Welcome to a new episode of Partner Ops Partner. This week, we're excited to feature Linkon Axon from Arys Consulting and a conversation around ISVs and Partner Ops.
In this episode...
Don't forget this is also posted at YouTube for a visual experience!
Connect with Linkon on... um... LinkedIn... or through his new site at Arys Consulting.
Good luck Partnering!
Aaron Howerton
www.linkedin.com/in/aaronhowerton
www.partneropspartner.com
Welcome to a new episode of Partner Ops Partner. This week, we're excited to feature Linkon Axon from Arys Consulting and a conversation around ISVs and Partner Ops.
In this episode...
Don't forget this is also posted at YouTube for a visual experience!
Connect with Linkon on... um... LinkedIn... or through his new site at Arys Consulting.
Good luck Partnering!
Aaron Howerton
www.linkedin.com/in/aaronhowerton
www.partneropspartner.com
Welcome to Partner Ops Partner. This is another part of the new format for me for 2024. And this week we are shifting focus. Last week it was Partner Ops. Week before that we had Partner Tech. This week it's Partner Leaders. It's people actually building, managing program, running programs. And I'm very excited this week to welcome Lincoln Axson from Aris Consulting. Lincoln, thanks so much for joining me today, man. I appreciate it. It was pretty short notice as well. So thanks for jumping in.
linkon-axon-_1_01-24-2024_141433:It was. It's absolutely my pleasure. Thank you so much for taking the time. I appreciate it.
aaron--he-him-_1_01-24-2024_081432:No worries. Um, I want to say this to folks. If you're listening on the podcast, there's also a YouTube. So I've got a new YouTube channel. I'm trying to put these on YouTube. All it is, is just looking at me and Lincoln staring at cameras, trying to pretend like we're staring at each other. So, uh, but if you like the visual, please feel free to go look at that on YouTube. Um, and Lincoln, for your part, I know that if you've, and we've talked about, like, we're using platform called squad cast. Um, if you see your video struggle with that, don't worry about the quality that'll get uploaded on your end. And then it'll look fine on the back end. So. Yep. If you see me go blurry too, don't worry about it. Again, audio listeners, you don't care about any of that. Lincoln, thank you for joining me today. So for context, tell us real quick about my audience. And my audience is predominantly, I'm trying to grow more toward partner operations professionals. So people that work in partner ops, people that work in channel ops, give me like a two minute bio. What do you do? What's your focus? Where do you work in partnerships? What's your drive?
linkon-axon-_1_01-24-2024_141433:Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. So, um, thank you so much for having me first and foremost. It's lovely to be here. Um, yeah, so, uh, I've been running a program recently for the last two and a half to three years, uh, for a, company here in the fintech space in the UK. Uh, we predominantly are an ISV, um, and we are part of that business. Um, we have roughly 40 to 50, um, active partners that have driven us about 3000 accounts in the last three years. And we drive about 70 percent of all our commercial revenue through the company via our partner channels.
aaron--he-him-_1_01-24-2024_081432:Okay. But for your particular focus, that's the whole program, right? Um, if I go to like your profile and you've got ISV. All over your language, all over your work. Is that network that you just mentioned, is that all ISV partners?
linkon-axon-_1_01-24-2024_141433:Predominantly it is. Yeah. I mean, what we are because we're in the fintech space, um, we deal with, uh, financial transactions. So we were regulated by the financial conduct authority. And so that essentially means that we are looking at, um, in person transactions and online transactions. So we either have Uh, we have our own payment gateway, um, of which we then integrate, uh, to various ISVs and, um, uh, vendors, uh, and consumers and clients and customers. Uh, and then we have our front facing physical, uh, current present payments, uh, as well, which involves integration with joint venture, uh, customers, clients, and partners.
aaron--he-him-_1_01-24-2024_081432:So real quick for, for my audience to something, I just talked to another partner leader about this yesterday. She was in the marketing space, the concept of like partner breakdowns, right? Like ISVs versus OEMs. Like to me, there's still a lot of mismanagement in terms of definition. We don't really have standards, right? What one person means by ISV may not be the same thing as someone else. Tell us from your perspective, like define an ISV for my audience, for what you do. Um, what does the acronym mean? Then what does that look like in terms of real, real realization, I guess, within the
linkon-axon-_1_01-24-2024_141433:Yeah, no, absolutely. So ISV stands for, um, independent software vendor. Um, so essentially what that means is we develop market, uh, and sell software solutions that run hardware systems or hardware solutions. Um, we mainly, uh, sell through the partner market channel as joint ventures or resellers. Um, uh, by creating or developing a joint venture initiative or solution that fills a feature gap. Um, within that, uh, space, or we, um, simply promote each other's solutions, um, via that partner network, um, on various degrees, uh, of incentive programs, uh, through, uh, the
aaron--he-him-_1_01-24-2024_081432:Does your, um, I guess this is another question too. So if you have an ISV, you can have an ISV. So they need access to like, from terms of operations, you mentioned also reseller. Is it really, really common in your network? Like the, in this network where you're at right now, and I know that you're, you're launching, um, your own thing here really soon. Very excited for you about that too. When you talk about ISV, do you see a lot of overlap between programs? Are people often going to be an ISV? By default in fintech and then also enter into the reseller space, like are they carrying that dual program engagement?
linkon-axon-_1_01-24-2024_141433:Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. I think it's almost standard across the board. I mean, what's, um, I ISVs, um, traditionally do within the space is, um, gives you maximized visibility amongst your competitors. You know, um, if, if you are especially pushing a joint venture, um, that creates that, um, increased value proposition, um, for, for a client, um, then, yeah, it's an absolute no brainer. We currently work with, um, sharp, for example, as the hardware, um, piece of the puzzle to our software solution. Um, so we package that up, um, to, uh, clients to create, uh, a much, much more over, um, a much more comprehensive. package to them where instead of going to two or three different vendors, they can come to one vendor. Uh, and essentially then, uh, we, we sell on joint bench or resell through, uh, that partner, uh, which is sharp. Uh, so yeah, I mean, it's, um, it gives you massive visibility amongst your competitors. It's a competitive market out there, as you said, especially in the ISV space. So, um, one of the differentiators you can have is actually partner up with, especially enterprise level and tier one. Uh, level businesses that can really boost and bolster your brand identity. Um, so long as you do a good job, the reputation improves, ROI improves. And, um, yeah, and that's how we grow in our scalable motion.
aaron--he-him-_1_01-24-2024_081432:So when you talk about ISV2, I think one thing that I, I'll say this for my own person is I've been in software for most of my career. Um, I have to caveat a couple of years I spent as an insurance adjuster for whatever reason. Um, really interesting job. But when I talk about ISV2, I think one thing that's confusing for me, at least when I talk internally, right. I work in the operations side. So for me, CRM utilization, can you see these things in the, in the account? We have a good breakdown. It feels like oftentimes the, the concept of an ISV. And that program level engagement versus being a reseller or something else that there's a little bit of confusion internally. Do you find that it is often important for people to really understand what an ISV is like as a program separate from other programs in order to be able to work with, engage and resell? Or is that maybe less important for your internals, more important operationally or just for you from a performance standpoint? Or am I maybe even way off base on thinking about this as an issue at all?
linkon-axon-_1_01-24-2024_141433:Yeah, no, I'm so easy. You're talking very granular, um, which yes, absolutely. You know, then it needs to. Yeah, there needs to be, there needs to be that definition. Um, um, 100%. Um, uh, when it, when you come to internally, um, yes, it really depends on your structure. I mean, we work with ultimately hard, uh, system, soft systems and informatic information systems, uh, are the main thing. things, actions and ideas and information, and they're the main three things that we work with. So they have to be very clearly identified and how they correlate, um, internally to potentially, you know, um, other, uh, partners or information systems or whoever we're working with. Um, so that, you know, there is a real focus and drive towards. Um, the end goal, I mean, our, our, our end goal as a company, um, obviously is, is we're customer-centric with, you know, partner program or not Sales Rev, um, you know, customer success, a and e marketing, whoever it may be. Um, that sole focus on is on providing value to the client and the, and the customer. So, um, if it doesn't, uh, if it's not an in itself in fulfilling that, uh, role and, and that, um, sort of scale. promotion, then yeah, we then have to make sure that we refocus on what we're trying to do and making sure that everybody else recognizes what we're trying to do, how we're trying to do it. Um, and, uh, yeah. And, and then pushing that scalable motion forward through each of those channels.
aaron--he-him-_1_01-24-2024_081432:So you just said something I think is really important because you used a word that we hear used a lot, like the word scale, scalable, scalable solutions, scalable programs, scalable growth. We all want scale. Um, if I look back at like what's happened the past three years in technology, I think our problem right now where we see a lot of partner talent being laid off, we see programs being cut. The tech layoffs in general beyond partnerships have been really brutal the past couple of years. And in my opinion, that's a direct result of companies not being ready to scale. When the pandemic hit and demand, right, right, just showed up. In my opinion, being ready to scale happens before demand. If demand shows up and you can't keep up, that's a, that's a scaling problem. And companies talk about scalability, but I don't know, and don't feel confident that we often build toward truly scalable solutions. So when you say scale, and we're talking about ISVs and clearly those ISVs are dipping into the reseller program, what are some of the common. Operational challenges that you face from an ISV perspective. If I'm in partner ops and I've got a broader focus myself, some folks are RevOps focused, what do partner ops professionals need to be looking out for to know how to help you as an ISV manager or to help our ISV programs be successful? Who are we engaging with? What are the challenges? What can we help drive internally for you?
linkon-axon-_1_01-24-2024_141433:Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. I mean, it's, um, you know, I call partner ops a unity engine, you know, they're the, they're the thing that drives, you know, that, um, that unity through delivering a great PX along with customers success, obviously. Um, and yeah, I mean, there's challenges because you are dealing with hardware and software. We probably find the most challenges in the hardware space because you're dealing essentially with a thing again, you know, with a hard system. Um, um, soft, not so much because they're quite dependent with the systems dependent. Um, Um, so, you know, they're, they're, they're, they're quite, um, they're easily actionable, especially when you do have an issue. But, you know, operational challenges, um, um, can be many. Um, or they can be few. I think that really depends on your structure and structure follows strategy and, you know, um, it depends on your, your strategy. And if you've got a good strategy, then you find the operational challenges are a lot less. I mean, the things that we do see is hardware disruption. Um. Uh, which we actually, uh, or many companies as well, use third party suppliers for hardware, um, uh, tools and, and, uh, and, and the kit that they need to, to run their business. Um, supplier disruption, not so much. I mean, we don't get that, you know, that's not really a massive issue, but it's definitely something that if, uh, did come to a head, we would, um, be calling on the partner ops to, to, um, help, uh, deal with, um, You know, managing partner churn is probably another one that I think partner optimum plays such a major role in that, um, uh, possibility. I always describe partnerships as a leaky bucket. Um, you know, they, they, you really have to try to plug as many holes as you possibly, uh, can, um, if you've got good systems in place, then it's not so bad, but it is, it can be a leaky bucket at the best time and managing partner PX as well. You know, they're very much part of the partner experience, even though they might be a. What's utilized or seen as a backend, um, uh, support network. I keep them very front and center in, in operation of what we're trying to achieve and absolutely huge. Um, as that, as that engine room of the, uh, the partnership program, uh, and the success of that program.
aaron--he-him-_1_01-24-2024_081432:So you mentioned you said several things there, and I am, um, I'm gonna try to recap some of what you said just to make sure I'm following along for you. Um, one thing you said, I think that I really like and I see this reflected often is that structure follows strategy. Um, I like the mindset. I think I said what you're saying is right. The structure of what you need to build made the direction you need to take the projects you bring on. All of that's going to be kind of dependent upon your partner strategy in terms of. Prioritization, making sure capacity is lined out and what projects kind of come first, second and third. Am I understanding that correctly?
linkon-axon-_1_01-24-2024_141433:Yeah, absolutely. Yeah.
aaron--he-him-_1_01-24-2024_081432:Yep. Okay. Um, um, good deal. So on that sense though, one challenge I push back on is that I have often found operationally structure might follow strategy, but ops gets pulled in late. So, decisions are made, strategy is set, and then, uh, even to the point of like, and I wrote about this maybe last week, even to the point of like, hey, we've made a big announcement, we've made a huge programmatic change, but we haven't done any technical validation to make sure we can achieve that goal, and that's okay, right? We can come back and validate that, but if you make those big announcements, that's okay, right? We And here's when it's going to happen. How can we as partner operations people stay close to the rhythm of that strategy? Cause I don't think we're always included. How does a partner operations professional who is trying to get more visibility? How do we stand out? What can we be doing from our end to help drive better outcomes when it's not uncommon for us to be excluded from the strategy side?
linkon-axon-_1_01-24-2024_141433:Yeah, no, it's a really good point. I mean, when you're dealing with a partnership ecosystem in the in the SAS space, especially, I mean, you're dealing with a lot of different parties, and that can be just in, like, in respect to the internal parties that you have to deal with. So, you know, you've got your developers, you've got your consultants, your ISVs, your device and hardware, your VARs, your distributors, your cloud MSP, system integrators, incubators, accelerators, could be, you know, a bunch of people that you're already dealing with. Um, What we advocate, um, uh, within my org at the moment is that the, um, operations has kept front and center of, um, the partner program. They, uh, we have daily meetings, uh, with partner operations and we have a weekly all team meeting, um, with, uh, operations, uh, as well, who are a part of that. So they very much have a seat at the table. Um, we make sure that, you know, we, uh, are all using. That sort of we grow, you grew mentality where we're keeping, you know, again, the customer value at the forefront of everything that we do, and everybody is involved in that. There's not one person who doesn't, who isn't involved in increasing that end client value proposition. Um, and again, partner ops is part of that. Um, yeah, I think comms cadence is, is a, is a big one. Um, I think, especially for, um, operations to help. Decrease or minimize the maximum risk of something of an oversight. Um, especially when it comes operationally. Um, operations permeates throughout most of the partner program journey. And that's why, you know, they're placed first and foremost, um, at the beginning. Um, so that, you know, that that Unity engine that I speak about, um, is functioning correctly. Um, so, yeah, I think, you know, comms cadence really important, you know, feedback loops. you know, preferred comms is also a really big one. You know, we have to communicate at the right time to the right people in the right way at the right time for the right reason. Um, and I think partner opposite that's even more important because they're dealing with so many different, um, external and internal, um, influences that, um, it's vitally important to, to keep, um, that structure, uh, that we've talked about. Um, First and foremost, in place and, and communicating between everyone involved, but also being flexible enough to allow the changes that happen in all operations roles, um, to be able to be, um, have enough of a buffer, um, zone to be able to Pivot when need to, um, to make sure that we're maintaining that client, um, value proposition in the best way possible.
aaron--he-him-_1_01-24-2024_081432:You hit him several things there too. And, and sorry, you just got me thinking about lots of things. So earlier this week, uh, Jen Waltz, who's the VP of partnerships at Kron made a post about organizational structure. Um, I haven't had a chance to chat with Jen one to one yet. She has agreed to come join me on the podcast. And so we're gonna go, I'm gonna go deep with her on this topic because it's got me thinking all week and everything that you just talked about also has me thinking about the organizational structure. It's, uh, it's visible, you know, when I think about all the roles that I've had and I frankly had too many, um, if you look at my work history, it's the layoffs, it's everything else. Right. Um, so the benefit of seeing lots of organizations as I've seen lots of structures, um, It also is difficult because the thing I have to fight coming in from partner operations is great. I know who my leaders are, right? I'm in a unique slot in that right now I work at a company where I'm in a program role over operations. I'm not in an operations seat, so I don't roll up to the rev ops team. I'm not rolling up to the central operations. Anything like that. Um, I have worked on Rev Ops teams. I have been a part of partner teams in the past, so I've been a part of a lot of different structures. When you talk about partner operations like where you're at, and also if you think about like consulting and going forward, like if you go to companies, I imagine you will occur, you'll encounter lots of companies all over the place. One thing I've told people who've told me before, like Aaron, you should really be consulting. I'm like, I appreciate that. That feels like a nice compliment, but nobody pays for partner operations. I think it's hard enough to get people to pay for partnership consulting. When you're going into an organization, both where you're at now, and when you get into consulting, where would you put partner operations? Where does this role tend to live within the organization? Why do you want to put it there? Things like that.
linkon-axon-_1_01-24-2024_141433:Yeah, no, it's a really good question. Um, yes, I think you're right. I think that's unfortunately quite systemic throughout. Um, Uh, C suite leadership and leadership executive teams that when they first think of partnerships or they have a legacy partnership program that they're running that they might want to optimize, um, where, where do I go first? Where's my first port of call? You know, um, do we, do we need that? Um, You know, laying the foundations, mapping the leavers, joining the dots and laying the pipeline that an experienced partner professional can do for us, maybe even fractionally, um, to make sure that those structures are in place that we've spoken about, um, or do we, we need somebody that actually can run the structure that we do. We hang the partner framework on to be successful to generate that in client value proposition. Um, I would say, you know, you need the partner manager, obviously, to run a partnership program. Partner Ops, in my opinion, comes second. I mean, I, I think, you know, you've got essentially you're talking about a promise and a delivery. So the partnership managers there, they're promising. This is what we're going to do for you. This is how we're going to do it. This is the structure and, and here's our tangible ROI driven by metrics and data speaking the language of leadership. But. The delivery of it is a completely different, um, ballgame. So there, that's what I see between essentially those two. And those two have to meet up in the middle to create that value proposition, um, successfully, um, to be able to run that, uh, that engine room, um, of the partner, which essentially is the promise of the partner program and what it will deliver. And the delivery of that promise, um, that essentially then ends up being the partner experience and the customer experience that drives that value proposition.
aaron--he-him-_1_01-24-2024_081432:I think what's important to call out, I want to make sure this was very clear in case there was an audio break or anything else. You are saying partner leader. Second hire partner ops. Maybe not somebody dedicated to ops, but you need to, you need an operator to join you to help execute them. Did I pick up that right?
linkon-axon-_1_01-24-2024_141433:Yeah, a hundred percent. It's
aaron--he-him-_1_01-24-2024_081432:I like that he's nodding his head. Yes. By the way, if you're listening to this audio, I'm getting the nod. I think he's excited. Um, right. It's. Marco DePalos talks about this, and this is a story, one of my favorite stories. He's got a really great, I don't know Marco DePalos or not. You should go find him on LinkedIn. He's got a really good story of a one year build, like from zero to millions of dollars and how he did it. And one of the many steps he's got outlined in his. Roadmap is like his second hire was his first hire actually behind himself was partner operations. Um, I've harped on that. I think that's critical. I don't think people talk about it enough. So again, that's why I'm here. It's what I do. I agree with you. I'll say that I think it's early stage. And what I tend to see is that program program people tend to be operations people by default, because you don't have dedicated operations support. So if you, if you're trying to hire a strong programs person, you do need to vet that operational background. Um, conversely. Like, I don't, I don't really have a program background. That's kind of what makes me a weird fish in some of this water. Sometimes is I'm, I'm in operations. I come through business operations and my tendency, my mental leanings are more towards system operations than revenue operations. I know I got a good friend in the industry. She loves the RevOps side. She loves being deep in the RevOps side, building out that stuff, structuring it. I'm happy to advise and consult and help RevOps know what they need to do and where to focus. But I, I'm more concerned probably for me. On the experience and on the systems and working with business systems for project management, PMO driving change, which one of those two focuses, right? And I could probably do both. I'm just honestly less interested in the, in the nuance of revenue, I think mainly because you end up always fighting with direct, right? Like, I don't want to fight with direct direct wins. This would be really fair. If you've got a conflict between direct needs and partnership needs, In a non partner driven organization,
linkon-axon-_1_01-24-2024_141433:A hundred percent.
aaron--he-him-_1_01-24-2024_081432:direct wins and partnership kind of has to make up. I mean, so all that to say, when you talk about the structure, I love that you're saying, Hey, ops needs to be early in stage. Are you putting that into the program team? Like a part of the partnership team? Do you think that role needs to live under rev ops or under business systems or business operations? Do you care? And maybe you don't even care as long as they're there.
linkon-axon-_1_01-24-2024_141433:Yeah, absolutely. I think they permeate almost the, the whole, um, life cycle journey, buyer's journey. built on that structure. I'm a, I'm a leader who's driven by structure and strategy. Um, and, and so for me, you need, um, it's, it's a necessity. It's not something that is a luxury. In my opinion, we have thousands of hard working teams of one partner professionals out there who we all know and love, um, who do a great job and wear all of the hats. Um, uh, but I think when you get to a point, uh, where Um, it's it's it's probably org size dependent. Then it's you have to, uh, you have to make sure that you're delegating, um, those, those issues and those challenges, uh, and the things that not necessarily go right, but the things that go wrong. You want to be concentrating on building those relationships with those partners because that's what drives that trust and that relationship. Um, uh, structure forward rather than being so transactional. It needs to be relationship driven. And, um, I think off the back of that, you need to be focusing on making sure that that is the priority, um, where. Then partner ops comes off the back of that. Who do they report directly to? Um, I have a couple of, um, controversial opinions about that. Um, even just down to the partner managers. I don't think partner managers should, um, report to, um, CROs, for example, whereas many people do because I just don't believe that the, the, uh, you can hang a partnership framework onto a CRO strategy. Um, I think it's, I think they need to be a direct to report. CEO. And I think they need to be there at the table because it is such an umbrella, um, uh, solution and motion that, um, and I think from a partner upside of things, I think they're almost exactly the same. I think they, you know, they permeate so many different rumblings and, you know, and strategy and structure that, um, underpins the foundations of every successful partner program. And pretty much every successful partner program I've seen now, um, has had a partner ops team program. underneath or behind or in front or around, um, a partner program, um, which then allows those partner professionals, um, to attract, uh, those all important leaves to, um, drive. Those results that C suite are looking for.
aaron--he-him-_1_01-24-2024_081432:Yeah, I think you did say, you said it's a little bit controversial. I think you're, you're not wrong. I like what you mentioned, your comment about the CRO, right? I am seeing that trend in terms of conversations we have. Um, partner people are, and it's a big, it's a big question right now. Is the partnership leader a C level role? Is it a head of partnerships, uh, chief partnership officer, whatever you want to call it? Um, Yeah. I've worked in, again, with the size of the organization I've worked in, I, I try not to get too wrapped up in, in like, you know, who's the, who's the boss, who's the, you could talk about hierarchies and how that influences narrative development all day long. When I think about partnerships, I am, I'm shifting in my mindset a little bit on kind of the other way toward the idea like recognizing that partnerships. Are part of the go to market rhythm, right? That's where I think the programs come in as incentives. So we have incentive structured programs that drive partner behavior that reward partners. But I do think there's maybe room for the relationship aspect. That's non sales oriented, right? We're keeping the partner happy. How do we comp those people on performance? What's the purpose of partnerships? Um, and that I see partnerships roll up in different ways, right? The PAMs that I've worked with, um, historically, Have been really deep on the sales end of the partner relationship. So they bring in a new integration partner to actually come in and build out an integration. And they get great. They pass that piece off to the product team. So the product now has partner relationship management responsibilities that are getting the product up and running, make sure the integration step. And the PAM may not think about that. That may be, you know, once they get connected, the PAM is going to move on. And that's where I come in and look at. That's a space for me. I feel like as an ops professional to come in and say, Hey, let's make sure that project is running good. So if I'm looking at like the partner operations side, um, and we're going to wrap up here in a couple of minutes, cause I know you've got a hard stop and I've got a hard stop. If I look at the partner operations side, I want to start just a couple of things here is that you mentioned they should be an early hire. It almost sounds like, um, and this is just me reading between the lines. If you're going to begin a new program, I don't know why we talk about this so much because there's a lot of existing programs that don't even have operations, but if you're bringing in an operations person, that first hire, um, would you rather that person be project focused or like Avenue, like, like again, partner ops rev ops, or do you think that really just depends on the needs of the specific business?
linkon-axon-_1_01-24-2024_141433:Yeah, it's a great question. Um, I think you've got to two verticals here. When you talk about that, we're talking about strategy and vision and we're talking about implementation. And I think that we both need to lead to a partner first strategy. Um, that's where that road should lead in every stage. Um, the, the, the strategy and the vision side of things is very much, you know, again, mapping the levers, joining the dots and et cetera, et cetera. Um, whereas the implementation side of things is, is very much heavily a partner operations role. Um, and in my, um, In my experience, you have to tie those together or you don't have the experience that you're looking for, you know, I mean, ultimately partnership professionals, um, you're looking to provide your partners with net new conversations and net new customers. Simple as that, um, provided to them via. Either two main processes, which are resources and relationships. Now you think after you said that you think, well, where does partner operations fit into all of this? Well, you can't drive those initiatives and you can't drive those emotions without having, uh, an operational structure around you, um, that when you do board and these new clients and customers and leads via your relationships and your resources that you provide to them, um, you just, you just won't have the, uh, the, the bandwidth, especially if you've got quoted at Phil. Um, To be able to adequately concentrate on, uh, on those, uh, those vitally important aspects. Um, and yeah, partner operations is at the middle of that, you know, values aren't a commodity, you know, we have to make sure that, that basic business is being done, results are being won, um, and partnerships at the end of the day are, are they people led, they are tech enabled, and then they're revenue focused. In a nutshell, um, and I think if you don't have the structural foundations from a partner ops point of view, the thing that you do actually miss out on is probably two out of those three being people driven and tech enabled. Then you don't lead that doesn't lead you down the path of results. And yeah, if you don't align, create, engage and support on that partnership journey, which partners are and essentially you're treating partners as part of your team operations have to be part of your team or not at all.
aaron--he-him-_1_01-24-2024_081432:Yeah, man, Lincoln. I've got so many more things I think we could get into from this conversation that we haven't gotten into, because you've mentioned like, uh, the tech enabled, right? So that, that, that whole, whole, like. Another hour, we could probably chat around, like, what do you think is happening in partner tech? What's your favorite partner tech? What platforms are you preferring for kind of how you execute programs? I think ISVs as because they, again, it's a broad swath of things that we could talk about. So thank you for giving me this half hour. I do really appreciate the insight on where you see the role fitting. Um, mainly because I think for what I'm looking at for my own career, but also for the career of the people that I'm in community with around partner operations, there's just no roadmap. Right now. My boss asked me a few weeks ago, where do you want to be in five years? I'm like, that depends on the story that we get to tell here. Um, I don't, you know, it's like, it really does. Um, so working on the projects, working on a good story for myself and then also helping, helping others think about where this fits. Um, okay. So in a week you're launching, uh, let's wrap up super quick here. Where can people find you if they want to reach out, ask you more questions. I know you're on LinkedIn. We can look you up on there. I'll put a link to that in the show notes as well. Where else, uh, you know, what are you, what are you looking for in terms of like. Conversations wanting to help people with.
linkon-axon-_1_01-24-2024_141433:Yeah, absolutely. So I'm concentrating on the, the B2B, uh, SAS scale up space. Um, I've been in the SAS industry, as you know, for the last three years, building a successful partner program. Um, you can find me at arysconsultants. com. That's A R Y S consultants. com. Um, and yeah, active on LinkedIn and, um, yeah, I'm. Essentially, uh, narrowed down a version two of my offers. I've had a soft opening. I'm now hard opening and pulling the trigger on the program. And, uh, yeah, doing various consulting assessments, workshops, courses, one to one partners, training, uh, et cetera, et cetera. So yeah, really excited. Really looking forward to it. Super scared, but, uh, we're going to get there.
aaron--he-him-_1_01-24-2024_081432:Well, that means you may be doing something right. Right. I like, always like the challenges to feel a little bit bigger than me. And I think launching on your own is, uh, always a little challenging. It's
linkon-axon-_1_01-24-2024_141433:absolutely. Yeah, I probably chewed up.
aaron--he-him-_1_01-24-2024_081432:you for joining. Uh, listen. I'm going to wrap this up real quick, folks. I'll have show notes. I'll have some links to Lincoln stuff in the, in the show notes as well. If you want to follow up, please reach out to Lincoln. He's good for a follow. He's really good for engagement. I mean, we've been, we've been connected a few months and, uh, it's been a, it's been good learning experience. I think, I think that's what I like the most about being in partnerships is always opportunity to learn. Um, as we get ready for another week, folks, I was always, thank you for listening. Please share, please subscribe. Um, let me know if we can do anything better. Um, until we talk next time, guys, good luck partnering.