Against The Norm
It’s all about creating a thrilling, adventurous and extraordinarily healthy life as we continue to age. Most importantly, it is about living life to the fullest—daring to go against the grain of average and ‘what is expected’. Instead, to bravely go against the norm to lead an incredibly exciting life.
Against The Norm
Chosen Suffering: How Men Over 60 Get Fit (Without Waiting for a Health Scare)
Use Left/Right to seek, Home/End to jump to start or end. Hold shift to jump forward or backward.
What does it actually take for a man in his 60s or 70s to get fitter—especially if he hasn’t worked out in decades?
In this episode of Against the Norm, Norman Calvo sits down with his personal trainer and strength coach Brandon Chu (Liv Method, Manhattan), who shares a refreshingly real roadmap for older men: start smaller than you think, build consistency first, and use accountability to make it stick.
You’ll hear:
- Why most men don’t change until a doctor or scare forces it
- The “momentum” approach: tiny steps that actually lead somewhere
- Why gyms feel intimidating—and how to lower the barrier to entry
- The simple truth about muscle loss, bone density, strength training, and protein as we age
- The mindset shift Brandon calls “chosen suffering”: pick the discomfort now, or pay for it later
This one is practical, funny, and motivating—especially if you’re thinking, “I should really start… but I don’t know how.”
Contact us: againstthenorm.net
Welcome to Against the Norm, the podcast all about older men and finding your greatest adventures in your past 60 or past 70 years old. I want to welcome today Brandon Chu, my own personal trainer and a strength coach. He works sometimes, oftentimes, at the Live Method in Manhattan. And I wanted to introduce him because he's helped me tremendously in my road towards becoming more fit, becoming more healthy, and losing weight. So, Brandon, I want to leave it up to you to kind of discuss what you who who you are, what where you were born, because that's interesting as well. I know it was uh someplace unusual, and uh how you got into training and what you do pre-ma primarily.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Well, thank you for that great intro, Norm. Um so I am I was born and raised in Guam. Right. And growing up, I played basketball, and I thought I was gonna go play basket uh basketball in college. So I was hell bent on doing that, and that eventually led me to coming to the States. Uh went to college in the States, ended up playing college rugby instead, and then went to a school that was known for strength conditioning and exercise science. And, you know, ever since I was young, I always knew that I wanted to be a coach. I wanted to help other people because when I was growing up and you know, I had these big aspirations of oh you know, being a great athlete. Um, I didn't have I didn't feel like I had much support around me. And so for me, it was a way for uh coaching was a way for me to be that person that I needed for someone else. And so since I was, you know, shit, in eighth grade, I wanted to be uh a coach and I specifically loved the gym. And so the gym and strength training was I knew was going to be my avenue for coaching. Originally I thought I was I wanted to work with athletes when I first got to college, but then from there, having got my feet wet with some more experience working in college athletics uh as a strength conditioning coach, I uh decided, okay, after a couple of internships, you know what, I'm not quite sure if this is this the route I really want to go down. And then so I decided, hey, you know what? I'm gonna move to New York City because I think there's no better place to really test myself as a person and as an adult.
SPEAKER_02Best place to be, yeah.
SPEAKER_00New York or nowhere. New York or nowhere. But that's right, you know, I decided to come here, uh, work as a personal trainer and just kind of be an adult for a little bit. You know, I'm 23, so I'm still very young in my career and just in life in general. So uh still figuring out uh all of that. And uh, but you know, now I've been here for almost two years, uh, been working as a personal trainer, uh work with someone like you, Norm. It's been such a fun, fun ride.
SPEAKER_02It is great, it really is great. And you know, it's very interesting. I had the chance to take a look at your Instagram page. And for those people who might be listening and watching this podcast, it's interesting to note that if you look at you now, you're this big buff, you know, trainer, right? That would be intimidating to most people. But when you were much, much younger, you were overweight, uh a little bit pudgy, whatever, and you made the metaphor metamorphosis to become, you know, somebody who's really super fit, super healthy, and super strong. And that's admirable. That is a really, really great thing.
SPEAKER_00Thank you, Norm. Um, I mean, I also want to add, you know, you bringing this up, actually yesterday I just posted a video about uh my younger, my younger self. I between eighth grade and senior year, I um I had an eating disorder called bulimia nervosa. Sure. If you don't know what that means, it's just um uh a person that overeats or the eating disorder is characterized by overeating followed by uh purging um and the expulsion of the food. And it was a really hard it was a really hard thing to go through. And I again I didn't really have many people around me, and I on top of that struggled with other mental health issues, body dysmorphia, uh anxiety, and those things growing up. And you know, a lot of those things drive me to do what I do now. To do it, to become better. And and and you know, uh like you were just saying, right, the you know, I wasn't always this person that you see now, right? You know me in the past two years as this trainer, he's buffed, tattoos, long hair, right, like young fit. But I I never saw myself that way. And I always wanted to become this version of me, but it's taken a long time. And even now, uh, you know, I look in the mirror and I you know, you you always have imposter syndrome. You always wonder, like, am I doing enough? Um, like is am I making my younger self proud? And you know, I ask myself those questions a lot, and so I think that you know that drives me to keep to keep going. Right.
SPEAKER_02It it's a testament to being capable of making change that's really great in you and in any div individual who's who really wants to to kind of create a new life or create something fantastically adventurous for himself. It's so, so important. And especially what what I think is important here is you're very, very young. I'm unfortunately, I don't want to say very old. No, but I'm much older than you. But uh Noah, you act like you're 12. That's I do. And I like 12-year-old jokes as well. You know, that's the greatest thing in the world. But uh for a lot of people, especially people my age, it's very hard for them to have this type of attitude of saying to yourself, okay, I know that maybe something is wrong or something is a little bit off. How do I go about and making the change? And if anyone takes a look at, you know, the internet or media or newspapers, wherever it is, you always see the fact that older people, especially older men, need to go out and exercise and change their lifestyle to be less sedentary and to go out there and get fit. How would you take somebody, let's say, who's about to retire and hasn't really much hasn't really worked out much at all in the last what 20 years, 30 years, 40 years since he's been raising a family and working, what would you tell a person to do?
SPEAKER_00How would you how would you start? And so this brings up uh an interesting issue because I think that uh just as the old adage goes, you can lead a horse to water, but you cannot force it to drink. Sure. And so just because we can wish things into our life of, oh man, it would be nice if I could just drive around in a Lamborghini all day and live in a nice penthouse and have all these things, but wishing it and working towards it are very two different yes, the doing, that is those are two very different things, as you know, right? And so, you know, we can look back to when you even first started, right? When you first started and you came to me, uh, you had already been rather active and you wanted to, you you just had more ambitious goals. And so of okay, I want to be front cover of men's health magazine. And that's exactly that's exactly what that is is exactly what Norman told me when he first uh when he first came to me. And man, um, and we're we're not letting go of that goal. However, we've we've we've now looked at the horizon and we know that the timeline is is much longer, right? So that might take us to get there, but you know, hopefully this this platform gives us the ability to do so. But um man, if if someone were to come to me starting from scratch, it's a lot harder because, well, you know, sometimes we there needs to be something that motivates them to come see me or that motivates them enough to really want them to change, right? If if you're if you're older, if you're you know in your 60s and your 70s, uh, and assuming you've not exercised before, right, taking the leap to exercise, like think about it. You've done the same thing for 60 odd years, 70 some years, right? And you've you've had the same routines, you you've had the same way of life, and for something to be thrust upon into your life, and that is, hey, look, we need to do something about this quick, otherwise, like something bad's gonna happen. Right. Uh unless something like that happens, people aren't gonna be willing to change. They're so comfortable. If you're 60 or 70 years old and you've made your money, you're retired, and um you're you've gone about your way of life for the past 40 years and you feel very comfortable. Well, why do you feel the need to have to to disrupt that comfort, right? And and you know this, but but you're a person that seeks adventure and you're a person that seeks discomfort. And you know, and unfortunately, most uh at least the older people that I know, and even with my family, my older generation, you know, they they are so comfortable with where they're at that until their doctor tells them, hey, listen, if you don't get this blood pressure, if you don't get your cholesterol, if you don't whatever it is, under control and you do something about it, man, you're not looking to live very much longer. And and unfortunately, it's not until you know uh death comes knocking at your door then you realize, oh shit, I gotta I gotta change something about you know my life, right? Otherwise, there's no impetus for change. And so for I feel like for most older people, it is the impetus for change that in which they are missing.
SPEAKER_02It has to come from within. There's no doubt about that. There's no doubt about that. And you know, it's interesting, there's so many people my age that are couch potatoes, and or when they go on vacation when they do have a little bit of free time, what they'll do, and I'm not saying this is bad because I love cruises too, but they'll go on a cruise or they'll go to some Caribbean beach and just sit and sit and sit. I mean, I'd go crazy if I did something like that. But that's the way it is with a lot of people, and when they oftentimes do get this, you know, health scare, they go to their doctor, they do this, they do that. And then the doctor, instead of insisting on, okay, I want you to start a regimen of physical exercise, you're gonna be walking X number of days per week, you're gonna go to the gym, you're gonna get a trainer, you're gonna do this. What they'll do, they'll they'll give them prescription drugs, medicine, right? And maybe that will forestall a little bit of their health problems or add a few more years to their life. It's very true, it could, but it certainly will not help as much as a regimen of exercise really would. So let's say now that okay, most people are not like that, but let's say there's somebody, I mean, I was a little bit unusual, but let's say there's somebody that has a somewhat of an interest and is willing to put his little big his big toe into the water and say, I have to do something before I get sick. What would you tell him to do first? He came to you and he says, I'm gonna do it.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I stand behind them, I push them into the pool, into the deep end. You go swim and he makes your go swim. No. No, but I mean that no, that's a great question. I think um I go back to any action is better than inaction. Right. And it doesn't matter how big or how small. Right. Right. For example, when we first started, um we had we'd been plant-based for a long time.
SPEAKER_02Yes. Oh yeah, I was vegan. I know. I know. We're gonna get into that. We're gonna get into that. All the protein stuff.
SPEAKER_00Norman's favorite word, protein. Norman's favorite word of all time. Okay. I've probably I've probably lectured him about protein at least, you know, a thousand times. At least, at least. Oh god. But I mean, when we first met, you were very much plant-based. And again, get used to that routine, right, of being plant-based. Now that's not bad, right? In the past, we've had some success in terms of losing a lot of weight with uh going plant-based. Um, or you why don't why don't you share a little bit about like your your weight loss with the plant-based, right? Oh, yes. What did you start out with the DNA?
SPEAKER_02So I started out when I went through the Dr. John McDougall plant-based program, his uh starch, it was I think he calls it the starch program, but uh it's basically all whole food plant-based foods. I mean, beans, potatoes, vegetables, uh brown rice, all sorts of things like that. And I did lose 25 pounds. I honestly I really, really did. But what happened as soon as the stress level started climbing, uh because I was doing this cabaret show, as you know, the weight kept coming on because it I just was never satisfied enough with the food that I was eating. So, and I didn't know how to resolve that problem. So until you came along and said, okay, have some chicken breast, make sure to have some meat, make sure to have eggs, make sure to cheat, you know, not cheese, but all the sorts of protein stuff. By the way, 145 grams of protein yesterday. Hey, not bad, not bad. By the way, I'm I uh uh Brandon has told me how to uh shown me an app that I'm able to uh you know log in the number of grams of calories and weight and protein and all this stuff.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, it just helps us track and hold us accountable. Tracking is very, very good. But but going back to that, right? When you first came to me, you were very much plant-based. Yes. And it wasn't like that one day of day one where I told you, okay, we need to change everything up. This is how much protein you need, this is what you have to do, this is how you gotta track, this is the app we're going to use, this is no, we didn't even do that until just about maybe one or two months ago, or maybe about a month ago.
SPEAKER_02I fought you in tooth and nail all the time. I fought you.
SPEAKER_00How long have we been working together for?
SPEAKER_02Almost, well, let's say a year and three quarters, maybe a year and a half.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, almost two years.
SPEAKER_02It took me almost two years. Change is difficult. What can I tell you?
SPEAKER_00Yes, exactly. And even for so so my point is even for someone who is already ready to and willing to make the change, it was already difficult, right? And now imagine going back to what you were talking about, if someone wanted to start really starting smaller than you think you you uh you ought to start, right? If my goal is men's uh men's health cover, right? I'm not just going like I like we were talking about, I'm not just gonna wish myself there. What is the one smallest thing I can do today that will get me just a little bit closer to that goal? Maybe it's I'm gonna look at what gyms are in my area, what is available, right? And that's just one small step because you know what? When you look at what gyms are in your area, then you might look at, oh, do they offer personal training? Right. Oh, um, oh, this place is good. Oh, um, oh, I'm interested in their group classes. Oh, this one looks fun. Maybe I'll sign up for one. And then I look at my sketch. And so it leads to just the act of you looking at gyms in your local area, or maybe it's, hey, you know what? After dinner tonight, I'm gonna go on a 10-minute walk. Right. And that's it. And but the point is if we don't do anything at all, then there is we're not building any any momentum. And we're again, we're not proving to ourselves that we're really in it to try and make a change. But if I say, hey, no matter how small, maybe at five minutes, even if it's five minutes a day, and say I get up for a for a walk, or maybe I do a five-minute yoga YouTube video, right? Something easy and accessible. Right. I start there and I build momentum because you know what? That little five minutes proves to me that, hey, this is something that I actually do care enough about that I'm willing to spend five minutes on. Right. And then from there, then you can get a little bit more advanced and say, okay, maybe instead of five minutes, I do 10 minutes. Maybe instead of uh just you know, scoping out the gyms, I actually go. Or maybe it's I find a personal trainer or and and then I commit to a personal training package. Or maybe it's um I I follow someone's exercise program online. I I you know what, like my first step is buying the program, right? Or or even um finding someone that knows more about the gym than I do and talking to them. Like all of those are small steps in which we can take to eventually becoming healthier versions of ourselves, right? But it doesn't start if we don't take those small steps.
SPEAKER_02You have to take the small step. And one thing that you mentioned uh about you know finding the gym and perhaps finding a trainer and things like that, uh you probably know, and we've talked about it many times. I'm taking this personal uh coaching course and learning how to become a personal coach. And one of the things uh that we talk about in the class about change is that if you want to find a way to make a change, oftentimes it's better to have to have somebody else also be accountable for what you're doing. You have to be accountable too, but if you're doing it with somebody else or paying somebody else, right? Yeah, that's your accountability factor because without it, the amount of times that I know, I remember how many times I skipped going to the gym. Oh, God, I 6 a.m. in the morning, oh, I'm not gonna do 7 a.m. Well, you gotta be nuts. I'm not gonna get in the subway at this hour. But if you're accountable to the fact that you've already prepaid for those lessons, and if you're not there, you're gonna get charged for it anyway. That is a really important factor. Not to mention the fact that it's fun to do it with somebody else.
SPEAKER_00Oh, 100% norm. There's there's a lot of research behind even just the effects of working out in groups. Groups, yeah. Right? There's something to be said, like, for example, if I were working out, excuse me, um, if I were working out with a bunch of my friends, I'm gonna put all the weight on the bar as I want because I there's an ego component to it. There's there's all of that. Okay, we'll we won't talk about ego lifting and and all of that. We won't get into that, but basically when there are other people, we we are social beings, right? When there are other people at stake, other people's time, other people's money, or things on the table, right? We we are not just we are not just showing up for ourselves. It's very hard to already enough, it's already hard enough to show up for ourselves. Right. Right. But now when we have other people to show up for and to hold us accountable, now we have that support system and we've created an environment that again forces us to really desire change, right? And and and seek change. So that's why, you know, early on when when we first started talking about nutrition and all those things, I asked, Hey, does your wife know about you know what you're trying to do? Uh of you're trying to lose weight and um because she's keeping all this, you know, really good food around, snacks and all these things. Yeah. And um you you told me no. And I said, Well, you know, she's buying all of this, all these snacks and all these things, but she doesn't know that you're trying to lose weight. So how do you think like that is helping you and your goals, right? And so maybe uh it can be like sharing with your partner of, hey, listen, I have this big goal um that I'm trying to accomplish, right? And when you speak it to someone else, that goal all of a sudden becomes real because now they know, like, oh, this is what they expect of you to achieve, right? Right. And then so they understand too that, hey, I'm going to make decisions based on trying that I'm going to make decisions that will help me get closer to that goal. And if that means that, hey, if you're buying all this food, like I'm not gonna eat it, right? Or maybe it's hey, you can help me out by not buying this food and keeping it around the house, because then that'll help me get closer to my goal. And then that'll also maybe help us as a household be a little bit healthier, right? And having conversations like that, I think is also really important because now, again, you prove to yourself my goal is real, right? Right when I start speaking it to other people. And again, you you use that because no one wants to let other people down, you use that as a sense of uh accountability.
SPEAKER_02Absolutely, absolutely. And you know, just interestingly enough, yesterday I had a a minor, minor, not an argument, but I went to the store to get you know some uh grilled chicken breast. I got killed for that one because we had leftovers from Friday night dinner, which was chicken as well. But I preferred the you know, grilled chicken breast. It was better. So I got into a little bit of a problem there. But whatever. She's a very understanding that I am on a diet. And uh actually she's gonna go on one soon too. So it's it's really, really good.
SPEAKER_00And that's what I mean. Like you you can it doesn't why do we have to fight each other about uh trying to live a healthier life? Like let's Build an environment together of how can we best help each other and create a household, create an environment around us that best sets us up for success and gets us towards where we want to go.
SPEAKER_02That's really, really super important. And one thing I wanted to mention that uh you know, you do better when you're with a group of people or with when you're with friends. I never believed the um I I I've done several marathons. I've actually 11 half marathons, and I did the New York City marathon as well. But I remember when I was first training, um they said, okay, well, don't worry about your your speed right now, you know. You'll you'll set a record when you're actually at the marathon. And because what happens is that when you're running with 25,000 people, and oftentimes I did, yeah, right? The adrenaline and the the effect of having so many people running with you is infectious. It's like, oh, I've got to do that too. I've got to do that, I've got to go faster. And I did go much faster at the actual marathons than when I was training by myself.
SPEAKER_00100%. I mean, you're gonna look across to your left, and Norm, you are 70, but I'm sure you weren't the oldest person running that marathon. I'm sure there is some other 80-year-old psychopath that was like, hey, you know what? I just run marathons for fun. And and you look over and little old Sally's 80 years old and she's about to pass you. You're not gonna let little Sally pass you. No way.
SPEAKER_02No. It's interesting though. Uh yes, I didn't let her pass me, but I was able to finish the race. My my speed or whatever was better than a lot of people half my age. It was crazy. Yeah. Really, really crazy. Because I trained, I followed the training regimen and I did it exactly.
SPEAKER_00But but but to your point, right? Um, the effect of having those people around you, you're seeing people pass you, you're passing people, right? There's an effect there of, man, we are all in this together. Like I need a push through, I need to finish. It's almost as if I you might not know any of these people, but it's like I can't let these people down.
SPEAKER_02Right, right, exactly. Yeah. And it's also interesting, a lot of the apartment buildings here in Manhattan or in any big city, they have gyms in the in the buildings. But most of the time, they're empty. Most of the time they're empty because who's who's I who am I gonna do it with? Unless there's a whole group of people that you're doing with, or if you have you know somebody to train with, you're not gonna do it anyway. You're not gonna go by yourself.
SPEAKER_00And you know what, to be fair, right? Um, and and to to cut some slack, I mean the the gym can be a very intimidating environment for someone who has never weight trained before. Because you walk in and you look at all these dumbbells, all these exercise equipment, and you're like, well, what do I do? Yeah. And and if you've never had a coach and you've never had a f or a friend who has taught you how to use the equipment or how to lift weights properly and not hurt yourself, it's very intimidating. Yeah. And so there is a barrier of entry, but I think, I mean, and this this kind of goes back to maybe our physical education system growing up or um other systemic, like why why is it that we don't know how to take care of ourselves, right? As a as a whole, as a society, right? Maybe we don't need to have the knowledge of a personal trainer or a strength coach, but at least I should know when I walk into a gym, maybe one or two things I can do. Or like a yeah, I think I think now it's getting better because people have social media and access to social media, and people can see on social media, and a lot of coaches post on social media about, oh, this is this is how you do this exercise. This is what you can do to uh for your legs, uh, for your arms, for your core, yeah, or whatever it is. Whatever it is. I mean, I mean, there's so much information now on the internet that I think it it has made the barrier of entry a lot lower, but now it's also almost information overload, um, at least with my generation. Way overload.
SPEAKER_02Well, my generation, you know what happens? Um people my age, or especially me. I'll talk about myself. Yeah, yeah. When I look at those damn videos, right? All these super fit fitness gurus that are better looking than Brad Pitt when he was 25, right? Yeah. Well, I don't know any of the common people that but but you you you say, I can never be like that. I I'm not gonna be like Arnie Schwarzenegger. I I just can't. Who's gonna do it? So you get defeated before you even begin because you know I'm 50 pounds. Well, I'm not 50 pounds overweight now, but people who are 50 pounds overweight, they're gonna say, What the f what the fuck? You know, I can't do this. I can't do dirty push-ups, I can't do pull-ups, I can't do this. I they've never done it and they don't even want to do it. So what do you think about you know all these things? Watching these videos for somebody in their older years, how is that going to be helpful?
SPEAKER_00And I I mean, uh and I think you also have to realize that you are looking at a glimpse of a person's life, right? You are seeing someone. Imagine you're um, I'm gonna use a video game analogy. You play video games. I don't play video games. You've played video games, I've played the old-fashioned one. Okay, okay. So, so maybe, maybe, maybe this analogy is um won't won't won't hit home, but but okay, let's say, let's say you were in a martial arts class, right? I had just started jujitsu, so this is a fresh of mine. So you're in a you're in you're at your jujitsu class, and it is your first day, and you are a white belt. You've never done it before. Yeah. And all of a sudden, the black belt comes and just doesn't teach you anything and just beats you up. And you don't know anything, you don't even know what what to do. This was this was me last week, because I I just started Brazilian Jiu Jitsu last week.
SPEAKER_01Right.
SPEAKER_00And I went in and look, but luckily I um there it was a smaller class, and so they were very individualized. And so, and I had a friend going with me, so he and he was very patient and he taught me some things, and then they we drilled some basic drills, and so I actually knew a couple things, and everything was moving very slowly, so it wasn't it, I didn't feel like oh, I was getting I was getting beat up just to get beat up, right, by this black belt, right? There was an entry point for me. But when you look online, right, and you're looking at you're looking at black belts online as a complete white belt that has never stepped into the mat. And you don't even know what your entry point is. And another thing uh to think about is you when you're online again, you don't know this person's full story, right? They were these people were once a white belt, just as yourself, right? They had to there was one no one is born, oh, I like I'm born and I'm Arnold Schwarzenegger, right? Even Arnold Schwarzenegger, there was a point in his life in which he decided I'm going to lift weights, right? And there was a point in which it was his first time ever lifting weights, and eventually that was the impetus that led him to become Arnold Schwarzenegger.
SPEAKER_02Right. And he did it five or six hours per day, every day for like 20 years.
SPEAKER_00But but that was again, that was when he became a black belt. That was later on in his but at the beginning at the beginning, it was just okay. It didn't start, it didn't start like that. In the beginning, you know, he was looking at bodybuilding magazines and he was getting all this inspiration, and he started doing push-ups and sit-ups and all of those things. But the the point is, is when you look online, you it's very easy to become disheartened because and and just say, oh, you know what, fuck this. I'm not gonna do this because you know, how am I ever gonna get to that level? But again, you're looking at someone's level 100, right? You're not even on level one yet, you're at level zero. Right. So you cannot compare yourself to that person. And just remind yourself that at one point in time, that person was exactly where you are. Where you are. But the reason why they are there and you're not is because they decided, oh, you know what, I'm gonna try. And I'm gonna go to level one, I'm gonna go to level two, then I'm gonna go to level three. Um, but I also do want to add too that just be careful of what you see online too, because you don't know who's taking what drugs you and and who's right um actually, you know, doing it naturally. And so, you know, you can it can get kind of muddy there. Um we don't need to get into that. But just just we want to also be careful in terms of, yeah, again, take it with a grain of salt. Again, you're looking at people, uh you're looking at a glimpse of a person's life. Right. That is not exact that you don't know everything about them.
SPEAKER_02You're inspiring me. You know what would be great for the internet now? What somebody my age just starting off putting together videos of how to get fit for the average guy, not this super fit fitness guru that looks like a movie star, right? But somebody who's a little bit has a little bit of extra fat on them, not that muscular, older, not the greatest good-looking person in the world either, but somebody normal who people can say to themselves, oh, if that guy can do five push-ups, maybe I can too. Because you can't start with 50 push-ups. You can't. There was a time when I wanted to do handstands. I still do, by the way, we've got to incorporate that into our work. Yeah, we will. We will. I want to really perfect a handstand, but whenever I look online to the trainers that are working with, you know, handstand, you know, uh, I don't know, videos, they're incredibly fit. They they they don't have a an ounce of fat on their body, and they can do almost anything. Well, I can't do those poses. I I just can't do that.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, for sure. I I think also, you know, we um you know, going back to what I was talking about, right? Like you're comparing your level one to a person's level 100. Right, right, right, yeah, you can't do that. And well, what you were talking about of like having someone normal and showing you like, okay, as an average Joe, this is this is how you uh start working out, this is what exercises you can do. Norm, there's already people doing that online, right? It it's a you have to be on the right, again, right side of the, I don't know, like in quotations, right side of the internet. Um, but there are people doing that online, right? I know a lot of coaches, I'm I'm I'm obviously a personal trainer and a strength coach, so I know other coaches in the space that do put out content surrounding, okay, how do I help, you know, men over 35, right? One of my mentors, his his online business and what he does is helping men over 35 reclaim their health and fitness. And it's just average Joes, you know, people that work people that work normal jobs aren't celebrities, aren't athletes, aren't these people that already have crazy physiques. Again, normal Joe Schmo, but um showing them, okay, this is how you progress into exercise, this is how we build a program. Um so, yes, there are people already doing that.
SPEAKER_02They do that defined. They themselves are already totally fit. They don't have the unfit, kind of like a little bit fat people on their videos doing five push-ups, struggling to do five push-ups. They show you, oh, this is how you do a push-up, and this is for somebody who's over 35, over 40. There's a fit father project on online. All right. Yeah. The guy looks like a movie star. Yeah. How am I gonna that's not for me? Yeah, right. Yeah. He he talks really, really, really well. And his videos, I'm sure I've seen a few, are excellent. Except, I'll never look like that guy, I'll never be able to do the things that that guy does. Show me a guy who's 50 years old, who's just starting out. Here's what you can do.
SPEAKER_00And you you know what? The and here's a big issue within the the fitness industry and content and social media and all those things is that when you're scrolling on social media, right, everything is taken for face value. Right. Right. So, you know, to say that looks don't matter would be a lie. Because again, for face value, it's hey, this person is very fit, he has a six-pack, he looks exactly like who I want to look like. Right. He must know what he's talking about. Yeah, this person who isn't fit and he's trying to give fitness advice. Well, you don't even look like you follow your own advice. So how am I why am I going to listen to you? So, and and that's why there are a lot of videos that blow up that are of transformations of oh, look, this person couldn't even do you know five push-ups, right? And now he's doing a hundred, or this person was super overweight, and now he's on the stage of a bodybuilding show. And there are a lot of these videos out there, but it's and and and I've also seen stuff about like people documenting their journey, but until they do it, dude. That's a different story. That's a different story. It's just like I, you know, I saw something online that said, Um, when you first set out to start a business, when you first set out to, you know, uh start exercising, and oh, I'm going to get a six-pack or I'm going to go accomplish this big goal, no matter what it is. Yeah, you're going to look like a fool to everyone around you because they know a version of you that is, oh, what do you mean? You're gonna go do this crazy, ambitious, adventurous thing. That's not you. Like, that's not the person I know. And so they're going to you're going to seem like a fool, and that's normal until you do it. Then everyone else becomes the fool. Finally says, Oh, yeah, I saw that from um Alex Hermozzi. He's he's someone that I I really like to follow. I gotta give credit where it's due. But but um uh like uh again, you can post your journey of oh, every day I'm working out, right? And if you don't look fit and you don't look um, if you don't already look like a super athlete, you post your stuff out there. Maybe no one watches it because they're just like, oh, you know, this is who like this this guy's trying to get fit, but he's not even fit. Um and he's not he's trying to teach people how to like get fit while he's going through it himself. He doesn't know what he's talking about. So no one's no one's going to tune into that until that person gets fit and all of a sudden, oh my god, his system works, right? Unfortunately, that's that's social media, right? Everything is taking that face value. Now, I have seen a lot of content though that is of people documenting their journeys, and sometimes it is very inspirational, right? And I think that's a great thing, right? Because it is, hey, this person is extremely overweight and he's still currently overweight, but you know what? He's already you know lost 10 pounds, right? Or hey, like he's going to the gym, he's showing up, he's showing like what he's doing at the gym, like, and and this is inspired me to go to the gym. And that and that's great too.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, yeah, we need a lot more of that stuff. A lot, a lot more of the stuff. Now, speaking about inspiration, what would you what would you suggest to somebody who's about to retire? And they do they do have some inclination to want to get started. Do you say, okay, you've got to do yoga, you've got to do walking, you've got to do weight training. What program, not necessarily all weight training, but what program would you say they would be good for most people? Or does it differ from person to person depending upon their natural capabilities?
SPEAKER_00So this will be a little bit more convoluted because every person's a little different and what they're inclined towards might be a little different. Right. But right, I would say again, if it's someone that has never done anything before, start small, start smaller than you think, and make it as easy as possible. Right. Because what ultimately is most important is consistency. And you can't build consistency if if you start and the pro the process is extremely hard, inconvenient for you, and inconvenient for you. Right. Yeah. Just like just like when when we first started, right? When going back to what we were talking about, the nutrition thing, right? Cleaning up what we eat, or or just just knowing what what to eat and what what what are the better things we should look for. That was a full year-long process of just, hey, norm, we need to eat more protein.
SPEAKER_02It was a little bit difficult. Yeah, we need to eat more protein.
SPEAKER_00And and we have all these hesitations. But now it's like, oh, we've we've opened up our options. We see how easy it can be getting your protein in. Yeah. And those things. But why I'm sorry to interrupt. Go ahead. No, I was just gonna say, but for for a person who is, you know, just just about retiring and wants to start, doesn't know where to start, and is coming completely coming completely from scratch, man, I would say start by walking. It can be as easy as walking. Maybe I set uh I make a I I schedule it. Three times a week, I go on a 30-minute walk. Right now, that might not, that might not hit what is recommended, but what is recommended doesn't mean it is what is most uh what will be most effective for me. Because what is most effective for me is ultimately something that I can continue continue doing for the rest of my life, every day as if nothing had changed. We need to treat exercise, our health and wellness um as if it were personal hygiene. When I wake up in the morning, I don't forget to brush my teeth. When I go when I go to bed, I don't forget to brush my teeth. So why is it that I can't treat, hey, you know what? Every Tuesday at um at 5 p.m. when I get off work, uh, I walk home. Well, we live in New York City, so it's a rather walkable city. Um well, it's rather walkable, you can walk to the subway, right? Or I'm going to walk to the next stop and then take the subway, right? You can there are many ways in which we can build it in, but we have to be very intentional. Um, but the point is we always want to start smaller than um than we think. And another thing is do what interests you, right? If you don't want to do yoga and you keep signing yourself up for yoga classes, you're not gonna have much inclination to want to show up or or continue doing it because if it takes so much out of if it takes so much energy just to get you up to go do yoga, it's going to be really hard to keep sustaining it. But if you have a very positive experience, say you tried your first yoga class and it was great, oh my God, then it's like, oh, this makes it easier, or you you you have a group of friends that go to yoga, right? So do things that are the most accessible for you and that you feel you're most inclined and interested in learning about. If you want to do strength training, do strength training. But the point is if you're just starting, you just have to start. Start somewhere. And then from there we can get into the specifics, right? Right. Of oh, 150 minutes of moderate, moderate intensity uh exercise or cardiovascular exercise per week, right? Uh 90 minutes of more intensive exercise per week. That's like current recommendations. But we can't get to 150 minutes or 90 minutes if we can't start with 30 minutes. Right. Right? How are we going to get there? So we have to be realistic. We need to first be consistent. Right. And making it easy and convenient and doing things that interest us, that will help make it make the the start much easier. Right, very interesting.
SPEAKER_02Now, one of the things that we've brushed on, and I agree, you have to you definitely have to be consistent and you definitely have to have something that you're interested in. But we've brushed upon the topic of protein over and over and over again without delving into the whys and especially for older men, what is what on earth is going on? Why is it so necessary? What is it about not necessarily just men, but what is it that as you get older, why do we need so much more protein? Why do we need weight training exercises? What is it that's you know, everywhere is everybody's saying, okay, men, especially as they get older, they're going to have to do some weight training, they're gonna have to eat more protein. Can we discuss that a little bit?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah, 100%. So there's a lot of research that has now come out about you know things like sarcopenia, osteopenia, osteoporosis, but like loss of bone mineral density and loss of muscle mass. Uh-huh. Right. Once we get up to around um, I think it's our mid-30s, we start to everything becomes a steady plateau and decline as we age. If we don't do something about it, if we don't strength train if we're not eating enough protein. Right. Right. And so, uh especially for older men, um, if we don't strength train and we don't eat enough protein, protein is the building blocks. Uh proteins are amino acids, and those those are the building blocks of all of our tissues, right? From our fingernails to our hair to our skin, our connective tissue, and also our muscle. If we're not eating enough protein, then it's going to be very hard for those tissues to regenerate. And also if we know that once we hit the third decade, about the mid-third day third, the midpoint of our third decade of life, muscle mass, bone loss, the c uh start or bone mineral density starts to decline as we age, then it it tells us, like, oh, okay, so if I am older, right, and I'm already losing uh I'm more inclined to be losing muscle mass, I'm more inclined to be losing bone mineral density, well then I probably need to eat uh more protein, a lot more protein, and also uh do some strength training, right? Um strength training isn't just for us to build muscle, it's for us to also, you know, prevent fractures, falls, things of that nature. And then to also build our bones and our connected tissue, right? So we can't think of uh strength training and movement as just uh, oh, I'm trying to look like Arnold Schwarzenegger. No, it's not, it's not that. It's about how can I live a long, fulfilling life. And in terms of protein intake, there's even research now. Now you asked about why. I'm not a hundred percent. Sure on why. There's some early research now that is suggesting that as we age, and especially for older adults, we need even more protein than uh when we are younger. Maybe it's the ability to utilize protein to build muscle and to repair muscle, is why we need more when we are older, because maybe it's uh when we are older, our bodies are less able to use protein to build muscle. I'm not sure. I haven't delved I haven't dove deeply onto like the the um protein intake for aging adults. Yeah, the why, but I just know that regardless of what age you are, um protein is very important, and I think protein is extremely important, especially for older because of sarcopenia, the loss of muscle mass as we age, um and and those factors to to prevent though the further uh loss of muscle mass. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_02Now it's interesting as we get older, there's so many things that we didn't consider when we were much younger that just, you know, if you're not careful, what's going to happen is that you may not eat the right foods, you certainly may not get enough protein, you may not get enough exercise, uh, you may have too much stress as you get older as well, because physical exercise also helps with the stress levels that you're going to ultimately find, you know, it's all around us all the time, especially living here. But there's so many things that you have to take care of that unless somebody is really interested in being healthy and getting fit and having a normal weight, you know, not being way overweight like so many people here are, um, it's going to be very difficult for them to lead healthy, healthy lives into their later years, let's say 70s and 80s. But would you say it's correct that if you get started when you're in your late 50s, even if you've never done it before, you get started in your late 50s, early 60s, and go on a specific program of taking care of yourself, making sure that your priority, you know, instead of all the other responsibilities, kids, grandkids, wife, family, this, that, and the other thing. If you take care of yourself, you'll be able to have, in general, a much healthier, older age. That's probably correct.
SPEAKER_00It's it's very much so. I I think there's uh there's an adage that I really like. The best time to start is yesterday. Right. And and so the and I and you've also heard me say this before. You only need to get fit once in your life. Because if you can get fit once in your life, and you say, I'm going to give up the next year, two years, the next even six to eight months to uh achieving this goal, again, I'm giving up a year of my time and some discomfort for the rest of my life, right? Because within that year, within those six months, within those two years, whatever the time frame, right? If you can get fit in that timeline, you would have had developed the habits and the lifestyle and also the knowledge to understand how to then maintain it for the rest of your life. That's why I say you only really need to get fit once in your life, right? Because if you can get fit once in your life, then you understand, okay, these are the things that I need to eat when I uh uh to get me on track. These are the uh this is the lifestyle I need to live, this is these are the workouts I need to uh be doing, uh, this is what I need to um build muscle, this is the habits I need to have uh and incorporate in my life, right? So but that doesn't happen if you just don't make that sacrifice of, hey, you know what, I'm gonna take these next this next year, next two years, whatever, and just um and try to get myself in in better shape. Again, th think about it this way like, yeah, it's uncomfortable, but again, you're giving up maybe a year, two years, and you're giving up a a year or two years of your life for the rest of your life, right? And so even if you're 50, even if you're 60, right, even if you're 70, just start. It it it's never too late to start. If you just start, there and there's research that even shows that um even amongst uh the uh older people, um, senior citizens, when they e when they've never, even when they've never done ex an exercise program before, upon initial starting, all of a sudden muscle mass improves, uh bone mineral density improves, right? There's some research that's that suggests that um that I've seen as well. And so it doesn't matter what age you are, you just have to start.
SPEAKER_02Right. And I think we'll end there. I think I think that's gonna be great, Brandon, because just getting started on any physical fitness routine, diet routine, making sure that you take yourself, your take your health as a priority, that's so, so important. And one thing that you told me as we as we end this conversation, it's much better to suffer, not suffer, but much better to have the discomfort or uncomfort uh or being uncomfortable with working out and all those crazy exercises that you make me do, especially those stretches. I'd rather have that being uncomfortable with those than uncomfortable under a surgeon's knife and really, really sick. It's much better spending the money, taking care of yourself now, and not having to suffer later on. Hopefully, not having to suffer later.
SPEAKER_00It comes it comes down to chosen suffering. What are you what are you going to choose to suffer? We cannot we cannot avoid suffering in this life. Life is unfortunately filled with suffering, right? But we can choose how we suffer, right? Right, who we suffer with, how long we suffer for. So for me, it it's really simple. Would you rather suffer going to the gym every day, going on walks, eating well, right, and doing these uncomfortable things, or would you rather suffer not doing those things and then later on having to suffer paying all this money for medication, um surgery, um disability, right? And those and those aspects. So what what is it are you willing to prefer? Yeah, what do you think? What do you prefer? What are you willing to suffer?
SPEAKER_02That's that's the key to suffer. That's the key there. So uh this has been really, really great. Thank you once again, Brendan. I really appreciate it. One thing that I'd like you to tell everybody, how do they reach you? If they wanted to train with you, if they wanted to find out more about you, where would they go?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, so I'm primarily most active on Instagram. My Instagram handle is at just bechoo, J-U-S-T-B-C-H-U. Um, and if anyone wants to reach out, um you can just shoot me a DM there. Um I'm not really on any other social media platforms. Uh but Instagram is, yeah, I would say is probably the easiest way to reach me. Yeah, and it's a great site.
SPEAKER_02So uh thank you very much for being here, and uh, I'll see you tomorrow once again at the gym.
SPEAKER_00Back at the gym tomorrow, Norm. All righty. Thanks, Brandon. All right, thanks, Norm.
