S4E1: Kindness As A Business Strategy with Christy Pretzinger

What if kindness wasn't a "nice to have," but the backbone of a high-performing company? We sat down with Christy Pretzinger—founder and CEO of WG Content and creator of the Better Leader Project—to unpack how a clear intention, supported by daily attention, can transform culture from a poster on the wall into a competitive advantage. 

Christy takes us inside the operating system of her team: four punchy values—empowered, curious, kind, fun—brought to life through monthly peer nominations, behavior-first language, and decision-making that holds up when work gets hard. Christy introduces the Better Quotient (BQ), a practical complement to EQ. IQ may be fixed, and EQ helps you name emotions, but BQ is the pause that lets you choose a better action—especially when an email sets you off or a tough call needs clarity and care. We explore her Culture Balance Sheet framework—assets like trust and psychological safety, liabilities like fear and inconsistency, and the equity created when "we" sits at the center. From healthcare's post-pandemic us-them divide to the everyday challenge of balancing empathy with accountability, Christy shows how systems, not slogans, shape results. 

You'll hear vulnerable stories about trading perfection for progress, concrete practices that build habit loops around values, and tools for leading across generations—especially Gen Z's push for authenticity and community. Expect takeaways you can use tomorrow: structure recognition to reinforce behaviors, set clear norms for early signals when life intrudes on work, and adopt the micro-practice that changes everything—stop, drop into your body, breathe, then respond. 

If this conversation sparked new ideas, follow the show, share it with a leader who needs it, and leave a rating and review so more listeners can find us. Got a question or a story about culture done right? Send it our way and join the conversation.

Christy Pretzinger ➤ Unlock the Power of BETTER.

Christy Pretzinger | President & CEO | WG Content

(1) Christy Pretzinger | LinkedIn

Your Cultural Balance Sheet: Keys To Creating Environment Where People Can Thrive: Pretzinger, Christy: 9781949680652: Amazon.com: Books

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Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:06

Good day everybody. This is Steve McKean.

SPEAKER_02 0:09

And this is Luca Munoz. And this is the Leadership Exchange. Today, Steve, I'm pretty excited for our listeners. We have a great guest today. Christy Pretzinger has accomplished a lot, but I'm not going to steal her thunder. Christy, please, if you could introduce yourself to our listeners and also tell us a little bit about your story, that would be great.

Founding WG Content On Kindness

SPEAKER_00 0:28

Okay. Well, first of all, thank you for having me. I'm looking forward to our conversation. I'm, as you mentioned, Christy Pretzinger. I am the founder and CEO of WG Content and also of the Better Leader Project. So I started building WG content, I don't know, something like 20 years ago. I had been a freelance writer. And when I started actively building it, I said to my accountant at the time that if I couldn't build a business based on kindness, I would go back to being a freelance writer, which is what I had been doing. As many people know, if you're building a business, you put your head down and you just start working. And I didn't really think too much about that intention until many years later, when I looked back in hindsight and realized that that very intention of building a business based on kindness resulted in the culture at WG Content, which is really my proudest legacy, really, other than my son, of course. Because what I what I realized over time, again, in hindsight, is that my real passion is about creating environments where people can thrive. Because of that, I've started another business. I wrote the book, Your Cultural Balance Sheet, which I know we're going to mention, because I realized that I looked at my business. Of course, I look at my balance sheet and my financials all the time, but I look at my business through the lens of a cultural balance sheet. So that became my first book, which I released this summer. And I compare your business looking at it from assets, liabilities, and equity, just as you would with a financial balance sheet. But in the process of writing that book, I realized that what I really want to do is teach people how to create environments where people can thrive at scale. And that is the purpose of the Better Leader Project, which is my most recent endeavor.

SPEAKER_02 2:15

Yeah, very noble. Thank you for that. You said so many great things there, Christy. First thing that really stood out for me was the concept of like legacy. And it it's interesting that Steve and I have actually, in our very, very first episode of this Leadership Exchange podcast series, we actually kind of introduced ourselves and talked about legacy because it's like, what's the impact that we're gonna have in the world? At the end, how are people going to talk about us at the dinner table? Will they talk about it? And what will they say? That really uh resonates with me. I love and I'm highly interested. We're definitely going to get into the book and the the balance sheet because the concept of, hey, how do you measure some of these things that people perceive as not measurable when it comes to culture? So exciting stuff.

SPEAKER_01 3:07

First time we met, Christy, you you told us about the uh core values for your organization, which really resonated and were very unique from other companies that uh we've seen and and even the core values that we work around between our partnership, uh Lupe and I. And I want to talk a little bit about those because you said a couple things in other podcasts that I I thought were really relevant and and follow a thread of some conversations Lupe and I had about having values posted up on the out the outside of a a boardroom or you know, even on a company's website are great, but how do organizations really look at those? Are they are they real? Are they plastic? And I I thought you've got some really uh unique values to start with. And then as a conversation Lupa and I have had, we definitely recognize that how how you put those in practice, the principles that you put forward to demonstrate those values, I think is key. And you've got a really great insight on that. So can you start us off with just uh talking a little bit more about the core values, why you picked them, and then maybe a little bit more on how you use those in your current work and how they were developed over time, I guess.

Values That Actually Drive Behavior

SPEAKER_00 4:25

Well, I uh started out as a writer, as I mentioned. So I am someone who believes that fewer words are better than a lot. That if you can, you know, like Mark Twain said, I would have, it would have been shorter if I'd had more time. And so when we wrote our values, I very much wanted them to be succinct and something that we could all really remember, first of all. I think there's a lot of organizations who have lovely values, but they're kind of a narrative. And so it's hard to really grab that and make it, you know, something punchy that reminds you that you hold on to. So we crowdsourced these many years ago, more than 10 years ago, uh, with everyone in the organization at the time. And what we came up with is empowered, curious, kind, and fun. And it's in that order and it kind of rolls off your tongue in that way. And then our mission, given that we used to be called writer girl, now we're WG content, but our mission remains the same, which is building relationships one word at a time. So it all kind of weaves together. When it comes to the values, we really have looked at various ways to engineer our processes and systems to allow for the active demonstration of those values. Again, being a word person, when we ask people about the values, we don't say, have you felt empowered? Because that's a different thing in your brain than when you say to someone, how have you demonstrated empowerment? It just switches to a different place. So what we do in our monthly meeting is we have our HR coordinator select a value, and then she solicits nominations from the employees to nominate a fellow employee who has demonstrated whatever the value of the month is. So that really accomplishes two goals. One of them is that you get to demonstrate a value by being kind and nominating a coworker. And the other one is that it reminds you to keep your eye out for whatever that value is for the month. So it keeps it very top of mind. And the way that I personally, we don't measure hard measure, you know, in a in a quantitative way. But years ago, we had an employee who was working with one of our contractors who very sadly had ALS and was getting, was worsening to the point where we could not work with her. And so the employee had worked with her for a long time and was just, first of all, devastated by the situation, but also wanted to let this woman know that in a way that was in line with our values, that we could no longer work with her. It just didn't work. And she was like, I just really want to make sure that the way I handle this is in line with our values. And I thought that was really a lovely, a lovely way to frame that conversation. One of the things that you've probably heard me say is that your values should remain constant. They're not something that you just willy-nilly change. They should be a thread that runs throughout your organization and upon which all decisions can hang. And that story I just told is a perfect example of how that works in our organization.

SPEAKER_02 7:26

Thank you. One of the things that I was thinking of that I think, you know, when we're talking about culture and leadership and within that context, a lot of leaders kind of see that as real soft stuff. You know, hey, we're here about delivering, we're here, you know, performance, results. I don't I don't have time for that softy, you know, tree hugging. Uh who knows what they say, right? But you know, how the they perceive that that their role as a as in that manager, whatever title, is mostly around the fact that they have maybe a high IQ and maybe that they have technical expertise. What do you say to those people?

IQ, EQ, And The Birth Of BQ

SPEAKER_00 8:06

Oh, so much, Libby. There's so much to say to those people. Um there's just a lot there. I think that there's a whole lot. In fact, I was just in an airport lounge the other day, and there was an older man and a woman who was not young. She was, she was a mature woman, and it was very evident he was her supervisor in some capacity because in this Sky Club in public with people around him, he was giving her her performance review. It was shocking. And I didn't listen to us with it. I had my ear pods on, but my my and my friend was with me and she was like, I can't even believe this is happening. And she heard him say, Well, you know, I don't, you know, I don't show vulnerability at work, that's weakness. And I was like, wow, okay, 1990, there you are, right there. You're right there, you know, not catching up with where we are now. The thing is that we've all been through a lot with COVID, right? We're we're we still, the ramifications of that are gonna filter out for generations, I would imagine. But I think what what happened in my own experience through that was people, you know, when people were leaving all over the place, remember when people were moving and it was like, oh, they only had so much time left in their life. No, they looked at it and said, these people treat me like a cog in the wheel, and I'm a human being, and I want all aspects of me to come to work. And the thing that I think is very interesting about IQ versus BQ, which I'll talk about in a moment, is that IQ is pretty fixed by the time you're an adult. And there is a myriad research to show that, particularly in the United States, that the Ivy League and our way of looking at intelligence and success, future success, is completely backwards. We look at things like IQ, we look at test scores, we look at where you rank, you know, compared to other people, which I don't even get me started on comparison. But the thing about that is that that's not the indicator of success. The indicator of success are the very human characteristics that we are not very good at, by the way, of curiosity, empathy, vulnerability, openness, all of those things, the ability, the capacity to get along with other people, to literally see who they are and be able to interact with them. When I talk about IQ and BQ and EQ, all of those, I put IQ aside because it's pretty fixed by the time you're an adult. But EQ, we all know about EQ, it's been around 40 years, it's very quantitative. There's tests, there's literature, there's all sorts of things. But as I was working with the Better Leader project and coined the term your better quotient, your BQ, I was looking at EQ and seeing that that what EQ does, which is very important, it teaches us to name and claim our emotions. You know, many people have no words for their emotions. That's why there's things like a feelings wheel, because we're mad, sad, or glad, that's it, which then is the lens through which you see the world. But as a human being, we all know the difference between sadness and anguish, right? Between happiness and elation. There, there are there are nuances to that, and that is indeed what determines your experience in the world. So when I started thinking about it with EQ, you name and claim your emotions. Great. Okay, I'm in this situation. I'm, let's say I've gotten an email that I feel is condescending, and I'm frustrated or I'm annoyed, or maybe even I'm angry. Great. I've identified that. Well, now what am I going to do with that? And that's where BQ comes in. BQ is teaching teaching us how to pause, recognize that, name and claim it, use your EQ to name and claim your emotion, and then use your BQ to choose a better action, to think about what am I trying to, what do I want to accomplish here? You know, we've all gotten that email where your instinct is to reply all, probably with just the same tone that came at you. And then you're like, oh my gosh, an hour later, maybe a minute later, you're like, what was I thinking? And with BQ, it's like, okay, I'm gonna, I'm gonna pause for a moment here and acknowledge the fact that I am really irritated. But what what in this situation could make me a better person, a better leader, a better coworker, whatever it happens to be, and then choose that action, which you know would be a more thoughtful response. So BQ is a is has really for me, coining it has been a way to encapsulate what I really want to teach people. And it's very much tied to my own personal experience, and I can share that story with you about how it came to be if you'd like. I don't know if that's going to be relevant to your audience or not. You would like me to share that? I'd be that'd be great.

From Perfection To Better

SPEAKER_02 12:42

Yes, please. Okay.

SPEAKER_00 12:43

Well, it all started when I came across a photo of myself as a little girl, four or five years old. And I was looking, you know, this little girl smiling as she walks towards the camera and you know, looks happy. And when I first saw that picture, I was awash with numerous emotions. And the first one was kind of poignant, like, oh, that little girl looks so happy. Quickly followed by, oh, that little girl has so much judgment coming at her in her life. And then finally, that little girl grew up to be an adult who struggled well into adulthood with perfection, specifically not being perfect. So I talk about, I mean, it really was it's the voice in my head that I had. I know we all have a voice in our head, which we would never ever speak to anybody the way that we allow that voice to speak to us. And mine was insidious. And whenever I started to feel even a little bit of accomplishment about something I had done, that voice would be like, Yeah, but you're not perfect. You're not perfect, you know, you're overweight, or you yelled at somebody, or you, you know, whatever. There's so many things that that happened there. And finally, I don't even know what led to it, probably years of therapy, frankly, and lots of reading and self-uh self-awareness and working on that, understanding myself. I finally was like, I will never be perfect. And in fact, it's not even an ideal that I want to aspire to, because if you aspire towards perfection, you completely eliminate the possibility of ever knowing yourself. Because in order to know yourself, you have to acknowledge you have imperfections and get curious about them, right? So I was like, I don't even want to do that. And then I thought, well, what I can be is better. I can be better, not perfect. And so that was where the whole, and then I was like, that is what your BQ is, your capacity to become better. And that's that's what that is. And we all have it. It's a lifelong goal, growth. It it never ends. You know, you'll you'll never get it done, and you can't get it wrong because you'll never get it done. And that's the the joy of that, too, is kind of bringing that the joy of self-exploration and who we are as human beings, and then sharing that with people in a way that hopefully helps them in their journey.

SPEAKER_01 14:54

Christy, I really appreciate you sharing that story. And I I know it's going to resonate with our listeners. Luke and I do quite a bit of leadership training. And some of the early conversations we have with what I would say is somebody that's kind of new to the leadership or maybe new to the organization, is the willingness to admit they don't know something and not be perfect. We've had several opportunities where team members have, you know, expressed that, and then the wave of relief that's come off of them as they've gone through some of the leadership courses that they don't have to be that perfect in individual. You know, when you think about current academia and the the strive for straight A's and and all that, it just it generates that context. And so, you know, we we see it in all age groups across the organization. So it's it's been around for a long time, and I I like the thought that you know what you've started to frame up is a way to counter some of that. And I think the sooner you can learn that as a a people leader, the the stronger you're gonna be. And I I just love the fact uh you shared that with us. And I I tell you that my own story, very similar, at a young age, was made a people leader for a very technical group that were more experienced than I was in the work that we did, just had a lot more knowledge, and and I had to recognize that it was okay not to have all the answers. But when they were stuck, I that was my job. I had to go figure out how to help them through whatever it was. And I think that's just such an important point that you've raised there.

The Culture Balance Sheet

SPEAKER_02 16:36

I loved everything you said, Christy. I do want to really get into your book. So the title of your book is Your Culture Balance Sheet: Keys to Creating an Environment Where People Can Thrive. My first question about that book is like what inspired you to create it? What was, yeah, what was the moment that really clarified for you that a book like this needed to be created?

SPEAKER_00 17:03

It's an interesting thing when when you think about when you reach, when you are at a point in your life where you have a lot of wisdom and maybe not as much energy, it's very interesting, the things that you pull together, you know, and and that's what I'm loving about this this stage in my life. So when when that came to be, I was actually in an organization, I still am very active in an organization called Entrepreneurs Organization. For anybody who's an entrepreneur, take a look. It's fabulous, it's global in, I don't know, 70 countries, 20,000 members, something like that. In any case, part of that group, that that organization is it's what's called a forum. Many people are familiar with it. It's a small group. These people knew me very, very well. This was several years, I don't know, maybe five years ago. And I was actually at dinner with some of my cohort. And they many of them have had, had had at the time and continue, to have had successful exits from their businesses. Uh, one sold to uh publicly traded companies, somebody else had VC funding, somebody else had sold to PE. So there was a lot of talk about EBITDA, you know, earnings before income and taxes, and um a lot of talk about multiples, how many, you know, what multiple can you get for your business, all this kind of stuff, which I find interesting, but not, it doesn't grab me because we were sitting there, and I'm someone who doesn't know what she thinks until she says it. So I'm a verbal processor. So I was sitting there and I was listening to them and engaging in the conversation, and I kind of mused that I said, you know, I I look at my balance sheet. Of course I look at my numbers, but I look at my business through the lens of a cultural balance sheet. And one of my friends looked at me and he goes, There's your book. He's like, now you have to do it, because he'd been bugging me to write a book. And I was like, okay, I guess you're probably right. So I started kind of mulling it over, and then I went to something with EO that was called Global Speakers Academy. And I went to this week-long workshop to craft a signature speech around this topic. I had not written the book yet. And I was like, I don't even know if this metaphor works. You know, so I'm here at this workshop, that's kind of this exclusive thing you're supposed to come in. I'm like, does this even work? So, like day one, I'm like, I'm not sure if this works. Day two, I'm thinking the people who are facilitating it, I'm just gonna have to pay them a lot of money and they're gonna have to write this because I can't figure it out. And then by the Thursday, they had helped me, they were brilliant teachers. They helped me craft the signature talk and really create the buckets that then ultimately became the book. The way that that I broke it down, and it was a really interesting process writing this, my co-author is an employee and has been employed with WG Content for more than 10 years now, I think. So she has lived this culture, you know, it has experienced it and has experienced me as a leader. So as we were working on it, there was a lot of shorthand between the two of us that we we understood, but it was really interesting to break it down into bite-sized chunks. There's I think 43 keys in this book, and you can dip in anywhere you want. And they're they're really much more qualitative than quantitative. You know, balance sheet is very black and white, right? You look at this thing and you've got profit and loss and all that. The thing about your culture is that the equity in your culture, unlike a business, the equity is really the combination of your assets and liabilities and the culture that you create itself becomes the equity, the psychological safety, the concept of putting we at the middle of everything, which then also takes care of me if you put we there, right? If you put me there, it doesn't necessarily include we, but we includes me. And so really sharing all of that is funny because I've talked about this on so many podcasts. And unlike people like yourself, frequently I talk to people and they look at me like I've invented electricity, that this is like shocking. I'm like, this is really just kind of human, which, but then what I realized too is this is the the origin story for the Better Leader Project, is that I firmly believe that the way we will coexist and and thrive with AI as a thing that's going to be everywhere is through our humanity, right? The things that make us human. The problem is that we are really bad at the things that make us human. So I thought, okay, maybe I need to back up here and help teach people to access their own humanity first, like you talked about, people realizing that they don't have to know all the answers. You know, Steve realizing that when you needed to help those people, the the thing that you're charged with is asking the right questions to remove barriers to their success, not knowing the answers to those. And and teaching people that that relief of, oh, God, I don't have to be perfect. I can say, I don't know. You know, I don't know. Maybe you know more than I do about that. Or, oh my gosh, I really messed that one up. I won't make that mistake again. You know, learning to access our humanity in a seamless way that that is just who we are helps everyone. It's better for leaders, it's better for teammates, it's better for parents. It's better for friends. It's better for everything. So that's really kind of the origin story, how that all feeds into where I currently am working with BQ and the Better Leader Project.

Intention Needs Daily Attention

SPEAKER_01 22:10

Fantastic. Christy, one of the questions that I had in your book, you talk about leading with intention, which you see a a lot in business books and leadership books, right? You got to lead with intention, you got to have focus, you've got to have just this direction, the North Star, all that kind of stuff. And and I believe that that's important, but you bring the other part together. And I I've used the term in my past, relational capacity. What you describe in your book is lead with intention and attention. And so maybe describe that a little bit. I think I understand from my reading what you're meaning, but I'd love for our listeners to hear that because I think it's very key to your book and really understanding what you're presenting here.

SPEAKER_00 23:03

But you know, in January, so many people set resolute, make resolutions. I quit doing that years ago because I'm setting myself up for failure. And they don't last. I mean, the the average resolution lasts maybe four months. And that's why intentions are a commitment. It's different. They're not a resolution. But the thing about an intention, as you just alluded to, Steve, is that you have the intention, but then you have to pay attention to the intention, or else it's no better than a resolution that fades over time. And the thing about the attention part, that's the key because attention is a discipline. It's something that you have to choose day by day, hour by hour, moment by moment. And if you lose that, you can come back to it. But if you don't have that attention, you forget that you even made that intention. I mean, I always liken it to, you know, I've I have worked out since I was 19 years old. So I mean, a long frickin' time. And I've gone to the gym, I've lifted weights. It's just a thing I've done. But if I go like a month for some reason and I can't get to the gym or whatever, I'm literally like, Jim, what gym? I've never worked out. What are you talking about? Because the bad habits are just like those burn into our brain. Like, oh no, I lay on the couch, read books, and eat Heath bars. That's what I do. I don't go to the gym. So that's why you have to have that intention. For me, over my life, the intention has been, you know, I left the idea of a bikini and that is so far behind me. What now it's like I want to be able to get up if I fall down. And I want to make sure that I'm strong, that that I can pick up, you know, hopefully someday I'll have grandchildren that I can pick them up and I can play with them. And so that intention is is met with the attention to, wow, I haven't, I wasn't able to get to the gym. But you know what? I can go for a really long walk, or I can hop on the Peloton, or I can, you know, do some workout at home. Really keeping that top of mind. That's why those devices, you know, the only I wear a regular pretty watch and my Apple Watch because it reminds me that, like, you've been sitting down for like three hours now. You might want to get up and move a little bit. And so that's part of the attention. And I use every tool at my disposal to remind me of my intention. I use reminders, I use timers, I use alarms, I use my my wearable, all the things to help me keep to my intentions.

Systems That Shape Culture

Accountability With Empathy

SPEAKER_02 25:25

As you're talking, Christy, I'm starting to notice you said it earlier, and but you didn't say it in this particular thing. But you very much have uh this natural ability to realize that building the system that supports the intention of what you're trying to achieve, because all those things to me are part of a system you've created that allows you the better chance of achieving the intention through through the attention that you've given into the system. And one of the things that you may or may not know about, Steve and I, is we're really big on OpEx, especially we we're big fans of the shingle model that really teaches you around systems are the ones that drive the ideal behaviors. So if you want people to be good to each other, you want people to be very much into helping each other and teamwork, well, there's a system you you've got to be focusing to create that those conditions. And the other thing is continuous improvement, like how do we improve? And what you were talking about earlier, and and I've never really thought about this when it comes to my my myself as a human being, as a leader, as a father, whatever, is like, hey, you've got to apply that that same mindset to yourself and how you get better, right? How do you become that better, better individual? And maybe it's a skill, or maybe, but but then there's to me just the humanity of oneself and and what does that mean to me and and how do I improve in those areas? So you're really putting a lot of things that were kind of floating around in my mind. You're really helping me align to align them up. So I appreciate that. One question I had for you is the the other thing that we feel is is an important part of success with teams is you know a high level of self-accountability, but just cultural accountability. So accountability to our to each other and to the team. How do you balance accountability with kindness, though? Sometimes people seem to struggle that there's got to be a first, is there a do you have to make a choice between those two? Or what does it look like to be able to do those well together?

SPEAKER_00 27:34

I think that we've spent a lot of time in our world, particularly in the United States, looking at things as an either or instead of a both and, which is much more eastern kind of looking at things. That two things can be true. When it comes to accountability with kindness or empathy, empathy is, I mean, first of all, kindness is not necessarily a soft skill. Kindness is clarity, right? Kindness is uh being uh transparent and clear with your feedback. And kindness is how you communicate even in the downtimes. And those are those are very practical skills. Kind of back to what you were talking about with systems thinking, it all feeds into each other. And and the whole idea of the systems that you were talking about, you know, when you talk about soft skills, and again, I say this all the time, I don't know who named them that because they're the hard ones, because they require intention and attention constantly, they never end. Learning how to do it, be an accountant is like something you can do by rote, but doing this is like, oh, and you're gonna mess up because it's being human. So when it comes back to accountability with kindness or empathy, the way that I have talked about this is that I gave an example in in a small cohort with the Better Leader Project, teaching people how to talk about this very topic. I said for myself, we ask people to share how accountability and empathy, we talk about it for a little bit. The next month we have a meeting talking about how did it show up for you in your life, and you have to share that experience. And you have to start with the feeling, then the headline, and then the significance. So in my case, talking about this, I said, okay, I wanted to hold myself accountable to eating less sugar because I'm a sugar fiend. So that was how I wanted to see how it showed up for me. So when it came to me sharing that, my update began with I was surprised, somewhat disappointed, but also proud. And what's the headline? I didn't do as well as I wanted to, but I didn't beat myself up about it. And what's the significance there? Is that I showed empathy for myself. Instead of going to beating myself up and letting that old voice say something, it was like, you know what? You had an attention, you did less. That's good. You still have the capacity to become better. You can access your BQ and continually try and do that, but you don't have to beat yourself up. When it comes to holding others accountable, one of the things we say in my organization is that it is absolutely understandable and expected that you are going to have personal things happen in your life, whatever that might be. And that's fine. What's not okay is to not alert us to the fact that you have something going on and you share as much as you feel comfortable with about the specifics of that, but you have to let us know something is going on so then we can come in and help fill in the gaps. So where the accountability comes in is if if you don't tell us that that's happening, and then we are saying, I've noticed your behavior is slipping here. This isn't like you, you're late to meetings, you've missed deadlines, you know, what's happening here? I can't help you if I don't know what's happening. And also another thing about accountability, which we all know is true, no one, and I mean no one, likes advice. No one likes advice. And frequently, accountability is saying, you did this wrong, and here's what you need to do, here's what you should do, which is like horrible and does not lead to real behavioral change. But what people do like is being seen and saying, you know, I've I've noticed you have a second after the meeting, I've noticed, you know, you're you seem distracted. Can you tell me more about that? And giving people an opportunity, which accomplishes the same goal, by the way, but allows someone to be seen and also can actually lead to true behavioral modification.

SPEAKER_01 31:31

I mean, just kind of listening through that, I think the importance and almost overused a little bit now when you hear the term psychological safety, but I think what's important is the practice, right? That building that trust so that people can come forward and tell you that, hey, I'm having a real hard time, and recognizing that not everybody's going to be at that same trust level, right? And so I think as a leader, you've got to continue to build that, find each individual person how to open them up. I did horse training years ago and kind of jokingly talked to Lupe about you know having to done some horse whispering in a situation or environment. And that was really that's going in, just learning how people communicate with each other, getting a sense of the environment, and then just asking some kind of open-ended questions to help start steering and and correcting in a way. And I found that when you can do that, it does build that trust you need to to the point. And you know, I think the other thing that you brought up is around accountability is just making sure that people understand the environment that and the expectations that we're working in. And I love what you started the conversation with is how you reinforce a lot of the values in your organization on a weekly practice, I think you said, where you identify one and then at a team-level meeting, somebody's recognized for that. A lot of really great ideas you've shared here, and you know, how to take some of the stuff that you've talked about in your book and in your uh work with better quotient development and put it into practice. So thank you uh for sharing that. I I guess the question I have for you right now kind of revolves a little bit around the communities that you see and and the workspace that you work in. Lupe and I have had some folks reach out to us from construction industry, from other manufacturing. The most interesting ones, I think, they're all interesting, but the the one that maybe is a little more surprising was in the medical fields. And in conversations with some thought leaders and leaders in those medical fields, they recognize that a lot of the big medical systems have really kind of developed a us and them barrier that describes activities and actions and practice for a certain group in those medical practices and then something different. And so it's created almost this folks for hire situation to where there's the turnover is so huge, and it's because you know, long hours, burnout, all those kind of things, but it's also, I think, a lot of what you've identified is people need to be heard, they need to be part of the whole. You can't have these two competing forces, otherwise, you are going to have a lot of turnover at really key positions. Has that been an area that you've focused on, or is that a also a group that you've started to work with in your practice?

SPEAKER_00 34:35

With WG Content, we work within the healthcare space. So we work with large hospital systems and within that entire ecosphere, with the exception of pharma, we haven't really dipped our toe there, but you're very right about that. And I think some of the us them came from COVID. And the the frankly, the abuse that frontline workers and and marketers too, by the way, because they had to engage with the patient population and the hostility that they were treated, you know, in the hostile way in which they were treated, really kind of did create this barrier. Although the interesting thing about that is that by and large, most people who go into healthcare, the actual practice of healthcare, I'm not talking about the science and the research and all of that, but the practitioners of it, they do go in because at the core they want to help people. So there still is that aspect to it. I mean, all sorts of things happen to us as humans. I mean, if you go through, you know, all the training to become a surgeon, chances are good you're gonna be have quite an ego. And maybe you should. You aren't opening people up and moving things around. That's kind of a big deal. But there is still the human aspect. There's a book called The Checklist Manifesto, and I can't remember who wrote it, but it was a surgeon who wrote it, and he talked about the fact he had to write it because if a nurse wrote it, no one would listen to them, even though they're the ones who know everything. He wrote this, and one of the things that I believe it was him too, in that when he goes into a surgical suite, before they they give that someone anesthesia, the patient anesthesia, he makes everyone introduce themselves to that patient and explain the role that that individual plays in the care of that patient. And that is, again, bringing the humanity back into these things. And yes, you hear people all the time say, I don't have time for that. Well, then you don't have time to be human. Now, granted, an ER situation, we're not talking that. We're talking about a schedule, you know, a different situation. But you you absolutely have to have time to be human. You simply do, whether you like it or not. You know, when I hear these big tech bros talk about the fact that empathy is causing the breakdown of Western civilization, if I could roll my eyes so much, my head would fall off of my neck. Because those people, first of all, by the way, they should be on the list that they're compiling of people on the spectrum. And they are the top ones because they don't have access to their own humanity. They may be brilliant in certain areas, but they are not brilliant in the areas that actually matter. How many people actually want to work for those people? I mean, the you know, the the the thing that we all know, and I don't care whether you are working on a construction site, whether you're a surgeon, whether you are Elon Musk, everybody needs to know that they matter. That is a common human threat. I don't care who you are, I don't care what country you come from, I don't care what color you are, what religion you are, you need to know that you matter. And that the key about that is you can't matter alone. You have to matter in community. That's just the truth. So how do we go from there?

SPEAKER_02 37:44

Christy, as as we start to hit the the back end of this fantastic conversation, if there's one thing, one thing that our listeners could start doing tomorrow that would help in the in the the realm of culture and creating the environment for their for their teams, what what advice do you have? What what would that change be?

SPEAKER_00 38:07

Well, as someone that, and I know you don't, I'm not trying to call you on the carpet lupe, but I I don't use the word advice because again, for me, I've just learned over time to use experience share. And boy, can I share some experiences of mistakes that I've made in this particular area. But one of the things that has been really instrumental, and and trust me, I fail because I'm I'm deeply flawed and deeply human, but learning to practice the pause. My father said to me many years ago when I was in like high school, I think, he he really would talk about, you know, Christy, you want to avoid behavior that is gonna require an apology later. And that stuck with me, even though I I still have over the years messed up. But but what the the pause is, as I was kind of referencing with like the email situation, and this is all part of your BQ, your capacity to become better, is to to give yourself a moment. And I teach people that in the pause, what do you do in the pause? Like, what do you mean by pause? Is stop whatever you're doing, thinking, saying, drop into your body for just an instant, because that's where all of our emotions are, and then take a breath. And giving yourself the gift of that pause often stops you from behavior that will require an apology later. And I could give you myriad examples of when I've I've not done that and I wish I would have. But that is one thing that if people can really practice that, you know, I think it was, I'm gonna say it wrong, whoever wrote Man's Search for Meaning, which is escaping me, but he is the one who said that between stimulus and response, there is a space, and that's the pause. And that pause is a gift to yourself that helps you choose, access your capacity to become better, choose a better action because of taking that moment. I think that is, you know, miles. I mean, I'm that will put you so far ahead of so many people if you just even every once in a while give yourself the pause and and begin the practice of that.

SPEAKER_02 40:11

Fantastic knowledge sharing, Christy. And I appreciate that you called out the advice thing, which which is gonna change a little bit how we asked the last question that we asked our our our guest. Uh, and that'll come in in a few, but thanks for that. Uh I think one of the things that leaders fall victim to, I'll say, is is that inability to take that pause. And and you're right, I think just a few seconds can make a huge difference. Because I, you know, there's been a there's been a few times, and Steve, Steve is my sounding board for so many things, where you know, I'm getting ready to send this heated email because I just like, oh, I can't believe that person said this and that. And I'll send it to Steve and said, before I send this, what's the tone or what what do you what do you get from this email? And he's like, uh yeah, I don't know that you want to send that, Lupe. Here's what I see. And I'm like, yeah, okay, you've validated some of my concerns. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 41:13

Maybe take a minute, yeah, maybe think about it for a second, walk away, calm down.

SPEAKER_02 41:19

Yeah, sage, sage knowledge to to share.

SPEAKER_01 41:22

Thank you. This has been great, Christy. Hope the conversations continue, and we definitely want to connect you know some of the references you've made in this podcast to our listeners. So we'll we'll include those in in the links. And I I guess moving into this final question, is there any questions you have for Lupe and I before I I kind of go into the the last question with you?

SPEAKER_00 41:44

I guess really, given that that I want to be here in service of your audience, the question I would have for you is there anything that you would like to address as conversation here that we haven't yet that you think would be really helpful to your audience?

SPEAKER_01 42:02

I do. And that question really is around the generations that we work with now. We've we've got this broad spectrum of individuals in organizations, under our care, under our watch, or adjacent to them, that we have to learn, I would say, different styles and ways to communicate. And and what has been your experience in that as you kind of develop this leadership practice that you're sharing with the organizations you work with?

The Power Of The Pause

SPEAKER_00 42:32

That's a great question. And I'm I'm so happy you asked it because in the process of developing the Better Leader Project and thinking about who am I talking to and is it seasoned leaders, who is it, whatever. And I started really kind of gravitating towards a lot of information about Gen Z as they come into the workplace. My son is a Gen Zier as well. And what I was reading about them was so interesting to me because those of us here, I think the three of us probably remember when Oprah Winfrey was a thing, and she used to talk about authenticity to the point where I think it lost its meaning quite. I mean, it's 30 years ago, I think. But what's interesting is that Gen Z has probably doesn't even know really or care who Oprah is, but they really want authenticity. They want to bring their whole selves to the workplace. They don't want to be told to leave something at the door, the virtual door or the physical door. They yearn for community and collaboration and connection. And they are uniquely unskilled in all of these things because they were COVID kids. And they they really want these relationships, and yet they don't have the tool, they don't have the tool belt, much less the tools to put in the tool belt, to actually do that. So that's one of the things that when I think about generationally, and I also laugh, I'm the I'm kind of like in between Gen X and Boomer. And I laugh when I hear people denigrate Gen Z because I'm like, you do realize that the greatest generation thought you were a bunch of punks. When you were protesting and going to Woodstock. So, like, stop it. So, I think that the thing that is the the best that I see of all of this that people used to make fun of millennials in the same way. And I have a lot of millennials in my organization. And when I was building my organization, I I didn't mean to because I'm not a millennial, but I built an organization that suited millennials. It was virtual. They could do things in their free time. It was very flexible. They didn't have to be one thing. They could be more than one thing. And I feel very much the same way with Gen Z. I love having younger people in the workplace because while I have wisdom to share, they have eagerness and they have energy and they have excitement and intelligence and ideas that maybe I don't have. So really, again, this goes back to that humanity thing. When I was a younger woman, and the reason I started becoming a freelancer is I was kind of tossed aside because of my eagerness in the organization, organization in which I worked. I had made some suggestions about something that was organization-wide. I did not have the whole picture. I was completely naive, but I was eager. And instead, I was dismissed and condescended to around that. It turned out fine, obviously. But when I have younger people and I make sure that I tell my team, when they say something that sounds kind of ignorant, for lack of a better term, because they don't have the whole picture, do not dismiss that. You know, make a note of it and understand they don't have the whole picture, but they are eager. And that shows their eagerness. So don't dismiss that. You know, take it in hand and maybe direct it and pay attention to it instead of acting like oh, they just don't know anything and think they do, because I don't think that's actually the case anyway.

SPEAKER_01 45:43

What's kind of funny too is you know, Lupe and I practice a lot of open-ended questions and asking those questions. And I would say across all generations, sometimes people look at us like, please just tell me what to do. And but what I find is that with each generation, there there's a different way of directing that, you know, and there's the pause, they're they're listening to the ask. But it's it's fun to uh just see the spark, and I I I love the energy that you mentioned as well.

SPEAKER_02 46:16

We're gonna wrap up with the final question. Are you ready, Christy? Because this is uh it's an incredibly philosophical and deep question. We'd love to put hypothetical. If you could go back in time and talk to yourself, what morsel of knowledge would you share with yourself?

Leading Across Generations

SPEAKER_00 46:40

That's a really good question, and one that can really kind of get at my heart because I go back to that picture of that little girl. And what I think about now, I keep that picture on my dresser, and it kind of chokes me up when I think about this because I am so happy with all of the things that I went through, all of that judgment, all of the not being perfect, not being good enough, all of that that I went through led to where I am now. And I'm happy about that. I call myself an emotional athlete because of the things that I went through. And I think I would tell that younger self that it's you're gonna be okay, and you're gonna be really proud of yourself on the other side of this.

SPEAKER_02 47:27

Excellent. Thank you. And I think that is definitely a great morsel of knowledge. Appreciate that. Well, as predicted, it's been a fabulous time talking to you, Christy. We are extremely grateful for the time that you've invested, and I know our listeners will benefit from. It'll be one more drop in the big bucket of legacy that you're gonna leave in this world. And we're just very fortunate to be a little piece of it. We will add all of the things that you referenced into our notes for our listeners to be able to access, along with how to contact you and how to reach some of the organizations that you mentioned and and and the business that that you're part of. I personally have gotten a lot out of our conversation. I I'm gonna have to reflect on some of the things that you said and as as we listen to the episode in the future, but very grateful for the time and and knowledge that you've uh shared with us and our listeners.

SPEAKER_00 48:25

I love this conversation, and I'm so happy we were able to finally have it.

SPEAKER_01 48:29

Thank you, Christy. And again, I I second everything uh Lupe said. This is we've been really uh excited about the opportunity and uh appreciate your time. Uh we know you're extremely busy. You know, thank you again for sharing uh your wisdom and uh experience with our audience. And I'll just go ahead and wrap it up here, Lupe. So this is uh Steve McKeon.

SPEAKER_02 48:50

And this is Lupe Munoz, and this is the Leadership Exchange. Thank you, and have a great day.