From London to Australia: A Casual Chat with Warren Eagles, CSI

Join us for a vibrant chat with colorist veteran, Warren Eagles. Broadcasting from a nice diner in Burbank, California, we get into the nitty-gritty of color grading and its evolution from film to digital. Warren paints a picture of his career progression, highlighting his move from London to Australia, how he  got started with his role as an online professor at FXPHD. Grab a good cup of coffee (or tea), sit back, and enjoy this insightful conversation with one of the industry's finest!

Links:
Warren's FXPHD Courses

Guest Links:
IG - https://www.instagram.com/warreneagles/
iColorist / ICA - https://icolorist.com/
Website - https://www.warreneagles.com.au

PixelTools
Modern Color Grading Tools and Presets for DaVinci Resolve 

Transcript

0:00:00 - Warren Eagles
You just got to learn. All these cameras, all these formats, all the codecs, it's the same. Get to know them. How do they play? Are they good to grade? Nice to grade? Got banding in the shots? Just really get to know. A new format comes out of camera. Get some of that footage, just put it in the box, play around with it, see where it breaks, what you can do with it. Same rules, same as what we did with film, as what should be doing with digital. 

0:00:26 - Jason Bowdach
Welcome to Color and Coffee, a podcast that focuses on the craft of color grading and the artists behind it. I'm your host, Jason Bowdach, and each week we'll sit down with some of the most talented and creative colorists in the industry and have a casual chat from one colorist to another. We'll share their stories, their insights, their grading tips and, of course, their beverage of choice. Whether you're a seasoned colorist or just starting out in the industry, join us for some great color discussion. Strap in, grab your mug. You're listening to Color and Coffee, so I have Warren Eagles here and we are at Nice Restaurant in Burbank, California. Welcome to the show, Warren. 

0:01:08 - Warren Eagles
Jason cheers, I've got a probably a local brew it's what you probably call here like a drip coffee, which is not bad. 

0:01:19 - Jason Bowdach
I was going to say normally my first question of the show is what are you drinking today? But we happen to just order it together, so I know you're drinking our local Burbank brew. 

0:01:26 - Warren Eagles
Well, that's the name of your show, so I figured we'd have to do that. We're drinking the local brew, folks. 

0:01:32 - Jason Bowdach
Normally we do this show remotely over river sides. We can see everybody on video, but Warren's a little bit different. He wanted to do this in person. So I'm actually having this conversation with Warren in Burbank before he goes into a color session over at Abel Cine. So this is a really different conversation. It's going to be a little bit more casual, just having people hanging out in person and talking about color. Thank you for coming on the show, warren. And as a similar question, when you're at home, what do you normally drink and what's your favorite cup of joe? 

0:02:01 - Warren Eagles
I would normally just have like a latte or flat white. 

0:02:05 - Jason Bowdach
Flat white. 

0:02:05 - Warren Eagles
I think it's invented by Australians, so you know, I can see it here now in a number of coffee shops. So it's good. But I wouldn't say I'm ever a coffee snob. I'll go with the flow. 

0:02:16 - Jason Bowdach
But I will definitely say I'm playing flat white as well. If anybody's not familiar with your work, why don't you tell us a little bit about your background? 

0:02:25 - Warren Eagles
I started in photography in London, grew up in London, I worked in photography, I wanted to be a DPR director and then I was starting working as a film projectionist, handled film, worked in film cutting rooms we're talking like late 80s, a long time ago. Then I got the chance to be a runner, like a gopher running tapes around London serving drinks. I just worked my way up and I thought, well, I'll be an editor of my way to be a DP director. Chance came to be a colorist, clark Muller, who now works here in LA. He said you want to be a colorist, I'll train you. And I thought I'll do that for a while 30 years later, still doing it, still not, you know, directed anything of notes. But I do have hopes. One day, jason, and I know I can direct something. 

0:03:17 - Jason Bowdach
You know we all evolve differently. It's funny how we all start. I started in the effects and now I'm a colorist. And you know what you might get into that director's chair soon enough, no, that's it. 

0:03:28 - Warren Eagles
So I just you know you get into it, you start doing it, you get a mortgage by a place to get a few kids paid for them. You can't then jump ship easily. You can, but it's hard financially. So, but it's changed so much. In the 30 years I've graded, you know I've gone from everything was film to now everything is basically shot digitally or shot on the phones, and do so much more in color that we could do. Then the game's completely changed, which to me keeps it interesting. 

0:03:59 - Jason Bowdach
That is so true. It's so amazing to think about when it used to be literally all film and then it started being a couple of digital shots. Now we're literally flipped where we have film as the rarity and digital as the norm, and so now film is the exception for high end production. So that's a completely different landscape than it used to be. Let's take a step back when you used to I believe you used to work in Telcini, correct? Yeah, how would you approach things differently than you would today? Because I've never worked in Telcini and I've never really worked with film. Is there any way that you would approach stuff differently than you would today? 

0:04:35 - Warren Eagles
One of my, one of my biggest bugbears or grouches, and now we never seem to get any camera sheets. Ok, so you'll, you'll get a job and you'll be looking at it. You may only get finished files or I never seem to get sheets from the production To know what space it was shot in, what frame rate it was shot in, what lenses they had. In film days you always got really regimented sheets. Pull the film out of the can you get a negative report from the lab, how it was processed, what stock it was Fuji Kodak, was it fast stock, slow stock? As a colorist you got to really know those stocks like you knew them really well. You knew where you'd have an issue. You knew if they shot a short end it could be tricky to match and batches were different as well. So they used to have to match the batches of stocks, otherwise they were slightly different. I suppose there maybe you just really knew all of those. You knew the background. You sort of knew what was coming. You couldn't change as much as you can now in terms of window shapes, like a noise reduction box was $200,000. It was grain there, just a bit of grain now. But the way that the sessions ran are pretty much the same. You still had the clients. You still had different genres that you worked on. 

Obviously, we didn't grade as much mainstream back then it was commercials, it was TV drama, but dockos and things that others didn't really do. We did music videos, A lot of those on film. Yeah, I find it great, but I think that was a good learning curve and I say that to kids coming up now. You just got to learn all these cameras, all these formats, all the codecs. It's the same. Get to know them. How do they play? Are they good to grade? Nice to grade? You know, have you got banding in the shots? Just really get to know a new format comes out or camera. Get some of that footage, just put it in the box, play around with it, see where it breaks, what you can do with it. Same rules, same as what we did with film is what should be doing the digit. 

0:06:38 - Jason Bowdach
I can understand it being really difficult without having those reports that used to have with film, especially for trying to learn digital. You're trying to especially run it through that pipeline like they used to do with digital, and without those reports, that technical information, you're lacking something that you need to learn. 

0:06:55 - Warren Eagles
Yeah, I think I think they do exist and I think what happens they also exist. From one set they go to a PA or somebody and, because I'm doing the finals, they never get past the long the line. They get stuck maybe with editorial and then you get a conform and it they sometimes don't make it down. You dig them out if you ask for them, but it's just really good sometimes to know what. You know, what they were thinking, what they did on set. So it's something I like to see probably more encouraged. 

0:07:24 - Jason Bowdach
Absolutely. It's something that I sometimes I have to get the DP or the director in the room to get that, unfortunately, now where, as you said, used to be able to get that on a piece of paper? 

0:07:33 - Warren Eagles
Yeah, yeah, a lot more regimented. 

0:07:35 - Jason Bowdach
Well, that's something that we can. We can hopefully work towards Standardizing in our industry. A little bit more is getting back to that, that information getting back through the post pipeline. That's something that I hope to work towards Getting that information going down. But Continuing on with with your history, tell us a little bit more about the FX PhD and I colorist. 

0:07:54 - Warren Eagles
I. I moved to Australia in In 99 so I was just grading in London. I had different jobs. London was mainly All-pogol, which was a controller that was a UK controller. There was a few in the States why number through London and Europe? 

And a chance came to run a Da Vinci. A lot of people scared of the big shit. Back in about 95, before 2k, 888 or do it was called, there was like a Christmas tree of menus. Most people said it's too hard to run. Instead. Well, I thought, well, no, I had an idea. Or maybe working overseas, I thought I'll get this under my belt, which I did, and it was quite hard to run. But through that I picked up three months gig in Australia, run in a Da Vinci, and three months Just turned into longer, longer Do you want a job? So find myself in Australia, which I like. It's been great for me. 

Then I was working for a number of companies there again always long-form commercials. I've always been everything, never Tight cast myself into commercials. That's why I've never had like a company Porsche or Range Rover, yeah, never. Well, I couldn't. I could have retired probably if I was stuck with ads. 

So come around, oh six, and I'm working freelance, then again doing everything, and and I get a call from FX PhD. They said we're starting this online University. Would you like to be an online professor? We're gonna teach color, you're gonna be our professor. Now, that's me. I've never went to film school. I didn't go to university. I'm thinking met professor and we're gonna do a podcast. Oh, it was a podcast. Never heard of a podcast. This is oh, six, yeah, I'll do it. You know, do everything. Always say yes, then work it out, do it. 

So we did. We made, I think, 10 45-minute lessons on DaVinci 2k and resolve. Nobody had those systems back then, hardly, because they were still $304,000. So the people who took my online training and Josh Pitock, who you know, who works here he took it. He was an avid guy but there wasn't any training. So the people took it were an after effects, are on of CP7 Avid and they're looking at it going this what colorist doesn't taking little techniques? Then obviously, as it moved on, we kept shooting them. Obviously, apple color people started coming in. They were buying it and then the big break, I suppose for us was when Black magic port DaVinci released it at the time for a thousand bucks, and then we'd there's had more customers For our training, so that's how that came around, and we're still making them, so it's good fun. I still enjoy it. 

0:10:38 - Jason Bowdach
It's tremendous training. It absolutely helped me when I was getting into resolve, I think around version nine. Yeah, I think they bought it around version eight or version nine. They really, really changed the game. Yeah, so I colorist is that training as well? 

0:10:51 - Warren Eagles
That's I colorist International Colors Academy myself and Kevin Shaw. Oh no, it was before black magic, but typically if we're talking any time before, sort of, we're gonna call it the black magic time. You would only get color training if you bought a $300,000 box in the SGO or Quonsale or Autodesk would send a guy for three days or a girl and would give you three days. Training was truly black magic. 

Yeah, so you did that training, but half of that time they were showing you the box no, whenever it really showed you techniques in color. So a lot of people on their own were going well, I can't know the buttons, but how do I get this experience and how do I run the room techniques? So we said, well, let's get together, we'll make a website and we'll encourage some other trainers to come on board and we're run classroom training. Because Kevin had run the DaVinci Academy in Florida, so he lived down Florida work for DaVinci before it's black magic. So he done. Then he was doing training stuff for new colder and I'd been doing a bit demo work For DaVinci and I thought, why not we'll make a website. Oh no, we've got different colorists to run around doing things that either Software or it's looks or it's strategies, hdr, whatever, and that's how that come around and that's still going. So we've done a lot. I suppose a lot of companies don't even make three years. 

0:12:20 - Jason Bowdach
Absolutely it's. It's really hard to run small business like in a ten, so congratulations on making that. So I hear you guys are running both in person and remote classes. 

0:12:31 - Warren Eagles
Yeah, that's the lady saying. Obviously, since the pandemic everything had went stop. On the classroom side we did a bit of zoom but you know I'm not a bigger fan for training a branch for the classroom. But we realized we need to offer both because Just not convenient for people to travel. So we've got for our 101 class we had six people in the room, which is an ideal number, but six people on zoom, so that's great both ways. We're calling it a hybrid class and we'll probably Try and run that out the different locations. 

I'm trying to get a base back in Asia. Used to go up to Asia a couple, three times a year. Singapore was a great hub for people coming in from Asia, which was good and we need to get that back going. But I just enjoy the balance between the teaching and the coloring Because I always learn things as well. You get people come in and they ask Like real left field questions and then I might have to go work that out, give them an answer. But it means I have to get up to speed with the software himself. I've got a teacher. I got to jump on the new version, watch new what's happening, just keep she current. I think that's. That's still fun, still enjoy. 

0:13:43 - Jason Bowdach
Now, as somebody who gets to not only train great worldwide, I have an interesting question for you Do you see different styles for techniques being used and being requested around the world? 

0:13:55 - Warren Eagles
Yeah, australia, we have the tendency and people tend to make things obviously a little bit warmer and hotter because it's a big desert, mm-hmm, and I think that maybe Something that we tend to do down there a bit more. I've done work in in Asia Singapore, japan, korea and there we are definitely making skin tones, definitely less wool, a lot of the thing there and I talked to Crash about this in my podcast. He went, he went and worked in up in Thailand and You'd tanned people are people who worked in the fields. They're not. They're not well to do, people that sometimes attached to the, the advertising that he was doing on the beauty industry. Oh, so they want definite pale of skin tones and if you go there and you look at any of their marketing in their big billboards, lots of people are quite pale, not too much color. They don't look on a tan or if we would probably call healthy skin tones in the West. They don't like that. So very different expectations. 

Yeah, yeah, they're very big up in Asia, very big on the hair and makeup thing. They do a lot of those ads and a lot of the the colorist back then they they sort of specialized. They were the hair and the makeup guy or girl, and they would specialize in all those beauty techniques, whether it's you know, the grading box or it's with flame as well. I was always more of a car guy. I always felt you did big car ads or you did the hair and makeup ones. You didn't cross over as much. 

0:15:27 - Jason Bowdach
I mean definitely the hair and makeup were a bit more finicky, if you like didn't want a car one, so I like that I always found that there is, and I don't think it's necessarily a colorist thing, I always think it's an agency thing and it's you know what, if you've never done a car ad or food ad, you can't do one. So I always think it's funny and there is a certain Necessity behind that. Obviously, if you've never worked with the sheen of a car before, it's gonna take you longer to work on it. But I also think that there's a little bit of BS behind that. 

0:16:01 - Warren Eagles
There is the case 22, isn't it? They're not gonna give you one. So you've done months. So how do you do one Exactly? You've got a big borrow and steal go. I'll do that and end up trying to get one under your belt. So you've got one on your reel, but you're still not the car guy. You've maybe done one and then hopefully someone gives you a go, but I find that commercials is really big water down the last few years. I don't know what it's like here in states, but just it's the whole. Budgets have just gone less, but they're spread out through so many different Versions that we have to make as colorists. So we're doing our hero, say a hero 30 that could still be on air. But then you've got your tick tocks and your socials and your 4x4, 9x16, little bumpers for shows and it's just spread out 3020 10, that's it all of those, all of those things, and so that probably adds is not as lucrative. 

Hence you know a lot of the colorists. We know now they do a bit of everything, which was never the case. You know, you were the long form, you're the movie guy, you were the TV drama guy or you did ads and you never really crossed over. 

0:17:05 - Jason Bowdach
I think it was a couple years ago where I started seeing larger houses like company 3 start to do TV yeah, and this was a couple things when we started to see television be more profitable too. So we started to see, I guess, prestige TV, where television started to become more movie-like yeah, and we started to see larger houses like HBO and Showtime demand a more prestige grade for their television shows. So I think it's also a catch-22 where television got better, but also how the demand for a better-looking grade content. So I want I think that's a great thing for colorists like us where that demand for this hiring grade is on so much more stuff I find it interesting. 

0:17:48 - Warren Eagles
I quite like being attached to a longer-form project because if it's like if you're there during the shoot, you can go to the shoot, you can strike up that relationship with a cinematographer, director, before they're actually in the room, and always the more you know and you have a relationship with someone, it's always better to jump on the phone and talk about things than if you don't know them. Ok, commercials very difficult, because a lot of the time you're coming on board. Ok, if you've got. We've worked with them a few times, yes, but you're always on the end of the job when they've always shot it and they finished it and they're all thinking about their next project. But for you it's here and now. It's long form, you're in it, it's 10 apps, so you feel part of the team. 

0:18:34 - Jason Bowdach
This reminds me of a conversation that we recently had with Walter Vopato recently, where he was talking about a series that he was working on and he's in season three already and he was mentioning how it just flowed, because he'd worked with the director and the cinematographer already and it's just coming right out and they're working remote, but they had this whole workflow established already. 

0:18:52 - Warren Eagles
Did he get through the whole show without swearing? Did you bleep it out, or was it an explicit one? I'm not going to comment on that one yet. 

0:19:00 - Jason Bowdach
Great and he tells a good story, but he's all in, he's 100% in it. But that's what you were talking about. It's like having the first day of a grade every single session, when you're doing commercial potentially because you're doing a new project each time and you're establishing where are you shooting, how are you shooting? What are any? 

0:19:16 - Warren Eagles
problems with it. Great point, especially with freelance. I don't think it matters if you're freelance or you're starved, because if you've got a staff job here, you're still really only as good as your last job and you have to treat every job as if it could be the last one you're going to do. And that's sometimes quite hard when you're in a longer-term position and you go into the same shop every day. You're trying to get upbeat and come up with new ideas, but for your client, this job could be everything for them. They could be hanging off their next job as well. So you've really got to stay focused and just put 100% into that. 

0:19:54 - Jason Bowdach
That brings up a great question to ask you. Some days, when you come into the suite and you're feeling like that towel that's just been rinsed out and it can be a Monday and you come into that session with that client, they're on the final day of that grade and they want everything. This is their feature. How can you reset yourself to? How do you reset yourself on those days where you just feel rinsed and totally empty, to come in with a little bit more ideas and passion? 

0:20:25 - Warren Eagles
Yeah, I'm a real good one of having breaks and walking around. You know that it's not going to be a tough session. It might be the last day of it. They're always looking for maybe a little bit more. Maybe it's something you can't achieve, but you don't want to let them know that. So I'd always just have a little break every hour, five minutes, walk around, go outside, come back in again, but always you've always got to ask or pull a client to the monitors, because sometimes they will sit there and they'll be not always paying 100% attention but always assume On the phone. 

Yeah, they're on the phone, they're on the laptop, they're on the next job, but you need to get them up and from right there and go. Is this definitely where we think we are with this scene? Is this good? Because the worst thing I find is you're matching some shots down. They look up and go. Is this what we're doing then? Is this how it's going to be? And I thought well, I thought we'd agreed that 20 minutes ago. I've just matched four shots here, so never assume get them up and go. We can change it. 

I don't mind whatever, but I think this looks great for your product and what you have to do. You have to sell it like you really like that and you're invested in it and you've explored the options. But you've got to be 100% behind it, because they're coming to you remember to colour their show. You've got to show enthusiasm that it's the right thing. If it's a movie, as I always say, everything's got a product in it. It's like this coffee here or this tomato sauce bottle for a commercial. It's an actor, it's a singer and a music video. You've got to be 100%. They're looking great. I think this is the way we go. 

0:22:07 - Jason Bowdach
You nailed it it's all about you. You are very specifically making it about them and their movie or their feature or their commercial, and you are showing you are personally invested in them, as opposed to just being there like what do you want? 

0:22:23 - Warren Eagles
You want a green, you want a yellow, no, no no, they don't get a cut at it, because you suddenly realise you don't get a call and you're not doing the next one and oh yeah, we use the editor. They just stuck a lot on. It looks all right. 

0:22:36 - Jason Bowdach
One of the things that I will ask about colourist society and think there's a big discussion about colourist as artists instead of technicians, and I think there's a big misconception about we can just go into a colour suite and he's just going to shift colours around, and I think that's really what you're getting at is to really remind your clients that you are here as an artist to help them. 

0:22:56 - Warren Eagles
I think I am seeing definitely more. Now here's a quote feature film shot in Australia Three weeks shoe, two red cameras, reasonable budget. I asked them about colour because I've worked with a director and they said well, you know, we're using the standard luck and it doesn't look too bad. Well, we might well just go with that. Now, this is a movie. Now, a standard luck will get you a normal and, yes, it doesn't look too bad, but it doesn't do anything different than anyone else is doing. You're not getting a person who's coming afresh with fresh eyes. 

And how can I tell this story? I think this could look slightly different. I think we should do that there. We can darken that area. There. That shifts the focus. And unfortunately, I know a lot of it all comes down to budget. They're thinking colourist going to be money. We don't have money. But I think it's just until you show them the difference. Right, you sit them down and go. Well, you could have this or you could have this. Most of them go. Oh, you know, that does look better, doesn't it? And unfortunately, because we're sort of at the end of the chain and sometimes the budgets have been used up on reshoots or other reasons, I find I'm definitely missing a little bit of these things because of the way that the system works now. 

0:24:17 - Jason Bowdach
Absolutely, and one of the things that you really jumped on to is the ubiquity of the same grade, whether it's the camera, a lot from the manufacturer or just the fact that a lot of our movies don't have their own DNA anymore and they all look the same. And I think that maybe having the fact on some of our newer creators, directors, people that are creating movies now, it's sad, it's unfortunate that people, whether it's in expense or not, don't want to have a unique print on their movie, through colour, yeah, and through audio, through all the ways they can do that. But the fact is that colour has always been a really unique way that they can put a stamp, a unique DNA that will make their movie unlike anything else. And the fact that they're just OK with well, it looks like whatever the manufacturer was OK at coming out of the camera looking like is good enough. 

Yeah, it's a sad statement to say. 

0:25:12 - Warren Eagles
Yeah, I mean said that it's always worth another call, like, oh, when I get back to Australia I'll follow up with that movie, because you know, sometimes their idea of what money they've got is and I might do it for less money. I always say, now, you know, tell me what budget you've got, because if it's a product, a project I like, I like the scripts I like maybe the team that are on it, you know I'll probably do it. And if they go well, we've got five days of money. And I always quote ten days for a feature. 

Even on Indies you're unlikely to get ten days, but ideally that's what you want to really give yourself time to get it back, change things, change scenes and get up with fresh eyes and look at it again. If they go well, I've got five days. Someone else is going to grab that five days and do it, or even less, so I might do it. So it gives me an option to say, yeah, I'll do your movie. I'll ring them when I get back. I'll let you know how it goes. I might be on it. 

0:26:11 - Jason Bowdach
I definitely I'd love to hear how that turns out. I've definitely had cases like that before, where you're just like you know, let's see what we can do, maybe we can develop a show. There's so many different ways that you can do it. 

0:26:21 - Warren Eagles
Yeah, it could be. And the other thing I'd say to people if you're battling this a bit, just ask if they can. I know we've got laws where you can't what you can't. People are not willing to share stuff because of it getting out. But if you can just get your hands on a scene and say, well, just give me a scene, I'll put a grade to it for you and see what you think, and if you like it, then we can talk further. 

0:26:43 - Jason Bowdach
I'm a big fan of productions really to their colorists before they really start getting too far down the pipeline to see what. What can we do? Let's see if we can make this work. 

0:26:52 - Warren Eagles
Yeah, we don't. Unfortunately, I don't see as much of that Now in big big stuff. Sure, you're on it from the beginning. You're a meeting, production designers, wardrobe, hair and makeup director, dp, all across the whole look great. But more in the indie sort of stuff that I'm doing, it's a bit like the editors sitting there with the director and they go oh, that C camera don't quite match that, but yeah, we'll worry about that next day. Oh, color temperatures. But oh, we've got to make this really dynamic. We better start looking for colorists. It's better color for them. Yeah, quite so. We look for colorists and it's right, who's cheap, who can do it? 

0:27:32 - Jason Bowdach
So hopefully we'll get to a point where we can have productions looking a little bit ahead of the scenes and instead of doing it for monetary reasons, we're doing it for creative reasons. 

0:27:41 - Warren Eagles
Yeah, and I think the other thing is people don't know whether they think well, if they sort of engage you, it's going to cost money. I would always grade a few shots and I'm always willing to talk to anyone and give them opinions and if I don't get the job, I don't mind. There's a lot of up and coming producers post production, but they're you know, supervisors. They're newer to the game. If they need help on workflows or whatever they're going to do, I'm always happy to talk to them and help them. 

0:28:05 - Jason Bowdach
Well, you heard it here. If you need Warren's contact information, you'll find it at the end of the podcast and I highly recommend that you have a colorist that you work with, that you definitely reach out to them after working on productions. I'm sure they would appreciate it. 

0:28:16 - Warren Eagles
No, totally reach out early and most people, you know, even if they don't get it, are going to be because you've made a relationship, haven't you? And it might not be right for this job, but you, it's all about relationships in this game and they might go well. Yeah, Warren was there and he had some good ideas. I think he'd probably be better suited to the next movie we're doing, and then you might find yourself on that one. 

0:28:39 - Jason Bowdach
As colorists, we're a pretty small group. I actually have no problem helping a production and having to go off to you or somebody else, and it's a really. As long as the movie gets colored, I'm a happy guy. 

0:28:51 - Warren Eagles
Yeah, man, that colorist mixer so I'm one of the reasons I'm in the States was for the colorist mixer in AP and you were. You were there, jason, it was just. It was just good because we had like nearly 300 people there and so you probably got nearly 200 of them colorists, or I've been colorist at some stage and now maybe they're, they're selling or they've moved in, but it was just great for people to get together, chat about what they're doing. There was, you know, everyone's all friends together, which was. It was a good fun. 

0:29:20 - Jason Bowdach
It was such a fun time to have so many colorists in a single room together for the first time since the pandemic and people that you talk to online or seen online that have sort of come up the ladder. 

0:29:30 - Warren Eagles
I suppose in those four years that were not the traditional guys and girls you'd known you go. Oh, your son, sir. 

0:29:38 - Jason Bowdach
I was amazed to get rid of that wall between the online name and the online hashtag and their face Exactly. It's so nice to finally connect. 

0:29:47 - Warren Eagles
It was good fun. It's good fun. We had to do one in IBC, so we used to run them a couple of times a year and maybe one obscure place where we were doing training class. We did one in Madrid, one in Bogota where we're in Cambia and people loved it. Like the craziest mix that we ever did was down in Bogota. People were just going crazy like the most excited crowd ever. We did this raffle and people were yelling and screaming out. It was fun. So, yeah, hopefully IBC will be the next one. 

0:30:21 - Jason Bowdach
I got my fingers crossed that I can hopefully make it there the color mixers regularly my highlight of any trip. 

0:30:27 - Warren Eagles
Yeah, we're talking. We may be trying to do a bit of a training thing up there because traditionally there's not been training. Ibc, like there is a NAB where PPW run a lot of training sessions. Quite a lot of manufacturers have expressed interest in supporting training. They don't particularly want to run it, but they want to be seen supporting any sort of training and if that's a hook to get somebody to IBC, oh well, I can do some training. I go to the show, see some new care and go to the mixer. I'm going to fly in there for a couple of days, but that's a fantastic city. Yeah, there's enough hooks to get you. That's tax deductible folks, you know if you're thinking of going. 

0:31:11 - Jason Bowdach
It becomes much easier to make that decision than that price All of a sudden tax deductible. It helps Absolutely. So, as we are approaching the end of our time together, I have a few important questions to ask you, and one of them, as a veteran of our industry, this is going to be a fun question for you. So resolve now has tons and tons of tools. In fact we have so many pages on it. We need second monitors at this point. But if I were to ask you do you have a small suitcase and you are going to a desert island and you can only take one tool with you to work on all of your future projects, with what tool with that? 

0:31:49 - Warren Eagles
I'm going to put it in two parts. It doesn't matter what tools you have available. They're just the aid for you to get to the end. The most important thing that colorist does is balance the picture. Primary controls make it match. I'm surprised how many people Don't quite get that right. But they can use all the other tools, all the great trackers, the magic mask, the auto things, the shapes, the curves, the trackers but underlying it doesn't quite match. You can't lose sight of being able to balance the picture. Now, however you do that curves, contrast, pivots, the HDR tool for talking, resolve all of these software packages, whatever you're using all do it a slightly different way. There's no wrong way, just being able to match. 

Back to your question, if it was a new feature, I'd say the magic mask is really good and it seems to get better every time I look at it. Every time there's a new version. They've probably done a bit of AI stuff through that neural engine and I'm going well. It didn't do that last time. I did a training class, because one of the great things about running training I use a lot of the same footage I've used for years, so I know how it tracks and how it keys and sometimes I pull out, definitely doing it better. 

0:33:08 - Jason Bowdach
It was a big fun thing. 

0:33:10 - Warren Eagles
So, yeah, probably the magic masking. They're doing really cool things with their development, which is good Because they're buddies of mine up in Singapore, and hats off to the team for what they've done. Yeah, really good. 

0:33:21 - Jason Bowdach
Here's an interesting question what does warrants go to? You can use anything to, but when you have, say, a picture that's a little bit too warm, what is your just? When your hand has to go to something on the panel, what is the first thing your hand goes to? 

0:33:35 - Warren Eagles
Yeah, I'm a big fan of using the offset tool Like I've always used. I've always gone there. First of all, I think you could tweak that with a little bit contrast and pivot. Then recently I'm dipping it into the HDR palette and using global control just as the first off the balance and working that out Awesome. And you know that's a really cool tool. I find it harder on my panel because you've obviously got to navigate your six wheels to your three and you get so used to doing things the way that you do it. You've got to force your way and go. Well, let's try this. This is different, but I'm going to use this on this job. That's what I would say to people Try it. 

0:34:17 - Jason Bowdach
I'm glad to hear you say that you're trying out the HDR goals and you're evolving into it, and that's why the sort of way I ask the tool is when I like to learn what people like to use, yeah, and what people are trying out. 

0:34:29 - Warren Eagles
Yeah, and that's all I would say to people. It's a bit like people say well, I don't really need any color management because I'm only making this little skateboarding video, but it's two cameras and maybe it would help. Yes, it will help you, but just set yourself down a job and go and do this color managed. Doesn't matter what you're doing at the end of it, just try it and see if it works for you, and if it doesn't work for you, you could do it another way. 

0:34:54 - Jason Bowdach
Here's stuff like that and the equivalent to me. Now and this is a nerd colorist who loves color management I hear I don't need to wear seatbelts just going down the street because to me the systems are here, they work really well. You just have to turn them on and to say I'm not going to use them for the short drive is just they work really well and they're there for you. 

0:35:17 - Warren Eagles
Yeah, I think there's a little bit of oh it's. You know, color management is just for big Netflix shows or bigger features, and we're going to get into knots. And once we've colored it, we're not going to get out the other end, what we've been looking at the two days. 

0:35:31 - Jason Bowdach
It's scary. It's a new tool. Like you were saying, you have to adjust and change the way that you're working a little bit, but there's definitely an amazing tool that can help a lot of people that are dealing with some display problems, especially when they're dealing with a variety of different displays that I think a lot of people can adapt to by just opening up the color management. 

0:35:51 - Warren Eagles
We have this debate, kevin and I like should we be talking teaching color management in a 101 class? We we now do, because we have to show both, but we have to put this out there and go look, because a lot of the people we get our editors and need to do a bit more color. If you can work color management, you're editing with, let's say, normal pictures. How much easier is that. 

0:36:15 - Jason Bowdach
I'm so happy to hear you saying that. I recently, when I taught a basic class, I just did a little. I call a toe into teller to say here's what it is. We'll come back here in two days and talk to you about it. 

0:36:27 - Warren Eagles
Yeah, you've got to know how to fix things when maybe that doesn't work. And I always say you know there's a huge push for luck, so I've no problem with lots, they do fantastic jobs. But if your luck doesn't work for you and you don't quite know what tool to jump on to match either under a lot or replace a lot, you'll be in trouble. It ain't going to match. You've got to know both ways. 

0:36:48 - Jason Bowdach
Exactly as we are at the end of our time together. Where can people find and learn more about you? 

0:36:54 - Warren Eagles
Warren Eagles dot comau is my grading, which is mainly out of Australia, but I do remote stuff as a beginning, and then I colorist dot com is the training site. Fxphd dot com is my, so they've been running a long time. We normally update them once a year and you get to hear my fantastic jokes and stories. Hopefully, while you learn, you learn something as well. 

0:37:20 - Jason Bowdach
And I look forward to watching the next one. I believe you're recording me now. 

0:37:24 - Warren Eagles
I'm not on the stage. Yeah, we are. 

0:37:26 - Jason Bowdach
So thank you so much for taking the time to be with here on the show today, Warren. It's been an absolute pleasure having you. 

0:37:32 - Warren Eagles
Thanks for coming out. I really like sitting down as a local coffee store here in Burbank. You watch the world go around and get out and about and sit down. 

0:37:41 - Jason Bowdach
Well, it's a true pleasure. Cheers, and that's our show. Be sure to follow us on Instagram, youtube or your podcast app of choice. If you're using Apple Podcasts or Spotify, please leave us a review. It helps us quite a bit. If you are looking for DaVinci Resolve tools, please be sure to visit our sponsor, PixelTools. We'll see you guys in two weeks with another great interview. Happy grading.