The Mom Archives: Hormones, Breastfeeding, Communication, and Your Relationship

Welcome to The Mom Archives! Join us as we discuss motherhood myths and our experiences with them.

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Key Takeaways

• After becoming mothers, many women face challenges that intersect multiple areas of their lives, but these challenges are not often talked about
• Lack of dialogue around the postpartum experience and perpetuated myths about the transition into motherhood can impact women’s mental health and interpersonal relationships
• Women should feel empowered to be open and honest about their experiences as mothers, and to seek support to help them navigate the transition

Transcript

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Jenny: Thank you for listening to Steele Roses, a podcast for women by women. My name is Jenny,

Melissa: And I'm Melissa. And we're here to bring you inspiring content in a space where we can still be real about the everyday challenges for women. Cousin, so before jumping into our first full topic, I think we should explain what this podcast is and who it's for. And I admit I'm a podcast listener. And if you look, there's a lot of working mom podcasts out there, there's a lot of podcasts for professional women, for the female executive, podcasts that target women's mental health. But there's really not a lot of podcasts out there tackling a variety of these topics and how they interact with one another. And I think women are dealing with these issues, not neatly compartmentalized, but we're sort of, kinda at the intersection of these things, you know.

Jenny: Right. Exactly. And again, as Melissa mentioned, we actually both listen to other podcasts. So we know there's tons of podcasts out there. But why this one, why is this one important? We really want to provide relatable information. We're not experts. You know, we're not with the stars, like we don't have nannies or maids, you know. I'm gonna pause for a minute because if I could, I would. [Melissa: More power to you!] Can't wait to be able to do that, I'm gonna be honest. Personal chef? I'm all in. But we do want to provide relatable content to everybody. We want everyone to feel like “this is a place for me and I can relate to these people and this information”. This podcast is gonna be based on real life experiences, real life challenges. And, you know, we're not experts, we're not health care professionals. We really are just striving to bring you information to show you that you're not in this alone. We're all in this together.

And on that note, we also want to create a safe space. This podcast, we hope that for everyone that listens, they come away from this podcast feeling like “I've got this, I hear these women talking and I know what they're going through and I can relate to this. And this podcast makes me feel good afterwards because it's something that I'm hearing and it makes me feel like I'm not alone.” And that's really what we want everyone to take away from this.

Melissa: Exactly. And we will, like we said, we are not experts on every topic that we talk about. We're going to bring in factual information, or we'll bring in the experts themselves and help explain the experiences that we're sharing and help us understand these everyday issues just like our listeners would. So that's exactly what we're trying to do here: make something relatable that the average woman is facing.

All right. So with all that said, now let's get into it. So, cousin, one of my closest friends, as you know, just had her first baby. And about two weeks and she called me and she was like, “How is this so hard?” She said to us, “How is this so hard?”

And it really made me flash back to that first month that my daughter was born. And I remember just one night laying in bed looking at the ceiling and thinking “Wow, I completely underestimated what motherhood was going to be like.” And then my secondary thought was “Will I ever be alone for a minute again?” [Jenny: No, never.] And you know, that transition was a bit of a shock to me.

So I was right in the middle of my PhD. I’d just finished my independent research and I was in the beginning stages of writing. So that's the point where you have to be crazy self-sufficient and independent in order to progress in the program. And then went from that to boom, having this tiny little person reliant on me 24/7 and having to be with someone else 24/7. And it really did take me a little bit of time to get a handle on that shift, you know?

Jenny: You know, I think that that's very normal for a lot of moms and a lot of women experience that but just don't really talk about it. Probably because it's just not talked about in a really public forum kind of way. Part of the challenge of the transition to motherhood is the expectations we have going into it. And if you don't meet those expectations, you ultimately just feel like a failure. You know, that’s it, you feel like you’ve failed— while you’re pregnant, and even way before you get pregnant.

Growing up in our society today, there's all these notions about being a mom and having a baby, and the pictures and the media really paint this really glossy, positive, butterflies-and-sunshine image about what it's like. So essentially you get two options when you're seeing what a mother is like. You're either the glossy positive, you know, euphoric person who wears stilettos and didn't gain any baby weight. [Melissa: And always has a smile on her face.] Always smiling and happy. Or you're like Hot Mess Express and you can't take care of yourself. Kids are a mess, babies are crying, it's terrible. [Melissa: You’re crying.]

But you know, the thing that, like, always troubles me, and the thing that actually comes to mind a lot for me personally when I see these things is like, OK, you know, I get it. It's funny, it's comical. This is why they're presenting it this way. In none of these images in media and movies, nobody addresses mental health challenges after giving birth. Well, no, it's not fun to talk about that. It's not funny. But that's a huge part of what women deal with after expanding their families and because no one talks about it, it is unexpected and the impact is a lot stronger because you just weren't prepared for it.

Melissa: Yes. No, exactly. You hit the nail on the head. So, OK, wait, what were the top three things that you were told about motherhood before having your first? And then I'll tell you why.

Jenny: Where do I begin? You know, OK, so I actually have a couple here. So, number one, now you have a real purpose to fulfill in life. And everyone who's listening who knows me (and if you don't know me, you will eventually get to know me ), saying something like that is like vinegar coming out of my mouth. I'm like the exact opposite of that notion.

Number two is you will not miss your pre-baby life, which I don't know where that comes from. Number three is read the baby books and you will feel totally prepared. And I'm gonna be honest, I fell for that one like a bag of rocks. And you know, I used to wax philosophical on how to take care of babies and what my method was gonna be. And that went out the window within the first like 10 minutes, like I'm gonna be real here. [Melissa: Yeah. Survival right? It replaces everything.] Basically, yeah. It’s my motto. 

And number four for me (and this one is this one's loaded, so we’re gonna dig into this), your relationship with your partner won't be affected, and if anything, having a baby will bring you closer together. Now, I know that's a volatile one. [Melissa: Ahhh. You’re gonna have to unpack (08:02) that one.]

I know not everyone will feel the same way, but that's the whole point. We don't think everyone's gonna feel this way and, you know, we’re not expecting that everyone will agree with us, but we want to get the information out on the table. Melissa, what about you?

Melissa: OK, yeah. Probably the top, you know, expectations that I had about motherhood based on what I heard from others was number one, this magical state of motherhood that you will immediately fall in love with your new life and everything is going to be this mystical type of atmosphere, that it's happening in the moment, you know.

Number two, that breastfeeding is simple. This notion that your body will innately know what to do once you have a baby. Yeah, no. That was not my experience and that probably set me up for some postpartum anxiety. And then number three, being a work at home mom makes things easier. Jenny, you and I both work sort of nontraditional jobs in the sense that, you know, it's not an office 9 to 5.

So that when I was like, oh, I'll be set, I'll be ready for this. So yeah, those were the top three probably, for me, that set up my expectations about what motherhood was going to be like.

Jenny: So there's a lot here. Clearly, this could be a two-parter or a topic that we come back to in the future, because there's a couple of things here that we would definitely want to discuss. But we can just take some time to dispel a few of these now. Let's pick our top three and just kind of dig into them. I'm gonna pick one. And this one actually was a big one for me. Did you feel an immediate bond with your baby right after birth?

Melissa: Ah yes, the immediate bond. Short answer, no. At least not how it's portrayed in the movies and on television. It was funny because I think it was like a month in and my college roommate reached out to me and she was like “How are you doing? How's the baby? How are things going?” And at first I remember just sort of putting on this facade and I was like “oh, everything is great, you know, things are good, I have a handle on it.”

And I remember her just pausing and being like “Melis, it’s me. You can be honest.” And I remember just breaking down a little bit and being like “I feel like I don't know what I'm doing.” And she was like “Let me just stop you right there. Let me tell you my experience,” and she did. She laid out this timeline. She was like “Listen. For the first two months, I did not feel a crazy strong connection with my child.”

She was like “I got no sleep. I was up all night, and I really didn't like it.” And then she's like “But it starts to shift. At three months, you know, you start to feel things growing and then at six months you start to get into this groove and they start expressing themselves a lot more, and you just sort of develop this bond over time. By nine months, I was completely in love with my kid and I couldn't imagine not having him.”

And she's like “It still didn't mean that he didn't drive me crazy at times. But it shifted.” And you know, Jenny? Not for nothing but it was pretty on point for me. Like, at three months I started to get into a groove. By six months, I really started to feel bonded with my daughter and then by nine months, I was like, damn, I'm in love with this kid. 

But I think there's a difference and I didn't realize that until after I went through the newborn stage, that you can absolutely love your child and not be in love with motherhood. Not instantaneously. It takes a little while to get into that groove and I think it took, you know, like a little while for me to both be in love with my baby and then also start to love motherhood in the way that it's portrayed. You know what I mean?

Jenny: Yeah. No, I get it. I totally get it.

Melissa: What was your experience?

Jenny: Well, as I quickly discovered (and what you saw, because you were at the hospital with me) is that I'm very much of a realist mom. As much as I had notions of what kind of mother I would be, I very quickly adapted to what was real. I love my kids like any mother. That feeling is infinite, it's unending. But at first meeting of this tiny person who kept me up all night, cried a lot, ate, threw up all over me pretty consistently and then slept— I really didn't like them very much. I'm gonna be honest, and I say that with the most love in my heart because you can 110% love someone but not like them in the moment. You don't have to like everyone all the time. These are my children; I love them but I don't always like them. And this comment, I'm making it and I'm putting it out there because I really want to highlight that this is one of those -isms that we want to really change the conversation around this.

It's OK to bring your baby home and be scared. It's OK to bring your baby home and not love being a mom. That one's totally fine. And it's OK to bring your baby home and feel resentful. That happens. We all feel that, but I don't think anyone talks about it. [Melissa: Or says it out loud.(14:23)]

I very distinctly remember after the twins were born (I have twin girls), after they were born, I was sitting on the couch really a mess. No sleep, bottle feeding, up all night. And, Melissa came in in the morning, freshly showered, did not smell like puke and was like, “Good morning. How are the babies?” And I was like, you better take that cheerfulness out the door and get out of my face. [Melissa: ?(14:55)]

Let me back up because I'm not a jerk, everybody. But to be fair, there's a lot of factors to consider with that. You know, it's not just cut and dry, it's not black and white. Something I wanna bring up, something I really want to talk about is the real hormonal changes after you give birth. Now for me, no one talked about hormonal hormonal changes or fallout after you give birth. You're handed your baby and you're wheeled out of the hospital, and you don't really have any guidance from anybody on what to be aware of for your own physical and mental health needs after giving birth. And this applies to C sections and natural birth.

Our bodies have natural methods to childbirth and, you know, I'm only gonna focus on the hormone portion here. (There's a lot of other things we can discuss and which we will.) Some of the research I did, referencing National Library of Medicine, at childbirth and directly after, your endorphin levels are off the charts. It's meant to make the mother alert. It's also meant to make the mother feel euphoric after birth, be more attentive. And in that very early per postpartum period, the endorphins with the oxytocin, they play a role in strengthening the mother infant relationship. So it's just something that biologically is necessary. Our bodies put that into play for us, which is great.

But then you go home and reality hits, the endorphins wear off and you might not be alone with a tiny person. But now you have a tiny person that you have to care for, and the dishes are piling up and everything's kind of a mess and it's all on your plate. There was an article on parents.com, I think a couple of years back, that discussed this, and every woman is going to go through this differently and gonna experience this differently. But the research I found suggested that at about six months postpartum, your hormones will begin to regulate. Now, that's not everybody. That's just, you know, a mild time frame there; they're making this suggestion. But once your hormones begin to balance back out, you're, you know, gonna start to feel better supposedly.

But even if your hormones are balancing back out, well, now you're sleep deprived, you're worried about your baby— you're trying to find a rhythm with your new life. In some instances, you're dealing with your child being sick, which I had that situation on my hands. And Melissa, I think you had a situation on your hands too that you're gonna get into a little bit. And then outside of, you know, caring for your child, some women have to worry about whether they even have adequate maternity leave.

You know, there's a lot that is there for women to have to deal with. And you know, there's not a lot of support from our society. We don't put that support in place and it’s not right, and it's just all on our shoulders. So yes, of course, there’s gonna be a lot that you're dealing with directly thereafter and even for the first few years. 

This is not a forum where I'm going to make any kind of recommendations on treatments or anything like that. I'm not a healthcare professional. What I want to say here is that if you are experiencing distress or feel like you're just not yourself after childbirth, if you have that gut feeling that something is off, you have to be your own advocate. You have to go and demand support from your doctor. Don't be ashamed of turning to your circle of support, from your family or friends, for help.

If you do any research before you have a child, it really should also include what happens to your body after giving birth and what you can proactively do to support yourself because in the end, you really have to be able to get through this and make it happen. So that's really something that I want to put out there to everybody. A big component is making sure that you have the knowledge to help yourself out.

Melissa: Yeah, exactly. And I think, you know, our podcast is just one small outlet, but I think it adds up. You know, the more women are talking about this, the more women will hear about it, and the more I think it becomes normalized to have these conversations. And I think both you and I would have been better prepared if more public forums were talking about this.

And I think it also speaks to these immediate postpartum care myths. You know, you constantly hear “Your body knows exactly what to do. Just let it happen.” After your six week check up, everything's going to be right back to normal. Your pre-pregnancy body will bounce right back. And you know, my favorite “Breastfeeding is natural. Instinctually, you'll know what to do.”

Can I please tell you how much anxiety that caused me as a new mom and the guilt I felt because I felt like I had no idea what I was doing? So in case you didn't know, cousin, (which brings us into dispelling another myth) is that breastfeeding has made a serious comeback right now.

So when we were growing up, breastfeeding rates were pretty different. Plugging CDC statistics here, about 55% of women initiated breastfeeding in the 80s, and approximately 16% of women were exclusively breastfeeding at six months. But as of 2020, 83% of new mothers started breastfeeding and at six months, 58% of babies still receive breast milk with 25% exclusively. [Jenny: Wow! That's a big jump, wow.] It’s a big shift in these newborn trends.

What I'm doing here today, I'm not knocking breastfeeding by any means. It really does have some research-proven benefits, you know, for both babies and moms. It is an amazing process. But I think what I've taken issue with is that with this shift in these postnatal trends comes a lot of pressure to breastfeed and sometimes not all the proper supports in place.

And from my experience, and those in my immediate circle, it can be a real source of mom guilt and create this postpartum anxiety. You know, before my daughter was born, I kept hearing “You're going to breastfeed, right?” Like it was an assumption and, that was followed by “Don't worry, your body will know exactly what to do. Your baby will know exactly what to do. It's instincts.” I heard that from my doctor. I heard that from the staff at the hospital after my daughter was born. I heard it from the pediatrician. The only ones that were not saying that were my close friends and family. So there's definitely some sort of disconnect between the new mothers themselves and the healthcare professionals a lot of the time. Did you have the same feeling, cousin?

Jenny: You know, as you were talking, all I was thinking about was how when you're in the hospital, after you’ve had your baby, they automatically wheel the breastfeeding machine. Like they have to, I mean, they're healthcare people so they do need to do certain checks and balances. Like I get that, I've worked in healthcare for a really long time, like, I get it. But there's posters everywhere and they bring it in, and if you say “No, I'm not gonna do it” like I did for my twins, you kind of get the stink eye. I’m not gonna lie.

With my son, I did do my due diligence. I tried, and I wanted to make sure he got the important— I can't remember— the colostrium? (I'm not saying it right, guys. Listeners, don't get me for that one.) That initial burst is very vitamin packed and I wanted to make sure all my kids— [Melissa: The liquid gold!] The liquid gold. Yes, thank you. And that was important to me. I wanted to make sure they had that benefit. But with the twins, I knew I wasn't gonna be able to breastfeed them. I already had a one year old, I had my twins; like, that was a lot on my plate already. And again, survival. I was like “I need to make this work for me and my kids. I'm gonna have to bow out of this. They'll be OK, I'll make sure I do everything I can for them.” But yeah, I was thinking all of that while you were talking.

Melissa: Yeah. So we're here to tell you. And me personally, after three different consultations with lactation consultants, after a tongue tie release for my baby girl, and about a grand later— it's OK if breastfeeding doesn't come naturally and causes you stress. You know, one of the first things that the lactation consultant said was “Breastfeeding is hard in the beginning, period. And if it doesn't work out, your baby will still be perfectly happy and healthy.”

And that immediately made me feel better, like immediately. You know, I put so much pressure on myself in the beginning, I was determined to breastfeed my daughter. Being adopted as an infant (as you know, cousin, but for our listeners), it was just something that I was set on from the get go when I found out I was pregnant. And we did it. We breastfed, probably a little bit too long. But it came at a cost. It really created a lot of anxiety in the beginning.

And those first six weeks were tough. It was so much work in the beginning. I literally feel like I didn't have a freaking clue what I was doing. [Jenny: Yeah.] Was she getting enough milk? Was my supply OK? Is she positioned right? And that's all normal. I just didn't know it at the time because no one talks about it. No one was really talking about it at the time. But there are thousands and thousands of mothers that feel the same way.

Jenny: The other thing I was gonna point out just now that you lightly touched on is that there was actually a legitimate physical situation with your daughter that you actually had to get taken care of and that's why the latching wasn't working. [Melissa: Yeah. And we found out by accident.] Exactly. So the reason why I want to point that out is because if you're feeling frustrated about something and you are getting a sense that, again, something is not right (I'm gonna say this probably on almost every single podcast because I feel very strongly about this), you have to advocate for yourself and, in this instance, for your kids. Because if you sense that something is not right, I would bet money that something is not right. And you innately know and everyone will tell you “No, you're crazy,” but you need to dig in deep and you need to do what you need to do to get your point across because people will always tell you you're crazy. Be crazy and make it happen.

Melissa: Oh yeah. And like for any of our listeners out there, if anyone has to deal with what's called a posterior tongue tie, that is very common in newborns. Please, DM us on Instagram because I will be more than happy to do that. But with your daughter, the same thing, there was something. And in my case, it was a very simple laser procedure where they just kind of clipped the tongue and everything was fine. But, you know, had I not done that, there could have been ramifications later with, you know, solid foods and things, things that we easily avoided. But I really had to advocate for my daughter and for myself, until they realized “Oh, you know what? You are right. Yeah, we'll get this taken care of.” You know, but all of that to say, debunked: breastfeeding isn't always instinct.

And just from our two stories alone, cousin, you can hear that the breastfeeding journey looks different for everyone. [Jenny: Yeah.] Right? And at the end of the day, if breastfeeding doesn't work out, it's OK. This really hit home for me recently. The reason why I brought this up on this episode of the podcast is because my friend called me about two weeks ago and, for whatever reason, her baby is not handling her milk well, and she was like “I have to stop” and she felt guilty. And she called and said “Well, you as a baby didn't get breast milk, right? And you were OK, right? And I immediately told her yes, as an adopted infant, I did not get one ounce of breast milk and I was a healthy, happy child who was completely bonded with my mother. So I wanted to help put that to rest for her. And I thought we could kind of do the same to anybody that's listening.

But anyway. Please, my biggest tips for new moms when it comes to breastfeeding is, one: get support, reach out. There are certified lactation consultants usually through your hospital, your OBGYN, or your pediatrician that do take insurance. And vet them like you would any other professional because some are absolutely amazing and some are ehh. And I wish I had done that sooner, you know?

And also, either join a local breastfeeding mom group or you can join one virtually on Facebook, because you will see that you are not alone. When I tell you that there are thousands of women who feel anxious and unsure about breastfeeding, there really are. I didn't even know those existed until another new mom told me about them, but it really helped me feel better that I was not alone and that this whole newborn process, it was OK to feel unsure, you know.

And then lastly, I just wanna say again, if it doesn't happen, it's OK. Breastfeeding or not, it doesn't say anything about you as a mother. It says nothing about your bond with your baby, period. And I think that's something, you know, that even though the shift towards breastfeeding is a good development for health reasons, we also have to play the flip side of that and say, you know what though? If you give it a try, or if you decide not to, it's OK. It doesn't mean that you’re any less of a mother.

Jenny: Yeah, of course not. The benefits are real. Breast milk is amazing. It has healing properties. It's awesome. But again, you can't do it or you just can't feasibly wrap your head around it? OK. You're fine. It's OK. My kids were all bottle fed. They're all right. They drive me crazy, but they're all right. 

OK, I think we have time for one more and I wanna dig into this one a little bit. The next myth we want to debunk is that your baby brings you closer to your partner. Now, before anyone gets too riled up, I want to provide a little bit of clarification here. [Melissa: Yes, let’s unpack that.] Yes, let me pick this apart a little bit. Yes. After you have your baby, you will lovingly see your partner with your child and be overwhelmed with love for both of them. This happens to me consistently to this day; when I see my husband with my kids, it just brings up this just overwhelming feeling. I love that.

Melissa: Yes. No, I can attest to that myself too because I remember after having a C-section (an unplanned C-section as well, cousin), I remember Matt holding our daughter and he was doing a lot of that heavy lifting the first day, obviously, and he just kept holding her in this loving embrace. And whenever I would see that, even to this day, I still picture that moment in my head, and your heart just bursts right? With warmth. It's like that cliche notion. But those aren't the moments we're talking about.

Jenny: No, we're not talking about that. We're not talking about those nice, gushy— that's not what we're here for. (No, I'm just kidding.) That's not what we're talking about here. What we're talking about here is outside of those moments. Now, there was an article published in the Washington Post a couple years back that noted a staggering 67% of couples in a study reported a decline in their relationship satisfaction after the arrival of their first baby. The decline typically shows up between six months for women and nine months for men after the baby comes. [Melissa: Sounds about right.] Another set of research (it was from an online article, goodtwo.com) has found a fifth of couples break up during the first 12 months after welcoming their new arrival. Among the most common reasons for separating were dwindling sex lives (which, I mean, obvious reasons), a lack of communication (which is wildly rampant, and again, no one talks about it), and constant arguments. Now, it's not gonna be everybody. Some people don't experience that at all. Some people will actually travel through that challenge together as a unit and it unifies them. That's amazing, but that's also not everybody. And what I want to bring to the attention here is, while everybody wants to show that image and make it seem like everyone is gonna go through this together and they're gonna hold hands through the whole thing and there's not gonna be any problems, that's not the case. And it's extremely critical to talk about this because you're going to have these dark times in that first year, couple of years even, where it is hard. You are both sleep deprived. You know, there's just so much going on. There's a lot of adjustments and there's an actual, legitimate physical adjustment in women's brains that happen after they gave birth.

There's a study (and I'm actually kind of annoyed at myself because I did not have time to pull the actual study up to reference it), but there was an actual study done that took images of women's brains before and after giving birth and it shows an actual physical change in a woman's brain. Now, this happens as a biological reaction to having a baby and it adjusts the mother's way of thinking so that they can better care for their child. This adjustment does not happen to men. So that difference alone is going to set you apart from your partner. And in times where you're gonna be like, I don't understand why you innately don't do this, well it's because they don't have that physical reaction. It's honestly not their fault and making sure that you know that, and anyone listening (if you've already been down this path or maybe you're about to go down this path) I want you to hear this. This is like something you can't control and it's not your partner's fault, it's not your fault. This is just meant to happen this way. The best way to combat any ill feelings after you have a baby and all that happens (34:59) is to take time to clearly communicate yourself, and your feelings, to your partner. [Melissa: Absolutely.] You have to take that step.

Melissa: Absolutely. And you have to remember also this is happening during those months, especially where you're sleep deprived. You're adjusting to this new life and (like we said, because it's really not talked about) you might not have even been aware that this was going to possibly be a bump in the road. And I remember, because like I mentioned, during the PhD program and then even now during my post-doc stage, I don't have that typical 9 to 5. So my schedule was a lot more flexible. And I remember I would watch my husband go off, and he had to go to work, but he was able to kind of live that pre-baby life from 9 to 5, you know? And walk out that door, take care of himself, focus on work, and then come back and then do the fun dad things. And I remember feeling, sort of, this resentment growing. And the best thing I did was instead of, you know, just trying to swallow that and keep it to myself, I had a conversation with him [Jenny: Yeah.] and we got through, and that was the key. That was the key to not letting it fester and bubble over, you know.

Jenny: Yeah. And you know, I was actually gonna say that I was extremely fortunate because my husband has a lot of wisdom. He's very wise and he brings a lot of communication to the table. I work in communications as a profession, so I already have my own set of communication skills. But he brought this wisdom to the table and combining it with, you know, us learning these communication skills together as a couple and how we work together. And it helped so much, and continues to help to this day because having kids is hard. My six year old consistently tells me “Oh, mommy, three kids is so hard.” I'm like, you got that right! You know, and that's why it's very important, clearly communicating with your partner and taking into account this isn't just you.

And while we all have this problem now— and I'm gonna call it a pandemic of social media, where all you see is the glitzy glossy photos of everyone smiling but you don't see the 150 photos in between where the baby puked all over somebody, and someone's crying, and somebody fell, and somebody's throwing a tantrum and then you're screaming at each other. But then click, you smile— and then you go back into the mayhem and the chaos. Like, let's be real people.

Oh, that's like a thing, right? “Be real?” I have some friends that told me about that. Let's be real people. Like, you don't have to picture perfect. This is life. Life is messy and it's awesome. So just go with the flow and like, just go with it. [Melissa: Live in your moment.] Live in your moment. Yes. Exactly.

Melissa: Not anyone else’s moment, or moments that you think somebody had because they're on a pretty picture on Instagram, you know?

Jenny: And one thing I wanna say (and I hope everyone takes away here) is you have to do what's right for you. I'm a big survival mode person. You need to do what's right for you, right for your kids, and right for your husband. At the end of the day, those are the only people that really matter. You have to take care of each other.

So there's a lot to cover on the myths of motherhood. But our hope is that a little of what we have discussed has helped to bring some clarity and perhaps relief to some of you. If you think this information will help anyone you know, please relay the information or share the podcast. It's just very important to myself and Melissa that the word is spread out there. We're gonna change the conversation here. We want to make this a world of difference, for everybody out there to know that what they are going through is normal, and they aren't alone, and maybe we can have some laughs along the way while we do this. [Melissa: Yes!] Melissa, you have any thoughts on key takeaways?

Melissa: Yeah, I mean, I think you hit the nail again on the head. Our whole purpose here is you are allowed to feel the way you feel, and based on your experience, more than likely this is a normal process. You're allowed to feel overwhelmed. Do not fall for that Superwoman syndrome. And this applies whether you have children or not.

The pressures that we put on ourselves, it's OK to feel overwhelmed. The pressures that society puts on us, it’s OK to not be able to handle that all at once and with all of these different balls that you're juggling in the air. And again, going back to the topic that we've covered today— do not feel ashamed for your feelings after having a baby.

And really— I think this is key— talk to someone that you can trust, you know? Whether it's a small group of friends, whether it's a family member, someone that you feel will place zero judgment on you— have a real conversation. Talk about what you’re feeling, because it feels so much better when you do, you know? And give your time to adjust, find your rhythm in your own time. A lot of what we talked about are these pre-conceived notions that everything is supposed to go smoothly immediately after the baby comes. That you’re supposed to know exactly what to do, your body knows exactly what to do. And I think we’ve successfully debunked some of these things. And just give yourself that time to find your rhythm, because a majority of us really do (41:14). I wish I had someone telling me what we’re talking about now because it would have been a much smoother journey, you know?

Jenny: Yeah, exactly. We really appreciate everybody listening today. We hope it brought some clarity, peace of mind (maybe some laughs, I don’t know) to some of you out there. Thank you again, and we’ll see you on the next episode.

Melissa: Thanks guys!