Butterflies and Halos: Angie’s Story of Love, Loss, and Legacy

There are losses that rearrange our understanding of life and how we show up in the world.

The death of a young person, a baby, a spouse or a sibling can be particularly devastating, due to the traumatic and out-of-order elements surrounding the loss.

Surviving  one loss can feel unbearable. But all four?

Today’s guest shares her story of immense loss — a journey marked by the departure of her one-year-old son, Garret, her beloved husband, Jack, her resilient brother, Seth, and her sister-in-law, Brooke.

In her own profound grief, Angie Hanson found solace in a mission to change the narrative around grief, to bring light into the darkest moments, and to offer genuine support to those walking the path of loss.

She founded Butterflies + Halos, a greeting card company that seeks to bridge the gap between sympathy and understanding, between condolence and companionship.

Through her story, Angie illuminates the way forward for those grappling with their own losses, and offers insight into how we can better support one another through life's most challenging moments.


Angie Hanson Social & Website:

• Website: butterfliesandhalos.com
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Nina Rodriguez Social & Website:

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Some of the conversation includes candid recounts of sensitive matters related to loss of loved ones. Listener discretion is advised.

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Transcript

I know that the question why? Why me will never get answered in my lifetime. You know, I won't know until the day that I die, why or how or anything. And I'm okay with that. I do believe in life after death. And the day that Jack died, I wrote Jack went to be in heaven with our son. And I. You know, the image that I had was Jack, get into heaven and our son being right there. And he just scooped him right up and off they went. You just lost your loved one. Now what? Welcome to the Grief and Life podcast, where we explore this new reality through grief colored lenses openly, authentically. I'm your host, Nina Rodriguez. Let's get started. There are losses that rearrange our understanding of life and how we show up in the world. The death of a young person or a baby, a spouse, or a sibling can be particularly devastating due to the traumatic and out of order elements surrounding the loss. Surviving one of those losses can feel unbearable. But all for today's guest shares her story of immense loss, a journey marked by the departure of her one year old son Garrett, her beloved husband Jack, her resilient brother Seth, and her sister in law Brooke. In her own profound grief, Angie Hansen found solace in the mission to change the narrative around grief, to bring light into the darkest moments, and to offer genuine support for those walking the path of loss. She founded Butterflies and Halo, a greeting card company that seeks to bridge the gap between sympathy and understanding and between condolence and companionship. Through her story, Angie illuminates the way forward for those grappling with their own losses and offers insights into how we can better support one another through life's most challenging moments. Sharing her incredible story with us today, Angie Hansen, welcome to the Grief and Life podcast. Hi, Nina. Thanks for having me. It's my pleasure. Thank you so much for being here. Your unique story has a lot of elements that are not very common, and add layers and layers to the grief experience, the shortness of the period of time, the untimeliness, and all of these other elements that you had to experience. Unfortunately. Start with your beautiful son, Garrett. And what was life like back then and where did your journey start? Yeah, like you said, my journey started in two thousand and six after we lost our my grief journey, I should say, um, after we lost our one year old son, Garrett, my husband Jack and I. And we have a daughter, Gracie, who was four at the time of Garrett's death. We're living the typical family life. We had an acreage and we live in Nebraska. And, you know, honestly, life was perfect for us. There was nothing that was that was out of the ordinary. You know, we were just happy it was the four of us, and we had a great community of friends and family. And I just figured that's how life was supposed to be, right? So after seven days. Well, six days after my son's first birthday, he turned one on June twenty first. He died in his sleep at his daycare providers house. And, um, it was just the whirlwind of, I don't know, I don't know. It catapulted us into a journey that we didn't understand. It was frightening. It was everything. But right away, we didn't know what had happened to Garrett. And then after they did an autopsy and the push from our pediatrician, you know, we found out that Garrett had a undetected heart defect. He had a kink in his right coronary artery that, um, it doesn't present itself unless you're in extreme rest or extreme activity. In Garrett's case, he was obviously sleeping. Taking his afternoon nap. And, um, you know, that was just, I don't know. I don't even have words for it sometimes. Still to this day, you know? So Garrett died in two thousand and six. Obviously. Here we are. We're going to be coming up on eighteen years, um, without him, which is absolutely unbelievable to me. I just, I cannot, I cannot believe it. And, um, moving forward, we just, we really just had to learn how to survive. And, you know, our biggest, our biggest goal for my husband, Jack and I at the time was how are we going to create a happy home for Gracie, our daughter, you know, and how are we going to support each other? And I will say it's not easy, you know, but Jack and I, we really did. We told each other that, you know, we, we have to do this and we have to be present. We have to do whatever we can to fight for our marriage, you know. And so we did. We just we did not grieve the same. We did not grieve the same timelines, you know, and I took to journaling at that time after Garrett died. Um, that was my biggest help for me, you know, and my comfort was journaling. So I journaled when I couldn't sleep at night and I journaled, um, just all the time and I'd write down my feelings and, you know, looking back at those journal entries now, and even six months after Garrett had died, I just saw the progression of healing, you know, and I think that's why journaling is so important. And I am a huge advocate of it for people. Um, because you don't you think that you're not getting better sometimes, you know, like I said, I could look back and I could see that, wow, I have, I have done better. I'm, I'm healing, you know, just from one thought to the next. So yeah, it was the first year after Garrett had died. I don't I'm not still sure how we survived it. We survived it from the love and support of our family and our friends, and just honoring Garrett's memory all the time. And, um, really just focusing on our daughter Gracie. And that's not lost on me that her name is is Gracie. It's Grace. Grace is such a big element of surviving grief. And it's not lost on me that you had this beacon of light in your life. Sounds like she was the motivation behind saying, okay, I don't know how we're going to get through this, but we have to do this right. And I'm deeply sorry for the loss of your son. That is the type of loss that no, we don't like to compare losses. We don't like to say one is the other. The worst loss is always our own because it's the one that we feel the deepest. There are layers to losses and the loss of a child. The loss of a son or a daughter at any age is just really up there. You know, it's it's the type that a lot of people say I wouldn't be able to do that until, God forbid, you're actually faced with that. Meaning people in this community, we realize a lot of people actually go through this and you do survive it. And like you said, it's now eighteen years, years after his passing. And here we are, right? And we're okay is okay can be right. I say we, I'm like healing. Yes, yes, we are, we are. I'm here with you. Um, you said you and your husband grieved very differently. So what did that look like and what did that mean at the time? At first it was hard, but I wanted to go to church more. Um. Jack did not want to go to church. He did not find the comfort there, you know. So I would go to church and I found my comfort there. Um, Jack did not his we lived on an acreage. So um and we had a small business, um like boat storage. So Jack found his comfort outside, um, mowing, you know, mowing the acreage or riding in the tractor, you know, doing, doing the work outside. So, you know, he'd be out there and then I'd be inside. And so really, that was just kind of his way of dealing with it being one with, I guess you'd say, nature. Jack was also a volunteer firefighter in our community, so we lived in a very small community. And so he was on the volunteer fire department. So he that was his second family. And he really made a lot of connections and had best friends in that community. And he would lean on that, you know, whether the guys would come out and they would be out in the shop, you know, just talking or having a couple beers or whatever they did. That was his help. I spent all my time with Gracie. I said, I have to get up every day. I have to be moving forward for her. But, you know, Jack and I would always come back together. We never really had arguments about grief. We never had any disagreements about it. Um, we just really acknowledged that we were both grieving differently. But in the end, we were really grieving the same. You know, we just did it differently. And and I think that's what worked for us. It's a good way to put it because there's always the pain of the experience. And then there's the suffering. The suffering is the parts that we can manage the pain. It's just the reality that we cannot fix. And so that part that we can manage. What I've seen work best with different people in different contexts of their grief is to allow each other to just do whatever it is and try our hardest not to take it personal. Because sometimes the fact that somebody else is not seeing it from our perspective could feel like a little bit of a sting or a big sting, but honoring that, hey, maybe the way what he needs right now is his work family and his volunteer family, and to be out in the sun and clear his head. And then you needed more of that spiritual nourishment or that community that rallied around you. And some words of comfort, perhaps. And both are okay. Both are perfectly okay. I think that's really important. So I love that you both had that understanding. He internalized a lot of the pain and having to hold the family together, and that took a toll on him. It was actually Garrett's one year anniversary came in June of two thousand and seven, about the end of August, beginning of September of two thousand and seven. Jack. He traveled a lot for work as well, so he was having some issues with his eye. And just like it felt like something was in it. It was bothering him. And, you know, he'd go to the doctor and, you know, he'd come home from a business trip and he's like, do you see something in my eye? It's bothering me. I'm like, I don't see anything. Just looks like it's irritated, probably. And so he'd go to the doctor. The doctor's like, well, I don't see anything. Gave him some drops, you know, we were doing everything and then sent him to an ophthalmologist and and Jack never had eye issues prior to this. Went an ophthalmologist, same thing. So this head went on, you know, they didn't see anything. And then this head went on for weeks and weeks. He'd go every couple weeks. And then it was towards the end of October of Two thousand and seven. The ophthalmologist saw something. So, um, she sent us. We, like I said, we live in Nebraska. So at the time, in two thousand and seven, they didn't have some of the equipment here in Nebraska at the hospital. So we were sent to the University of Iowa, um, to their ophthalmology department. And Jack was seen, but it was a whole workup and he was diagnosed with ocular melanoma. Um, so what had happened was he had a tumor in his eye. It was it broke through his iris finally. And that's what the ophthalmologist had seen at that moment. It was just like, are you freaking kidding me? You know, like what? What what? Okay, so we just kind of moved forward, you know, they wanted to move fast and furious in Iowa to like, remove his eye, do this, do that. And we kind of put the brakes on that. And we really wanted to come home, process talk to his family and we wanted to see our regular doctor and all that. So his doctor, they ended up doing, you know, scans and all that. And it had spread. It had spread to his liver, spleen and his brain. So at that point, the brain tumors that were there were the most important because it was going to cause, you know, some functionality issues. And Jack ended up doing a starting in December, he ended up doing full brain radiation. And then they radiated his eye. Um, and then he started chemo. You know, we go into two thousand and eight and it was just a long year of ups and downs on this cancer journey. About a year later, it was, well, October, November of two thousand and eight when Jack the cancer just started spreading aggressively. And he was given six to nine months to live, you know, and when Jack was first diagnosed, you know, he was diagnosed stage four terminal cancer. So, you know, we we knew the fight that we had. We didn't know how long we'd have. We thought we could have a long time or not. We didn't know. But um, and we never, ever gave up hope. That was not in Jack's DNA ever to give up. And he was gonna fight for his family, his daughter, for me. You know, I mean, that was what he was going to do. And so Jack ended up doing full brain radiation again in December of two thousand and eight, which is they don't normally do that, but Jack wanted to try. He ended up only living two months from that. So he died February eighth. Just we just passed an anniversary here. Yes, yes. Um, on Thursday last Thursday we fifteen years. So Jack's been gone fifteen years now. And at that moment in time, I didn't know. I didn't know what my future would look like, you know, and I was scared. I was so, so lonely. But again, I looked at my daughter Gracie, you know. So she's six at the time. This girl deserves to have a beautiful life. And so I have to do everything I can as a mother to make sure she does. I have to get up every morning because now it's just us. Definitely was not the path I thought my life would ever be, but here I am. That's a lot for any person. And yet you found something to hang on to. So in that process, that could be so part of grief. It just makes you feel so untethered. Every part is moving, including the ground you're standing on, and you have no idea where anything's going. So what grounded you? How did you find ways to ground yourself amidst the chaos and the news and the uncertainty? I leaned on family and friends. You know, it was getting harder because we were all losing the same people, but, you know, in different aspects. You know, grandparents were losing grandchildren. You know, my in-laws lost their son and grandson, you know, so it was just this culmination of different people. But we were all losing the same person. So Gracie and I started going to a local grief group here in Nebraska, and that is where I kind of found my same people. Um, so I met a wonderful group of widows and widowers at the time. It was called Teddy Bear Hollow, and it's now called the collective for Hope. But they focus on grief for children. And so really teaching them, guiding them through the grief journey. And then we go as adults or caretakers or whoever we are, we go. And we also learn a lot. I read a ton. I mean, I any book I would pick up and I would read, that's all I could do at the time as well because I was so alone as well. You know, it was just me. And I think that's one of the scariest things that people don't talk about a lot after you lose a spouse. And just the loneliness is incredibly scary. It's hard. And then the decisions you have to make. It's so strange. I guess you'd say like, I didn't have to run any like a big purchase. Who did I get to talk to about? I didn't get to talk to anybody about it. I said, we lived in a small community, and our community really stepped up and really guided Gracie and I, and we continued to go to church. Um, it was getting harder and harder for me to do that. I always had my faith and I always had hope, but it was, it was starting to falter a little. Understandably so. I think it's I don't think there's any shame in saying that these types of losses that rearrange your understanding of what life is, what death is, the fairness or lack thereof, you know, and I, a lot of people say, well, life is not fair, but jeez, you know, there are there are circumstances and there are circumstances. And it's okay to question all of those things. Our faith, our belief in God, the why. There's a lot of questioning. We're trying to make sense. Our literal brains are trying to make sense of the experience. And part of that is really, you know, it shakes your foundation a bit a lot. That's very normal. On top of that, when you're questioning all of this, then something else happens to somebody very close to you as well. So tell us about that. My brother Seth, who is six years younger than I am, he, uh, he had actually been battling a brain tumor. August two thousand and four, he was diagnosed with a brain tumor. Um, and my brother Seth actually lived on our property, so I, like I said, we had an acreage, so we had the big house and then we had a little house. And so my brother had just graduated college and he trying to find his path in life. He was living on the farm with us and we loved it. It was so, so good to have him. He moved in in August, and a couple weeks later he had a seizure. And at that time, then we found out he had a brain tumor. Grade one. So that was fortunate because they were able to remove his brain tumor. He didn't have to do chemo or radiation or anything. So that was a blessing. And he was very healthy. And so he bounced back so well, just amazing. We moved forward. You know, he finds his love and he gets married. And they stay living on the farm actually in the little house. And it was so just amazing to have them living there with us. You know, my brother, he would we'd, he'd always come over and we'd play Guitar Hero, you know, and we'd always eat my leftovers. He was a great eater, he wrote right after he got married in September of two thousand and seven, Jack started having his issues. He was diagnosed. My brother's tumor came back again, and he had to have a second surgery to remove his brain tumor. And again, it came back grade one, which was amazing news again. And he ended up not having to do chemo and radiation again. And he again he bounced back, was doing great. Him and his wife, Joey were living a beautiful life. And you know, they were there for us, helping us do things around the farm and all that. Fast forward. Yes to when Jack died, February two thousand and nine. I just remember my brother and Joey took Gracie and I to the. Drove us to my husband's funeral, and my brother turned around when we were leaving the church, and he just looked at me and he's like, don't worry, sissy. He's like, I've got you. I'm going to be here to help you. And you know, that was at that moment, I was just like, okay, it's going to be okay. You know, however it's going to be okay. I believe wholeheartedly that the stress of our losing our son, Garrett, ignited some of this cancer in Jack. And then I believe the death of Jack and Garrett ignited Seth's cancer as well. You know, just to push it again. So Seth started having issues again in March, the beginning of March. So not even quite a month after Jack had died. He had a third brain surgery on March thirteen, two thousand and nine, and this time it came back. It was growing and it was angry. And my brother, he just never bounced back from it. He ended up dying. April seventh, two thousand and nine, exactly two months after Jack did. So at that point in my life, I had no family to turn to. I didn't feel like. Because how could I turn to anybody? We were all just in a tailspin of grief. And that's where that was probably my darkest point. I didn't know how to move forward. I didn't know who to turn to, and I had lost a lot of my faith at that point in time. I was so, so, so angry, and I didn't even know who I was grieving for anymore. You know, a lot of the time I didn't know. Was I grieving for my son? Was I grieving for my husband? Was I grieving for Seth? I didn't I had no clue. You know, I look at my daughter Gracie had a birthday in between all that in March. So she's seven now. And I just looked at her and I was like, we are. We are going to live life. We are going to live. And I don't know how this is going to look, but we are going to live. And so that's what we did. And it was so sad. It was such a sad period of our lifetime. Understandably so. You know, I feel the sadness just listening. So I can only imagine what it was like living it. What changed for you and Gracie in how you viewed grief, how you view life, even amidst the anger, even amidst the questioning your faith? Did you talk about grief openly with her? Was it something that you welcomed in in terms of, you know, we're going to talk about them, we're going to do these rituals? Or were you a little bit more quiet to the heart about the experience? Oh, no, we openly talked about it. That was one thing. I was going to keep these people alive, you know, because Gracie was just young and she still needed to get to know who these people were. So we were going to talk. So we would honor, you know, anniversaries or, you know, angel bursaries, as we call them. We celebrated and honored our people. Um, we would have dinners. We would celebrate with family and friends. I don't one hundred percent suggest people do this, but my, my goal was to travel. I was like, I'm gonna travel. Gracie and I are going to travel. So that summer, after we had lost everybody in two thousand and nine, we were gone a lot. We traveled. But the reality is, in August, when we had to come back and Gracie had to start her school routine, so she was just going into second grade. Then every time you came back, it didn't go away. I think I was trying to run from the grief, like, oh, if we keep ourselves busy and do this and that, then it's okay, you know? But the reality was when we came back, it's like no death and grief were still sitting there. You know, at our house. So like I said, we started going to that teddy bear Hollow again. So we started doing group. I mean, we just really leaned into surviving. I journaled a lot. We talked a lot about it and surrounding ourselves with friends and family. They are the people that carried us was probably later, you know, my faith began to grow. Sometimes I just wonder. But, you know, I continued journaling, I continued reading, I have no magic, no magic advice, but I will just say that you have to. You really just have to live. You have to live for your people and you have to honor them always. And I think that is what pushes you through and forward. Sounds like the journaling practice was the constant amidst every single change and every single loss. I love that too. I have my own journaling practice. And as simple as it may sound, it is profoundly comforting and helpful to processing and integrating and transmuting the grief as we move forward in life. And it's like you say, sometimes it just feels like you're writing the same thing over and over and over and over. That's okay. That's part of the process. Every time you write it, there's a little bit of a release, there's a little bit of an acceptance. There's a little bit of a change. Life is constantly changing. We're not stagnant beings. We're dynamic beings. And the journaling practice. You leave breadcrumbs as to where you were, and you can kind of look back and say, oh my goodness, and you read it and it almost feels like, well, at least when I read mine, I'm not going to speak for everybody. But when I read mine that first year, grief sounds like a completely different person than who I am today. And yet I remember her so viscerally. It's all this, these different versions of ourselves. I like that you highlighted that because a lot of people say, well, what can I do? And like you said, yes, live life. Life doesn't stop, go, go, go. And yet, when you come home, there's an element of grief waiting for you to process it. So it's this and that. I think it's beautiful to do both. If we can give ourselves whatever this looks like to everybody. But if we can give ourselves the opportunity to take a break from the grief, I believe that is healthy and necessary. We cannot be in a state of grief at all times, and we also have to address it. So it sounds like you did both. I always hesitate to use the word beautifully, but there's something beautiful to the quality of just big picture life, um, evolving here. And then all that being said, one more, another loss. Tell us about your sister in law, please. Yes. So my sister in law, Brooke. Um, so this is my first husband, Jack's sister. It was just the two of them. This is where I've always talked about our choices that we have in life and how we how we move forward in life. We can choose to live and heal and honor and survive. Or my sister in law, Brooke, did not choose that. She chose alcohol. That was her device. She lived in Colorado, so she was away from all of us. So she had a lot of guilt on her shoulders, not being right here with us in the midst of it all. She had guilt of not being here when Garrett died, and then she felt guilt not being here during Jack's cancer journey. Right before Jack had passed, Brooke had actually lost her job. They were resizing and reorganizing, so she had not found a new job yet. That was another catapult for her. You know, she had a very good job. She was trying to figure out life, you know, within that. Then her marriage is also suffering because she's not working. She's depressed. And so like I said, she started drinking. Her parents, my in-laws, they've tried everything they could. They would go there constantly to Colorado. They'd come back here. Brooke did end up coming home. She was hospitalized. So Brooke would have, um, alcohol induced seizures, so anytime she would drink, she would have an alcohol induced seizure. I feel it's very important to talk about this aspect of the grief because people just they don't understand, and I don't want it to be a taboo subject because it's very important. I've talked to my mother in law about it, talking about it on platforms like this, and you know, she's okay with it. So I'm not spilling the beans and trying to talk about Brooke badly because Brooke was an amazing lady. She really, really was. And she had a heart of gold and she just got lost. But she did come back about twenty seventeen. She came back here. Well, after she was hospitalized. She checked herself out. She came here and she became sober and she became healthy. She grew mentally, she was stronger, but she still had her life in Colorado. In March of twenty eighteen, after Brooke being home in Nebraska for about a year. Um, she decided that she was ready to go back to Colorado to work on her marriage, to work on finding a job, to work on herself. And she really, really was in a good place. Something happened. We'll never know for sure. But that's what alcoholism does. And in June of twenty eighteen, Brooke died from alcoholism. She was alone at home, and she died. It's so, so sad, you know, and it's just it's a disease, you know, it really is a disease. And Brooke would have never wanted this, especially for her parents, now that they had to bury both of their children. It's so sad to watch her. You know, her family. I'm sorry for that, too. I have compassion for her pain because, uh, like Doctor Gabor, mate, I don't know if you're familiar with him, but like he says, don't ask why the addiction? Ask why the pain and usually that type of behavior to where you're drinking, to where you're having seizures is numbing, severe, severe overwhelm of pain and inability to cope with certain things. Some people, some of us have better skills than others, and that depends on many, many factors. But it sounds like one thing trickled into the other had that domino effect that eventually ended her life. Sounds like she fought very hard, and her family rallied for her and tried to keep her here with us and keep her in the best spirits, so we honor that as well. That is a tough journey for her parents. I, I can only imagine, you know, just them losing both of their children, adult children in such a short amount of time, even though it doesn't matter if it was a long time in between. It's just it's a horrible experience. So I'm so sorry for that. You're close to you, your mother in law, your first mother in law, because I also know you were married, and it's not lost on me that your current husband's name is chance. I just hear this name and that your brother's wife, his name was Joy. So I'm just hearing all of these elements. I like to sometimes see how all of these dots connect looking back, and it's not lost on me that all these names play such a significant role, you know, as the people they were and symbolically. So tell us what happened afterwards. You know, you're now remarried and how grief has shifted for you over the past fifteen years. Well, yes. So I am remarried. And what I will say about chance and remarrying is, you know, I do feel blessed that I have been able to find two men that I get to love during my lifetime and then also love me so much. And chance honors my people as much as I do. And he gives me grace upon grace for everything that I'm doing within the grief journey. And he's pushing me to do all the stuff that I am doing. He has become a huge part of Jack's parents, Gracie and I. As we grew, we just started living life and you know? And I always kind of said, why not? Why, why, why can't we? Why don't we get to fill the joy and do all that? So I kind of just took that perspective. And it's never easy. You know, days are still hard. The grief journey is still very you know, there's days that just get me, but I feel so much more joy that I was a part of all these people's lives that I had my son, that he was mine. You know, that Jack married me. You know, I I'm the blessed one and my brother. I got to be his big sissy. You know, I get to be the honored one here, my new family. And I don't say new, like, we're kind of all blended my new in-laws and my new family with Chance's family. Um, they have embraced Gracie and I as well. They honor all our people just as much as we do. And my father in law, for my first marriage. Jack's dad also died last year. He died actually, the same day Jack died. Fourteen years apart. My mother in law. She's alone, but we just take care of her, you know? And she's just part of our family. And, you know, I've started this whole new greeting card business, and that's my passion for the purpose of all of what we've gone through. I love that. And before we get to Butterflies and Halo, I love that you have this community. It sounds like you have this beautiful acceptance between the blended family that you've created. It sounds like everybody is alive and well in spirit and in energy. And then the love that's shared and in the way that you honor and remember everybody. How has your faith and your belief about life after death? Or what is your belief about life after death? If you're okay talking about that in terms of do you still have connections with them? Do you still feel them around? Do you still hold any maybe anger or is that completely subsided? And now you're just more at peace with all of that. Yeah, I would say I'm definitely at peace. I'm definitely at peace with where I'm at. I know that the question why why me will never get answered in my lifetime. You know, I won't know until the day that I die why or how or anything. And I'm okay with that. I do believe in life after death and the day that Jack had died, um, he had a caringbridge site, um, where we just kept everybody up to date on his health journey and everything. And the day that he died, I wrote, you know, that Jack went to be in heaven with our son. And I, you know, the image that I had was. Jack, get into heaven and our son being right there. And he just scooped him right up and off they went. I believe that they're all together up there, and they are the ones that are. They are the ones protecting us and guiding us. And that's why I have to honor the life that they lived here on earth. Just like I have to honor their life in heaven because I think it's it's extremely important because if I don't do that, I don't know what life would look like. The signs we get for Garrett is butterflies and rainbows. And we actually did a live butterfly release for Garrett's one year anniversary, so that was absolutely beautiful. I don't have a lot of signs for Jack. I find kind of strange. I don't know, it's just it's weird things that happen. Like maybe a song will pop on a radio or somebody will say something. You know, Jack always said, it's all good. So I'll like, see that just randomly or songs. And then with my father in law, Cardinals, the day after he died, we were sitting there and there was just Cardinals sitting there, like looking at us. I've been working on a project the week of their anniversaries. You know, it would have been Jack's fifteen year death date. Then my father in law's one year, and I was sitting there working and I just kept on hearing this noise. I'm like, what is that noise? It kept on getting louder. I'm like, it stopped. And then it got louder. And then even the dogs were just like, what? They were like dead asleep. You know, they were looking around like, what is going on? So I get up, I'm like, what is it? And there was a cardinal trying to get in my house. Like it kept out the window. And I was like, oh my gosh. So I got my camera, my video camera real quick. And I was like, and he flew up there and he sat there and I was just, this is the part that just gives me so much peace. As you know, I, so I am writing a book. I'm in the process of that. And so I was writing, finishing up my chapter on my sister in law and my father in law. Here he was, I felt just saying, good job. Keep on doing what you're doing. You know, by honoring all our people is where you're going to find the greatest peace, you know, within yourself. It's kind of why I've done what I've done with my business is just because if we don't talk about it, if we don't talk about them, I mean, if we don't honor them daily, they're going to get shoved away and we're going to hold so much hurt and hatred in our hearts. And I don't want people doing that anymore. Thank you for that. Grief, to me means witnessing and release. When I first started, I had one thing clear. I had this one experience where I felt like my heart was breaking into two. It was a physical experience. And I said, oh my gosh, I think I need to go to the doctor. Like, am I having a heart attack? Is this like, I didn't know what I was experiencing? So I researched it and that's when I learned about takotsubo cardiomyopathy, which is the broken heart syndrome. And I realized that it could be so physical. So I made a promise to myself and I said, I'm not going to let it sit in my bones. I will release it. I don't know where I'm releasing it to, but it's not going to live in me. And that's not to say that I will deny it or not feel it or anything like that, but I am a channel. It's going to go through me and it's going the same way that it comes in, it's going to come out. I've released it in the way of this podcast and the social media and the connections and listening to other people's stories and helping people along the way and other ways that we do privately as a family. So I hear you when you say this, and I do strongly believe that it needs an outlet, whatever that looks like to you, it could be a quiet, private outlet, or it could be a loud and public outlet. It doesn't matter, but it needs somewhere to go. And, and I love that. And so one of the ways that you've harnessed all of that energy and love and remembrance has been through butterflies and halos, which is your beautiful company. And I love this because it's so true. There truly are no words to say to somebody in their grief, but there are some things we can do to comfort each other in a way that's more in touch with the experience than, uh, sympathy cards, right? So tell us where butterflies and halos came from. I know that butterflies symbolize your son, Garrett. And then the halos, I understand, is the rest of your loved ones in spirit. That's a beautiful way to also connect with them through your work. Tell us a little bit about that, how that has evolved and where it's going, what new products you're launching, etc.. Yes. So that is exactly what it's about. Butterflies is, um, in honor of my son Garrett. And then the halos are all my people. And I want people to realize too, if you're newer in on the grief journey or in the grief world, some of these things may not be instant. It took me sixteen, seventeen years before I even was able to do anything after my son died. But the cards, I was sitting there and I was just like, why can't there be a card that I would give my girlfriend? Why do they have to say with deepest sympathy, I'm so sorry for your loss. You know, great intentions, hallmark, I get it, but I, I am one to very I would not give my best friend if her spouse died a card that said that so I just would buy blank cards, really, and I would just write everything in them. Kind of like to have a little snark in some of them because I feel like as I've journeyed through grief, people don't have problems saying stuff to me or assuming or things like that. So I'm going to turn a play on words and I'm going to make a card, you know? So it's been a really fun journey. But the first one I made it was it says, I don't know what to say. Let's go eat one of those damn casseroles. Okay. Right. Because what happens? We get a lot of casseroles. And then the second one I had made, I didn't bring a casserole. I brought the wine, my PJs and my listening heart. I'm trying to change the narrative around grief, and how do we show up and speak to our friends, you know, and how do we eliminate the stigma that grief brings? You know, it is hard. And I know people don't understand what to say, but let me help you say so. I've created a greeting card company that has about one hundred and fifty some cards. Um, some are well meant nice, and some are very snarky. You know, I do a lot of pop up events locally. And I'll tell you what, the ones that are snarky sell like crazy people love them and they're just like, oh my gosh, I need this. Oh my gosh, I need this card. You know, and the conversation that evolves from having these is the thing that has really grown my heart. The cards aside, the conversations and the connections I've made have truly just catapulted me into a newer level of grace and learning about grief and sharing grief and hope. And so it's put me on to this different mission of what I'd like to see. But I offer greeting cards. I do have a couple notebooks, a couple notepads. I am starting to make quite a bit more stickers, um, like vinyl decal stickers for your water bottles or computers. And during the holidays, I have a couple different ornaments. So it's just been, it's just been a labor of love. And I truly, truly do this to honor all my people. And, um, I honor all the people that are grieving. And I want to help you as a friend, help your friend, you know, because we know in life we can't fix this. We can't fix grief. So that's why I say we can't fix it. But, you know, one of these greeting cards will just help somebody. And if we could send a card, if you could send a card once a month to a friend, I mean, imagine if they're having just a crappy day and they open up their mailbox and they have a card in there. You know, just imagine how their day will change. It will lighten their day. It will make them feel seen, feel heard, feel acknowledged, you know, because that's what we need to do, creating this ability to connect and have conversations around the experience in a way that doesn't add insult to injury is very important. I love that you used humor in the Snarkiness. That is an underrated tool in grief if and when used appropriately, of course. Not all. Not all comedy has the green light here, but I took a look at your store. It's on Etsy and I'll link the the link to the store in the show notes. But I also saw how this could bring a smile to somebody's face when they're facing the absolutely most horrible, painful, and hard and difficult time in their life. So I love that you have these conversation starters. They're super cute. They're creative. You could tell that thought went into it. You don't even have to write anything else. The words are there for you. The work has been done through somebody who deeply understands what a griever needs. So this is a great, great resource for a lot of people. Also, you are writing a book. So tell us about the book. Yes. So I hired Blue Hat Publishing Company out of Franklin, Tennessee, and I sent over my first rough draft. So it's in the editing phase right now. Looking at it being released June of pretty soon. Yes. So pre-sales will go on sale probably April. They kind of said so. I'm so excited. Um, the book is a journey of all my people and it's going to be a story of their life, their death gracey's life, our life afterwards. And it's just, it's going to be beautiful. I'm, I'm so excited for it. Besides my Etsy store, I do have a website which is butterflies and halos dot com. And I do a blog there. So I write a blog on there as well, but I have all the information on there where you can actually purchase the cards and any of the items. Um, but you can read the blog and I have my information from my book coming out on there as well. How was that for you? Um, I actually started writing my book in twenty nineteen. It does not come easy because it was hard again. My husband chance was just like, Angie, you need to do this. And you know, after I started the cards, I'm like, I have more to say. If one person picks up my book and they read it and they're just like, wow, she she survived that, you know, she's surviving this, you know, she's living life to the fullest. I, I want to do that too. You know, I want, so I've helped one person, but in the beginning, it was okay. These last month to two months writing it has been extremely hard. Um, just because it brought up a lot the stuff I wanted to include journal entries, just our whole journey. It, it brought up a lot and it was very hard. And so when I closed my laptop for the last time, really, I cried, you know, but I feel so good. I actually feel like right now I have this weight off my shoulder and I'm just like, okay, what's next? You know, and it's not even done. I know I have a lot of editing to do still too, and I, but I do, I feel like I just feel like I've released, I've released what I needed to the words in. There are some of the words of Jack's words, um, going through his cancer journey, Gracie's words. So it's, it's been very therapeutic. You get to incorporate so many elements of whose story you shared and who was impacted through your story. So grief and light, the, the name of this podcast, the light aspect was this idea that I had that Grievers can shine a light for other grievers along the path. So somebody who's gone ahead of you can help you navigate that way forward. And just in amidst this crazy, chaotic darkness, so another griever can shine that light through their story. The story matters so much. Your ability to say this happened, it was as awful as they say it is, and you could also survive it and you can thrive. Thank you for writing the book. I look forward to reading it. I'm excited for you. That's a big feat. I'm happy to hear that. It also feels like some weight has been lifted off your shoulder. I love that they get to live on through your work and through the stories that you share, and I love that your husband, chance, is so supportive. That also says a lot about your family and what you're you've built. Thank you for being here. You, um, I will leave the floor open for you to say anything else. If there are any last thoughts. And what would Angie today say to Angie eighteen years ago? That's. Wow. Um, I've learned more about grace than I ever I ever would have known, I guess. And, uh, I always tell people to give yourself grace. Um, if you're having a bad day, if you feel, if you feel that you can't move forward throughout the day at all, just give yourself grace. If you feel like you're a lug and you're just sitting on the couch. And why can't I be like that person? And it's okay, you know? It's okay. Just give yourself grace always. And you know, and I always tell people who aren't the griever meet the griever where they're at, you know? Meet them. Meet them where they're at. Don't try to fix them above. Don't try to go beneath them. Just meet them where they're at in their grief journey because that's all they need. I give grace to everybody because we just don't know. Thank you so much, Angie, for being here, for sharing your story with us. Thank you. Yes. Thank you so much. That's it for today's episode. Be sure to subscribe to the Grief and Light podcast. I'd also love to connect with you and hear your thoughts and your stories. Feel free to share them with me via my Instagram page at Grief and Light. Or you can also visit Grief and Light dot com for more information and updates. Thank you so much for being here, for being you. And always remember you are not alone.