Navigating Jealousy: Transforming Insecurity into Strength Within the Relationship

Have you ever found yourself gripped by the green-eyed monster, feeling like it might just tear your relationships apart? You're not alone. On the red couch today, we're unraveling the intricate patterns of jealousy and how it can show up not just between lovers, but among family members and colleagues too. Reflecting on personal journeys, we examine the intertwining of professional aspirations with our home lives, and how these strands can sometimes weave a complex web of envy and competition.

Dive deep with us as we dissect the murky waters of jealousy and insecurity, particularly through the lens of a stay-at-home mom whose world has been upended by self-doubt. It's a raw look at how feelings can often masquerade as facts, and the importance of distinguishing between the two. We'll talk about the pitfalls of actions like snooping that can fracture the trust you've built with your partner, and the brave step of confronting the past to pave the way for a more secure future. This episode is a guide through the thorny brambles of emotions, helping you find a path to open communication and empathy.

As we wrap up, we turn the spotlight on the power of vulnerability and the strength it takes to lay bare our deepest fears to someone we love. We're offering not just insights but also practical tools, like the use of "I statements," to articulate feelings without blame. And for those moments when the journey seems too challenging to face alone, we're here to extend a hand with an invitation for a free strategy call to provide personalized support. So, whether you're looking to fortify your relationships or simply seeking a deeper understanding of yourself, join us—because it's time to transform jealousy from a foe to an ally in love and life.

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Transcript

Amy: 0:01

Welcome everyone to another episode of Thrive Again, your relationship podcast. We are on the red couch today and hope everyone is well out there. How are you going?

Michael: 0:12

I'm good, thanks, I'm doing well, and we've just been on a bit of a trip away for a few weeks and we've been working on the road a little bit with our couples and our individual clients as well, and getting back into the swing of 2024 and I'm wondering how it's feeling for the audience because for a lot of people and I just facilitated a men's circle last night for a lot of people, everyone seems to be going through a little micro crisis of sorts, and some of them are big, big problems and some of them are not so big, but they still provide a lot of challenges and, and certainly today we really wanted to unpack an issue that is going on in many relationships around the world and and it's something that we have been working through with some couples as well and that is the dynamic that is jealousy and how this is impacting relationships.

Amy: 1:10

Yeah, it's a. It's a good topic because I think often it's unspoken, we kind of just push it away or we manage it differently, or sometimes it can actually really be very vocal and obvious in a relationship. So there's lots of dynamics here, to varying degrees, of what impact or effect jealousy has on the relationship for you and your particular situation, but I think it's a good one to tune into. We're going to share a couple of things that maybe you haven't thought about with jealousy and maybe potentially ways that you can manage it better if it's impacting you on whatever degree, whether it's causing heaps of conflict and upset or whether it's actually just kind of underlying and causing some niggling issues.

Michael: 1:58

Yeah, so, with jealousy, let's just accept that it's a type of vulnerability. You know it's. It's something that is part of us as humans, and to a varying degree. You know. It's really prominent in some people and that's based on past experiences.

Michael: 2:20

You know it's based on our makeup, how we actually see ourselves as well. That directly impacts how much jealousy we experience or how much we perceive outside of us with our partner and our partner's interactions. And because if I believe that I'm not good enough or that I'm subpar in comparison to other people, other men, then I'm naturally going to drop into a fear based reality, which may translate to jealousy.

Michael: 2:54

Where I'm, you know, I'm worried that I'm not good enough and that someone else out there is better than me, and that you know, in our example, that Amy might be wooed over by a guy who has the runs on the board, who has, you know, a kind of fitter body than me, who has like more emotional presence, who has da-da-da-da-da, and we can go on with the story that we create in our mind, right, and this can be super damaging.

Amy: 3:22

Yeah, and I think there's different types of jealousy too. Obviously there's that insecurity side that you talk about, but there's also the jealousy of like the jealousy of you going to work. I remember that was my experience, you know Like I remember the fact that you got to leave the house and go off to work when the kids were little. There was a kind of like an underlying jealousy in myself that wishing that I could be going to do that because I was at home with the kids and I was grateful for that. But there was times where I didn't want to be at home with the kids, I wanted to be going out and doing things for myself. So, yeah, so there's that sort of jealousy too. So there's kind of different, varying degrees of jealousy and I think that's important to highlight that it doesn't have to be, you know, jealous of a boy or a girl impacting their relationship, but it could be just what the dynamics are of a relationship and what the other person does or doesn't do.

Michael: 4:17

Yeah, absolutely, and I totally agree with what you're saying with regards to, yeah, me going to work, and I think the part of this process we'll get into is understanding your triggers. So we will step into that shortly so that you can become aware of why you're experiencing that feeling or that jealousy. And I'm imagining that when I was going to work, you know you would see me having access to socialization, I was able to get outside in the world, I was able to exercise my ambition, I felt like I had purpose and so maybe, I don't know, was that something that you felt you were devoid of at that point in time in your life?

Amy: 5:01

Yeah, for sure.

Michael: 5:03

Yep, yeah, so we can see. You know that often this is a perfect reflection of where we're not being, you know, fed, or we're not getting our needs met or our life, when we're not happy in ourselves. So I think, firstly, I'd like to just reference what John Gottman says. So, for those of you who don't know, john and Julie created the Gottman Institute and they are really the leaders in terms of relationships and education around relationships, I should say. And when asked about jealousy, john Gottman said I believe that every person has areas of enduring vulnerability. For a marriage to succeed, these vulnerabilities need to be understood and honoured.

Amy: 5:52

Yeah, that's a really good point about jealousy because it can be turned and flipped on its head, because, instead of something that we avoid in relationships, jealousy can actually be an opportunity to connect and understand each other in a whole different way, which can be really beautiful in the connection process.

Michael: 6:12

again, yeah, that's right. It totally flips jealousy on its head. So, instead of something to avoid in relationships, jealousy all of a sudden becomes an opportunity to connect, and I want to. We're gonna share some ways in which we can flip this around so that it becomes a source of connection.

Michael: 6:29

You know, a source of openness and connectedness between the two of you, rather than it be this like Tumor that's in between the two of you that's causing Resentment and separation. We want to actually see if we can help you to to use this to connect both of you better.

Amy: 6:51

So let's maybe dive into maybe our own experiences. I think I mentioned before, you know, one of the the times where I've experienced the feeling of jealousy and remembering like jealousy is a feeling or an emotion that we can feel, and that was when, you know, you would go off to work and I would be at home and and I think those other times, you know, in that time, where I found myself obviously being a new mom, maybe carrying a bit more extra weight, maybe, you know, not obviously prioritizing my own self-care because I was dedicated to the kids where I did feel like insecure. I had my own insecurities on what I Felt like in terms of my body image and Myself esteem. So that impacted on the way I was feeling, because it led all of these thoughts Down such a big rabbit hole that created this real feeling of jealousy within myself and and jealousy of what?

Michael: 7:57

jealousy of other women.

Amy: 7:59

Yeah, jealousy of other women, yeah, jealousy, like I said, like you're going off to work, and I created all sorts of stories in my head. I don't think there was ever any evidence. But when you're a stay-at-home mom and you're sleep deprived and your, you know your body's changed and you probably Aren't in your best space at that time, then, yeah, my mind Definitely Kept racing away with the worst-case scenarios. I'm sure he's like why would you want to be with me? Why would you know? I'm sure there's many other better things out there. You know he's going to interact with all these different people, like those, those female ambulance officers. When you're in the ambulance there was, you know, different people that you would go and catch up with and hang out with, and all of those things crossed my mind, definitely. But I think it was lucky for me that I was able to kind of like Notice the difference between the feeling nor the fact. You know, like I was able to pull myself out of those moments with by questioning Is that really true?

Michael: 9:03

or is that something that?

Amy: 9:04

I'm creating in my own mind which our mind is amazing at kind of trying to protect ourselves.

Michael: 9:11

But what you just said, there is a powerful little practice actually that a lot of people wouldn't be aware of. So that comes with self-awareness, literally just being aware of self in those moments when you feel a negative type emotion. So you just said, like what was the question? Is that so or is that true?

Amy: 9:33

Yeah, it's just like the feeling versus the fact, like is it actually true what I'm I'm feeling, or Is it something that I'm actually creating?

Amy: 9:41

in myself, so yeah, and looking for evidence like so, if I question that so, is that true? Where am I seeing it? Like? Why do I think that? And you know, I could kind of scour through my mind of, well, he's coming home, he's not, you know, doing this, he's not doing that, he's like actually there's no evidence. So, therefore, I can let that kind of rest and I can remind myself that that's only my mind creating that.

Michael: 10:11

Right. So some people, though, would struggle with that, in that they would feel it, and then they would ask is this true? And then they would Look for the facts, but they look for it in an unhealthy way, wouldn't they like they?

Michael: 10:28

could actually Start to dig deep into you know, like in your experience, like into his phone, trying to find evidence, going on some sort of frantic journey to look for, you know, evidence that this is actually the truth and actually playing out. And I guess the danger of this is that your mind is very, very powerful at almost creating some seed of evidence which can then be blown out into something bigger than it actually is. But equally, if you have suspicion and you're pushing away that gut feeling, then that's unhealthy too, right. If you're suspecting that there actually is some foul play here or that he is actually out doing some dodgy things and you don't want to ignore that gut intuition, then you know, then the mind actually is kind of a powerful tool. So it's, you know, again asking that question is this true, is this based on facts? And starting, just slow on that process and just without going into searching for evidence, just search for evidence in yourself first and then, and what has led you to that, to that thought process?

Amy: 11:39

Yeah, exactly. So if you're doing things like you know, checking your partner's phone or email without their permission, like maybe if you're assuming that, that you know that you're not, your partner is not attracted to you because of some sort of reason that you've created in yourself, so that's making an assumption there If you're maybe grilling your partner on where they've been all the time and and not trusting what they're saying, then that's the negative impact of jealousy on a relationship, because all of those things are only because you've kind of created that. There's no evidence behind that. So that's the important point that we recognize we're like, oh, I'm feeling all of these things and my behaviors are showing up in all of these kind of maybe not nice ways, as far as like looking for evidence on their phones and emails and all that kind of stuff, then it's time to kind of maybe step back and actually be open and vulnerable with your partner about what you're experiencing.

Michael: 12:40

Yeah, for sure, and we will get into that. And I think, on the on the other side of that, if you are dropping into these unhealthy habits like checking, you know, looking into my phone and my emails and grilling me about where I am all the time, that has, of course, an effect on you in terms of your energy expenditure, right, because you're worrying all the time. But secondly, like onto the partner, like what's happening there is that they are experiencing a level of like mistrust, like she doesn't trust me, and that in itself can be consuming and, over time, this can actually really collapse an entire relationship due to just the energy that's been expended in this area, right? So, although we're going to give you some tips and ways to manage this, it may actually be a process of inquiring as to why I feel jealous in the first place, which is obviously, you know, a place that you might want to inquire in, because past relationships, often we bring baggage into our current relationships. You know, we, we bring experiences of mistrust.

Amy: 13:56

And that's what I think is important is an understanding your triggers from the past and how they're impacting the present. And that's okay, of course, we've all got that stuff. But if you're aware of that, then that's maybe something that's really important to be able to share with your partner, to let them know hey, this has happened to me in the past and it and it does trigger me or it does kind of make me feel really uncomfortable. Right, yeah, that can be an opportunity right there.

Michael: 14:23

Yeah, and you spoke about feelings versus fact. Let me be clear on this Feelings are feelings and they are the truth. So now what that does that translate to? It being a true, like a true thing? That's happened. No, like as in. Just because I feel worried that my partner is whatever cheating on me doesn't mean that it's true. But what is true is that I feel that way.

Amy: 14:50

Right.

Michael: 14:51

So that needs to be honored by your partner in order to have a thriving, healthy relationship. So what we're speaking about here is fun being vulnerable, being open with your partner to that level where you can actually speak up about.

Michael: 15:07

Hey, honey, I'm really I love that you're going out with your friends tonight and I really want you to do that and I know that it's in really important to you. Is it okay to just I just want to let you know that right now I'm feeling super insecure. I don't really know why. I trust you. I know that you're a good man, I know that you have supported me over all these years, but, for whatever reason, I just feel really, really insecure, that I'm just not really enough and for whatever reason, I kind of I worry that some other woman is going to be better than me and you know, I just can't help but jump into these worst case scenarios. That's a start and an opportunity to start into that, that space of vulnerability where you're just speaking your truth, using I statements it's me, it's, it's you know, this is my experience.

Amy: 16:01

I think there's a good point that Brene Brown makes about this, because she talks about the fact that vulnerability is actually the birthplace of love, belonging, joy, courage. So in her perspective, she believes that having vulnerability allows that space of deeper love, deeper connection, understanding, so that that what you just shared is being truly vulnerable. Yes, your feelings are your feelings and they're true for you, but it doesn't mean that they are actually fact. But it can be a really beautiful opportunity to express that to your partner, to be able to share that vulnerability, to allow each other to kind of drop into, you know, that deep connection.

Michael: 16:46

And I think I mean the response might be something like oh my God, you know I'm. I just want you know there might be a reassurance that comes through this that, hey, I'm really sorry that you feel that way, like it's. You know, I'm sure that's really really hard for you and I want to provide as much reassurance as I can. But I just need to know from you how I can provide that. Can you speak about what might help in this process? And now we're gaining feedback, we're gaining some clarity into what's important for for your partner to help ease that internal disruption that happens.

Amy: 17:24

So I think jealousy in itself has always got a bad rap. You know you can't be jealous. Don't be jealous. You know, don't have jealousy in your relationship.

Michael: 17:32

And like like it's unhealthy. There's a level of shame also there like because you want to hide that you're jealous, you want to seem like you're secure. Yeah, everyone wants to present to like I'm secure, I'm fine, we got this, we're a great couple.

Amy: 17:43

Yeah, yeah for sure. But that's what I kind of want to also point out that actually jealousy is not a bad thing to have in a relationship. It's actually quite a healthy feeling because it means there's so much, means you care, that means that you you know, you're actually conscious of what potential could be there. But that's where I would love you guys to kind of look inside and go. How can I turn this feeling of jealousy into a space of communication and vulnerability?

Michael: 18:13

Yeah, and next level of communication, because the communication that often we see when couples come to us is it's just frustration and resentment and it comes out in in just unhealthy statements in the language that's been used in, like people are critical of their partner.

Amy: 18:33

And that's okay too, because you're hurting right.

Michael: 18:35

Yeah.

Amy: 18:35

Yeah, that's the only reason why they're speaking like that is because there's a pain or a hurt underlying all of that. But yeah, that's that's the the awareness level we need to help people to understand that, that pain and that suffering. When you're using statements are like oh, you never think about me or I bet you're probably, you know, looking online for other things or I don't know, you know those sorts of things. They can just become from a real place of hurt and you're not able to express that true feeling of what you're really experiencing on the inside.

Michael: 19:07

Yeah, so that's actually what we really really love helping couples with is dropping from that layer, that surface layer of frustration, down into the deep emotion that's underlying that. And that actually comes with practice and sometimes guidance and and I bet, but you can absolutely do this on your own and it starts with just having the courage to speak your truth, the courage to speak your emotion, you know, to really open up. But it does require your partner to allow that to land.

Amy: 19:41

And that's sometimes.

Michael: 19:43

Sometimes that's the missing piece and it can be tricky, you know, if your partner gets defensive because they feel like they're not trusted, then they see that as a threat. Why can't you trust me? I'm not like your last partner. You know you can see how easily it can become about them. Yet the person who's experiencing the jealousy is just trying to connect right. They've just opened up funnably, so pay attention to those moments.

Amy: 20:14

Yeah, and I think also, you know, an opportunity for those couples that are there too is to have those really clear boundaries. You know, I think that's when, if there's a grey area or a couple is unsure about what's okay and what's not okay, because you know, maybe past relationships for someone it was okay, but this relationship it's not. So having those types of conversations to help clear up those boundaries so there is no uncertainty, helps to settle and feel safe in a relationship, to be able to either move forward through jealousy or to be able to have a deeper understanding of each other in a relationship too.

Michael: 20:53

Right, so actually mapping out what's okay and what's not okay. I think that's really important.

Amy: 20:58

Yeah.

Michael: 20:58

Like that's a process that we help couples with too, isn't it like in the relationship agreement, actually establishing an agreement which sounds a bit contract-like? But it doesn't need to be like that. It can just be sitting down and just saying, hey, I'm really curious to know what you think's okay and not okay in terms of me catching up with women, for example, because you might say I'm actually okay with you catching up with women as long as I know them.

Michael: 21:21

You know as long as I'm comfortable with them and I trust them. I've met them and I, you know, feel okay with that. That there's nothing there. But otherwise I will feel insecure, I will feel jealous, I will feel like I'm second best. If you just go out or if you don't tell me, that's obviously something that's really not okay. So just mapping out the intricacies of what's okay and what's not okay in terms of meeting up with other people would be a really good start, yeah, and you might find that changes too, which is great, you know.

Amy: 21:52

You might find that, you know, after a few years of evidence of seeing that that trust is built and you don't feel that maybe insecurity or that jealousy anymore, then it's easier to kind of drop into more of that richness and presence in a relationship as opposed to the fear and worry. Yeah. So I think there's a few things in that episode and in that sharing of different ways to see jealousy in a relationship. Often it's very labelled negative, but let's see if we can switch that and create a space of vulnerability and openness to be able to get connection in this space.

Michael: 22:33

Yeah, for sure, and I think also just opening up that opportunity for you to explore if there's something to be healed from the past, you know, because sometimes that can be a perpetual problem that exists in this relationship and any other relationships that you may fall into into the future. It can really dramatically affect every dynamic. Until you face that, until you can isolate that and there are ways in which, you know, even we can help in that process, but there's a lot of practitioners out there that can help to guide, help you guide safely back to experiences where you've experienced mistrust and help to kind of see things from a different perspective.

Amy: 23:15

So yeah, I think that is us today. But what I want to also just mention is that if your partner's unable to hold that space for you to have those conversations, if you don't feel it's safe to have the vulnerable conversations about how you're feeling and experiencing jealousy in your relationship, then I would say that that's a pretty big red flag and you probably need to either take some action into seeking some help, some professional help, or just assessing the way maybe you're approaching it as well. So, just being mindful, it's always eye statements, but, yeah, if you need any help with any of this sort of stuff, please reach out. We're here to help you guys. We offer a free strategy call and I feel like that would be a great place to start so we can highlight, I guess, what you're wanting and what is happening at the moment in your relationship.

Michael: 24:09

Yeah, beautiful guys, thanks for listening and we will catch you on the next episode.

Amy: 24:15

See you guys.