When Patty Mathews sent me a heartfelt card six weeks after my mother's passing, little did we know it would spark a conversation about the layers of healing and the true fabric of support. It's these moments that Patty and I unwrap in this latest episode.
Battling a health crisis can feel like navigating a labyrinth in the dark, but suppose we flip the script and call it a 'health project'? We explore this perspective shift and its profound psychological impact, weighing the balance of intentionality against the randomness of life's challenges.
Closing on a chord of empowerment, Patty and I discuss the vitality of active participation in our own healthcare journeys. We share insights into the growth mindset and the agency we possess, even when the ground beneath us seems to give way. Through candid and caring conversations, we illuminate the path of mindful reactions and control amidst life's unpredictability. Join us for an episode that doesn't just talk about adversity but aims to transform understanding into a narrative of empowerment, proactive living, and the enduring warmth of true friendship.
Buy Me A Coffee: https://buymeacoffee.com/nickiekh
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Website: https://nickiekrommingahill.com/
*Purchase Nickie's book on Amazon! "Things I'm Thinking About; a Daughter's Thoughts on the Loss of Her Mom"
https://www.amazon.com/Things-Im-Thinking-About-daughters-ebook/dp/B083Z1PWKP?ref_=ast_author_mpb
Join my mailing list here: http://eepurl.com/g5hikj
*For speaking inquiries or for questions or comments on the podcast, contact Nickie at healandgrowwithnickiepodcast@gmail.com
Disclaimer: This podcast is for informational purposes only and should not be considered legal health or professional advice.
Nickie is not responsible for any losses, damages, or liabilities that may arise from the use of this podcast.
This podcast is not intended to replace professional medical advice.
When Patty Mathews sent me a heartfelt card six weeks after my mother's passing, little did we know it would spark a conversation about the layers of healing and the true fabric of support. It's these moments that Patty and I unwrap in this latest episode.
Battling a health crisis can feel like navigating a labyrinth in the dark, but suppose we flip the script and call it a 'health project'? We explore this perspective shift and its profound psychological impact, weighing the balance of intentionality against the randomness of life's challenges.
Closing on a chord of empowerment, Patty and I discuss the vitality of active participation in our own healthcare journeys. We share insights into the growth mindset and the agency we possess, even when the ground beneath us seems to give way. Through candid and caring conversations, we illuminate the path of mindful reactions and control amidst life's unpredictability. Join us for an episode that doesn't just talk about adversity but aims to transform understanding into a narrative of empowerment, proactive living, and the enduring warmth of true friendship.
Buy Me A Coffee: https://buymeacoffee.com/nickiekh
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/healandgrowwithnickie/
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/healandgrowwithnickie/
Website: https://nickiekrommingahill.com/
*Purchase Nickie's book on Amazon! "Things I'm Thinking About; a Daughter's Thoughts on the Loss of Her Mom"
https://www.amazon.com/Things-Im-Thinking-About-daughters-ebook/dp/B083Z1PWKP?ref_=ast_author_mpb
Join my mailing list here: http://eepurl.com/g5hikj
*For speaking inquiries or for questions or comments on the podcast, contact Nickie at healandgrowwithnickiepodcast@gmail.com
Disclaimer: This podcast is for informational purposes only and should not be considered legal health or professional advice.
Nickie is not responsible for any losses, damages, or liabilities that may arise from the use of this podcast.
This podcast is not intended to replace professional medical advice.
Hey, hey everyone. I am thrilled that you get to meet my dear friend, Patti Matthews today. Patti Matthews wrote her own bio, then plugged it into ChatGPT and really liked the person that it described, so is using it as her bio from now on. Read on and be intrigued. Patti proudly wears the badge of being a jack-of-all-trades, master-of-none, relishing in the diverse tapestry of experiences that have colored her life. From serving up smiles and food service to captivating audiences as a dancing uncrustable PB&J sandwich, Patty has dipped her toes into countless realms, leaving no stone unturned in her pursuit of exploration. With over three decades of theatrical brilliance in the vibrant landscape of the Twin Cities, Patty has shared stages with local luminaries and legends, including the incomparable Nikki.
Speaker 2:Hey, that's me.
Speaker 1:Her journey as an actress has woven her into the fabric of the arts community, enriching her life with every curtain call. In her current chapter, patti can be found presenting documents at Ancona, title and Escrow, helping people buy and sell their homes, all while embracing the joys of writing, gardening and other creative ventures. Yet amidst this tapestry of endeavors, petty's most profound pursuit lies in the art of not giving a shit about others' opinions, prioritizing the pursuit of joy above all else. Whether she's savoring moments with cherished friends, conjuring confectionery delights in her kitchen or jet-setting on global escapades, petty eagerly anticipates a future filled to the brim with the things that make her heart sing. With a spirit as boundless as her imagination, patti continues to craft her narrative one adventure at a time, embracing the journey with open arms and an irrepressible zest for life. Welcome to Heal and Grow with Nikki.
Speaker 1:I'm your host, nikki Kraminga-Hill. Here we talk about everything Grief, hope, illness, work, family, tragedy, possibilities, fun stuff and not so fun stuff. It's all on the table. Let's take a look at our lives and work to heal and grow together. I'm so glad you're here, hello everyone.
Speaker 1:I am so happy for you to meet my dear friend, patty matthews. Hi, patty, hello. Oh, yay, I'm so glad that you're here. I'm happy to be here, well yay, Well, that's helpful it's.
Speaker 2:You know, it's a symbiotic relationship there.
Speaker 1:How I always like to. Well, since, so far, I'm still just like having my friends over to tell me about their lives. Naturally, let's chat really quickly about how we know each other. Now. We've known each other for years, like we've been in the same theater circles for I think I don't know I remember meeting you probably 20 years ago, maybe oh, probably, yeah, yeah, yeah, theater will do that to you, where you don't remember where you met or how you met, but you feel like you've known each other.
Speaker 1:But but I've known you for a long time, yeah, and, but it was very casual, like, oh, hi, patty, how are you? Yes, hi, nikki, how are you? Bye, right, I feel like we became good friends when you and I've talked about this on the podcast before you just gave me a lovely surprise by sending me a note, sending me a letter in the mail. You just sent me a card and it was six weeks after my mom died. Oh right, yeah, how, six weeks after my mom died, and you, your card, just said I know that it's been six weeks and I'm, you know, I'm still thinking about you.
Speaker 2:Well, I just remember. I can't, I don't even know where I heard it, but I remember somebody talking about the fact that after you lose a loved one or whatever, and the funeral is over and the hubbub is over and you've gotten all these cards and all of this attention and all of that, that, right around the six-week mark, is when, all of a sudden, you start to feel the full impact of what just happened, because you're not in the hubbub anymore, and I know that happened, like when my mom died. It was so overwhelming for a while and then, after it was all done, it was like wow. And so I've tried to, especially when I know that it's a relationship that was really important to the other person. I try to do something like that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, it made a huge impact on me. I talk about it a lot, actually, I bring it up in conversations when, when people reach out to me and say someone passed and I don't know what to do, do you have any advice? And I always say, well, reach out now, but make sure you reach out in a few months. Just acknowledging an acknowledgement of I'm still thinking about you.
Speaker 1:I know that it's been X amount of time, which I'm not great at. I sit and tell other people to do it. I'm not great at it.
Speaker 2:I'm not either. I mean, I love it when I remember to do it, but I am not the best at it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it just it really touched my heart. It really touched my heart for the reasons why you said, like at the first couple weeks, everybody's here and there's food and it's actually I mean, I actually kind of had fun right away. I wasn't like yay, my mom's dead, but I was like people are stopping by. This is so fun, you know, and and no one had any expectations of me, so they'd stop by and I'd be in my jammies and I didn't care. Exactly, exactly, yeah, so there's a, there's a hubbub right away when there's a loss, understandably.
Speaker 2:Yes.
Speaker 1:But at six weeks, at three months, whatever it's like. I'm still dealing with this loss and everyone has moved forward.
Speaker 2:Right, yeah, right. And you, you are stuck in a limbo of almost feeling like you have missed out on six weeks because you've been so in your own world. Yeah, and then, yeah, you look around and it's like, oh, nobody else stopped. No one stopped, my life stopped, but no one else's stopped.
Speaker 3:Yes, and wow, how do I merge?
Speaker 2:back into the freeway of life, Whoa that was great.
Speaker 1:How do I merge back into the freeway of life? Well done, thank you very much. Minnesotans we need to learn how to merge.
Speaker 2:I get so irritated.
Speaker 1:That's a whole other podcast. Right, how to Merge. I get so irritated. That's a whole other podcast. Right, how to Merge. Let's heal ourselves by driving correctly, that's also love?
Speaker 3:That would be gross.
Speaker 1:So I get this card from Pat Now this is 2016. And we had already been doing the Spread Sunshine gang a little bit like on a small scale, right, and maybe it was before my mom died, I don't remember. I'm sorry, but I know. Definitely after my mom died you showed up for a bunch of stuff. You're like how can I help? Let's do this. What about this? And so when we were growing more, we asked Patty to okay, let's just do this together, like it's you, our friend Tim, our friend Sarah, and Paul and I were meeting once a month and planning everything and you have been integral in the Spread Sunshine gang. I know we're sort of pausing right now, but you oh my gosh Well it's Can't do it without you.
Speaker 2:It was such, it's such a good idea, and it's something that I tend to be like a big picture thinker. I love to dream about things and think about, ooh, this would be so cool, and I am really bad at the details, like I will lose interest or lose not lose interest, lose focus.
Speaker 1:Yeah, interesting.
Speaker 2:Once the idea is out there, then my brain goes, oh well, that was good, and I move on, as opposed to okay, how do we make this real?
Speaker 2:So I can make a lot of really good suggestions and I need someone else who will distill them down and then I'll jump back in and be active in it.
Speaker 2:But there's this gap in between. That's why my friend Lainey and I, when we were doing Two Smart Cookies my friend Lainey and I, when we were doing Two Smart Cookies, we were the perfect match for that, because I was the one going ooh, and then we should, and then we could, and then we, and she was the one who was like pencil to paper, going okay, a batch of cookies costs us $3.85. So if we get 27 cookies out of a batch and she was able to, she was the details and the one who would go we can't afford to do that right now, but it's too expensive. So we can't make that extra whatever. Or, you know, and and that's why we made such good business partners is because I'm up here, she's down here with the roots and I'm up here and we pulled each other Because there were times where she was like I don't think so and I'd be like come on, and sometimes it worked.
Speaker 1:Two things. One that's so interesting because I have never picked up on that with you, Because, being perfectly honest, I get really irritated with ideas. Only people Good to know Well, like the ideas are important. We need the ideas, but we also need a way to execute the ideas.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:So I've never noticed that in you at all. So it's just interesting for me, the way that I already know you, to hear this, because I never would have been like Patty's, just an ideas person.
Speaker 2:Well, I never totally drop out of the process. I will still like talk about ways to do it. But there just seems for me to be a gap between I have this great idea and I need to make it real. If somebody can go, here's how you can make it real and like give me a little hook and then pull me in, then I'm golden. It's just like there's a synapse missing for me of how to execute things a lot of the time, fascinating.
Speaker 1:I mean, I understand what you're saying. I just never thought that about you. So funny Because you brought it up. Will you please tell us about Two Smart Cookies? And what it was and what it is now, and how everything happened.
Speaker 2:It is now a distant memory. Two Smart Cookies grew out of one of my best friends, malaney Danky and I were sitting out in her.
Speaker 1:Laney's name is Malaney Laney's name is Malaney, hi, laney, malaney, danky, malaney, danky, that's a cool name, isn't?
Speaker 2:it. Okay, little side note of how I met her. So when the Barnes Noble downtown on Nicollet opened, they were the first Barnes and Noble to have a cafe in it and I was the first manager of that cafe. I did not know this, I was, and so just before we opened I had to interview to get some baristas and staff for it, get some baristas and staff for it.
Speaker 2:And Lainey walked in and she had flaming red hair and she had upper arm tattoos on both arms and she had like a white t-shirt with her sleeve rolled up a little bit. She was wearing Doc Martens and she just oozed cool. She was just so cool and yet one of the nicest, bubbliest persons I've ever met, and so it was that thing.
Speaker 2:You know how, where somebody walks into a room or you meet somebody, you instantly know that you need to be friends with that person. Yes, so I was like, okay, a I don't know if corporate will let me hire her because she's too edgy looking, but B I need to figure out a way to be friends with her.
Speaker 2:Yeah, oh, I love that and, fortunately for me, our store manager went to bat for her, so I was able to hire her, and you know, when I was doing the scheduling- I kind of oh, we were both together it was so weird.
Speaker 2:We worked together almost every day. It was so weird, yeah, so, yeah. So Lainey and I have been friends for a long time and we were sitting out in her front yard one day and she brought up. She said hey, do you want to bake cookies? And it was like yeah, I could go for some chocolate chips.
Speaker 2:You know, and she wasn't talking about just then, she was talking about life like doing a business because, she had had this idea with someone else and that person had to drop out and and I was in from the get-go, it was just like, yes, oh my god, love of baking and love of my friend laney, yeah, combined into something. So that was how two smart cookies was born. Um, we were in business for seven, between seven and eight years um those are some dang good cookies too.
Speaker 1:I remember, because I remember when you opened um, I don't know, was this pre social media? I don't know how I heard about it. No, no, there was. Maybe it was like two smart cookies. That is a brilliant name for a bakery.
Speaker 2:Well, you might have heard about it, because our main focus we weren't as much retail as we were wholesale, as much retail as we were wholesale. And the very first thing that kind of merged my life into Two Smart Cookies was we started doing concessions for theaters and so I was oh, maybe that's how it was I was building on my connections in the theater community to grow our business and so yeah, so it may have been that you went to a show and had one of our cookies or something.
Speaker 1:I just I know that I've had them and they're delicious. Okay, sorry to interrupt, go ahead oh gosh, no so.
Speaker 2:So yeah, we started out baking in a church basement. We rented a church basement kitchen when we first started out, um, and then because we had to be in a commercial space we couldn't be doing it in our homes right and then we moved into a caterer's kitchen and then we moved into. I don't know how many people know about the Black Forest Inn.
Speaker 3:Oh yeah.
Speaker 2:They have a separate building behind the restaurant that is their baking kitchen. Oh, I had no idea. And so we were there for a little while, and then we got our own space on Snelling and Selby in St Paul.
Speaker 1:How long were you at that space? A little over five years, I think Okay so you were in business a couple years and then you got your own space. That must have been like oh my gosh.
Speaker 2:It was daunting but so exciting, because our lovely landlords actually built the space out for us.
Speaker 2:Oh, wow so it was not a commercial kitchen space until they built it that way and it was black and white tiled floors and it looked like kind of an old-fashioned bakery and Terry Lynn Carlson built us these gorgeous counters and yeah, it was awesome. It was awesome. There was something really like I'm an adult. But it's also kind of a dreamy scenario because I'm with one of my best friends baking every day and we're baking cookies, I mean come on yeah so yeah, and we did.
Speaker 2:The majority of our business was like we did concessions for the ordway and children's theater and theater latte da and park square and um you guys were everywhere we actually did, yeah, but we also opened in the middle of the 2007 recession Not really the best time to be opening a business, but yeah.
Speaker 1:So then what happened? Why are you not doing it anymore?
Speaker 2:self-sustaining business. So like the money that we took in paid for, like all the ingredients and utilities and things like that, but we really weren't paying ourselves. Yeah, and there was one day when we were both talking about getting part-time jobs and it was like maybe it's time to think about, yeah, closing, um, because this was a full-time job. This was oh, yeah, because I would go in every day between probably 6 and 6.30. And I was there usually until 5. And yeah, it was constant, and the holidays, forget about it. It was bananas. Oh, I'm sure it was kind of a yeah, but yeah, so we ended up closing. Sadly, we were both really sad about it and it was kind of a blow because I became known as cookie lady in a lot of circles and all of a sudden I lost my identity.
Speaker 1:You're not cookie lady anymore. I'm not cookie lady anymore.
Speaker 2:Well, I still am, because I can't resist bringing cookies wherever I go. I'm not a cookie lady anymore.
Speaker 1:Well, I still am, because I can't resist bringing cookies wherever I go. Patty brings delicious baked goods to your house all of the time.
Speaker 2:You need to be friends with her, I was going to say I don't randomly come to your house and drop them off.
Speaker 1:Okay, good point, good point. I should clarify To her friends' homes there you go, yeah, so you shut down. That must have been challenging.
Speaker 2:It was hard. I mean, I was fortunate in the fact that my friend Emily was pregnant at the time and just before we closed she and I went out to dinner and I had it in my head. I'm like hmm. I wonder if she will need a babysitter. Yeah, and evidently she had the same idea. And we went out to dinner and at the same time it was like so are you going to need a nanny? And she goes, so we're going to need a nanny. Wow.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:It was pretty fortuitous, so we closed. Maddie was born July oh man, 20th or 21st, I can never remember and we handed over the keys on July 31st, wow, and so I kind of seamlessly transitioned into being the nanny of this most marvelous creature named Maddie, and so, yeah, so I mean it was. It was really sad not to have the cookie shop, but I was very fortunate to like go from one kind of dream scenario to another.
Speaker 1:Right. I don't think that things like that happen by accident.
Speaker 2:No, not at all.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think the universe was like all right, we have to take this one thing away, yep, and we're going to give you something else, because, although I've never met Maddie, you've spoken to her often and I know that she's just this really special, special person in your life.
Speaker 2:She's just a ray of sunshine she is. I don't have any kids of my own, and my brother and his family live in Portland, Oregon, so I don't see them very often. But Maddie is my niece for all intents and purposes and she and I have the best time together and I feel very fortunate to have that little nugget in my life.
Speaker 1:How old?
Speaker 2:is she now? She's going to be 10. No, she's. Oh my gosh, I gauged how long the cookie shop has been closed by her age and then no, she's going to be 11.
Speaker 1:Hey y'all, I really want you to get in on this incredible collaboration. We% off your entire purchase at Jensen Natural Jewelry. I have so many gorgeous items from Chris Jensen's collection. I have beautiful mini bead bracelets. I have an anklet. I have a gorgeous necklace that is a slice of carnelian stone. I would love for you to check out Chris's work. It's absolutely beautiful. Purchase a gift for yourself or a loved one Don't forget that Mother's Day is coming up really, really soon and check it out. Jensennaturaljewelrycomcom. Code Nikki 20. That, all of that, was a sidebar. It's a big old sidebar I love it, like I.
Speaker 1:I love it Cause I just, anytime I have someone on, I just learned so much more about them Right, like, oh God, I had no idea that. You know you opened the Barnes and Noble on in downtown and you, you know, and that's know, you opened the barnes and noble on in downtown and you, you know, and that's how you met your best friend and like I love that, um, the and you know a conversation could go any which way on here. So, um, I really wanted to talk to you about your breast cancer journey ah, yes um, um, you've been in remission.
Speaker 1:How many years? 15. 15 years, yeah, 15 years. Um, I know that your mother had breast cancer. Yes, and that was the cause of her death, yes, yeah. So would you mind like walking us through that, like finding out and treatment, and absolutely like how? I mean how you're doing now?
Speaker 2:obviously I realize it's 15 years later, but, oh, you know, once you're affected by cancer, that never, it never completely goes away right I mean, it's um, my one of the first appointments that I had was with the plastic surgeon who was on my case and he is one of the most amazing doctors I've ever met. He's just this beacon of kindness and everything. And he was sitting at a table and I was sitting next to the table and he reached out and put his hand on my arm and he said don't worry, we're going to work on this and in about a year this is all going to be in your rear view mirror. And I held on to that through the whole thing because it was like, okay, all right, a year, I can do a year.
Speaker 2:I can do a year and the image of seeing it in my rearview mirror was like, okay, because it will always be there, but at least it won't be out my front window. So, yeah, I first of all I don't call it my breast cancer journey, because at the time, and still, cancer is a very charged word for a lot of people and so most people didn't want to talk about it and they didn't want to bring it up. Because they didn't want to it's just hard to say that word so I called it my health project.
Speaker 1:My health project. My health project, an incredible way to to view it. You know, and just change, change it up so that it's like a I'm just just learning.
Speaker 2:This is just education well, I looked at it, as you know, when you were a kid and you had to do a project for science class, you know, and you had to make a little diorama and do a little report on the, the, how music affects your fern, or whatever.
Speaker 1:I want to see that how music affects my fern.
Speaker 3:Absolutely.
Speaker 2:And it seems doable. Sure, you know it's like okay.
Speaker 1:I'm going to do a project.
Speaker 2:I'm going to do the project, and then it'll be done, yeah, and then we'll move on from that project. And I feel like words are so charged in every sense of the word, I kind of lost the word there.
Speaker 1:Speaking of words, yeah.
Speaker 2:Speaking of words, but they hold so much power that I think we don't realize sometimes. Sure, and well, I guess okay to kind of give you a little preface to this. So when my mom was diagnosed, it was 1980, probably 1985, maybe something like that, and it was devastating to her, she it it shook her really hard and and it was something and she didn't talk about it much. But I was like I wanted to find out all I could about this sort of thing and so I read Dr Bernie Siegel's books. If you've never read them, it's amazing.
Speaker 2:The first one that he wrote was Love, medicine and Miracles, and he I think he's still alive, but he was an oncologist and he wrote this book. It was just anecdotes about different patients that he had encountered on his journey as a doctor, and there was one in particular where the woman had come into his office. I don't remember what kind of cancer she had, but she was there to talk about treatments and what her options were. There to talk about treatments and what her options were, and so he laid out like three options for her and he kind of described them all and then he went back to talk about the side effects of all of them and she went nope, no, no, I don't want to know the side effects. If you were in my shoes, which one of these would you choose? And then she chose and he went back and checked on her and she never experienced a side effect because she didn't know what they were.
Speaker 2:So she didn't know to look for them, or her brain didn't manifest them, just because she thought, oh, I'm supposed to feel achy, or oh, I'm supposed to whatever feel achy, or oh, I'm supposed to whatever.
Speaker 2:Wow. And the big takeaway from that book for me, when I was reading it back when mom was sick, was that if you take I can't remember, I think he used the word responsibility Basically if you take the reins of your illness and you decide to be an active participant in dealing with it, that it's so much stronger, that you are so much stronger in the process, if you don't just succumb to it and you say, here's what I'm going to do and I get. And I was so excited about the book and I gave it my mom and I'm like, oh, she's going to love this. There's so many great stories and it's so great. And that thing about like taking the reins or taking the responsibility or whatever word he uses, is like in the first chapter. And she started reading it and I happened to be in the room when she got to that point and she snapped the book closed and she said this is not my fault and she threw the book at me.
Speaker 1:Oh, so she just had a completely different interpretation of what she read.
Speaker 2:Exactly. She thought he was saying it's your fault, you're sick, so you need to do something about it.
Speaker 1:Oh goodness, which was not what he was saying. No, no, no.
Speaker 2:And she had a tough time with it. She, she fought it, but not in a way like empowering fought it, she was just fighting it, just fighting. Yeah, she was struggling she was. She struggled a lot yeah and I just remember thinking gosh, if that ever happened to me I don't September, and I felt I was putting my seatbelt on in the car.
Speaker 2:And all of a sudden it was like my chest hurt and I'm like what the heck is this? Because it hadn't before, there was nothing, and I was due to have my annual physical and mammogram and stuff like that, and so I just thought oh, I'll have her check it out. And so I went and did the mammogram and typically you get the note in the mail that says all clear or whatever.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I got a phone call and they were like there's something on the mammogram. Will you come back to do like a magnification screening?
Speaker 1:I'm like okay.
Speaker 2:Keep in mind my boobs were really tiny. There wasn't a lot Mammograms hurt a lot when you have very small boobs, Anyway. So I went back for the magnification screening and I didn't tell anybody about this.
Speaker 1:I was just kind of Were you worried about it at all.
Speaker 2:When I got the call about the magnification I was a little concerned, but it was like whatever you hear stories about people, it's like whatever you know you hear stories about people, it's like they moved ever so slightly and there was a blur on the image and so I was like, don't worry until there's something to worry about. So I did that, and the next day I was actually at the cookie shop and I was actually out at the front with a friend talking to them and the phone rang and Lainey came out and said the phone's for you. And I'm like, oh okay, and so I just excused myself and went back. And the woman on the other end I can't imagine being the person who has to make these phone calls.
Speaker 2:But she said, yeah, you have invasive ductal carcinoma. And I went, wait, excuse me. And I went, wait, excuse me. And I just I kind of listened to what they were saying and I had a follow up, something that they scheduled for me and I'm like okay, and I put the phone down and I went out and continued my conversation with my friend until she left and it was just like okay, all right, I can't, I've got stuff to do, I can't let this affect me right now.
Speaker 2:But yeah, it was freaky. I still remember like kind of not believing it was happening, right, but I was fortunate in the fact that I had this amazing team of doctors put together for me. Piper Breast Center is where I went for my mammograms and evidently this is what they do, so they find a surgeon and an oncologist and a plastic surgeon and they put together a team for you. Because I didn't have to do any of that. They just said here's your meeting with the surgeon, this is your surgeon and this is your oncologist and this is. I was like thank you, because you know you talk about being thrown into like a miasma whirlpool. It was just like okay, I have no idea what to do next.
Speaker 2:Right Because my mother never shared her journey with me and so I knew she went to doctors. I didn't know that there was a separate surgeon and a separate. You know, I thought they were all Well, I didn't know. Surgeon and a separate. You know, yeah, I thought they were all well, I didn't know. And I think I had the best team possible I had. What I know Dr Brodsky was like the number one or one of the top surgeons in the country.
Speaker 2:People would come from all over the country to see her and I loved her because she walked into my appointment and she was very stern, like very Doctor, very doctor. Yeah, I mean, it was just one of those things where it was like, oh okay, so this is she's. She's a scientist, she's a surgeon, she's a whatever. And of course I had brought cookies with me, of course, for the, for the office staff and for her and stuff. And so she walked in and we had our consultation and she said you know, put on the gown, we're going to do the exam. And she left the room and so I put on the gown and I was sitting there and she walked back in and she had the biggest grin on her face and she was like, did you bring cookies? And it was like, oh, I see you are.
Speaker 2:You know you put on the doctor face for the people who need the doctor face, but you are, and she was great and she talked to me through everything and like I just knew that that piece was going to be fine, it was gonna be awful you know, but she was like so here's what I think, and I opted to have them both taken, because it was like the options were to take one the breast that had the cancer in it and then take my chances that maybe it wouldn't come back in the other one, or just take them both and I'm like well, first of all, symmetry, if you seriously, because if they reconstruct one it's not going to look the same, and so then they have to do some stuff, and the other one and it's like take them both and they'll both look the same.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I guess. Yeah that's. I mean, that was, that was.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that makes sense that was how I thought about it. Yeah, I was like nobody's using them, so you know whatever, and so. So that piece was done. And then I met with Dr Miliore. And but you, the same time, then the plastic surgeon comes in and he puts in the expanders.
Speaker 1:Okay, so you have to know going into your mastectomy whether or not.
Speaker 2:Well, you don't have to. I mean, this is something that you can change your mind down the road. It's just if you have a strong feeling one way or the other. If you want to do reconstruction, it's easier because they're already in there Right.
Speaker 2:And you don't have to go through another, a second surgery for that. So they put in the expanders at the same time. Which are these things that when you look at them they look kind of like a whoopee cushion and they have a little port on them that you can access from the outside and inject saline into them to blow them up like a water balloon? And this is probably more information than you thought you were going to get.
Speaker 1:This is really interesting to me actually. You thought you were going to get this. Is really interesting to me actually.
Speaker 2:So yeah, so they put these in and then they start the expansion process.
Speaker 1:And it's. I can't remember how often. I feel like it was every three weeks or something like that.
Speaker 2:You go into the doctor's office and they use a little magnet on the outside of your skin to find where, because it might move around to find where the port is. And then this is fascinating I've never had so many instances of having my shirt off in public.
Speaker 1:You mean, you had a lot before this.
Speaker 2:I had none before this, so well, I mean, you know changing clothes during shows and things like that, but it grew to the point where it was like I didn't even think about. Like I walk in and take off my shirt.
Speaker 3:That was just you know yeah, it was just.
Speaker 2:That was the process for almost a year. But I would sit there and there'd be a nurse on one side and the doctor on the other and they both had these huge syringes full of saline and they'd be. You know, they had to do it slowly, and so we'd be talking and talking and I could look down and my boobs were growing in front of my face.
Speaker 1:It was sort of like a puberty.
Speaker 2:but Sort of like one of those dolls. You know that like you pull their arm, whatever.
Speaker 1:They should have those like to show you. Okay, let's look on the little dolly. This is what it's going to look like when you get the saline put into your breasts.
Speaker 2:But what they don't tell you is so the purpose of the expanders is to stretch out the muscle and the skin, because when they put the implants in well, this was back then they can do it under or over now, but they usually put them underneath your pectoral muscles, and so you can't just put something big underneath there without stretching it. So it would stretch it and then it would sit and then they'd stretch it a little bit more Could you feel the expanders in there? Oh God yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, what they don't tell you is that when they are filled up, they are solid. So if somebody hugged me when I had them, it was like hugging a brick wall it was, and people would go what, what is going on with you.
Speaker 1:So, do you get to pick the size of your breasts?
Speaker 2:You do you just keep looking and it's like I think we're done more. Yeah, truly, that's. That's exactly what it is. There's a great book, a little like almost cartoon book, that was written by a Minnesota woman I feel like she was down near Rochester or something like that and it's called Bigger Boobs and Better Hairstyle and there's one panel of a cartoon where you see like the inside of a doctor's office and the door, and then you see these two humps like right on the doorframe and she's, and the caption underneath is something like I think.
Speaker 2:I think we're done now or something you know, like the boobs are entering before you do so. Okay, that's big enough that's big enough, so yeah, so that whole process was surreal I'm sure very surreal, um, but then I did like two or three expansions and then I had to stop because I had to do chemo, because, um, when they did the mastectomy, they, they sample some of your lymph nodes okay to see if it is spread.
Speaker 2:Yes, and it had a little bit into some of the nodes, so they do preventative chemo essentially. They do this course of chemo that goes through and it basically kills any rapidly dividing cells. Wow, and because cancer is rapidly dividing.
Speaker 3:Right.
Speaker 2:But the reason and this was a trivia thing that I learned the reason a lot of people lose their hair is because hair follicles are also rapidly producing cells. Oh well, that makes a lot of sense, and so that's they shut it down. Yeah, when you do chemo it shuts down all those rapidly producing cells.
Speaker 1:So that's why people lose their hair did you lose your hair?
Speaker 2:I did I was completely bald um, but you also lose the hair on your arms and your legs, all hair everywhere so you don't have to shave, which made no having to wash your hair or shave your legs. Showers were instantaneous.
Speaker 1:Wow, you saved five minutes.
Speaker 2:And a few gallons of water.
Speaker 1:Exactly, it's eco-friendly.
Speaker 2:It's also cold. I was going through this in the winter and you don't realize how much your arm hair keeps you warm.
Speaker 1:Right, you never think about that because it doesn't look like anything.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it provides a lot of warmth let me tell you Wow, so you were very cold I was very cold and I slept with a hat on because you know nothing up here to keep your head warm too. Yeah, that was a surreal experience too, because I started chemo and my oncologist oh my God, who's a whole other story lovely, hysterical, crazy man I'll tell you another story about in a minute. When we had our consultation, he's like yeah, about two weeks after you start chemo is when you'll probably start to lose your hair, and I'm like so what if I don't want to lose my hair, Does everybody?
Speaker 2:And he said well, I think it's eight or 9%, don't? I'm like I'm going to be part of that eight or 9%? Yeah, I didn't. Yeah, that didn't work, but it was weird because I had gone home. I'd gone down to Arkansas to visit my dad for. Thanksgiving and in the shower I was washing my hair and went okay, that's a lot more hair than I usually use, so I wore a hat for the rest of the time. Yeah, came home and I'm like I wonder like how fast I'm gonna lose my hair.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And I took my little trash can in my bathroom and I put it in the sink and I started running my hands through my hair and after about five minutes of doing that, I was bald. Oh my gosh. It was just, and you know what it was ready to go yeah, as surreal as it was and as much as I didn't want to lose my hair. I didn't want it. I would rather have done that than have it come out in clumps and be clumpy.
Speaker 2:It was like all except one little stubborn patch like right in the back, and so when laney got home from her mom's house from thanksgiving, I made her shave it off yeah um, but yeah, yeah, it was, it was weird were you ever?
Speaker 1:were you ever afraid that you might lose your life like your mom did?
Speaker 2:I'm sure I had moments like that. I don't remember them. Yeah, I was pretty determined from the get-go.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Like, for example, using the word health project Right, and also I didn't tell many people.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Because I wanted to very much curate the energy that was coming at me.
Speaker 1:I love that. Say that again. You wanted to.
Speaker 2:I wanted to curate the energy that was coming at me.
Speaker 1:So important.
Speaker 2:I didn't want naysayers, I didn't want. I wanted as little negativity. I wanted to disturb things as little as possible. I worked the whole time.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Much to Lainey's chagrin. Yeah, she brought me home from the hospital after my mastectomy. I wasn't supposed to drive for a week.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:She knew me better than the doctor. So she got me all settled in and she went and she wiggled my keys at me and went see you later and she took my keys that's one smart cookie, yeah. She didn't give them back to me until the doctor said I could drive again.
Speaker 1:That's a good friend.
Speaker 2:Oh yes and Dang it um, but yeah, so I was very. I made a lot of very intentional steps during that process, and I do believe that that is why I had minimal side effects yeah and why I'm sitting here now. Um, and I just was so intentional and I wish that I had that drive to be that intentional. Now, like once the quote journey was over, that dropped off, and it's like why that was so. It was so pivotal and it was so important to me. Why did I just let it kind of drift away.
Speaker 2:I do do it sometimes, but yeah, it was. So I think that that stopped me from dropping into the worst case scenario, thinking for me Right right. It was something that, yeah, it took a little bit of practice, but once I was practiced at it it was easy to just say health project and I made it clear to the people that I was telling and that was close to that. No questions were taboo. They could ask me about anything, Because I also think that's important.
Speaker 1:I think cancer we don't want to talk about it.
Speaker 2:It's so secret, which was why that people are so scared of it, Whereas, if you know, I had people like like you're asking me now. Did it hurt? Did you know? Did you have to make this decision? What was it like? I wanted people to ask me those questions so that they could say, oh, okay, Well, yeah, it sucked. I'm not gonna it less scary for you, or maybe the general you.
Speaker 1:Yeah To say, to be able to talk about it just frankly and openly. And I think it makes it less scary for your friends to be able to just say just ask whatever they want to ask.
Speaker 2:Absolutely. The fear of the unknown is one of the biggest obstacles to life in general, for everybody is, we all fear the unknown and the more we can shed light on just everything if people can be open about yeah, it hurt a lot when I broke my leg and this was the road you know. Or yeah, it hurt when I had this surgery, but I found that if I did this it made it easier. And then all of a sudden it's like oh, it's not taboo.
Speaker 1:Right, I don't have to be terrified of this.
Speaker 2:I have resources.
Speaker 1:I have people I can talk to.
Speaker 2:And I also didn't want people avoiding me because they didn't want to bring it up or didn't know what to say, but I really didn't want to be treated like a sick person. That was my big thing up.
Speaker 1:I had to take steroids before chemo treatments.
Speaker 2:And so I went to pick my medicine up from the pharmacist and very kind person, nothing against this person, it was just where I was at with the whole thing. They hand me the thing you know and then they say, say, do you have any questions for the pharmacist? And I was like no and they went. I hope you feel better with a little head tilt or this, this will really help, or something like that and I went, thank you, and I ran back to my car and I just burst into tears in the parking lot, because it was like they see me as a sick person.
Speaker 2:I've been striving so hard not to be a sick person. It's like, well, people know you're sick, you're sick, you are a patient, you are sick, you are sick, right. But yeah, it was just one of those days where I was very, very aware of the fact that I was trying so hard to hold it together and it just wasn't working. But yeah, like and people like my oncologist were, Dr Bloom is a character he used to be a stand up comic in New York City.
Speaker 1:See the guy that has the one man show.
Speaker 2:Yes.
Speaker 1:Patty and I have talked about this man before.
Speaker 2:Yes, go ahead. He is a New York Jewish comic. Stand-up comic former stand-up comic and I remember when a couple of my friends who are nurses heard that he was going to be my oncologist, they're like ooh. And I said what? Oh, there are some people who don't. He's, he's, he's different. I'm like okay, well, you know, the other two were great. I'll go, and if I have to change, I'll change.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:This man was a godsend in this process. He was similar to Dr Bratsky. He came in and he was a nut job, but he could be serious when he needed to be, so he was kind of the flip side of her. One of my favorite stories is when you are going to go through cancer treatment. They usually do a full body scan, so it's like putting you in a scanner like a paper scanner and it goes down one side. It looks like a big tanning bed.
Speaker 2:The scanner goes down your back and then over your front, so you can see the whole body and they can see if there's cancer anywhere else.
Speaker 2:And so it comes up with two images of you, the front and the back of your skeleton. And so I had my appointment after the scan and he was telling me it was all clear and that was great. And he said do you want to see? I'm like yeah, absolutely. So he turns the monitor to me and there's the two. And he goes I'm like, yeah, absolutely so. He turns the monitor to me and there's the two. And he goes you want to do something else? And I'm like okay, and he overlaid the images with just a little bit off and he was like here's Patty dancing, and he'd go the front and back and the front and and it was like, oh my, I love this man.
Speaker 1:But I can see where people, someone might be like dude nuh-uh.
Speaker 2:Well, because for a lot of people it's not a laughing matter, right? They want to know that their doctor is serious. Yeah, yeah, and he is. Yes, like when he was, he would write out everything he would tell me, and I still have all of the notes and the first one he was. He would write out everything he would tell me and I still have all of the notes, and the first one. He says you have cancer, shit.
Speaker 2:And then wrote down all of the things that we were going to do, all of the chemo treatments and what they would do and how they would do it, and I had the good fortune of seeing him for the next almost 10 years, you know follow-up, visits and stuff like that and um he is now. He's not a practicing oncologist anymore, but he is working at the med school, teaching like bedside manner and and things like that and it's like there's no better man that I can think of than injecting at least a little bit of that into your bedside manner.
Speaker 2:Cause he was. He was great, my whole team was there Another reason why I am still sitting here and and had such an easy time of it, I think.
Speaker 1:That's what an incredible story. You know, like I love that you, it was me. While you were talking, I was thinking about this book that I love and I gosh, what is it called? I think it's called just um mindset by Carol Dweck, and it talks about fixed mindset and growth mindset and how having a growth mindset is so important and that's and that's what you did for yourself and that's that's what your team did for you, and what a difference that makes in your, just in your, in your health project, in your journey and in your, in your journey and and in your, even in your recovery and remission.
Speaker 1:Just like I'm, I'm going to be okay. And here are the steps that I'm going to take in order to be okay. And as opposed to a fixed mindset where you're like, well, the stats aren't good and my mom died from this, so you know it's and the book that you were talking about that you gave your mom, it's not, you didn't do anything to get sick, that's not your fault. No, you know, but we do have a choice in how we're going to proceed with that information.
Speaker 2:Well, and I think the biggest takeaway for me is that you have to be an active participant in your life period. Right, you can be passive, you can just let life wash over you, and I'm going to tell you right now that I don't think you'll have a very good time of it most of the time have a very good time of it most of the time, but just to even make a few decisions about how you want to handle something or how you want to move through something is.
Speaker 2:It makes. I shouldn't say it will. It made me feel like I had a say. This wasn't something that was being done to me. I was a participant in it and I could at any time go. You know what? Chemo's uncomfortable. I don't like it, I'm going to stop, you're going to be done. Right, you could have. That was my choice. I could have said Dr Bloom is too wacky for me.
Speaker 2:I need another doctor, Right, you know. And so and I think that's another thing that was different between me and my mom is my mom very much respected her doctors as the authority and didn't feel any ability or permission to question it.
Speaker 2:So whatever they said, and again, she didn't talk about it, so I don't know what they told her. I don't know if they gave her options for her treatment. But, especially in today's healthcare systems and things like that, you need to advocate for yourself. Or, if you don't feel like you can do it, you need to get a healthcare advocate, and they are part of the system, so you can request one if you need one, if you are in a journey like this and all of that, and it's just somebody where you can say in a journey like this and all of that, and it's just somebody where you can say this is how I'm feeling about how I'm being treated, right, and I don't like it, but I don't feel strong enough or comfortable enough to say it to the doctor, right, and so they'll go fine, and they will find you another doctor and they will terminate this one and they will instate you with you know and so, or?
Speaker 2:and they will terminate this one and they will instate you with you know and so, or take a husband or a wife or a friend or somebody along with you who can be an extra set of ears and go. You know what? I was watching you when the doctor was saying that you don't look comfortable with that decision. Is that really what you want? You know and so? Because it's just, it swirls around you and it happens so fast sometimes that you need to be able to step away and go, you know, thank you for telling me all my options. Can I go away and think about it for a minute?
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Because, unless you're bleeding out on the side of the road, Do you have that time to think? A day, 24 hours, isn't going to make that much of a difference. So just being an active participant, I think, is one of the biggest takeaways from that health project of mine, because I don't want to be somebody who life happens to. I want it to be my life, I want it to be my choice as much as possible, you know, even though there's not, that's not always possible.
Speaker 1:But that is. That's beautiful you. You cannot see me people, but I'm. I have tears in my eyes, just like yeah, we get to choose to be an active participant in our lives, no matter what life throws at us. You know there's not a lot that we can control, but there are sometimes things that we can and when we're offered that opportunity, we need to embrace it.
Speaker 2:And yeah, Well, because they always say you know you can't control what's coming at you. What you can control is your reaction to it, and if you're mindful in the reaction and paying attention to how you really feel in a situation, it seems to go much better for you if you can acknowledge that and not just let it go. Oh well, whatever.
Speaker 3:Here we go.
Speaker 1:Thank you. Thank you so much for coming in and telling us such a personal story. I really appreciate it, Just like taking us step by step and because I don't know how this stuff goes, you know none of us do until you're until you're tossed into the middle of it. None of us really do. So I just appreciate you just sharing all that with us.
Speaker 2:Absolutely. Thank you. Probably more information than you'll ever need to know.
Speaker 1:No, I want all the deets.
Speaker 2:Well, like I said, no questions, taboos.
Speaker 1:All right. Thank you so much, Patty, for being with us today and, as always, everybody thanks for healing and growing with me this week.
Speaker 3:This podcast is not intended to replace professional medical advice.