United in Accessibility
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United in Accessibility
E59: Accessibility in Practice: Teaching, Testing, and Leadership with Radek Pavlíček, CPWA
In this episode, Radek Pavlíček reflects on more than 25 years of work in accessibility, sharing practical lessons about assistive technologies, conducting real-world user testing, and supporting organizations across Czechia. He also discusses the evolving landscape of accessibility practice, the value of professional certification, and the role of community leadership in strengthening digital accessibility.
Speaker 00:03
Welcome to the IAAP United in Accessibility podcast. Today, we're honored to feature Radek Pavlíček, a visionary in digital accessibility and a lifelong advocate for inclusive technology. Radek has been shaping the accessibility landscape since 1998 leading transformative projects through the Teiresias center of Masaryk University and the Théseus initiative, partnering with organizations like Czech Television, Czech Radio, Dr. Max and the city of Brno to make digital products truly accessible to all. As the first certified accessibility specialist in the Czech Republic and the recipient of the 2025 IAAP Global Accessibility Leadership Award, Radek is recognized worldwide for his practical leadership, data driven advocacy and commitment to meaningful, user centered accessibility. Join us as we explore Radek's journey, his early contributions to web accessibility and his vision for the future of inclusive digital design on the United in Accessibility podcast.
Sam Evans 01:05
Hello and welcome to the United in Accessibility podcast. This is Sam Evans, certification director at IAAP, and I'm so pleased today to have a chance to talk with our friend Radek Pavlíček. Radek has been working in accessibility for a long time. We are going to share some really exciting things with you, about an award he won, but really today is our time to talk about Radek and his work in accessibility over the years. Thank you so much for joining us today, Radek. Can you please introduce yourself and tell us just a little bit about yourself and what first drew you into accessibility? Was there a personal experience or a turning point in your work that shaped your passion, that brought you into accessibility?
Radek Pavlíček 01:45
Hello, everybody. As was said, my name is Radek Pavlíček, and I am digital accessibility specialist at the Teiresias Center of Masaryk University in Brno in Czechia, in the very heart of Europe. I focus mainly on the practical side of making websites, applications and documents accessible for people with a wide range of access needs. I publish articles, blog posts on accessibility, and teach courses on digital accessibility. I also lead a small team of accessibility specialists and organize events focused on accessibility and assistive technologies and many, many other, let's say, activities related to accessibility. On the personal side, I am a 47-year-old white man. My wife and I have three children, and we live in a small village on the Moravian Slovak border. Outside of work, I enjoy music, swimming, traveling, reading books and spending time with friends, and admittedly, I still treat accessibility as one of my main hobbies, as for what first drew me into accessibility, it was, in a way, coincidence, rather than a current plan. As I mentioned, I grew up in a small village on the Czechoslovak border, and until I was about 20, I knew almost nothing about accessibility, or to be honest, even about people with disabilities. I am talking about the year 1998 like the last century even, and when I was studying at the university, my roommate in the dormitory was just finishing both his studies and a student job at the Czech Blind United, where he taught blind and partially sighted people how to use a computer. He taught me about it, and it immediately caught my attention, because it connected like two things I care about at the time, like teaching computer science, I will be studying and doing something that clearly helps people in a very concrete way. I decided to try it, and it resonated with me so strongly that I simply never left over time. I moved from the individual training to broader questions of how to remove digital barriers for many people at once, but the first experience of sitting next to a blind user at the computer and realizing how much design decisions matter has been with me ever since.
Sam Evans 04:34
I think those kinds of personal introductions to accessibility are really how most of us come into this, if it's not with our own lived experience, does your roommate from college, from university, do they know what they turned you on to and how that's become your career path? Do they know?
Radek Pavlíček 04:51
Yes, they do. Yeah. Since now, I have been working for, let's say, the same University I studied almost 30 years. ago, so yeah, they know about it. Yeah.
Sam Evans 05:02
Lucky for us, for how that came together for you and for so many people that you touch in your career, we brought Radek into the podcast today. It's always lovely to talk to Radek and talk to our accessibility experts around the world, but I wanted to make a moment to, before we get into the rest of the conversation to talk about an award that we presented from IAAP to Radek just recently, just a little over a month ago. Actually, IAAP has a Global Leadership, an Accessibility Leadership Award, and the premise on that is for people that make lifelong, lasting impressions with the work that they do and their contributions to accessibility. And so, as Radek mentioned in 1998, is when he started that career path in digital accessibility, but he's been actively dedicated to removing barriers and websites and applications and documents, and he's widely recognized in his pioneering work in Assistive Technology Education. He is a leader in that field and one of the first particularly in Czech Republic, he's been teaching blind and visually impaired students how to use screen readers, magnifiers, mobile tech and working with the Czech Blind United and Théseus centrum in Brno. But in addition to work with users, he's a really respected educator and an advocate amongst digital accessibility professionals. He trains, he teaches. He helps people understand design and public sector institutions how to actually implement this so it's not just a concept. He teaches public sector institutions how to bring this into the work that they do. He brings technical expertise together with policy awareness and how to make this part of a system so that it's viable. It's really impressive. We should all you know, we should all hope to work with people like that that could help us act in change management to make things happen, so that organizations understand why to do it. It's really his work is just terribly impressive, and it does so much good for so many people, but he's helped to elevate accessibility from not being a niche of like a little small piece of the puzzle to an actual recognize discipline across academics and industry and government. And so, it's world leaders like that that really do affect change and help us bring the world to a better place, to remove barriers. And Radek is just going to continue to keep making the world more inclusive and where accessibility is a word that people recognize for what it means, not as an afterthought or a small concept. So Radek, again, thank you, and we're so pleased and so appreciative. And I was so excited to see your name for our Global Accessibility Leadership Award. So, congratulations.
Sam Evans 07:24
Thank you very much. My microphone was muted. Yeah.
Sam Evans 07:38
Obviously, we're really proud to have you in this, in this award and that recognition for York, but you talked a little bit about your early days when you first learned about accessibility, but looking back to your early days when you first got started in working in accessibility, what were the biggest barriers that you saw in technology back then? And how have those barriers changed? Hopefully, some of them have been removed. But do you want to talk back to, going back to those early 1998 days, what those big barriers were, and how they might have changed since then?
Radek Pavlíček 08:09
Yeah, we are talking about, let's say, our past in digital industry. And you know that around the year 2000 the web was still quite young, and from today's perspective, relatively simple. It was mostly text, images and basic forms, and that's it. But the fact is that almost nobody designed it with accessibility in mind. You might know that the first version of Web Content Accessibility Guidelines was published in the same year 1998 so it was really like fresh topic, or how to how to say it. And on top of that, we soon got table-based layouts, image only navigation and later flash, which did not help accessibility either. So for screen reader users, this often meant that the internet effectively ended the homepage and at the time, there was also very little local guidance, which is why we eventually created the blind friendly web methodology and the first Czech Accessibility rules to help people understand what accessibility is about and how to deal with it, and so on. And let's say that today, some things are clearly better. We have international standards like web content, accessibility guidelines, national legislation, and accessibility is mentioned in more and more public vendors and company policies, operating systems and mobile platforms ship with built in assistive technologies and better APIs than we could even dream of 20 years ago. Maybe you remember that 20 to 30 years ago, if you needed a screen reader, you had to buy. Or if you needed screen magnifier or assistive technology, in general, it was usually a third-party software which you need to purchase, and at the same time many of the practical barriers are some surprisingly similar. We are still struggling with missing labels, with inaccessible custom components with poor keyboard navigation, no captions or audio description, interfaces that change dynamically without telling the user what happened. So the technology has changed, but I would say that the core challenge remains turning accessibility on paper into accessibility in real user journeys.
Sam Evans 10:45
I remember in that timeframe, I was still helping students there. There was no access for many students in university, and so I was, I was a note taker, or I would transcribe audio, like cassettes for people, for notes in university. So even in the late 90s and early 2000s there was still in the US, there was still lack of access. So it was, it really was the beginning, the very, very early days. So, let's come forward a good bit to in the last, I don't know, the last 10 years, maybe. You were the first IAAP certified accessibility professional in the Czech Republic. We were excited because we knew you, and you helped us work so much on building programs, but what did that milestone mean for you and to be that one person that first in the accessibility movement in Czech Republic?
Radek Pavlíček 11:37
As for let's say it was a milestone, as you said. But of course, I mainly see it as, let's say, as a signal that accessibility here has grown into, let's say, a proper profession with recognized competencies. Personally, the certification helped me check my own blind spots and structure what I have learned over many years of practice and professionally, it made discussions with organizations and decision makers a little easier. It gave them something concrete they could trust in a field that was still new and sometimes perceived as nice to have. And what I value most is that I was not the last one. I was the first one, as you said, but I am not the last one. And seeing colleagues here in the Czech Republic, and let's say the wider region, also from Slovakia, which is quite close to us, pursue IAAP certifications and other forms of professional development is a good sign that accessibility here in my region is becoming more systematic, not just driven by a few enthusiastic individuals.
Sam Evans 12:55
I know we saw several applications come in this session from for people in Slovak region, so I thought of you as I watched those, those countries come in. So, it’s really it's good to see. And I know that you've, you've helped build that confidence for that and helped promote. So, I first met you through IAAP many years ago, I want to say probably going back close to nine, almost 10 years ago, but you've been part of the IAAP, the International Association of Accessibility Professionals, community, for several years. What does that mean to you? What has been a member of that accessibility community meant to you, personally and professionally?
Radek Pavlíček 13:35
For me, IAAP is mainly about community, and let's say shared language. Working in a relatively small country like Czechia is we have about 10, maybe now 11 millions of inhabitants. It's easy to feel a bit isolated, and IAAP connects me to colleagues who face similar challenges in different, in very different contexts, like from government agencies to big tech companies, through academia, NGOs and so on. And professionally, IAAP has provided structure, common competency, framework, certifications, webinars and conferences that helped me keep up with global trends and best practices. I have been happy to contribute as well, for example, through sessions at the Zero Project Conference with this IAAP drop in, sessions with Susanna Lauren and colleagues from IAAP D-A-CH chapter, and for example, the IAAP EU accessibility hybrid event, which Masaryk University hosted in Brno in April this year. That's basically why I started at the IAAP as member, and why I am still in.
Sam Evans 14:55
Sometimes the concept is difficult for people to understand, but it really is that access to peers and colleagues who can help you learn in areas, maybe that you don't work in, but you can learn so much from your peers and colleagues, and they work in other branches of you, know, policy or governance or types of market and industry. But I would say that the program that you did earlier this year in April in Brno was really some I got to watch some of it virtually remote. So, we came to you instead of you coming to us, as often happens so. But kudos on a really great program recently and again thank you for being part of what the big draw is for the IAAP community in that profession. And you mentioned shared language and so I think that really is what builds a profession, is when we start using expect everyone to share the same concept, terms and language, so that we can all speak the same way about accessibility and make it in a uniform fashion, so that people that work in the profession can start to learn the language of the accessibility professional community. So, I'm going to shift back to things that you talked about, particularly, you said the first time that you sat with somebody who's blind and watched and listened to them use a computer, that feedback that you got, that first experience was really powerful for you. When you teach, not just in academia, but when you teach and lead in business and training, your approach takes combining standards, which is the technical, normative, testable content, but you take those standards with usability and real user feedback. And so those three things are kind of a powerful like that's a really strong approach, because we talk about not just the technical components, but the usability and then real user feedback. So, can you give a moment to think about maybe a story where some of that real user input changed how a team started to understand accessibility and help them make change part of how they do their work?
Radek Pavlíček 16:54
Yes, and there are many stories, and this happens almost every time we bring users into the process. Let me give you just let's say one, one example. We were working with a large organization and a business company on improving the accessibility of their online service, and they came to us saying we have implemented WCAG contrast ratios are fine, four fields are there. Everything is good from our perspective. And then okay, you know. And then we invited several blind users who rely on screen readers to test a key user journey. Very simple task is just signing in and completing simple tasks in the online service. Technically, all the required elements were there, but one visually very prominent call to action, the one the whole flow depended on, was coded in a way that made it almost invisible in the screen reader's reading order so users could get through, but only after a lot of trial and error and with a very good memory. And for the company, watching those sessions was a turning point for their team. They realized that passing WCAG was not enough, and that accessibility is also about hierarchy, focus, management, cognitive flow and all these things. And after that, they started asking much better questions. Not just is it compliant, but how does this actually work for a real person under time pressure, for example. And I personally like these situations because they show why we need both. Solid standards, because people need to know what to do. You know, we need to tell them, hey, there is something that you can study and you can follow these principles, but we also need real user feedback and one without the other tends to miss important parts of the picture. And in the end, it's always wise to follow the principle of Nothing about us without us, and make sure that people with disabilities are involved in the process that it's not Radek is talking how things should be, but that real users are there, and they are clearly demonstrating how the surveys or how the document or whatever is or isn't accessible for them.
Speaker 19:38
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Sam Evans 20:16
I think that's really smart. I try to when I talk with people, I they want to go to the WHAT and the HOW, how do I do it? What's the what do I do and HOW do I do it? And I try to pull people back to say, we first need to you can learn the HOW and the WHAT. That's great, but that could be technically correct, but it might not serve the people. So, we need to make sure we go back to the WHO and the WHY, so that we can deliver and design the best, WHAT and HOW. So, I think that aha moment, and you say, you know, so it's not just Radek says. And so, I really like the experiential learning that you bring in so that, I think that's where you convert technologists and designers for them to understand why to do it differently. Because if they can make that connection with people, they're far more likely to accept a change in process because they understand how it's going to make things better. And so that experiential learning, I think, is just really essential. And if I ever hear something and Radek says, that's enough for me, I will say, okay.
Radek Pavlíček 21:20
Thank you.
Sam Evans 21:22
So, you work with students in academia, and you worked with professionals in the business and governing world. So, what have you what have you observed or what do you think these younger generations have taught you about accessibility that maybe our earlier mentors or earlier guides hadn't or didn't?
Radek Pavlíček 21:44
Okay At first, it's, let's say, my personal feeling that I am still 20. I'm not 15, but I'm 20. Since I've been working with students, with young people for the whole of my career. But back to the point. Students mainly bring perspectives that are very firmly rooted in the present. For them, there is now nothing special about having a smartphone in their pocket, what's essentially a very powerful mobile computer, permanently connected to the internet, which they use to do a huge range of everyday tasks, and they take it for granted that there is AI, virtual reality, smart homes and many other technologies around them, and they quite naturally ask how accessibility fits into This environment. That means that they don't let me stay in the world of the technologies I started with almost 30 years ago, and they quietly force me to keep learning, to update my examples and tools and the way I teach them, and to follow new trends so, that what I teach still makes sense in their reality, and not just, let's say, in mind from 2025, years ago, but at the same time, they remind me, how fortunate we are from a technological point. For me, many things we knew only from science fiction films 20 years, 25 years ago are now part of everyday life. So,for accessibility, this is a huge opportunity, but only if we make sure that these technologies are designed to be inclusive from the start. So that's what students, how students enrich me and my professional career.
Sam Evans 23:40
Do you find too, I believe this is likely to be true internationally. But do you find that young people today have these young adults have an expectation for accessibility and inclusion to be part of how they engage with the world? Does that hold true with the students that you work with as well?
Radek Pavlíček 24:01
Yes, I can confirm, yeah. Let's say the self-confidence, or say in English, yeah, it's much higher than 20, 25 years ago that I would say that now people can, or students, especially young people, can much louder like speak for their rights and ask for accessibility and for being a part of community than it happened 30 years ago.
Sam Evans 24:35
I think that's going to translate into business as well, where there's an expectation where they will choose to do business, where they find what they expect for that inclusion, and I think that that will happen in the workforce, where people will choose to work for companies that hold those same values. So, talking about businesses and the bridges between academia and the business world, so a lot of your work that you've done Radek has been bridging gaps and connecting places between academia, teaching in university settings, et cetera, to government, policies and practices and industry and business. There are three very different realms. But what's the hardest part we talked earlier about the language and common terms in the accessibility profession? But what's the hardest part of getting these different worlds to speak the same accessibility language?
Radek Pavlíček 25:29
The hardest part is probably to be a translator. You know, each word comes with its own popularity. In academia, we talk about research questions, pilots, long term impact, government tends to focus on compliance, risk, accountability, and industry cares about costs, speed and user satisfaction and accessibility touches, all of these, but in different ways, and one of the hardest parts is often alignment on what accessible enough means. A public body might feel that publishing an accessibility statement and fixing a few issues is sufficient while users still cannot complete essential tasks. That's what we discussed earlier. Company might want to focus solely on legal minimums, even though a slightly broader approach would actually improve usability for everyone and reduce the support costs for example. My role is often to translate, to turn user stories and standards into language that makes sense for each stakeholder, and to create spaces where they can actually meet in classrooms, workshops and conferences, rather than in separate silos and that's what I really like very much when we organize a conference, and there are people from academia, end users, NGOs from ministries, from business companies, and there is a safe space for them where they can share their ideas, they can discuss, they can like, get oriented, what accessibility means for the others and so on.
Sam Evans 27:20
I wonder if I'm thinking about roles that I see in business and private industry, and I think that often program managers are that translator tool. The program managers are translating between the customer side, the engineer side, and the policy teams. And so, I think that set of skills that ability to translate and meet people in their world and help them understand how this works for me. That's a really powerful skill. It's a soft skill, but it's rooted in deep in technology policy and communication. So, we need to figure out how to quantify that skill set, because it's strongly needed everywhere. So that's a brilliant offer that you bring to the table with all of your work across those different programs. So, I'm going to want to turn back to some of the things that you've been working on, one of your outreach, one of your modes of communication is that you have a blog, and I'm going to attempt to say this as closely as I can. Poslepu.cz, and I think that means that I'm a person who has no vision, or I'm blind. I think is that a translation that's close from English.
Radek Pavlíček 28:30
Yeah, it's in English. It can be translated as a blindfold, yeah.
Sam Evans 28:36
Okay, blindfolded, okay. And in English, we often say under blindfold, when people talk about taking it, you know, for temporary experience, but you've been educating professionals for years on your blog, can you talk about like, when you started it, what inspired you to start it and what keeps you motivated to continue sharing your insights on that mode? So, you touch a lot of different venues for communication and education?
Radek Pavlíček 29:03
Yeah, I started this blog almost 20 years ago in 2007 as a Czech language space where people could find reliable information about accessibility and assistive technologies, especially for users with severe visual impairments. The reason was that, at the time, resources in Czech were very limited, and I kept answering the same questions again and again in trainings and consultations and a block seemed like a natural way to share and answers more widely and to spread awareness about accessibility as such. And what keeps me going is that the questions keep evolving. New technologies appear, registration changes, and there are always new case studies while documenting from accessible, virtual reality to the impact of the European Accessibility Act, what's like a hot topic of this year, and the blog also has also become hub for promoting our events, our conferences, like Agora Inspo Webinars, so which we deliver, and so on. And personally, to be honest, Writing helps me clarify my own thinking. If I can explain something clearly to readers, I am more confident in explaining it later to clients, students or policy makers. And still, once I wrote an article and it has been published that I can easily share the link and direct people to this article, and they can read it in case that they need more information about a particular topic.
Sam Evans 30:53
I think the way we oftentimes can learn the best is if to think about it, whether or not we know something is if we have to teach it to somebody else, whether that means we're writing it out, to write it out as an explanation that somebody else could understand, or if we're trying to prepare materials, I think we can really clarify our thoughts and what that means in our in our own minds, and helps us be sure that we're saying it. And I think it changes as we learn more with new audiences. We'll discover more clarity, or it becomes a stronger concept the more we teach and share. I think. So, I've gone back to your blog several times, and people have asked me for questions about things in your region of the world. So, I've pointed people to it, there's many times over the last few years. So you talked about that was almost 20 years ago for the blog, and you've talked about, you know, what some of the things that you've used as impact on teaching and translating between not in language, but between different modes of business and audiences, but so after more than 25 years in the field, what kind of things still motivate you every day. And if you could go back to that 1998 self who sat with your roommate and learned what a screen reader was, so what motivates you still every day? And what could you tell Radek 1998 about one piece of advice?
Radek Pavlíček 32:15
What still motivates me is, I would say, very simple. Seeing the accessibility work has a concrete impact on someone's everyday life. When a student can study the program they want, when an older person can manage, for example, their banking independently, when someone can apply for a job without asking a sighted friend for help, these are small but important victories. And when I compare 1998 and 2025 I think that we still do the same. Okay, the world has changed, the technology has changed, people have changed, but we still do the same, but with, let's say, different tools. And I am also driven by curiosity. New technologies from artificial intelligence to virtual reality keep changing the landscape, and I want to make sure that they are used to remove barriers, rather than to create new ones. So that's why we now quite intensively play with AI and search for, let's say, new ways to use them for our students or for people with disabilities in general, how to help them to overcome barriers. And as for the advice, if I could give my younger self one piece of advice, it would be get involved in the international accessibility community much earlier, my first real experience abroad was in 2012 at the ICCHP conference in Linz in Austria, and then in 2013 at CSUN in San Diego in California. And those were formative moments for me, because I suddenly had the chance to meet and speak in person with people I had previously only known from their articles and resources online. So my advice to my younger self, to Radek 1998 would be go abroad and connect with others as soon as you can, and it will broaden your perspective and accelerate your learning in ways that are hard to achieve on your own or in case that you focus on, let's say a local, local movement or local activities only.
Sam Evans 34:47
I think that international connection, beyond the accessibility, I think that's really important, particularly for people who live in some of the larger western industrialized countries, is to spend some of that time abroad or engaging with people in other parts of the world, particularly in the Global South, to have a greater understanding about the largest markets in the world and where things are. So I'm going to tap onto the advice younger Radek to get involved as soon as possible, as good advice, particularly for our folks in the world who live in, you know, those larger industrialized, more advanced economies, to spend some time to outreach to and work and learn with our colleagues in other parts of the world as well. It's eye opening for lots of reasons, but it's also a really good way to understand how technology grows, not by steps, but in the global south and other parts of the world, it's exponentially fast the growth that changes, and so some of the innovations that happen in other parts of the world would be really good for folks to learn about too. So, what kind of things, what kind of projects that you're working on right now that you're really excited about? And then what's next for Radek?
Radek Pavlíček 35:53
Yeah, there are a few directions I am particularly excited about. One is continuing to develop the disease project and related activities here at Masaryk University, where we support organizations in making their digital services accessible in a practical, data driven, data driven way ensure the accessibility of university and university studies in general. I also plan to continue teaching, blogging on possible see that organizing events and being part of meaningful projects related to accessibility while working with organizations, not only here in Czechia, but also from abroad, and since accessibility is a never-ending process, there is always something useful to do next. And I am also very much looking forward to further collaboration with IAAP and the wider international community as well. Next year, in July, we will host the ICCHP conference in Brno. It will be for the first time here at my university and this conference will create valuable space for exchange among practitioners, researchers and policy makers. So, I'm really looking forward to, let's say, bring all the colleagues from the accessibility world to Brno, or at least as many as possible we can get to Brno. And frankly speaking, I still haven't given up on the idea of helping to establish an IAAP Czechoslovakian chapter. You know that I have been thinking and slowly working on this for years, since I think that it could be a very natural way to connect the Czech and Slovak accessibility communities even more closely, and not only them, but to make them a part of, let's say, the international accessibility community as such. So these are my plans for the next 2, 3, 4 years. We'll see.
Sam Evans 38:13
That's a lot. Radek you have, you've been such a welcoming agent in everything with IAAP, for anybody who hasn't had a chance to meet Radek or see Radek in person or listen to his voice somewhere, he has just a warm, robust smile, his laughter is is just charming, and he's a fabulous teacher, colleague, and I know that he's made huge impacts, not just in his own home country and region of the world, Radek, I thank you so much for everything you've done for the world at large. Diky is that the right way to say in Czech? How do we say in Czech, Thank you?
Radek Pavlíček 38:48
Děkuji.
Sam Evans 38:49
Okay, Děkuji.
Radek Pavlíček 38:52
Thank you Sam, and thank you for the invitation and for very nice words and for the very pleasant conversation with you.
Sam Evans 39:00
So, for those of you who've joined us, perhaps for the first time, for our United in Accessibility podcast, this is Sam Evans from IAAP, and I've had just the lovely pleasure to spend some time today with our friend and colleague, Radek Pavlíček. You should know the name. You'll recognize it when you see it next, read it next, or hear it next, whether you're in Brno for the for the larger conference next year, or just in accessibility in general. So again, thank you all for joining us for the United in Accessibility podcast, and we will talk with you next time.
Radek Pavlíček 39:33
Thank you. Goodbye.
Speaker 39:36
The International Association of Accessibility Professionals membership consists of individuals and organizations representing various industries, including the private sector, government, non-profits and educational institutions. Membership benefits include products and services that support global systemic change around the digital and built environment. United in Accessibility, join IAAP and become a part of the global accessibility movement.