Saving Lives Through Harm Reduction with Thomas Guerra | Podcasthon 2026

PODCASTHON SPECIAL EPISODE Part of the world's largest charity podcast event — raising awareness for causes that matter

What does harm reduction actually look like, and how is it saving lives right now?

In this impactful episode, we explore the realities of addiction, harm reduction, and the ongoing fight to save lives. Thomas Guerra of F-Fent.org shares personal insights, dispels common myths, and highlights the vital work being done in communities everywhere, from music festivals to college campuses and beyond.

This conversation explores:

• The current state of overdose deaths and recent trends: around 80,000 in 2024, a significant drop from 110,000
• The importance and impact of harm reduction strategies like naloxone / Narcan distribution and fentanyl test strips
• 5 common misconceptions about recovery and substance use
• The role of stigma and language in shaping perceptions and community support
• Community awareness and systemic support in combating the overdose crisis
• Family dynamics in recovery and supporting loved ones through systemic understanding
• The evolving landscape of drug toxicity
• Advocacy for funding and policy reforms supporting harm reduction
• Personal stories of life-saving interventions and full-circle moments in the field
• How everyone can contribute, from sharing information to volunteering and donating

Connect with Thomas Guerra:

• 🌟 Donate Here 🌟
• f-fent.org
• Harm Reduction Resources
• Upcoming Trainings
• Instagram
• Previous podcast episode with Thomas Guerra

About F-Fent.org:

F-fent.org is a 501(c)(3) nonprofit fighting the fent@nyl crisis through education, harm reduction, and community outreach. The goal is life-saving awareness without judgment. Donate Here

About Podcasthon:

Podcasthon is the biggest charity event in the podcasting world: a fast-growing non-profit initiative uniting thousands of podcasters globally. Hosts dedicate one episode to a charity of their choice, releasing them simultaneously each mid-March to create a massive, international wave of inspiring audio content.

Learn more at: podcasthon.org

Supporting harm reduction saves lives

Everyone has a role: through donation, education, compassionate languag

Transcript

You just lost your loved one. Now what? Welcome to the Grief in Life podcast where we explore this new reality through grief-colored lenses. Openly, authentically, I'm your host, Nina Rodriguez. Let's get started. Hello and welcome back to Grief in Light. My name is Nina Rodriguez and I'm your host. Today we are joining a worldwide podcasting initiative. Grief in Light is thrilled to participate in the fourth edition of Podcast Thon.

the world's largest podcast charity initiative, bringing together podcasters globally to raise awareness for special causes. For one week, thousands of podcasters all over the world will highlight a charity of their choice. And today I have the honor of welcoming an organization doing life-saving work. Our guest, Tomas Guerra is back in conversation with us as he was part of season one of the Grief and Light podcast. The episode will be linked in the show notes.

Thomas is CEO and founder of F Ventinel, a harm reduction organization working to prevent overdose deaths, reduce stigma and support recovery. Their mission is deeply personal to me as their work helps prevent deaths like my brothers and support families navigating this reality. Today we're going to talk about where things stand now since our last conversation three years ago, what has changed and how education, compassion and harm reduction

continues to help save lives. If you or a loved one struggled with addiction or an active recovery, or if you lost someone to substance-related causes, then this episode is for you. Please go ahead and share it with those who you think need to hear it. Thomas, welcome back to the Grief In Life podcast. It's great to be here. I can't believe it's already been three years. I feel like we did that the other day.

Seriously, we fling them here we are, but I'm so grateful to have you back. You are such a light in the space and in life in general. And we've kept in touch over the years because you've done some amazing events, especially here in Miami, South Florida, where we're located. And I was very called to have you back because of your knowledge, your work, your experience, and just you being a friend of the podcast. since we last talked, and for those who don't,

know you or haven't heard about F-Fensinil, if you could just give us a brief story about what got you into this work, take it from wherever you'd like. Sure. So, right when we had the last podcast, that's like right when we started, 2023. We were like a month or two into it. We started because overdoses were at the highest rate at that point, 2023 and 2024. Those were the highest, like 110,000.

deaths a year, we needed to do something, right? And I had worked in recovery before, but I felt like there was a whole huge population that was still missing. And so that's where F-ventanol was born and we meet people where they're at, whether it's somebody with a severe substance use disorder or somebody trying for the first time, they're all at risk. And so we try not to let anybody slip through the cracks. We try to give the information. We do trainings and talks.

to high schools, to universities, to churches, wherever. We'll go anywhere to educate folks that wouldn't normally hear this message. The biggest thing we do is education and training, and we also distribute life-saving medication, which is the Naloxone or Narcan, which is a huge reason why the numbers are finally going down when it comes to overdose deaths, although they're still very high.

they're finally, we're finally seeing some, some type of going down with those. Well, thank you for the important work that you do. And it is absolutely saving lives. I'm curious. I remember, you know, for example, my brother passed in 2019 and the numbers were incredibly high back then too. When we connected, it was like you said, about 110,000. Do you know what the numbers are, what they look like today, three years later? Yeah. Well, the most recent full year that we have 2024 was about 80,000.

They have portions of last year which seems like they have still been going down. I'm assuming around 70,000 area, which is a significant drop, but that number is significantly high still. And we can attribute that to a lot of the work that the people on the ground are doing. Meeting people where they're at with the trains, with the Narcan, with the harm reduction. that's a word that is tricky these days because they're not really supporting.

harm reduction in the federal government, but it is a huge reason as to why the numbers are going down. And, you know, we say it's one of those good news and yet, right? Because it's good news that it's trending downward. Sure, we'll take that. And also 80,000, 70,000, 1,001. When it's your person, one is one too many. You know, I just want to highlight that because we're saying these big numbers, that these are human beings. These are brothers and sisters, friends, family.

sons and daughters and one is one too many. So thank you for the work that you're doing and also this work needs to be supported so much more. But before we talk about anything else, I want to dispel some myths. I feel like people have some preconceived notions about the stereotype they have in their mind about who would use fentanyl or who would die from fentanyl poisoning or who is

is in recovery. So we want to dispel a lot of this. We're going to start with five different myths. I'm going to read one and then you enlighten us and educate us about the actual truth about each one of these. So myth number one that we're dispelling is people who abstain or are in recovery don't have fun. People who are in recovery are just boring and they don't have fun. Well, I wouldn't be here if that were true.

Although it feels like that when you first get into recovery, it feels like, I'm never going to have fun again. How am I going to have fun? That's the first thought when you're early on in recovery. But as, as you grow in your recovery and years pass by, you realize not only do you have fun, but you feel it more, you experience it more, you remember it more. Those memories are more genuine, right? And it's not, Hey, you remember you did this and no, I don't remember that.

It's more like, do remember that and I had such a great day that time. And so it is a common myth. Whereas I needed a substance to validate having fun. Or I needed a substance to say, hey, I'm actually doing something. It's not really the case. Fun, we do so many things these days and it involves recovery. Everybody there is sober. We've had events.

where we go to the heat game together, we've had picnics at the park, we've gone into music festivals and we've connected with people there, right? And that doesn't mean we can't have fun. Yes, and in South Florida, we have a big festival and I always see that you're present there. I'm curious, have you saved somebody in the moment in one of those festivals? Because I know that there's a lot of incidents that happen there. Have you experienced anything? Yeah.

Myself directly, I haven't, but as a result of the Narcan that we gave out last year, we heard about 10 different instances where they used our Narcan. That's not to say that they didn't use more, but that's just the ones that told us that we heard back from. And so it is absolutely necessary at these music festivals. It's been more commonplace, right? It's a norm to have Narcan there at the festival and people, you know, we were giving out Narcan, people are like, I already got mine right here. I'm ready to go. They're prepared and they're not.

there to be because they're going to be using necessarily is because they're ready to save somebody else. So it seems like there's this awareness that if we're going into these places, there's a high likelihood that somebody's life could be at risk. so carrying this could literally save a life and it has and thanks to this awareness. right. Myth number two, people in recovery aren't allowed to hang out with people who drink. They can only be friends with each other. So now you

you're like separated in groups of friends. Tell us a little bit about that. Yeah, I mean, initially I thought that was the case and I think it's more of a pick and choose in those situations, right? I do not go on a regular basis to situations where it's constantly a lot of drinking, a lot of using. But if I'm going to, you know, party, I'm not going to hide out.

If I'm going to a family function, I'm gonna go. Not everybody that drinks has a severe problem. Some people are able to drink recreationally and I don't hold that against anybody. I just know that that's not me. When I go into these situations, I always go prepared. And when I say prepared, I go, hey, I go in my own vehicle. I have a plan. I go and focus on other things besides, hey, I can't drink. It's more, hey,

can't wait to try this food. can't wait to see my, cousin and going for, for different purpose. Right. and I absolutely have, how now with numerous situations, you know, where people are drinking, but it's, it's not my, my norm like it used to be. Right. where it was like 24 seven every day. Now it's, you know, I pick and choose my battles. Not that it's something that is difficult or in the beginning it is for sure. And I would always advise somebody that's new to recovery.

You don't have to prove anything to anybody if you don't need to be there. You don't have to pass this test or do the, it's pick and choose. Do you need to be there or do you not need to be there? If you don't need to be there, you don't have to test yourself. Put some time in between, get some time under your belt before you have to go into these situations. And when you do, go in with the plan. Don't get stuck in the situation if you just got dropped off there and you have no way out. That's a tough situation.

but having a way out, going in your own car or having a sober buddy to go with you, always a good option. And bringing your own beverage, right? Huge. I always bring my own. I bring energy drink or water, whatever it may be, so I can have something ready to go in my hand. So it's easier for people to see, they don't offer me a drink because I already have something. And it's been good so far. I haven't had any issues. And for the most part, after a while, people know,

He doesn't drink. I'm not going to offer him anymore. Right? I haven't been told that I'm not fun anymore. That's the benefit I see. Thank you for touching on that because yes, your organization has the word fentanyl in it, but we're talking about the broader sense of recovery and support and harm reduction. So all substances, including alcohol. And I would also argue or call and invite people to

Be mindful of how, when, and what you're offering to another person. You don't know what somebody else has been through. And I have become very aware of, as harmless as it may seem, and almost like polite in some cases of saying, hey, would you like a drink? Oh no, seriously, here, let me pour you a drink. There are so many times, especially somebody in early recovery, that I can imagine, they only have like one or two nos left in them before they may not cave in. And I say this,

Seriously, because I don't know what happened, for example, on the last day of my brother's life, but it was the day after his birthday. I have a feeling somebody that he knew from his past may have called him, invited him over, and said, here, take this, right? And maybe he had one or two nos left in him. I don't know. I can only imagine what it's like to have your willpower tested so many times, especially if you're around friends or family. It's not necessarily that one goes out seeking this. It's so pervasive.

for even, like I said, friends and family to welcome you to barbecue and say, hey, have a couple drinks, have this, have that. So I would invite people to be more mindful. The first no, it's enough. Like if they say no, that's it. I completely agree with that. honestly, it's really none of your business why somebody's not drinking, right? And to not push it and say, why or what happened? What's going on?

That's really none of your business. If they want to tell you that that's okay for them to disclose if they want to, but to push that or, hey, it's my birthday, we're taking shots, come on, come on. This is a serious situation for a lot of folks. To say no and to be tempted and influenced is another thing. We already have enough with our own thoughts in our head, right? And then to go in and maybe we're not even thinking about anything and then that gets offered, right? And it's just another added temptation.

That we got to deal with so I would say be a supportive Bystander right and you see somebody pushing that on somebody to step in you know because Some people they're this close right there this close and it's a life-or-death situation for a lot of Thank you for that myth number three relapse is always a

part of recovery. And I have to say this one is one that I actually believed because it's repeated so much. So enlighten us with that one. Relapse is always a part of recovery. Definitely a myth because a lot of people will hear that and say, you know what, I haven't relapsed yet. Maybe, you know, I got mine coming up. Right. And I would say, no, it's not necessary to be part of recovery. If it does happen, it can be a very

good learning experience, right? But it's not a requirement for recovery. I know a lot of folks that have actually had not haven't had a relapse. Is it the majority? No. Most people will have a bump in the road on the way to sustained recovery, right? But it's not the requirement. When I'm working with clients at the treatment center, I'm never going to say, hey, expect a relapse or to their families, expect a relapse. I'm always going in. Just be cautious. You know, if it does happen, we can learn from that.

But it's not a guarantee. Everybody is an individual person and everybody is different and everybody has a different journey to their recovery. so, my life, had numerous relapses, right? Numerous and I would never say that they were failures. I would say I learned a lot what doesn't work. I know a lot not how not to stay sober. So it helped me in the future, right? With multiple attempts to go on a treatment, multiple attempts to go on the meetings.

I learned of things that didn't work for me and help me now today, especially when I'm helping other people. Yeah, that one was eye-opening for me as well because it's a very common myth that people repeat without really knowing what they're saying. Thank you for saying that it could actually be an expectation for somebody in recovery if you believe that myth.

of saying, well, if I haven't had a relapse, then I'm not, you know, I'm not there yet. So it just, be careful with it. Yeah. I mean, I mean, it scares people, right? Which sometimes it's a healthy fear, but for somebody to, having relapse, what does that mean? Does that mean I'm going to relapse or do I have to relapse? It's, you don't want to have that mindset of like, oh no, I'm going to fail. It's just, hey, I got to keep my guard up and I'm going to do my best.

Myth number four, you can spot a person in recovery just by looking at them. They have a look. How is this a myth? Maybe for some, some of them, but not all of them. I'm surprised on a daily basis when I run into people and they disclose their recovery to me. And that's between us. I don't ever share that with anybody else. But I've met so many different people from different professions.

lawyers, doctors, when I was at the university with professors and researchers, you wouldn't normally think that, right, because of the stigma attached to recovery and substance use, that people work in those fields, right? But honestly, you can never tell. When somebody is open with their recovery and they kind of share it openly, if it's a celebrity or somebody sharing about their recovery, it kind of opens up like, wow, how is this person, you know?

He has everything. have all, you know, they got money, they got status and they're in recovery, right? And so it can be from any walk of life. doesn't matter what race, what gender, anything along that nature. And the coolest part too is that I connect with people that I wouldn't normally connect if I didn't have this recovery or if I didn't go to meetings, right? It's just like, I meet people that I wouldn't think that we would have anything in common, but we have a lot in common.

I've learned that as well. It's when people feel comfortable to open up, you would be surprised how many people have either struggled with something or have a loved one that is struggling. It's more common than we may understand. So just not having those ideas in our mind of what it may quote unquote look like, like the movies portrayal, could be really helpful to connect with people.

share and when people share openly, it gives other people courage to reach out for help and share about what's going on in their lives, right? When sometimes they don't have it in them to ask for help, but somebody opens up about their recovery or what's going on in their family and it gives them that much strength to ask for help or to open up, right? And I see that constantly where, and when I'm working at the treatment center, I always ask the clients, right, how long?

before you asked for help. it's years, usually the answer is years, right? When they built up that strength to ask for help. Thank you. And this is the reason this podcast exists. My brother was in recovery. And when you actually invited me to participate in the overdose awareness day, I think it was, in the University of Miami,

It was the first time I had to confront myself and say, hey, am I ready to talk about this openly? And when I realized like what was stopping me, I felt like there was shame about people judging my brother, people judging my family, people judging me. And there was that protective sister wanting to step in. I don't even want to talk about this because people will take it the wrong way. Then another thought followed, which was who cares? Like who cares what people think? That is not.

That's not my business, right? That's their business. And more importantly, allowing ourselves to be quiet and keep this hidden because of whatever shame we may feel is what's making things so pervasive and harmful to people. This is why people suffer in silence. This is why my brothers suffer in silence. So I said, I won't add to this silence surrounding, you know, recovery and addiction and...

all these things because that is literally what is killing people or what's in my opinion, right? It's the reason people hurt in silence. So shining a light on these topics, talking about them openly is literally saving lives. I think 100 % you know, and you see that after you open up, right? And how many people come in and talk to you and thank you. And it's so amazing how many people are

suffering in silence, you know, and there's also ignorance out there. And I don't say that to be mean. I say that because people don't really understand the disease. They don't understand addiction. They don't understand overdose. dealt with this other day online, right? I put a promoting the overdose prevention training. Then somebody put a comment. How about they just don't use drugs? All right.

What a groundbreaking thought. What a helpful groundbreaking You solved the problem. But it was a very judgmental, like, hey, not understanding. I didn't engage with it, but it just shows me, hey, our work is not done. We have to talk to these people, and hopefully we could change some people's mind. We're not going to change everybody's mind. But I was one of those people in a different way where they changed my mind with harm reduction.

I was not supportive of harm reduction. I didn't understand harm reduction. As a person in recovery, I was like, no, don't use drugs and that's it. Whereas harm reduction is getting people where they're at and people are still using drugs, but they're staying alive. I switched my thought process because I learned from it. And that's the goal here is to put that information and hopefully people can change their thought process.

to support people and be more compassionate. And unfortunately, this happens when they have that certain way of thinking and then somebody in their family was affected by addiction or overdose, right? And then immediately they change their mind. Thank you for saying that. And if you could elaborate on what is harm reduction and why somebody would maybe be against it, like, you know, that earlier version of you, why would somebody be against it?

Harm reduction is basically meeting people where they're at. is limiting the dangers of something that is very harmful. There's fatal car crashes on a daily basis, but harm reduction in that manner is having seat belts, having airbags, having safety features in the car because you're not going to stop driving, but you want to limit those dangers. When it comes to drug use, it means living the dangers despite somebody, even if they are not willing to stop using or they are

not even having a severe substance use disorder, but they're using recreation. It's just meeting people where they're at. so taking the judgment out, right, which was hard at the beginning for me, because I was taught, you know, in recovery, we don't use, right? But then over time I realized, you know what, are we just turning our back on people that use? I needed help when I was using. It's really about not turning your back on.

despite the fact that somebody's not wanting to stop or ready to stop, still showing love and providing support and giving them some safe tools so they can make it to the next day. And maybe they'll want recovery that next day. Thank you for that. And I love that you said taking the judgment out. Once you do that for yourself, for a loved one who's struggling, you see life through a different lens and you see their experience, your own experience.

through a different lens. And that's incredibly helpful. Another thing I found helpful was using people first language. Some people like this, some people don't care for it. I found it really helpful. Instead of saying addict, junkie, all these words and labels that completely minimize this person's life to one action, you say a person struggling with addiction or a person in active addiction or a person in recovery.

it's a person first. And when you see that, you separate the behavior from the person and there's a space for possibility. And that possibility could be long-term sustained recovery and a healthy full life. Yeah, I love the language too. Specifically, when using it around folks that have never been around recovery or substance use, because if you say,

hey, I'm an addict or I'm an alcoholic to somebody that never heard the lingo, they're going to think somebody at the lowest level of their addiction, right? Because there's a stigma attached to those words. And so it is helpful to get your foot in the door for those conversations because some people would turn their back if they hear anything like junkie or addict or anything like that. And a person's life, I want to reiterate, is not defined by this. And I highlight this in conversations and articles in public and when I speak because

my brother's cause of death was related to fentanyl. That is not what defined his life. It was a part he struggled with. Fentanyl was not his drug of choice for the record, but it is what took his life. And so that end point doesn't define his entire life. And I want people to understand that if you are somebody who has a loved one experiencing active addiction,

If you've experienced it yourself, I'd want to validate and normalize that doesn't define the fullness of your life. So I feel like people need to hear that sometimes. All right, myth number five, people in college are too young to be in recovery. They're just so young. That doesn't happen to them. I used to believe that, right? seeing so many young people find recovery at a young age,

A lot of times in college, I've seen it and I've seen it numerous times. And my story involves getting some help while I was in college or having also a relapse while I was in college. I did learn about something called collegiate recovery when I was getting back into recovery. And there's full programs, there's student-led organizations and clubs for students in recovery.

on these campuses. I think the numbers are close to 180 campuses that have some type of support on campus for students. And that's a pretty small number compared to the number of campuses, of colleges, as opposed to 2,000. But there was only like five. So it's increased dramatically. And there is support. College is a hostile environment for somebody in recovery.

It's hard to be in recovery, but it's not impossible with the right support. You're never too young, you're never too old. If you have the right resources, you definitely can get sober or get into recovery at any age. And that's what I advocate for. I was advocating at Florida International University for it to start a program, and that's where we started our student club. We saw what is possible, and a lot of people got into recovery at FIU during that time we were there.

went to their first meeting on campus. Imagine that going to your first recovery meeting on a college campus. And a lot of kids did that when we were at FIU. Well, thank you for your work there. I don't know if this has anything to do with it, but I recently helped a relative move into college. And I noticed in the dorms right next to the AED, there was a set of box, think it was like a few boxes of Narcan readily available.

and a number to call the emergency to call somebody. And I wonder if you had anything to do with that. Well, if it was at we did have something to do with that. We connected with the Sandler Center there and they got Narcan all over the place now, which is amazing. That is amazing. And maybe somebody's listening and saying, it shouldn't have to be this way. We shouldn't even need this. People should just know better. Right. And I would offer that it's more

important to focus on having these systems in place in case of an emergency, the same way that we have a fire extinguisher, an AED. Just having it in place, like break the glass in case of emergency, then not having it at all. Because the timing is so crucial. And at the end of the day, whether somebody took a substance consciously, or it was a substance that they ingested unknowingly,

you want to be able to have the means to potentially save their life. And the timing is everything. So college campuses, public spaces, offices, et cetera. 100%. Any public place should have that, exactly what you said, right? Just like the AED with the sign that says, hey, overdose reversal medication naloxone here. And they have those available. just some places are a little iffy about including that.

of what is it say about our location, right? When reality says you care about the people there.

And I recently saw a post, I'm sorry I didn't save it and I can't remember the name of it, but there are people talking about drugs stronger than fentanyl being out on the market nowadays that are not responsive to naloxone. Have you encountered this?

Yes, I mean the main one that is probably the most out there is dilazine, right? Which we have seen in Miami, but they put it on the media like in Philadelphia and Kenting, where you see a lot of folks there just kind of nodding out. For the most part, it is still going to be mixed with opioids. So the Narcan will work on the opioid part of it and can still save their life. But we're always

Teaching in our trainings too is that the rescue breaths, right, which can be very important, especially if it's another drug involved, right, so including those rescue breaths. And I attended a conference the other day, where they mainly use oxygen to revive somebody. It's oxygen, they don't use the Narcan. Although they have the Narcan there, the oxygen is the main thing that they're using to bring back people, because that's really what the overdose is, is the...

the lack of oxygen and respiratory failure. And so when we do our trainings, we teach the rescue breast, we give the CPR face shields so people can not worry about exchanging fluids or anything like that. It's very important because it's an ever-changing drug supply market, Right now, it's fentanyl. It's gonna be something else in a few years, right? And it's just gonna change. It's just we gotta adapt with the times. Thank you, C. I learned something new today. I didn't know about the oxygen and that makes me

perfect sense, just knowing that the oxygen is the key component here is something new that I just learned. And, you know, we're living in a time when support for programs that are so helpful to people, including mental health, including recovery and harm reduction, are just being gutted and ripped apart and all the things. I have thoughts, but I will let you share yours.

in terms of what's working right now and what is needed? Yeah, well, it is a scary time. It was a couple of weeks back where they took two billion away and then they gave it back the next day. But just the fact that they thought this is not important, mental health, addiction, all these things are not important to the federal government where they're willing to gut it without a second thought. And so it takes a lot of advocacy and a lot of people.

making calls and letting their voice heard so they let them know that we need this. the evidence is there, right? We see that the numbers have begun to go down with what has been funded in place, which was never funded before. Harm reduction is something new that was funded in recent years, including the Narcan, including test strips, including some other more controversial things, right?

But the numbers don't lie. The numbers are going down. And although they may try to take credit for the numbers going down now, it's the work that we did in previous years that come out later on. And so Narcan does work. We know that works. We know that compassion works. Then we know that peer support works. We know that treatment works, right? But not just one by itself, all of them in conjunction together. And so to take parts of it away,

is not smart. They're not basing it on science or evidence-based. They're basing it on, you know, who knows, right? When all you gotta do is go back to the data, the data that shows what is happening. But unfortunately, sometimes the data's not enough. And so we have to advocate, this is something that works. should immediately tell them, we should put more focus on this area. And so it is a difficult time, but I know

We're ready for the fight. We're fighting already. And we know what we're to do in the next few years. How can we support your work? Simply by sharing what we're doing. A lot of people are not knowing about our trainings or not knowing what Narcan is. Information is saving way more lives because we can pass that along. can share sharing real life stories, passing that along as well saves lives.

We always have lot of volunteer opportunities, whether we're out in the community doing outreach, we're at the music festivals, we're a very grassroots organization. We are in desperate need of funding, right? Which is something that you can do if you go to our website, f-fent.org and click donate. We have a number of different ways you can donate and that's gonna keep us going. It always helps when we can, you know, purchase more supplies and reach out more people, right? And that's definitely what helps us.

Thank you. And of course, that'll be linked in the show notes. You could go there and donate directly. And for clarity, your organization is a 501c3, so this would even be tax deductible? Absolutely. Yes. We are a non-profit 501c3, so, good to go. This is life-saving work. We cannot emphasize the importance enough. These are our brothers, sisters, daughters, sons, friends, colleagues.

These are human beings who are in need of help, support, and every little bit counts. I just want to really, really emphasize that I believe in the work that you're doing. The numbers are there. It's efficient. It's working. It's saving lives. It is doing its job, right? This awareness, education, meeting people where they're at. You said that a few times, but I want to highlight that it's

Don't wait for people to seek the help that's on them, sure. And also, there's many things that we could do to meet people where they're at. that alone, that willingness to see people, that willingness to meet another human being at their most vulnerable is the connection that may save their life or yours. with that in mind, just because the current administration may or may not support it, hopefully they will.

doesn't mean that there's not a part for us to do. So just donations alone, sharing this episode, going on your social media accounts, sharing the posts, volunteering, all of that counts and all of that helps. Have you had full circle moment in this work that maybe you can share? You don't have to give personal details, but maybe you One that comes to mind, this just happened the other day. And I did a training, one of the gentlemen's there, he does Uber as a side gig.

He met me up when I was going into work and he just grabbed me and said, hey, I just saved somebody with a Narcan. I picked somebody up from a club. I'm not going to name the club, but it was a very well-known club. And a couple got into the back seat. He noticed that there was a fuss or something was going on in the back. He turned on the light and he saw that the girl was blue. And so he immediately pulled the car over. He went to the trunk and got the Narcan out.

and administered the Narcan and she woke back up. They called the ambulance, they cut her out with the seatbelt and they basically told them, hey, thank God you had that Narcan because she wouldn't have made it otherwise. I get goosebumps when I hear stories like that, you know, and there's times where I do trainings and I'm like, all right, did anybody pay attention? But then you have times like that and, you know, and these are sometimes people that don't necessarily think they're going to use the Narcan or like, yeah, I'll take it, I'll take it.

you know, and they end up using it, right? And we've had a couple different cases like that. We take it to a treatment center and they immediately use it in the treatment center. So there's no place where we won't take it, where we won't do a training. were a university student that took the training at the university, used it at a music festival. Somebody that I trained at the treatment center that I work at that used to. So it is working, you never know. It's so important to have.

And hopefully think that you're never going to use it, right? But have it anyway. Because if you get this and for free, right? There's none of the stuff we do with charge. We give the Narcan for free. We give the Kestrelks for free. And so there's really no excuse. Well, that story gave me goosebumps as well, because it's one of those moments when you see the work in action and saving that person in real time. And I'm sure there, would imagine her family.

if they learned about what happened, would be incredibly grateful to that person who stepped in and knew exactly what to do because of the training. So that's a full circle moment. Thank you so much. And you mentioned very quickly on the test strips, what if for somebody who doesn't know what that is, we talked about in the previous episode, but maybe touch on it here. Yeah. And I think since the previous episode, they became legal. So you can literally get these at any place like a CBS or Amazon.

test strip is a little test that will tell you if it's positive or negative for fentanyl or if it's a different type of test strips whatever you're testing for and then you can make that educated decision which you're gonna do prior. You can avoid getting to that overdose because once you're already in the overdose you're using Narcan somebody's already dying with the test strip you can avoid getting to that point. That's why I think these are super important although some people think we can't.

We cannot take them in certain areas, although they let us take the Narcan, which doesn't make too much sense, but it is a great tool. They're very cheap. We have them, but you could get it on Amazon on a lot of different sites in bulk. It's a way to ensure safe consumption and that you don't have to face a situation where somebody's life is at risk. And I want to talk about

terminology, right? I often say, for example, fentanyl poisoning instead of overdose. I think the terms are less relevant. It's whatever somebody feels comfortable with. But I want to get your take on it. In my experience, I learned that there's technically no safe amount of illicit fentanyl for use that could just guarantee nothing was ever going to happen to you. Even a small amount could cause incredible harm. I come from the perspective of working on destigmatizing and deshaming and making this

work and this experience and this understanding more human. So for that purpose, I use fentanyl poisoning because ultimately that's what it is. I've heard some people in the grief space call fentanyl deaths homicides because of the nature of the drug. It's not like, let's say weed or marijuana, whatever, that you have dispensaries nowadays, right? So there's levels, I guess, what I'm saying is to this. Do you think this language is helpful, hurtful?

What are you seeing working in terms of that? Yeah, and I can understand the poisoning and the homicidal. I get it because it's directed towards... We can blame somebody, right? We can put our energy into that, right? And then I understand overdose too because most people don't understand what that means, right? What overdose is. But it is very confusing because some people will say...

or they intentionally, or they took it on purpose too much, right? When the reality is they're taking something that they had no idea was in what they're taking. So that's where that poisoning comes in. The majority of those people that are passing away were not seeking out fentanyl, trying to use fentanyl, right? It was them using something that they thought was a Xanax or a Percocet or Adderall.

That if you get them from prescription, right? It's a prescription drugs They look like prescription drugs and a lot of people take their guard down because they think it's a prescription drug and so I mean I gauge it by the audience that I'm talking to honestly, it's just getting the Information as to what is happening, right? I think it is a poisoning honestly in my opinion. It's it's not people that are having a severe substance use disorder that are

you know, following that path, right? Of reaching rock bottom and, you know, and then passing away. It's people dying first, second time, trying for the first time, right? And it's completely different than 10, 20 years ago with the drugs. Whether it's a homicide, whether it's a poisoning, it's taking our loved ones away. Something needs to be done. To a certain extent, I think, you know,

The access that they're trying to prevent from different countries bringing in this type of drug is going to help, right? But it also has to work from inside as well from inside, you know, because there is a demand, you know, there's always going to be a demand. And when there's a demand, people are going to meet it by any means necessary. Right? And so we have to work all different areas together to hopefully make a dent in this. Thank you for naming that. I've heard

many cases of fellow siblings who have lost their sibling to fentanyl-related causes. from what they tell me, the vast majority was unintentional. Even like somebody in medical school, he went to a party and just did something and that was it. So yeah, there's levels to this, right? But for the record, whether your person was in active addiction for many years and this was their drug of choice, or whether it was a one-time event that unfortunately took their life.

In both of these scenarios, they deserve to live. And I'd want to highlight that, that one is not better than the other, one is not more worthy than the other. In both cases, these people deserve to live. I love this quote by Dr. Gabor Mate, but I'm so curious how you receive it and if it resonates with you at all. He says, when talking about somebody in addiction, do not ask why the addiction, ask why the pain. Does that resonate at all?

100%, 100%. I mean, the problem was not the drug use. There was a problem before that and the drug use and the alcohol use helped me deal with, you know, with life. You know, it was the solution for a very long time until it added on to the problem. All for me, my initial issue was the mental health issues that I had. And the drugs and alcohol took away that pain and the discomfort and...

It worked. for most people that use this, it's to get rid of discomfort, to get rid of pain, right? Pain medication, right? It's used for physical pain. Guess what? It works very good for emotional pain too, right? That's where that addiction comes about, right? And so take away the drugs and alcohol, guess what? We still have something to work on. Now it's the difficult part, right?

when you remove that. And that's where that work begins, right? As to, you know, why am I coping with this or how do I cope with other needs? Once we get into active addiction and especially if we start at a young age, that's the only way we know how to cope with anything. A breakup, know, grieving, happiness, whatever. You take that away and now I'm like, my God, I don't know how to deal with all these emotions. I don't know how to deal with any of this.

And so it's a learning experience, but it's also the hardest part is patience, right? Because for us that have substance use, we're used to immediate, take that immediate, right? Whereas now it takes time to figure this out. And so it is a difficult process, but once you get onto that road of recovery, you can deal with anything that life throws at you. Once you get those resources and that support of other people.

So yeah, pain is a big part of it, but that also means that you can address it. That means if you address the pain and you figure out what's causing the pain, you're less likely to use. Thank you. This is why we do this work and we have these conversations because the pain is something we all experience. We're humans. So long as we're alive, we will experience joy and pain and all of these things, but we are not taught to deal with our emotions.

We are actually encouraged to avoid our emotions. Our culture rewards avoidance. We're starting to see a slight shift, but we have a very long way to go. So this is not just people, a person struggling with addiction. This is every single one of us who needs to learn how to better lean in to emotions without allowing them to take over. And I've heard, I think it was David Kessler, he's a big name in the grief space.

say that when it comes to addiction, wishes there was a system for people to better conceptualize the degree to which somebody is struggling, for example. He says he wishes there was a system similar to cancer diagnosis. So in his idea, there's a difference between stage one cancer and stage four cancer. So if we had a similar analogy with addiction, like stage one addiction versus stage four addiction.

We're talking about very different struggles. Does that resonate? I see you nodding, but does that resonate? And what's your thought on that? I mean, it's not a one size fits all for this at all. We say that abstinence is the only way, right? A lot of people say that. And I don't agree to that. Maybe for a severe substance use disorder, somebody that's on this end, right? But there's people still on the first stage, right? And so it's not a one size fits all.

And also with the cancer metaphor, when somebody gets cancer, they are in treatment for a very long time. And even when they're in remission, they got to go on a regular basis to the doctor. When it comes to addiction, that doesn't happen. Depending on insurance, depending on financial ability, you're in there 30 days and then they kick you out and that's it. Good luck. That's why the success rate is not good because we're not putting in the amount of time that is needed for

each individual, right? For the most part, they need to go down the whole spectrum, that continuum of care, which is, you know, going inpatient, you know, for a little while, IOP, OP, aftercare, right? Recovery support, all these down the line, you know, and that's not really happening with the majority of our folks that have substance use issues, right? And it's because of the stigma and it's because of insurance companies and it's because of all these different things that treat it differently.

than any other disease. So ideally, if money was not an issue, insurance was not an issue, stigma was not an issue, people would be in care for a way longer period of time and be able to deal with it in a proper means. But it's like, all right, you're done, you're out of here, good luck. And that's why it doesn't work. Absolutely. I'm nodding my head in agreement.

If our audience is listening and you have experienced grief, if you're here by following this show, then you know grief lasts a lot longer than people may realize. And especially if you've lost somebody, it's the equivalent of a month going by and saying, you're better by now, right? Like you're doing better. That's it. And that's not the case. And one thing I would add is, and I wish we learned this earlier, when you have somebody in your family that struggles with addiction, it is a family system thing.

It is a systemic thing. is not a them problem. They might be feeling the symptoms of certain family dynamics that are screwy. Let's just put it that way, right? And when somebody's in recovery, the recovery needs to be supported by the family. This includes the family educating themselves on what is the nature of addiction.

on how to reduce the stigma, how to reframe things in their own mind, what the person needs, no talking down, you're not them, you're not going through the experience. So please know that your perspective is not their lived experience. Their lived experience is not your perspective. So that gap needs to be brought to a meeting point somehow. So if you're a family, friends, trying to help somebody in active addiction, just know you have an incredibly important role to play and it is not preaching, it is more.

listening, educating yourself, learning. And if don't know if there's anything you'd like to add here to that as well. Yeah, it's difficult. I know for a family member to take away, you know, the anger or the feelings you have attached to the person, right? But just remembering that this person is trying. This person is not, they love you, but the disease is very strong compared to anything else.

If you love me, you would stop having cancer. It doesn't work that way. Something needs to happen. And also, like you said, the support of the loved one, of the family is huge. It's huge. And so when that person goes to treatment, they come back into the environment where it was, that's why they were using, right? Not to say the whole family, but the whole environment that they're going back into. So understanding that they need some support and some adjustment.

It's hard to go back into the same environment where, know what, that's where I was using there. This is everything is a reminder. And so just understanding how can I support you? What can I do to support your recovery? And even attending a class, going to a support group, doing all these things so you could understand, right? And I've seen families where they say, hey, you got to go to a meeting now. Go to this meeting, go to that meeting, go to this, this, this, And then the family member doesn't attend any, not even one. It's hard enough to do that, right?

Imagine how hard it is for this person. So get those resources as well, because it's going to be a whole different language once they start getting into recovery. That's a good way to put it. Also, it's a language and we all need to learn how to speak it. So we're on the same page. Thomas, it has been an absolute honor. We're here at the end. Is there anything that you'd like to include in this conversation? And if not, then we'll I'm thankful for you having me on the show.

You come a long way as well. And it was amazing when you came to speak at University of Miami. I know that this is your purpose and this is something that you find close to your heart. And I know what that feels like. And so I'm forever grateful. And for anybody that is listening and they want some help or they need anything, they can go to our website, f-fent.org. We'll be happy to do a training, provide Narcan.

or provide resources to anything you may need. Thank you so much. It's an absolute honor and I thank you for the opportunity. I don't think you knew this back then, but you unlocked a big part of this work and my ability to speak about it openly the way I do now. So thank you for that as well. And thank you for being here. Thank you for listening, watching. And that wraps up this special episode of Grief and Light as part of Podcast On.

As I mentioned, the beginning podcast on brings together podcasters around the world to raise awareness for causes like the one you just heard doing vital work. If today's conversation moved you, I encourage you to learn more about F Fentanyl. We will link it in the show notes and the life saving harm reduction work Thomas and his volunteers do. You can visit their website and find education, resources and ways to donate and support their mission.

And if you would like to discover other impactful charities featured by podcasters globally, go to podcaston.org, that will be linked in the show notes as well, to explore more voices and causes. Thank you so much for listening, for staying curious, for helping create a more compassionate, grief-informed world. And Thomas, thank you for all you do and for being you. That's it for today's episode. Be sure to subscribe to the Grief in Light podcast.

I'd also love to connect with you and hear your thoughts and your stories. Feel free to share them with me via my Instagram page at griefandlight or you can also visit griefandlight.com for more information and updates. Thank you so much for being here, for being you, and always remember you are not alone.