The New Loyalty Playbook: Global Status Commercialization with Loyalty Status Co

Think points are the prize? In travel loyalty, status is the real currency - the fast lane, the lounge, the upgrades, and the ease that comes from knowing you’re looked after. In the second episode of our Loyalty Series, we sit down with Erin Murray, CMO of Loyalty Status Co, to explore why many loyalty programs are now more valuable than the airlines that run them and how the smartest brands use status to shape behavior, lift yield, and keep their highest-value travelers loyal.

We follow Erin’s 25-year career across Air Miles, Points, and now Loyalty Status Co to reveal what truly motivates frequent travelers. You’ll hear how Status Lift reduces the need for painful “status runs” by letting near-qualifiers buy up at exactly the right moment. And how Status Match acquires proven high-value flyers the moment a competitor falters. Just look at Air France: after BA’s program changes, they matched 4,000 elites who went on to book 17,000 flights, many in business class. That’s the playbook: spot the moment, validate the traveler, deliver benefits that matter, and watch the revenue follow.

We dig into how personalization is entering a new era. With richer data and AI, brands can detect intent fare shopping, route exploration, requal risk and deliver one-to-one offers that feel timely and relevant. Choice benefits are rising too, giving members flexibility to select what they value most, whether that’s e-upgrades, guest lounge access, or softer thresholds in slower travel years. And of course, co-brand credit cards continue to fuel the commercial engine, turning everyday spend into aspirational trips and steady program revenue. Beyond airlines and hotels, we also look at cruise and casino, two verticals where modern status design can unlock fresh monetization and deeper engagement.

If you lead loyalty, revenue, or partnerships in travel, this conversation is a masterclass in building programs that feel personal, deliver real commercial impact, and keep your most important customers close.

For more information about Loyalty Status Co, please visit https://www.loyaltystatus.com/. 

👉 Listen to The New Loyalty Playbook: Global Status Commercialization Now

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Chapters

• 0:00 Loyalty Programs Outvalue Airlines
• 0:27 Series Setup And Guest Intro
• 1:28 Conference Highlights And Host Travel
• 3:20 Season Roadmap And Themes
• 3:31 Aaron’s 25 Years In Loyalty
• 5:36 Why Loyalty Drives Travel Economics
• 8:49 Inside Status Match And Status Lift
• 12:06 What Actually Moves Traveler Behavior
• 14:39 Starting A Loyalty Program The Right Way
• 17:04 Points vs Status And Real Benefits
• 19:32 Personalization At Scale With AI
• 22:48 Credit Cards As Loyalty Revenue Engines
• 26:16 Partnerships, Coalitions, And Co-Brand Cards
• 29:04 Pitfalls And The Value Exchange Problem
• 32:18 Status Perks That Truly Matter
• 35:51 Airline Trends And Choice Benefits
• 39:00 Results: Air France Wins BA Flyers
• 42:02 Fraud Prevention And Verified Elites
• 44:14 Beyond Air: Cruise And Casino Potential
• 47:08 Rapid Fire: Favorites, Perks, Gear
• 51:10 How To Connect And Closing

Transcript

SPEAKER_00: 0:04

Loyalty programs are often more valuable than the brand itself. So if you think about United, AA, the market cap of their loyalty program is higher than it is for the brand itself. So they're making more money off of selling points and miles and marketing out to their consumers than they are selling seats.

SPEAKER_02: 0:27

Hello everyone, welcome back to Travel Trends. This is your host, Dan Christian, and we're about to begin part two of our deep dive into loyalty. We had our episode one last week with Oliver Ross from KM Malta Airlines. And today we're going to hear from Aaron Murray, the CMO of Loyalty Status Quo. And next week, we're going to have the CEO of Citizen M. I was very keen to have a hotel and then airline and a true expert, which you'll hear from Aaron today, who also happens to be the sponsor of this series, which is partly coincidental because I was just genuinely keen to actually have her on season six. And here we are in episode 12 with this partnership and loyalty status quo for those of you who are just coming to be familiar with them. They are the team that is rewriting the playbook on status program management, and they really are the global leaders in status commercialization, and they are the team behind the award-winning status match platform. So they work with airlines, hotels, and even retailers to turn status into real value. For more information, check out loyaltystatus.co. Now I just want to give a little bit more context to today's conversation and where I find myself because I've just arrived back from Las Vegas. I saw many of our listeners, colleagues, and friends at the Focus Right conference in San Diego last week, which was truly extraordinary. We recorded more than 30 interviews. Thank you again to Pete, Gene, and the team for inviting us to be a key part of the event. We certainly looking forward to continue collaborations in 2026. And that episode will be out in the next two weeks. So look for our Focus Right spotlight of 2025. And right after that conference, I flew from San Diego to Vegas and I was able to join the Rail Bookers conference with my friend Frank Marini. What an extraordinary company and culture. I recorded a special episode meeting with their executive team, which will also be out shortly. And I look forward to doing more rail in 2026 as well. So thanks again to Frank and the team. And then just to wrap up, I then spent the weekend exploring a little bit of Utah, and I had the most extraordinary RV experience with Blacksford. They focus on luxury and premium RVs. And I had four nights in the desert and managed to, on my birthday, e-bike Zion of a national park, which was one of the most beautiful ways I could imagine spending the day. And then later on drove to Las Vegas and went to the sphere to watch The Wizard of Oz. And I posted about this on LinkedIn because it was just such an amazing day, really marked by just two complete extremes of the types of experiences and reminded me of why I love this industry and why I'm so passionate about having these conversations, because we're actually going to do something on RVs and we're going to have the head of the sphere joining us in next season as well. So lots of inspiration coming out of those two events and the time away. And I just want to say thanks for all the birthday wishes that people extended. It really does mean a lot. And so thank you. I'm back. I'm looking forward to being in Toronto for the next few weeks as we record the rest of season six. We've got not only the loyalty series to finish, but we also have a sustainability series coming up and aviation and many other captains of industry profiled as well. But let's get into the conversation. I'm really keen to share with you guys today with Aaron Murray, the CMO of Loyalty Status Quo. Welcome, Aaron. Great to have you on Travel Trends. Thanks for joining us.

SPEAKER_00: 3:41

Thanks for having me, Dan.

SPEAKER_02: 3:42

For sure. I was thrilled for us to bring this series together in season six. Obviously, you and I have known each other for a couple of years now. We had a chance to talk at a Tech TO event. Both of us shared a passion and a background for loyalty, and you have a great deal of expertise in this subject area. So not only not only was I keen to finally bring a loyalty series to life, but obviously it's been fantastic to bring it together in partnership with you to be able to do an air episode and a hotel episode, and now bring you in to kind of round out our loyalty series, the first iteration of us actually approaching loyalty on travel trends. So thank you for the partnership. But I I also I I want you to give everyone a bit of an overview of your background. You have such an impressive uh career in the loyalty space. So tell us a little bit about how you got into loyalty in the first place.

SPEAKER_00: 4:30

Oh, great. Um, yeah, so it has been a long career loyalty, 25 years. I started at Air Miles Agency right out of right out of university. And Air Miles, for those who don't know, it's the largest or was the largest retail coalition loyalty program in Canada. So I eventually moved over to their in-house team, uh, leading their segment marketing team and starting their gold, like rebranding their gold program and launching their Onyx program. Uh so really exciting uh early days experience in at AirMiles. Uh and then I moved over to Points, uh, where I spent 10 years in marketing. And Points is the e-commerce platform, loyalty e-commerce platform. They're best known for helping brands sell points and miles. So most people that are our avid uh loyalty program members would be very familiar with their offerings. Um and then finally, moved over to Loyalty Status Quo, where I'm the chief marketing officer. And uh yes, it's been an exciting uh few years here.

SPEAKER_02: 5:40

Yeah, well, and what's so interesting is that uh, as Aaron knows, we come guess past like ships in the night at points. I was there before you, and I I learned so much when I was at Points about the loyalty space, and you clearly had the background with Air Miles, which for many people in North America and especially in Canada are very familiar with the AirMiles program. And then points.com, as that was known for a long time before it was acquired by Plusgrade, and you know, there that business has continued to evolve. But the interesting thing with your background for me was like Air Miles and Points, those are two of the largest organizations in this space, and there's a great deal of expertise that someone like yourself would get working in purely in loyalty and then how loyalty works in travel, which is why I really wanted to bring this series together because it's something that we've not touched on, and yet it drives such uh an it plays such an important role in consumer behavior with not only status but also collecting points and how it all works. And there's this is as you know, a subculture unto itself with people who are in the world of points. So t tell us a little bit about that uh that context, because obviously I'm familiar with uh some of the um uh some of the blogs, and obviously there's like the points guy, and like but tell us a little bit about the world that you live in and the um the types of companies that exist in this space.

SPEAKER_00: 7:00

Yeah. Well, I mean I mean, loyalty is immensely important in travel. I mean, retail as well, but talking about travel particularly, uh loyalty programs are often more valuable than the brand itself. So if you think about United, AA, the market cap of their loyalty program is higher than it is for the brand itself. So they're making more money off of selling points and miles and marketing out to their consumers than they are selling seats. So when you think about the role that loyalty plays in the in the overall travel ecosystem, it's incredibly incredibly important. Um and what's really interesting is that that's that's relatively new learnings. Like it's I think anybody that were worked uh primarily in loyalty understood the importance, but it wasn't until COVID and brands started to have to put up their loyalty programs as collateral that that there was this real world-wide recognition that wow, these programs are um critically important to the success of the brand. Um they're not just marketing cost centers, they are true revenue generating machines.

SPEAKER_02: 8:11

Yeah, and that's interesting because that came up in my conversation with Oliver from KM Multa Airlines, and we were talking about the valuation of these programs to exactly your point, and then how it does shape consumer behavior and you know with credit cards and um and so when I started at points, one of the uh Randy Peterson was kind of the big deal with Inside Flyer, and everyone was you gotta know Randy, Randy's, and that's before the points guy came along, and there's now even new startups that are doing interesting things with points, and um uh and obviously what you're doing at status match we'll get into is really uh fascinating. I guess that's where for me when you think about this industry, it's not it's not only massive, but it's continually evolving. So um so on that topic, let's talk about loyalty status quo and uh and status match. And I know status match is the product that you guys have built, and loyalty status quo is the company, and people heard a bit about that in my introduction. But I think even uh even in Oliver, he was talking about how he worked and collaborated with you guys. But I think it would be great for our audience to understand a bit more about um who you guys are and what you guys do. So, would you mind give us a bit of an overview of the organization?

SPEAKER_00: 9:15

Yes, of course. Uh so I'm sure you're as a frequent traveler, you're very familiar with status. So, status program is you think about the standard loyalty program, and then within every standard loyalty program, there is a status program. So tiers that members can climb up and climb the ranks from silver to gold to platinum based on meeting certain milestones. Um, often these programs have been sort of set and forget while the standard loyalty program evolves around it. The actual status program, the program that's designed to engage and grow uh a brand's best customer hasn't really evolved at the same pace. So our focus is on helping brands better leverage these programs, optimize these programs, and grow uh members throughout, uh grow the value of members within these programs.

SPEAKER_02: 10:10

So this is the interesting thing, and this is where I'm intrigued about kind of both sides of the equation, which is they, you know, there's the points and miles side, which a lot of people obsess over. Uh, but the part for me, as people have heard me mention in this series, is status. Status is so important to me as a frequent flyer because I want the express lines in the airport, I want the lounge option, I want to know that I can have an extra bag or a dedicated phone number. For me, it's a hundred percent about having that status and everything that comes with it. And the part I found fascinating about your business, because I didn't know, I wasn't familiar, it wasn't until we met a couple of years ago, and I learned, you know, we realized we have so much in common and we worked at different places, and then what you're working on now, I was like, this is at the right place at the right time when people were coming back from the pandemic, and I I was exactly in the situation where I was super elite with Star Alliance and had been for three years and never wanted to lose it, and then the pandemic happened, and it was grandfathered for a year, and then partially for the next year, and then I lost my status. Like I lost that top-tier status, and I will get back there uh at the end of this year, I will be super elite for next year, and I cannot wait. But the idea of losing that status is like was for me like one of those things that keeps me up at night that was like, I can't, uh I don't want to go back to the life that I knew before. And so, and neither does my family. They love coming to the airport with me because of my status, right? So tell everyone about the yeah, this concept of status match, the idea that you can maintain your status or switch to other programs. I think it's such a clever concept.

SPEAKER_00: 11:37

Yeah, absolutely. And and that is such a great example that you just used on the importance of status to people. Like it does keep people up at night. And I I'm absolutely the same. I travel enough where the thought of getting to the back of the line, not having a spot for my my luggage, not being able to sit in the lounge and work before a flight, it it is uh yeah, definitely keeps you up at night. So so there are so many people that feel that way. And these are people that are frequently traveling, people that are giving their loyalty, um, spending more in order to retain their status. So these are the people you want to keep. These are the people you want in your program. Um so, in that case, in that example that you gave, what what a great opportunity for um Air Canada to do a little bit of analysis and say, here's somebody who we we now have the data and predictive insights to know that not only is this somebody who's hugely valuable to us, but they are they are going to continue to be valuable and they've responded to our marketing activity in the past. So we know that we have the capability to grow their value further. But instead of providing you an offer, like something that we do is work with brands to just provide them an offer to say, um, give Dan the ability to buy up to 75k for X dollars, thereby retaining your loyalty, not turning you into a free agent that says uh can look to go and try another brand. Um, and also removing that cost that is inevitable, that when you lapse and they have to go and invest in bringing you back. So that's one product. Um and uh and that's very that's called status lift, uh very different than status match, uh, whereas status match is looking at okay, you've you now Dan is looking for like you didn't get the offer to to buy up into 75k, and all of a sudden WestJet comes to you and says, here, we'll give you equivalent top-tier status. Uh, we fly all the same routes, um, and uh you just gonna visit the status match platform, validate your existing status, um, and then we will give you automatic top-tier status with WestJet. Thereby, they've got the best customer already validated, a frequent flyer, and you no longer have to go back to um it's like building up your status again, and you immediately get those benefits.

SPEAKER_02: 14:10

Yeah, and that's so that's what I found fascinating about the business model. So tell us a little bit about the journey, because what I want to get into on our discussion today, Aaron, as you know, is that given your expertise in loyalty, there's so much that others can learn from this conversation, as they heard um from our previous two episodes, that and this is where like, you know, before I worked at points, there was so much I didn't understand about loyalty. And then even in my uh subsequent roles within the travel industry, you know, I worked at one of the largest privately owned travel companies for nearly a decade, and they had no loyalty program. The only loyalty program they had was great customer service and offering a repeat guest discount of 5%. Um, but no, and and I think it was a missed opportunity for uh and and continues to be for so many organizations, because I still remember when you made the example of retail, like every retailer now has some type of loyalty program, and even if they were late to the game, they've now created programs. And I can think of two retailers here in Canada, Shoppers Drug Mart, uh um, or even um Tim Hortons, our famous you know, international export, you know, and eventually introduced a loyalty program. And I remember when they came into points.com interested in creating one, and it was like they and it was like I thought they were late to the game, and now it's such an important part of their business. So the only reason I highlight that is that there are thousands of travel companies out there that will benefit from this discussion today to learn from you how important loyalty is and what some of the solutions they can implement. But just before we get into that, tell us a little bit about the types of program that the I guess the offering that you guys have and who it applies to. Because you guys are continuing to grow and expand into new markets, so the comp the company is still only on the cusp of realizing its full potential globally with different airlines. So tell us a little bit where you guys are on your journey.

SPEAKER_00: 15:56

Sure. Um so we have 26 different uh airline hotel uh retail partners. Uh retail being, we're still very focused in travel, so retail being duty-free, club of volta. Uh and um each of these, we work with each of these brands differently a lot on status match, but some on the full sort of status management uh ecosystem. So somebody we help uh uh uh let's say I'm flying blue, for example, Air France KLM Flying Blue, help them acquire new members, um, identify an opportunity for when there could be high-value frequent travelers looking for new opportunities, help them go out, reach them, target them, because we've built one of the largest databases of status holders worldwide. So help them uh acquire those members. And then once those members come in, how do you ensure that you're actually turning them into longtime loyalists with your brand? So it is not at all about go and give someone status so that they when they fly you that one time, that they can take advantage of those benefits. That's that's the opposite of what we're trying to do. Our our whole model is about will we help brands bring them in and then we help them grow in value and move their way through that status ecosystem so that they're delivering the most amount of value to the brand possible.

SPEAKER_01: 17:20

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SPEAKER_02: 19:39

And now, back to the show. I keep to know when you are looking at other travel companies and trying to figure out where they are on their level of maturity in their marketing, because of course, you being a CMO and having a great deal of marketing uh expertise as well, like what would be that's the first thing that you would recommend to a travel company that is looking to get into the loyalty space? What are some of the initial things you would tell them to consider? I know one of the things that we started doing was like even just a refer a friend program. Like that's one form of loyalty. It was just like you get a discount, they get a discount, most basic form, but yet it still works. Um but yeah, t tell us if you wouldn't mind, what are some of the first steps you'd recommend a travel company consider?

SPEAKER_00: 20:19

Yeah, so I I mean it it like you said, the any any travel company that doesn't currently have some sort of loyalty offering is very late to the game. Um but the good thing is that there are a number of partners out there that uh that have all the tools and technology to help uh a new growing travel brand to scale a loyalty program quite quickly. That that's not really what we do. We're focused on programs that already have existing status programs. Um but absolutely if a if a travel brand is looking to start a loyalty program, then I would say partner with some of the experts out there. Um, ensure that you're not dealing with legacy legacy systems and fragmented data sources, like fix all that first, because that's going to be key to delivering an optimal experience for in any any loyalty experience. Um but yes, partner with one of the experts would be my advice.

SPEAKER_02: 21:16

Well, and one of those things, and I've I um I'm often when I'm asked uh you know about AI and some of these like major developments, it's like, you know, you've got to find the right partner to work with. If you don't have that expertise in-house, finding the right partners is critical, and especially in a space like this, because uh one of the things I'd love for you to clarify is the different terms that get thrown around. One of them is loyalty marketing, and another one is loyalty programs. So actually it'd probably be helpful for audience, maybe if you wouldn't mind explaining the differences between those two. And so if things if rewarding, because I was giving examples of rewarding peop people for being loyal, but that's actually quite a different thing than having a loyalty program.

SPEAKER_00: 21:53

Well, a loyal a loyalty program, I mean it's it's very straightforward. A loyalty program is is the they're the tools. So you have all these tools that you can use in order to grow member value, drive long-lasting loyalty. Um, but it tools only work if you use them properly. So it's this is now loyalty marketing is what are you doing with those tools? What are the strategies that you're uh you're implementing to cultivate long-term loyalty? Um, it's all about how to use those tools. You can, you can, you can offer points and miles, and you will not change behavior in any way unless you've actually thought through what am I trying to achieve? What does what matters to my customers the most so that I can then build a strategy in how I use these tools, points, miles, experiences, access, benefits in order to drive that that behavior change I'm looking for.

SPEAKER_02: 22:50

Yeah, and that's I guess that's where if we think about what are the most impactful things you can offer. So that uh I'd love to go back to this one because I'm keen from your perspective, not only given your background, but also current role, with what actually moves the needle with customer behavior. So I we uh we both shared status. Obviously, that's one major one for sure. Um but the points and miles side of it, I we've talked about a little bit about that in the series, the valuation of them and how you can use them and terms like earn and burn. Um I'd love to get a bit more of your take on the tools that are most effective to build repeat and um ensure loyalty. So, how important are points and miles in terms of those programs? And is there anything else beyond status, points and miles that travel companies should be thinking about implementing within their loyalty program or their loyalty marketing strategy?

SPEAKER_00: 23:40

Right. Um points and miles are definitely becoming less important. Uh as but but that's the that's because at the end of the day, if you think about what anybody wants, they only want points and miles so that they can access benefits. So points and miles are a way to redeem for things that you care about. And so if you're building a program and you're thinking about um, like status is a great example. You earn status and that unlocks benefits and access. Um it's it's not related. Somebody who is is a real loyalty program, avid loyalty program member, they're thinking more about the lounge access than they are about the hundred bonus points that they get with this booking. So it really what's important is that that's the the mindset of the consumer. So when you're designing your loyalty program, think about the benefits that matter to them most and what that value exchange has to look like for them. Because that's the really critical point is that how much do I have to spend in order to unlock the benefits that are meaningful to me? And so it's not how much do I have to spend to get 100 miles, it's how much do I have to spend to get the rewards and benefits I care about.

SPEAKER_02: 25:00

Yeah, it's a much better way to look at it because you see the credit card companies highlighting all these amazing vacations you could have. And I'm like, wait a second, is this uh Expedia? And it's like, no, this is um uh this is a bank advertising their new credit card. I'm like, is this an air Airbnb commercial? But they're literally selling all the joy of travel because that's to your point, that's exactly what people are seeking, and they they will they will spend accordingly, knowing that that tropical beach is at the end of the rainbow for them. Um and one other thing you made me think of too there, Aaron, when I was thinking about status, because uh one of the things I I guess I didn't call out, but it's not it's an obvious um um correlation to this, is that you know even the big OTAs are trying to build status, like in booking.com being a good example with like their genius, like you know, you are a genius for and you get you know the you get a discounted pricing for being you know uh uh uh part of our genius uh you get different statuses, and TripAdvisor does the same thing. So I mean many organizations are applying this methodology, whether consumers realize it or not. So it's not just airlines, because obviously that is the first one to point to, but um, there's any sort of travel companies that want to give people status recognition. So status points of miles becoming less effective, which is interesting to get your take on that. What what would be some of the emerging trends in the loyalty space?

SPEAKER_00: 26:20

Um I think that I mean the the just back to to what matters, what's really interesting is that the emerging trend is is that what matters to everybody is different. So it's all like somebody might have been inspired by that beach vacation. Somebody else may not like the beach and only want to ski and only so it's become the the days where it's a one size fits all approach to loyalty are far behind us. Um, and so I think the real trend is that we're getting to a point where technology and data and AI is sophisticated enough to really allow this like utopia world that we've been thinking about as loyalty marketers for a long time, which is true personalization at scale. So that means that uh different different offers, different value propositions, different benefits, and and uh even status programs will likely start to see that that what your status program looks like as an Aeroplane 75K is different than what mine looks like. Um it's a and so I I I see like step by step we're making progress in that direction, that we're we're moving away from segmented marketing and more towards a true one one-to-one approach.

SPEAKER_02: 27:39

Yeah, I want to ask you a bit more about that because personalization and AI, like when I get asked about AI and I highlight the personalization or like hyper-personalization and personalization at scale, like true one-to-one marketing, you know, uh being in a marketer as well. And and so the the two of us have had you know some similar experience in the industry of working with different travel brands and being in a marketing role and that whole idea of trying to get the right message to the right person at the right time. And you know, it used to take us, you know, having a data analyst and being able to um mine our um contact databases and try and send trigger emails, and now all of a sudden that technology is so accessible and cost-effective without even having these expensive uh analyst resources. So I'm keen to know how you're utilizing that because it was a big topic at our AI summit that many of our listeners uh would have attended. And uh it's one of the things that kept coming up is like is personalization and at our AI summit. So tell us a little bit more about how you're using that with at loyalty status quo, how you guys implemented some AI tools and how is that working to improve personalization?

SPEAKER_00: 28:41

I I mean personalization, as you would know, you've been in loyalty for uh almost as long as I have. It's like it's we've been talking about it for since the beginning of time. Like personally, it's just it's just a constant moving target. Like I think back to what at Air Miles and and it was like you personalization based on postal code, like that was revolutionary, you know, that if you live in this postal code, you'll respond that and now so then you got you moved beyond that, and it was personalization beyond and to a high segment level. Now you really are okay, it requires um a if you really want to drive behavior change, it really is about talking to the individual. So for us, um, what we do is look at again, laser focused on this high value frequent flyer segment. We look at those members within um the loyalty program database within the brand's database and say, okay, what what is what um member will respond to what offer at what time? And let's ensure that we're targeting and speaking to them at exactly that moment. Uh so helping brands work, like look at their status program as more of a CRM management tool. So outside of their overall CRM. I'm just look at uh status as the CRM. So, how do you take the person that almost qualified and make sure that they get into that gold tier for the first time, knowing that you have the data that proves that once they're in gold and they experience the benefits, that they will, like us, do anything not to possibly lose it? So, how do you find that person and validate them as a high potential value customer and then serve them at exactly the right offer to get them to make that leap into um into the status program? And then once they're there, how do you get them to spend more on higher um higher class fares and grow throughout the like meet all the important milestones that are going to help them grow through the program in tiers?

SPEAKER_02: 30:51

Yeah, it's interesting you mentioned that because the end of last year I was literally just underneath the 50,000, which is a as far as I'm concerned, the minimum threshold to function I'm with you. Yeah. At the airport, because that literally gives you that gives you the priority line, it gives you lounge access, like it's like it's critical. And I had one I was under by like 700 points, and even my wife had said, I'm sure if you just call, they're like, I'm like, I'm not I took a flight that I didn't even need to take just to make sure there was no dispute over this. So but if I had known or if there was a way for the marketer to trigger a message to me to make sure, because I'm sure there's other people out there that maybe are not managing it as closely, and it would incentivize behavior to encourage them to or and and this is also the case when you have like you know double miles or where like this is where people get so into this that they get different credit cards and they and they buy things on different credit cards based on when they're you know maximizing their points of miles. But there's obviously a lot of people out there that just don't have the time. I'd love to know the stat. I'm not sure if you have a uh a percentage breakdown of like you know, out of a hundred loyalty people, how many of them are those like uh super type A, very intense, like playing the game all the time? Is that 10% of them? But um and if there's 60% that are the ones that are um uh cognizant but not always chasing, that those are the ones that you could target. Do you do you have any sense of how what what it looks like?

SPEAKER_00: 32:14

I I do not have a stat, but I have a really interesting anecdote that I was at uh an event, the Prince of Travel ran an event last year, and it was a consumer event. So almost all the events we go to, like you, are generally they're B2B events, they're brands. So this was this was an interesting one because it was all consumers. And I was like, the tickets were$800, I think, to get into. And it was on a Saturday, downtown Toronto. And what he was doing is he was he brought in um bloggers, different expertise from the loyalty space to talk to consumers about how to make the most of their points and miles. I was sitting at a table, so these the the room is full. So all these people have flown from all over, paid$800 to sit and listen to how they're getting how they what credit card they should get, what and I was taught I had so many interesting conversations because people were telling me, like, this is I'm retiring. This is my retirement plan. The same way that I would hire a financial advisor to tell me how do I grow by the value of my portfolio is exactly what they were doing. So they were sitting there like taking notes. What card do I have to get? What flight do I need to take? How, how can I get status here? Um, so there is no shortage of uh people that are look at these pro look at at their loyalty program balances as like true bank accounts.

SPEAKER_02: 33:37

Yeah. It's interesting. That was one of the things that came up during the pandemic, too, that people were looking at these programs and starting to spend on them because when people become more cost conscious, and it could be another wave of that activity as people concern themselves with recession or change spending patterns. And then this is one of the things I wanted to ask you about too, is that when people work with credit card companies, so one of the things that we've certainly done or I've done in my background is working with uh American Express or Visa or MasterCard and some of the different credit card companies to then be able to do things like targeting people who have a propensity to spend and travel. And I I love your example about postcode because I know all too well about trying to buy different postcodes and even doing like you know, direct mail pieces for brochures and magazines and being like, this is a high net worth neighborhood or an affluent neighborhood. But when it comes to the understanding the data and even working with credit card companies, where does that fit in? Because I think a lot of people associate loyalty with credit cards. How do you see that side of the business today? And I and part of the reason I ask is because I continue to see new credit cards being introduced that do travel and even um Booking.com, not to uh raise them again, but that was one of the things that came up. They also now have a credit card. Um so yeah, where what is the importance of credit cards, I guess, in the whole loyalty space? And how do you guys work with with credit card companies?

SPEAKER_00: 34:59

Sure. Uh well, credit cards are the the revenue generating machine for any loyalty program. So when we talk about loyalty program value being through the roof, it really is primarily from credit cards buying the points to issue to their customers. So that that is, I mean, there's a lot of money in selling points and miles direct to customers, there's a lot of money in in um working through uh status commercialization, but ultimately the number one by far is the the ability for loyalty programs to sell their currency to to credit cards. Um so that that's just continued to grow. And as every credit card is now like branched out so they have one for like your student credit card, and then your uh a mom with one pet credit card, and you're like it is there's no longer like five uh loyalty program cards. It's every type of card for every type of person, every type of spender. Um, and I think that follows this trend of uh these brands are are are since seeing the worth in these programs, are recognizing that they need to be integrated into every point of this person's life. So they're turning more into lifestyle programs rather than frequent flyer programs. So you think of aeroplan, they don't want to talk to you just when you're flying, because for the vast majority, that's going to be twice a year. They want to talk to you when you're going to Starbucks, when you're buying that bottle of wine, when you're ordering out. Um, and so credit cards are a part of that as well, which means that there has to be a constant reminder that your loyalty is to this brand, and that can't be on your twice-a year trip.

SPEAKER_02: 36:51

Yeah, exactly. Yeah. So that and that that's where, depending on the size of the travel business and you're listening to this. Obviously, some of you might already be working with credit card companies, and uh, you know, we've worked with American Express before to target and to add in additional incentives that then will go into and to effectively encourage them to uh burn their miles by uh booking a river cruise with one of our brands or that type of thing. So like but it just shows you how we even within the loyalty world, there's obviously having your own loyalty program, but then there's actually working with other uh loyalty providers. And so how important do you think that is for people in the travel industry? Like it just again, given your expertise, if people listening to this are uh haven't done that yet or aren't familiar with that as an opportunity, um, and I know that's kind of outside of clearly what you guys do at StatusMuch and Loyalty Co, but still interesting to just uh have a discussion on that. Like, how how important do you think those opportunities are for companies? Because I I that's one of those things that we only scratch the surface with some of those uh opportunities. And do you think there is a lot more there that travel companies could benefit from by reaching out to credit card companies and trying to get into loyalty program incentives?

SPEAKER_00: 38:06

Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I don't I think you'd be hard pressed to find any major well-known travel brand that doesn't have a co-brand credit card now. Uh, but if you're starting as a you're a small travel company, um, there's there's significant value in strategic partnerships because you share the cost of marketing your loyalty program. So it's sort of a fine line between like what is a coalition program. And if you think about a coalition program being like an Air Miles where Air Miles owns the loyalty program or runs the loyalty program, but then all these major retailers issue the same currency. So that's a that's a coalition program. It works really well for programs that don't want, don't have the budget, the resources to develop their own program, and they want to immediately issue a currency that is well known, credible, um, right out of the gate. Uh, there's obviously a lot of cons to that as well. Um, so on the flip side, you see you run a strategy, you you're a smaller travel brand, you want to partner with a um car rental company, um, they'll market you through their channels for reciprocal benefits through your channels. Things like that are can really help to get the ball rolling and help to grow brand awareness and and credibility.

SPEAKER_01: 39:29

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SPEAKER_02: 41:21

And now back to the show. One other thing I also wanted to get your take on is the challenges you've seen with companies that have implemented loyalty programs. We've talked about the success stories, and as you just mentioned, any major uh travel company today might have their own credit card, they might have their own loyalty program. There's a lot of smaller players out there that are certainly going to get a lot from this conversation as far as what they can or should be doing. But one of the things for sure that definitely happens, you probably don't hear as much about, uh, or our listeners may not hear as much about, is loyalty programs that haven't worked and what challenges that they've run into. And you don't have to uh I'm not asking you to to name anyone specifically, but I would love to hear some of the pitfalls to avoid in introducing a loyalty program.

SPEAKER_00: 42:04

I I mean it is it I think that the what is table stakes now is so high for a loyalty program to be truly a part of a consideration stat uh set. Like we are we are so far past the days of a stamp card unless you're um like a corner, maybe coffee shop, even then. I'd I'd I'd question that. Um but for a travel loyalty program, I think the expectation is you know that you are mobile first, that you have a fully optimized, seamless customer experience, that you going back to the value exchange, that there is true value for what you're spending. Um and then on top of that, there is now so many concerns around data privacy that in order for a customer to say, I will share everything about myself, which is truly what's going to be required for you to market a program to me in a way that is going to drive any significant change. Um, in order for me to do that, I want to understand what I'm getting in return. And that return has to be pretty significant. Like it's not, we're not, you can't not like air miles 20 years ago where it's like, give me all your data, spend all your money for a year, and we'll let you redeem for a movie ticket. Like this is customer expectation is really high. Um so I think that that that what needs to be considered for anyone starting a loyalty program is don't just go out and do it without any real um, you know, formal thought or consultation around how to make it successful. And the bar of entry is quite high.

SPEAKER_02: 43:48

Yeah, it's it's it's interesting you mentioned that correlation, the value, because it's certainly, I think, people I've got a great friend who's a stand-up comic, his name is uh Tim Riker. You can find his comedy special. My kids have been watching it recently and getting a kick out of it, but he did this bit about loyalty programs and he bought a the joke was that he went and bought a Honda and he got given a um a loyalty card, and after he bought his seventh Honda, he got a free Subway sandwich. And it was like because it and it was anyway, it was just it was a light joke, but the point that obviously he was making was that like it was the reward was totally out of sync with the spend that someone would actually have to do. And that's so that's a uh a terrific example of how companies can get it wrong, because if you don't have the value equation right and you don't have the right incentive. So I think that's where it comes back to your point you were making earlier about working with a partner, because if you're gonna implement your own program, it's gonna be um uh not only time-consuming, costly, complicated, but also high risk. So I guess back to um uh the status side of thing that I'm I'm intrigued to go back to because when someone decides to go down that path of status, what are some of the things that you see work particularly well? Um I was giving some of the examples of all the airline uh benefits that you can get. Um what are some of the things when you just think about status? What appeals to people, what actually does move the needle that they see that there's enough value in that to justify their time and attention?

SPEAKER_00: 45:13

Uh I mean it's quite different depending on airlines. Like our experience is very similar with with AeroPlan and what matters to us, especially as we b both of us travel internationally quite often. So lounge access is really important, priority boarding, the ability to upgrade, all those things, those things really matter. Um, and we probably would. Like I would do the same thing where you're taking a status run at the at the last minute, um, which is not the best thing for the brand or for you. You have to go be away for your family to get the$700 flight. Um, you're taking up a seat that that Air Canada could have sold, uh, which means that like that's displaced revenue. So, what a better way for um a brand to engage you before you have to do that. So see you are about to lapse, let you buy, let you pay a fee, generate ancillary revenue, keep your loyalty. Um so I think there's there's examples like that where it's just a no-brainer that there are things that the programs can be doing to engage their members at the right time, um, and and avoid them having to to take that that status run. Um but yeah, but I was just gonna say what really matters, because at the end of the day, what is going to um all the research, all the surveys, there are our um like a difference in international travelers, what it matters to them. And then we work with ultra low cost carriers as well that have status programs. What matters to those consumers is is drastically different. I just want to be able to know that I have a seat on this plane. Like that is what is is beneficial. Um, so understanding that that based on brand, consumer, um, category of of uh of airline that you're what the customers want are going to be different.

SPEAKER_02: 47:12

Yeah, and the reason I go back to status, not only because is it something that is incredibly valuable to me, but also we have our air series coming up after um our sustainability series. The last deep dive we have of season six for all of our listeners is aviation, which we haven't done before. And I really wanted to tie the two together in season six to have loyalty and have aviation. And so it almost really helps us set the stage for the conversations we're gonna have about aviation. Um and you know, we had a uh a session at our AI Summit around air. We had obviously the session with um the recording with Oliver. And so I'd I'd love to get your take on the importance of on the aviation side. So I know you guys have a very impressive client list from like Etihat, obviously Air Canada, Swiss, like Air India. You've got KLM, Air which and Air France, of course, those two go together. Um so and and it continues to expand with the new partners you have on. So what what are some of the big trends that you're seeing with airlines and this concept? Like what is it that really appeals to them? Because obviously Oliver was raving about it, and he was like, it was great technology, really easy to implement, and he was just like, and they're already getting value from it. Um and you guys are pretty much alone in this space, which obviously is exciting because it's again there's so much growth potential. So, what what are you seeing? What what does the next year look like for uh for status match and your partnerships? And what are the what are the airlines really seeing from this?

SPEAKER_00: 48:37

Yeah, um, so phenomenal results we're seeing. Our partner, Air France, we've talked about them a bit, but they just shared some recent results. Uh they had and and what's what uh the campaign was uh was a status match targeting BA customers. So BA launched a change to their status program this year. It met with a lot of backlash. It it significantly made it significantly more difficult to qualify for for status. Um Air France saw this as an opportunity to acquire some high-value disenfranchised BA frequent flyers. Uh, and that's a really important point because that is something that we do is like identify what are these market events that make it perfect timing to reach out and acquire new customers. So be uh Air France um within a couple months acquired 4,000 new uh validated high-value frequent flyers. Those flyers booked in an incremental 17,000 flights uh within those next three months, um, more than significantly uh skewing more towards business class. So really, really like now it's not just about let's get these members in the door and um give them all the benefits without actually having to earn them. It's now you know them starting to see that, oh my gosh, these members that come in, they are delivering the value to the brand uh that a previous high value uh uh member would. So so I think when we look at what these programs are looking for, um they're looking at results like this that are be shared that are being shared across the board and and want to replicate them. How do we drive incremental flights, higher class fair bookings, um, and and acquisition of truly validated high-value travelers? Um, whereas a status match of the past, anybody could just log in and I'd Photoshop a picture of myself on an Emirates Skyward uh and uh and match in whereas all of our tools and technology ensure that this is there's almost zero fraud and they're all uh validated high-value travelers.

SPEAKER_02: 51:02

Yeah, it's so interesting. I guess that's where you know it you mentioned something interesting there about the fact that what the lengths that people are willing to go to try and uh get their incentives and benefits and all the um the checks that have to be in place to make sure that um people are earning legitimately and like that uh the um on this uh topic of uh status and where we're headed, uh the other thing I wanted to know from your perspective, I know you've uh you've mentioned some of the different programs and the different incentives that have uh but in terms of aviation, one of the things that people highlight is that you know we are you know at uh um many airlines have been at capacity and their load factors, and we we've finally seen a little bit of you know choppy waters in this last year, like in the last six months, with some of the geopolitical events, especially with the US and some of the load, certainly from Canada, but also from Europe uh lessening. And and I've spoken to a few different airlines. And this is the interesting thing I I find about loyalty is that like it works in um when the market is strong and that also performs as well when um people are looking for value, and if there is concerns about people's financial portfolios, people then turn their points again. And so when we think about some of the big consumer changes in 2026, is there any airlines that are doing anything particularly interesting that stands out to you um that our audience might find interesting with how they are rewarding their customers? And this the reason I asked this is because I've got some rapid-fire questions coming up for you, and I want to get your your take on a few of these direct questions. But yeah, what where do you think the innovation is happening in the airline space and what are some of the the guess more interesting concepts you're seeing airlines implementing along with you know status match to to to fill up their yield on certain routes? And uh uh yeah, tell it tell us what's happening in the airline space in this capacity as we prepare for our airline series.

SPEAKER_00: 52:53

Yeah, so as you said, uh airlines are doing well very well right now, full capacity and and on so many routes. Um there's been, I think what we're we're seeing more of is that there is this ability to quickly evolve the benefits that are offered. And that's because of again technology and the way that how quickly you can bring new benefits and rewards to market. Um so something with status, I think about is that that we're seeing more more airlines offer a choice in benefits. So I think we'll start to see this more and more that that you know, what may what matters to me is being able to bring my family into the lounge. What matters to somebody who doesn't have family would be to gift a status for a day to a friend or two. Um so when you like with Air Canada uh specifically, you now choose your benefits. And um, I think this is is showing a real sign that that's the direction we're going in, which is a personalized status program by member.

SPEAKER_02: 53:56

Yeah. I I love that you mentioned that because that immediately stood out to me and I hadn't even thought about it yet. Is that the one benefit I know that when I become super elite again is that my wife gets automatic 50k. So she can now fly on her own, not have to wait to fly with me, because otherwise I do get those passes and I give them so they can get to the lounge, or if my mom's flying in to see me. So everyone gets and that that's why I asked, because like for me, I'm on the receiving end of getting something in the mail from Aeroplan and opening it up and learning what the Aeroplan program has in store for me for the next year to keep me loyal and to give me the rewards that I'll drive benefit from. And then, of course, I get to go in and select the ones that are most meaningful to me so I can customize it based on my interests, which I always pick e-upgrade credits. I've got tons of e-upgrade credits and I try and use them every time. So I'm always buying a class affair that I know has the opportunity to upgrade, and it feels joyous to get that call up and be in business class when you paid for economy, all because of your status and some upgrade points. I'm like, um so yeah, uh so I think that's really interesting, is being able to um to be able to provide that to someone else. Like those are so yeah, is there anything else along those lines that you're seeing uh companies implement? Because I again I find that so fascinating and I think it yeah, it shapes us up well for some of these airline conversations because I'm keen to ask them about their loyalty programs.

SPEAKER_00: 55:16

Yeah, I I mean really I think it all is still boils down to like a different way of implementing personalization. Like it is that that is what whether or not it offers timing of communications, um, seeing more and more airlines being able to plug into different data sources that that will allow them to identify somebody as being in the market to travel. So much more a predictive lens to marketing than a let's see when this person laps and then action a re-engagement series. This is like we know that somebody's in the market to travel, we know that somebody's um uh looking at competitive fares, we know that, and I want to be able to customize their offer in real time based on these actions that they're taking. And that is just growing in sophistication daily. So I think because of that, it may not seem that different to you, um, but all the things that are going on behind the scenes to ensure that what you're seeing makes sense at exactly the place that you are within your travel journey, your travel consideration, that's where I think it's gonna get really interesting and help uh airlines grow in engagement and profitability overall.

SPEAKER_02: 56:39

Yeah, no, I think that's absolutely right. I think that's a good way to look at it is actually the personalization with that example I mentioned in my instance that you know you can choose, and I'm sure many of the our listeners who are you know frequent flyers uh their res you know that your reaction to my statement, you may have a different view of like being able to um uh get discounted future tickets or be able to the other one is um be able to have a lower qualifying for the next year if you know you're not gonna be spending as much, right? Like it's like so it it is that like based on your personal situation, what is the best incentive that's gonna meet your needs? And obviously, yes, I I would be excited if that does get more um personalized. Is there any one last question on this topic, and then I'll I'll jump into our rapid-fire questions, which is like when I think about status, obviously I associate that with airlines, but we've talked about the fact that it can exist in um in any other uh vertical within travel. We've talked a little bit about hotels, and obviously you have hotel providers as well, like part of your uh program. And I know with with like with loyalty status, you know, you've got not only status match, but get status, status booster, status lift, and it's all around status. And where I'm going with that question is like beyond air and hotel, who else, like what other verticals? The one that stands out to me is cruise, because basically those are floating hotels. Um, what are some of the other verticals that you see could apply this model? And maybe that's also where you guys are thinking about expanding in the future.

SPEAKER_00: 58:08

Yeah, absolutely. I I see so much opportunity for cruise. Um, cruise, a lot of uh a lot of cruise lines deliver lifetime status. Um, fairly easy to acquire lifetime status, or so that makes it very difficult to commercialize and extract any ancillary revenue from those products. Um, and it also makes it difficult to use as a motivator, so to really change behavior with that being the carrot, because it's no longer a carrot, you always have it. So I think there's so much opportunity for crews to optimize that the way that they've built their status programs and really look to airlines as the guiding light on okay, how do we take a page out of their book and and start to replicate some of it? Um, and then of course, with status match, like just an easy way, there's there's such a natural synergy between uh cruise and airline because you have to fly usually to get to a port. So the most like, how does crews look to acquire high value frequent flyers? Um, and status match is such a a simple and easy and effective way to do that. Um and then the other would be casino. Casino is a very, there's such a big opportunity with casino programs as well to look at how they're running their current status programs and and start to leverage some of the best practices from travel.

SPEAKER_02: 59:37

Yeah, and that's a that's actually a great example of personalization at scale. Um like MGM and some of these like uh uh casino and reward programs, because I've listened to a number of people speak on this topic and the fact that how profile their customers are without even realizing it. Um go to Vegas and stay at their hotels and understanding their uh their gambling habits and trying to get the. Trying to keep them coming back. That is that's where I think we can all learn a lot for sure from the casino and gambling side as as marketers. Um, but you're right, that's a a great example of of loyalty too. Well, um I'm keen to ask you a few rapid fire questions, and I'll finish off making sure that uh people can connect with you and uh and learn more for partnership opportunities. But uh a few rapid fire questions that I'm keen to ask you and see how your answers might differ to mine. So uh question number one What is uh if you could have status with uh one airline or hotel for life, what one might that be? And now I realize I'm asking you that question, you've got a lot of partners you need to like manage. Um so uh but uh for me that's an important one because I know colleagues that have worked in airlines and they've worked there at Delta just long enough to make sure they continue to have their status for the rest of their life. But yeah, what would be the one airline or hotel that you would choose to keep status with?

SPEAKER_00: 1:00:55

Well, I need to caveat I love all of our airline and hotel brands equally, and uh and whenever the opportunity I have to fly with them is uh but I am a die hard Air Canada, Aeroplan, and Mario Bonvoy uh uh loyalty member. So that that is like the same way. Sounds like that's that's uh you as well. And I think this just by nature of being Canadian, um that's our our airline of choice.

SPEAKER_02: 1:01:23

Yeah, for sure. It's absolutely like you're your base. I lived in Australia for Qantas, it was One World, which is the same as British Airways. So for sure, we're all biased to um what is our major carrier, for sure. That's obviously the and then um um and then also your style of travel. So your example with Marriott Bonvoy is really interesting because that program has really taken off in the last several years. They've done such a great job of bringing it together under one brand with multiple accommodation providers. And every time I check into a hotel, I'm always reminded about my Bonvoy, and I'm like, I'm that guy that's like, I think I do, and like I'm like, where is it? And I'm like going through my emails trying to provide a number. I need to get better at that, but it's um they're good at making sure I use it to give me free internet, like those things that just give you like the most basic incentive that you're just like it's it worth it to sign up for it because I don't want to spend$20 a day on internet that should otherwise be included with my hotel stay.

SPEAKER_00: 1:02:15

And it's interesting, like the Citizen M. So Marriott just purchased Citizen M. Citizen M is a partner of ours. Citizen M is uh just an incredibly unique and fun brand. So often we will stay at Citizen M when it has it has great working spaces and and uh really amazing rooms. So now with the Marriott integration, that's definitely going to be on top of my list as well.

SPEAKER_02: 1:02:38

Cool. Now that brings us to my next uh question, which is what is the most unique loyalty perk you have ever received?

SPEAKER_00: 1:02:45

Oh wow. Um unique. That's a tough one because like I think about what we were talking about before, which is like the benefits now around um being able to gift a gift status, or like those are I they're becoming less and less unique because I think uh one airline started it and now everyone at airline has seen that that's a a great motivator. But uh but that would be the one that that when I first received it was very unique. And uh and and I I really appreciate being, especially because I travel so much, being able to um for my husband to be able to get 50k or being able to bring my kids into the lounge, or being able to gift my parents when they're going on a a trip, lounge access, like give them a status for a day. Um, I love those benefits where you kind of get to, you know, you're away a lot, but now we get to you get to share the experiences and the benefits and the perks of all that time away. That's what really matters to me.

SPEAKER_02: 1:03:52

To that personalization. Kids in the lounge was a big one for me. That's a horrible feeling to get your kids turned away or know that you can't go into the lounge. It's like so um I think a few of our listeners have been there. The number of times I still go to the lounge because I'm just ready to like scan in and I'm so confident in my status. But like you still see those poor people lined up uh pulling out different credit cards, asking like, can they get in or where could they go? I just feel I always feel so awful for them.

SPEAKER_00: 1:04:18

But yeah, and and actually, you know what the one thing I would say is that the the the sometimes the most unique benefits aren't the ones that are published either. Like uh I one time was stuck and in Dubai or something, and uh the the flight was delayed, and somebody like weaved through the crowd, found me, was like Aaron Murray. I'm like, oh my gosh, what did I do? What what happened? And it was because of my status, and they pulled me out and we're like, we've got to, you're number one to get to figure out how we're how to get on the next flight. That's not a published benefit, but wow, was that ever uh uh you know a like a driver of my loyalty to the brand?

SPEAKER_02: 1:04:56

Yeah, exactly. Well, one of my favorite movies of all time is Up in the Air, which is now pretty dated. But if you want to see George Clooney in its absolute prime and understand the the power and importance of uh of loyalty programs, eventually like meeting the pilot and having come to your seat, that was his dream, and that I don't want to give too much away for those people who haven't seen it, but I could I could identify with that. Um, two last questions and we'll wrap up. So on now, I'm gonna move away from loyalty with these last two, which is uh, and more on a on a on a personal note. So for you, you were just in Portugal, I know as a family. What's your next kind of dream destination? Where are you guys ultimately headed next? What's what's your next bucket list destination to travel to?

SPEAKER_00: 1:05:38

Uh well, we have no plans yet, uh, but it is definitely on a bucket list. Uh would be to do like Uganda, Mountain Gorillas. Um, we did Botswana a few years ago and ever since. So it's like Africa is is going to be very close to my heart, and I will do as much of it as I possibly can. Um, but I have two kids in AAA hockey. So uh the finding finding two weeks to go to Africa, I might uh it might be a ways off.

SPEAKER_02: 1:06:08

Yeah, sounds like a high school graduation before university trip.

SPEAKER_00: 1:06:12

Exactly. Exactly.

SPEAKER_02: 1:06:14

All right. And then one last one, which given you're such a frequent flyer, an avid traveler, uh, outside of loyalty and status programs and all the things we've discussed on our uh conversation, what would be one thing that you don't leave home without? Like one item that you travel with that you could not imagine leaving? And it can't be your phone. That's the only number. Okay. Um no, I think it could it could be an app on your phone, but it's like it, yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 1:06:38

Oh, that's that's an easy one. I couldn't live without Uber. And I I've only been to one country ever that doesn't take it. And I honestly I was like, I I have no idea what to do. Like I it was like I I uh I forgot that you could still use your telephone to call cabs. And but that that is is for sure like when you're in a country where it's just it makes it so easy um from the minute you walk out the door. So that, but aside from that, I have the best travel pants where I fly so often overnight and I could leave and go to a meeting, and they were like my my comfy sleep pants, but all of a sudden become my acceptable meeting pants. So um everybody needs a pair. I don't even know where they're from, but uh I will I ruin the day for when they're going to break a seam or something.

SPEAKER_02: 1:07:25

It's funny, that's where like um the one that's come up more recently for me is the number of people that are now buying um the Bluetooth adapters for their headphones so they can watch the screens without actually having to use the airline headphones. And that is like, you know, and it's like one of those things you can get them on Amazon for like$15, and it's like a game changer for like Wow. Yeah. So that would that would I was I'm throwing that one out there as well because all of a sudden I'm seeing more and more people with them, and it's like, but a lot of people still aren't aware, and they're putting their hand up for headphones, or they're like, it's um yeah, it's like we don't have to do that anymore. You can use your AirPods, you can literally use your AirPods now for the screen, not just for your phone.

SPEAKER_00: 1:08:01

Ah, amazing. Okay, it's on my list.

SPEAKER_02: 1:08:03

Awesome. Well, Aaron, I've so enjoyed this conversation. I really appreciate you getting involved in our loyalty series. I was thrilled to bring this together with your support and also just having you part of this series. And I've so thoroughly enjoyed our conversation. There's lots more I would love to continue on, at and I'm sure we'll have the opportunity. But uh, let's make sure everyone can find out more information about uh Loyalty Co. and be able to follow up with you if they have more questions.

SPEAKER_00: 1:08:27

Great. Yeah, so for any consumer looking for great status offers, uh, visit getstatus.com. And for brands uh looking for partnership information, visit loyaltystatusco.com or message me on LinkedIn. I'd love to chat.

SPEAKER_02: 1:08:41

Fantastic. Well, thank you so much for joining us. Safe travel's coming up, and I'll look forward to uh catching up with you again in the next couple of months.

SPEAKER_00: 1:08:48

You too, Dan. Thanks so much.

SPEAKER_02: 1:08:50

Thanks so much for joining us on the latest episode of Travel Trends. I hope you enjoyed today's conversation with Aaron Murray, the CMO of Loyalty Status Co. I also wanted to say thank you again to Aaron and the team for sponsoring this series. To find out more information about them, check out loyaltystatus.co and also be sure to check out statusmatch.com. Now, next week we're gonna have the CEO of Citizen M joining us to round out our loyalty series before we move on to sustainability and aviation, and we have several major captains of industry conversations planned as well. So lots to look forward to in season six. And I just wanted to remind all of our listeners that we do post clips and highlights on our social channels, which you can find on LinkedIn, Instagram, and YouTube. And then, of course, we send out our monthly newsletter, which is coming out very shortly for the month of December. So be sure to register at traveltrendspodcast.com. Thanks again for joining us today, and until next week, safe travels.