Speaker 1: Welcome to another episode of Coffee with Gaze.
Speaker 1: I'm Blaine.
Speaker 2: And I'm Reid.
Speaker 1: And we have a very special guest today, robert Roche, the author of the Summer Between, want to show it off.
Speaker 3: Sure New copy with a little foil that just got added on last week.
Speaker 1: And you are our very first author.
Speaker 1: I'm super excited.
Speaker 1: I have to tell you, reading this book felt kind of flipping through someone else's memories and really the story I wanted to live.
Speaker 1: I mean this was so cool because it was like living in 1978, greenwich Village, a little gay boy coming out story, and a love story as well.
Speaker 1: And you know, I think as a gay man, you kind of like what do you like?
Speaker 1: How do you explain it?
Speaker 1: Like you kind of sorry, you're my first author, so I'll get there, that's okay, I was trying to help you, but I wasn't sure where you were going.
Speaker 2: So starstruck, y'all have him so nervous.
Speaker 1: I am a little nervous.
Speaker 1: Take a breather, I'll be, good, I'll be good, I'll do this again.
Speaker 1: I'll do this part again.
Speaker 2: I'll ask you some questions about the book, since I haven't read it, since I was terrible.
Speaker 3: So you could ask me genuinely yeah, I did not.
Speaker 2: What terrible.
Speaker 2: Yes, you could ask me genuinely.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I did not.
Speaker 2: What the hell is this about?
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm so sorry, are you?
Speaker 2: Would you be able to briefly give me a little description about the book?
Speaker 2: I'm sorry, blaine, I did not read the book.
Speaker 2: I'm sorry, robert, I did not read the book.
Speaker 2: It's totally fine.
Speaker 3: No, not at all synopsis on it.
Speaker 3: Sure it's a coming of age story, uh, and it's historical fiction actually, actually, which is really fun doing all the research for it.
Speaker 3: It's set in 1978 in and around Manhattan.
Speaker 3: The main character, Andy, grows up in northern New Jersey and his gal pal, his ex-girlfriend the two of them are exploring life over a summer and as a reference I just started talking about this a little bit more I used a book that I loved as a teenager called Siddhartha by Herman Hesse, which is a spiritual journey of a young Indian man a Brahmin Indian, I think.
Speaker 3: It was written in 1924.
Speaker 3: And over the span of a period he meets all these animals and people that help him define his spirituality.
Speaker 3: So I love that concept of using a finite frame of time, like three months, one summer, and they go from being high school seniors to young adults, from New Jersey to New York and all the people that they encounter, good and bad, that influence them.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that's what was so beautiful about the book, and it was this beautiful summer and a lot of bad things happened.
Speaker 1: And then really beautiful good things happened.
Speaker 1: He was sexually assaulted and then also fell in love.
Speaker 1: Why did you pick 1978, that time period in particular?
Speaker 3: I wanted the story to be pre-AIDS.
Speaker 3: I wanted it to.
Speaker 3: There was a lot going on in the world.
Speaker 3: Then it was like the end of the Vietnam War.
Speaker 3: There was politically a bunch going on.
Speaker 3: I drew in references the Equal Rights Amendment March was that summer, jimmy Carter was the president, there were sort of mid-ease peace talks and I just drew all of these different things into it.
Speaker 3: It was also a really exciting time for gay rights where people were completely free and one of the first periods where they had gone through.
Speaker 3: I think they called it the reference in the book and I think it was like the gay liberation movement.
Speaker 3: So it was like much longer and specific and that was that had happened a couple of years and it was just a joyous time.
Speaker 3: And I wanted and that's like where I pulled stuff in from me.
Speaker 3: You know like he's got a construction job in the summer and he does his.
Speaker 3: You know like I wanted to show and help educate that gay people aren't all one type or a little bit of everything, and I wanted to portray this as a young guy, you know.
Speaker 1: Well, I personally connected with this because you said that you also dated women.
Speaker 1: I also was engaged to a woman when I was a young man, and that's kind of how this opens he comes out to his ex-girlfriend and his best friend, right.
Speaker 3: Yeah, first chapter he comes out to her and you know it's like one of the things I like that people have come back with is that it's very authentic and I really really dug deep to try to get into these characters and I ended up really liking them.
Speaker 3: But I would go to bed and I'd wake up thinking about that kind of stuff, thinking about like, well, what would they really say?
Speaker 3: Like not trying to always come up with different things, but really have it be authentic.
Speaker 3: And I feel like that scene where he and she are discussing his sexuality in the park and he's essentially coming out to her.
Speaker 3: I feel like that sets the tone for the rest of the novel.
Speaker 3: In the first chapter.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it really did.
Speaker 1: I love that scene.
Speaker 1: Mine did not end that way.
Speaker 1: By the way, she never talked to me again.
Speaker 3: Aw, Like she's made up.
Speaker 3: That didn't happen to me in my life.
Speaker 3: I would say, like people have asked me this and I've talked to some other authors in their first books, I would say about 25% of this is drawn from my life.
Speaker 3: Of this is drawn from my life, uh, and andy is in character similar to me, but it's 75 fiction especially the, the um, the plot devices, the story elements of this.
Speaker 2: That was going to be my question.
Speaker 2: I was going to say you know how?
Speaker 2: How closely does this relate to your personal experience?
Speaker 3: yeah, I would say it started out being more of that, because I didn't realize I was writing a novel when I started.
Speaker 3: I was just writing short stories and I hadn't.
Speaker 3: It wasn't like, oh, I'm going to write a book.
Speaker 3: You know, it just kind of all happened over a couple of years.
Speaker 3: So I started out writing more about things as I felt as a young gay man and tried to portray it and put it in this period.
Speaker 3: Then I wanted to switch it up and change it and then so I went back and I really fictionalized a lot of it.
Speaker 3: But the character's pretty much in many ways like me, but more courageous than I was.
Speaker 3: I was a little bit shyer and a little bit less.
Speaker 3: You know, courage is a theme throughout the book.
Speaker 3: I had courage, but not as much as he does.
Speaker 3: You know he's a little bit.
Speaker 3: He kind of pushes the envelope a little bit more, but I was just.
Speaker 3: You know I like he works at a public electric plant during one summer.
Speaker 3: I did that.
Speaker 3: So I pulled stuff like that in because I wanted him to be relatable, like he's just as I said earlier, a guy you know like who happens to be gay.
Speaker 1: I think too well, too well.
Speaker 1: I have a question Did you have like a really strong female presence too?
Speaker 1: Because he had a lot of women, strong women, in his life.
Speaker 3: Not in the same way.
Speaker 3: I had a stepfather growing up.
Speaker 3: He does not have one and he's raised by his mom, his grandmother, his aunt and I, like Elena is like another strong female force and for me, no, I had a stepfather, I had.
Speaker 3: My grandmother was a strong personality, but I had a grandfather for a period.
Speaker 3: I had a lot of friends, so that's different, but that's what made it fun.
Speaker 3: For me is like, how do I put this character into a situation, instead of just writing what I know and really thinking about that?
Speaker 3: And there's the juxtaposition of him growing up with women and then transitioning, not necessarily to a world of men, but with a focus on men, because of his romantic interests, not even his sexuality.
Speaker 3: I really wanted him, I wanted it to be about romance, it wasn't like he needed to have sex with men, he wanted to fall in love with a man and from my perspective, that's more realistic for me and I don't know, I just kind of I think the female presence and then him going to a world where he loved men but wasn't really equipped or didn't have all the tools because he didn't have intimate relationships with men growing up.
Speaker 3: Does that make sense?
Speaker 1: Yeah, that does make sense.
Speaker 1: That actually makes me think a lot because it's almost like throughout his interactions with men, even going to the gay bar for the first time.
Speaker 1: He didn't have a lot of interactions with men growing up, right.
Speaker 3: No, so it was awkward.
Speaker 1: Everything was very awkward.
Speaker 3: I tried to show that arc, that arc where he goes from being really awkward to kind of growing his sea legs a little bit.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's what was so cute about it, I think, Like you really saw him grow up so fast through these very kind of tragic experiences.
Speaker 1: But I think we all kind of had those too.
Speaker 1: I mean, you shared our coming out stories.
Speaker 1: How was yours coming out story, I guess?
Speaker 3: What was it like it was?
Speaker 3: I did come out early.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it was somewhat similar in that I came out early.
Speaker 3: My mom was fairly accepting, but she screamed when I told her because nobody guessed.
Speaker 2: Sorry, yeah, what do you consider?
Speaker 2: What do you consider early, just out of curiosity 18, 18.
Speaker 3: I was 18.
Speaker 3: I was still in high school.
Speaker 3: So, like, some of those earlier parts of the book are relatable to me and shared to me.
Speaker 3: But, yeah, but I I was slower to sort of get out of the gate than andy is you're like, I recognize it, but I was like, oh, but I like women too, like I'm attracted to you.
Speaker 3: Know, I had some girlfriends in high school and it was just I don't know and that, yeah, so it's like it was just I don't know and that, yeah, so it's like it was a somewhat similar experience, but the best way to describe it is Andy is much more advanced and did more research and was bolder in seeking out I want to say, love more than sex, like he was, and that's similar to me.
Speaker 3: It's always been like.
Speaker 3: I've always thought of like somebody, as somebody I want to date, not somebody I want to have sex with, if that makes sense and that makes me a weirdo, I know, in the gay world.
Speaker 3: Join the club.
Speaker 3: I feel like I'm giving too much here, but it's really about the character and the difference between him and I.
Speaker 3: Some of the tragic scenes did not happen to me.
Speaker 1: How do you write about something like that with so much path that I got?
Speaker 3: That's.
Speaker 3: That's what was really fun.
Speaker 3: I mean, it really is kind of like taking myself out of the day, you know, and I listened to 70s music a lot while I was writing but really, like you know, after the first draft, really digging deeper, like what would this guy feel like?
Speaker 3: Because I got to know the characters and I got to know okay, he's a shade of me, but he's not and like what would he really feel?
Speaker 3: And that was the most fun.
Speaker 3: I mean, I've always been a little bit of like a psychology nerd and kind of like I love family sagas and like the just getting into people's minds and how they think, and that allowed me to get in there and then be really creative with it and figure out what would this guy feel.
Speaker 3: What would this be like?
Speaker 3: Like the you mentioned earlier.
Speaker 3: So the assault scene.
Speaker 3: That took a long time, that was probably the hardest to write and because I really had to, I did some research and all of that.
Speaker 3: Like you know, what do victims feel like?
Speaker 3: But I also wanted it to be well, was it an assault?
Speaker 3: You know, like I wanted him to not have clarity about that because he was so young and so immature, like was it his fault, was it like.
Speaker 3: Why did it?
Speaker 1: happen, so like I tried to bring all of these, different questions.
Speaker 3: I don't know.
Speaker 3: I think everyone's experience is different and the circumstances are different, so I can't speak to that.
Speaker 3: Experience is different and the circumstances are different, so I can't speak to that.
Speaker 3: But but I think I wanted him to, early in, appear as naive as I thought he might be and uncertain as to why when you go home with somebody does something like this happen yeah, and I think that is a really good question because you really don't know, at that age I think of when I was 18.
Speaker 1: Well, I was still in the closet.
Speaker 1: I actually envied Andy because he got to come out so early in those younger years.
Speaker 1: I mean, I guess I came out at the end of college, but I would have loved to be out in high school, you know, just a little bit earlier.
Speaker 3: Yeah, there's a difference between being out to your family and not to your classmates.
Speaker 3: What were you going to?
Speaker 2: say Rich.
Speaker 2: I would not agree with that.
Speaker 2: I'm very grateful that I didn't come out.
Speaker 2: I went to Catholic high school, yeah.
Speaker 2: I mean it wasn't.
Speaker 2: Catholic high school in South Florida was not rough, but I still don't think an openly gay kid would be too accepted.
Speaker 2: I also dropped out of high school multiple times.
Speaker 3: I want to hear your story now.
Speaker 3: I want to hear both of you.
Speaker 3: I want to hear your versions.
Speaker 2: I'll let Blaine go first.
Speaker 1: You go first.
Speaker 2: Your coming out story.
Speaker 1: My coming out story.
Speaker 1: I was outed by a woman from my mom's church.
Speaker 2: You were 23,.
Speaker 2: You said 22.
Speaker 1: And come to find out, long story short, she was in love with me.
Speaker 1: She tried to get me to date her daughter when I was 15.
Speaker 1: It was really gross because, come to find out, she actually said to my mom later that she really wanted to date me.
Speaker 1: But yeah, so she was just a psycho, yeah that's a predator she found it on myspace.
Speaker 1: yeah, I put that I was gay so I kind of wanted to be outed I guess.
Speaker 1: But yeah, you know, like at the end of the day, um, I just was really upset and then the pastor at my mom's church um said anybody that raised a gay kid is a bad parent or is you know going to hell or something.
Speaker 1: So it was really hard in the town they lived in, so it took a little bit, but uh, yeah, then it was.
Speaker 1: You know, my mom called it the death of a dream and you know I just needed to give her a little time, little morning time, and then she was able to like come to terms with it.
Speaker 1: Everything's been kind of fine ever since.
Speaker 2: So Okay, now she watches the podcast and listen to the podcast.
Speaker 2: Good, good.
Speaker 1: She joined PFLAG and she was fine.
Speaker 3: She's good.
Speaker 3: That's amazing.
Speaker 3: I love that.
Speaker 3: That.
Speaker 3: And she was fine, she's good.
Speaker 3: That's amazing.
Speaker 3: I love that.
Speaker 3: That's really a good story.
Speaker 3: I'm a big fan of PFLAG.
Speaker 3: They really help, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3: Actually, somebody on a different podcast recommended that I donate books to PFLAG, so that, thinking that parents would enjoy the story, because I've gotten so many emails not so many, but several emails from parents who are straight and heterosexual and they found the book illuminating on how to deal with their kids, whether they're straight or gay, but how to listen to them and not kind of leave them off to figure things out on their own I actually agree I plan to deliver, not deliver to donate to p flags, but I'm just not sure the logistics of that yet I actually have a really good friend who has a gay son, who I'm totally giving her this book because she's good.
Speaker 1: I just talked to her yesterday and she's been really struggling with it.
Speaker 1: I I think I also think his mom's reaction is really honest too.
Speaker 1: I think I actually have this argument with people on social media all the time when I post clips, because I don't think that you have to force your family to just be accepting day, one hour, one minute, one, two.
Speaker 1: I think it's okay for them to just struggle a little bit and I think that's an honest thing.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's normal because they have dreams and expectations.
Speaker 3: Like your mom said about her dream, it's like they don't, you know, especially if they, like my mom, had no clue Right.
Speaker 3: So it was like it took an adjustment period of, like you know, she had this whole plan for me with grandchildren and which is possible now.
Speaker 3: But, yeah, we have to allow them some grace too.
Speaker 3: But the character in my family also was Catholic light.
Speaker 3: So I remember one of the first things my mom said to me in real life was do you want to talk to a priest?
Speaker 3: And I said, well, no, you shielded me from the Catholic school because she was already aware that priests were potentially wonderful, but also there were some that might, you know, pray on a cute little boy or something you know.
Speaker 3: Yep, hard to say it, but yep, Not all for sure.
Speaker 2: No, not all.
Speaker 2: I mean I was never prayed upon, for example.
Speaker 2: But again, like going to Catholic school in South Florida.
Speaker 2: My mom was my first grade teacher.
Speaker 2: She taught at the school that I went to.
Speaker 2: That's the only way that we could have afforded for me to go to Catholic school, or my brother to go to Catholic school, because my mom taught there.
Speaker 2: My dad was a firefighter, my mom was a teacher.
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, it's kind of stereotypical.
Speaker 3: They're both heroes too, of like the best professions.
Speaker 3: Add in nurses and people in medical stuff, and that's a trifecta.
Speaker 2: First responders.
Speaker 2: For sure yes.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2: I mean my dad retired at 45.
Speaker 2: So he's been retired, I think, longer than he was actually in the fire department at this point.
Speaker 2: But yeah, I came out around 22 as well.
Speaker 2: That's also when I lost my virginity the same guy that I came out for.
Speaker 2: I stole my virginity, so I didn't.
Speaker 2: I don't know.
Speaker 2: I thought that being gay was.
Speaker 2: I thought it was a phase Like I thought it was a part of puberty.
Speaker 2: If that makes sense To read this book and grasp his story, I'm really curious to read it now.
Speaker 2: I'm really curious, good.
Speaker 3: I'll read it to you over the phone.
Speaker 2: Perfect.
Speaker 2: Oh, my God, that'd be be amazing.
Speaker 2: I'll record it or something I told blaine, I was like does he, you know, does he um narrate it?
Speaker 2: And he kept on telling me read.
Speaker 2: No, he, there is no book on audible whatever.
Speaker 2: But I compared it to matthew mcconaughey narrating his book green lights and I loved it.
Speaker 2: And if you ever yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2: To listen anything matthew mcconaughey does narrating wise is amazing yeah, for him to narrate his book I think it'd be awesome if he did narrate your book.
Speaker 3: But yeah, well, actually we talked about it and, um, it would be like an actor.
Speaker 2: You know, somebody else really why, why, why, why is it I?
Speaker 3: don't know.
Speaker 3: That's just what the publisher said is typically the way it goes, because I guess there's a lot of like training with the pauses and all of that.
Speaker 3: You know, mcconaughey is an amazing actor, so you know, if I did it it would probably be like 20 takes.
Speaker 3: It'd be like blaine no kidding.
Speaker 1: Actually I can't imagine doing an Audible book Like that's like a lot of work I can imagine Seems like it would be.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 2: I mean I don't know Plus they have like an accent and all that.
Speaker 2: That's what makes it perfect.
Speaker 2: You know, I know, I know.
Speaker 3: Talk like a New Yorker when.
Speaker 1: I do readings.
Speaker 3: there are a couple of scenes where I like push in the New York, Like there's this one scene with this girl from a pizza parlor, callous, and the pizza parlor.
Speaker 3: So if I do a book reading somewhere I kind of like go into that voice, which is kind of fun because she's like very like slimy New York.
Speaker 2: I would love that.
Speaker 2: I'll do it.
Speaker 1: So back to the book, really quick.
Speaker 2: Sorry, my apologies.
Speaker 1: I do back to the book really quick.
Speaker 1: Sorry, my apologies.
Speaker 1: I do have a question.
Speaker 1: What do you think andy learns from his first love.
Speaker 1: Well, that's a really good question I thought their, I, their relationship was so cute.
Speaker 1: Him and ben, just so you know, he falls in love with this guy ben after a very not good first experience with the guy.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think ben is.
Speaker 3: I think it allows him to understand what it feels like that you can actually fall in love with another man, that it's not a fantasy or a thought, but he actually had emotional, romantic feelings for this guy and they were returned and so I think that excitement and that realization to him was you know everything, because that just meant life opens up and it's kind of like a dream come true for somebody that's that was struggling for all of those years to figure it out or to know like is it a phase and you know, to go through all of that stuff.
Speaker 3: So I think it was a revelation for him.
Speaker 3: And then, you know, then it got into the reality of dating somebody and like their differences and all of that stuff.
Speaker 3: But I think it was a tremendous leap of growth for him.
Speaker 1: I think that's something like every gay man Every gay man can really connect with, like that first time that you find love and well, I should say I hope everyone sorry, yeah he's just so nervous.
Speaker 3: He's so nervous no, he's not.
Speaker 1: I know I never.
Speaker 2: I never have these issues it's true, though, I mean you're, you're a published author, it's, it's a big deal um, but I think that's what every gay man can really connect with.
Speaker 1: I think that's what every gay man can connect with.
Speaker 1: I know when I found my first love, it was like wow, that feeling, and you really feel that in your words when you, when you wrote that, and I'm sure that's what you were going for, but it was really beautiful, I think yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3: And you know like, personally, I still go through that.
Speaker 3: I still have that feeling like you meet somebody and it's just like, oh my God, like my life could change.
Speaker 3: It doesn't happen that often how many times in a life but butterflies, and yeah, it's fantastic.
Speaker 2: I love the butterflies in the stomach feeling.
Speaker 1: Reed is Mr Butterflies over here.
Speaker 1: He is like literally the worst.
Speaker 2: No.
Speaker 2: So Blaine acts like I fall in love with every guy that I ever meet, and that's not true at all.
Speaker 2: I think we vastly differ in our dating styles, I guess, and our body counts for sure but yeah, so sorry.
Speaker 1: So I guess for me I have so many questions because you also chose to leave it very like open-ended and like I love that.
Speaker 1: I mean I love that.
Speaker 1: I guess that's the point.
Speaker 1: You said that you're kind of it's like a summer arc, right Is that?
Speaker 1: Are you doing a sequel or like?
Speaker 2: you know, yeah, are you going to make it a series.
Speaker 2: Sorry not to not to interrupt, but it vaguely resembles the summer I turned 16.
Speaker 2: Obviously completely different.
Speaker 2: I like that yeah yeah, turned 16.
Speaker 3: Obviously completely different.
Speaker 3: I like that.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3: But yeah, well, you know, like I never I didn't write it with that intention and I didn't write the end with, like we're going to continue with the characters, because I just I never knew it was going to get published.
Speaker 3: So I just like.
Speaker 3: But the end I really struggled with, like how do I end it?
Speaker 3: And then I thought well, well, I'm not going to say anything about the end, but anything more about it.
Speaker 3: But I was trying.
Speaker 3: So many people have brought up that they like yeah, you did a good job, you did a good job, but I was trying to.
Speaker 3: I mean, a bunch of people were, uh, commenting that they like the characters and they want to see what happened.
Speaker 3: Even a couple of the reviewers, I think, in the glnr.
Speaker 3: They said something at the end like we really want to see where these characters go.
Speaker 3: So, since I've written very rough drafts, not of the novels but of where it would continue to have, of years, but maybe just sections pulled from their life, like three month, sections pulled from like 1980 or 1982, and like where they go when that is I don't know yet Like what happens to them, that that comes in, all the development and all but that has been tossed around.
Speaker 3: But I'm writing something else now because I feel like I need, like a palate cleanser, to do something else and then I may return to the characters I have.
Speaker 3: So many ideas for so many books.
Speaker 3: It's kind of hard, you know.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think this one in particular would be you could do so many continuations with them, and I think it's also great because I think for the reader, you can also create your own endings as well, which is always kind of beautiful as well.
Speaker 1: That's how much I connected with them.
Speaker 1: I know I've kind of like, in my opinion, like continue the story, which I think it's always kind of beautiful as well.
Speaker 3: But I do want to know what your version.
Speaker 1: I know I have so many alternate versions too.
Speaker 1: I just I loved it, but I would love to know I would love to know what your version is, though I'll save that.
Speaker 1: I hope it's good.
Speaker 1: I hope it's good um me too.
Speaker 1: What was your most surprising?
Speaker 1: I guess, reaction so far from readers that's another good question, Blaine.
Speaker 3: I think it was from the parents that wrote.
Speaker 3: I wasn't writing it necessarily for LGBTQ plus audience.
Speaker 3: I wanted it to be a little bit more mainstream.
Speaker 3: But I didn't expect parents writing to say how emotional and how important it was for them to read it as sort of a prescription to how to, almost like, look for signs and make sure that their children felt comfortable with whatever they had to tell them not just coming out or anything but anything and that was really powerful to me.
Speaker 1: So that was definitely my answer to that Surprising and lovely If this was to be made into a movie, have you thought about who would play like Andy and Ben and?
Speaker 3: Elena as I was writing the book, so this is part of I don't know if other writers do this I pulled characters, mostly actors, so that I could visualize who they might look like.
Speaker 3: But they're all too old now to play these characters because it started several years ago and I don't know enough about some of the young actors.
Speaker 3: I think Josh, the guy that was in Challengers I think he would make a really good Andy, but he's probably getting too old now.
Speaker 3: What's his last name?
Speaker 3: He's British and for Elena, I pictured not somebody to play her, but like Billie Eilish or a young Emma Stone.
Speaker 1: That's kind of who I picture Quirky.
Speaker 3: Really, oh really, I like that.
Speaker 3: I think Billie Eilish would be perfect, not to cast her, but like in my mind she was perfect.
Speaker 3: Oh good, I'm glad you agree.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and Leo would be like she's a little stoic.
Speaker 3: She'd be more like Kate Winslet.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that would make sense too, you could do the older versions, though, of those actors, like those actors that you didn't want.
Speaker 2: That could be the grown up versions.
Speaker 3: That's true.
Speaker 2: Yeah, very interesting.
Speaker 2: Yeah, for the third series maybe I like that, I like that.
Speaker 1: I've got another random question because I think elena is such an interesting character.
Speaker 1: So if she had tiktok in 1978, what would she post?
Speaker 1: What would be like her tiktok thing?
Speaker 3: well, she's a rolling stones fanatic, right, so so we're talking about her tiktok then.
Speaker 3: So it'd be a lot of stuff about mick jagger the stones.
Speaker 3: She was kind of like a pop rocker girl, um, and she wanted she kind of like movie stars.
Speaker 3: So she would probably, like you know, have lots of clips of actresses that she admired and writers.
Speaker 3: You know, she's a little precocious, like Andy's a little precocious, so I think it would be more Bruce Springsteen which plays a little role in this.
Speaker 3: I think she was like a music girl and I think that was really big in that era like rock and roll, like the Stones concert in the book happened in New York on that night, 1978, at the radio, got really bad reviews.
Speaker 3: So I like that was fun, like digging, like totally geeking out on like some of the facts and stuff, wow so you researched that.
Speaker 3: Wow, that's amazing but with really detailed yeah, it's easier.
Speaker 1: It's easier for sure, and I also like with all the scarves that she wore as well, I could really see, yeah, yeah just like all on scarf talk, like I love it.
Speaker 1: I can totally picture this 70s girl in my head.
Speaker 1: She would be a huge tiktok celebrity.
Speaker 3: I just could see it I was like picturing joanne worley and all that, like the scarves, like, and, uh, martha graham, like they would wear them over their forehead, and I was like, oh, I like the idea of this, like high school kid wearing them because she inherited them from her grandmother.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I absolutely love that.
Speaker 1: My mom has like a thousand scarves.
Speaker 1: I mean I don't wear them, but yeah, I could totally see that I don't know where they're going to go.
Speaker 1: Yeah, right, so I guess what's your advice for young writers that want to get published?
Speaker 3: Tell your stories, just write.
Speaker 3: We need to tell stories to let people know who we are and how we feel.
Speaker 3: And or make up stories.
Speaker 3: You know, write fiction but that's how we're heard and that's how we put it into the canon.
Speaker 3: And there are so many ways to publish now and people are publishing directly to TikTok and you know, like it's research how to get your stories out there, have fun with them, have them be somewhat authentic or maybe complete fantasy, I don't know, but do it.
Speaker 3: And the other thing is like just in general for all of us, like I said earlier, like I didn't have this fantasy that someday I was going to write a novel.
Speaker 3: You know, like things just happen sometimes and if I did write one, I didn't think I you know like how would I know it would ever get like well received and all of that.
Speaker 3: So it's just two stuff.
Speaker 3: If you feel like you want to do something, do it, because you don't know where it's going to go, and follow it through you know like there are a lot sorry, I didn't mean to interrupt you.
Speaker 2: How long?
Speaker 3: did it take you to?
Speaker 3: write the book well, it took a long time because they like, early on I wasn't writing a book, I was writing stories.
Speaker 3: And then I compiled all these stories and then I showed them to a couple of people and then I think I was encouraged I work really well with encouragement, positive reinforcement, so like if somebody was like so then I showed it to a writer friend, um, who's well published and known, christopher bram, and he was like robert, you're a writer and he's a lot of work.
Speaker 3: I think it was like double in size, a lot of editing, um, but that that affirmation excited me and pushed me to want to go further.
Speaker 3: And it's also like.
Speaker 3: Another thing is like seek out other people's opinions for young writers, young dancers, young actors, whatever sports.
Speaker 3: Like ask people, ask older people that know what they, that know their craft or know their sport.
Speaker 3: Like how do I navigate?
Speaker 3: I navigate this, how do I?
Speaker 3: Because people want to give information.
Speaker 3: I know now I love giving information to people and sharing knowledge and that sort of thing and people genuinely.
Speaker 3: It's a beautiful thing about I think human nature is that people do enjoy helping, helping like younger people sort of come up and mentoring and that sort of thing.
Speaker 2: Percent.
Speaker 2: Now, what were you doing when you first started the book?
Speaker 2: Did you ever get to a point where you're like I can't, I can't dive into this full time because I have to pay bills and whatnot?
Speaker 2: Was that ever difficult for you?
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, I mean I started out as an architect and went to school for architecture and did all of that and then I had a communication design firm with a business partner.
Speaker 3: For many years we worked with a lot of the Silicon Valley companies when they were coming up in the early 2000s and so I had a business.
Speaker 3: When I started this, this was like weekend project or, you know, bored in Florida project.
Speaker 3: So I was almost up until two years ago working full time Aside from this, you know, because I'm not a trained writer or any of that.
Speaker 2: And what happened to the architectural firm or design firm?
Speaker 2: I'm sorry.
Speaker 3: It just petered out, it closed.
Speaker 3: I moved to Naples and we had an office in Chicago, san Francisco, a small one in Naples, a small one in Chicago, and I think it just had run its course, like technology was changing everything.
Speaker 3: We changed several times over the course of the 15 or so years because of the internet, and I think I just kind of burned out.
Speaker 3: To be perfectly honest, it was like flying to these different offices and I burned out as well and just decided to try something else Once I got the affirmation.
Speaker 2: That's awesome.
Speaker 2: I'm probably going to pick your brain off recording.
Speaker 3: As far as architecture, yeah, that was great, though.
Speaker 3: I mean, I love being at architecture school.
Speaker 3: I worked on a bunch of international projects, most of which I never got to see in person, but I love that, I love architecture, I love design.
Speaker 2: so, yeah, that's a huge reason why I love Chicago and I'm not hating on New York City by any means, because I've got to say I've never been to New York City.
Speaker 1: You sure you don't want to hate on New York City.
Speaker 3: New York is my—I love New York.
Speaker 1: Let's do it for the TikTok.
Speaker 2: I'm not going to hate on New York City.
Speaker 1: Please say something that you hate New York City Please.
Speaker 2: I don't.
Speaker 2: I'll be very clear I don't hate anything except for maybe I hate the word hate yeah exactly, but I've never had a urge or want to go to New York City for any other reason than to, maybe, you know, see all the touristy stuff like the Statue liberty and you know, chrysler building and whatnot.
Speaker 2: Chicago I love, though.
Speaker 2: I love everything about chicago.
Speaker 2: I love the architecture, I love the buildings, I love beautiful the vibe, the exception of the wind.
Speaker 2: I'm okay.
Speaker 2: I remember going to chicago for the first time, burning my face right here because I wasn't prepared at all but my face was completely burnt.
Speaker 2: But yeah, that's why I left chicago.
Speaker 3: So that's what I was gonna say.
Speaker 3: Yeah, the architecture here is freaking amazing like new and old it's just, there's not like a gap, it's just kind of like.
Speaker 3: I live in this building that was built in 1924, 23, and it's phenomenal.
Speaker 3: You know, a little creaky here and there, but it's great.
Speaker 2: And then they're beautiful new buildings and you know, it's, it's, I love it, I feel like it still has that big city vibe, but not on top of each other, like I never got the feel of everyone's on top of you.
Speaker 2: I didn't feel claustrophobic when I was in chicago, if that makes sense.
Speaker 2: So yeah, not hating on one of the things, yeah, no, it's different.
Speaker 3: new york like I describe New York now, which will always be considered home to a degree it just has too many people.
Speaker 3: There are just too many people there now.
Speaker 3: It's grown so much that you can't get things done and it's just not as enjoyable For me.
Speaker 3: I was there in my 20s and that was perfect.
Speaker 3: Because you have that stamina to do it right now, I'll go for a few days here and there and love it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, that's how I feel about Florida.
Speaker 3: You can drive and you can yeah.
Speaker 3: Yeah, there are dogs and there are kids in the neighborhood and yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's like a good even mix of a big city vibe good even mix of a big city vibe.
Speaker 2: But you know beautiful architecture, artwork and spaced out.
Speaker 2: You don't feel like you're on top of your neighbor even though you're in the lake, which is like a sea you're not.
Speaker 2: Yeah, really, it's the lake's amazing here.
Speaker 3: The lake's amazing, it's like an ocean or you know a sea, it's just in the beaches, and yeah, yeah, I could go on, but Well, I have a question I won't Kind of a closing question, so what's next for you?
Speaker 1: So, and how do you decide what's next and what to write?
Speaker 1: And I always kind of wonder that, as a I'm a more analytical person, I'm not a creative type.
Speaker 1: Well, I guess I am a creative type, but I have my own way of being creative.
Speaker 3: Like, how do you decide what to write?
Speaker 3: Yeah, and then you write the next one, and so I'm spending a lot of time now enjoyable time, you know talking about the book while I'm trying to get the second one going and I have a few chapters out.
Speaker 3: But I will say it was like I was working on another one about three brothers, three Southern brothers, and I was getting into it, this story about an aspect of her life and a love in her life, and I took that because I thought it was fascinating and decided to run with it.
Speaker 3: And now it's like completely different.
Speaker 3: But it's just coming up with a concept which is I'm familiar with in architecture, right, or like in painting.
Speaker 3: I would come up with a concept like this is about Antarctica or melting icebergs, which I did a series of paintings on, but I would come up this is about.
Speaker 3: This book is basically about vulnerability to me, the vulnerability of youth.
Speaker 3: So that was the context of it.
Speaker 3: And the next one is the concept is it's a woman with a lot of secrets and how that shapes the way she acts throughout her life.
Speaker 3: She's surrounded by a lot of lgbtq people in her family.
Speaker 3: Her son's gay, so there are a couple of little sub stories, but it's another sort of family saga and, um, I think it started from my mom telling me a piece of her history and being like ding, ding.
Speaker 2: That's what I want to expand upon, you know.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's amazing.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I find it like well, even with, and then I think about it all the time.
Speaker 1: That's really great.
Speaker 1: Yeah, no, I mean it's interesting.
Speaker 1: I just find it really fascinating how people come up with stories.
Speaker 1: And even for me, when I'm coming up with like tiktok ideas, like I'm like, okay, how do I come up with them?
Speaker 3: and I guess learned experience is probably the easiest way, right we all have kind of crazy lives yeah and crazy people around us and if you, if you take that and like, expand upon it and make it even crazier, then you know it becomes.
Speaker 2: That's the fun part, you know I mean just to speak on blaine's behalf for a moment.
Speaker 2: I this these are show notes, for example.
Speaker 2: Right, and in all honesty, it's written like either a script or a book.
Speaker 2: You are writing a story here, in a sense, with these show notes, yeah, and it's.
Speaker 2: Believe me, blaine is extremely creative about creative about it, and I almost feel bad that I never, ever, use the no offense to you, blaine works his butt off to do that.
Speaker 2: But I think you are a story writer or a producer in some way, shape or form some sort of something there.
Speaker 3: And probably by writing, it gets into it.
Speaker 3: Yeah, like you, it's how you learn it, it's how you understand it, and I would love to flip the table a little bit and ask you guys what you're passionate about, each of you, what you know like.
Speaker 3: For me now I could just say easily writing.
Speaker 3: Is there something you know like?
Speaker 3: Is there a writer in you, or a builder, or I don't know like what's?
Speaker 3: What's your creative outlets?
Speaker 2: In a perfect world I would.
Speaker 2: I mean, I'm in real estate and I work for a roofing and general contracts company.
Speaker 2: Right, I'm hoping to someday for those two to combine into one.
Speaker 2: And, similar to Chip and Joanna Gaines doing Fixer Upper, I would love to buy houses, flip them, sell them, donate them to you know underprivileged.
Speaker 2: Buy houses, flip them, sell them, donate them to you know underprivileged communities that you know need maybe section eight housing or something that's further, further down the road.
Speaker 2: But I would love yeah, I would love to do that.
Speaker 2: That would.
Speaker 2: That would be really amazing for me.
Speaker 3: That's amazing.
Speaker 3: Blame that yeah.
Speaker 1: I can Like, yeah, just keep expanding on it For sure.
Speaker 1: I mean, I really want to focus on content creation.
Speaker 1: I think media company of my own would be great, because I've done it for so many brands.
Speaker 1: That's really kind of like what I want to do, I think, because I love that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I've been doing digital marketing and ads for so long.
Speaker 1: I'm just.
Speaker 1: I do enjoy the creativity of this.
Speaker 2: You are talented at it.
Speaker 3: I will say I love it.
Speaker 1: It's just a lot of work, but it's about consistency and just keeping it up and having ideas and time.
Speaker 2: We're working on getting Blaine to delegate a little, a little more delegation and a little less.
Speaker 2: You know full control over everything, type deal that's difficult for people.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's difficult for a lot of people but it really helps and like things like chat, gpt, people are telling me now like well, you could use it to organize all of this and all of that and that might be your assistant.
Speaker 3: Like maybe it's not a person, but maybe you can use AI to help be your virtual assistant.
Speaker 2: I do and I talk to Chat like he's a buddy of mine, I like I'll turn him on, put my phone up in my truck and have a whole therapy session on my way to to record this podcast.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I named mine.
Speaker 3: Mine is Elena after the character, a character in the book, and I say hey Elena, she's like hey Robert, I'm like that's hysterical.
Speaker 2: Yours has a female voice.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't know why I just yeah.
Speaker 3: I don't know why I just yeah, I don't know why, but it does have a female voice mine has this really male voice and I didn't, I didn't pick it out, but watch just for example hey chat, hey there.
Speaker 2: How's it going?
Speaker 2: What's on your mind today?
Speaker 1: I turn them off though you have the surfer one, I have the more dude one.
Speaker 2: That's a sexy voice though, so calming Sorry.
Speaker 1: Yeah, he's good, you can go change it.
Speaker 3: I think of a surfer as a dude.
Speaker 1: I think his name is Cove or Cade.
Speaker 3: I'd have to check the settings.
Speaker 3: I love that.
Speaker 3: You know what.
Speaker 3: I never tried to put the voice on, so I don't know if it's a male or a female voice.
Speaker 3: I just type where I speak.
Speaker 2: Yes, and then it comes out as words.
Speaker 2: I got to.
Speaker 3: But I.
Speaker 2: So I'll show you.
Speaker 2: It's this, it's this I'll send you, I'll send you, I'll text you and send you what to do with like a screenshot and screen recording or whatnot, but it's it's very efficient and easy for someone that drives all the time that if I need to access it, I just say hey, what's up, you know.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I haven't named him yet, but eventually I will.
Speaker 2: What did you name yours?
Speaker 2: I'm sorry, Did you want to?
Speaker 3: did you want or no?
Speaker 2: I mean, we can play red flag with you it's, it's kind of it's about dating.
Speaker 2: I'd love it.
Speaker 2: I love games like this you do it's about.
Speaker 3: I would love let's go.
Speaker 3: It's a challenge.
Speaker 1: Dating is a challenge love to know your answers and it's relevant.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so our last episode was about the fact that I don't really, uh, have, I'm not good with red flags, with men, okay, how I picked a really bad last boyfriend, and this is really relevant to the story.
Speaker 1: So, yeah, I think this would be a great game to play for you.
Speaker 2: Yeah, this is a real casual atmosphere here.
Speaker 2: Casual but for professional.
Speaker 3: I love it.
Speaker 3: I'm having so much fun.
Speaker 3: I'm like this is freaking great.
Speaker 1: Flag it.
Speaker 1: I love it.
Speaker 1: I'm having so much fun.
Speaker 1: I'm like this is freaking great.
Speaker 1: Flag it or fix it, so would you.
Speaker 1: Is this a red flag, which means you wouldn't go with the guy, or would you try to fix him Ready?
Speaker 3: Okay.
Speaker 1: He messages you sup at 1.38am.
Speaker 1: That would be effective.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Wait meaning like he's never messaged you before.
Speaker 2: You guys linked up on what you know.
Speaker 2: Of course, my question automatically was does he have your number already?
Speaker 2: Have you guys spoken before?
Speaker 2: And he?
Speaker 3: yeah.
Speaker 1: You're on a dating app.
Speaker 3: That wouldn't bother me.
Speaker 3: I be like oh good, yeah, here's another way.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's good getting way too drunk on the first date that would probably unless we both got drunk, and then I wouldn't care then it would be fun.
Speaker 3: But if it just he were, he was and I wasn't, then that would be a little bit weird maybe.
Speaker 2: I told Blaine the last episode red flag yes, well, so it depends on your level of drunk, right like I didn't go into depth about the one of the two dates that I went on recently where the guy was already hammered before I even got to the bar to the restaurant he was already like that's red flag.
Speaker 3: Yeah, he was already like five, that's red flag.
Speaker 2: Yeah, he was already like five old fashions in and then, you know, still had to wait for me to have a drink and dinner.
Speaker 2: But I ended up going with him back to his place it was in the same neighborhood just to say Not to hook up, just to see his place and meet his dog.
Speaker 3: And make sure he got home safely.
Speaker 2: Right and on the way on the drive between there's a gas station in the neighborhood, from the restaurant to his place.
Speaker 2: He had me go to the gas station that's right there in his neighborhood, pick up two gas station bottles of wine and bring it back.
Speaker 2: He got into one of the bottles of wine, finished it to himself at his place, then proceeded to try to get into the second bottle of wine, right I had no wine at all whatsoever.
Speaker 3: I had nothing to drink, right?
Speaker 3: Yeah, geez, could not get the cork out.
Speaker 2: He he pulls out a drill, a power drill, and says reed, I'm gonna hold the bottle you drill into the cork to pull it out.
Speaker 2: This is how hammered he was.
Speaker 2: I'm like I don't think it's gonna work out.
Speaker 2: I gotta go.
Speaker 2: I'm sorry you sober up and have a little bread and I'll talk to you some other time not a loaf of bread yeah with you, I'm with you on that.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean the five, the five drinks.
Speaker 3: When you show up now, that shows he's not serious or he has an issue.
Speaker 3: And who wants to deal with that, like you know?
Speaker 3: Get it fixed and then I'll go out with you, right?
Speaker 3: Yeah, that shows he's not serious or he has an issue.
Speaker 3: And who wants to deal with that, like you know, get it fixed and then I'll go out with you, right?
Speaker 2: yeah, that's what's scary.
Speaker 2: I think he has an issue.
Speaker 2: I think he's one of those people that has like a toddler in his, in his car, on the way to the office every day yeah, okay.
Speaker 1: So yeah, I agree, you know getting too drunk on the first date.
Speaker 1: My guy fell out of a booth at a steakhouse, so that wasn't good.
Speaker 3: You're giving me good plot devices here.
Speaker 3: I like these stories, the drill and falling out of the booth.
Speaker 3: I mean I enjoy having drinks, but you know I don't get shit-faced drunk.
Speaker 3: I don't know if I can say that, but shit-faced drunk.
Speaker 3: It's just like getting I love te tequila, and that can just make you so happy and horny.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think some people just get so nervous on dates they just like take it too far yeah, it was like blaine when the podcast started.
Speaker 2: That's not a good side now I'm just kidding, but wait, what kind of tequila?
Speaker 2: Because I'm similar in the sense that, if I do, don't give me cafe Patron, but give me regular Patron, clear Patron, clear Patron.
Speaker 3: And I'm a fun.
Speaker 2: I'm a I'm a great time Cafe.
Speaker 3: Patron, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2: I'm probably still a great time, but I might be naked in the middle of the street, or you know a lot to handle.
Speaker 2: You know what I mean?
Speaker 2: Yeah, so Well, you know a lot to handle.
Speaker 3: You know what I mean.
Speaker 3: Yeah, so well, you have to pace tequila, like, if you drink too much, too fast, then you're like a fool, and I've.
Speaker 3: That's never happened to me.
Speaker 3: But yeah, no, I like Casamigos, I like Don Julio, like for the basics, or Patron, and there's some really delicious ones, like that Casa Azul I think, but I don't drink that much, but I like, yeah, I love tequila.
Speaker 3: It makes me happy.
Speaker 3: I think I read or heard at one point that tequila is the only alcohol that is not a depressant, because it's true, it is an upper.
Speaker 1: You are correct, one hundred percent.
Speaker 3: Definitely makes me happy.
Speaker 1: Yeah, FYI, here in Texas we drink Ranch Waters, which is just really tequila, Topo, Chico and fresh lime juice with a little tahini on the rim.
Speaker 2: So you should try it if you like tequila.
Speaker 3: It's delicious.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, I love tequila.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I haven't been there forever.
Speaker 1: I have a couple of friends over there actually, next one, okay.
Speaker 3: Flag it or fix it on his dating profile.
Speaker 1: It says no fems fats mask only uh, should I be pc here or should I give you?
Speaker 1: We're not pc.
Speaker 3: We're not pc, gays I know I I don't like that there's no fems, or, but I'm attracted to masculine guys.
Speaker 3: Well, it wouldn't be a red flag necessarily, unless they said anything derogatory or negative.
Speaker 3: I mean, it may be a preference, it wouldn't be the part that I love, but because I am attracted to masculine guys, that would override the other part.
Speaker 3: So I would probably be okay with it, with a little bit of a footnote.
Speaker 3: You know, like I don't like this, but yeah, yeah, he's masculine.
Speaker 3: Okay, let's talk I think that's.
Speaker 1: I mean, I think that's fair, I agree.
Speaker 1: I mean I think as long as you're just not like rude to everybody, I think people are allowed to have preferences.
Speaker 1: I think this is like it's so ridiculous.
Speaker 1: I'll be the controversial one and say I just think it's ridiculous when people are like oh, you're not allowed to have preferences.
Speaker 1: I don't know why.
Speaker 1: Gays yeah, every gay has a preference.
Speaker 3: But I don't know that they need to say that in the profile, but whatever I agree.
Speaker 1: I don't think you have to say it in the profile.
Speaker 2: Well, that's like saying why doesn't anybody have top or bottom in it?
Speaker 2: Because nobody wants to?
Speaker 2: I don't know.
Speaker 2: I feel like people just want to get to the point, like, are you a top or are you a bottom?
Speaker 2: Because if I fall for this person, it's exhausting, it's personality.
Speaker 2: And then it comes down to a week in you find out you're both bottoms.
Speaker 2: Even though these days you have to be versed, apparently.
Speaker 2: I don't know.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think it depends on chemistry.
Speaker 3: That stuff to me is like I might feel different with one person than I do with another person.
Speaker 2: You know, I don't like all those labels and stuff.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I consider myself very neutral in that department, though I have been called one thing over the other.
Speaker 2: But I don't know.
Speaker 2: I feel like in the bedroom I want like, if you have that connection with somebody, let's roll around and fall off the bed for crying out loud, I don't care Like yeah, it's about fun and pleasure, Like you know.
Speaker 3: like, yeah, Find the right spots, you know.
Speaker 2: Exactly.
Speaker 3: What are?
Speaker 1: we talking about hey, so this is my favorite one.
Speaker 1: So you're dating somebody, you're in a relationship I wouldn't know.
Speaker 1: You're dating somebody and he says he wants something real, but he hasn't deleted grinder yet I want something real, but I'm not willing to delete grinder.
Speaker 3: I don't know I would say if you're far enough along and you're kind of like decided you're not sleeping with other people, delete the freaking Grindr who needs it?
Speaker 3: Like what's the point, Unless somebody says, oh, I'm just looking at it.
Speaker 3: Depends on the character of the person and how trustworthy.
Speaker 3: But I would be happy to delete all the apps if I were into somebody Bar none.
Speaker 3: So maybe I would expect that of someone, but I might give a little bit of grace because I know that I am a freak.
Speaker 3: Nobody else thinks the way I do about these things.
Speaker 2: No, actually I've learned that people do.
Speaker 2: I've learned that people do.
Speaker 2: They're just few and far between, but they do yeah.
Speaker 3: I mean yeah, I did delete it.
Speaker 3: I say delete it, yeah, I agree, I agree on that one, yeah.
Speaker 2: I just don't see how you could focus or invest time into someone when you have other distractions.
Speaker 2: Does that make sense?
Speaker 2: It's like trying to.
Speaker 2: It's basically window shopping.
Speaker 2: Still, you're not really doing it like if you're still on I agree.
Speaker 2: You know why are we dating so?
Speaker 1: yeah yeah, I love to window shop.
Speaker 1: Okay, suddenly acts like two dates are a committed relationship.
Speaker 1: Red flag, that's me.
Speaker 3: No, I've been guilty of that.
Speaker 3: Oh, because I'm very enthusiastic, so I would say red flag because that's something I've changed in myself, but I'm kind of like, but I'm guilty of like, oh, this is a good thing, I love this, yeah yeah, I'm not a relationship like let's move in yeah, okay.
Speaker 2: So have you ever been on the on the other end of it, though, where you take somebody else out on two dates, or are you of the of the sense where you know, know on the first date whether or not this is going to work out?
Speaker 3: No, there's no way to know that.
Speaker 3: I mean, you could have the butterflies and be all excited about it for several dates, but yeah, but I would be creeped out if somebody were doing that to me.
Speaker 2: Exactly.
Speaker 3: So red flag?
Speaker 3: Ok, that's a good way of thinking about it.
Speaker 3: You're welcome.
Speaker 1: What's the next one, blaine?
Speaker 1: The next one is grainy photos on the profile that look like they were taken 10 years ago.
Speaker 1: Total red flag.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I agree.
Speaker 1: You know who doesn't agree, reid.
Speaker 2: What do you mean?
Speaker 1: No, because you ask if you should talk to these guys.
Speaker 2: This is why I have this question so, blaine, I still post pictures that are probably grainy.
Speaker 2: That I took yesterday with my very fancy iphone pro.
Speaker 2: Whatever, blaine.
Speaker 1: So that's why I'm like what I mean.
Speaker 2: It could just be a mistake, maybe they're, maybe they're army guys on leave or in afghanistan, and maybe that's why the photo's grainy.
Speaker 3: I don't know, but I like to okay he's like, but you can tell like old, but you could tell old, grainy and you could tell like, okay, this guy probably doesn't take good pictures.
Speaker 3: I mean, I think there's a difference when they're trying to hide it, or or I love it, when the first picture is like hey.
Speaker 3: And then you go three photos in and you're like, oh, you just aged 20 years and look like a completely different person.
Speaker 1: Those are the worst.
Speaker 3: I've actually asked a couple of people like which photo do you look like?
Speaker 3: Now it doesn't go well, it's amazing.
Speaker 1: That's all the red flags.
Speaker 1: No, I just started back on them again and I've really only met people in real life over the last few years and I have to say I had to get off because it's too overwhelming, it's too much.
Speaker 3: It's too much.
Speaker 3: But it's also like when you meet someone in person.
Speaker 3: Like when you meet someone in person, I have a much better chance if I go to a party or to, you know, out to a bar with friends Like last night I went to a sports bar and I ended up talking to all these guys they were all couples, but it was really fun and I think you push yourself a little bit more and you know that there's like that chemistry there right away.
Speaker 3: The apps are just like like oh my god, it's such a waste of time.
Speaker 3: Not that I don't use them, but yeah, they frustrate me.
Speaker 3: I just want to let you be in a relationship and be added to the whole fishbowl, have you been approached by any couples?
Speaker 2: is that?
Speaker 2: Is that what you're like?
Speaker 3: you were meeting a lot of people, but right, yeah, oh, not last, you mean last night, no, they were just um, they just happened to be couples.
Speaker 3: Like I didn't know.
Speaker 3: I was like oh you single?
Speaker 3: No, are you single?
Speaker 3: No, I'm with him you know, that kind of thing and you're like, okay, yeah, it was more like that but they were.
Speaker 1: We had a lot of fun talking yeah is that it for the questions blade?
Speaker 3: is he laughing or is he it's fuzzy?
Speaker 3: His photo is fuzzy.
Speaker 1: No, sorry, I was choking.
Speaker 2: Did you?
Speaker 2: Have questions for us, robert Gosh this is such a good dialogue.
Speaker 3: We could just like order dinner in and keep talking.
Speaker 2: I mean these usually, yeah, these usually go Tell about dinner.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's so much fun.
Speaker 3: You're both like you're entertaining and I don't know you just kind of like pair off each other very well.
Speaker 1: Cool.
Speaker 1: So anyway, robert, I just want to thank you for writing something that'll really stay with so many of us because you know, I think we'll all kind of remember our summers in between.
Speaker 1: I mean, I know I did.
Speaker 1: I have so many of them and I really just appreciated this book so much.
Speaker 1: It was just really incredible.
Speaker 1: So thank you for giving it to us.
Speaker 1: I find books such a special thing.
Speaker 1: Thank you so much.
Speaker 1: I'm going to give a copy, I know, to my mom now.
Speaker 1: Wonderful.
Speaker 1: So thanks so much to our viewers.
Speaker 1: Pick up this summer in between, wherever books are sold and, robert, you want to kind of tell everyone where you can get it and follow you and all that stuff.
Speaker 3: We'll put all the links too in our Absolutely I will, and I'm just going to share, not because it's giving me a big head, but I was selected as a finalist for the NIEA Awards two weeks ago, so the books will now have this cool little gold seal on it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that was a shocker.
Speaker 3: Thank you.
Speaker 3: It made me really happy and the book is available pretty much in all online formats Amazon, apple, barnes, noble, I think, target, I think in Europe, saxo or Saxon and any independent bookstore can order it if they're not carrying it.
Speaker 3: And we're trying to.
Speaker 3: It's a grassroots effort to make bookstores more aware of the book, because so many come out every week and they can order it for you or order it for your book club and that sort of thing.
Speaker 3: And on my website, robertroschcom, you can just hit a link and it'll take you to all of the places that you can buy the book amazing, well, awesome well I'm so glad that you are our first author and oh my god, so much, so much.
Speaker 1: You guys are amazing, you're amazing thank you so much, thank you for dealing with me as my, as my first author interview.
Speaker 1: I I really appreciate it.
Speaker 1: You were awesome, so were you both of you Great.
Speaker 2: Thank you.
Speaker 2: Thank you, Robert.
Speaker 1: Thanks.
Speaker 2: And thank you all for joining us for Coffee with Gabe we could rap about something else.
Speaker 1: Please do, please do.
Speaker 1: Yes, sorry, we will definitely have you back.
Speaker 1: I mean, we definitely are going to continue having more guests and we've just been really enjoying it.
Speaker 1: Continue having more guests and we're just been really enjoying it.
Speaker 1: So yeah, so cheers, beautiful.
Speaker 3: Cheers.
Speaker 1: There you go, thank you.
Speaker 3: Cheers, salute.