Broadway, Backstage, and Box Steps: Twenty Years of Musical Theatre Education

Twenty years beside a musical theatre enthusiast transforms even the most resistant skeptic. "I couldn't get over that," Aaron confesses about his initial reaction to characters bursting into song, a sentiment many non-theatre goers share. Yet through two decades of marriage to podcast host LJ, something remarkable happened—he developed an appreciation that surprised even himself.

Tim is on a well-deserved break after a fantastic run of Les Miserables in the Grand Opera House Belfast. So EP Aaron had stepped into the host chair for one week only. The conversation takes a fascinating turn when Aaron draws an unexpected parallel between musical theatre and professional wrestling, his own passion. "There's dialogue, and then the wrestlers would grapple... in theatre, there's dialogue, and then they would have a performance to move the storyline along." This revelation showcases how theatrical storytelling structures transcend genres, creating unexpected bridges between seemingly different art forms.

Whether you're a dedicated fan or a reluctant companion to one, this heartwarming conversation illuminates how the theatrical world teaches us in unexpected ways, creating connections that enrich our understanding of storytelling, performance, and human expression. What might musicals be teaching you without you even realizing it?

End of MLL

Transcript

Speaker 2 0:25

Hello and welcome to Musical Lyrical Lingo. This week, your hosts are LJ and.

Speaker 1 0:31

Aaron.

Speaker 2 0:31

Yeah, tim is on a well-deserved break and instead of us not being in your ears this week, I decided to rope in AP Aaron, hey, hello, both mics are on this week, which is very exciting. Thank you.

Speaker 1 0:47

It's a novel approach.

Speaker 2 0:48

It's a novel approach. I do apologise. I just wasn't up to scratch the last time, which was a disappointment, but we're definitely going to have Kerry back and I have had the cold, so my voice is coming to you in some sort of sexy sultry tones, hopefully.

Speaker 1 1:07

Debatable.

Speaker 2 1:09

You've loved it, haven't, emily? I've been very sick and I've been able to nag you all week absolutely not, and somehow you find the strength to nag me um.

Speaker 1 1:18

But you seem to be coming out the other side. You don't seem to be as sick as you were no, definitely not.

Aaron's Journey with Musical Theatre

Speaker 2 1:24

So I thought we would take this week a little shorter episode, but chat to you, because what is our podcast all about? What have musicals taught you? So we've been together 20 years. This is our 21st year.

Speaker 1 1:36

Correct.

Speaker 2 1:37

Our children are very into musicals. I'm into musicals. You haven't really been able to escape it in the last 20 years.

Speaker 1 1:45

I haven't been able to escape it, but I also haven't been bitten by the bug. I don't go. Oh, let's go out and see a musical. What I would say is, since the start of the podcast and listening to you and Tim regularly, and often in the same room, I feel like I've got a better appreciation for musical theatre, the art itself, whereas before I was like why are they singing? Why did they not just say this? What is the point of bursting into song and dance? It's so unrealistic and I just couldn't. I couldn't get over that. But now I've got an appreciation for it and I've kind of grown to to uh, enjoy it somewhat okay, so it it's taken the podcast.

Speaker 2 2:26

So it wasn't anything to do with your love for me.

Speaker 1 2:29

You thought it was my love for you that I listened to the podcast. Ah, okay, it was listening to the podcast that gave me an appreciation of musical theatre.

Speaker 2 2:39

Okay, Well, what I wanted to check? Well, what have musicals maybe taught you? Perhaps you know what helps medicine go down.

Speaker 1 2:47

A spoonful of sugar, yeah.

Speaker 2 2:49

What do you do with a BA in English? Can you guess what musical that's from?

Speaker 1 2:57

My Fair Lady.

Speaker 2 2:58

Avenue Q.

Speaker 1 3:00

Avenue Q. I should have got that. I've actually seen that I did enjoy that one.

Speaker 2 3:05

Or is there a sunny side to every situation? Could well be 42nd Street, or do you know exactly how many minutes there are in a?

Speaker 1 3:18

year. That's not round, is it it?

Speaker 2 3:19

is round 5,000, 525,600 minutes.

Speaker 1 3:27

The fact I even know that I was about to get up and walk out whenever you started asking those questions. I was like, well, I'm lost.

Speaker 2 3:31

What do you do with BA in English?

Speaker 1 3:34

Catch a bus.

Speaker 2 3:35

Okay, so musicals do teach us lots and lots of things, but a question I wanted to ask you is what is your first memory of a musical? When were you introduced to musicals?

Speaker 1 3:45

When was I introduced to musicals? Does animation count? Yeah, let's go for it. It's probably going to be a Disney movie. Sadly, it's going to be Pocahontas, probably. It's the first time I remember going to see a film that they were singing. I was like, what is this? Though I didn't hear it, as you well know, but that's the first time I actually recall going to see something that had music and I, oh, jungle Book, jungle Book.

Childhood Musical Memories

Speaker 2 4:13

Oh yeah, that's what I was going to say Jungle Book for that, because your mum is quite into musicals. Well, enjoys them. Appreciates them a little bit, doesn't she?

Speaker 1 4:21

Yeah, but that wasn't something around the house.

Speaker 2 4:24

Yes, so maybe is that something that she's maybe discovered later on.

Speaker 1 4:28

It was the love of you in the podcast. Absolutely, that is lovely.

Speaker 2 4:30

The Maybe is that something that she's maybe discovered later on it was the love of you in the podcast, absolutely. That is lovely, the support, though you were in a musical whenever you were in primary school.

Speaker 1 4:37

I was in a musical.

Speaker 2 4:38

Weren't you Was I Oliver.

Speaker 1 4:42

I'm quite sad to say that was high school. Oh, was that high school?

Speaker 2 4:45

Yeah, oh gosh, and I had absolutely no singing parts in it. No, but you were still in the musical.

Speaker 1 4:53

Well, yes, I played the very prestigious part of Policeman no 2. Which is, and had two lines, a pivotal moment of Oliver. Oh, actually, you had to shoot somebody?

Speaker 2 5:05

Yes, isn't it.

Speaker 1 5:06

Yeah, gun didn't work.

Speaker 2 5:08

Well, we've all been there.

Speaker 1 5:09

Gun didn't work. I had bought an expensive cap gun.

Speaker 2 5:14

You, yourself.

Speaker 1 5:15

Yeah, yeah, oh listen, if I'm going to do it, I'm going to do it right.

Speaker 2 5:18

Okay.

Speaker 1 5:19

And I got this expensive cap gun. It was metal and everything you know. So the weight in my hand I very much have to embody the character, method, actor Method actor yes, absolutely. I needed the weight of the gun, the cold steel in my hand if I'm going to take somebody's life in a musical. Okay, and I put it out and I went, like people laughing, I just went. Can't swear, sure can't.

Speaker 2 5:41

No, don't swear.

Speaker 1 5:41

No, I just went not, I lied.

Speaker 2 5:45

Oh, in head, in my head.

Speaker 1 5:47

This wasn't the character. This was Aaron. Okay, I just went bang and then more people laughed. But yeah, that's right, I was in a musical in high school.

Speaker 2 5:57

Okay, yeah, you went to see a musical that you felt sleeping. What was that?

Speaker 1 6:02

That was in primary school, that was Grace.

Speaker 2 6:03

That was Grace In the West End with.

Speaker 1 6:05

Shane Ritchie. Yeah, at the time he was known for the Daz Doorstep Challenge Getting your whites white.

Speaker 2 6:12

Okay, so really up to the point where you met me at age 18, musicals did not play a part in your life. They had been sporadically there.

Speaker 1 6:22

Yeah, I had a sprinkling of musical theatre throughout my life. Okay, but I didn't realise I was about to take an overdose of musical theatre for the next couple of years.

Speaker 2 6:29

This 17-year-old bubbly, musical-obsessed person, Timothy Bell. Timothy was going to be involved in your life for the next 20 years. And along came Lauren on the side, yeah. Okay, Okay. So what was your first impressions whenever you knew that I was into musicals and drama and all things theatre impressions whenever you knew that I was into musicals and drama and all things theatre I've probably tried to feign an interest at the start.

Speaker 1 6:56

Oh yeah, I'll come and see you and as you know, I do not enjoy going to see those shows and stuff, but I do. I embrace it, more so now than I did before. But my first thing was that's a bit out there. But, as we've said many a time, I also really enjoyed professional wrestling.

Speaker 2 7:15

Yeah.

Speaker 1 7:15

And I feel like, as time went on, and maybe this sort of helped me come to the conclusion that they're more alike than what I would care to admit initially- yeah.

Speaker 1 7:28

That there's dialogue and then the wrestlers would grapple, and then in theatre that there's dialogue, and then the wrestlers would grapple, and then in theatre there's dialogue, and then they would have, dare I say, a choreographed performance. But then they would have a performance and that's their expression of continuing the storyline, to move the storyline along. And once I sort of had that epiphany I was like oh, you can understand it more, I know.

Speaker 2 7:54

Yeah, it really helped with the appreciation of the art, yeah okay, so I also want to ask you, probably something that I should have asked you like so many years ago, whenever we first started going out, you discovered a bob fossy documentary and watched it inside out. Please explain this. This has always baffled me, because anytime Fosse is mentioned, you always go into the one line yes, he had a very unorthodox style and I want to know was that a young, naive teenager trying to impress his girlfriend?

Speaker 1 8:28

There's nothing naive about that. That is what you call game.

Speaker 2 8:32

Or were you just lying in bed when this documentary came on and you were like I'll watch it?

The Family's Stage School Experience

Speaker 1 8:38

Yeah, the latter, you were seriously. Yeah, no, it was, but Both come into play here, okay. So I was lying in bed one night in this documentary. It was on about Bob Fosse. I was like, first of all, who is Bob Fosse? Not a clue. What's this musical? And I was like, do you know who would know all about this, lorne? So I was like, right.

Speaker 1 9:03

I'm going to listen to what they have to say. And then this is where the game comes into play. When we're watching something or having a conversation, I'm just going to throw a slide out and just it was one of those things where I remember the first time you were like what and I've got Tim with it as well and I've got a couple of your friends with it where I've done it like yeah, bob Plossie was known for his unorthodox dance styles, I think it was with toes pointing in or something.

Speaker 1 9:27

It was all this and those sharp staccato movements or whatever you know all that sort of stuff and I was making it like I was totally making it up. I was faking it until I make it um. But yeah, 20 years later or whatever, maybe I'm still getting away with that one line and people still seem surprised how does he know this. I think I need to go back to the well and re-watch it and add something to it.

Speaker 1 9:56

But I think people are maybe starting to stagnate a wee bit on my lack of knowledge of Bob Fosse.

Speaker 2 10:01

It just always interested me that you yeah, I didn't know whether or not it was something that you were trying to impress, but anyway. So we have seen a number of musicals over the years. We're going to go and see one another one this year which you're very excited about. And we'll talk about that in the pod later on. But now you, instead of experiencing your wife, your girlfriend on stage, you now experience your children on stage. And what is that like? Be nice.

Speaker 1 10:30

It's fantastic, be nice, it's fantastic it? No, I'm happy for them that it's their pursuit and that they enjoy it. And it's great to see how the stage skill has developed those skills. And having somewhat grown up with you and your sister constantly saying without stage skill and everybody it's been, you know, I've been blessed that they've been brought into, I've been brought into their circle, I suppose through stage school. You know the confidence, the leadership skills, the communication skills, the teamwork skills, all that sort of stuff. I didn't truly appreciate the benefits of that either.

Speaker 1 11:19

I thought it was just a, you know, a line that you heard that you all, you know, agreed upon and you all spewed out. Yeah, but very much so. I have seen that with my own daughter, where she was really struggling with confidence and she would cry before she went on stage and just because the emotions, the tension was building up, it's akin to getting on a roller coaster. You know, I personally my own experience getting on a roller coaster the buildup's worse than the ride. I thoroughly enjoy the ride, but the buildup used to kill me. Oh, flip me. No, I'm alright, I'll skip this. But whenever I got on I had the best time of my life. I would jump back on it straight away. I've seen that with our daughter that she was getting on stage and the build up to it was causing her so much anxiety, but when she was on stage she was thriving she was belting it out.

Speaker 1 12:08

She was dancing. You know there's a talent there and I've seen that with her. But I've seen also how that's changed over the last couple of years and how she's been able to fill that role with greater confidence and put herself forward in other aspects of life, not just three-stage school but that sort of thing. So it's really. It is quite a joke and you know what's it like to go and see them, but it's great to see those skills develop and to see them on stage and pursuing a hobby that they are both so passionate about.

Speaker 2 12:38

Yeah, no, that's lovely because musicals obviously teach in so many different ways. But being part of theatre, seeing a guy his name is Josh Groban saying that if you need to hire somebody, hire a theater kid, because we're so adaptable, we can do so many different things and it's lovely that you're you're able to see that then um, from the kids. But also, is it really weird seeing people up on stage dancing and singing whenever. That's something that you know you could do it 100, you could do it but that's not something that you would feel comfortable in. I would always love to know what others who are not involved in theater think of theater. Does that make sense? So is it? Do you go? That's amazing that they get up and do that and you're really proud of them. Or do you go? Gosh, I can't believe that they they did that both yeah, you know, you know.

Speaker 1 13:32

But if you see somebody up on stage and they're giving it their all and you can really see their talents shine, um, it's impressive. Yeah, it's really impressive. And sometimes, if it's somebody close to the family, um, or a member of the family singing or dancing or whatever, or just knocking it out of the ballpark, it does, does like it, pulls my heart.

Speaker 1 13:53

I get kind of a wee bit emotional, you know, and I feel like you know bite down on the cheek here a wee bit Like your sister's singing. Whenever your sister's singing she's belting out, every time, no matter like I'm like oh, I hear good job, good job, but every time she's belting out and she's giving it everything and she's had a good performance I get really proud of her. Yeah, you know, and the same with Charlotte and Ethan and you Thanks, yeah, yeah, but you know you're just really proud of them, Just go.

Speaker 2 14:20

I don't know. Yeah, that's good.

Speaker 1 14:22

But no, I have the utmost respect for anybody who gets up on stage and does that and, as you know, I have a real thing for people who can dance in time, Not people who can dance in time like a troupe where they're all moving in synchronicity. They're all turning.

Speaker 2 14:36

Yeah, you love that, don't you Real?

Speaker 1 14:37

sharp, everything's bump, bump. I could watch that all day. You know, you see everybody just in time. It's that attention to detail, that focus, the teamwork. It is something that I'm just like. That is incredible and to me it shows the hard work that's been put in yes, the opposite of that I suppose is whenever.

Speaker 1 14:57

I equally love this, but in a different way. I love seeing people dancing on time. Yep, I appreciate that when I see people. You know, go and see a show in a school and a community setting. Yeah, you know, go and see a show in a school, in a community setting, you know, a church, whatever it may be. That's putting on a performance and they're right on time and the singing's off key. I love that just as much, okay.

Speaker 2 15:20

Why? Because you can see the passion behind people. No, because it's a shit show.

Speaker 1 15:26

Okay, and somewhere you know, somebody's stressing out in the background, going they just didn't get it, they just didn't get it and I love that. But you can see the kids are having the time of their life. Did they put in the hard work? Some maybe did, but the ones that don't, they're the ones that stand out for me and I just shoulders are going. Tears are dripping down my face.

Speaker 2 15:52

I love it. You love that and that's funny that you mentioned that somebody backstage is stressing out. Are you aware of that? Because on many occasions you were backstage like trying to get that curtain open and close. For many of our stagecoach performances, alex was making sure you were doing it right that was no easy fight.

Speaker 1 16:08

An awful lot of responsibility was put on me there by the guys at your stage school. Um, no, I, yous were so well coordinated backstage and yous were so well trained and well I was gonna say well behaved. But yeah, yeah, well behaved. Yous were taught how to be professional from the offset and I know that came down from um Vivian and those that really had that professional ethos and instilled that in these from a young age, that usually you do not talk at the side, you do not play at the side, you do not whisper and you self-policed each other, which I always surprised me because I was always a piss about, especially then you know I'm standing backstage and you know, can't we?

Speaker 1 16:50

but not saying bored but you, if you've seen, the show 20 times and you're pulling up and down the curtain, which is an important role close the show out, you know. But yous were so good at keeping each other in check and keeping the younger ones in check and how the older ones looked after the younger ones, brought them out on stage on time no, it was a well-oiled machine. Time no, it was a well-oiled machine. So I don't have that experience, but I imagine, having spoken to you and I know the frustration that you know. You know tim maybe has had in the past.

Speaker 1 17:18

You know he's like you know we need to get this right yeah you know and you hear him talking about whenever there's something coming up with stage killer or any of his um many adventures that he's on the guy's a busy man, he's a busy man, you know, um, but you know that whenever you have professional standards, you want professionals and throughout. So it's understandable that if you're not seeing that, that there's going to be stresses.

Musical References in Popular Culture

Speaker 1 17:41

So no, I actually haven't seen it firsthand because of the professionalism you saw, but I have seen, yeah, I have heard yeah so I imagine that goes on, and you know me, I like a wee background story to any scenario that I see, and I imagine, whenever we're watching a community production, that there is somebody in the background who's very passionate about it, but maybe just didn't have the talent there or it's still in a raw form. They're maybe stressing out, and their family's there watching it. They've been talking about it for six months, yes, with their life it's consumed it.

Speaker 2 18:12

They've been talking about it for six months. Yes, yes, with their life, it's consumed them.

Speaker 1 18:14

It's fallen to pieces on stage.

Speaker 2 18:17

Well, that's another thing. From Avenue Q Shout out Freud.

Speaker 1 18:21

Shout out Freud, yeah, is that happiness in other people's misery?

Speaker 2 18:25

Yeah, you do love what we've been allowed to do A hundred percent. When appropriate yeah, when appropriate, yeah, when appropriate. When appropriate, okay, yeah, you know what? It's interesting that actually you have more of a holistic and a more varied view of musical theatre since you've been involved through me for the last 20 years, as opposed to if you were just to randomly go and see a production, you kind of can appreciate it a little more. So it definitely has taught you something over the last number of years.

Speaker 1 18:53

Do you know what it's taught me? Do you know what it's?

Speaker 2 18:55

taught me.

Speaker 1 18:56

What have you ever heard of the frequency illusion?

Speaker 2 18:59

No.

Speaker 1 18:59

Right, there's this thing called the frequency illusion. I think that's like the layman terms. I think the real thing is like the, something like Batter Meinhof phenomena, right and what that is is the more you learn about something, the more you see it in places.

Speaker 1 19:17

so the more I learned about musical theater and the more I listen to you and tim or spend time around the family that you hear these things coming up and I obviously enter the room. Musicals are on, that I start to see them more often, like we experienced it whenever we found out you were pregnant the first time and we couldn't tell people and you know. So we're sort of going, hmm, but everywhere we went there's babies, there's prams, there was nappy adverts on TV or diaper adverts on TV. Everywhere we looked there was baby-related stuff.

Speaker 2 19:48

We're going to buy a car.

Speaker 1 19:53

Yeah, so it's mini or whatever it might be. Just driving down the street and you're like, is somebody trying to tell me something? I found that by listening to the podcast and speaking to you, that I stick on tv and maybe a series that I've watched many a time over the years and there's a reference to something I just didn't just didn't quite land or I went, oh, that's a musical. I'd maybe understood that it was a musical reference.

Speaker 2 20:17

Yeah.

Speaker 1 20:17

You know, things like Family Guy, south Park, things like that, that have always been on the TV, and there's maybe reference things, but I truly didn't understand the depth. There was layers to the joke and I didn't understand it until I started listening to the podcast. But now I put on things and I'm like ha, that's a reference to Chicago, that's a reference to Seven Brides. There's so many things that I go, oh, I get the reference now, or I understand what he's getting out there or she's getting out there, and that 100% came from listening to the podcast. And I do pick up on those references, more so now than I certainly would have before.

Speaker 2 20:56

Yeah, that's cool. So maybe musical theatre people are everywhere in everybody's lives when we're just slowly dropping them in and then it's like a secret little joke Tell me, that's so right. Yeah.

Speaker 1 21:08

Is. Well, let me figure out how to say this. Are there more musicals coming out now, or are musicals coming out at a faster rate now and getting into the public eye quicker than they used to? It just feels like now every time I'm speaking or maybe just because I'm around you is now that I'm hearing more about it, but it's oh such and such coming out or they're making a musical. You know every single rock band. You know. The first one I heard of was Queen getting a musical. Now it was Tommy wasn't there, but it seems like we've got one for everybody.

Speaker 2 21:46

Now there's Tina Turner yeah, nina Turner, yeah, hold on.

Speaker 1 21:51

Did I hear there's going to be one of Hugh Lewis in the news? Yeah, so Hugh Lewis in the news and God knows Elton John Does that count?

Speaker 2 21:59

Abba.

Speaker 1 22:00

Abba, yeah, abba, the musical, that's right. It just feels like that's just bands, that's just one genre. It feels like they're just banging out musicals. Now Is it getting? Are they coming out faster now than ever?

Speaker 2 22:16

I would say yes. I would say also, in the last 20 years. You think about Moulin Rouge, which was a film that came out when we were roughly around.

Speaker 1 22:24

We started going out just before that yeah.

Speaker 2 22:27

That was like one of the first movie musicals for such a long period of time and then that kind of like kickstart. Then you had like chicago was then turned into a movie musical. There's been lots of musicals which have been turned into movies and there's been a load, a big surge of movies being turned into musicals like clueless, back to the future, mean girls. They're just like some which are currently on the west end at the minute. Um, then, jif book musicals are are very popular at the minute and the reason is the music's already there. They just need to get a story to it. So that's what's maybe coming out quicker and you're seeing so brand new musicals. Um, it's still probably taking a long time. And there was, um, why am I so single? Which was a brand new musical from the creators of Six. That's unfortunately closed now. It didn't even last a year on the West End, so there's still not a huge amount of musicals coming out and lasting for a long period of time.

Speaker 1 23:23

That's what I'm saying. Are some of them a cash grab, in your opinion? Are some of them a cash grab? And inevitably are they going to be just a flash in the pan, sort of thing like fire it out, let's see what happens.

Speaker 2 23:36

yeah, it doesn't resonate with the audience, let's pull it yeah, I don't think producers can allow things to flop as they used to.

Speaker 2 23:44

I know from our research like the musical yeah, I, I know that from our research and doing this podcast. A lot of the time some of the classics like maybe hello dolly or um, you know just some of the really big musicals maybe only had like 300 performances. But it was seeing this such as it was seen as success. Well, having maybe 300 performances now is seen as a failure. So it's a very different time. Um or like Sondheim never reached a thousand performances on Broadway Like and Sondheim's. One of the greatest composers of all time it is Stephen. Well done, stephen the icon.

Speaker 2 24:20

yeah, I think every so often there is a surge and there is a new love for theatre comes in lots of different ways. Look at what the Wicked Musical Part One has done. You know, not only was there one musical nominated in the Oscars, there was two, you know. And that doesn't happen all the time either. So definitely with the likes of social media and the internet itself.

Speaker 1 24:51

Yeah, the internet.

Speaker 2 24:52

I suppose, and whether you, you know, agree with them or not the likes of social media and the internet itself. Yeah, the internet, I suppose, and whether you, you know, agree with them or not, but legs, you know, and pro shots definitely. Theater is becoming a little bit more accessible, so therefore there's more chance of new musicals or new styles of musicals coming out and people being exposed to them and seeing them. Yeah, I don't know if that really answered the question.

Speaker 1 25:17

I kind of went there, but no, no, no, certainly interesting. I think I'd love to see you know on average, year on year, how many new musicals came to broadway in the west end and how that has changed over the years. You know, has there been that swap out? You know, and what's the average length of time a Broadway show has been in? You know in the 70s today, you know 70s, 90s, whatever. You know in increments. You could look at that and it would be fascinating just to see on what accelerated that. What was the catalyst? And was it Moulin Rouge?

Speaker 2 25:50

yeah, yeah, it's really interesting. I suppose as well, when we got the chance to speak to Nico, who wrote Millennials.

The Evolution of Modern Musicals

Speaker 2 25:55

Are Going musicals and she was so given of her time explaining as well the long process that goes into writing a new musical and just who wants to see it, who wants it picked up, and like. She was really fortunate that a cast recording was done of that musical, so we've been able to hear the songs. Well, but there's plenty of musicals out there, like death comes here, for instance, which is a musical which has been tried in chicago and it's currently now on broadway. It's only released two songs, so right now you're sitting going. Oh, I don't know what the whole album sounds like, but you know what's going to be fabulous.

Speaker 2 26:30

Well, millennials, millennials of Killin' Musicals you can listen to everything and we can get a real good understanding. But it's not actually on the West End or Broadway yet. It's had little trial runs.

Speaker 1 26:41

But you and your sister used to do that when you were younger. You would listen to the soundtrack and you'd buy the album and play it constantly and you'd be like I love that musical.

Speaker 2 26:53

Yeah.

Speaker 1 26:53

And it used to frustrate the life of me. I was like you've never seen it. Yeah, you've never seen it. How can you say you love that? But there seems to be an understanding within you know your circle of friends that no, that's okay, you love the music from it and you have an understanding of how the story progresses and things like that.

Speaker 2 27:10

Yeah, and you never understood that. Actually that's a really fair point. You were like but you haven't seen it. Sometimes you yeah, don't get me wrong you need to see theatre, like, whether it's plays or musicals, and seeing it alive. There's nothing that beats that.

Speaker 2 27:26

But theatre isn't always accessible. No, you know, and you think of where we live. Really, it's only in the last 15 years of bigger musicals being able to come to our capital city, and even now, whenever there's a UK and Ireland tour, belfast is often missed out and it's Dublin, so we've got to travel like two hours to go and see it. Theatre is also very expensive, so it's not always successful. So being able to just listen to a cast recording and then do that research and finding out who's in it and who the understudies are, who the creative team, and learning more about the process, can then make you really fall in love with the musical. And that's what happened with Hamilton, like in our house. And then all of a sudden, the pro shot was available and then that became. You know, we were able to see it, not live, but as close to live as possible.

Speaker 2 28:23

Yeah excellent production also I want to ask you you absolutely adore any TV show and there's a wee bit of singing in it. Let's think of Spigot Inn ah, great joke so part of me wonders is there?

Speaker 1 28:38

but it's tongue in cheek, it's tongue in cheek and it's done in a humorous way and I know musicals can be like that as well about that yeah is there what sorry? Is there a?

Speaker 2 28:50

wee secret musical theatre boy just dying to get out there.

Speaker 1 28:55

Yes, I love it Probably Honestly probably.

Speaker 2 29:01

Yeah. Do you think if it had been more accessible for you, where you knew that you could have done a mixture of things like? Look at our son, for instance Yep, he enjoys musicals, loves going to stagecoach just for the friendship and the learning part of me but also adores martial arts and video games. I think is number one excuse me, is number one in his list there um of what he, what he adores. But he could do it, do it all. But maybe whenever you were younger it wasn't something that was in your psyche so you didn't realize that you could go and join a local drama club or ham dram society. I wasn't interested yeah, I wasn't I didn't spark me that far.

Speaker 2 29:46

It did. Look at that smile I enjoyed.

Speaker 1 29:50

I did a couple of Like school plays and stuff. But I'm just not Talented. I can't sing. I cannot carry a tune in a bucket. There's no, I just can't.

Speaker 2 30:01

You actually can, though.

Speaker 1 30:03

I just can't.

Speaker 2 30:04

I don't think it's. You can't sing to a style that you want to be able to sing in. Yeah, just like I can't either, but I can still sing to an extent.

Speaker 1 30:14

I'm not the next Michael Ball fan, no, it's. It just wasn't that way inclined. I mean, I think I could have been easily talked into it. Put it that way.

Speaker 2 30:27

Yeah, I think definitely if we had met younger, I could have convinced you to maybe be involved in one or two productions Tim nearly got me once. Tim nearly got you once and still is raging.

Speaker 1 30:39

I actually showed up for the rehearsal and everything.

Speaker 2 30:41

Yeah.

Speaker 1 30:41

But I couldn't deal with the lack of professionalism from my counterparts, my peers.

Speaker 2 30:47

The lack of professionalism.

Speaker 1 30:49

I mean that was disgraceful. I just looked at Tim. The two of us just rolled our eyes and was just like I can't work in these conditions.

Speaker 2 30:57

Because you have a nickname amongst some of our friends. What Well, don't act surprised.

Speaker 1 31:03

Well, I don't know what the nickname is.

Speaker 2 31:04

No but you do Acty ID.

Speaker 1 31:07

Oh yeah.

Speaker 2 31:09

So you're much more extroverted than you would allow yourself to believe. You like to think that you're an introvert, but you're not. You're an extrovert. So there's definitely potential there and you have performed many, many times I've been saying many times uh, many times in front of a large crowd who's going to see this? Haven't you yeah not just in theatre, but in wrestling which, as you said, towards the beginning they're quite similar. So I do honestly believe there's a little musical theatre boy just wanting to come out.

Speaker 1 31:53

I'm a natural entertainer, darling.

Speaker 2 31:57

I love it.

Speaker 1 31:58

I'm a peacock, you gotta let me fly.

Speaker 2 31:59

Oh the other guys the other guys yeah. Love it, love it. See, I take an interest in your movies and you take an interest in mine.

Speaker 1 32:10

Mine are a wee bit more lowbrow than yours. If I'm being honest. There's a classiness attached to yours that certainly didn't come from movies I enjoy.

Speaker 2 32:20

Right, well, that's what I wanted to check. Have musicals taught you anything? Have you learned anything over the last 20 years of being with me through musical theatre?

Speaker 1 32:31

I mean I was aware what the planes were. If that helps beforehand.

Speaker 2 32:35

Shut up.

Speaker 1 32:36

Sometimes, what. The two of yous come off with things and I'm like, how did you not know that? And I understand it's because yous were watching musical theatre from a young age.

Speaker 1 32:47

It's not that it taught you while you were preparing for that episode. It's stuff that it was the first time that you heard that at that age, the first time you saw that musical. Now, that being said, there's fairly recent musicals that are using words that you use and I learned this and I learned that and I'm like, oh my gosh, they have driver's licenses. They're allowed out in public. They don't have care assistants with them All right, that's licenses.

Speaker 2 33:13

They're allowed out in public. They don't have care assistants with them.

Speaker 1 33:14

That's desperate, no. But there's times, there's things that you come up with and I'm like really Really, but no. And then there's times where I'm right there with you and.

Speaker 1 33:25

I'm going did not know that. That is completely new to me. But yeah, no, absolutely. I've learned stuff from hearing about musicals because I don't watch them. But yeah, no, absolutely. I've learnt stuff from hearing about musicals because I don't watch the documentaries that you watch, and hearing you and Tim talking about them and being in that circle. Yeah, there's definitely stuff that we learnt and stuff that you could apply to life. You know, it's not like a wee box step to get you out of a sticky situation. Oh go, yay, go yay, tim will.

Speaker 2 33:52

The life. You know it's not like a wee box step to get you out of a sticky situation. Oh, go, ye, go ye. Tim will be very proud of you right now.

Speaker 1 33:56

Thanks, Very proud Thanks.

Speaker 2 33:57

Tim. So we are getting to go see a musical this year and hopefully getting another wee London trip to go and see a couple more.

Speaker 1 34:04

Yes.

Speaker 2 34:05

We're very excited.

Speaker 1 34:06

Yep, we're going to see Diana the musical.

Speaker 2 34:08

No, we're not.

Creating New Musicals and Accessibility

Speaker 1 34:10

We've got tickets at. Is it actually?

Speaker 2 34:17

Yeah, still can't.

Speaker 1 34:19

That'll be hilarious to watch.

Speaker 2 34:20

Sometimes in my random Spotify where I'm just like listening to musicals, a Diana song will come up. I'm just like I just I still don't understand how this got made, why it's terrible. It's terrible.

Speaker 1 34:36

But you don't know because you haven't seen it?

Speaker 2 34:39

Oh God no.

Speaker 1 34:42

I imagine it's going to be terrible. It's one of those ones I'm going to get that community production thing going on. We're going to be watching it and I'm going to be killing myself laughing going. This is so bad, it's amazing.

Speaker 2 34:54

I think it's that a couple of those films which have now become they were so bad they're amazing that people have to watch them.

Speaker 1 35:03

I can't even think there's a term for things like this, but I'm not going to use it in relation to, okay, uh, diana musical. But oh yeah, I imagine it would be one of those productions an absolute mess.

Speaker 2 35:16

Um. Okay, gosh, I'm on computer. Okay, I'm glad that you have learned something. I feel like I need to continue on this journey.

Speaker 1 35:27

You didn't set up the podcast to teach me stuff through musical theatre.

Speaker 2 35:31

No, you could have done that on a slide deck, um no, but the podcast was all about teaching others, or like what musicals have taught us, and then sharing experiences.

Speaker 1 35:42

Yeah, I think that's what people like to hear. We like to hear your stories.

Speaker 2 35:47

As a fan, a regular listener, we'd like to hear the stories that you and tim have and the anecdotes that you've come up with, and and they're so funny yeah, and it's nice discovering new musicals, learning about them, and then not only learning about the actual musical itself, whether it's like Marie Antoinette or like the Henry Six Wives or Henry Eighth Wives. You know there's so many things that can be taught through musicals, but also, like if you're involved in a production, you can learn so many like life skills, and also you can just be introduced to a new musical and that could be some learning for the week. So there's a whole variety.

Speaker 1 36:32

Yeah, that's the thing. I haven't seen Sex. But Charlotte, our daughter, speaks of it all the time.

Speaker 1 36:38

Well, not all the time, but she was really into it and I've heard some of the songs being played in the house which absolutely was not age appropriate. But she was mature enough to understand what she could and couldn't say. Maybe just didn't understand why. Yep, how historically accurate is that thing? Like, obviously they wouldn't play it in school, but Charlotte has an understanding of the order of the wives of Henry VIII and should that come up in exams she would do well.

Speaker 2 37:09

Where they came from.

Speaker 1 37:11

Back to the house of Holbein or something.

Speaker 2 37:12

Yeah, do you know what I mean? Like you know the French and then moved to German and yeah. You know, like all of those, alba Lynn was French. She grew up in the French.

Speaker 1 37:30

Yeah.

Speaker 2 37:30

Sorry, I thought you were saying I was wrong.

Speaker 1 37:32

Was it Oregon and Spain?

Speaker 2 37:34

Okay, yeah, so, yeah. So she has like. But the musical is not done like as a proper historical representation. It's like about trying to say he had the worst story. Yeah yeah, yeah, but there's definitely learning there.

Speaker 1 37:50

Yeah, yeah, no doubt.

Speaker 2 37:52

I mean, what did you? You know, I was going to say like we already kind of like discussed that, but I was just thinking, thinking, whenever you first hear something that you like being turned into musical, usually your barriers are up yeah, aren't they?

Speaker 1 38:08

not interested. Oh, they're gonna ruin that yeah let's see how they ruin that.

Speaker 2 38:12

Yeah well, I've been proven wrong time and time again have you I have yeah and you've also convinced your friends to go and see things, and then they've enjoyed it enjoyed it, which is pretty good A bit of social proofing. You did enjoy Wicked.

Speaker 1 38:27

Yeah, more than.

Speaker 2 38:28

I wanted to.

Speaker 1 38:29

Not more than I wanted to, but again, it was one of those things I was being coerced into watching it and I didn't really want to.

Speaker 2 38:37

But a bit like my poor dad. Like my dad is not into musicals at all and, growing up with parents who were obsessed with musicals, dragged him to everything and then married my mum, who was obsessed with musicals, and then had two children and now I have grandchildren that are obsessed with musicals. But he has an appreciation for different parts of the musicals, but sometimes whenever he Like the hand parts of the musicals, Um, but sometimes whenever he like the set design, like he actually goes and watches a musical or would watch a musical and be more interested in how the?

Speaker 1 39:10

set was created which is why Back to the Future would blow his mind.

Speaker 2 39:13

Yeah, absolutely I think actually he would, he would enjoy that. Um and you can kind of appreciate both. But you really did enjoy Back to the Future like so much so you would go and see it again yeah so hopefully if there was anything else. I mean, I think if they turned around and said Star Wars and Star Wars Musical, you would draw the line. I don't think you could cope with that.

Speaker 2 39:35

I'd go to see it but you'd have an annoyance because it would have to change some of the storyline and then you would be sitting going. That's not what they're saying at this point.

Speaker 1 39:46

That's not common. Yeah, it depends which one they do, but yeah, no, I'd go to see it. I think I'm improving wrong time and time again. What's the worst that can happen?

Speaker 2 39:58

Yeah, I think what I was trying to say before I went to my husband, me and my sister were obsessed with it, and then my mum was obsessed with it and my poor dad. It literally was just in his ears 24-7, so I don't think that he would ever entertain watching the film because he's just been like burnt by that music. He's just like no, remember, you were obsessed with that.

Speaker 1 40:23

He dodged a bullet, though, didn't he? Didn't we all go to London one time? Is that the time you?

Speaker 2 40:27

went to see it. Yeah, we went to see it, yeah.

Speaker 1 40:28

You just went to see it and because he had a brother in arms, we were able to go to a comedy show instead.

Speaker 2 40:35

Yeah, yeah, definitely.

Speaker 1 40:37

Yeah.

Speaker 2 40:44

That was his way out, yeah, which he was delighted about absolutely delighted.

Speaker 1 40:46

Yeah, yeah, it was cute likewise well, you've seen it now.

Speaker 2 40:50

Well, you've seen part one, looking forward to part two in November, so that I think is going to be our episode for this week and then coming up musical theatre for the listeners well, I mean there's quite a lot.

Diana: The Musical and Upcoming Shows

Speaker 2 41:01

Usually this is Timothy's bit, so I'll just keep it short. The Lightning Thief, the Percy Jackson musical, is going to go on tour from August. Okay, it's just a UK tour. It's not coming over the water, unfortunately, but there's a real buzz around this musical originally started on Broadway and it hasn't made it over to UK shows yet. Greatest Showman we all know the Greatest Showman.

Speaker 1 41:27

PT Barnum.

Speaker 2 41:27

Yeah, you actually have not watched that film. Excuse me, you've not watched that film. You're not interested in it because it has literally been shoved down your throat every single song. And you are almost taking a bit of a stance against that one, aren't you?

Speaker 1 41:43

Yeah.

Speaker 2 41:44

Though your brother loves that. A guy who definitely is not interested in musicals at all is obsessed with that film.

Speaker 1 41:50

I wouldn't say obsessed, but yeah, he's sort of enjoyed it.

Speaker 2 41:52

No, no, no, he is, he will.

Speaker 1 41:54

He has tried to sell it to me.

Speaker 2 41:55

And he will optionally put that on as their family movie night, like that is his choice. So there you go, greatest Showman. The musical will premiere in the UK at the Bristol Hippodrome, but that will be spring 2026. So a little bit. Hercules is starting to slowly drop.

Speaker 1 42:16

I chewed up my feed there last night. Did it, yes, did it.

Speaker 2 42:18

So we're hopefully going to go see that in August. Fingers crossed Okay well, and yeah, it's getting lots of wee little bits are slowly dropping. The big night of musicals it was filmed a couple of weeks ago. The big lottery night of musicals it will be aired on television on the 22nd of March, so really not that long. A couple of Saturdays, okay. So there will be Mean Girls Hercules will be there, cabaret maybe is it here now the Steps musical it will be there. Yeah, it'll be a great night.

Speaker 1 42:55

Steps have their own musical.

Speaker 2 42:56

Yeah, that's a tragedy. Oh gosh, and then the Olivier's were announced this week. And just special shout out to wonderful Lauren Drew, who has been nominated as Best Actress in Titanic, which is currently on the West End. Absolutely well deserved, lauren, for your nomination, and she is up in the same category as Mel DeStone for Hello Dolly.

Speaker 1 43:23

Wow, Isn't that a wrap. That's the one that Tim loved. See the fact I even know these names.

Speaker 2 43:28

Also Tom Zander. He has been nominated for Best Actor in a Musical and he is currently playing Damien in the West End. Timothy and I got to go and see that and he hit a game well deserved for that as well In what musical Mean Girls. Leighton Williams has also been nominated in that category too, for Titanic. So Titanic has been nominated for Best Musical. So yeah, fantastic.

Speaker 2 43:55

There's a lot going on. I will certainly not take any more of Timothy Sunder because he knows a lot more than me, but he has had an amazing week in Les Mis in their 40th celebrations. Let the people sing.

Speaker 1 44:09

Congrats, tim.

Speaker 2 44:10

Congrats Tim, congrats Kerry, congrats to the whole creative team and all who were on that stage. Absolutely wonderful production. So enjoy your week of rest and recovery, hopefully and Timothy will be back, hopefully- To take a seat.

Speaker 1 44:29

I've been keeping it warm.

Speaker 2 44:30

To take a seat.

Speaker 1 44:32

Pressure's off.

Speaker 2 44:34

Yeah, some fun musicals with lots of learning.

Speaker 1 44:39

You can't tell me what the next one is. Do I have to wait?

Speaker 2 44:41

Yeah, that's it, because I don't know which order we're doing it in. I don't want to make a mistake.

Speaker 1 44:46

I get the same surprise whenever we're recording. I don't get told beforehand what are we doing tonight? I'm sitting there and you just kick me out. I'm like okay.

Speaker 2 44:55

I'm interested in this. Thank you for joining us this week. Have a lovely week. I'll be back in your ears again next week, all for.