Hey did you know Harlequin Romance makes teen novels? Neither did we! Thankfully (thankfully?) Margie found a real winner to tell Rachel ALL about! Tune in as Margie tells Rachel all about Elizabeth Craft and Shea Olsen's Flower.
Hey did you know Harlequin Romance makes teen novels? Neither did we! Thankfully (thankfully?) Margie found a real winner to tell Rachel ALL about! Tune in as Margie tells Rachel all about Elizabeth Craft and Shea Olsen's Flower.
Hello, and welcome to textual tension. Every other week, I, Rachel jump in here and keep you guys up to date on what's going on in our little world. This time. I'm here with Betsy in my lap say Hi, Betsy. She's shy today. And Zack sitting next to me say hi, Zachary. And I got a lot to go through y'all. And I even like, like, so much that I made a list. So let's knock this out so we can get you guys on to the awesome episode. First off, we have a new patron. Hey, Tiffany, I love you. Is that too much? Too bad. I said it is out there. I love you. And you're wonderful. And thank you so much for supporting us, we really, really appreciate it. And if you guys are interested in supporting us, you can check us out on Patreon. At patreon.com/textual tension, you can't search for us. But we're there we promise, you just got to go to the URL. And hey, not all of us can have the expendable income to support some of our favorite creators. And that's okay, and if you can't totally find but one thing that would really help us is given us maybe a little bit of a review, or maybe sharing us with your buddies, that will be amazing. And we already love you. But we'd love you more. Almost as much as I love know, as much as I love Tiffany. Um, what's next on my list? Oh, hey, yeah. And if you do support us in the next like, I don't know, month or so of episodes, fair warning, I am going on vacation. So I am not going to be here. Well, I'm doing a bunch of these in advance. So I won't necessarily be able to call you out on the next episode after you support us on Patreon. But I will get to you as quickly as I can and read as soon as I get back from vacation. So I swear, we don't love you any less. We didn't forget about you if you decide to support us. I just won't be around to do it. But don't worry, you will get a cool shout out I swear Hey, social media is the next thing on my list. Cool. So in addition to Patreon, we are on all of the Twitter grams and face. Bob's I don't know, check us out at textual tension pod across the board including textual tension pod.com. And our email at textual tension pod@gmail.com. Hit us up, reach out to us. We'd love to hear from you guys. And sometimes we talk back actually, we almost always talk back because we like you. So hit us up. And something that actually came out of someone reaching out to us and being super cool. I just want to give a quick shout out to a really neat local podcast that is going to be coming up soon. The cold storage podcast it's a really neat new narrative podcast is coming out and it is local to Dayton so if you want to support something that's local to my heart, personally, check them out the Kickstarter goes live on March 11. And you can find them on the Instagram at cold storage underscore podcast. You should check them out. I'm super excited about it. And I can't wait. Two more things on my list. We got it guys. Come on, hang in there. First off under the covers for this one. If you are a patron, it's gonna be a little different. Because we couldn't do one. And that's okay. Instead, we reached out to a professional so if you're interested in hearing what an actual professionals opinions are on these characters after you've listened to this episode, hey, check that out. Be really cool. And it's a really good one guys, like really good. I listened to it because I wasn't actually there for it. And oh my god, it's amazing. So totally check that out. And lastly, triggers. Remember how I said we're doing a lot of these in advance a boy I hope I'm hitting all these because I think Margie missed a couple of them. So we have death violence, stalking and mental health issues. So bingo, not great. But I just want to make sure we heal those and God I hope I got them all. So thank you guys so much for hanging in there. It was a lot to get through and we did it together. You guys are great. And I suppose without further ado, please enjoy episode A 39 The language of purple flowers tearing me apart from
Margie:Hello, and welcome to textual tension. love hate relationship with romance novels. I'm your co host Margie, and I'm your co host Rachel. Every other week one of us reads and summarizes a romance novel for the other unsuspecting co host. And together we unpack
Rachel:what the fuck
Margie:just happened. So Margie, this book was shouted out to us by Olivia one of our patrons. Yeah, yeah. So thank you, Olivia. She wanted to see our reaction to it and Olivia. Oh boy. I have many feelings, damn feelings. And I don't think I could talk to you about them at all until I just hand the book over to you. Oh, so that is what I'm going to do. But thank you, Olivia. Oh, god, okay, okay, okay,
Rachel:we're gonna get right into this. Yeah, we're
Margie:gonna crack right into this. Oh, good lord. And
Rachel:flowers flower. Okay. Ah. The subtitle concerns me.
Margie:Oh, just wait. Okay. All right. So
Rachel:this is by Elizabeth Kraft and Shea Olsen and I will now only say was Elizabeth Olsen isn't one of the Olsen twins.
Margie:No, not the twins. She's the older sister. There's Elizabeth Olsen married. Yeah,
Rachel:come on. Sorry. Of course.
Margie:I'm sure Scarlet Witch. She's a badass.
Rachel:I mean, true. Yeah. Okay, so this cover is like actually really Blaine?
Margie:Yes. It is very plain. It hides the darkness within
Rachel:Yeah, I see that. So it's a blue cover and it has the word flower. And it looks like so the the word flower was originally in white but the F the W and the R are like lifting up and the L O and E are like coming down into behind out Yeah, like cut out and like punched out. And behind it are
Margie:flowers purple roses flowers. Are they roses? Yes. They should be
Rachel:look like violets actually.
Margie:Plot and lose purple roses.
Rachel:Sorry flower. She had a plan then she met him and I hate that
Unknown:I hate that so much.
Margie:It's oh and that there is a little bit of text on the back for the book that you could read the inside cover that's it was my plan
Unknown:Oh, okay.
Rachel:All right. It's Friday night Charlotte. Go out with me. There are countless reasons to say no my mother's past my sister's present my future one date he continues his voice low almost hypnotic. Say yes. What do you have to lose everything? I think I hate this. I
Margie:know. I hate that. Look at the bottom. What does it say on the bottom? Yes, yes. This is why Olivia reached out to us.
Rachel:Listeners I did not know this existed. listeners. This is a harlequin teen book. Yeah.
Margie:It shouldn't be.
Rachel:Is this Harlequin? Romance is like Anthony I'm sure why a Yeah. Is it why is there six in it?
Margie:There is no sex. Okay. There is no sex. So it is why it is why but but so the leads are 18 to 19. So it would have been legal. Yeah. And okay for them to have sex and they do. They get steamy? Yeah, get steamy.
Rachel:I hate this.
Margie:Oh, yeah.
Unknown:I hate it. Alright,
Margie:Ruby. Okay.
Rachel:This was almost a $20 book.
Margie:I got it from the library. Thank God. I mean, yeah.
Rachel:Oh, good. Yeah. Just jumped in this episode. Not a bad thing. No, it's just refreshing and different. Yeah, we're here. Yeah, cuz especially since the last one. We had like 20 minutes of us bullshitting with, uh, with our wonderful trigger. Bingo.
Margie:Oh, right. Yeah. Oh, they're still triggers on this.
Rachel:Oh, good. Okay, we'll get to that now. So yeah, okay. All right. Are we ready? These are the things that I've always wanted to get the top grades in my class, to make my grandmother proud. And most of all proof that I could succeed where the rest of my family had not a Stanford acceptance letter. early admission. My mother and my sister we're obsessed with boys and love and sex are so obsessed that they lost sight of their futures of what they wanted. And in the end, they lost everything. I'll never let a boy distract me. I promised myself that. That was before tape date. taint from now on, before the biggest pop star on the planet took an interest in me. Before private planes and secret dates and lyrics meant for me alone. There's so much I don't know like why he left music. Where he goes when we're not together. What dark past he's hiding. But when we kiss the future feels far away. And now I'm not sure what I want. I didn't know I hate this more.
Margie:Oh, you will? Oh, I will need the bar.
Unknown:Gee, no. Oh, no.
Margie:Don't say that to be say that to Olivia. Olivia. Olivia. We love you though. No, it's fine. That's fine. I live. My best friend's name is Olivia. So
Unknown:I do Still
Rachel:I don't know how I feel about the fact that Harlequin teen romance novels exist. I mean, I
Margie:feel terrible about surprise because like I read a lot of teen like YA novel, young I mean, they're not far off the mark from what this is not far off the mark from what I was reading. It's just the the category of putting it into Harlequin at all right? Instead of just doing calling it a accompany. Yeah, yeah. So Harlequin is Carla Quinn or Harley Quinn, Harley Quinn. So um, Harley Quinn, Harley Quinn is a company that produces mostly romance novels, as far as I'm aware. So this is like their sub is Harlequin teen.
Rachel:They could have come up with a better name.
Margie:They could have come up with any literally anything about
Rachel:young adult. Oh, and I feel like they could have like, they didn't have to put Harlequin in there. No, they should not distance themselves from your life. Right? Because that Harlequin itself has like not a great reputation doesn't know well. Why would you market that towards teens?
Margie:Why would you market this? So here's the thing. Here's the thing about this book, this book is severely damaging. These are the books that me and Rachel have talked about of like, Oh, we don't want people social justice. Social. We don't want so one of the reasons why we started this podcast beyond just being a comedy podcast is that we want to expose the behavior that is unhealthy. Yes. Horrible. Yes. And somebody very young reading this thinking that this is an okay, romance is gonna get a really distorted view so that somebody can take advantage of them. Also, I rewatch surviving our Kelly this week, and I was just social justice rant. Yes. So um, that's my big concern with this book. Is that
Rachel:good? And sarcastic? Good? Yeah. Is
Margie:that Oh, young girls reading this are gonna think it's okay. And it's not and I am waving the book in the air. Like,
Rachel:Oh, I'm so ready. Right? I swear this dumpster fire. Oh,
Margie:yeah. Okay, so Margie did the thing again, where she wrote two thirds of the notes and then stop. Great. Good. But I read the whole book. I need triggers, though. Oh, triggers I'm sorry. Trigger. Triggers are very obsessive behavior, very controlling behavior on the borderline of like stalking. Cool. Good. Yeah, surprisingly, you'll probably be like, No, that's stalking but like, cuz I read it right. Next. Let's see. What else
Rachel:do you think it's interesting that that kind of speaks to how hard like, when you read it, you're like, Well, maybe it's that and then when you tell like
Margie:somebody else they're like,
Rachel:yeah, it's that Yeah,
Margie:I had a conversation with my my other friend last night and she was telling me about this creepy guy at work. And I was like, You need to report this HR but because she's in the middle of it. It's hard to see when you're in the middle of Right exactly. And I was like, No, this is really good. I was telling her make sure you take pictures of those messages and she's like, I don't think I need to do that and what do you do you do anyway so
Rachel:All right, y'all strapped in for social justice insanity. Okay. Wait so is that it just
Margie:started really stalking the I we can always come back that's what I recall. Because it is like like I said, there's no assault thankfully. Oh, there is some violence at the end. I'm sorry. Okay, some girl on girl kept like violence.
Rachel:It's gonna be like, like, is Rachel's feminism brain going to just die? getting that vibe.
Margie:Well, guess we're gonna find out in the believer vibe. Oh, Jesus believer. Yeah. Oh, you should be feeling that. I
Rachel:feel for sure. Awesome.
Margie:I believe I could fly. Okay. Hashtag our Kelly. Oh, I believe I could die. Okay, so we got we got Charlotte, who is an 18 year old high school senior. She is She's smart. She's perfect grades. She's pretty. She's sweet. There's not a lot of descriptions do I think she has curly hair? I think she has green eye.
Rachel:She's a MC MC teen. Yeah, she's
Margie:exactly right. Her grandmother who's raising her. Her grandmother. She had law words or hard words or her. Charlotte has a grandmother who is raising her along with her older sister Mia who has a suddenly Oh, okay. Yeah, so it's four people in the house. Charlotte is determined not to make the same mistakes as her mother's last slash sister. Fall in love, get pregnant and have everything fall apart. Charlotte and Mia's mom
Rachel:falling in love and getting pregnant doesn't have to mean everything falls apart. But sure, but also falling
Margie:in love doesn't mean everything. Bad thing exactly. So I'm Charlotte and Mia's mother was kind of always going after another guy she was very young when she got pregnant with Sharla Mia they twins they're not twins me as older by just like by a year or two years maybe. And so she got pregnant very young. Some dating guys, one night got I think high and drunk and literally her boyfriend RAM to them into a concrete wall. And they backed. Oh, good. So her mother's dead. Okay, yeah, great. Um, this book is also I said, I have though, this book is a goddamn stereotype. Charlotte's best friend of high school is a gay boy named Carlos, who was always trying to get her to go out with him.
Rachel:You cannot convince me. It's not my cat in human form.
Margie:Yes, there you go. cause danger, Carlos Danger. I think he does have dark curly hair. Perfect. Done. Afterwards, Charlotte works in a flower shop. And one day, a guy comes in and she's like, so she's in the flower shop. She's doing her thing. You know, she's like, she's playing her music, I think on either her speakers or headphones. And she's kind of dancing while she's putting together flower arrangements. Honestly, I do the same thing. Like when you're working you're just trying to make things a little more normal human thing, right? And this guy comes in comes in and he said he's, she's caught off guard cuz she's like a little embarrassed that he caught her dancing. And guy says he wants flowers. He introduces himself as Tate and asks her what her flight favorite flowers are.
Rachel:taint Tate? No, it's taint. Oh, it's tape. Right? It's stain.
Margie:She says purple roses, any orders? A dozen of them to be delivered. I can't remember if he takes. No, he says he'll come and pick them up like the next day. All right, the next day. Those flowers show up at her high school at Charlotte's high school while she's in class.
Unknown:That is
Margie:a new was where she worked and what her first name was rify Yang. She didn't tell him her name. He read it off of her name tag. Oh, you know where she went to school? I hate it. She hides them in her locker. And she actually like is not creeped out is totally fine with that. Yeah. Oh. Oh, it gets worse. Shower. It's so early.
Unknown:It's so horrifying.
Margie:Yeah. Yeah. And he's so he's 19. She's 18. It's very young to be doing that kind of like you stalking behavior. You know, that is such. So I was talking to my other friend about this. I'm sorry, Lindsay. And she actually works. She's becoming like an advocate for kids with with mental hmm, yeah, mental health problems. And can't remember she's becoming a psychologist or what she's studying right now. And I was telling her about this book. And she was like, Yeah, this is this is really bad. It sounds like he's got she's got a desperate need for attention. And he's got some sort of obsessive narcissistic personality disorder. I just, yeah, high school. Okay. So I know, I know. I know. So Charlotte goes back to work that afternoon. I wouldn't want to go to work, but she does. Oh, and guess who comes in homeboy? He has brought her eight copies as he didn't know what she would like. He leaves after giving her sad coffee. And this happened in an anime I watched like something very similar. And it was Guess what? It was totally creepy. It was just weird. Yeah, you're so disgusted. It's so funny. Oh, my
Rachel:God. I know. I know. I just I wish that my facial expressions could come across in an audio medium.
Margie:Oh, it's worse. No, yes. No.
Rachel:The next thing I wanted to start my Saturday so on Friday,
Margie:she's closing her shop. She's locked the door to the flower shop. She's getting ready to go home.
Rachel:That means it's night. It is night and she's alone. Yeah.
Margie:Fuck, fuck. So she's like locking up. She's almost ready to go home and she hears a knock on the door. It's tape and, um, so she's like, nope, doors already locked. I'm headed out. Good night like she kind of does. Her phone starts ringing she didn't give him her number. She answers he says come out with me. It's Friday night. Let me take you out. She's thinks it's cute. She goes out with somebody stalking so much soggy. far into the book. Are we oh, we're like 20 pages 20 to 50 pages. Yeah.
Rachel:Healthy, basic relationship.
Margie:So he takes her out to a fancy restaurant and there's a lot of that we're like any t shirt.
Unknown:He's a t shirt. 19. He's 19.
Margie:So he takes her to this fancy restaurant. Oh, and they lit and she lives in LA in LA. And he it's just a very weird like Kind of. He goes through the backdoor with her because he knows the chef there and he does all this weird like nodding thing of like, just assuming, like, things are gonna get done because he nods like the waiter. He nods at the chef, you know what I mean? Okay, like in the movie like my central powers. Well, it's like, you know what I mean? But you see that? Oh, yeah, these of like, they kind of like rich people give the head nod and suddenly the other person knows exactly what he's what they want. Yeah,
Rachel:and you're rich, you can pay to read people's minds and plant ideas. So on the rich,
Margie:they have a great evening. They talk about stuff. I guess.
Rachel:I like
Margie:cheese, delicious food.
Rachel:My insides have curled into a ball of like horror, right? I just
Margie:Oh my god. I'm just really angry at Elizabeth Kraft and Cher Olsen. This is not healthy behavior. It's terrible. It's really bad. So the way
Rachel:that this book would be okay, is it in the middle of it? She realizes what the fuck am I doing and then goes to Stanford.
Margie:Right? So so on the way out of the restaurant. She gets caught in a street kerfuffle, what you have to try really hard to do. I know that I work downtown in a pretty sketchy area of my downtown. Yeah, it's hard to get caught up in like a fight.
Rachel:No, I mean, sometimes you walk outside and you accidentally yell Hey, anyone want to
Margie:fight. So she gets caught in the middle of this kerfuffle and he kind of like pulls these guys off of her like day to day and suddenly cameras are flashing. Oh wait, he's famous. And I put famous and a capital F. Like every other level. Capitalize
Rachel:on me. It's Roman, like rainbow colors.
Margie:It is famous. So he is take Collins famous musical artist. Like think that Billy Eilish doing this behavior is okay. And she's pretty close to this age. Yeah, you know, she's like what? 2020 so
Rachel:she wouldn't worry about pulling someone out of a fight she just summon a demon. Billy I love you your music is amazing.
Margie:She a bad guy.
Rachel:She just like have you know the like, weird demonic arm shoot out of her chest to grab the dude and pull it into the void. Yeah, you're
Margie:right your goalie right the boy that center chest. Yeah, yeah, yeah, my portal. That's what I'd like to do. Yeah. Anyways, so
Rachel:like a friend cuz come to come.
Margie:He's sitting under there the whole time. Yeah, no idea. Yeah, so venom. He wants that. So like venom? Yeah, yeah. Phantom.
Rachel:Demonic. Yeah. So she,
Margie:Charlotte runs. She's like, I can't get caught up in this like all this like, pop around. I'm out of here.
Rachel:Which I'm smart girl smart girl should have run a while ago. Yes. But also
Margie:the camera should have already caught her. Yeah, you know what I mean? The next day is pretty normal at school, except Charlotte's head is in the clouds because of homeboy.
Rachel:No, don't give me that face.
Margie:Carlos and Charlotte walk out of school. And Carlos says Hey, before you go to work, do you want to go get some coffee down the street. And Charles make sure that we can work on homework together.
Rachel:Because we're friends. Yeah. And I'm allowed to have a friend that's a boy weights. I know where this is going weights.
Margie:So they're they walk to the coffee shop together. And she notices a black car like a Range Rover type like literally, like literal soggy and it's not following that. But like so they get to the coffee shop. That car was outside of school. Now it's outside of the coffee shop and just pulled up. So Carla, they sit down, they get their coffees, they start their homework. Carlos says he has to go to the bathroom. So he goes in. Tate walks into the coffee shop. While he's gone. Well, Carlos is gone. Uh huh. And let's see. And he asked to take her out again, he's like, I'm really sorry about what happened last night. I would really like to take you out again. She says no. And he leaves. Good. Yeah. So Carlos is in the bathroom during this entire encounter, though. He misses everything. And he has no Carlos has no idea that this is happening.
Rachel:Yeah. And also he just showed up at a coffee shop that she just happened to be going to for funsies Yeah, because he's been following her.
Margie:Um, so then our girl well, so Charlotte goes, gets goes into the bathroom, and she gets cornered by a golf girl who tells her to stay away from homeboy and our girls like, that's fine with me. Let's see him again.
Rachel:Because, of course, why she got to be guff.
Margie:I have no idea. So in Charlotte's mind. She feels like Tate lied to her and that's why she does doesn't want to see Yeah, that's the
Rachel:problem with this. Oh, yeah. Right, right.
Margie:After the coffee, our girl goes to work that afternoon to discover that homeboy has bought all of the flowers in the flower shop and donated them to a hospital so we can take girl out. She says no, again, because she has any work to do. What? Yeah, and her boss is like, her boss says, like, you'll still get paid for the time, but like somebody bought out all the flowers and then take walks in. Yes, yeah. See, I find that to be extremely creepy. I mean, everything's buying her time.
Rachel:Yes. Oh, I just yeah, you broke me. I broke in. And I need I'm gonna need my throwing cupcake at some point.
Margie:Well, because this is a team episode. I feel like we can't drink and I'm really bad about that.
Rachel:You know where we could and just not ominous about not terrible.
Margie:Not yet. Not yet. I'm not ready yet. So and her boss is like her boss is a woman. I think her name is like Jennifer or something. And her. Her and her boss is like totally okay with all this happening.
Rachel:Which is not experiment, which by the way, I have an interesting thought experiment for the like after this. Okay, I want to go through after all this entire episode at the end, I want to discuss gender flipping it. But okay, my interesting thought experiment for the end, right? Yes. But for now, if you owned a shop, let's say let's do something different, let's say like a bookstore, right. And someone came in and put all of the books in your store and donated them to an orphanage or something. Just so they could go out with the person at the counter?
Margie:Yeah. At your store, right.
Rachel:What would you do? I think my first response would be no, you can't buy all of my books.
Margie:No, I would say no. Go ahead and buy all the books. And then I would call that employee and say don't show up into work today. Yeah, that's probably what I would do. Because I would still take the money.
Rachel:Yeah, I mean, okay, that's fair. I
Margie:if they're that stupid, I'm taking their money. First of all, I want
Rachel:to wire transfer. Yeah, confirm it right. My Account. Yeah. Second, who the fuck is gonna deliver all the books, I probably still need her to come help. And third, I would be calling the cops.
Margie:You. Here's the thing, though, like and this is because I was listening to a Jeffrey Epstein podcast. They just had a hell of a week. They would not do anything about it. Like this guy, supposedly super famous, like Grammy winning artist. So like, I don't think that they would do anything if he just went and bought something, or did something stupid, like buy a bunch of flowers?
Rachel:Honestly, I think that the most unrealistic thing about this entire scenario is the fact that you didn't recognize him on site.
Margie:Yeah, she mentions that too. Cuz when she sees him she's like, I recognize you. But I don't know from where because, you know, she's one of those. She doesn't follow the pop star. She always studying. She's hashtag basic, but she's not one of quote unquote, those girls. Oh, yeah. Yes. Right. She's
Rachel:not like other girls.
Margie:Oh, I
Rachel:hated just saying that.
Margie:I know. It was awful. It may be my insides crawl. I'm so bad boss. Talks Charlie into chasing after homeboy after he walks out the door. Yeah, and homeboy takes Charlotte to his house
Rachel:All right, we're playing a game Hi. I'm Rachel voice go during this entire goddamn episode. What the fuck? He said
Margie:like get to his house and she's kind of like Why have you been so upset? Why are you so obsessed with me?
Rachel:I would ask that question before I went with him alone to his abode. Her
Margie:and um, he explains that he started stalking her because she was so intriguing. And because she didn't recognize him if you want somebody doesn't recognize him recognize you go to like India.
Rachel:Kappa with ABS intriguing.
Margie:I'm saying that because India has a large plethora of their own celebrities.
Rachel:If you want someone to not give a shit about you call me.
Margie:Let's be honest. Okay. Um, he kisses her.
Rachel:The way you said that concerns me because it wasn't they kiss it was he kisses her.
Margie:She tells Oh, she was into it. She tells him it's her first kiss and he immediately pushes her away and is like I'm not right for you. He literally just turns around and walks back into the house and leaves her outside and has the bodyguard drive her home. Can you imagine just kissing someone and the big like so drama? I'm not right for you and then just walking back into your mansion to wage shifts thing to do,
Rachel:because Bruce Wayne at least still is human underneath this child,
Margie:poor child man.
Rachel:Like he's here's another thing to think about. He's about just slightly younger than my little brother. I would punch my little brother if he ever did something like
Margie:this. I'm only child. Yeah, he's an only child Saxon
Rachel:only child too, though. And he's a normal human.
Margie:Yeah, I'm not saying that. I'm saying he doesn't have a sibling to like, tell Hutchins is not okay. He needs like an older brother to tell him that this shit is not okay. Kick to the air. Yeah, he needs he needs a lot of things. He know a lot of
Rachel:really honestly, honestly. He really just needs professional help. You just need to get hit. He needs like to sit down with a therapist. Right. And he has the money to do Yeah.
Margie:Yeah, God. So she's pissed and hurt. Right? I mean, rightfully so she's 18. You know? She's when you're,
Rachel:when you're like, what's the most so?
Margie:impressionable? impressionable? It seems like he's almost grooming her. Yeah, yeah. And there's that hot and cold. There's that hot and cold. Right, exactly. And so she's hurt. And she's like, but she does not hear from him for three weeks. Good, right? She goes to his house a few weeks later, and is like, hey, what you did wasn't cool. Why bring me all the way to your freaking place, and then just push me away and have your driver take me home? I mean, why do all of those things?
Rachel:I'm glad she called him on it, but at the same time, leave us leave it be.
Margie:So he's like, I want to date you. But there have to be boundaries. And I have to set those boundaries myself.
Unknown:He's the one. No, no, if you are stalking someone, you don't get to set the boundaries. We've already established.
Margie:Exactly. She's like, No, that's not going to fly with me. And this is place she calls them at 3am. Girl I changed my mind. Let's try it your way. Girl. No, literally girl. Oh.
Rachel:You're just trying to make our listeners drunk.
Margie:Well, it's my I mean, as long as somebody is getting drunk sorry.
Rachel:This is a teen book. hopped up on soda pop. Yeah, that's what this is days right shit ton of their sock their
Margie:Zehra kids not to do drugs. Dare them not to read Harlequin teen romance novels. I mean, oh, shit.
Rachel:Well, here's the problem. Don't read Harlequin teen romance novels is a given that. If you didn't point it out, I wouldn't have known. Oh, yeah. It looks like a regular young adult. Right novel. Yeah, I would have had no idea. So problematic.
Margie:Okay. He picks her up from school. The next day right blindfold sir. I'm okay. And takes her to an old Hollywood theater to watch Casa Blanca together because she's never seen it before. And there's like this whole dinner setup. It's just the two of them. Roses, sparkling water. Very fancy.
Rachel:is happening.
Margie:Oh, yeah. And when she gets nervous about said blindfold, he's all like, Don't you trust me? My eyes roll into the sunset.
Unknown:If you have to ask,
Margie:then. No. And also
Rachel:you've done nothing
Margie:to earn that trust. Exactly.
Rachel:Wow, you just open the book. Are we already almost towards the end of it?
Margie:We're getting there. Oh, shit. Okay,
Rachel:this was a fast one.
Margie:Yeah, well, it's only like 300 page book.
Rachel:That gives us more time for our thought experiment.
Margie:Oh, yeah. Oh, let's see.
Rachel:Hang on. I want to go get my throwing cupcake. I feel like I'm gonna need it at the end. Oh, yeah.
Margie:Good idea. Um, so on the way so he out on the way out of the theater. And like on her way home. He's going to drive her home and his car and she gets into a car and she sees like on the sidewalk three other girls who are very, like, let's stop glammy and she's like, I don't look like that. You know any mean? Like? Yeah, so then so he picks her up again the next day. She she's and she's also she's been lying to her grandmother and to Carlos about where she's going. She's not been telling anyone that she's stealing Tate. Yeah,
Rachel:that's a good thing to do God the dude that you
Margie:haven't told anyone that you're going out with? That is not a good idea. No, where's our castle? Horrible idea. Um, so the night he calls her the next morning and says, I want to take you out for another kind of like surprise run. Let's do this. Okay, he takes her to a big old department store and buys her a bunch of shit. A bunch of really expensive beautiful clothes.
Rachel:Good. Yeah. That's how I like to start my relationships by having my love purchased for me.
Margie:Yep, yep. And he gets her hair done.
Rachel:And makes her look like the glitzy chicks. And yes, and gets her makeup da. It's like you're like, Well, if you just take your hair down and take your glasses off, you'll be beautiful.
Margie:I think 80s Montage for music like like princesses versus diaries.
Rachel:Yes, that's exactly what I was. Exactly. Okay, what 80s Montage song would we have in the background of this? I'm thinking I'm
Margie:too sexy. Oh, I should know. So we still think about like red flags. Yeah, maybe like
Unknown:dancing clean.
Margie:So that's pretty good, huh? Um, let's see. So she's out. They go out to a restaurant. And she's really glammed up really, let's stop. And as I think as they're walking out, pictures are snapped of her, of course, of course of her and him together and he does his best to like, make it so that they people won't recognize her but like it's too late. They've taken pictures of her so she gets she says like it's okay. He says, he says he apologizes for he's like, I'm really sorry. I don't want you to get caught up in that kind of stuff. You know my world. Yeah. You're dating her? Yeah, you're dating or it's that's how it works.
Rachel:And also adult human conversations are Hey, by the way, I'm this thing. Are you comfortable with
Margie:that? Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Okay. Um, so she changes in the car out of the clothes that she bought him or he bought her. And he's in the car with her. He turns around, but he's like in the car. And I'm like, why didn't you get out of the fucking car and just
Rachel:wait outside, which is not change? Well, she has to change
Margie:because she doesn't want to grandmother's. She just got a picture taken. Well, so the her picture has been taken, but she doesn't know she doesn't think that anyone's still gonna recognize her because she has highlights in the picture. She's wearing this gland. Remove the highlights from her hair well, and also views covering up like her eyes. Okay, so it's a book writer, right? Suspension of disbelief. Wow, that's gone. Yeah. So then, um, oh, yeah. The next day. Her sister burst into her room and says like, what the hills with this and it is the picture and processor. Mia is like, you're wearing our mom's ring. I recognize it. Like I know. It's
Rachel:okay. Nice. And amount. Shay.
Margie:You're right. It's me. I've been dating this guy. Don't tell grandma. You owe me anyway.
Unknown:Okay, this is fine.
Rachel:Right. That's a healthy sister. Yeah. And so
Margie:she and so share Charlotte, Texas. Tatum is like Does anybody else know? And he says, no, no one knows who you are. They haven't figured it out yet. And she gets to he was able
Rachel:to figure out who she was based on her name. And the flower shop she works at chances are other people are going to be able to to.
Margie:So she gets to school. And nobody recognized her but Carlos comes up to her locker and says the same thing. I recognize your ring. I know that it's you. Why did you lie to me? And she's like, I just kind of wanted to, like be my own thing.
Unknown:I just want to be my own person. He
Margie:makes me feel different. Hmm. So like other boys, and she told us Yes. So he's a little mad at her. And he's like, do you promise not to lie to me again? And she's like, Yes, I totally promise. I still cool. Okay. All right.
Rachel:Whether or not she lies to him again. That doesn't sound like
Margie:Alright, so I'm sure they keep dating and secret. One morning she wakes up Charlotte wakes up and Mia comes up to her says there's something weird outside you need to come and take a look at this. And she's like what? There's snow all over their yard and in the front yard and in their backyard and Tate is in the backyard with all this snow and he's I think it's a it's a la Yeah, it's because she's told him at one point she had never seen snow. So we bought her snow he buys her snow Excuse me What the fuck? He buys her snow and tells her that he wants her to come home with him for Christmas to meet his parents.
Rachel:Okay, cool things should have been Rachel science corner. Yes, you can make artificial snow. It's still fucking LA. Is it winter? In LA,
Margie:I've no idea. Well, you know what it is because it's your Christmas.
Rachel:Okay, that's fair. So it's 60 degrees. Well, I mean, technically, yes. It could get warm or cold enough for them to artificially make snow there.
Margie:But how are you going to transport it? It's
Rachel:probably radioactive. Well,
Margie:what if they got it here? So there are ski resorts in California.
Rachel:Yes, there are so we could have gotten it was it's possible. It's absolutely possible.
Margie:The real problem is how did nobody wake up all the snow was being shoveled onto their yard?
Rachel:Yeah, like, like, if you ever seen a snow machine? They're allowed loud. Yeah.
Margie:I did see that may take a long time. I think it might be a serve. Like I saw a modern family. You know what? Maybe they so like, alright. Devil advocate. Right? They do. They are in LA. So maybe they got something from a set or something. They probably have a snow machine on set somewhere. So you probably could have hired one of those. Here's what I'm imagining pains are very, I imagine those are very loud.
Rachel:Let me paint a word picture, please. It's night. Yeah. In the skies above la in the very smoky mist. Three Blackhawks. And we're talking full on like stealth mission and just Alright, bay doors open, go go.
Margie:Calls. Love it. Hit the target. Love it. Stay on target. Stay on target. Christ, so and she introduces Tate to her grandmother. Charlotte. Look,
Rachel:grandma. It's my secret boyfriend. My secret boyfriend who brought us snow.
Margie:Grandmother is not okay with it. And it's not okay with the guy and she's going out to Colorado. Good grandma. And literally chapter 12. The beginning of it. This is a bad idea. Charlotte. Grandma stands in the doorway as I sit on my suitcase to zip it up.
Rachel:Fucking shit. Yeah. Well, someone in this book has goddamn sense. Yeah,
Margie:seriously, one person. So she flies out. She's
Rachel:grandma. So she's old. So
Margie:she had I don't think that she's that old though. Because her daughter was young when she got pregnant. She was young when she got pregnant.
Rachel:Yeah, but like, she's that old? Like she's old.
Margie:So. And they had this argument about like, surely you're going out to Colorado, you're doing all these things with this boy. What about your future? What about your dreams? And I was like, I'm still the same person. I'm just going out to LA to go out to Colorado to meet my boyfriend's parents. You know, so like, in that sense, I'm kinda like, legitimate Sure. The problem is your boyfriend is psychotic. Yes. There are other problems. Other problems with the grandmother doesn't mention that. It's about her dreams. Oh, of course. Yeah, of course. Because the boyfriend spy dreams. Boy, boy, boys have cooties. her. So she goes out to Colorado meets his parents were absolutely lovely. They adore her. They think she's really nice a psychopath and a handle? Yeah, like produce a psychopath, which is really sad. And there is this like, little bit of undercurrent of he doesn't get along with his parents that well. So he's like, trying to mend the gap because he got to LA to pursue his music career. And his parents weren't really that thrilled with that. And also, they don't have any power over him anymore. Because he became famous, very young. You know, they don't have really any say in what he does in his career anymore. Right. And so that's obviously caused some tension, but like, they still have a really nice time. And, you know, her, his parents are great, and all this stuff. So that night. And she even mentioned, she's like, wow, this is like the family. I kind of wanted when I was younger, just because her family was so dysfunctional. So that night, she's like, she's ready to lose IV card. She is
Rachel:go by for
Margie:that to get rid of that card, like awesome. So she puts she puts on lingerie, and she's in her own room.
Rachel:I did not own lingerie at 18
Margie:I think like it under, you know, cute underwear for a teenager. So, um, she puts on lingerie, like, you know, whatever it was, and I think she mentioned like, it's a push up bra. So you know, something, okay. Yeah, so it's that Victoria's Secret pink. Right, exactly. And so And she goes, she knocks on his door. She goes into his room, and it's not okay. It's not okay. At all. Like me. I don't remember.
Rachel:You're also at his parents house.
Margie:I don't think that that's that weird to do that all the time. Like very fair teens. Teens bone in their parents house all the time. So where there's hormones, there's a way he comes into her room later because she goes back into her room when this all goes to shed. Um, so she is not sleeping. He knocks on her door. He comes in And he she thinks, oh, he's here to apologize. No, he's here to tell her there's going to be a jet to come and take her back to LA at 7am on Christmas morning.
Rachel:Okay, hang on. Yeah. You cannot. There's a lot to unpack here. There's so much but we're gonna start with the fact that you cannot. Okay, hypothetically, let's get on board with the fact that Okay, sure. She's gonna follow by your limitations that you've arbitrarily set in this relationship. And she's playing by your rules. You have to tell her those rules, will you and then you can't get upset if she breaks the rules that you never told. Yeah.
Margie:Yeah. And also, if she breaks the rules, like you can't just nobody's perfect. Nobody's perfect. You talk it out. Yeah. And that's he never likes to talk anything out in like a human being. And God only knows what his parents thought. The next morning she's just gone.
Rachel:And like, Can I also say that I get fuck you money. But this kid has no sense of retirement plan, does he? He's just pissing away all that cash. Hmm. I
Margie:think he really like in the book. They describe it as like, he is super rich. Like he is crazy wealthy. So
Rachel:Bezos kind of guy.
Margie:Yeah. Yeah. Great. That's why you can you know, throw in private jets around everywhere.
Rachel:He says his voice better like, literally undress people.
Margie:I don't think they even describe what kind of music he makes.
Rachel:Your favorite. It's your favorites. Your favorite? Yeah. You specific?
Margie:Great. Oh, great. Um, so she returns to her life. She apologizes to her grandma. She's like, you were right. I'm sorry. It didn't work out. But I'm here now. Stanford. Here we come. I'm back on track. So that sounds great.
Rachel:Great, right. You mentioned what she like, wants to do in Stanford. She
Margie:wants to go to medical school, but it's mostly just because she wants to make money. She wants to kind of get out of where she is right now. It's not really and make
Rachel:money what boning a popstar fair,
Margie:but let's not that I think she's already pretty emotionally invested. Yeah. So if you're not emotionally invested, you live your life, but don't break your own heart. Jesus. Um, uh, it gets to the she came back on well, actually, it's been a couple months because she came back from Christmas, right? It is now Valentine's Day. Okay. And she's still pretty heartbroken because she's 18. Right? But she's so she works in a lab after school. Like another one of our after school things to get some credit hours for like college and all that. And she works with this other girl. And as she's like, sitting there doing some worksheet here. She thinks she hears the girl come in Rebecca, and she's like, Hey, Rebecca, and she turns around and it's hate.
Rachel:I hope he's wearing close toed shoes and long pants.
Margie:He is not. He's not there to work. He's there. Yeah,
Rachel:but that's just basic lab safety. What doesn't matter if you're there to work in the lab, you still can't be in the lab without your close toed shoes and your long pants. Okay, whatever. Oh, shit. Damn it.
Margie:Okay. So how did he even get in the building though? Can we just ask that question? Money? Money, right? Fuck
Rachel:you money. So the fuck you magic fucking money.
Margie:Here's something that I hate. He is the person who hurt her. Right? And he says he asked her to apologize. Oh, no. He says before you say anything he starts Let me explain. No, I hate that. I would be so pissed. I would be screaming at the person. Like if they did yes to me. Right? Yeah. Right. And she says, I don't want to get back together with you. We're too different. This is not gonna work out.
Rachel:So you're an unhealthy human.
Margie:Right and you need it, so I'm just gonna read this text. I messed up. I know I did. And I'm sorry. I never should have let you leave Colorado like that. I never should have put like
Rachel:you leave. You're the one that got her on the private jet.
Margie:Yeah, I'm grinding my jaw and I forced myself to stop. But you did let me leave. You kicked me out of your parents house on Christmas morning. Do you have any idea how that made me feel? How much that hurt me? Are you even capable of understanding is your heart so hollow, so numb from whatever ruin to you that you can't even see when see when you're destroying the people around you? And he says, You're all I think about and I'm going insane not being with you. And so then Rebecca comes in, thank God. And she. He's like, let me take you out. Let's go talk about this. And she was like, No, I gotta work. And Rebecca says No, she doesn't. She doesn't have to work. We don't have much work to do tonight go out with him.
Rachel:This girl needs better than Robinson friends in her life. And like, I listeners, if I don't towards the end of books like this, if I'm not saying a lot, it's just because there's too much to say. Right? Yeah, like I could just it's It's all the same thing. Like I just keep saying. Yeah, no one big circle drink, horrible circle jerk.
Margie:So they kind of they decide to restart. She says, Listen, you cannot keep secrets for me anymore. You cannot expect this relationship to work just based on your boundaries and how you feel. It's about me too. Yeah. And he's like, I he's like, okay, because he's in love with her apparently. Sure. Yeah, whatever. He has no personality in this book, too. Like he is no, just Oh, no, he
Rachel:does. It's just he hasn't told you about his boundaries yet, which included personality.
Margie:Oh, true. Yeah. Well, it's like he's so rapidly. His character is so created based upon his love
Rachel:of Charlotte, he said really Olen? What? He's Edward Cullen.
Margie:He is Yeah, so right. He's our Colin Okay. Yep.
Rachel:Good. Figured it out. He sparkles.
Margie:Um, let's see. He buys her bracelet for Valentine's Day. With diamonds on it? Of course. Yeah. They start making out in his bedroom. Stay man, great. And he tells her, I've got I've got all of these great new ideas from a music I'm so excited. It's all thanks to you. And because of that, I'm gonna be going back to
Unknown:Oh, okay.
Margie:To go and work with this producer. And, like, we just got back together. And he's like, I know, babe, but like, this is such a good opportunity.
Rachel:And you should support me in what I do. Exactly. Yeah. Yep. You're not a good girl. That's, that's gaslighting my friends. Good. Um,
Margie:okay, so then she tells Carlos because she has lied to him again. Great. She was dating tape and he's upset. He's like, you told me you were gonna tell me? Yeah. And he says, I'm your best friend. Like, how could you do this? I feel really sorry for Carlos. You can't? You can't get the opportunity to be a good friend. If they don't tell you anything. Yeah. So he she tells him I need you to lie for me. Because I'm going to go to New York, and go and see Tate for a weekend. And I need you to cover up for me for my grandma and say that we're going to go and do something. I'm going to be with you that weekend. Mm hmm. Oh, okay. So she gets to New York. He ends up and he gets her this penthouse apartment or not apartment, hotel room. And he ends up showing up really, really late the first night that she's there, like way past when they were supposed to meet and she just goes asleep anyways, and she wakes up and he's like curled up next to her in the bed. It's fine. That's fine, right? Still. Um, and they go out for pizza together. She's in this like really ritzy dress that he had bought for her. But they just go out for pizza because it's the only thing open and they start making it and then they go back they start making out in the bed like nothing happened. Well, I shouldn't say nothing happens. But you know what I mean? And she tells I don't know why she tells him she loves him. That goes over well. Let's I thought
Rachel:that he loved her. She did not set it yet is not set yet. No homeboy just has major commitment issues.
Margie:Oh, so and he explains his major commitment issues because he had this one fan to fan who was absolutely obsessed with him and girl, not yet and would follow him everywhere at like every event. She was there. And eventually he kind of like let her come through and just talk to him. They couldn't they didn't really have a friendship. She he would she would just kind of show up at the parties. Right? And
Rachel:yeah, it's really weird how uncomfortable it is when someone's just showing up at places that you're getting a lot of information about you. Yeah, weird weird. Wonder why someone unlike that.
Margie:So he sleeps with her at one point, this girl named Ella St. John. And she tells him she tells him she loves him. And he just does not feel the same way. He was like I thought that it was a one night stand like that. That's where I was on it. And he doesn't say anything back. She kills herself.
Unknown:Shit yeah.
Rachel:Hey, suicides a trigger.
Margie:Oh, right. So bad with triggers. But damn it, I'm so sorry listeners
Rachel:guide. Jeez,
Margie:so that's why he has so many commitment issues. And he says I didn't think I deserved you. You were perfect. You are perfect. I didn't want to destroy you to take away everything you've worked for. Good. No. and No, they stay together this time. Does he say he loves her too? No. Okay. Yeah, that's fine, though. If you're not ready to say you love someone. That's fine.
Rachel:That's fine. But like, oh God, Jesus, ah, Marian,
Margie:somehow grandma finds out about the her going to New York to see Tate and she's, yes, yeah, yeah. Um, but Charlotte is kind of also going through this internal catharsis of is this is this feature that I planned for myself, really what I want. Okay. And so when she's at the lab one day, and she's just like, I gotta get out of here. Like, I don't even know who I am anymore. I'm
Rachel:is this just a generic lab? Or is there a function for this lab?
Margie:I think it's like a university lab. It's a universal, but it's something medical related. Yeah. Um, and so she goes to see Tay and she's kind of like, you know, suffering inside, right. You know,
Rachel:you're 18 Shouldn't be expected to know exactly what you want to do for the rest of
Margie:your Yeah, exactly. heartache, heartache. And she's just kind of like, she wants comfort. She's trying to find comfort from her boyfriend.
Rachel:Does he do Oh, tell me what he does. So I can throw that Oh, person says,
Margie:hey, it's really he's, he's, he comes to visit her in LA. That's where she goes to see him. Okay, she meets him at the airport that's sharing this big moment is happening. And he tells her, it's great. I got the surprise gig tonight in LA. So like, I'm gonna be doing this big old concert. And she's kind of upset cuz she's like, I wanted to spend the state with you. I don't get you that often. So she tells him I got into Stanford. Neat. Yeah, so she did get in good. And, um, but she's like, you know, I'm just not sure if it's what I want anymore. And he tells her, I'm about to go on a world tour. And so they're kind of like, having this like, he's really excited. But she's kind of afraid, kind of moment. And she says, What if I just go with you? What if I go on tour with you for a year and like, we can be together and I can figure out what I really want out of my life. And then I you know, and then and she's kind of afraid, too, because she's like, I don't want to go on this tour. Meet a bunch of girls like I we just got back together. Fine. Right? Um, you also just got back together? Yeah. So he gets back into his car to go to that gig to go to that concert. And he tells her, go to the back door, tell the guard your name. And they'll let you in. Okay, for the show. I can't wait for you to see it. She gets there that night. Her name isn't on the list. She gets to the stadium. Her name is not on the list. And the guard feels really sorry for her. He's like, I'm sorry. Like you haven't been given a clear to come in. I can't let you in. And she's like, you know who I am. I'm his girlfriend. And he's like, I can't let you in. So she realized that. So then she's like, What the hell is happening? And she knew that after that he was planning to to take her tour to his house. So she's like, maybe this is a mistake, but I want to talk to him. So she goes to his house. And she looks at his Instagram and she sees that he has been just hanging out with like models and checks all night after the show and behind, like, behind the backstage and she's like, What the hell is happening? And she realizes he's closed her out again. So she Yeah, so she gets into her car to head back home. When suddenly God girl. Oh, god, god girl tells her we were meant to be together. It was supposed to be mean Tate. I'm in love with him. And
Rachel:is this the chick that did she like pretend to kill herself? And then
Margie:No, she did. Another chick Cher. She just
Unknown:fuck night. So, um,
Margie:she's like, we're meant to be together. So Charlotte says literally says you can have good I want to get out of here. But um, and the other girl says I will once you're gone. And she literally tries to murder Charlotte in front of his house goth girl.
Unknown:Okay, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait.
Rachel:I'm gonna call this now. Okay, he shows up while this is happening. realizes that if she gets killed then like, initially, he really has a sudden realization of his feelings for her. No really do Ah,
Margie:he does show up, show up. He breaks them apart. The goth girl gets arrested. He takes Charlotte to the hospital. She literally is almost choked to death. Oh, good. Yeah. And so she wakes up in the hospital and Tate is there and Tate says I can't let this happen to you. I can't like I'm so sorry about what happened at the concert. But like you really with? I can't ruin your life. Because he's like, always problem because he's like, so I'm sorry, I didn't put your name on the list. It's Stanford thing because he knows. He was like Stanford was your dream for so long. And I feel like you're giving it up because you're in love with me and you shouldn't do that. I don't want you to do that. And I also feel Like, maybe sit down with me talk with her life with me is going to be too hard for you like you can't this lifestyle. I don't want you to get wrapped up in this lifestyle. Like that's her decision to make. But exactly. And that's what she tells him. She's like, it's I feel like that's my decision to I feel like we should talk about this. And he's like, No, and he leaves. Yeah, yep. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So there's that. So she recovers and her grandmother is pretty understanding about the whole thing. She feels really sorry for her because she's had her heart broken. Again, again, but like, I mean, this is pretty. This is like the final straw kind of thing. Fucking be and she shot a bull's
Rachel:eye plugins now and she realizes that what she's always wanted to Stanford and she goes on and lives a great life is a wonderful medical professional.
Margie:Nobody's This part's okay, though. Okay, Charlotte does that she's like, I have to be honest with you. Charlotte, Charlotte. I'm not sure about Stanford, and I don't want to go and do something that I'm not sure about. So I'm going to, like put it on the backburner for a year. I'm going to go and do some traveling and I'm going to do some soul searching and figure out what I really want. Okay, great. She's 18. That's good, right? Good. I fully I want our listeners to know I fully advocate back No, go do it. Go Go figure your shit figure your shit out. So she does and she goes traveling for like a year. She's still thinking about tape. But she does a lot of like soul searching. She realizes what she really loves is photography. Okay, she wants to be a photographer. So she comes back at one point just to visit and there's something Oh, it's because of something with me. I think Mia is graduating or something from some college. So she comes back briefly. She sees Carlos again. And she's still kind of like on the rocks of what she wants to do. But this is like, I think like six to eight months into her traveling. So she's heading back. She's gonna so she's her plan is she's gonna go to Italy. And she's gonna work for a florist there for a while and she's gonna take pictures. Neat. Yeah. Cool. And this little town called Vinnitsa. And she gets onto the plane. And
Rachel:he has a private jet. I just like to reiterate Yes, right now.
Margie:And she's bumped into first class. And she's like I didn't in there like your lucky day. So she sits down in first class and it's taped next to her.
Rachel:He owns a private private jet. He
Margie:came to talk to her. Obviously, let's see,
Rachel:I hate him. Oh, I hate him. I hate him.
Margie:And he says, so I'm going to this whole book reminds me a lot of Bridget Jones diary. Like this dude is like Hugh Grant in that movie of like, he says Hugh Grant at the end of that movie says if I can't be with you, when it comes to Bridget Jones, I can't be with anyone. And she's Bridget says that's not a good enough offer for me. No. So it's unhealthy. Yeah. So someone obsessed with me. And that's pretty much what Tate says. He says, I can't stop thinking about you. I tried to go on tour. I thought it was what I wanted. But it felt wrong without you all the songs were for you and you weren't there to hear with them. And when I found out you, me, me, me, me, me. Me. Yes. When I found out you were in LA, I had to see you. And he says don't go to Italy stay here in LA stay with me. And she says, fuck you No. Good. She goes back to the back of the plane where her original seat was good. Yeah. And good girl. She goes to Italy. She goes to Vinnitsa. And so he finds her God. And he tries and he says like, I was Dec? Yeah, I'm sorry. Not enough on the plane. Like, I want to start over again.
Rachel:Which like, this is like the fourth time Yeah. And it's at the end of the book, what the fuck is gonna make so instead he says,
Margie:I hurt you. I know I hurt you. And I'm so sorry. You're the only thing in my life that makes sense. Even the music The thing I used to think I wanted above all else is meaningless without you. And I want to start over no more rules. No more control. No more pushing you away when I get scared or making decisions that should be yours. I want to do this. Do this right this time. Finally, can we start over? Okay, that whole thing about starting over is that you can't as much as people like you can't you you can't 100% You're always gonna have that hurt. You're always gonna have that pain.
Rachel:He's done absolutely nothing to indicate that this time will be different. This is like the fourth time the
Margie:fourth time and and he's doing the same behaviors that he was that he was doing before of stalking her finding her and really pushing himself on her when she doesn't want that.
Rachel:So there's a lot like we are almost done. Yeah, well here's here's my problem is like, honestly, yeah, he's creepy as shit. Yeah. awful. But I also kind of feel bad for him. Because he's a dude who obviously needs a lot of help. Mentally, like he needs to sit and talk with a professional. He was. He became famous at what seems to be a very young age, and I can really fuck someone up and he was sent like, a strange a little bit from his parents. When that happens. We lost a lot of a support group. I kind of feel bad for him. I feel, you know, if it's okay, no, you, I can still appreciate where he comes from. Feel for Yeah, it
Margie:doesn't make it Oh,
Rachel:no, it's still not okay.
Margie:He's what I, if his apology is legitimate, I would still say to her like, No, you know, I would still if I were her that I would still say no, just because like, I can't forget about all the things I can forgive like, I forgive you, right. But I can't forget, like, I know, you're still capable of these things. So
Rachel:until he does, until he proves that he is going to be able to change his behavior I do not see. Right. And
Margie:I think that it would be something of it wouldn't be a light switch. I think that he would have to do like, prove to her in little ways over time that no, this is like, this is a change that I am making, right? And if it doesn't work, it doesn't work. But there's this romanticized idea of like a light switch. Yeah. And that's not how relationships work. And it shouldn't work that way. No, it shouldn't work that
Rachel:way. Because if it does, then that means you can turn that light switch right back off. Yes. So
Margie:she gets back together with him, and they live happily ever after the end.
Rachel:Fuck that book. Fuck this book. Oh, my God. Jesus, so okay. I feel like we hit a lot of the really terrible stuff during the plot synopsis. Like I think I feel like we did a really good job with that. I want to talk about switch the genders. Is it okay?
Margie:No, it wasn't. It's not okay. It's genderless. Yeah. Jenna. Yeah. Meaning,
Rachel:right. Well, but Well, I would guess, thought experiment would be okay. It's like a Taylor Swift type character. And a dude who wants to like, go and do something else. Like, I guess I'm trying to like,
Margie:it's like Tom Hiddleston. And Taylor. That relationship? Oh, god, Oh, God.
Rachel:I'm just thinking like,
Margie:I'm in love with Tom Hybels. Just in case this ever becomes viral,
Rachel:right? Oh, God, I'm just thinking, like, I always like to try to do that flip. Because that's something that's very inherent, like, in my, in my life, because I am a female engineer, I get a lot of like, in my brain, I'm like, okay, swap. I agree. Gender is meaningless. It's all a construct. But if we assume the non corrects gender binary in this case, or whatever, and say, okay, non normative and non normative? No, no, it's better. Yeah. So, okay, it's a female Popstar, and a dude who wants to go pursue his dream of being a doctor or whatever. Like, I'm curious how the social dynamic and the the the, the, I guess, social C section
Margie:would change. I still think that it's all based on feeling, though. Because if we're assuming that it's still definitely not okay, if Okay, so let's instead of Charlotte, Charles. Sure. If Charles was, I think that it's hard to because if I'm imagining a gender swap, then probably Charles would kind of be like, quote, unquote, the man of the house. And so he would in his home life, he would almost be expected to do these types of things just because in our society, that there's a lot of that.
Rachel:And that's that's kind of the I hope that that comes across. That's a thought experiment I want to do right is how, how would it change? And why would it change it? Because it doesn't mean that
Margie:the expectation is the expectations of him. In his home life would be different. I think because he's a boy, he would be a boy. But I do think that her obsession to her obsession with him would be taken by the media as a lot creepier to Yeah, I think that there would be a lot more of which is good. Right? Well,
Rachel:well, so that's kind of I guess that is that's kind of what I wanted to hone in on is why was this obsession? This obsession was not taken as being creepy, right? But if it was a female Popstar going after a male it would be taken as creepy. And that is kind of what I'm trying to write on. Yeah, like it's not obviously none of this is okay, this is terrible. It's awful, right? But why does the fact that it's a dude doing this creepy stalkers, behavior, make it okay.
Margie:I think it's a it's a it's a cultural build up of history throughout the years and years and years and years. I think that that's really all that it is. Yeah. Um, because we've been glorifying stories like that.
Rachel:So big manly Viking men,
Margie:right? Oh 7.2
Rachel:Girl, give me a shieldmaiden any day.
Margie:And I'm trying to think of like, like climate trying to think of classical logic classic literature. Rochester. Rochester. That's that was my first thought. Yeah, I'm really not okay no not okay at all
Rachel:Chester's a fuck boy. Oh, he's
Margie:such a fuckup I still love that book. Take advantage takes advantage. Oh God. Oh God still love that book. Oh, love it. And also but I mean like and that leads up to today of I just saw Star Wars spoilers spoiler alert here.
Rachel:I haven't seen the I know, but do you care? No.
Margie:Okay, I'm sorry. Well, I mean, you know this because of Alexa, because Alexa, but the Kylo Ren re relationship is not a healthy one at all. But we still are like, glorifying and have Railo fans. So it's, like I said, it's something that's just been built up in our society.
Rachel:This is like, another version of the alpha is an excuse to be abusive thing, right? Like, it's all just kind of boils down to that dynamic.
Margie:Can we also go back to to, though, of how damaging this would be to you if you're 16 years old? Oh, God,
Rachel:well, 18? Well, yeah, but
Margie:if you're reading that if you're, if you're reading that as a 16 year old, but it's a teen romance novel, so you believe that between 13 to 19, we're assuming, and like I said, horribly damaging.
Rachel:Like I said, like the cover of that book is totally benign. It's benign,
Margie:but you really I mean, the even the inside cover, though, is not benign. No, like, the back of it isn't fun. I and I know that when I was 13 to 19, I was super impressionable dude,
Rachel:I would have fallen over on would have loved that. But I I feel like honestly, a huge formative moment in my life. Granted, I will know I read Twilight when it was popular with the movie, specifically so that I could bash it. Right? But I remember reading it, you're super into it, loving it. Yeah. And I got to the end, and I feel like it. I feel like at that point, you know, those moments where it's like, my life could go one of two ways. Right? And mine went in the I'm done with it. Wait a minute, rather than the give me the next I almost got the next one. But then I was like, No, and I know you did. I did. But we still have another round at the same point. I'm
Margie:not ashamed of shouldn't be that time because it's what society and culture Sure has. groomed me to think is okay. But and I still catch myself
Rachel:saying absolutely. And I think we all kind of still
Margie:do. So are we gonna write this book? Or is it too problematic to ring? Good question. I think it's too problematic to write because I think it's problematic. Yeah. With in terms of teen romance.
Rachel:I agree. Okay. I do. Yeah, no, I agree. I think I don't think this one needs it was bad. It was really bad and painful. And and but I will say I think it sparked some really interesting and productive conversation. Yes. And we would absolutely love to hear your guys's thoughts. Want to hear you. Thank
Margie:you, Olivia. Yes, thank you. Yeah, this was a great episode. It was it was a really good episode.
Rachel:mazing Yes.
Margie:So thank you again.
Rachel:Yeah, um, but I will say, because I'm sure you needed something to help distract you from that.
Margie:Yeah, he's very cute. I'm holding little cuckoo low. You are bugging him and squishing him.
Rachel:But what what other media were you consuming to take mine off of that?
Margie:Um, so I, I finished the book of S, which was that was really good. I've heard it's so good. It was really fun. And I've started reading Crazy Rich Asians. Nice, which is very funny.
Rachel:All right. Well, thank you guys for for joining us on that social justice. See, I that was a good conversation. It was a good conversation. Very
Margie:good conversation to feel cleansed after that conversation.
Rachel:It helps me bounce back from that book. Please reach out to us. We really do want to hear your opinions. We do love to hear them. Yes. And oh, thank you, Eleanor. You for the use of your song. Oh, love of the album be held? Yes. Ah. We love you all. Yeah, great. You deserve someone that's not hot and cold. Yeah. You deserve a functioning human adult. Yeah. Yeah. Also, maybe if you need it, reach out and get help. That's just fine. You're, you're allowed. It doesn't make you less of a person. You're wonderful. Yes. All right. Yes. We'll see you guys later.