Fractional
Fractional
Forced Fractional: Kelly Schuknecht on building your business after a layoff
Today we're joined by Kelly Schuknecht, CEO of Two Mile High Marketing.
In this episode, we sat down with Kelly and touched on what it means to be a thought leader (and how that actually plays out on platforms like LinkedIn), why showing up online matters, and when it might make sense to step into a fractional role. We also unpacked the difference between growing your salary and building real business revenue.
- Kelly Schuknecht on LinkedIn
- Beyond the Bestseller podcast
- Beyond the Bestseller YouTube
- Two Mile High Marketing
- Laurel Farrer on LinkedIn
All right, welcome back to the Fractional.fm podcast. I'm Lance Robbins here with my co-host Joshua Wold and a very special guest, someone that I've known on LinkedIn for quite a while and I've had the pleasure of working more closely with over the last few months, Kelly Schuchnick. CEO of Two Mile High Marketing. Kelly, how did I do with your last name? And tell us a little bit more about yourself.
SPEAKER_03:You did good. It was pretty close. So Schuchnecht.
SPEAKER_00:Okay.
SPEAKER_03:If you ask my husband, he actually says Schuchnecht, which it's actually his name, but I don't think that's how you really say it. So I say
SPEAKER_00:Schuchnecht. But he's not the authority on pronunciation.
UNKNOWN:Okay.
SPEAKER_03:I mean, it's just, you know, it's it's a name that's like it can be said, I think, a million different ways. And it's OK. You can say it wrong.
SPEAKER_00:What's the what's the origin of the name?
SPEAKER_03:It's very German.
SPEAKER_00:Very German.
SPEAKER_03:German. Yes.
SPEAKER_00:All right.
SPEAKER_03:Well, I don't speak any German, so I don't
SPEAKER_00:know. That was all the German I know, too. So I don't even know what it means. Yeah. Great to have you, Kelly. Tell us a little bit about about you. where you come from, what you've been doing, and yeah, why you're here.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. Well, so where do I start, Lance? I feel like you mentioned that you and I have been connected on LinkedIn for a long time. We've never met in person. I don't think either one of us remembers how we got connected on LinkedIn, but we did. Something related to remote work in the remote
SPEAKER_00:world. Yeah, there's probably a Laurel Farr connection in there somewhere.
SPEAKER_03:Yes, I think so, yes. Um, so yeah, so we have been connected a long time about, I think about a year ago, I had reached out to you kind of like, Hey, I'm thinking about doing this fractional thing. Right. And you and I had a conversation and at the time you'd given me some good advice and you said, um, at the time I'm thinking about coaching in this space, uh, you know, so maybe, maybe come back to me later and I'll, I'll be doing coaching services. And then in October, I lost my job and it was kind of like that moment of like, all right, are you going to do this? Because you've been thinking about it for a long time and it's time to make a decision. And so I reached out to you again and I said, so have you figured out how to do that coaching service? And so you and I have been working together since then, since the end of last year. And you've been just kind of helping me along the way. I originally was planning on doing fractional CMO services, and that was kind of why I had reached out to you and what we started talking about. My business kind of morphed into what I like to call thought leadership marketing and then outsourced marketing. So kind of two areas that we focus. The outsourced marketing is basically fractional CMO services, but the way that I position it is a little bit more boots on the ground, tactical day to day marketing for companies that are wanting to grow. So that's what I'm doing. It's two mile high marketing and again, pretty, pretty brand new, but has taken on a life of its own pretty quickly.
SPEAKER_02:I'm curious what the name, are you at the very top of the peaks in Colorado? Like where's that name come from?
SPEAKER_03:Yes. Thank you for asking. So as you know, Denver is known as the mile high city, right? And Leadville, where I live, is at two miles high. So Denver is 5280 in altitude. And Leadville is 10,200 feet.
SPEAKER_02:The only reason I know about Leadville is because of the race there, of course.
SPEAKER_01:You're a runner, so yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Yes. Yeah. It's one of those that I will never do in my life, but I'm very aware of it. And I might do some more marathons just to feel like I'm part of it.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. It's inspiring. I love the race series. And... I am fooling myself to ever think that I'll run 100 miles, but that's Leadville.
SPEAKER_00:I've never, you know, Leadville is such an iconic event, but what is it like to live there? And
SPEAKER_02:can you explain what it is for people who aren't runners? Like, why is it such a special event?
SPEAKER_03:Yes. So we're going to take a little detour on our fractional conversation. But so Leadville, Colorado is known for the Leadville Race Series. So the way I usually explain it to people is, is there's a series of races that happen throughout the summer. So June is a half marathon and a marathon. July is a 50 mile run and a 50 mile bike. Not that you have to do both of those, but there's those two races in June or in July. And then August is a 100 mile run and then a 100 mile bike. So we get the whole summer, we have tons of, it's a small town, but all throughout the summer, we get a ton of tourists. We get a ton of athletes. I've met some of the big, you know, the big runners. Yeah. So that's kind of what we're known for. And we also so my husband and I also own businesses in town, which is great. The race series is a great thing that brings people here for business as well.
SPEAKER_00:So, Joshua, you don't have to run 100 miles to participate in the Leadville event. Maybe there's a half. I can do that.
SPEAKER_02:Maybe if I train.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. But even the half. So it's a heavy half. So at 10,000 feet. Yeah, at 10,000 feet. And it is 15 miles. So it's not a half half, but it's it's called a heavy half. And it also goes like straight up some mountain pass, whatever. And it's it's yeah, it's I've heard people say it's harder than running like a regular marathon. Oh,
SPEAKER_02:my word. All right. So I could maybe train for that. I did. My last half was with Lance in Austin and 90 degree heat and I was overheating. So we just kept hopping into the river.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, I think we talked about that on an episode way back. That was a brutal event. That was just a that was not an event. That was just like, hey, we're both in Austin at the same time. Let's go. And I was trying to get ready for a marathon. Okay. Anyway, we have derailed significantly, but now I'm curious about,
SPEAKER_01:hmm,
SPEAKER_00:what's that Leadville half look like maybe next June? We'll have to see. Okay. So you said something earlier, you said we, you know, so many people get into this thinking this is only for solopreneurs, you know, they don't build teams, but you said we, what does that mean?
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. So I think at the beginning, uh, Part of what my concerns were was I was used to running a team. I'd come from being a marketing director. I'd built a team of people. There was about seven of us. And so then when I thought about going out on my own, I was like, how do I do all this work myself? Like, I can't do everything. Right. And and I actually I had a conversation. I had a lot of conversations with people when I was just starting to build the business, just starting to, like, put things together at the beginning. And one of the people told me, like, oh, you don't want to hire people like that's just like. That's just people that you have to worry about laying people off or you have to worry about, you know, you just have to worry about like managing people. And I was like, no, that's actually what I really enjoy. I enjoy building a team, working with people and, you know, and helping, I don't know, like put a cohesive team together. Like that is what I actually really like about the work I do. So pretty early on, I hired an assistant first and I hired another person. to, I call it the director of client services or client success, excuse me, director of client success to help with all the client meetings and help with the deliverables for the clients. So I was really fortunate that I got to that place in about, within about a month of starting my business that I was able to bring on those two people. And then now I have a full-time, my first full-time employee starting next week as well.
SPEAKER_00:So that's a bit of a departure. Sorry, I should
SPEAKER_03:explain those two first ones are full-time contractors and now I'm bringing on a full-time employee.
SPEAKER_00:Okay. All right. So we've got a couple of contractors and now an employee coming on, which is a bit of a departure from kind of the fractional model. But you yourself are still quite involved with the outsource marketing pieces, it sounds like, to where customers may be getting a fractional experience from you. but you have the support of a team around you. Is that a fair way to characterize it?
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, so I am the main person with all the client relationships, right? Like they're all connected with me. I'm meeting with them. I am, you know, the person they're reaching out to. But my team is mostly behind the scenes. So although some may come with me to certain meetings, they're doing a lot of the work behind the scenes. They're interacting with the clients. So the outsourced marketing piece of it, I can't remember Lance, if you're the one who suggested this, but we'll give you credit. We'll say yes. I don't know. But we actually, so we start with a workshop and we do a workshop with people to, with companies to help them develop their marketing plan. And so it'll be me and one of the other team members who will be there for the workshop. And then we'll, we'll deliver that, right? So it's, it's a work, it's a, marketing plan that they can take and they can implement themselves or they can outsource to us. And that would be to the team. I would be their point person, but then there's the people behind the scenes because I'm not a designer. Like I'm in marketing, but I am not a designer. I can do the writing, but I would prefer not to, right? So there's pieces that I outsource to team members that the client doesn't have to worry about who's doing what and they don't have to manage any of that. They're getting a whole team of people for the price of a person, basically. And if you hired a marketing manager, you're gonna get a person who can implement your plan, but you still aren't gonna get all of those pieces. Not every person in marketing can do every piece of marketing that you need, right? So we're a whole team that comes together and can provide those services for those types of companies.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, I think you're touching on something important because I think a lot of people go into what they imagine is gonna be a fractional business thinking that they have to do everything, right? It has to be a one person deal. And if we're being really dogmatic about definition of fractional, maybe that's true. On the show, we try not to get too particular about what that exactly means. But essentially, no one person is great at everything. And so, of course, any business is better with multiple skill sets, a more diverse makeup of a team, even if Yeah, absolutely.
SPEAKER_03:Absolutely. Yeah. And the other piece, you know, so I think what we do is is fractional. I guess I don't even know, like the definition of that. But to me, it's like I would say it's fractional. But the other piece I didn't like about fractional CMO was that I think a lot of companies when they're hiring a fractional CMO, it's like we need that person to come in this high level strategy. Right. Which. which we're doing. But to me, it's like I wanted to close that gap and say, we'll put together that strategy, but I also want to help you implement it. Like, it's not just to me about you need a new website or you need to rebrand or you need, you know, what what CMOs can can kind of focus on. I wanted to say, you know, the companies that we're working with are smaller companies that are just practical like we do. We need leads. What do we need to do to get leads? Right. And so it's like, here's the here's here's the overall strategy. But then here's all the things that that need to get done on a weekly basis, a monthly basis, a quarterly basis to help you accomplish those goals. And to me, I don't know. I'm curious what you guys think. But to me, that was different than a fractional CMO. And that's why I wanted to position us slightly differently in the way that we communicate who we are and how we help.
SPEAKER_00:Do you want to take that one, Joshua?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, I'm actually thinking about this because a friend of ours, Michelle Kiefer, she is a fractional CMO. She's been on the podcast before and I've heard her kind of define how she does work. And I think there actually might be a lot of overlap with what you're describing, but it's not something I've done specifically because I'm going off of guests that we've interviewed, right? And me trying to learn how the fractional space fits. I think a lot of fractionals are basically saying, hey, I'm your part-time leader. to step in and help you with your plan, but also help implement it. But the limitation is they are part-time, right? They're not being paid for full-time. So what you're describing feels like it's quite similar, except you're saying we're almost like a boutique studio that is here to fit your needs. And we've got a little bit of extra contracted or employees to pull in. And actually, this gets to something I've been wondering about. And I'm curious, Kelly, your view on all of this. Lance and I both come from well, startup world, agency world, et cetera, but I've spent quite a bit of time at agencies. And I wonder going forward if large agencies will not be the model. Instead, it will be fractionals and small studios of two or three people that can kind of come in with, maybe it's AI tools, we'll see, but basically come in and handle what a lot of these small teams need. How are you seeing that with what you're building relative to maybe some of the larger agencies that used to do a lot of this work?
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, interesting. So, One of the things we've noticed with everyone we've done the workshop with so far is they've all said we hired somebody. They came in. They had all these, you know, ideas and they were going to handle all this stuff, whatever. And we got nothing like they did nothing. We got no leads. Right. And so those were and I know the names of the companies, but I'm not going to throw them out there. But these are bigger companies that are more well known. Right. And the client's. experience was not good. So after, you know, several months of paying for a fractional CMO that was, you know, high priced, who, you know, promised certain things, the company was getting no leads out of it, right? And so then they were coming to us going, can you help us get leads? That's what we want. And that's, again, where I was saying, like, to me, it's not just about putting together strategy and getting really, really detailed about all of that. It's the tactical boots on the ground. What needs to happen today to help start bringing in leads? And so to me, what we're offering, the clients that we've brought in, we're just so much more aligned with them because of that. They have been burned by those bigger companies and they really want somebody who's going to listen to them. That's been the most... eye-opening thing to me is that as we're delivering the plan after, after doing the workshop with them, they're going, Oh my gosh, like, yeah, like we sat through one or we, you know, presented one where the entire, everything we said, they're like, yes, that's exactly right. Yes. That's what we want. Yes. That, you know, and they felt so heard. And I was like, what are these other marketing companies doing? Like, just like, it blew me away to like, to realize how, how much they had felt heard by us. And I, Boutique is exactly the right word to explain that, that we're really listening to them because I think the business owners often, they do know their business the best. They know what works and what doesn't work. So they don't need some outsider coming in and telling them what to do. They need somebody to listen to them and what their experience has been and then to build on that. I
SPEAKER_02:remember one project I was part of, I think there was nine or 10 people on the call, but there was two people who were going to do the work. And it was this, there's so many siloed pieces trying to solve a specific problem that the company's paying for. But at the end of the day, everyone is so busy in so many disparate parts that one or two people are left to try and see if they can solve it. Well, what if you could just pay for that one or two people is kind of what I hear you describing. I want to really dig into something you called out. So you have the workshop, you help to figure out what they need. You hear from the owners what they're actually good at. What is that process of maybe like thinking of a recent event or someone that you're really proud of actually finding that first lead? How does that happen? Because to me, that's the lifeblood of a company trying to continue forward.
SPEAKER_03:That first lead for them?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, for them. Yep.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. So we actually had one. This was really interesting to me. We did a workshop with a female-owned business, but it was her and her husband that were in the workshop with us. And she's very LinkedIn averse. Like she has a LinkedIn, right? But other than that, she's not engaging. And we were saying for...
SPEAKER_02:Go on.
SPEAKER_03:Yes. In fact, yes. You and I can continue this conversation. So one of the things we were telling her was that we really think you have some opportunity on LinkedIn. It's an accounting business. Like your clients are female-owned business owners and they're on LinkedIn, right? So we had that conversation just in the workshop. We were saying, I really think you need to think about this. And of course we put that in the plan, but we hadn't even presented it yet. When we got to the point where we were presenting the plan, they said, oh, we shared something on LinkedIn and that turned into a lead for the business. So in between the workshop and the actual deliverable, they had already seen the result of listening to something that we had suggested. And that to us was just like, you know, that's so much fun in marketing that you're like, see, keep doing that, right? Like you're going to see results. It may not be in the way that you want. Like, you know, you may prefer different platforms and that's okay, but it's not about you. It's about where your audience is. And so finding the ways to connect with them that are going to make the most sense is really important.
SPEAKER_02:So my... Understanding the marketing is very limited, but I'm a fan of it in that I've read a bunch of Seth Godin books. So we'll call it very limited, but I find it very interesting. What is the kind of perspective that you try to encourage companies with marketing? And maybe it's permission based marketing. Maybe it's putting out information to draw others in instead of cold calling. Maybe you recommend cold calling. Like, what's the philosophy that you're helping these businesses to put themselves out there?
SPEAKER_03:So that's a great question. And I will be clear with any person when I am doing either a consultation call or during the workshop that I am very thought leadership based in everything that I do. So I'd always tell them that because I'm like, if you don't like thought leadership, if you don't like putting yourself out there, I'm probably not going to be the person for you because I'm going to recommend speaking events, podcast interviews, LinkedIn content where you're sharing information that you're showing your expertise. So to me, that is what I gravitate towards because I've seen it work in my career. I mean, that's just what I, it's what I enjoy and what I've seen people get results from. So again, like thought leadership, that's kind of the focus of a lot of what we do, but that can look different for different people. So we try to merge kind of that approach with also just the person's the business owner's style and interests as well. Because if they're really just like, I'm not doing LinkedIn, okay, that's okay. Then we have to figure out what is going to make sense for you. Of course, we'll make recommendations on what we think is best. But, you know, ultimately, if they're not into it, it's also just not going to work for them. I
SPEAKER_02:love that. You don't want to turn them into something that they feel completely wrong for, but you don't mind gently nudging them a little bit in what the idea behind thought leadership is. something they are genuinely good at, finding a way to share it on a platform that will get someone's attention. And that's something that I can resonate with. I think the question comes, and this is where an outsider helping you is like, what am I good at saying and what's a voice that I can have that's useful? And that's where you come in and maybe help to shape that a little bit.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, yeah. So speaking of just thought leadership, the power of thought leadership, Lance and I told that story about how we met on LinkedIn, probably through Laurel, but we don't, Laurel Farr, I'm going to name drop her again and I'm going to tag her when we post this. There's marketing. Sounds good. But I mean, that's a perfect example, right? So Lance and I both are kind of, we have a little bit of a presence in the remote world space. Me, because I've worked remotely for 18 years and Lance, because of all of the things that he does. I mean, we both kind of are, I don't know, thought leaders, but, you know, we are present in that in that space. We know a lot of people in the remote workspace. And that is so that's what brought us together. And then because of that, now we're working together. And, you know, and also I can provide leads for Lance and vice versa. And we're connecting, you know, we're just building our network on that. Like that to me is. you know, it's thought leadership, it's personal branding, it's genuine connections with people. Like I didn't connect with Lance originally because I wanted anything from him or vice versa. It was really just like kind of being social online and meeting people and finding your tribe, like finding those people that you enjoy and want to work with. And I think any business owner and anyone in the fractional space especially should be leaning into that type of networking experience Even if it feels weird, like put yourself out there and do it because you never know what that will lead to down the road.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, I look at it like, is there something valuable I can learn from someone else? If so, that attracts me to that person's content profile, right? And so I'm going to follow along. And so I think that's what you were doing, what I was doing, where we connected originally. That's the premise of this podcast, right? Yeah. How do we get into fractional? There's a lot of fractionally curious people that are exploring becoming business owners. So Joshua and I were stumbling through becoming new business owners ourselves. And we thought, hey, shoot, let's just start this podcast and share all of our missteps, all of our wins, and get other people who are on the same journey to start sharing too. And if I'm not mistaken, Kelly, was this podcast something that kind of re-put me on your radar to reach out and connect for help?
SPEAKER_03:Probably, because back when I reached out to you, I think, I don't remember when you started it. It might have been around then, but I remember you telling me about it when we were talking and I was like, I'm going to binge this podcast. And, you know, of course, right away I subscribed to it. And I was like, I need to, you know, learn everything I can. And that was before I had taken the leap to start something. It was more of just when I was, what did you call it? Fractionally curious. I like that. Yeah. Yeah. When I was fractionally curious, yeah, it was a resource for me and just trying to get my head around, like, how would I do this, you know? And so, yeah, I mean, I think that's a great thing that you put out there and help people kind of figure out how to navigate this.
SPEAKER_00:It's about, you know, creating something that's valuable for someone else. And also, you're looking for the people who are creating value. And yeah, it's kind of a big picture, long range thing. strategy or approach, right?
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. And it positions you as the fractional person, right? So when people are thinking of, like, I need this, you're going to come to mind because you're continually putting out that content around fractional work. I did a similar thing. I started my podcast, which is Beyond the Bestseller, which is focused on female authors of nonfiction books. None of that is to get a lead for my business necessarily, but it helps me continually put content out there, but also position myself as the person who works with thought leaders, right? So it's all about just kind of how you want to be seen, like your personal brand, right? How you want to be seen online and how you want to be perceived by people and what you want them to remember about you. I get leads all the time with people who are reaching out about writing a book, for example, because of my my history in publishing. And, you know, because I once in a while will put out a little bit of content about that, or I have now my podcast talking with authors like those things are just reminders of what you do and help keep you top of mind for people who are looking for ways that you might be able to help them.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, I'm going to push us maybe into a little bit more of a vulnerable topic here. What did it feel like You know, getting the news, hey, your job is terminated. You have a big decision to make. To take us through some of those emotions through that and how you made decisions and looking back, how do you feel about it now?
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. Well, in the moment, of course, there was like a lot of stress. I mean, so you've been laid off too, right, Liam? Yeah. Oh,
SPEAKER_00:let's be clear. Me, you... Joshua and a host of guests that we've had. They who is it? Kim Minnick was saying she was forced fractional. Right. It's not a choice. I
SPEAKER_03:like that. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, that was me. Right. So I it my experience is that my company was acquired. So three years ago, when almost three years to the day when when my company was acquired, I knew that I probably only had a certain amount of time left. there was a five-year merger, five-year transition. And so I thought I would have until the end of that five years. Even though, you know, nobody was saying that anything was ending anytime soon, I just felt it, right? Like the company that acquired us had a marketing department. So I was like, why would the big company care about the little company's marketing department? Like they have their own, right? So to me, it was just common sense. And So I had started, and that's why I had reached out to you about a year ago. Maybe it was a couple years ago. I had really started thinking like, what is next for me? Which I'm lucky. I'm really lucky that I had that time to really start thinking, even though I wasn't doing anything yet, but it was just getting my head around what was next. So in the moment, for those who have not been laid off i'll explain what it feels like you're in a meeting and all of a sudden somebody pops into that meeting that you were not expecting and you're like i know where this is going and uh and it was literally
SPEAKER_02:like as soon as you see hr and we we have had many hr on here but it's that moment like oh wait you don't usually come to my one-on-ones why are you here oh
SPEAKER_03:yes yeah i mean so yeah so there's definitely like a oh And then there was like that panic of like, oh my gosh, what am I going to do? Like I have, you know, a family to take care of. I have a salary. I have insurance. I have all of the benefits, you know, all of this. Like your mind goes like a million miles a minute. You're just like, oh my gosh, like how am I going to, you know. And when they were like, okay, well, your computer is going to be shut down, right? And like I literally like shut my computer and I was like, well, all right, time to figure it out. And I... This was the most eye-opening thing to me. Like, I felt such a... Even despite all of the stress and anxiety and, like, holy cow, what just happened, I felt relief more than anything else. Like, I knew that it was time to do something new. I knew it. I just never, ever would have... I never would have taken a leap. Even though I had reached out to Lance months before, I never would have taken a leap if somebody hadn't pushed me off the ledge. And... So then, you know, then it was like, I gave myself about 24 hours to mourn the situation. About 24 hours later, I was like, all right, time to figure it out. I mean, this is just my personality. Lance knows it pretty well now because he talks to me every couple of weeks. But I mean, it was like, all right, it's there. And one of the things you said to me, Lance, was failure is not an option. Like, That was my mode was like, failure is not an option. This is going to work because I'm going to make this work. It's going to come together. And Lance has seen that progression from November 1st to today. I mean, I have been able to hire three people. I have, you know, about 10 clients. Like I have been able to grow really fast because I just got my head. I think the biggest thing for me was I got my head in the right place as soon as I could. Like I gave myself that time to like, you know, be scared, be upset, be whatever. And then I was like, all right, all of that just needs to go away and you need to like start building. And I did. Now I look back and I, the one thing, I mean, I know everything came together the way it was supposed to. So I'm not regretting anything and I don't wish I would have done anything differently. But now I realize I could have left the situation on my own terms and much earlier and I could have been successful. I just didn't trust that. And so being forced fractional was actually a great thing for me because I don't know if I would have bet on myself, but I was forced to and I wouldn't turn it. I wouldn't go back. There's no way.
SPEAKER_02:There was the moment for me where I lost my primary income and I went fractional and Yeah, there was stress and it did not last forever. I actually I ended up needing to get another job. But there was that moment of recognizing that there's a certain amount of ownership you can have and autonomy that you just don't get as a W2 employee. You have to be the actual founder yourself to do that. And once you get a taste for that, it never leaves your system.
SPEAKER_03:Oh, I can tell you. So we talked about running earlier. I so. A couple of times in the summer, I was training for a marathon and I had taken Fridays off to do my long runs so I could get it done before the weekend. Anyway, so I'd be out running and my manager would text me. I know you're out, but I just have a quick question. And I'd be like running on the mineral bell around Leadville, like trying to answer the text, you know. And there was always this guilt of. taking a day, taking any time, like if you were, if it was business hours, you were supposed to be working, even if you took the day off, even if it was approved by your manager, you're still working, right? You're still supposed to be available. And that was the, like, one of the biggest things I noticed in the first couple of weeks was I was like, oh my gosh, nobody cares where I am right now. Nobody cares what I'm doing. Nobody's going, I mean, I work remotely. So the fact that like, that was still so heavy on my mind is really sad, really. But, but it was true. I mean, I was, always worried if i stepped away from my desk for an hour to go to lunch or something that somebody was going to need me in that one hour right and so that that freedom of just like i don't have to worry about what i'm doing at you know two o'clock on a thursday doesn't matter it's it's i'm gonna get the work done on my terms i can work tonight i can work on the weekend and as i'm building a team i am making sure that that i'm intentional about that for them as well that uh I may message you at any time, whatever, but like they're in different time zones. It's like I want everyone to feel that autonomy and freedom in their their schedule. Reality is you don't feel that as much when you're working for somebody else. But that has been probably the most freeing thing I will totally say. Like that is that's been really, really great for me.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. If you as a runner, if you go on a run for an hour, you're not needing to check your phone to make sure that Slack isn't blowing up. There's a difference there.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:No guilt runs.
SPEAKER_03:Yes.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:Or hikes for you, Lance.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, that's right. Kelly has caught me on the tail end of my Friday morning hikes a couple of times. I didn't quite time making it back to the trailhead as gracefully as I should have. You're talking about this concept of autonomy and freedom with time. But what about revenue, too? When you're an employee, they tell you how much you're going to earn. Where you're sitting right now, and be as vulnerable or as transparent as you feel comfortable with here, but are you at a place where you've replaced income with revenue? Are you breaking through that ceiling? What do you see as much as you're willing to share? How high is the sky the limit for you now as an independent versus an employee?
UNKNOWN:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, that's another that has also been eye opening to me that, you know, I set my prices. So I say this is what we'll do and this is what we're willing to do it for. And then I
SPEAKER_00:tell you to raise them.
SPEAKER_03:Yes, I know you keep telling me, but I'm not doing it yet. But yeah, I that has been. that's been just freeing. Like nobody's determining my value. They can determine it by saying, I can't afford you. That's okay. But I'm going to say this is what I need to set this at so that we can make it work. So yes, income wise, I had a very nice salary. And that was my biggest fear was like, can I get to that point? Because I didn't even think that was possible to do by piecing things together with multiple clients and, you know, how you do this. But like I said, I've hired two full time contractors. I have a full time employee coming on. I am almost to the point of replacing my salary. Not quite there yet, but like I keep my husband, I keep joking about I just need a couple more clients. And Lance, you probably heard me say that a lot too. It's always like the solution is like, I just need a couple more clients to hire that next person. I just need a couple more clients to whatever, right? Or
SPEAKER_02:increase the current clients by a certain percentage, right? Which is up to what Lance has been saying.
SPEAKER_03:Yes, he actually, so he just told me like within the last couple of weeks, like you need to raise your prices. And I was like, I will, but I just need a couple more
SPEAKER_00:clients. After I close this next one, I'll feel comfortable to raise my price. Yeah,
SPEAKER_03:well, because my goal as I started out, so we're just at like four, four and a half months. And my goal when I started out was to get to that base amount of to be able to pay myself, to be able to pay my team members. And so yeah, so I'm almost where I want to be. And then from there, I have set a bunch of milestones. It's like, okay, once I can pay myself what I want, I have these team members in place, then my next goal is to have have the ability to hire the roles that I know that are gonna help us scale, like to be able to hire those when we need them, right? So that's a couple more clients, right? And then from there, then I want to get to where we have like maybe six months of payroll that's in the bank account. So it's like, I'm not worried if we lose a client here or there because that's gonna happen at some point, right? And just to be able to have that kind of flexibility in our cashflow. So yeah, so I just I never would have thought this was possible. One of the people I talked with early on had said to me that in their first six months after being laid off, they made$30,000. And then in the next year, they made more than their corporate salary. So my expectation was something like that, right? Like, okay, it's going to take a long time to build up. And as Lance knows, it has not taken a long time to build up, even though I act as if it's taking forever, because every time we talk, I'm like frustrated with the amount of time it takes to close each deal. Some of them might be like a week and some of them might be two months, but I'm always like anxious for the next one, which I think speaks to just my entrepreneurial spirit. Like, I think that this is what I was supposed to be doing. I just didn't know that. Until I was forced fractional. I'm going to use that term all the time.
SPEAKER_00:Shout out to Kim. That's a good one. Yeah. Great story. Thank you for sharing. And especially about, you know, revenue, because I think that's what a lot of people early in their fractional journey are like, feeling the same fear of, you know, can I actually make money doing this? I'm struggling. Like, yes, yes, you can. And, you know, everybody's going to look a little different, but you're living proof, right? yeah, this is a really viable way to put together a career. Yeah. All right. I'm going to do something that breaks the mold here for us just a little bit. And if it's icky, we'll just delete it and edit it out. Okay, Joshua? Roger. What? All right. This feels weird to me to ask this, but... Where is it going? What's... I don't want to say this. What is the value that you've had from working with a coach as someone who's starting out on their fractional journey?
SPEAKER_03:Well, where do I start? So I think, I mean, you have seen the entire progression of everything in the last four and a half months. So first of all, it was like, I think I came to you with like, what do I do? Like, that was my first question. Like, what do I do? How do I get how do I start this? Right. Then I got my first client. And then my question to you was, what do I do now? Like, how do I, you know, but you had sent me your contract, because I think at the time, like, I didn't hear back from you, like immediately. And but I'm like, I'm, you know, not patient. So I, of course, was like, I have to figure this out. So then I looked at the contract you had sent me. And I was like, okay, I can figure this out. And so I kind of just duplicated what I had seen from you. And then, you know, every couple of weeks, I mean, you're kind of my therapist, as you know, because I'm I like mind dump every time on you. Like, here's all this stuff going on. Here's all the whatever. And you have helped with ideas. You have helped with you've connected me with people. You've helped with, you know, just resources, talking through things. And so, you know, for me, it's just been like having that support person that's like. I don't know, again, I almost feel like you're like my business therapist that, you know, it's just really like you're laughing because you're like, I know. But like whatever's going on, you're probably the person that I can be the most honest and real with, like where I'm just like, oh, I'm frustrated or like, oh, like this isn't, you know, happening as fast as I want or whatever. And I can just like talk through it, like where I'm not going to talk to one of my team members that way because I don't want them to feel any pressure around anything. I'm not going to talk with a client like that. Like, you know, but just having that person that I can go to and talk through things and and and just be a cheerleader for me as well. I mean, that you've been very supportive in that way of just like always, you know, telling me to raise my prices, telling me, putting me in like in putting things into perspective where like I think like the world is falling apart because we didn't get that client within two weeks, like I thought. And you're like, it's OK. You are doing amazing. Just hang in there. Right. So I don't know, like in all of those ways, it's been really great for me to just have like that support and that listening ear and, you know, just helping me
SPEAKER_02:think through things. For someone who hasn't had coaching or therapy, and I've had both, you are your own hero and the coach is your guide. They are not the hero, right? They are here to listen, respond. And if they're good at what they do to give you ideas that you're going to push forward. And this works really well for people who are self driven, who are self motivated, but are so inside their own heads that they kind of need to be able to brain dump on someone. And those of us with amazing life partners and spouses, they are there for us. But sometimes they're like, I need you to just stop talking to me about this topic because we have other things we got to talk about.
SPEAKER_03:Right, right. Yeah, I think Lance thought that this process would be a lot more structured when we started. Like he put together this agenda and all these things we were going to work through. And then I think he saw after like a couple of calls, he was like, oh, you're just going to talk at me for about 45 minutes. And then I might ask a couple of questions and then help steer you in a direction. I'm like, yep, that's great.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, I definitely had things more structured, which was there in case we needed it. Right. But Didn't turn out that we needed a whole lot of that. That was good. You know, there have been a number of guests here who do coaching for fractionals. I think about Heather Corallo. I think about Monica Ablos. I think, you know, I know we've had a handful. And I think those are all really great resources that, you know, someone who is kind of either on the edge thinking about it or just getting into it. Yeah, probably worth considering, right?
SPEAKER_03:Yeah,
SPEAKER_00:yeah, absolutely. Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. In fact, you know, we've extended to like, you know, I have some I have some goals I want to hit before I let you go. So we got to keep working
SPEAKER_00:together. Yeah, for sure. So anyway, and shamelessly, I'm open to I'm open to exploring coaching more. So I'll throw my hat in the ring alongside those other great guests we've had who do the same.
SPEAKER_02:And one thing I'll add with Lance is he's good at listening to long rants and responding in a way that says, I hear you. And have you thought about this?
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, that's that sums it up very well.
SPEAKER_00:Okay. Kelly, how can people find out more about you, the work you're doing, learning from your journey or getting in touch with you for your services? Where's the best place for people to go?
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. My website is twomilehighmarketing.com. And I have my podcast, I mentioned, Beyond the Best Seller, which video on YouTube and audio everywhere. And LinkedIn is also a great place to connect with me. I try to post two, three times a week and try to, you know, connect with people on LinkedIn. So if you're on there, I'd love to connect as well.
SPEAKER_00:Great. And you can always reach us at email at fractional.fm. We always want your feedback, your questions, or if there's any way we can help you, you can find us there.
