Mary Carter on Education's Uncertain Future: Funding Challenges, Policy Shifts, and Global Implications

The episode features Mary Carter discussing the challenges students face in accessing higher education amid shifting federal policies and misinformation. Concerns about funding, student debt, and undocumented students illustrate a landscape fraught with uncertainty, while the conversation emphasizes the importance of advocacy and grassroots movements to protect educational access for all.

• Discussion of student anxiety relating to the Department of Education 
• The FAFSA process and its significance in obtaining financial aid 
• Breakdown of various college tuition costs and financial aid opportunities 
• Examination of student loan forgiveness programs 
• Challenges faced by undocumented students regarding financial aid 
• The larger implications of proposed cuts to federal aid programs 
• The importance of political engagement and grassroots activism in education policy

Transcript

Speaker 2 0:09

Hello everyone, I'm Al Neely Welcome to Listen Up Podcast and today we have Mary Carter. She is a college counselor at a high school and I wanted to have her come in and talk about what she's experiencing, what she's seeing with her students and their concerns about going to college under the present administration and their policies. Mc say hi to everyone. Hey everybody. Okay, MC's a friend of mine. I've known her for a while, so we're just going to sit here and talk Sounds good, like we would just normally do, having a conversation yeah.

Speaker 2 0:51

So I guess about three months ago, I noticed a post that you had put up Um you said that your students were concerned about whether they would be able to get um be able to get into college and have uh money to get into college, right, um, can you talk about that? Why was that a concern?

Speaker 1 1:17

Sure got elected something. I don't know if it was on TikTok, I don't know where it started, but students started hearing Trump wants to get rid of the Department of Education. The Department of Education is where Pell Grant comes from, where student loans come from, and so students started thinking well, I can't go to college and I can't tell you how many kids came in, miss Scott, do I even bother filing my FAFSA when it opens? Because what's the point? The Department of Education is going away. And I said at the time do not panic. I talked him off a cliff. I'm like that's not going to happen. That's a really unpopular idea Across both aisles. The Department of Education being dismantled is not going to happen. Right, that's what I thought in November.

Speaker 2 2:09

Okay, so fast forward to now. What's actually taking place? I haven't really been following what's going on because I feel like after the first administration, it's just, you know, following the news every day to see something that's going on. It wears you out.

Speaker 1 2:34

It's not good for your mental health.

Speaker 2 2:35

Right, so I basically, once the election was over, I stopped listening to the news. Stop listening to the news. Of course, I have to focus on some aspects, because a lot of things I talk about has to do with society and the community, and so I have to focus on that, but I haven't specifically got into what's taking place with the Department of Education. Do you know?

Speaker 1 3:00

Yes. So he had always been saying he wanted to dismantle the Department of Education and now, as I said, the rule of thought was oh well, it's not going to happen. But now, with the way Musk is going in and talking about how he's going to dismantle all these departments, and then Trump's continuing to say this about the Department of Education, that it's seeming like it's more and more likely. So what that would mean now the Department of Education, yes, it handles for college students, it handles the loans, gives out Pell Grant, work, study, stuff like that. They're saying that that can be moved over to the Treasury Department. So in an ideal world, if the Department of Education does get dismantled and it gets moved over to the Treasury Department, students will still get their Pell Grants, still get their loans. There's been some talk about it.

Speaker 2 4:01

I thought he was trying to control the Treasury Department as well. Oh yes, oh I mean all the departments.

Speaker 1 4:07

I mean Musk was just yesterday said that he wants to systematically dismantle. I mean a large number of departments. It's right now. They're just causing chaos. It's an absolute mess. So at this point it's almost like a guessing game. Some people are speculating that they're going to want to privatize the loans, which would benefit the banks and all of his rich cronies. So they can make, because I would always advise a student to take out a loan from the federal government. First year students, for example, can only take out $5,500. That's the max they can take out from the federal government. So if they need more than that, they can go to a bank, but the federal government one. Some of them are subsidized, so you don't have to start paying interest on them until after you graduate or drop out which hopefully the student won't do or fall below half-time. So their interest rates are lower. They're more forgiving. If your income is low, you can do an income driven plan so you don't pay as much yada yada.

Speaker 2 5:13

banks no it's like trying to qualify for a loan under any other circumstance.

Speaker 1 5:19

Yes, Yep, they would have to, whereas a student doesn't have to go through a credit check to get a student loan from the federal government. But they would, obviously from a bank, because a bank wants to protect themselves. The federal government is just way more forgiving of a lender. So I would discourage anyone from going to a bank and getting one unless they absolutely have to and getting one unless they absolutely have to. But if they let's say they choose and again we're speculating here let's say they choose to then privatize all the loans and get out of the loan business, that would be a real pickle for a lot of students. Interestingly, I had a student one year this was years ago who said I think I'm just going to put all of my college on credit cards and then declare bankruptcy because you can't get rid of student loans with bankruptcy. And I was like are you a genius or is that the stupidest?

Speaker 2 6:18

idea I've ever heard. I remember when I was in college I had a guy I was working with with a car like that. With a credit card, and then well, With a credit card, I'm like geez, do you know how much you're paying in interest? Yeah, crazy. So I have a question, two questions the makeup or the demographic of usually the students that are seeking out federal monies for college, do you have any idea?

Speaker 1 6:52

Yeah, so students who are eligible for Pell Grant, and there's an algorithm, a formula that I'm not privy to, but the max amount of Pell Grant that's free money from the federal government that a student can get is $7,395, but it's like a sliding scale, so, and it's based on family's income and family size right Family size right. So I would say, like a student who is in a family of four whose parents make about $50,000, $60,000 or less, they'll get some Pell Grant. Again, this is an estimate. I mean a lot of it varies, the age of the parents matters and stuff like that. So really, when it comes to Pell Grant, that's going to be more lower, middle to lower class students, like low income students.

Speaker 2 7:53

Gotcha.

Speaker 1 7:53

So, but loans anybody, regardless of income, can get, and so then the FAFSA then goes to the colleges, and then the colleges can add additional.

Speaker 2 8:05

FAFSA are the loans.

Speaker 1 8:06

The FAFSA is the free application for federal student aid that they complete. And the FAFSA is what determines if they get Pell Grant and if they get loans.

Speaker 2 8:15

Okay.

Speaker 1 8:16

Then that FAFSA goes to the colleges. The colleges put together a financial aid award letter that will include other things or could include other things letter that will include other things or could include other things. State grant money if it's an in-state school institutional grant money, that's all free money from the government, Then the state government in that case is or the college.

Speaker 2 8:35

So what is it? Run now to go to college. What would you say? Okay.

Speaker 1 8:42

That depends greatly on where you're going. All right, we'll start Cheapest on where you're going. Let's all right, we'll start cheapest people. Community college, let's start, okay, yeah we'll start at tower community college here, ballpark. If you're taking two semesters full-time, about five thousand dollars, let's say, is the direct expenses, that's tuition and right. Let's say you want to look at like an ODU, there's again and state their tuition and fees runs about 13,000 ish.

Speaker 1 9:14

If you want to live on campus. That's okay If you want to live on campus. You're looking about like an additional 12,000. All right, so that's like ODU, virginia, wesleyan, their tuition, that's what I'm thinking like a small private school. Their tuition and fees is maybe shoot, I don't want to lie to you $38,000, $40,000 maybe, and then living on campus is usually around $12,000.

Speaker 2 9:39

Then it can go their fees, or what.

Speaker 1 9:42

Tuition and fees and then room and board you got. Tuition and fees is about $40. For like a little large company that's for yes, that's for, like Virginia Wesleyan, but you think that's expensive Schools. There are private schools that go up to $85,000. But what I'll say about those schools is they give really the schools that typically go about $85,000 give amazing financial aid to low-income students, really, yeah, so most people do not pay sticker price.

Speaker 1 10:14

You'd have to be loaded to pay the full $85,000. So there's a lot of grant money out there. The FAFSA, again, that's through the federal government, through the Department of Education. So what would happen to that? Would the Treasury Department run the FAFSA? It's so overwhelming this whole and I hate the fact that I told my students you'll be okay, they're not going to do that. It's an unpopular idea. But right now the Republicans are bending the knee for everything that this administration wants to do, almost like completely, almost unanimously, yeah.

Speaker 2 10:54

So one of the things I never really understood was when they were talking about student loan forgiveness. Student loan forgiveness, first of all. Why does it cost so much to go to college? That's number one, right Two I'd never really thought about it, but when I take a look at the endowments that these schools have, why, first of all, why are they charged so much? And then, number two, why are they so hooked on, you know, forgiving some of the student debt Some of these, these colleges have? They have stockpiles of money bigger than Apple and Amazon, these colleges. So I'm sitting here going why, and can you imagine? You're a college and you have a football program, you have a basketball program, you're a major college. What are you doing with all the money?

Speaker 1 12:02

Right, yeah, so why schools cost so much? That's a darn good question. That's a question for the people who make those. I will say the thing about endowments is like, for example, harvard right has an enormous endowment In Virginia, washington and Lee has a really large endowment. University of Richmond, uva large endowment University of Richmond, uva. But those three schools that I actually including Harvard, those schools all meet 100% of demonstrated need because their endowment is so large. If a low income student, if the federal government, through their process, determines that the student can pay $0 to go to school, they will pay $0 to go to that school. So that's where the endowment comes into play.

Speaker 2 12:46

So yes.

Speaker 1 12:47

Scholarships, that what. Through that, through scholarships and grants, that's how they uh, they pay for it and then you know it's in there and it's spinning off income for the school. Another reason why colleges they're competing with one another, right, so they're like we got to have the nicest facilities. You know we need to have the best All of that stuff to attract students. Like University of Alabama has like a lazy river or something in their gym, like with their pool or something I don't know. It sounds amazing, but yeah, so stuff like that.

Speaker 2 13:16

So you can drink some bourbon and and float around.

Speaker 1 13:20

Yes, yeah. But one thing I'll say about the student loan forgiveness, and I think a lot of people don't understand this. Student loan forgiveness was done. If somebody works and the you know, like a nonprofit or in the public sector or something like that, and pays on their loan for 10 years straight, so that's a lot of loan payments and I can attest to the fact because I had loans from my master's program they have been paying primarily interest, but they have probably paid more than the actual loan was in the first place. So, yes, the government would be eating the interest, but it would be more like if you lent money to a friend and then Allow them to pay you back whatever.

Speaker 1 14:23

And then your friend paid you back in full, but with not all of the interests that make. Does that make sense? So nobody's getting? I think there's a misunderstanding and people are like, well, they should have to pay all that interest. So is the federal government in the business to just to take money from people?

Speaker 2 14:42

So, if I'm hearing you correctly, they're actually making more money the longer term for the loan Because they're making interest on the loan.

Speaker 1 14:54

Yeah, I mean, I'll tell you my grad school loan.

Speaker 2 14:56

I'm surprised they want to get rid of that program.

Speaker 1 14:58

Right, right. Well, you could also say that that money could be accruing interest if it were sitting in a. Yeah, I do not want to lie to you and tell you I'm like an economics. Ok.

Speaker 2 15:09

Got you.

Speaker 1 15:09

Yeah, but I will say that I know from having loans myself that you can keep chipping away at it and see the principle on your loan go up, go up. So when people are getting loan forgiveness, I would say in more cases than not they have paid off, technically paid off more than they actually borrowed, except for they've been chipping away at interest and not really chipping away much of the principal. So it seems like they're getting away without paying, but they really have paid it.

Speaker 1 15:42

You know, what I mean. Anyway, that's something I feel like people need to know, because they're like it's not like.

Speaker 2 15:48

Hey, I borrowed $20,000 and I didn't pay a dime on it, yeah, but if you listen to these narrows, all your bums you should pay for what you got.

Speaker 1 15:57

And I would say a lot of the people that say that either didn't go to college themselves or they didn't have to take out loans themselves to college themselves or they didn't have to take out loans themselves. I don't think that anybody would say that if they had ever had student loans before, because you would see how the process works. And so, and my gosh, you're working for a nonprofit for 10 years. You're not making a whole lot of money but you're providing, you know, a wonderful service to the community, more than likely. Or you're a teacher, you know, working in the public school system. You've done all of that, paid on that for 10 years. You paid more than you borrowed. I don't see the downside in cutting people some slack, but again, you know I understand it's a hot button uh topic, but that's my two cents on it anyway.

Speaker 2 16:49

Gotcha. So how long have you been in the public school?

Speaker 1 16:54

I am in my 14th year at the.

Speaker 2 17:04

I think it's misleading to think if you get rid of the Department of Education, it's going to affect completely your local schools, because local schools are funded by your locality and states and things like that. But how do you see any effects?

Speaker 1 17:25

Oh, it will impact local schools, but you are correct in your assertion that they are primarily funded by our local communities. Sure, that's why in wealthier neighborhoods they have the nicer schools. Quote unquote. You know, but Title I is a program where federal government gives money to the, gives money to the lowest income schools Programs to support students with disabilities. That's a huge one. Yeah, that one is.

Speaker 2 17:57

Yeah, that's the one that probably touches me the most. Right? Yeah, I've had. I did Podcasts with someone that works with autistic children and they were talking about the effect of Title I with students that need that help and then the parents that can't pay for it how it affects them. That's an interesting one, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 18:21

So you've got Title I funding. You've got students with disabilities. You've got civil rights protections Title I funding. You've got students with disabilities you've got civil rights protections.

Speaker 1 18:29

The Department of Ed, you know, just kind of serves in that capacity. So this would be it would really impact students that have IEPs and 504s. I mean, I just I can't even imagine. Iep is an individualized Education Plan for Students with Disabilities, a 504 is, I guess, like a less intensive version of an IEP. That's usually students who have ADHD or maybe autism or something like that. Some autistic students have IEPs but many have 504s. It depends on their function.

Speaker 2 19:09

Have you worked with students with those types of?

Speaker 1 19:11

things. Yes, oh, for sure, yes, a lot of students with 504. And they've been productive.

Speaker 2 19:15

Mm-hmm. Oh yeah, have you gotten in college?

Speaker 1 19:17

Yes, yeah, even students with learning disabilities have gone to school. I mean it's amazing. I had this amazing young woman. She goes to Norfolk State now and she advocated for herself so well. When she needed help, she would seek it out and she I mean she had a learning disability and she's doing so well at Norfolk State right now. She's still in touch with me and she still asks me questions and I say, hey, seek out this resource. She's just amazing. So there's some really amazing students. I have to say and I might be getting off topic here but when the election, the day after the election, I was, I mean, devastated would be putting it mildly for a variety of reasons, but more than anything was thinking about my students. I have a lot of undocumented students or students with undocumented parents. That's who I cried for the most the day after the election, those students thinking how petrified they must be or their parents must be. I have a lot of LGBTQ students right and this administration is clearly not friendly to them. Yeah, what's?

Speaker 2 20:32

so funny is that everybody knows someone that's one of those designations or has somebody in their family.

Speaker 1 20:59

That's going to impact somebody that all of us love. Yeah, them talking about possibly cutting most Medicaid, and so I did some research. There's 80, just under 80 million Americans who have Medicaid.

Speaker 2 21:14

Right.

Speaker 1 21:14

And I have so many students who get Medicaid. They want to do a 20% cut to SNAP, which is food stamps.

Speaker 2 21:25

Yeah, yeah, I don't get it. The whole thought about those programs is that we can run the country better if we get everybody off the social programs. But I would be willing to bet somebody in your family or somebody close to you know is on a program or receiving money for something from it. So we've always been a socialist company. We're not completely socialist.

Speaker 1 21:53

But we have some socialist policies yeah.

Speaker 2 21:55

Yeah, and we have for a long time and people use them on a daily basis and they benefit from it.

Speaker 1 22:01

Yeah, and I will say it's interesting. I had this conversation with a student the other day.

Speaker 2 22:04

I want to go back to something you said, but go ahead.

Speaker 1 22:09

Oh well, there are certainly people that abuse the system, but is that a reason to not have that safety net for the betterment of society? I just so. I have a lot of students that would suffer.

Speaker 2 22:19

Yeah.

Speaker 1 22:20

I mean they even want to get like reduced uh, get rid of free or reduced lunch. Some, some uh politicians are talking. Talking about this is just to me it's just heartbreaking yeah, um so you said you wanted to get back to something. Yeah, I want to talk about the um.

Speaker 2 22:38

What's your experience or what have you been seeing with um? The students that um are undocumented. Now are they in school or they're coming to school. What's going on, interestingly. How does that happen? How do you? Let's just talk about how does that happen. How do you become an undocumented student?

Speaker 1 23:03

Okay, so I'll tell you that most of our students that are undocumented, came here on asylum, fleeing a dangerous government. So they came here legally, but they don't have I mean legally under asylum status. But they don't have social security numbers.

Speaker 1 23:19

They don't have green cards, so they're technically undocumented, yeah, but the process is incredibly lengthy and incredibly backlogged and right now it's frozen right. But a lot of students I have they're documented because they were born here, so they're naturalized citizens, but their parents are undocumented and so they're fearful for their parents. And so we'll do a student who was born here can do the FAFSA because they're an American citizen, but then their parents have to be on there and so that's petrifying for a lot of the parents to put their information onto this form. But can I tell you, these undocumented parents are putting so much money into our government and they can't get social security yes, how are they putting in taxes?

Speaker 1 24:10

filing taxes? Yeah, they're paying taxes like they're getting paychecks. Yeah, they're. They have itin numbers. They're working. They're paying taxes.

Speaker 1 24:19

They have to file their taxes okay they do not get any of the federal uh benefits. They're paying into social security they're not going to get it. They're paying into medicare they're not going to get it. They're paying into Medicare they're not going to get it. So if you get rid of a lot of these undocumented families, we're going to lose a lot of income. I'm not talking about Venezuelan gang members. Do you know what I mean? I mean there's certainly people here that need to go, but there's also a lot of people that are paying their taxes and they're good people in our communities, and I realize that's a hot button issue. I feel particularly strong about it because of who I work with every day.

Speaker 2 25:09

Yeah, yeah, you're invested.

Speaker 1 25:12

You see it every day, you talk to these people every day.

Speaker 2 25:15

Yeah, so I get it. I understand that's interesting. You know how do you determine who's good and who's bad? I guess you don't really know, but um, I had no idea that. Um, they were paying into the system taxes.

Speaker 1 25:37

Oh, yeah, something like and I again I don't want to lie to you, but it's something like, um, all undocumented, uh, undocumented, um, people in this country pay something like $86 billion in taxes. I'd have to Google that to get the exact figure, but it's something astounding like that. So there's got to be a way to differentiate between the people who came here on asylum, like the people who came here on asylum and you know it's like it's a civil crime, not a. It's not like a felony, um, you know to to be here. So I, I just I feel like there are a lot of really wonderful people that are here, but then I know, I know people say, well, then, just come here legally.

Speaker 1 26:24

But it's not that easy when someone comes here on asylum but then they can't, they're caught up in the system that's moving incredibly slowly. I have a lawyer, an immigration lawyer, but it's been a couple years now. I mean, this is what I hear a lot and it's very hard. So Virginia has something that undocumented students can complete which is like the FAFSA, but it's called the VASA Virginia application for state aid. I believe is what it stands for. They can complete that. They're not going to be eligible for federal money. They're not going to be eligible for Pell Grant or the loans from the federal government, but they will be if the parents pay taxes in the state of Virginia they can be eligible for and they've gone to high school in Virginia for at least two years, they can get in-state tuition and possibly get state grant money.

Speaker 2 27:22

Wow.

Speaker 1 27:24

Yeah, so that not every state has that. That's something that virginia had. Um, I'm kind of surprised that uh yunkin didn't try to get rid of it I think he probably did right, but then yeah, I think the state legislator, they wouldn't allow him to yeah I think he did.

Speaker 2 27:42

I think he was trying to cozy up next to um the guy at the top right now.

Speaker 1 27:48

Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 27:49

The extremely right wing people.

Speaker 1 27:52

So, yeah, it didn't work. Nope, yeah, no, we've got. Yeah, so I? I mean, if somebody has been paying taxes in the state of Virginia and living here for a couple of years, give give them in state tuition. I mean they were here. I Give them in-state tuition. I mean they were here. Yeah, and I understand that not everyone feels this way. Yeah, I will confess I am a very empathetic person. I have a bit of a bleeding heart for other people. So I think about, like the stuff that I'm telling you I'm upset about will not affect me. It will not affect me. Getting rid of Medicaid, it's not going to affect me. Getting rid of lowering food stamps eligibility, it's not going to affect me. Do you know what I mean? I'm not undocumented, I'm not LGBTQ, like I am concerned for other people, but some people they're more focused on, well, what's going to impact me? What's going to affect me? And so that's a different mindset and I just don't have that.

Speaker 2 28:57

Right, interesting, yeah, so finish talking about the programs. I think we left off it before we changed the subject.

Speaker 1 29:11

You were talking about the programs that are being affected by the federal government. Oh, yeah, so well. Yeah, I mean right now. So they're locking, you know, congressmen out of the various departments who are trying to get in and see what's being done, and they're not letting congressmen in to see and they're saying we found all this waste and fraud. Okay, can we see this waste and fraud Crickets? Nothing showing what this waste and fraud is. But it just came out that Marco Rubio just signed a deal with Musk, for the State Department is buying $400 million Did you see this Of Tesla armored Tesla trucks?

Speaker 2 29:58

Well, yeah that part. I don't understand how people just don't ever see it coming. I'm not trying to be funny.

Speaker 1 30:09

No, but I mean, come on, the writing was on the wall, come on oh so that was one of the things that I always tend to look at history.

Speaker 2 30:18

It just repeats itself. It doesn't Century empire. It's all to enrich the people that are in power and the people themselves. They tend to lose, lose out the people that we're talking about, the people that we see on a regular basis, people that can't afford to lose their Medicare, the ones that can't afford to go to college to pay for it themselves. So I think I don't think people look at history the way I've looked at it but it's with every century, every empire, every country that's been in power, you see it.

Speaker 2 31:11

So I feel like that's what the whole idea was, with Musk getting in there so he can get.

Speaker 1 31:26

He's benefiting greatly, while trying to cut things that will impact ordinary people yeah, because he doesn't have any relations with anybody like we see, yeah, so I mean it's pretty obvious.

Speaker 2 31:39

But you take a look at all the other countries that are like that around the world Russia yeah, because we want to be just like them they pay Putin, whatever. And if he gets mad at me, he takes their stuff.

Speaker 1 31:53

Oh, I mean, he's cozying up to Russia right now. He's making enemies of our allies. He's throwing Ukraine under the bus.

Speaker 2 32:03

Who's?

Speaker 1 32:04

that Trump or Musk? Well, I mean Musk is pulling the strings, right, but oh, I haven't really been paying attention.

Speaker 1 32:12

Oh see, I pay too much attention. So, um, but you know another program and and this gets to that point um talking about, when we go back to talking about musk with this, he's getting all these contracts. He's talking about waste and fraud. Well, for example, he's, he, you know, they froze USA ID, which is aid to other countries, which is a form of like kind of soft um, I forget what they call it, but, um, it's. It's a way to maintain diplomacy and maintain our place in the world by helping other countries, right, and so, um, musk froze it. And then you, you have them, the people who are like we should be spending money not on other countries, right, and so Musk froze it. And then you have the people who are like we should be spending money not on other countries, but on us. But there's something to be said by being viewed in a positive light and having allies.

Speaker 2 33:00

They're isolationists, yeah, which means that I don't know. The only thing I really have a problem with that is you don't quite understand. Everybody is connected. We can't function.

Speaker 1 33:14

Yeah.

Speaker 2 33:14

There's a lot of people that just can't function at a high level without the assistance of the United States, and then, in turn, it kind of benefits us as well.

Speaker 1 33:25

Exactly right. That's what people don't understand.

Speaker 2 33:28

I don't necessarily like it. A lot of it has to do with money or occupation militarily, but that's another thing that's happened throughout history.

Speaker 1 33:41

Yes, oh, yes. And one thing I think is so. Elon Musk is claiming I don't even I've heard. There's Russian propaganda too that's coming out and talking about.

Speaker 2 33:49

That's another thing, yeah.

Speaker 1 33:51

Cut all that off. Yeah, but that's talking about, like, what USAID is being used for, and one of them was drag shows in Argentina. Okay, okay, I don't know the truth is in that, but it's. But that's something like a, but that's something like $100,000. So in my mind it's like, hey, look at this over here, this $100,000 for drag shows in Argentina. Again, I don't know that right, but while Musk is over here getting a $400 million contract with the State Department, what You're worried about? $100, dollars for drag shows. We don't know whether that's accurate or not, and that's what people are getting so angry on social media, while while somebody's uh, fleecing us over here. And do you think, if we stopped that a hundred thousand dollars to argentina, or um hiv, um aid, um in africa, do you think that you're going to pay less taxes? No, you're not. It might pay down our national debt, but not really because of the tax cuts for the millionaires and the billionaires. That's who's going to benefit from it.

Speaker 2 34:58

Well, one of the things I have noticed in the last few days is that I kept trying to explain to people that when Trump was in office the first time, how bad he was at the national debt, where he basically quadrupled it Right. So, first of all, I've been following him since the 80s. He doesn't really know what he's doing.

Speaker 1 35:27

He's not a good businessman.

Speaker 2 35:29

Okay, but the other thing that I just recently noticed is they want to cut all these programs, but they want to increase spending by $4.5 trillion.

Speaker 1 35:44

Which is almost the exact amount of the tax cuts for the wealthiest Americans.

Speaker 2 35:53

And the inflation has gone up 3% since December. Right, the Federal Reserve is trying to figure out what they're going to do with the raising the excuse me Interest rates.

Political Concerns and Grassroots Activism

Speaker 1 36:12

The interest rates he's trying to get them to lower the interest rate.

Speaker 2 36:16

I'm sitting here going. You guys not realize you guys are going to pay for this, right. I mean, we're going to pay for this.

Speaker 1 36:25

I mean the tariffs.

Speaker 2 36:28

I don't even know about that yet.

Speaker 1 36:29

Yeah, that's going on with aluminum and steel, oh really. Yeah, and Canada is getting a little retaliatory themselves, and I've talked about putting 100% tariff on Teslas, which I think is hilarious.

Speaker 2 36:44

Oh, you know what? You know what I found out last week about that I had no idea that Michigan, new York and I think it's one other state they get like 60% of their power from Canada so. Canada's like go ahead.

Speaker 1 37:09

I will shut your states down. Yeah, but poor New York, they were blue.

Speaker 2 37:13

I had no idea.

Speaker 1 37:15

Yeah, we get a lot of power from them. Lumber, I've learned so much that I did not know about. Yeah, our relationship with Canada. I'm team Canada right now. I got to say I feel for them. They've taken, like American, um alcohol off their show.

Speaker 2 37:33

Yeah, I don't. I don't really think they're playing with um. I don't, I don't really think they're going to play with this administration.

Speaker 1 37:40

No, I mean the EU is standing up right now against them. Mexico wants to sue Google for changing to Gulf of America. I mean you can't make this up. I feel like we're in a movie but a really bad one.

Speaker 2 37:58

That's why I turned off the news. I shut down my news networks because I can't do this every day. It would be just too much. I need to focus on what Al wants to focus on.

Speaker 1 38:11

Right, and I know people say, well, only focus on what you can control, and I get that. But at the same time, if the people are complacent and keep their heads down and their fingers in their ears, that's when they can fully take over. So I've joined, like grassroots organizations, to try to focus on the state and local level. I am a protester Like I am. This is in my blood. My parents raised me this way. I'm very passionate about politics and now, right now, I'm not shutting up.

Speaker 2 38:41

That's good. I am not a person that's that compassionate. I'm more about people. So that was one of the reasons I like to do what I'm doing so I can educate people about things, but I'm probably I did what I could the last election Voting.

Speaker 1 39:02

I know the last election Voting, I know it didn't work. Well, that's funny, because my boyfriend's like well, I was just raised, you vote and it doesn't go your way. You're like okay well, it's different.

Speaker 2 39:13

It's different yeah.

Speaker 1 39:14

And I'm not raised that way.

Speaker 1 39:17

You know I marched on Washington with my mom. I've gone to lobby day at the state capitol. You know I marched on Washington with my mom. I've gone to lobby day at the state capitol. You know I have yeah, it's ingrained in me. And so the last Trump administration. I didn't post things on social media much, maybe one little sad, you know post once. Oh, now I am because I feel like people need to open their eyes. This Project 2025 is frightening. If you read it in its entirety, or even a Cliff Notes version. It and the and the men who wrote it. They believe we should be a monarchy. They think there's nothing wrong with a dictatorship.

Speaker 2 39:58

They, I have researched them and I've researched their belief system and, um, that's been frightening, right? Because everything that they believe is the exact opposite of what. Why this country is here, uh-huh right, they want a monarchy. They, they want to yeah, we fought with England for that reason. Right, so we can have freedoms and have a monarchy.

Speaker 1 40:29

One of the guys who helped write it was quoted saying, oh, that we should just get rid of local and state governments To just have one government. I mean, yeah, the more I read about it, you know, and I thought that it was just like, oh, that's scary, but that's not going to happen. Well, right now it's check, check, it's happening. So, yeah, I mean, musk bought this election. Peter Thiel, that guy Is it, thiel Thiel? Whatever? I mean, they're all in cahoots and they've got the money and they're able to do it. They can buy elections. Will there ever be an election that Musk doesn't buy? I don't know. So I feel like people need to be aware. That's why I am shouting, that's why I'm paying attention.

Speaker 2 41:28

So, yeah, yeah I think some people are um focused on the, the election in the next two years, where you're voting for your representant.

Speaker 1 41:45

Yeah senators, congressmen, stuff like that. We have this November, we have our governor race, so we've got that and it's gosh. I feel like the Democrats are going to win because the Republicans are a bit of a nut, so, but hey, you know what? I thought Harris was going to win. So take what I say with a grain of salt.

Speaker 2 42:14

Interesting yeah, but we'll see.

Speaker 1 42:16

Yeah, I mean the midterm elections will be interesting. I think you know Trump distanced himself from project 2024 so much and just ran on immigration, racism, uh-huh and yes, anti-dei, yep Xenophobia, yeah, all of that, all the hate. He ran on hate and eggs. He did the hate stuff.

Speaker 2 42:43

And your eggs cost more now.

Speaker 1 42:44

And I'm on a DEI committee at my organization, like I am on the DEI committee.

Speaker 2 42:50

How long have you been on that?

Speaker 1 42:52

Three, two, three years and it's. I mean I was from the ground floor, like it's infancy. You know it didn't exist. Who have?

Speaker 2 43:02

you seen it benefit the most? Who in our demographic have you seen it benefit?

Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion in Politics

Speaker 1 43:11

Well, interestingly so, I think, people. When it comes to DEI, I think a lot of it. It is not about hiring somebody who's less qualified just because you want a black person or because you want a woman. Right, that's not what it is. It's offering them a seat at the table, offering a woman a seat at the table. If you didn't have things like affirmative action back in the day, or DEI, you didn't set some rules to hey, at least interview a person of color, at least interview a woman, it would be a white men's club, do you know?

Speaker 2 43:50

what I mean?

Speaker 1 43:51

Yeah, you mean like the government? Yes, right, let me guess Very much right.

Speaker 2 43:55

We thought that.

Speaker 1 43:56

Obama thinks it turned around. Nope, yes, absolutely the government. Well, you look at the Republican Party, and it was even a Republican who said when you look at the Democrats, they look like America.

Speaker 2 44:07

They do now.

Speaker 1 44:08

Right, yes.

Speaker 2 44:09

Right. They, they it was pretty much the same up until the 70s?

Speaker 1 44:16

Heck yeah, oh yeah. So, um, I think women benefit from DEI, people of color benefit from DEI, but what's infuriating to me is Trump and his cronies blaming everything on DEI and assuming if you are a woman, if you are a person of color, you are not qualified for that job. It's the automatic assumption. So if you're white, qualified, if you're a person of color, dei hire. They said that about Kamala. Are you kidding me?

Speaker 2 44:50

Well, I have my thoughts on that. Okay, so these are the things that I study and I research eye research. If you take a look at the top one, two, three income earning groups Indian Indian, it's number one, yeah. Asians, asian Americans. And white Well, I hate saying this, but Jewish, oh, okay, they're white.

Speaker 1 45:23

but okay, yeah, in this country.

Speaker 2 45:27

Yeah, but I told you I had to spend some time in the hospital recently.

Speaker 1 45:35

Yes, right.

Speaker 2 45:37

Plus, I've talked to a lot of my I ask people questions when they have a different opinion. I usually ask them questions what? What do you mean by what? Those you know, what do you mean by? There's too many foreign students in medical school, so these are questions I ask, and most of the time I'm asking men, white men, so I'm getting a feeling as to what they're fearful of.

Speaker 1 46:04

Right.

Speaker 2 46:05

So what I've learned through having people that are in medical school close relationship people that are in medical school and then talking to white men that are older, that were in the medical profession is that there's a lot of students, and a lot of these students that are coming over are students from India and Arab, so a lot of your doctors are. So of course, they don't want them. This is my thought.

Speaker 2 46:36

They don't want them in medical school anymore because they want to be able to be the top student in medical school anymore, because they want to be able to be the top student in medical school. That's my thought, right, but one of the things that they have in common, those groups is education, and a lot of the programs that they benefit from have been set up. You know, the civil rights programs have barely benefited the Asian people, the what is it when you have school, the affirmative action programs, okay, these have benefited a lot of foreign people, right, and they're the best students.

Speaker 1 47:23

I will say that affirmative action has started to disproportionately negatively impact Asian students because they are not considered underrepresented in higher education. For the percentage of the population they're actually overrepresented in higher education.

Speaker 2 47:40

So this is why they are where they are and this is why there's a fear. I feel like um cause the Indians, the uh. Middle Easterners and the Asians are your top students in medical schools, right?

Speaker 1 47:56

Yeah.

Speaker 2 47:57

Right how many hospitals you walk into. Most of them your doctors and your nurses.

Speaker 1 48:01

My neurologist is Indian. My primary care physician is Indian.

Speaker 2 48:07

So that's your threat there. So of course you want to get them out of your schools, right? Yeah Well, I don't.

Speaker 1 48:11

I'm just saying Don't look at me, no.

Speaker 2 48:14

Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 48:16

No, but what I believe and this might sound cynical, but I believe the anti-DEI and the anti-woke is white men afraid of losing their power and privilege in this country, which they've had forever right. So now they want to get rid of all the brown people right, particularly those from South America, and so that they, because they're starting to feel outnumbered. That's the way I see it, so that's my opinion.

Speaker 2 48:51

Gotcha.

Speaker 1 48:52

Yeah, okay.

Speaker 2 48:54

So how do you think it's going to go? This whole, it's going to go well, no, are they going to be able to get rid of him?

Speaker 1 49:03

Not with the Republicans currently, because they're all falling in lockstep. I believe, I really believe that if they put these cabinet nominees up for a vote anonymously, I mean RFK wouldn't have been.

Speaker 2 49:21

They are so not qualified. They are horrible Hegseth.

Speaker 1 49:24

Are you kidding me, did you see? Anyway, yeah, no, they're not Talk about DEI hires, they're all like the least qualified people. It's bananas.

Speaker 2 49:38

I have to say like, for example, that's scary to me. That's more scary to me because I look at the accidents and the tragedies that have happened on the railways, in the air, on the highways right, and one of the things I will say is buddha jets was an extremely good secretary of transportation right, it's like soon as he left. There's been like it's like an airplane crash every week right.

Speaker 1 50:18

yeah, I mean people are speckling because he fired the FAA, like the head of the FAA who knows?

Speaker 2 50:26

So this stuff is in the back of my mind. I'm like, oh, I want to go to California next year. I'm sitting there thinking I'm probably not flying.

Speaker 1 50:35

I did just get back from California. I flew, I flew, I flew. I went out to California for my nephew's bar mitzvah, and it was right. I mean days after that happened. So yeah, I experienced it, yeah. But I survived, I survived, I'm here, okay, I'm here to tell the story.

Speaker 2 50:55

So yeah, that airplane crashed in Philadelphia. It was right, pretty much right down the street from my house. Oh, really, yeah, crashed in.

Speaker 1 51:01

Philadelphia. It was pretty much right down the street from my house. Oh really, wow, it sure seems like it's happening a lot.

Speaker 2 51:09

Yeah, those are things I look at. I don't know.

Speaker 1 51:16

Well, I'm concerned for this country and where it's headed. As I said, you're in danger, girl.

Speaker 2 51:25

Yeah, I'll do my part. I'll try to get as many people on as diverse as possible and talk about things. So I'm trying to get some people in power in the state on and see what happens. Yeah, I just think that people need to be aware, some people in power in the state. Honestly, we'll talk to them, let's see what happens.

Speaker 1 51:42

Yeah, I just think that people need to be aware. And if you're aware and you're cool with what's going on, okay, but if you're not, we need all the numbers we can get to. You know what I mean to stand up to what's going on. There's power in numbers, but they got money.

Speaker 2 51:59

Yeah, but you know what MC there's, a third of the people are just. They didn't vote I know, they were indifferent. They don't think the system works right. I was talking to family members. He's like I don't vote. I'm like why don't you vote? He said, because it doesn't you know. They have the whole thing set up anyway.

Speaker 1 52:25

And I'm sitting there going huh, it's sad, it's a sad mentality when you feel the system is rigged against you.

Speaker 2 52:30

Or it doesn't work for you.

Speaker 1 52:33

Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 52:34

When you actually have the power. Well, you used to, right, I don't know what's going to happen now, but you used to.

Speaker 1 52:40

Yeah Right, yeah, right, yeah yeah. Who knows what's going to happen now, I don't know. I, as hopeless as I feel sometimes, I'm trying to be optimistic that, if you know, we all band together, if the courts stand up, if we can get some people into the midterms so that we're not outnumbered by Republicans, all of that. But it's very, very hard. I've never been this scared for our country than I am now. His first four years I was scared and kind of said the Muslim ban and that kind of stuff Like it upset me. This is next level because of project 2025.

Speaker 2 53:26

Yeah, but you know, I I know you're saying Republicans there's Democrats that are exactly the same way, like, for example, I saw the other day there was one Democrat that well, you saw there were several and Congress and over the last five or six years, but they vote a certain way to get in uh-huh and then they get in the people that put a man or they were supposed to be representing they're not really vote against their interests, and so I I don't.

Speaker 2 54:07

I don't know if it's, I just think it's the majority of the politicians right.

Speaker 1 54:11

I say when I say republican and democrats, I'm talking about like. If you look at these, not cabinet nominees, it was almost down party lines, except for mitch, for Mitch McConnell, who was the only one who had the guts to vote against them because I mean, he's already like Well, but the only reason he did? Because he's not running for reelection. You know that other. So my point is we need more Democrats who will stand up to Trump. I mean, there could be Republicans that stand up for Trump, but they're not.

Speaker 2 54:41

I mean there could be Republicans that stand up for Trump, but they're not. So let's put like this OK, I know your point. There's a few that have a spine or a backbone or that will have principle and vote with principle, and so I do feel like that is the case. Very few. Ok with the Democrats they tend to care more about people. I believe a lot of the ways that they do things and then their programs are not beneficial and it doesn't help them. That's why they lost. So there tends to be more Democrats.

Speaker 2 55:24

That care about people, so I know your point, but I think people in general are just disenfranchised. Yeah, this two-party system. Because, okay, all right, I still want to stay in power, I still want wealth, I still want influence. Okay, I'm going to vote with you a little bit to get this.

Speaker 1 55:44

It's a game.

Speaker 2 55:45

Yeah, and it's. You know it's going to be against my um, my constituent, See, but the best is for you guys, Right? So I'm going to keep my power.

Speaker 1 56:01

State office though yeah, yeah, I mean that's yeah, no, it's, I'll tell you if you want to feel the grassroots thing.

Speaker 2 56:10

I'm on that, yeah, Cause I've been talking with some people that are around here. They're in politics and I'm hoping that they will just ascend. I think that's the way to go.

Speaker 1 56:22

Yeah, for sure. Yeah, well, if you, if you ever want to feel optimistic about some power being instilled and people that care and the democratic party, Jasmine Crockett from Texas, I don't know if you know.

Speaker 2 56:36

Oh yeah.

Speaker 1 56:36

She is phenomenal. She and AOC are the future of the democratic party.

Speaker 2 56:42

Huh, they can't stand. I know she is phenomenal.

Speaker 1 56:43

She and AOC are the future of the Democratic.

Speaker 2 56:44

Party. Huh, they can't stand AOC I know she's great.

Speaker 1 56:46

That's why Because she's great she pulls no punches. Nor does Jasmine Crockett. I mean the way she just decimates Marjorie Taylor Greene. I mean she's brilliant. She's passionate, she cares about people. I think she's brilliant. She's passionate, she cares about people. I think she's fabulous. So there's a couple folks out there that keep me hopeful.

Speaker 2 57:08

Yeah.

Speaker 1 57:09

So that are fighting for Americans like you and me and those who can't fight for themselves.

Speaker 2 57:31

Right, right, okay, any last words? No, I appreciate you having me come on. It went from education to a bit of school, one's finishing up, but yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 57:49

See again, it's not something. Maybe that affects you and me personally, but it affects a lot of people Absolutely, and that's what matters. Yeah, in my opinion.

Speaker 2 57:57

Yeah, absolutely Okay.

Speaker 1 58:00

Well, thanks so much, this was fun.

Speaker 2 58:02

All right, well, um, thank you for following us on listen up. That's it for today. We'll catch you next time and listen up. For anyone watching this channel, I ask that you please like and subscribe for upcoming videos.