Pioneering Perspectives

Manufacturing the Future with Philip Morton

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0:00 | 41:30

 Welcome back to the Pioneering Perspectives Podcast! In this episode, “Manufacturing the Future,” we’re joined by Philip Morton, Founder of PM Technologies. Philip shares how he turned his background in mechanical engineering and additive manufacturing into a company focused on on-demand, point-of-need production for defense and advanced manufacturing. He talks about starting during COVID, pivoting into defense tech, securing a $190K federal contract, and building within El Paso’s growing innovation ecosystem. 

Whether you’re an aspiring entrepreneur or a seasoned founder, Philip’s journey highlights resilience, technical innovation, and the drive to build something that lasts. 

Now available to watch on YouTube! Link: https://youtu.be/2VCbl2nqJwc  

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Music:
♪ Onion (Prod. by Lukrembo)
Link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KGQNrzqrGqw 

SPEAKER_00

Howdy, y'all. Welcome back to another episode of the Pioneering Perspectives Podcast. My name is Michelle Kirsten Tubbs, Strategic Operations Specialist at Pioneers21, and I'll be your host for today's episode. Pioneers21 is one of the first and longest running incubators in the border region. Our mission is to inspire and incubate businesses and entrepreneurs through mentorship, training, and connection. Thank you for being with me, Philip. How are you?

SPEAKER_02

I'm doing well. How are you today?

SPEAKER_00

Doing good. Thanks for asking. I'm excited to jump into the questions.

SPEAKER_02

Okay, yeah, let's do it.

SPEAKER_00

So I'd like to know a little bit about yourself. Tell me a little bit about yourself and your background.

SPEAKER_02

Okay, so I was a mechanical engineering undergrad student at UTEP here in El Paso. I got the opportunity to do a lot of research while as an undergrad. And probably more important or most important for the company is I got into the Keck Center, the, you know, it's a big 3D printing research center here in El Paso. I was a research assistant for a while, and then I got appointed to a research manager there. And that kind of started a lot of things off, gave me a lot of good experience in a lot of fields related to advanced manufacturing.

SPEAKER_00

And was that all within the time that you were completing your bachelor's?

SPEAKER_02

Um most of it I had so I graduated in uh 2014. Um and I want to say I started a master's pretty much directly after that. But I'd say within the first, you know, like six months or so of starting a graduate degree is when I got appointed to uh to be a staff member.

SPEAKER_00

Tell me a little bit about the experience, whether that's soft skills or that's technical skills that have helped you in the stage of what you're doing right now.

SPEAKER_02

It was, you know, I'd say it's a combination of all. So I did a lot of you know technical research, uh, wrote papers, filed patents, uh, you know, managed projects. But as a early on in my bachelor's, I also was like the guy in the lab of mixing the stuff together and you know, making doing reactions and different things. Um and then the soft skills, I think, also helped a lot because more toward the end, when I was a manager, I got a lot of opportunities to present, you know, talk to people, um, both at conferences, you know, in front of an audience, but also like uh meetings with our clients and customers where I was giving technical updates. So it was, you know, really a mix of both that I think helped a lot of you know where I'm at now. But yeah, for me, it's I think technical stuff is easier to understand than um, you know, I guess more communication, like telling storytelling type things is like I like to tell stories with data versus setting the stage. Yeah, yeah, it's a good thing.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, and I think a lot of engineers can relate to that. But let's talk into uh PM technologies. What inspired you to start PM technologies?

SPEAKER_02

Um, so I always wanted to start a company as a kid. Uh you know, I used to do like yard work in my neighborhood and you know, make little bits of money here and there, but um it's it's something I always wanted to do. Um for a long time I didn't really have an idea. Like, and while I was at the Keck Center, I got the opportunity to uh be part of some incubators and you know economic development activities. So I I got a call one night from my boss. Um and he tells me, Hey, do you do you want to start a company? I was like, Yeah, I've told you before I want to. And he's like, Well, do it. Like get on LegalZoom or whatever. Like, we're you know, we're setting up some stuff in Horizon City. Um, I was like, okay, so I didn't really have an idea, just you know, they needed companies, you know, there was some funding for different, you know, little bits of funding for this and that. Um and I guess one of the things, you know, kind of working with 3D printing, a big thing we initially got into was uh mass customization of products. So we built some software and we had um, you know, the first product we launched was a a rubber coaster. Um, they're the best coasters ever. We don't really sell them anymore, but it was a rubber coaster, silicone rubber, and we had a software algorithm that would basically engrave like a logo into the coaster, and then we put the mold and um you know, pour in the silicone and actually make them. Um and so that's kind of where it started. I mean, we've we've pivoted a few times from that, but yeah, just kind of spur of the moment, like, hey, you should start working on it. And it was kind of just finding, you know, where kind of my skills and what product potential kind of intersected, and it's it's changed quite a bit since then, but um, that's kind of where it started.

SPEAKER_00

So, what was the need that your boss was looking into? Like, what was the need to start PM technologies?

SPEAKER_02

I mean, that was just, you know, I want to say they were starting uh like UTEP and Horizon City were starting an incubator.

SPEAKER_00

Okay.

SPEAKER_02

Um, and so they needed people to fill it. And I had told them before, I'm like, yeah, you know, I want to start a company at some point. Um, so that just kind of happened. The product need was uh, you know, just I guess offering different types of like promotional products. So, you know, there's like I I forget all the names now, but like foreign print, right? Like you can get your water bottle and you get your logo like silk screened on it. We're trying to do something that's more like tactile, more 3D, um, and then leverage 3D printing to affordably make those products.

SPEAKER_01

Okay.

SPEAKER_00

So I want to talk a little bit into the team behind PM technologies. Is it just yourself or did you have a team when you first started?

SPEAKER_02

I mean, it's mostly been myself. I've had, you know, a few team members here and there uh kind of help out with different aspects of the business. Um, we've been doing this for five years and kind of where we started isn't really where we're at now. Um so it's changed a lot. But I'd say, you know, a big a big reason why we're still around is probably the customers that we've had. A lot of, you know, local small manufacturers that I've worked with have actually helped me out quite a bit.

SPEAKER_00

Oh wow.

SPEAKER_02

Um, you know, not only just being a customer, but um giving guidance, you know, letting me use their space before I had space, um, you know, to like put machines and things so that's that way it's not scattered all over the place.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah. At home.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, and like cramming everything into a small closet, and then when I needed something, having to dig through it all and find yeah, it was um, but yeah, we we've had a number of team members and customers have helped a lot to so is it just you right now? Yeah, right now it's just me. Um I had an engineer that just got a job with Exxon, so he left. But um, so yeah, I'm I'm alone right now, but hopefully not for too much longer.

SPEAKER_00

Are you looking into um having another team member on?

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, I think as um, you know, we have some contracts in the pipeline, and I think as those come online, I'll have to bring in more people. And um, I mean, we're also looking at raising some investment funds so that you know, if if we're able to raise those funds, then yeah, we'll we'll hire, you know, a small team probably.

SPEAKER_00

Definitely. So, how would you describe your company's role in El Paso's advanced manufacturing and defense environment?

SPEAKER_02

Um so I kind of described like where we started, right? Like mass customization of promotional goods. That's definitely not where we are now. I'd say where we pivoted was to what the Department of Defense calls expeditionary manufacturing.

SPEAKER_01

Okay.

SPEAKER_02

Um, so there's a number of systems, you know, that they're currently fielding and they're looking at more technologies. But, you know, if you imagine like a shipping container that has manufacturing equipment inside, so they can put it on the back of a truck, you know, drive it wherever, deploy it, and then they're able to make products in the field, basically. So that's kind of the space we occupy. Um, we've we've been working with the you know the defense industry, you know, maybe for about the past like two and a half years. And so I mean our our role is, you know, I think occupying that space is, you know, one, we're an advanced manufacturing company, so we have a lot of knowledge in um 3D printing. Um, we have knowledge in expeditionary manufacturing, which is you know of specific interest to the Department of Defense and and other industries. I mean, our our big focus is defense, but it's it's applicable elsewhere. Um and so that's you know, I I think we were one of the first, if not the first, um for sure startup company that started actually getting defense-related work here in the region? Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

Oh wow.

SPEAKER_02

Um, I mean, there's been some, you know, over the years, uh, I mean, with Fort Gliss here, there's a lot of military contracting, but um trying to keep that growing. Yeah. Um, yeah, that's what we're working on. So I mean, ideally, you know, if we're successful, we'll be that company that you know, the El Paso politicians or whoever, you know, gives speeches can like point to and like, yeah, we're like we're in this space now, you know, we've we've had some success. So that's you know, hopefully, right, we're definitely um for El Paso.

SPEAKER_00

So what were your early days like going into the company? Um, did you have any challenges or surprises that were able to turn your business into a real thing, like that moment where you're like, okay, this could actually work out?

SPEAKER_02

I mean, the the early days were really tough. Um, like I mentioned, we started out like promotional products, right? Where kind of our markets that we were wanting to hit were like hotels, restaurants, um, and we started in 2020. So I think March 2020 is when like COVID shut everything down. The bar and restaurant and hotel industry like struggled a lot. Um, so that kind of like shut out that big market. We, you know, we did have some sales with like people who would run Airbnbs and things, but um it was really tough early on. And and like I said, we had some good customers that had um work related to like vaccine development and things where you know, we're doing some product development for them. Um that kind of helped like weather that storm and keep the lights on, so to speak. Um but I think our kind of big moment that changed a lot was probably about two years ago or so. Um kind of talking to some of the contacts I made while I while I was working at UTEP um helped get us some you know decent sized contracts, and that's I think when some of that started to uh take off. Well, I shouldn't say take off, we're still still working, but um, you know, made made it feel more real, I guess, instead of being like, you know, the guy running around like asking people like, hey, do you do you need parts printed? Do you need parts designed? To like, okay, like we're we're actually developing something now. You know, we're getting to actually having a product out in the market.

SPEAKER_00

Definitely. Uh, I want to talk a little bit about the community and how the community resources have been out able to help you as a founder. Can you talk a little bit to that?

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, I mean, we've so since the beginning, I mean, we've tried to take advantage of as many resources as we could. Um, like I said, early on it was really tough. Um, but I think pretty much any and every um incubator, you know, startup related organization, we've probably worked with in town. Um, some of the big things that helped a lot, and and especially since we're um, you know, more of a hardware company is space was super important. Um and a lot of the organizations that gave us some space were you know pretty critical. Customers, you know, helped us out for a little while. We had space at the MCA. Um, you know, and then recently it's with the airport and the innovation factory, um, which has been really awesome because it's like the most space we've ever had. Um, and it, you know, it kind of lined up really well with, you know, as we're growing, this space kind of opened up for us. Um, and so that that helped a lot. I mean, we also met with a lot of mentors and coaches and um, you know, lots of people. I mean, it's uh yeah, I think everything helped, right? Um getting ideas from people, networking, introductions, opportunities, like like I said, we talked to everybody, and I think everybody we talked to helped us out in at least one way, you know, sometimes more.

SPEAKER_00

So and I think it definitely shows like that being part of this community has helped because I mean you started back in 2020, it's 2025, so you've been able to stay alive for five years now, yeah.

SPEAKER_02

Um, and like I said, that helped a lot. Like, if if we would have had to rent space somewhere, that would have been really tough. If um, you know, even some of the mentoring services, like learning about accounting and things that I again I've I've been doing this a long time, so I don't remember exactly where all the help came from, but um, you know, yeah, like learning accounting, right? Like I'm an engineer, I did some budgeting at UTEP because I manage projects, but nothing extensive. Yeah, it's like how do you do a like how do you project your cash flow? Um so again, I'd find you know, accountants and things that would just take time to you know talk with me and kind of show me like, yeah, this is how you do it. And and yeah, I think to your point, it's it's all the little things that I didn't necessarily have to you know pay for, which is really difficult early on, or do on your own, yeah, and kind of like mess up and then pay a lot and have to pay a lot of taxes or penalties or whatever. Um but yeah, I I think you know, El Paso in in general is kind of like that, right? Like you can always find people to help you, and and doing a startup is no different.

SPEAKER_00

Is that part of the reason why you've decided to stay in El Paso?

SPEAKER_02

Um, I mean, I like El Paso a lot. I was born and raised here. Um I wouldn't say like the the aspect of help is a big reason I stayed, but it's it's for sure been helpful. Um I think the biggest reason I decided to stay here, like you know, the big places for startups are like San Francisco, Austin, there's a lot of money there, investors and things. But um so being from here, when I graduated my bachelor's, I want to say something between like 90 to 95 percent of the engineering grads have to leave El Paso, right? Um and the big thing, you know, if you look at like what an economy needs to develop, it's engineers and like those high-paying jobs to stay in the city. We're a very service-oriented economy, you know, lots of logistics, lots of uh medical schools, things like that are the big employers, but not so much like design positions for engineers, um, which that uh I might be getting off on a tangent, but that's okay. Um like if you start designing parts here, then those design engineers will work with the local small and medium manufacturers, you know, drive their business, and then you create this like engine of like economic growth, right? But majority of the engineers that graduate from UTEP leave, right? Or, you know, there are some decent-sized companies here in Iwatez, but not so much the design side, it's more just manufacturing. Um, and I think that's been my biggest motivation to stay is I I would always tell the um students I'd work with, you know, like somebody's gotta try to do it, right? And I'm not saying I'm gonna be the one that's successful, but um, you know, kind of starting that and you know, saying, hey, I'm gonna actually stay here, you know, invest my time, try to build something locally to maybe spur, you know, real economic growth for the city. And then there's you know, there's a number of startups out there doing the same now, but again, it's like if if you're not willing to try to do it, why would you expect others to? And so I you know decided to stay and and try. Um, I think is the motivation to stay here.

SPEAKER_00

I think that's so powerful. That's definitely something huge.

SPEAKER_02

Well, yeah, thanks. I mean, it's like I said, I I've always been that guy, like yeah, if nobody else is gonna do it, I guess I'll I'll give it a shot, right? Even even growing up, like doing dumb things with my friends. It was for one reason or the other to guide a volunteer for yeah, for anything.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, exactly. Uh so you landed a $190,000 STTR contract, and that's huge. What was that process like? How did you get that opportunity?

SPEAKER_02

So STTR is they uh there, I forget what it stands for. It's small business technology transfer research. Um, so their grants for small businesses to do research, and STTRs specifically have to partner with a university or I think nonprofits qualify too, but kind of like have a research partner. Um and so I think everything kind of aligned for this. One specifically, it was you know geared toward a region I had worked in for a while, like expeditionary manufacturing, with a technology that we actually have a local machine manufacturer. Um I teamed up with UTEP, um, who at the time the Aerospace Center had a digital engineering cloud. Um, so we could basically use their resources, run simulations, you know, kind of like build a digital twin of the system. So they were our research partner. Um, who's the North American uh arm of O'Connor 3D, which is a German 3D printer manufacturer. Um, we're another partner, they're you know, local in El Paso. Uh, so they let us use or agreed to like kind of rent us or lease us their equipment so we could run some experiments. Um, and so it all kind of like worked out, like it was uh, you know, this like perfect topic for you know all the partners in the region. And then I I had background while I was at UTEP, we did a lot of training related to like expeditionary manufacturing. So I had some of the background on it. Like one one thing I used to get told a lot was, and and it might be true, but I might have just gotten lucky is these small business research grants, they usually like to have like a PhD or at least like a master's uh person, kind of lead them. I just have a bachelor's, so I kind of got lucky, I guess. I don't know, but like I said, it kind of felt like everything aligned for this one topic. And I was like, well, I I gotta submit a proposal, you know, put together a proposal, submitted it, and then we won, um, which was pretty awesome.

SPEAKER_00

So definitely huge.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah. And like I said, that's you know, probably around the time when it started feeling, all right, like um we're actually like have something to develop, like, you know, potential end customers, uh, because you know, if it's a topic, there's a need out there. Um, so yeah, I I think it was uh it was a great opportunity, I should say.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02

I used to say I'm lucky, but I don't know, look.

SPEAKER_00

Luck doesn't feel like the right word because it's um because you also have to build that proposal, bring all those partners together.

SPEAKER_02

Um I forget. There's a saying like success is where opportunity meets preparation. Um kind of ideal, like partners were here, people I worked with locally, and the topic came up, which was the opportunity, and you know, kind of combining both those things, uh, I think is the reason we we won that that award.

SPEAKER_00

So through that contract, have you been able to build upon your you know, your credibility as a small business, compliance, scaling? What has that contract been able to teach you?

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, I think I think it helps a lot with credibility. Um, because that's you know, something that's challenging as a small business is like, you know, I go to people and be like, I have all this experience, like, you know, kind of like telling them my resume, right? Like, um, and they're like, oh, okay, like that's nice. But now I'm like, well, you know, this is what we do as a small business. We won this, you know, phase one award, and then that kind of, you know, their ears perk up a little bit, like, oh, okay, like they're a little bit more, you know, serious and you know, getting money and you know, building stuff, that kind of thing. So I think that that's where it's really helped is um, I guess validation. I don't know if that's the right, right term, but um yeah, now you know I can use that like, hey, we have this conceptual design. I mean, hopefully we get more funding to actually build the physical prototype, but it's something I can talk to other customers about now that are interested in it. Um, like, hey, we have this conceptual design. Is it you know something you're interested in? Um, and then you know, having that led to other proposals we've submitted with other partners, um, where now we can say, hey, we, you know, we really do have experience designing in this space, but now we want to bring in other, you know, technologies into it, you know, not just uh like the metal printing capability. So that's that's I think where it's for sure helped the most is you know kind of opening more doors, so to speak.

SPEAKER_00

Definitely. What about the compliance side? I feel like that's something that's very new for a small business, especially with a huge grant like that.

SPEAKER_02

It's um so luckily, since these are tailored to small businesses, there's not all the same like rules and requirements that are attached to normal defense contracts. So they don't they're uh what they call firm fixed price contracts. So it's like this is the dollar amount, you basically have this much money to like deliver what you told us you can deliver. Um so the compliance is mostly on like leveraging, I'd say like invoicing systems, making sure you're submitting your reports on time, making sure your invoices are correct, and like if you ever get a contract, there's like all these weird numbers, and you have to like make sure you put the right, like I mean, I I think they're kind of like account numbers, right? But not necessarily, like you gotta like take the contract and take the numbers from there, and when you're submitting the invoice, like make sure it all all aligns, yeah. And so I again I another another area I got help is like there's this uh I forget what it stands for, it's but it's WAF, like I don't know, it's a it's an online portal for you know to submit invoices, right? So I open it up and I'm like, I have no idea. I look at like the documentation they have to help, and I'm like, this this doesn't help anymore. Um so again, I I you know I asked around, like, hey, you know, I asked some of the local companies that I knew did defense work. I'm like, can I uh talk to like whoever it is that submits your invoices? They're like, yeah, sure. Um, so again, I I met with people and they're like, oh, this is you know, this is how you do it. Like you get this stuff from the contract and you put it in these, you know, forms and and all of that. So that's um yeah, compliance. I mean, there's kind of a learning curve to some of it, but like I said, locally, since they're tailored to small business, it wasn't as uh like stringent as like non-small business contracts, I guess. Um but I mean, just to add on a little bit, like things we're working on now are like cybersecurity certifications. Like that's that's a big thing being pushed by defense. Um, there are still like contract mechanisms to get around some of that because not all businesses are gonna like be compliant. Um but that like accounting certifications and it's it's gonna cost money, which is always tough. But um yeah, luckily we didn't have to have too much of that in place. I think for future work we're we're gonna have to do a lot of it, and and we're working on some already.

SPEAKER_00

That's good to hear. What advice would you give to engineers who want to start a company?

SPEAKER_02

Um I mean, the first thing that pops in my head, and I'll I'll add on to this, is like don't do it unless you're serious about it. Um and I've watched not not that it's great advice, but like I've I've listened to a lot of like you know, VC investors and stuff talk about successful startup founders. Um and I think a big takeaway is like it's difficult. Um so if you're not like wanting to do it for the right reasons, I would probably not do it. Um, like I said, a lot of people I've talked to over the years is like, oh yeah, I want to start a business, so I have freedom. Like you have you have freedom in the extent like your business can do what you want it to, but you know, it's not freedom to like take a month-long vacation, right?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02

Um, and that's that's one of the reasons I wanted to start it, is like I when I was at the Keck Center, you know, we kind of had our projects and like focus areas and things. And I kind of wanted to like do my own thing, right? Like, oh, I you know, I think that this you know, this technology or whatever has applications here, which I had a lot of freedom at UTEP, you know, not nothing against them, but now it's like totally up to me, right? Like I can do what I want. Um, I have to work like seven days a week on it, but I get to do what I want, right? Yeah, um, and so yeah, I just say, you know, make sure it's you're wanting to do it for the right reasons. It's like other people are like, oh yeah, I want to get rich. Like, there's easier ways to get rich, you know, like uh go into business, yeah. Business, like work for a big company, do well, get promoted, and you'll make a lot of money, you know, if if you're successful in that regard. Like, what's the stat? Like 90% of startups fail. Yeah, like something crazy like that, right?

SPEAKER_00

So it's like 90% of startups fail, but 60% survive with mentorship.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

That's that's our stat.

SPEAKER_02

But it's I mean, it's overall it's difficult, right? So it's like if yeah, if you're if you want to get rich, there's easier ways and to do that. Like starting a company is not an easy way to get rich, or fast way, oh yeah, or fast, right? Like I've been doing this for five years and I'm not rich. So um probably gonna do it for another five years, and I probably still won't be rich. Um, then even if you have success, right, all of your uh I guess net worth is like tied up in equity in the company, and then you gotta like find a way to like liquidate it. And anyway, yeah, you know, I just say be sure like your motivations are are correct because you know, and I think understanding like what you really want to do with your life, like where you want to be in five years, ten years is super important. Um not to discourage people, right? But like it's I I think there's a misconception out there that you know you always see headlines like oh, X company raised a hundred million dollars, right? But people don't understand like how many hours went into that company before they got to that point, right?

SPEAKER_00

Yeah um how many sleepless nights?

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, like did the guy have a house when he was doing it? Was he sleeping on his friend's couch?

SPEAKER_00

Like was he sleeping in his office?

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, like you know, all the stuff you don't hear, and and my my point's not to discourage people, but just to reiterate it's you know, like if you're gonna do it, like be willing to do it, yeah. Yeah, because you see it, I mean and you see it in pitch competitions too, sometimes, like some guy will be like, oh yeah, I'm just you know, I'm gonna pitch this business idea, I'm gonna raise millions of dollars, and if I don't raise millions of dollars, I'll like go back to uh whatever they did before, right? Yeah, there's another joke I've heard, like um people like doing like a B2B company, right? It's like yeah, if they don't raise money or they fail, it's they go back into business. Or um I forgot there's one for like B2C or C2C. Anyway, but yeah, it's like there's there's a lot of people out there, and and I think it's it's more of a thing not in El Paso. Like I honestly a lot of the people in El Paso are pretty serious about it. I mean, we're we're a pretty young like entrepreneurial community right now. Um but yeah, I mean be only do it if like you're you really want to do it, because uh depending on how far you go, like you can ruin your personal credit, right? Like if you're living off of credit cards until you make money, like um, and look look for help, right? Like I mean, I've talked to you know, the organizations like Pioneers 21, right, about things I need. I've talked to other founders in town, um investors in town, and uh like talk to people, like really know what you're getting into and and I guess plan it out to whatever degree you can. Like it's a lot of it's unpredictable, but you know, kind of like having a vision like how you'd actually succeed, I think is also important. Um I don't know, did did that answer your question?

SPEAKER_00

I feel like you covered a lot.

SPEAKER_02

Okay.

SPEAKER_01

All right, good.

SPEAKER_00

That's great. Um, and finally, for my last question before I let you go, what's next for PM technologies? What do you have in mind?

SPEAKER_02

Um what are you envisioning? Hopefully we don't go out of business. That's always like a good good plan, right? Yes, um, number one. Yeah, stay in business. Um but yeah, I think really what we're trying. I mean, we're we're looking into contracts and you know, like more work we can do and related to the products we're wanting to develop. We're looking at licensing technologies from different entities and organizations to kind of get a little bit more like robust uh technology offering. Um, but I think our big kind of next step is like seeing if we can raise investment money, right? Um because that'll be another like kind of validation step, I'd say, you know, we we we're getting work from our customers, you know, we got the STTR grant, um, we got some other stuff either ongoing or like stuff kind of in the pipeline. Um and we can just do that and kind of stay, you know, relatively small, like steady pace of growth. Um, but if you know we can raise some investment money, it kind of like will accelerate a lot of that really fast. Um, and I think that's really what what we'll try to do. Um, because I think the timing's right, you know, there's there's a lot of interest in like the the technology we're working in. Um I don't know if you listen to like the secretary of is it secretary of war now. Oh I gotta change all the names, but um I mean their big interest is like additive manufacturing, which is 3D printing for those not technical um and drones. And so basically we're hitting both of those, right? Yeah, um, that's why I think like investment money makes sense, like there's demand signal out there, we have some technology already, we have a roadmap on like what other technologies we'd want to you know integrate into. Um and so investment would really help accelerate it. Like we have uh partnerships, networks kind of in these within the DoD, you know, entities parallel to the DoD, and you know, even other private industries that are interested, it's just uh kind of getting the capital to do the things we need to do, you know, build prototypes. Um sales is easy. I shouldn't say sales is easy, but let's scratch that. Um but it's like we know there's interest, right? So if we have if we get money to build these prototypes, we can start demoing it for people that we already know are interested in it, and then you know, hopefully that would lead to like you know more work, larger contracts, and all of that in the future.

SPEAKER_00

So it sounds like you have a lot coming up, so I'm excited to see your growth.

SPEAKER_02

Well, like I said, number one is just like stay in business, so keep our bills paid. Keep the lights. I mean, I don't necessarily have to pay myself, but I like to. I have my own bills, but I figure it out if I need to. But yeah, it's um hopefully, like I mean, it sounds like a lot, we're doing a lot, and hopefully it you know turns into a lot.

SPEAKER_00

So hopefully, that's always the goal. Yeah, but thank you so much for being on this podcast.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, thanks for having me.

SPEAKER_00

I appreciate it. I know it's an early morning, so thank you for coming downtown for this episode.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, of course.

SPEAKER_00

I hope our listeners took a lot away. I definitely did. Yeah, thank you so much for being on this episode.

unknown

Thank you.