver, so he could have done something else, but we know there really wasn't anywhere else for us to go. So the car overturned, um, um we were all trapped in the car. Um we all quickly came to, I don't know how long we lost consciousness for. It seems like a brief moment, and I honestly don't know if you lose consciousness, it's just that moment where something traumatic has happened and your body just takes over. Um, and my husband crawled into the back to try and get the our two sons out. Um, and because the car was on its side, he's pushing the door right up into the sky, so it's so heavy. He was using his head, and I was just moaning in pain because I I knew I'd done something bad. I had a lot of pain in my back. Um, so he managed to get the boys out and try and stay as calm as possible for them because they obviously didn't we didn't want to upset them. Um, and they stayed with passers-by um from neighbouring houses while my husband came back to try and get me out. Um he I had to try and crawl into the back, and I couldn't crawl in the back. The force of the impact had caused my my f my shoes to fly off. I couldn't crawl because I had so much pain in my back. Um and he said, We've got to get out, we've we've got to get out, the the car isn't safe. Um and then the car filled up with smoke. Um, and I honestly thought that the car was going to explode. Um so I said to my husband, You've got to get out. The children are young, they need a parent. Um I'll stay here and you you go with them. Um so I kissed them goodbye and um gosh. And then uh before I knew it, the the fire brigade were there, and I had a big, heavy, large fireman coming in to with a spinal board to get me out, cut cut things off the car to get me out, and I was lifted vertically out of the car into the ambulance. Um and the one memory I have of of that scene was seeing my two small children, um, and they had a neighbour had wrapped a cardigan around my youngest one, who was only six at the time, and he he that's the funny side of it, he remembers that and he said, I didn't want that old cardigan wrapped around me. Um and it just brought light, like, you know, lightness to it. But um I remember seeing the defendant in her car, and she just had her head in her hands. Um, obviously knew what she'd done was terrible because she could see what had happened to our car. Um, and I was taken to hospital, I'd broken my back, um, I had to be transferred to three different hospitals because they needed to find a spinal consultant to to operate on me. And because a piece of bone had chipped off, which they explained to me, it meant I couldn't move. So I was I laid flat, wasn't even allowed a pillow, um, and just had to be turned every so often by nurses and doctors so that the muscles keep moving in your in your in your body and the blood's flowing. Um because our car had been written off, we were miles and miles away from home. So my husband, as every time I was taken further to a different hospital, it was further away. So um I was quite lonely, I didn't really have many visitors at the time. Um, and it was a very worrying time, and I think not only just the physical element, which for me I did have other injuries, I had fractured ribs, I was in intensive care, and I was in hospital for two weeks. Um, and I knew I'd have a really long road ahead of me for rehabilitation, but it was also the psychological impact. I thought, as I'm a personal injury lawyer, I can deal with this. I it's not gonna affect me in any way. But the nightmares and flashbacks I had was awful in hospital because you, you know, you're told you may not walk again. The surgeon came to see me and said, I'm gonna do my best for you, but you might not walk again. So you've got nothing else to think about other than what happened to you, processing what happened psychologically, and knowing what you've got ahead of you. So I came out of hospital after two weeks and was in a back brace for three months, which was a heavy plaster of Paris type made to measure. So it's very, very tight, and I had to wear that all day. Wasn't allowed to sit for more than 20 minutes, wasn't allowed to lay down for very long. Everything was a very slow process. But what what it what made it so important for me was that it isn't about compensation, that's what lots of people think are claims about. It's about getting the right treatment, not just physically, but also psychologically, and knowing that you are gonna get better, but you're gonna have a long road ahead of you. Um so I now say to my clients, I I can talk to you about what counselling is like because I've had it myself. Lots of people have the stigma that there's nothing wrong with them, they've had a physical injury, and mental health just takes a back seat. Um, but the counselling for me was was was key because it helps you to process the trauma. I could never talk about being trapped in the car before. I still get a bit emotional about it now, but I couldn't even talk to anyone about it without sobbing. Um, because you think, you know, life's gonna change. Um but I still have I've got metal rods and screws in my back, I've had to adapt to my life. Um, I still have pain, but some days are better than others. And what's important and what I learned from counselling was just look forward, don't look back, don't draw a line in your life and say, I want to be that person I was before, because sometimes it's just not possible. Um, and if clients really struggle with accepting what's happened to them, feeling very vulnerable, um, worrying about their job because they don't know how much time they're gonna have off work, financial problems, um, and getting the treatment on the NHS is obviously, as we know, takes forever. So the key the key parts of a claim is to make sure that we get the rehab in place as soon as possible because if you can get the rehab in place, the long-term prognosis is so much better.

SPEAKER_01 9:48

Yeah. Um and would would you say that having been through that, I mean, especially what you're saying about the psychological side of things, does it help you um help your clients? Not having a lot of things.

SPEAKER_05 10:01

Yeah, I think I was always empathetic. I've done personal injury claimant work for the whole of my career. Um I've always had that kindness side to me, but seeing that I went through it myself, um, you can it you can understand why clients sometimes get frustrated with you because things aren't moving as quickly as perhaps they'd like. How important interim payments are at the beginning to help ease that financial strain because there's nothing worse than trying to get over a serious injury and having the financial worries as well. Um, and I I think I I've built up a really good rapport with all of my clients. I don't tell all of them because I don't want to burden them with my my issues, but where a client's unsure. Uh last week I was talking to a client who said, Well, you've arranged for me to have some counselling, but what's it really going to do for me?

SPEAKER_04 10:49

Yeah, I've had that.

SPEAKER_05 10:50

And and I can and I can talk them through that, and I can say that you know, you will come out of this better, but give it a try if you don't think it's for you. Counselling isn't for everyone, but if you don't think it's for you, then then you know you don't have to have it, but just go and give it a try. And every client I've said that to has come out and said, I really benefited from that. So I think it's it's really key.

SPEAKER_01 11:11

Yeah. Um yeah, I'd I'd agree with that. I mean, I think the the majority of clients that we end up helping with psychological treatment do benefit from it. There aren't many that go along and say, Well, that was a waste of time. Um yeah, okay. Um, and having been through that, I mean what you've said earlier about um being able to empathize more, even more with the clients um from that experience, um does it also help you uh in trying to describe to the client what the process will involve?

SPEAKER_05 11:49

Yes, and I think lots of clients think that this process is going to happen very quickly, they're going to get compensation very quickly. And what I always say to clients is how long a claim takes is down to individual you. It's how how long it takes you as an individual to recover, because you only get one chance at compensation. We want to make sure that when we put forward your claim for compensation, we're putting forward not just the past losses, not just your injury, but also what the future holds, because you want to make sure that you're not going to be left in a vulnerable position years down the line, particularly when you've got permanent injury. So is it going to impact on your job? And is it going to impact on if you lose your job, are you going to be able to find another job? Are you going to be disadvantaged? So I think it makes sure that the client is aware how a claim works, that they don't keep going on at you about this is taking a very long time, how much longer is this going to take? And emphasising to them it isn't just about the money because money can't buy you health. I I, you know, every every client I've I've I speak to just wants their health back. Yeah, yeah. Um they've suffered a fatality in the family because of an accident. You can't bring them back what they want. Yeah. Um, so you are limited, but you will work tirelessly to make sure you get them the best outcome. And that's what we do here at LSNs. We we really do try everything we can to get the maximum for.

SPEAKER_01 13:10

Yeah. So um can you just help uh people watching and listening to understand a bit more about what the the process, the personal injury claims process actually looks like?

SPEAKER_05 13:23

Um so initially you'll um obviously have had an accident. We want to make sure that you instruct a solicitor as early as possible. You do have three years from the date of the claim to bring an accident claim, but obviously it's better because if it's soon after the accident, there's witness evidence that can be available, police reports we need to obtain for liability, photographs of the scene, photographs of the of the injuries, which is also really, really helpful to look at extent of injuries, scarring, bruising. Um and we'll initially speak to someone in our team, we'll speak to them, uh, take initial inquiries, and then it will be handed to a senior member of staff, which is usually you, Steve. And uh you will then have the difficult job of risk assessing each case and seeing whether we think that we can take the case on for the client. Um and then it will be um sent to one of the team, depending on the severity of the injury, whether it will come to you or me or or to someone more junior in the team. And we will then talk you through what what will happen, what the next stage is. So um once we've got all the evidence together, we will then uh obviously instruct the defendant's insurers and we will request an admission of liability and then we'll know whether or not liability is going to be admitted or disputed. Obviously, if it's disputed, then we might need more more evidence and more disclosure documents. Um and when the recovery is at the stage where we think that the consultant or medical ex medical expert will be able to provide a prognosis, then we um will instruct and obtain all your medical records, have a look at your past medical history and talk you through what will happen at the appointment with the independent consultant who's going to prepare a report for the claim.

SPEAKER_01 15:08

Um yeah, and that that's a that's a lot of information that you you've just gone through there that we do have to kind of go through with people when they first contact us, which is difficult because often they've been through something really difficult, really traumatic. They're trying to figure out where to go, what to do, and we're having to chuck a lot of information at them, um, make sure they understand as best they can, assuming they're they're able, you know, they have capacity to understand, which they don't always. Um, and I think on top of that, we're also having to deal with often the stigma that comes that's attached to it, and people feel when they contact us that they're doing something wrong by even thinking about making a claim. And um I was thinking I was thinking about this recently, and I I posted about it on on LinkedIn recently that you know, if if people have damage to their property that's caused by someone else wouldn't think twice about making you know if it's your car or someone crashes into your house, you get you're gonna claim off your insurance, aren't you, for that that to be made right? And yet when people have that done to their own bodies, yeah, they kind of they feel bad about it. Um, which you know it's it's far more important, your health, uh physical, psychological. Um, so yeah, I I wish it was something we could do to kind of remove that stigma, but it you know, it's come from so many different places over the years. Um, and I think the association or yeah, the the um the way people feel about the word claim um seems to yeah, prevent people from coming forward. But you know, a lot to do. Um I just think there's more out there that that should contact lawyers that should be uh trying to you know seek the justice they deserve after something has happened to them that shouldn't have happened. Um and and I think then on top of that they've got the fact that uh or or the the preconception that it's quite a confrontational process. So you know they're they're scared. They're firstly they've got um what lawyers to deal with, that can be scary, especially if they've never dealt with lawyers before. Um then you know they've got to present a claim sometimes it might be against their employer or someone they know. Um, you know, that can be pretty off-putting. Um, and then and I'm not saying this this doesn't happen, but you know, then they're thinking this could be a big kind of thoughts litigated case, it ends up at court. Um, and that's all pretty scary stuff for them to to have to get their head around after something so horrible. Um and we're in that initial contact, in that initial phase, trying to um yeah, cover that as well, and just explain to them that um firstly we're not scary.

SPEAKER_05 17:59

Yeah, um that we're here to help them feel at ease.

SPEAKER_01 18:02

That that we're not gonna be, you know, charging them up front, sending them um bills for anything, that um and that that we can if we if it's not a case we can take on, because we because we don't think there is uh a strong enough case, we can still signpost them to um relevant uh places that can help provide treatment or support. Um and if it is a case we can take on, then um then we're pretty confident that we'll we'll do a good job and we'll be able to help them with interim payments with early treatment. Um and ultimately, you know, trying to to get things back on track is it like you said earlier, that we can't turn the clock back. No, we can't make it as if the accident never happened, uh and money never will do that.

SPEAKER_05 18:49

But no, um we'll we'll clients will never forget the day their accident happened or the day they had their operation. I remember it like you know, it's it's an anniversary like a birthday, and it's except it's not a very nice day. Yeah, but as long as you can talk to your solicitor and open up um and build up a good rapport with them and trust, that is what's so important to make sure that you can just speak to them about anything. Um and I think we do that really well at Ellison's, we're a small team, but we always give all our clients 110% and give them that personal touch that they need and the trust that they need to build up. And you know, we get we we've we've spoken to lots of clients who get very upset when the claim's over. Yeah um and I had a joint settlement meeting, I remember, where one client we we we settled, we got a really good outcome. The barrister was there and said, This is an amazing outcome, it's brilliant. And the client just sat there sobbing, and his wife said, Oh, what's happened? What's wrong? And we were worried he wasn't happy with the settlement, and he said, I'm not gonna be able to speak to Benice anymore, and she has been my lifeline through this, and the claim took quite a few years, but you do see them at their lowest point, yeah, and then you see them at the end, yeah, and the recovery that they've made. And yes, not all of our clients are going to be able to return to to normality or return to the job that they've done before, but it it it's so rewarding to see them at the end, isn't it? And I I miss them, I do miss them. Did you miss yours?

SPEAKER_01 20:20

Yeah, yeah, it can it can be it can be um quite bittersweet, kind of because after they've been through that ordeal, they've kind of known us ever since, up until the point the case concludes. So, yeah, that can often be three, four, five years. Um so we've become a part of that part of their life or that period of their life, and um, yeah, you you get to to the conclusion, and it's great because you've you've got them treatment, you've got them damages, um, you've tried to help set them up as best you can for them to then move on, but then you're having to kind of let them go, and you and uh you know, hope for the best and hope that they they do um continue on the kind of trajectory you've set them on. Um but yeah, it's it's it's a weird feeling.

SPEAKER_05 21:12

Um I I yeah, I always get to the end and I'm so so happy with the outcome. Yeah. But also you do feel that little bit of I'm not gonna be talking to them. Some clients they ring you more than once a week, don't they? They ring you quite frequently for lots of support. Yeah. And uh you're always there for them. Yeah. You know. Um and when they disappear, another new client will come along. You know, there's always another one to replace. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 21:37

But um, have you got any particular cases you're thinking of?

SPEAKER_05 21:41

Well, I had a client who uh suffered a brain injury when he fell from a roof of a building uh due to someone else's negligence while he was at work and he landed uh on his head as he fell onto concrete flooring. I I I built up a great rapport with him. He's got his life Back on track, you know, he's he's building a life for himself, but he's adapted his life. Um, and it was so nice to see him on that journey because to see what he came in like to see how he leaves was just amazing. Have you got any that you remember?

SPEAKER_01 22:15

Um, yeah, I mean a recent one is yeah, involved uh a spinal cord injury for uh a guy who'd yeah, been injured at work essentially. Um yeah, accident just should never have happened, and um fortunately the the company admitted that straight away, so we didn't have a fight on liability. Um but there was there was loads of treatment to sort loads of interim payments um uh to try and keep him you know going through a very difficult time. Um and yeah, I I think the the biggest result on that was pushing the defendant insurer to to fund um a kind of state-of-the-art neuromodulator through one of the the top guys in the country who fitted the device um because the insurer didn't want to do it, they didn't think it would work um because it is still you know pretty experimental, it's not always um yeah, uh beneficial, it doesn't always yield results, but um this in our view was he was a perfect candidate for it and and the the surgeon agreed and yeah through through the court process we did get that funding and um he had it and it was amazing. I remember him ringing me up I don't think it was the day he had it, I think the next day, and he just said it's just changed my life overnight. He woke up um from the procedure and immediately all of the pain because the spinal cord injury had as you know caused symptoms in lots of other places. Um so all of the pain that he'd been having constantly since the accident and um had just I mean he said probably you know one, two out of ten instead of nine, ten out of ten. Um yeah, and so yeah, we kind of through the claims process the the settlement, the final settlement figure had to include making sure that device was gonna be replaced when it was needed and you know throughout the course of his life so that he would effectively be without that pain. Um and he he changed, you know, his personality kind of changed with it because he'd got so used to living with this pain.

SPEAKER_05 24:30

You get pain every day, it takes over some days.

SPEAKER_01 24:32

Yeah, and he was just a a different different guy. I mean he still had other issues and other limitations, but um I think it helped him so much psychologically as well because he could actually start seeing past the pain. Um and yeah, we had a a big settlement meeting uh last year and yeah, similar kind of outcome and one very happy client, and uh yeah, he was it was a similar situation with you know having helped helped him for four years or so and then it's kind of like see you later. Hope you have a good life and you know, hope that you never need my help again. Yeah, yeah, that's what you say.

SPEAKER_05 25:09

You'd like you to come back, but you don't really want them to come back. Yeah, yeah. But then they do instruct us in other departments then, because then by that time they've got they've got their compensation and it's time to look at their lives, isn't it? And say, Do I need a will? Yeah, you know, am I gonna move house? Who can I trust in this? And we really try hard, don't we, to do that?

SPEAKER_01 25:27

Yeah, and it's servicing the whole family because you get to know the family as well, it's a partner or um adult children that they might have, or um, as part of the claims process, we're often needing to take witness statements from you know everyone who supported the claimant, and that can be a very that's difficult emotional process, yeah. You know, going back because you're having to take them back through everything that's happened, and um, but it it can be a good process as well, and that you know it's they can see how far they've come by um going through through that timeline.

SPEAKER_05 26:03

I think lots of clients worry though, don't they, that they're going to end up with their case going to court. And we we used to find that there was more cases going to court, but nowadays I would say hardly any ever actually get there. You might go through the process and get your trial date listed, yeah, but there's so many steps before then.

SPEAKER_04 26:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 26:19

And that's one of the stigmas I think that clients do talk about is like, am I gonna have to go to court? I can't give evidence.

SPEAKER_01 26:24

Yeah. Um, which worries them, which is understandable, but yeah, and I mean, yeah, we we sometimes have to start court proceedings because of the limitation that the the time deadline that's placed on these kind of cases, um, or for other reasons, but actually getting to a point where the client has to go to court for a trial is hardly ever happens. Um I can't actually think of the last one. No, I know.

SPEAKER_05 26:51

Um joint session meetings, though, are something that we we put in before the trial and we give ourselves enough time so we've got all the evidence together. Yeah. The defendants have got all their evidence together, and then it's like a round-the-table discussion. Yeah. And clients always worry that they're going to then meet the defendant again, which of course doesn't happen. No, so you always deal with the insurers and the solicitors, so they don't have to go through that. But some clients want to have their day in court, but it's not needed. It's not there's no point to it, really, is there?

SPEAKER_01 27:19

No, I mean that can be a difficult conversation sometimes, can't it?

SPEAKER_05 27:22

When they feel um Will I get more if the judge gives me more? It's like, no, not really.

SPEAKER_01 27:28

No, and and when you know a lot of cases, defendant insurance companies are actually quite reasonable, and you know, that there's there's a lot of risk to them too in taking the case to to trial. Um, so you quite often get reasonable offers in or can negotiate and end up with a reasonable offer, and sometimes some clients will still want to go to court and we can't justify it if there's a if there's a good offer on the table. So that's where our legal advice you know comes in, our our experience comes in, and ultimately um yeah, we have to have that frank discussion with clients that um yeah, the the terms on which we're acting, it means that they are kind of bound by our legal advice, really. Um because that's how no-in, no fee representation works. We share the risk with them. We don't charge them anything up front, we don't get paid if we lose. Um, but they get the benefit of all our experience and and expertise in in trying to get the best outcome for them.

SPEAKER_05 28:27

So I think clients do worry, don't they? If they've had an accident, they're very vulnerable, they've been injured seriously, they can't work, they don't know if they're gonna get paid. They then think, well, how much have I got to pay you up front for you to take my claim on? And it's really important we say, Well, you don't pay us up front, you only pay us if you win.

SPEAKER_02 28:43

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 28:43

Um so we then that's why we risk assess every case, isn't it? To see if we think we're going to have reasonable prospects of success. And it's quite hard at the beginning to assess that, but yeah, you just have to keep that ongoing risk assessment going when disclosure documents come in to make sure if liability is in dispute that you still think there are reasonable prospects.

SPEAKER_01 29:01

So are there any types of case that that we don't take on or can't help with?

SPEAKER_05 29:06

Oh, I mean, there are. Sometimes people just have a pure accident and there's no one to blame. Um, and when you dig down deeper into it, you have to say to them, well, who do you think is to blame for this accident? And sometimes I've had clients say, Myself, and you can't see yourself.

SPEAKER_01 29:25

Not clients, inquirers. Oh inquires, yeah, they're not.

SPEAKER_05 29:28

No, no, no, we definitely didn't. I remember I had one where um um there was a um a person working in a school uh as a cleaner, and her job was to use Henry the Hoover um every evening, and she'd injured herself, fallen over, broken her wrist. Um it was quite a bad way, and I went to see her and said, Well, how did the accident happen? And she said, Well, it happened in a school. Um there's been um I was I was cleaning and uh I was using Henry the Hoover and I tripped over the lead. So I said, So you were in charge of the Hoover, yes. Um who do you think was to blame for this accident then? Well, Henry. So I said, Well, who do you want to sue then? And she said, Well, Henry. And I was like, You can't you can't sue a Hoover. So um it's something that's always stuck with me.

SPEAKER_01 30:26

I'm sure someone's tried.

SPEAKER_05 30:28

But I think clients do sometimes forget that sometimes accidents can just happen. There isn't always someone's negligence, and we can only help them if there is a defendant who's liable, but also a defendant that has the means to pay, because obviously if someone doesn't have insurance, we do get quite a lot of cases sometimes with I'm thinking dog bites really, yeah, where the owner doesn't have insurance and the owner doesn't have any money, so you can't sue somebody despite how how awful the injury could be. You can't sue somebody if they have no means to pay you. So it's quite hard sometimes to talk clients through that.

SPEAKER_04 31:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 31:03

Um and we and we talk to all of them, don't we? We we have a lot of inquiries. Yeah. Um and we don't we can't help everybody, unfortunately, because sometimes there just is no no prospects.

SPEAKER_01 31:15

No, and and that's what I think actually uh we we kind of provide this. That's gonna I'm gonna sound like um I'm after sympathy here, but we kind of provide this free public service because we you know the vast majority of calls we deal with we don't take on. You know, the vast, vast majority. So we're um offering this uh kind of triage telephone, largely telephone service, sometimes in person if if they come in. Um yeah, whereby we're having half an hour, sometimes longer chat with them about what they've been through, and there's there's absolutely no case there at all. There's no um, I mean, that's probably the minority. Most of them, you know, there's potentially a case, but it's just not strong enough. Um but we're we're kind of acting as a as a filter, really, stopping those kind of cases that are never gonna succeed or get anywhere, entering into the system. Um stopping people from having that kind of false hope that they might get some conferences.

SPEAKER_05 32:21

That's the thing, isn't it? People don't we don't want to give people false hope. There's no way.

SPEAKER_01 32:25

And kind of giving them um a view on a general view. We can't really give legal advice, but by not being able to offer representation for their case, we're we're kind of letting them know that it's it's not a case that would succeed at court.

SPEAKER_05 32:41

They can then go and speak to some other solicitors. Every every solicitor will have well their own risk assessment that they'll do on each case. Yeah. Um and I think, you know, I think we we do that really well.

SPEAKER_01 32:52

Um but I think what we've we're seeming to find more and more of is that because there aren't um that many kind of local specialist teams doing this anymore, so lots of the inquiries that are being made by people, they're just getting kind of uh very short and sharp responses saying can't help you. That there's no kind of detailed discussion um or conversation or you know, kind of real interest in in their claim unless they can see straight away that it's a strong claim and it's potentially worth a lot of money. So a lot of um yeah, well, yeah, I'm just talking about really the the fact that I don't think there's a lot of uh options out there for people in this region who want to instruct a local specialist.

SPEAKER_05 33:39

And it is better to instruct local because you can go to the scene of the accident, you can go and visit them at their home if they're not well enough to travel. Some clients have significant injuries where they can't drive, and so they're worried about how they're gonna get to see you. And one of the good things that came out of COVID, I suppose, is all of the um technology so that we can now have teams and we can video uh and and see people on the screen. Um it isn't just having that face-to-face meeting, and some clients prefer that, which is which is fine. We we offer lots of different ways of speaking to people, don't we?

SPEAKER_01 34:10

Yeah, and we know we know the you know the the top case managers that help with rehab, that in turn know the best rehab treatment providers in in this region, you know, we know the the top medical expert witnesses that uh uh have the best experience and best place to examine and report on different types of injuries for different clients. Um so so yeah, I I think yeah, what we're just seeing that um the result of probably you know what's gone going on in the wider kind of legal picture as far as the industry is concerned, is a lot of um mergers, amalgamation, so actually less choice for the clients out or the definitely people that have suffered from accidents out there. Um and where we're trying to make sure we can give everyone the time they need, whether whether we turn them away, whether we take them on, we want to give them the t the time they need to find out if if they can be legally around.

SPEAKER_05 35:09

And with Allison's offices, we've got we've got them all the way from Jumpswood, London, Barrett St. Edmunds, Ipswich Gulf, Norwich. Yeah, now our new office in Norwich. So um, yeah, we we've got lots of local people we've helped in Essex, Suffolk, and hopefully Norwich going forward.

SPEAKER_01 35:24

But yeah. So um what what would your key advice be for listeners um about what to do if they have had an accident?

SPEAKER_05 35:34

I would say speak to a local specialist personal injury solicitor um who don't just do a Google search and and pick the top one. I mean, you've just got to do your research. If you want somebody to represent you that knows knows the area um and you can build trust in, then go to somebody that you can build up that rapport with. Um know that the first appointment you have with them, you're not gonna be charged for, you're not gonna get a bill, because sometimes it can go on longer than you know the 30 minutes, can't it? It can go on for quite some time sometimes. Um, and everything you say to us is confidential. Lots of people worry, particularly I think accidents at work where they're still working there. There's that stigma of I can't make a claim till I leave, which I think you've got to try and reassure the client that, you know, they do have employment rights and we do have an employment team that can assist them. You know, there there are other signpostings that we can do to help people.

SPEAKER_02 36:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 36:30

Um but also I think at the outset there is a lot that we tell people tell clients don't don't we when they first speak to us. Um and I just make it really important to keep receipts, take photographs, make sure you get the details of the defendant, if you're in a road traffic accident, get the vehicle registration, see if there are any witnesses. Um try and build up that case if you like, because it makes it much easier for us. If all of that work is done at the beginning, try and get details of the police officer, see if you can get the police report. Because things like that do take a long time, and it's hard for us to start work if we need a police report and we and we just can't get it.

SPEAKER_01 37:09

Um and yeah, just uh Yeah, I th I mean I think evidence gathering is a is a huge thing at the start, isn't it? So again, that's a reason I think to to instruct a a a local lawyer would be because if it if the accident has happened in a location that your lawyer can get to um to to get that evidence, you know, take photos, take videos, um, then that could be crucial to the case because we we we've both had cases that have turned on, you know, one piece of evidence and you just and they can be huge cases, and you think, wow, if that if we hadn't gotten that piece of evidence, um we wouldn't have got here.

SPEAKER_05 37:49

No. Um I also find with my cli we I mean, I think we we both do it with people that are injured severely, is keep a pain diary, and that's the one thing I would recommend from my own experience. I was a bit sceptical about do I really want to write something in my diary every day about how I'm feeling. But actually, when you're going through a serious injury and you're going through a recovery period that is is countless appointments one after the other, it can all get a bit overwhelming. And it's hard when you're going through a serious injury recovery yourself to actually think that you've improved week on week. It's not normally day on day, it can be, but week on week. So I just used to write in my diary something about if I was having if I'd had a nightmare that night or a flashback or if I'd heard a loud noise and it had triggered me off, something, some trigger that I'd had. But also the pain levels. So you can score them out of 10 and say 10's really bad, zero is no pain. And if you can score yourself each week, when you go to see the medical expert, which can be quite some months down the line, if your recovery is is is too soon and you can't go and see the the expert too soon, you can take that diary with you. It gives you that aid memoir of of of things and how you were recovering. But also you can look back, and I remember having some really down days where I thought, I'm never going to get myself back to work. How am I gonna carry on? Yes, had a young family. Um, but actually looking back through that diary, I was like, well, actually, I haven't I haven't recovered that much in the last two weeks, but actually look where I was two, you know, three weeks ago and look where I am now, and actually now I'm doing a bit more. So pain diaries with serious injuries, I think, are really a really good thing to do.

SPEAKER_01 39:29

Yeah, yeah, yeah, I completely agree. And I apologies if you did cover this, but yeah, it's evidentially it's great as well because you know what if you're if you do end up in a position where you're having to serve formal witness statements in the litigation, then that kind of information, evidence to have is is is hugely beneficial when you're drafting because you've got contemporaneous evidence, this is what I suffered. It's very hard for a defendant, barrister, or you know, their legal reps to to suggest you didn't go through this when it's all written there in a diary. Um so yeah, I think that's that's really good advice.

SPEAKER_05 40:06

And also if you feel like you don't something quite personal to you and you don't feel that you want to tell your solicitor at an at the early outset, you can write it in your diary and give your diary to your solicitor. You know, clients, it it affects everybody in lots of different ways. Yeah. Um and yeah, I think it's it's a really good it helps us to prepare that witness statement, which I don't really like doing witness statements, I don't think you do, but they take forever, don't they? They do, they take forever. And you've got to be so careful because that's that's if you do go to trial, that's what your main evidence is factored on. So you've got to make sure you get all the details, be really careful. I always say to clients about social media.

SPEAKER_02 40:43

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 40:44

Because um I've had a client years and years ago that said this was before really social media really was a big thing, and that was when defendants would take surveillance evidence. So that was um something that you know we don't really have that happen that much anymore because social media is more the way of defendants looking. But don't just think when you're making a claim that the defendants' insurers aren't going to look up you and see what you do in your spare time. So if you go out and say, I can't do any gardening and you're captured on a social media cutting your grass that's one acre, then that's the sort of thing you need to tell your solicitor about. So that can go in your witness statement and say, Well, actually, I don't normally do this, but I did it. Felt awful afterwards, had to go in and lie down for an hour and take some painkillers, but just make sure you're honest because honesty is so important in making a claim, isn't it?

SPEAKER_01 41:39

Yeah, because defendants or their insurance companies are are hugely incentivized now to try and establish any as any dishonesty they can on the part of the claimant, um, because there are cost incentives for the defendants to do that. Um so it does mean that now more than ever that they are that's what they're trying to do. It's it's it's a it's a huge um objective for them to try and uh undermine the claimant's credibility, try and pick out any inconsistencies, and that's where yeah, uh that's a huge part of our job, really, isn't it? Making sure that the evidence is is consistent, making sure that that the client understands that the defendant will be will be uh looking at those kind of things. Um, because we need to give as much context as we can to to what they're going through. Because, like you say, a video of them doing one particular task might, in isolation, look contrary to what the expert evidence is saying they can do.

SPEAKER_05 42:41

And they'll use anything to discredit.

SPEAKER_01 42:43

Yeah, but we need to be making sure that we're explaining, yeah, that they might have had to rest all day to then perform that task and then rest all day on.

SPEAKER_05 42:51

And it's quite hard to to try and explain that to a client, but not wanting to make them fearful of what they do. Um and clients you don't want them to become paranoid about that. But yeah, you know, in the days of surveillance operatives when that was much more of a thing, yeah. Um, you know, people saying there's someone outside and they've got a camera and it's peering through my hedge, and you're like, that's sure. Yeah um and and and clients and then you're watching hours and hours of video and actually there's nothing on it. It's just your client going about their normal everyday life not doing anything, but it's done to um make them feel nervous, isn't it? And to rumble them and intimidate them.

SPEAKER_01 43:28

Make them accept a lower offer. And um but I I think I think it's still rife, the defendant surveillance um operations, but I I think it probably speaks to you know the work we do that. We haven't had surveillance footage come in on a case at least five years, I think, if not more. Um but but it's a very real risk, and it's uh that is a whole aspect that they need legal advice and support on. Um yeah, and that's only gonna get worse with social media. With AI coming in, I think it's so easy now to do a background check on anyone through AI, you can find out a lot of information about individuals and insurance companies will have ways and means of doing that.

SPEAKER_05 44:13

But if you think when you when you know when we contact you to do your witness statement, if you think you've done something, I always say to a client, just tell me now, just be honest. If you've done something that you don't think you should have been doing, let's just put it in your statement because then you can explain that you tried to do it, but you couldn't, and you felt awful afterwards. But as long as we know there's no hidden surprises, is there at the end.

SPEAKER_01 44:34

We don't want them to be scared to tell us about positive steps they've taken in their recovery and the fact that they're actually now more able than than they used to be. Uh we don't want them to become entrenched in kind of this um kind of suffering because to to support or to do what they think supports their claim. It's it's not about that at all. Um but yeah, uh we've gone off on a bit of a tangent there. We haven't, haven't we? Uh yeah.

SPEAKER_05 45:00

So what do what do we think that that they can clients can expect from us then?

SPEAKER_01 45:05

Well, so so in terms of uh actually contacting us, I hope that that we're not scary, you know, that we're no, we are human beings. Yeah, and um you know we've been doing this a long time. I think we're adding up between us, 45 years between us. Wow, you must be older than me then. Yeah, sorry, yeah. I rounded my bit up. Um yeah, we've been doing this a long time and we do it because we love helping people.

SPEAKER_05 45:34

That's you know We're really passionate, aren't we? I just absolutely love my job. Yeah. I'm not saying that some days it's not really, really stressful. Yeah. Um, and we do sometimes have a battle with defendants, insurers, but it's the most rewarding job. I'm I'm so glad I chose this as my career. Yeah. And uh our team is a small team, but it's it's a great team. You've got a um great people that will listen to clients and speak to them, and and and we will help as many people as we possibly can.

SPEAKER_01 46:05

Yeah, and the whole team's invested in our clients. You know, we all want um what's best for our clients, and when we do get a good result, it's you know, it's a team result and we kind of celebrate it together. Um yeah, and I guess we probably don't do it enough where we actually take stock and look at the client we have at the end of the case and look at how they were at the beginning.

SPEAKER_05 46:28

I mean, I know we do that as part of the process, but that's actually um that's over on a human level when clients say, you know, when they fill in a survey at the end and they they talk to you about about what's happened and and then you get some fantastic reviews. Um and it just makes the job even more rewarding, doesn't it? Just to get those and know that how appreciated you are.

SPEAKER_04 46:49

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 46:50

Um and hope that you know you'll you'll help them on their way and they're prepared for the rest of their life ahead of them. But yeah, I don't suppose there's many people that can say I've I'm a personal injury lawyer and I've been in a serious car accident myself and I know what you're going through, but I I really do understand what people go through and and uh yeah, just just get in touch with us.

SPEAKER_01 47:11

Yeah, and I've I've witnessed it in the work you do and you know the relationships you've built with your client and the feedback you get from them. Um yeah, it's it's it's amazing. So thanks. Um compliment from the boss then. This is part of your appraisal, by the way, if you didn't know. Yeah, okay, okay. So uh yeah, I think I think in summary we'd just say, you know, if you are in need of a a lawyer after an after an accident um and you you don't know where to turn or what to do, our recommendation would be to to go local. Um, you know, wherever you are, try and find a a specialist that really knows their stuff and um yeah, and can get out to you, can get to the the places they need to get to um to to do whatever needs doing to support your claim. Um and hopefully like us, they won't be scary, um, they won't be charging you anything up front, um, they won't be looking at their watch. Um and and if they can help you, then great. They'll um they'll be able to do it on a no-win-no fee. They'll uh get you any interim payments, any rehab treatment you need, um, and hopefully help set you up for life, you know, to to try and recover after the the trauma you've been through um and help you move forwards. Um yeah.

SPEAKER_05 48:31

Yeah, that's that's I think that sums it up really.

SPEAKER_01 48:35

From all my podcast experience, I'm pretty sure this was a really good ending. So um Thanks for watching, thanks for listening. Thank you. See you next time.

SPEAKER_00 48:46

Thank you. Any additional guides and insights we've mentioned today will be available on our website. We hope you found this episode insightful. If you would like to discuss anything further on this subject, then please do get in touch with our website, www.lison solicitors.com. Please don't forget to subscribe to our podcast and follow us on our social channels to keep up to date with the latest news and insights. Any information shared on this podcast was accurate at the time of recording. However, we advise speaking to your usual Ellison's advisor to make sure there haven't been any changes since. Thank you very much to Punch Studios for producing this podcast series.