Mayor Skip Henderson (Part 2): How to Help Those Affected by Homelessness and Addiction. The Roles of City Government, Businesses, Churches, and Private Citizens in working with Organizations Like SafeHouse to Help Those Living on the Fringes of Our Comm

A powerhouse of an episode with the Mayor of Columbus, GA, Skip Henderson!  Mayor Henderson shares great insight into what it will really take for us to overcome the challenges of homelessness and addiction in our communities.  The discussion covers crime, the economy, and the roles of City Government, Businesses, Churches, and Citizens.  This is an episode you'll want to save/bookmark to go back and listen to a second time!

Transcript

Skip: 0:00

I personally think that the homelessness issue, because it's so diverse and so widespread It is a community issue and it impacts everybody in the community. The entire community needs to get involved. And I'll tell you, I've told my pastor too, I mean, there are 300 plus churches in Columbus, Georgia. If we could get everybody on the same page, all the clergy, all the different religions, if you really are here to serve God's children, then everybody needs to work on that. I mean, people say, what can I do man? Just call Safe House. You know, say, Hey, what can I do to volunteer to help out a little bit? There is something that each of us can do, and I stand by my statement that we have way too many churches who do way too good a job for way too many people to not be able to lick this problem. the one thing you can't do is just sit on the sidelines and say, I wish I knew what to do. There's too many people to ask. There's too many organizations out there. It's hard sometimes to make a commitment, to step out there and, um, and try to make a difference in not just holistically the community, but making a difference in that one individual. I mean, it could be that one guy that, shows up at Freedom House the next day. And you know, it may be that that person that you talk to every day for two months and they don't give you the time of day, and in one day you catch'em when they're a little bit more willing to talk. And you're able to try to learn a little bit about'em and point'em in, in a direction that's gonna change their lives forever.

Phil Shuler: 1:33

HellO, and welcome to Renew, Restore, Rejoice, the Safe House Ministries podcast, where we share stories of the power of God to change lives through Safe House Ministries. Safe House Ministries is based out of Columbus, Georgia, and we are a ministry that exists to love and serve people who have been affected by addiction, homelessness, and incarceration. I'm your host, Phil Shuler, the Director of Development for Safe House Ministries here in Columbus, Georgia. Safe House serves over 1, 100 people each month as they transition back into our community. Safe House provides an abundance of services including 213 beds for homeless individuals and families, case management for obtaining job skills and long term employment. Over 300 hot meals every day, free clothing, and so much more. One of the most incredible services that Safe House provides is our free 9 12 month intensive outpatient substance abuse program, which is state licensed, CARF accredited, and has no wait list. Almost 100 percent of individuals staying in our shelters who follow our three phase program become fully employed within a few months. And 68 percent of individuals who stay at least one night with us End up finding work and moving into their own home. Thank you for being with us today and listening to our podcast. We hope you enjoy this week's episode.

2:45

Thank you for being here with us today on the podcast. This is going to be part two of the conversation I had with Mayor Skip Henderson, and it is so, so good. We really do dive deeper into the areas of crime and. The economy and how homelessness and addiction impact those things. We talk about businesses, we talk about what can citizens in the community do. We talk about the role of, of the city government and the best way to approach tackling this very, very challenging and complex issue. So I hope you enjoy this episode. It really is probably one of my favorite. I think it's so insightful, it's so helpful, And we would love to hear what you think. We would love for your feedback. If you want to just leave us a review, give us some comments of what you feel like the value that you gained from listening to this episode and share it, please share it and just spread the word because we really need to work together if we're going to be able to. Truly tackle the challenges that come with trying to help people go from being homeless to being housed and having their own homes. To go from being in the bondage of drug addiction to being free So that they can get to the place where they recognize that they have value, they have worth, and can become a contributing member of society and give value to others.

Phil: 4:17

thinking about the, the results that have been able to been, to be accomplished of the past 18 months, safe House Ministries have been able to help almost 300 people go from being on the streets to now being in their, their own housing. That's a big number, but there's still so many more.

Skip: 4:35

There are. And, uh, and I think that, um, one of the things we have, have, I believe we need to do is we need to update our resource, our resources in our toolbox, right? So, I think I've talked with some individuals with United Way and some others, and they're. Kinda reconvening. Uh, years ago, about 10 years ago, there was a, uh, 10 year plan to end homelessness. Well, we knew that was a grandiose plan and it was very likely to fail if that was your true goal, but it really wasn't. The idea was just to get people focused on Yeah. On the, on the issue. And I, I, right now, there's an organization of folks that are pulling together and have a very small working task force, and then they have sort of ancillary groups that are feeding into these individuals and giving them some, uh, real life stories of what's going on in the community. So I think as, as you pointed out, whether it's post COVID or whether it's just a shift in the economy, a lack of affordable housing the scope and the shape of the issue has changed, and I think it makes really good sense to go back and reevaluate and see, all right, are we still doing the things that are making positive change? 300 people, getting them into housing is incredible. The scary thing is there's still a lot of people out. There's a lot, a lot of vouchers that are available through these organizations through the CHA Columbus Housing Authority with these individuals and organizations being the conduit, there's so many available because there's, it's not enough to, to take care of the cost of the housing. Yeah. So, but it, it's all connected. We, we, we haven't talked about jobs, we haven't talked about some of the training. We haven't talked about education. We haven't talked about delinquency. We, all of those things feed into this because if you don't, if you don't develop, if you don't develop the skills that are gonna put you in a position where you can be employed then it's gonna be really hard. It

Phil: 6:31

is. And you're right. You're so right that. The importance of case managers within the, the structure of organizations like Valley Rescue Mission, safe House Ministries to just really help partnering with Goodwill for job training and collaboration and working together is, I think it's done pretty well in Columbus. Obviously it can always be done better but we have a, a pretty good system. You know, I know we use Safe House Ministries, uses Goodwill and partners with them and everybody that comes into our shelters to go through, I think it's eight classes of just job training. Mm-hmm. Foundational classes partnering with healthcare organizations like Mercy Med and Valley Healthcare mental health organizations American Works, new Horizon, and I think that's important and that, that is part of the secret to success is working together.'cause you one organization can't do everything. No. And there are others that are doing things well. And so if you can work. Effectively together. And it makes a big difference. The

Skip: 7:29

collaboration is the difficult piece, right? Because everybody is having success in their own lane, and so they, they tend to stay there and just stay focused on what they do well, uh, which can be a very, very good thing. But I, as you pointed out I'm just proud of this community because yes, we've got problems and some of these problems are significant to the point that it does take patience and consistency and time to, to solve them. Our poverty rate is too high. Well, you don't change that overnight. Uh, and, and the poverty rate being high is what leads to a lot of these people who lose their homes and they're now on the streets. So I think that as we continue to try to look for ways to modify our approach, I think the success that we are having is gonna continue to grow exponentially. Uh, safe House does an incredible job and Safe House has done this. Safe House has Eva reevaluated their numbers. And try to put a finer point on the services they deliver so that they could have more impact with some of the things that you guys got have going on at some of your, your shelters. Yeah. And um, so I think as we continue to do that and look at what is really making a difference because y'all experienced that, where you, you had so many folks coming in and you were helping so many people, and then you started looking at the numbers and determined that, you know, a lot of these folks are not wanting to be housed. And so could the effort of Safe House be brought to bear in a different area that's gonna really make a positive impact and lead to those 300 people finding, finding shelter?

Phil: 9:03

Yeah. Yeah. Kind of a related but different question. Columbus I think has a wider reputation of just being effective. At helping people go from being homeless, being in the midst of substance abuse and just getting back on their feet. So much so that I hear from other individuals that I work with all the time about counties across Alabama and Georgia and, and just other places, other cities that are essentially dumping individuals in Columbus. I'm sure you're familiar with that, help us to understand what that looks like and why that is, and just maybe some more truth and understanding about that.

Skip: 9:45

Yeah. I mean, there, there are, I mean, look, the, you, you have successes with some of the initiatives that are put in place by organizations and you have some that aren't gonna succeed, and the question becomes, what happens to those folks that aren't part of the success? Side of the ledger and if they've been brought here under the understanding that they were gonna receive treatment and try to receive some assistance and then it didn't work. Some of them ended up right here in Columbus. And I have heard the rumors where people in cities throughout Georgia will put'em on a bus and send'em to Columbus. And I don't think that happens much, but it absolutely does happen. You'll meet people whose home is, uh, on the other side of the state who said, yep, they gave me a bus ticket and let me go. But we do something similar in, in Columbus. We do have folks who will ask them do you have family say, yes, they're in Wisconsin. Do you want to get back to them? I do. Well, then we'll give them a bus ticket to try to get home, not just to go to another community. So if we have an opportunity to reunite them and get them off the streets and get some help from the family. We, we, we do that. Uh, that leads to another challenge because we'll have people say, well, we need to build a village, tiny home village transitional housing. Okay, well here's the problem. Where, where do you wanna put it? Because you have to put it near resources. If you just stick it out there in a field somewhere, these folks have no access to feeding themselves and getting some of the other basic needs that that all of the state for granted. So it goes back to what I said right at the beginning that we want to rush to help. First we have to make sure that we are in fact helping and we're not just doing something, uh, and I hate to say, to make us feel good, but it does. If the gentleman that I talked to that went to Freedom House, man, I. I felt good about that. I didn't do anything. All I did was put him in touch with people who could perhaps change his life.

Phil: 11:50

Yeah. Thinking about homelessness and the related, and often, almost always, not quite always, but so often connected issue of addiction, substance abuse, how do homelessness and addiction issues impact crime in the city?

Skip: 12:07

You know, we've, we've been very, very fortunate in that respect too. We, we had just like most communities and it was around the time that COVID was at its peak, and then you had the defund police movement. You had the lack of respect for police officers. Police officers leaving the force in droves. And, and, um, a lot of that created sort of a perfect storm because you also had the homeless constituency that, were self-medicating, right? They, they, if they did not have mental illness, they knew they were on the streets, so they'd start self-medicating with some of the, the drugs and alcohol. Uh, and when you get dependent on those, you, you're gonna go out there and try to do whatever you need to do to have access. So it does lead to some crime. But we have beefed our police department up almost to full capacity. And our crime numbers have dropped dramatically by overall by about 24% this year and about 12% last year. But going back to what I said earlier, you, you can't enforce your way out of this issue. You've got to, you have to enforce the law, but you also have to try to find ways to get alternative sentencing where people can get some assistance and some help. the challenges and this is the part that we don't like to talk about with regards to some of the individuals that are, are living in the woods and living in encampments, uh, but there are some economic issues that result from that. If you have, if you come in right on one of our main thoroughfares coming into town, there's a private property that we haven't been able to get in touch with the owner where folks have just sort of camped out. And there's unfortunately a lot of these individuals that are involved with any, some type of drug or substance abuse. There's, there's a, a lot of debris around and it, it makes a difference to people coming into our community when that's one of the first things they see. Yeah. And people aren't gonna wanna shop at shopping centers where there are people sleeping on benches and, um. Creating an impediment for people who are going there to spend money and to shop. So it's, it's a very difficult issue to balance because as a government, we care about both groups. So we have to try to find a way to provide positive opportunities for the group that is sleeping on the bench, and at the same time try to encourage people who want to go shop at those places as well.

Phil: 14:37

Yeah. It's

Skip: 14:38

a challenge. It's, it sounds heartless to put it that way. Well, I mean, it's, but it, but it is a, it is a fact. It is that it causes challenges. You

Phil: 14:45

have to, you have a right to, I mean, you have a responsibility to, to try to keep the peace and take care of everybody in the city, not just certain people in the city. I mean, I, I can relate just working at Chick-fil-A in the drive-through, you know, being a manager at Chick-fil-A and. We can't have homeless people coming on the property just asking our, the customers for money, even standing sometimes in, in the parking lot as cars are trying to get into the drive through. I mean, just obstructing things. It just, and so, yeah, you just, you have to find the right way to, to try to keep the balance. And I mean, you have to respect the businesses and also whatever you can do to help those who are struggling. Well, but, you

Skip: 15:25

know, some of those locations, and I'll use Chick-fil-A because you brought it up. Uh, but, uh, I'm so encouraged by the people who want to help. My wife and I were driving down, uh, Bradley Park Drive, saw a gentleman holding a sign, homeless standing by the side of the road. So we went in to get, she wanted a milkshake milkshake machine was broken, but what, it put us there for a reason, we thought. So I said, well, gimme a. Gimme a sandwich and some fries and a drink. And so we pulled around to give it to this guy in a short period of time. It took us to pull around on the other side of Chick-fil-A. He already had a sandwich. Somebody in front of us had beat us to it, and of course we gave it to him anyway and encouraged him to share it with anybody that he was headed back to. But people want to help. Yeah. It goes back to people want to help. Yeah. And, um, I'm no expert on the best way to do that. I've always taken the approach that I'm going, I'm gonna give them, I'm gonna give them the, the food, but I'm not gonna give them cash. Because I worry that it would further force them to sink into a some type of, of, um, addiction.

Phil: 16:30

Yeah. Yeah. And in most cases, they probably already are aware of the 2 1 1 line that they could call, but. Maybe in some cases not, so, just even a mention of, hey, you know, there's a resource in Columbus, you can call 2 1 1 and they can connect you with organizations that can support you. And

Skip: 16:47

yeah, and you learn by trial and error. I mean, I, and everybody looks at their own personal experiences. I we were, um, taking a, our family was going outta town for a while, for a few days. It's a blood oath I swore to my wife that I would do once a year as mayor. And you've kept that promise? I said yes if come close to messing it up a few times, but, um, getting some gas in the car. Young man came up and asked for a dollar. So anyway, I started engaging him in a conversation, got his name and I did it wrong because what I did is I told him, I gave him my card. I said, look, I'm headed out of town, but if you call this lady's name on my card, tell her that you and I talked and and she'll help you.'cause he said he is recently homeless. And then I gave him five bucks. I broke my rule'cause I was, but um, he didn't call. So, in my opinion, what I should have done is offered to take him right there, right then, and maybe just bought him something to eat and, and encouraged him to contact 3 1 2, 1 1. But, you know, we all, we try to help the best way we can. We just need to talk to your organization at Safe House Ministries, talk to some of the others that, uh, work day in and day out and trying to provide the, the appropriate type of help. But, and, and back to what you said, just encourage people to get involved. Yeah. I mean, people say, what can I do man? Just call Safe House. You know, say, Hey, what can I do to volunteer to help out a little bit? There is something that each of us can do, and I stand by my statement that we have way too many churches who do way too good a job for way too many people to not be able to lick this problem.

Phil: 18:30

Yeah, you're right. And we haven't talked a lot about it, but the issue of mental health and mental illness, which really is growing just across the country, but as well in Columbus, what are your thoughts around, obviously it connects deeply with homelessness and substance abuse, but how to maybe tackle that challenge?

Skip: 18:50

I mentioned the, um, community cares program that our fire department is putting together in conjunction with our police chief and, uh, and private, counselors, uh, to try to keep them out of lockup. Maybe if the paramedics there, if they need to administer medication, if they just haven't taken their medications, uh, maybe help'em with that. But that, that is a, just my opinion, that is a, a tougher nut to crack because you've, a lot of these individuals when they're growing up, they have, they have guardians, they have their mom and their dad or somebody that helps assist them. Well, when they hit 18, 20, 21 years old, they're grown. Maybe that caretaker's not around anymore. And now there's no one to remind them to take the medication. There's no one to remind them to go see and check in with a counselor. Uh, so you, if it forces us, I think it's incumbent upon us to be a little bit more understanding, a little bit more patient, try to understand what's going on.'cause if somebody's on the autism spectrum. One of the worst things you can do if they're an adult is put your hands on them. You've got police officers who do a fantastic job, but they're going from call to call to call. So sometimes it puts them in a position where they've gotta make a decision, and fortunately our folks are so good that they'll make the right decision and involve some clinician or somebody from department of Public Health or an organization that will take a look at what the real root of the problem is. But it's, I mean, we, we talked about drug addiction, but the mental health crisis, what one good thing, I think if you call it a good thing that came outta COVID, is I think people talk more now about mental health. They recognize that, um, you know, sometimes the activity that somebody engages in doesn't necessarily mean we need to take'em right to jail. It means, wait a minute, let me ask a few questions. Let me see if we can help'em. Our community policing folks don't go out and arrest people. They don't do that. They ho homelessness is not a, a crime. Unfortunately, some of the activities engaged in by a small group of, of the homeless population results in criminal activity. Now, they're not gonna get arrested for being in an encampment, but if it escalates, and that's always the danger with mental illness then, um, then the officers have to react in a way to protect the public. But, uh, but their first their first thought is to try to identify what's going on. See if there's an alternative to taking these folks in.

Phil: 21:19

Yeah. I think, um, you've had a lot of successes in your two terms as mayor, but I think one, to me, one of the ones that, that I think stands out is the, the, just how we, we struggled for so long with staffing the police force, and we are in a, in a good place right now. So much better. And I think that's a huge win just for the whole city.

Skip: 21:38

Well, and I, I appreciate it, but I, I think a lot of that credit goes to the council who, agreed to raise some of the pay pay level. And it also goes to the leadership in our public safety departments. We have been blessed with people who are leading our police department, fire department, MCP sheriff, all of them that, um. That really care about folks that are very good leaders and have had a lot of success in building back up the numbers.

Phil: 22:09

Yeah. You mentioned something about, uh, when we were talking about mental health isolationism and the fact that after COVID, people are more likely to kind of share. I think that's important. I've, I've had many individuals who've come on to share their stories. A part of many of those stories was that isolationism and feeling alone and, and, uh, recognizing that they had to get past that if they're gonna get help. And the reality is you don't have to be alone. There, there are, even if, as often is the case when you're in the midst of drug addiction and the way that you behave often alienates you from your family and, and so many times. Families write them off. Um, but there are people in Columbus that, that are here to help and love. And you don't have to be alone. You know, you can go to organizations like Safe House Ministries, valley Rescue Mission, salvation Army. There are places that want to help and have the resources with, to help with substance abuse or any other thing. And I, that's, that is something that I think when people realize that they don't have to be alone and they, they don't need to be alone and they shouldn't be alone, that turns the tide.

Skip: 23:21

Yeah, I agree. I, and, and that, you know, we were talking about how it was an eyeopener for me and going to visit some of these encampments. That's one of the things that struck me. I don't know why I made the assumption. You, you just touched on it about, I made the assumption these folks are alone. They don't have anybody that really wakes up in the morning and says, Hey man, I care about you and I just want you to be happy. Every encampment we went to, at least 50% of the folks there are from this area. I said, you have any family? Yeah. Where do they live? Well, they live right across the river in Phoenix City. Or they live right over there in clo And not judging the parents, because as you pointed out, that sometimes it, it reaches a point where there there is nothing they can do except to just pray and pray as hard as they can. But to your point about the isolationism, that's where the 2 1 1 comes in, I think.'cause they can get them in touch with somebody. Look, we, we care very, very deeply about the people that work for the Columbus Consolidated Government. Used to years ago, you worried about their physical health? Right. Make sure they're okay on the job and things are going smooth. But we have really been focusing on their mental health. We have seen, just in the time I've been mayor, I think there's been three individuals that have taken their life because they felt in some way isolated. So we're working, have been working for the last month or so on, really focusing in on how do we take good care of the mental health of the people that are employed. When I think about folks who are living in encampment, there's nobody really thinking about how they need to be taking care of their mental health. So it's, um, it, it is a big challenge and the only thing you can hope for is that when there is an encounter in, in some of our community policing or some of the Safe House staff or one of the other resource centers can interact with them. They can talk them into coming in for an evaluation and. Try to get them involved in some type of program that will help them deal with some of the challenges they're facing.

Phil: 25:19

Yeah. What are your thoughts on what just the average citizen in Columbus maybe can think about as a way that they can help? Just with the challenge of homelessness and people struggling with addiction in our community,

Skip: 25:32

you know, the easiest way, at least in my opinion, is to identify, to contact the folks who already have, as part of their identity, dealing with those organizations call Safe House. Uh, there's a new building going up on Second Avenue for, um, salvation Army that's gonna be dorms for people who are homeless, uh, for temporary housing. You know, you've, you've got churches that are, are trying or, or go to your pastor and say, Hey, I wanna start up some type of homeless task force here within the church. Then you can contact the community policing folks. You can contact Safe House, you can contact all these people. But the one thing you can't do is just sit on the sidelines and say, I wish I knew what to do. There's too many people to ask. There's too many organizations out there. It's hard sometimes to make a commitment, to step out there and, um, and try to make a difference in not just holistically the community, but making a difference in that one individual. I mean, it could be that one guy that, shows up at Freedom House the next day. And you know, it may be that that person that you talk to every day for two months and they don't give you the time of day, and in one day you catch'em when they're a little bit more willing to talk. And you're able to try to learn a little bit about'em and point'em in, in a direction that's gonna change their lives forever.

Phil: 26:53

Yeah. Yeah. You mentioned, uh, I think a, a project in the works, some funding for police officer or social worker. Mm-hmm. Um, and someone else to go out and help with some of the challenges. How do you feel about just a, an element of funding going to organizations in the community that are on the front lines? Do you feel like that would be a help? Or do you feel like, just what are your thoughts on that?

Skip: 27:19

Yeah.

Phil: 27:20

I'm

Skip: 27:21

not sure I understand you.'cause you're talking about if, if there are resources or organizations, so like

Phil: 27:26

a, just a, and I'm not as familiar with the structure of city budgets and how they, they work entirely, but is there a possibility of just a part of the budget going to. Organizations like Safe House Valley Rescue, mission, United Way, who just to say, Hey, this is, this is a money that the city wants to put into preventative efforts. You know,'cause the city obviously has to deal with backend issues. Right. But is there, is there a thought or a discussion maybe of, of money in a preventative way just going to some of those organizations to maybe try to minimize or reduce the cost that's gonna be on the backend?

Skip: 28:06

Yeah. You know, that's always such a, a challenge because the, for city to, to give funding to a 5 0 1 C3, now you're giving tax dollars, taxpayer dollars to charitable organizations that conceivably could be something outside what somebody would've spent their tax dollars on. So what we prefer to do, and what we've seen work modeled through other communities is that you try to create that. Atmosphere where you maybe in kind services or you have some other level of involvement other than financial and then help them get the fundraising aspect going.'cause quite frankly, when we started the 10 year plan to end homelessness and out of that kind of came home for good, which was part of the continuum of care.'cause we had a number of different organizations that all connected. The idea was that the city would pay for the, that organization to be up and running. I think we three or four years. Uh, it wasn't a significant amount of money, but it was, it was a good chunk of money. And then at the end of that time period that would give, that time period would've given the organization the opportunity to build their philanthropic piece, to build their givers and to make it self-sustaining. Because in, in something that is that broad throughout the community. No one funding source is gonna be able to, to really fix what's going on. So the city typically does not get involved in funding that directly, uh, just because there's so many other organizations that we would feel obligated to try to provide funding to as well. But if we can put together some organizations that serve as a connector with the other resources, then uh, then we've, I think that that they have done pretty much what they need to do to try to, to try to lessen the, the challenges that we're facing.

Phil: 30:03

Yeah. Being a connector is a bit, is a, is an important piece to helping. Yep. what are your, just, I don't know, maybe key lessons that, that you have found. Have really worked well when tackling hard issues, like helping with homelessness, addiction, just, you know, from, from a city government perspective,

Skip: 30:24

First and foremost, it's find individuals who feel similarly in collaborating. There's power in numbers. We've got a giving community. The, um, you know, we've been blessed with private companies and organizations that have stepped up and, uh, really done a good job at trying to help fill the gaps. And I think that first and foremost is to try to gather the information and I, not to belittle it, but oftentimes we do have sort of a knee-jerk reaction to a situation and we see something, well, I'm gonna fix that. You may fix. For that one person, but it may have not improved the opportunities for a whole constituency that's in a similar situation or may even have unintentionally and inadvertently caused it a steeper hill to climb. So I think you've got to understand the issue. You've got to figure out, as you pointed out, you've got to go back to those root causes. You can't just, homelessness is a situation that people find themselves in that is just not, that's not a, it's not necessarily just a symptom, it can lead, or the genesis of homelessness starts in areas that you might completely overlook. And that, that to me is the, is the challenge. I've always been a, a big believer in identify people who know a lot more about the subject than I do, like safe out. And, uh, and ask them, what are you doing? Where, where are your gaps? What are your weak points? Maybe there's something we can do from an in-kind standpoint or a participation level at some, at some other level. But I, I think you just look, look to partner and you look for people who are subject matter experts.

Phil: 32:08

Yeah. You mentioned that, that root underlying causes that are often overlooked. And that's another one of the things that I've learned a lot about just in doing interviews and the podcast every week, the root causes that, uh, you know, they, they begin substance abuse and the substance abuse leads to homelessness, but the cause down deep in their life maybe was an unmet need that they just had this desire for companionship and. Ladies that were looking for companionship in the wrong places and it led to bad situations, and then they start taking drugs and try to escape and it just, it's a, an escalating cycle or, or a downward cycle. But there's those root causes that, and that are underlying that if you can't figure out and address those root causes, you're not gonna be effective at helping with the symptoms that result.

Skip: 32:57

Yeah, and you know, you touched on a really good point. You know, you see people start at an early age, you have no idea what drove them to my, to maybe want to get involved in some type of self medication through alcohol or drugs. But if they do that when they're in their early teens or in their teens, then by the time they're 25 or 30, if they live to that age maybe they've realized, yeah, I shouldn't have done that, but I'm in pretty deep. I don't really know where to go. So those are the folks that you really have to, I think, start talking to start that conversation. Because you can't just say, Hey, you gotta get off this, or you gotta stop doing that. You really need to say, tell me, tell me about what's going on. And I mean, are you, are you happy with where you are? And if you're not, how did you get there? Do you, was there one triggering event or was it living in a, an environment that was most kids fortunately don't have to live in. Yeah. So those are the kind of things I think that, um, has to happen. And that's why it is, I sound like I'm a commercial for Safe House, but that, but that's why it's so important to have organizations like Safe House, like Valley Rescue Mission like Open Door, all of these resources because you have to have, if not a case manager, you have to have somebody who the individual begins to trust and who feels like really does have their best interest at at heart.

Phil: 34:15

Yeah. Any last. Important things you wanna bring out, or last thoughts or comments you wanna make around homelessness, addiction, mental health, any of the things that we've talked about.

Skip: 34:27

You know, you've, you already mentioned it. That is find a way to get involved. And, and it, and it, look, there are all different levels of involvement. I mean, if, if you, uh, uh, you just want to go work at Safe House and try to help prepare meals or if you wanna, uh, make a, a financial donation to any one of these private organizations, that allows them to do the kinda work that's necessary to get this number to go down. And, and then, you know, the other piece is, is, uh, job opportunities. Trying to make sure that folks have the same kind of opportunities as other folks. The last thing I'll leave with is this is it's like the world's biggest Rubik's cube, right? It's solvable. It's solvable, but it's going to take a lot of commitment. It's gonna take a very broad base of interest in seeing this, this challenge addressed. And it's, uh, it's gonna take, it's gonna take collaboration and, and, and yes, some funding as well. So I would just urge people that, uh, when you see people on the side of the street holding the sign up, and I know it can be aggravating, but try not to let your first thought be. We need to get those folks off the street and have that first thought be all right. Is there an organization that I can get involved with? Tell'em about this guy and see if they can come help

Phil: 35:44

him. Yeah. That's so good. That's very good. I think I know myself, I've been guilty of this and many of us, we tend to judge too quickly, and when I hear, when I take the time to listen and hear someone's story, I have to recognize that. Where I to have started in the place that they started, I might be worse than what, where they are now. And then when you look at someone, and from where I think I might think they need to be so much farther ahead, but where they are now compared to where they used to be, is so much farther ahead than where they used to be. And, and I need to shift my perspective oftentimes,

Skip: 36:19

and I, and I will remind people that, um, that there are, we, we've talked a lot about the organizations that are available to provide assistance. The individuals have to want that assistance. You can't just descend on them, you know, like, like, like a, a herd of locusts and just we're gonna fix everybody. That's not how it works. Yeah. But we, we have to be, we have to be mindful that it's going to. Take a while. Yeah. With some of the individuals, simply because they've enjoyed living off the grid, they've enjoyed the, no obligation lifestyle and nobody has hassled them about some of the substances that they're, they might be involved with.

Phil: 36:59

Yeah.

Skip: 37:00

So yeah, just cause I, we do get a lot of people say, why don't you help this individual? We, we've tried, we, our folks know'em by first name basis. But some of those individuals aren't ready yet. Yeah. So all we can do is keep, keep doing the best we can to be available with those resources when they are ready and, uh, keep praying.

Phil: 37:19

You're right. Yeah. So often it, it comes down to loving people over a long period of time and just staying there, letting'em know. And when they hit that point, you know, it, it makes me think of the story in the Bible of the son who had. Mouthed off at his father, took his inheritance and ran away and found himself with nothing.'cause all his money was gone, eaten out of a pig trough. And he's, the Bible says that he came to himself and he's like, what am I doing? Yeah. The servants at my dad's house live better. So he had that, he came to that place where he wanted to get better. And, but you

Skip: 37:52

know that, the interesting thing is there's another character in that parable, and that's the son that stayed there, did the right things, and then can't help but be frustrated and upset that all of that energy, all of that, another robe in a ring and a fatted calf went to the sun. That in his mind, betrayed, betrayed the, the guy. So you have to balance. Yeah. It's a big community and we, uh, we want everybody to have the same opportunity.

Phil: 38:18

Yeah. Thank you for your time. Thank you for being here this morning. Well, thank you. I appreciate it. Good to see you again. Yeah. You mind if I close this in a word of prayer? Please do. Father, thank you for your grace. Thank you for just your blessings. Thank you that you've placed me and my family here in Columbus. Thank you for Mayor Henderson and the, the work that he has done just to, to invest and serve this community. I pray you bless him and bless our other city leaders. State leaders. Give them wisdom, give them guidance. Help them with the challenges that they face in the work that they do, but also just in their personal lives. Lord. We know that the enemy tends to want to attack those who are in leadership very toughly. Sometimes I pray that you'd just bless Skip and his family and his path going forward. In Jesus name I pray, amen.

Skip: 39:07

Thank you, Phil.

Phil Shuler: 39:08

We look forward to being with you again next week as we share another testimony about the power and the goodness of God to change lives through Safe House Ministries. if you are someone listening to this podcast that loves to hear these stories of the great things that God is doing in changing people's lives for the better, and if you would like to be a part of that work, please reach out to us You can reach us at 2101 Hamilton Road, Columbus, Georgia, 31,904. You can call us at seven oh six three two two. 3 7, 7 3, or you can email us at info@safehouse-ministries.com.

Microphone (Samson Q2U Microphone)-2: 39:46

Thank you so much for being with us this week for the renew restore and rejoice podcast of safe house ministries, we pray that God will bless you this week. And we look forward to having you back with us again next week for a new episode.