Yes, Immigration is sticky. And right wing Alexa ain't helping. feat. Immigration Attorney Liz Cannon
Oct 24, 2023Season 2Episode 5
SLAP the Power
The "Immigration issue" may be the key thing that determines all the control of power next November in America. And ALEXA going all MAGA loco in millions of households isn't helping either. Obviously we need to SLAP some light on how we can help navigate this often misunderstood and vital issue. So we chose to get someone in who could help us understand it like we were musicians who didnt know what we were talking about.
Enter our delightful interview today, Liz Cannon, a seasoned immigration attorney who graces our show with her great takes on why most of our leaders don't actually want to help solve this issue and instead how WE can help each other fix this. You're going to want to listen in as Liz dissects the silliness of US immigration law, clearing up misconceptions about undocumented immigrants, and she helps explain to us what the F a 601A waiver process is. :)
I mean...do you know the difference between those who enter the US with a visa and those who cross the border without documentation? How many people overstay their visas vs cross at the borders? With Liz's guidance, we limp through this complex terrain together, shedding light on the impact of changing immigration laws under different administrations and she also touches on the deeper, class-based issues contributing to the current immigration predicament and exposing how these factors play into the exploitation of immigrants. We round off with Liz by discussing the power of individual advocacy. Reminding ourselves that even a simple phone call can influence immigration policy. Liz generously shares resources for listeners interested in supporting immigration reform.
We also debut our new segment the "Wish Factor (AKA I wish a MF would!)", where we imagine dealing with difficult situations, that you kinda wish would happen. We leave you with another humorous TOURROR STORY from the road (Halloween edition) to lighten the mood.
So jump in with us as we try and SLAP some sense into the ridiculous and insanely important issue of immigration today.
and as Liz said on our episode, sometimes, calling your representatives and demand to be heard on action to help our broken immigration system.
FIND AND CONTACT YOUR ELECTED OFFICIALS HERE https://www.usa.gov/elected-officials
and if you know who your representative is but you are unable to contact them using their contact form, the Clerk of the House maintains addresses and phone numbers of all House members and Committees, or you may call (202) 224-3121 for the U.S. House switchboard operator.
and here are some recommended resources how you can also help
SLAP the Power is written and produced by Rick Barrio Dill (@rickbarriodill) and Maiya Sykes (@maiyasykes). Associate Producer Bri Coorey (@bri_beats), with assistance from Larissa Donahue. Audio and Video engineering and studio facilities provided by SLAP Studios LA (@SLAPStudiosLA) with distribution through our collective home for social progress in art and media, SLAP the Network (@SLAPtheNetwork).
If you have ideas for a show you want to hear or see, or you would like to be a guest artist on our show, please email us at info@slapthepower.com
The "Immigration issue" may be the key thing that determines all the control of power next November in America. And ALEXA going all MAGA loco in millions of households isn't helping either. Obviously we need to SLAP some light on how we can help navigate this often misunderstood and vital issue. So we chose to get someone in who could help us understand it like we were musicians who didnt know what we were talking about.
Enter our delightful interview today, Liz Cannon, a seasoned immigration attorney who graces our show with her great takes on why most of our leaders don't actually want to help solve this issue and instead how WE can help each other fix this. You're going to want to listen in as Liz dissects the silliness of US immigration law, clearing up misconceptions about undocumented immigrants, and she helps explain to us what the F a 601A waiver process is. :)
I mean...do you know the difference between those who enter the US with a visa and those who cross the border without documentation? How many people overstay their visas vs cross at the borders? With Liz's guidance, we limp through this complex terrain together, shedding light on the impact of changing immigration laws under different administrations and she also touches on the deeper, class-based issues contributing to the current immigration predicament and exposing how these factors play into the exploitation of immigrants. We round off with Liz by discussing the power of individual advocacy. Reminding ourselves that even a simple phone call can influence immigration policy. Liz generously shares resources for listeners interested in supporting immigration reform.
We also debut our new segment the "Wish Factor (AKA I wish a MF would!)", where we imagine dealing with difficult situations, that you kinda wish would happen. We leave you with another humorous TOURROR STORY from the road (Halloween edition) to lighten the mood.
So jump in with us as we try and SLAP some sense into the ridiculous and insanely important issue of immigration today.
and as Liz said on our episode, sometimes, calling your representatives and demand to be heard on action to help our broken immigration system.
FIND AND CONTACT YOUR ELECTED OFFICIALS HERE https://www.usa.gov/elected-officials
and if you know who your representative is but you are unable to contact them using their contact form, the Clerk of the House maintains addresses and phone numbers of all House members and Committees, or you may call (202) 224-3121 for the U.S. House switchboard operator.
and here are some recommended resources how you can also help
SLAP the Power is written and produced by Rick Barrio Dill (@rickbarriodill) and Maiya Sykes (@maiyasykes). Associate Producer Bri Coorey (@bri_beats), with assistance from Larissa Donahue. Audio and Video engineering and studio facilities provided by SLAP Studios LA (@SLAPStudiosLA) with distribution through our collective home for social progress in art and media, SLAP the Network (@SLAPtheNetwork).
If you have ideas for a show you want to hear or see, or you would like to be a guest artist on our show, please email us at info@slapthepower.com
Speaker 1:
Biden has not done half of what he promised immigration attorneys and immigration attorney organizations that he said he would do. There's so many small changes he could make that would benefit so many families. He has not done that. However, there has been a massive change in at least allowing people within immigration to do their job. So under the Trump administration, they lost over a third of their workers in the Department of State and over a quarter of their workers in USAIS, who all just either quit or retired early because they weren't able to do their job. Because the administration kept saying things like you can't say yes to anything and or you can't accept any argument and or you can't accept any of these petitions. So, for example, daca, daca. Trump just basically said you know we're going to call this illegal and we're going to make it, so you have to. Just you can file it, but no one's going to look at it. So nobody has gotten DACA for years.
Speaker 2:
All right, all right, yo yo yo. Welcome to slap the power. The world may not need another podcast baby.
Speaker 3:
But a show do need that slap.
Speaker 2:
That's right. Welcome to slap the power, the show where we try to cut things up in one of three bins. We usually put them in climate, democracy or rights, and today is no exception. We're going to be going into rights with an immigration lawyer because I have a feeling and we were talking about this offline that immigration is going to be the key issue in a year from now.
Speaker 3:
It's also interesting how rights affects policies, which affects climate change which affects rights.
Speaker 2:
Yeah, democracy, rights, climate.
Speaker 3:
Exactly I mean it all be tied together, and our expert for this particular subject was really great about breaking down nuances about immigration that I didn't know existed. So I think that we need to have episodes that break down some of these nuances, because it's really hard to get the nuanced information that's behind a lot of these issues through traditional media, like it's almost non-existent.
Speaker 2:
Exactly that's why we created the show. That's facts, that's facts, and so on the show today we're going to have Liz Cannon. She's an immigration lawyer, so make sure to stick around for that. We're also going to be doing Torah stories. What Halloween edition. That's right, halloween edition. And we've got a new segment that we're going to be doing. What's it called? Maya?
Speaker 3:
This segment is for all of you that have something I like to call the wish factor, and that is you wish a mother fucker would. So what are things that, if you were Peter Griffith, what would grind your gears? What is the thing that you wish a person would do? Because that is the thing that will send you to the brink and really make you show them true.
Speaker 2:
Aggravated colors, that's right, what are those things? That's the fuck around and find out.
Speaker 3:
The answer to that, so yeah, and shout out to Cedric, the Entertainer, because he is the one that I got the wish factor from. If you've ever watched Kings of Comedy, he discusses the wish factor in detail, that's right. By wishing a mother fucker would take his seats, because that's me right there, sir. That's four and five, yeah.
Speaker 2:
Four and five. But first, one of the things we there's so many things that come up in the news nowadays where you're like, man, I want to pick it, I don't want to find out more, but I saw this and I was like we have to kind of go into this. Apparently, alexa, who won the 2020 election, alexa, the voice assistant from Amazon that's in an estimated of 70 million homes, has been falsely telling users that the 2020 election was rigged.
Speaker 3:
Now.
Speaker 2:
Now it says that this was out of the Washington Post, so that's wild.
Speaker 3:
Ok, so what in the Jeff Bezos is going on Like who at Amazon? Amazonian scam is only was like let's, let's, just, let's just do this right here Like what's happening. No, that no.
Speaker 2:
I feel misinformation is going to be. It's the issue that is now on our doorstep.
Speaker 3:
But if misinformation is now that systemic right.
Speaker 2:
Do we do exactly exactly when it's been in Alexis in millions and millions of homes. It says here in the Washington Post that the 2020 races were and this is what Alexa would say, quote notorious for many incidents of irregularities and indications pointing to electoral fraud taking place in major metro centers.
Speaker 3:
According, to Alexa Now. Who did they say was responsible for this mishap?
Speaker 2:
So here's the other thing it says Alexa contended that Trump won Pennsylvania. Citing an Alexa answers contributor. Get out of here Stop.
Speaker 3:
So you're about to be the new Wikipedia, right.
Speaker 2:
Stop and false and saying false shit. This is the problem. So I feel like, pay attention to where you get your news from, and that means podcast too, because you know sometimes you know we could be wrong. We'd be the first one to tell you if we're wrong, but you know what If we are wrong?
Speaker 3:
check us. I'm not, I'm not sitting up here trying to be miss right all the time.
Speaker 2:
No.
Speaker 3:
I'm trying to be misinformed, not informed but, MISS informed. So or you know, ms, if you Nasty, but we are a community based podcast here, so we are reliant upon what the public has to say, and if there's something that we didn't get right, please let me know. I'm not her, I am not trying to be the person who's dying on the hill of. I have to be right all the time. In fact, I feel like that's what's killing the nation, yeah.
Speaker 2:
Yeah, no, and straight up. I feel like we're going to need each other. We're going to need to be talking about things that you know most, everybody. If you ask them, they'll say, oh well, the media, this the media that they don't like it. Well, we are the new forms of media.
Speaker 2:
We if the election in 2016 was one by 70,000 votes in three different states and if in 2020, it was run one by 40,000 votes in two states, the electoral college is a fucking problem and the system that we have is set up in a way that it. We need to figure our ways through this together and we need to circumvent this sort of systemic system problem that makes our democracy not function, and one of the things that is going to be at the core of the fight for whether we become an authoritarian nation or whether we actually stay a democratic or try to be a democratic one, is going to be making sure that we got our facts right, Make sure we got our information right, because we are. People nowadays say we're in two different silos information silos and that is true because of algorithms and our cell phones and the Internet has broken our brains, but it doesn't mean we can't seek out and find our overton windows together.
Speaker 3:
It means that we need even more outlets that give us an opportunity to seek out, that give us an opportunity to not just be sound bites at each other, but really give us an opportunity to understand nuanced information and to be able to disseminate it in a way that everyone can understand. I was looking at just even the way I talk sometimes and a friend of mine pointed out that she said you use a lot of big words all the time. And I'm not aware that I use a lot of big words all the time. I use it because I don't think of them as big words.
Speaker 2:
Don't be facetious. You know that's not even big. But you get my point. Yeah, sure, I get your point.
Speaker 3:
But so I've been looking at even just how to use language in a way that is more encompassing, because I definitely can. You know, to my friend's point, I'm not trying to be alienating, right, but the climate has been so polarizing, especially against the educated, that the minute you say something that could be construed as higher echelon. Thinking you thinking becomes elitist. Yeah and there I feel like that's been done on purpose.
Speaker 2:
It 100%. Yeah, like when did science become the devil? When did actually?
Speaker 3:
books become the devil right there is. I was listening. I was looking at SNL the other day and they were saying that in Alabama there's this. This guy is trying to have a book come out and because of their ban on the word gay, his book can't come out because his last name is gay. Is that where we're at that?
Speaker 2:
is so fucking stupid that that is just good, god. I mean, I mean, we also have a theme that I stole from the great and all-powerful John Lovett, but it is. Everything right now is ridiculously important and insanely stupid all at the same time At the same god damn time, and that's one of them, can you?
Speaker 3:
not listen to Marvin Gaye in the state of Alabama, because I did. They take out all of Marvin Gaye's music like sir.
Speaker 1:
I mean.
Speaker 3:
But this man cannot have his book in the library because his last name is gay.
Speaker 2:
Get the fuck out of it. I'm not and I was just like wow. That's why we do what we do. That's why we started this shows, because that this kind of ridiculous stuff.
Speaker 2:
We need to live because it's wowsers, yeah, and it's giving wow it is giving wow factor and one of the things that you and I kind of talked about, where we're. We have this situation where if we, we, we understand that Really there's one side of government in our country right now that has professed that they don't want to govern and and and they're Explicit about it, and the other side is, is trying, but in a kind of a broken system. And I feel like immigration is the one issue where, if there is a weak spot for, you know, the, the side that is at least trying to govern, it is, you know there is a, there's a nuanced to your point, problems with immigration. We haven't been able to solve a lot of this stuff there's and everything, and so, you know, nationalism and fascism kind of are disguised as patriotism nowadays and a lot of propaganda that's thrown around. But what is real and what is political theater is something that I know.
Speaker 2:
Oh, for now and over the course of next year, we're gonna try and be getting that and that's why I'm so glad that we got a chance to interview our guest today. You know, liz, liz can, with a great last name, cannon, I feel like you know you're coming in, you're coming in. You know, hot, hot guns loaded, so make sure, coming up after coming up next is gonna be our interview with Liz can, and so check it out. It was definitely incredibly informative. It sort of enlightened me on on the fact that Tons of people come through Canada who knew and you know, yeah, so all kinds of things.
Speaker 2:
So make sure to stay tuned. We'll be right back with Liz cannon, okay, joining us for the interview today. You know, maya and I believe that we were talking kind of off-camera, and immigration is sort of one of those things that it's a tough thing to talk about nowadays Because it's you know, sometimes it's a boring subject, sometimes it's something that people just feel like there's not a solution for, and I know Maya and I were kind of talking it feels like it's it might be the sole issue that can scare our country towards autocracy in 24.
Speaker 3:
I've always thought this, because maybe this is just me as a black woman, but every time I have seen immigration brought up in the media, especially in a political sphere, it seems like it's really code for Xenophobia and white supremacy. Yeah, so my issue with the way immigration is discussed is that we're not looking at all of its elements and it's still being criminalized in weird ways that still champion White supremacy and overall racism.
Speaker 2:
Yeah, yeah, and I mean what is real, almost anymore because of what's like what you said and how it's getting synthesized through the media and what's sort of kind of Heartless political theater, like sending immigrants to Martha's vineyard or anything else. On drug, why is the war on drugs still a tool that's used against a sensible solution? And so thankfully, thankfully joining us today Is Liz cannon. She's an immigration attorney specializing in I-601 waivers.
Speaker 3:
Liz, thank you so much for taking the time with us today and helping us break this down so we can understand it better and also Thank you for doing it at our dinner, at your dinner time, because we could casually hear you and your fam Having dining times and a. I just think that's really sweet.
Speaker 2:
It's a door.
Speaker 3:
I didn't grow up with like that kind of thing, so whenever I see like families doing that. I'm like.
Speaker 2:
Welcome. Welcome, liz. Thank you for coming.
Speaker 3:
Okay, so pardon your girls ignorance and maybe for the rest of the world. But what is a six?
Speaker 4:
Yeah, what's?
Speaker 1:
there is a lot of minutiae in immigration law and and most people who are not immigration attorneys or who not are actively involved in a 601 process are never gonna know what it is. But it is one of those ways that I explained to people who are somewhat or very anti-immigrant why their stance may be, coming from a place that's a little bit not in line with what reality is for immigrants. So a 601 is necessary for people who are in the United States without permission and have some kind of reason that they're not immediately allowed to get their green card through their spouse, and that is actually a lot of people, including anybody who came through the border without inspection.
Speaker 2:
How many? How many people you think on average?
Speaker 1:
you can easily get the stats from the Department of State and USCIS on the amount of people who apply for 601s, and I think it usually runs around 300,000 people a year but of the people that apply, how many of those?
Speaker 2:
how many people don't apply?
Speaker 1:
So let's back up a little bit, let's talk about. Let's talk about please illegal Versus whatever else.
Speaker 1:
So let's start with that. So most of us immigration attorneys prefer the term Undocumented immigrant, and there's a reason for that. It's actually not illegal to be inside the United States without permission it's. It's a it's not a criminal act. So if you don't have the paperwork to show that you are here with permission, then you're undocumented and you're kind of unable to do almost anything.
Speaker 1:
A lot of people think people who are undocumented can access things like Welfare. They can't. They don't have the paperwork to get it, etc. Etc. But people who come across the border or Come in with a visa and then overstay that visa are both undocumented immigrants. There's a difference between the two in immigration law. However, if I come in to the United States as a tourist and I just decide to stay, I am an undocumented immigrant, and that's probably about One third or more of our undocumented immigrants are people who came here on a visa and just stayed.
Speaker 1:
They can get married to a US citizen and automatically apply for a green card. If they have a child over the age of 21, that child can apply for a green card. It's pretty straightforward. It's not that complicated. However, if that person came across either the Canadian or the Mexican border, and I do have a lot of people who came across the Canadian border with no inspection and then they get married to a United States citizen at a later date. They can't just get a green card, they have to go through a 601 process. And that's basically saying to the government Please forgive the fact that I am here without documentation and allow me to do this and there's a level of hardship you have to show to the US citizen spouse. It's not a guaranteed process and this is just one of those interesting ways that we separate immigrants that doesn't really make very much sense if, if this spouse was a reality housewife, would that make it easier to get approved?
Speaker 1:
I have represented people who are on a reality show. I can't tell you who. I have Represented people whose spouse worked for high-level CIA. I have worked for People whose US citizen spouse were the head of one department of the DEA.
Speaker 4:
Yeah, oh my god, they had to go through the same dang hoops, yeah.
Speaker 1:
Yep.
Speaker 2:
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3:
Wild.
Speaker 2:
What's your biggest challenge, Then? As far as if you're specializing in the 601s, what do you find is your sort of biggest hurdle on a daily basis?
Speaker 1:
So my biggest hurdle isn't even the 601s. I'm an expert at them, I'm very good at them. I tend to win them. My issue is sometimes with the government and its inability to understand that it's saying that someone is inadmissible. That's the term we use to say you can't get a green card when they actually are. That's my biggest hurdle, and I have to fight, sometimes pretty hard, including going to federal court and saying hey, you guys are making a massive mistake. This guy isn't even inadmissible, and usually that's about a criminal issue. Sometimes it's not, though.
Speaker 1:
I had a client who, when he went to his interview in El Salvador, he made a mistake about a date when he was talking, and you're not allowed to have an immigration attorney with you when you go to these interviews, which I actually think is technically against the law, but we won't go into that. So he's going to his immigration interview in the consulate in El Salvador and he messed up a date and they said oh, so you were in the United States twice and he said, no, no, I wasn't. They said, but you just said you were. And because he messed up one day, we had to do this huge rigmarole. They didn't accept all the evidence showing he'd only been in the states once.
Speaker 1:
We had this, all this evidence about him running his own dentistry practice, so he wasn't in the United States when he messed up and said that date and I had to go to federal court to sort it out. It was so stupid. Those are the kinds of things that just drive me crazy, because this is the big problem with immigration and this is one of the things I wish more people understood is it is a huge bureaucracy and even as an attorney, I don't have access to talk to the people who can make the decisions. I have to go through slow, terrible paperwork processes to try to reach people most of the time. Every now and then I have a contact in some higher level that I can reach out to, but it's pretty rare, and so much of the time I'm actually forced to file something in federal court for something super, super simple which, I gotta tell you, waste our tax dollars.
Speaker 3:
There's a lot of ways, so what you're saying is that you're bogged down in my new department government Okay, got it.
Speaker 2:
So can.
Speaker 3:
I ask a question. Yeah what has been the change between the Biden administration from the Trump administration and how is that affected? First I'll say what you do.
Speaker 1:
Biden has not done half of what he promised immigration attorneys and immigration attorney organizations that he said he would do. There's so many small changes he could make that would benefit so many families. He has not done that. However, there has been a massive change in at least allowing people within immigration to do their job. So under the Trump administration, they lost over a third of their workers in the Department of State and over a quarter of their workers in USAIS, who all just either quit or retired early because they weren't able to do their job.
Speaker 1:
Because the administration kept saying things like you're, you can't say yes to anything and or you can't accept any argument and or you can't accept any of these petitions. So, for example, daca, daca. Trump just basically said you know we're gonna call this illegal and we're gonna make it, so you have to. Just, you can file it, but no one's gonna look at it. So nobody has gotten DACA for years. Wow, that is also something the Biden administration could have possibly worked with Congress to get codified. That hasn't happened. That's harder to do. That's not an easy thing for him to do.
Speaker 2:
Yeah, yeah, I wanted to. I wanted to kind of to touch back on the things like because we do have two problems, like you were saying. One of them is you can't talk to the people in charge, and another one seems to be like it's legislative. And if it's legislative, when we have an obstructionist house, then there's something that a president can promise. But just the ways that are, the ways that our Constitution, ways, our government works, is going to make that not possible, and that's not necessarily on on Biden, in so much as it seems like you can't get.
Speaker 1:
Oh, of course, but there are because of the way that administrative offices are set up. Underneath the president, there actually is a lot of power that he has as the executive of these administrative offices, and there was a hundred points that Aila, the American Immigration and Legal Association, handed the Biden administration, saying these are a hundred points of things you could do the very first day you're in office to make life easier for us as lawyers and for our clients, and to date I think he's done 24 of them and are the?
Speaker 3:
are the okay. So the reason why he hasn't executed these hundred point these okay. Is the reason behind him not executing these hundred points partisan issue or could he have just with a clear no.
Speaker 1:
These are. These are small things that you can say by having the agency make a policy change. It's not a change in the law. So so in immigration law we've got different levels. We've got congressional law and then Congress delegates responsibility for certain details of that law and how to implement it to the actual agency. The agency answers to the government and the government can say to the agency, for example, something Obama did that was fantastic. The process I do is called the 601.
Speaker 1:
Until the Obama administration, my clients were forced to leave the United States and file their 601 outside of the United States and wait for it to be decided, and that could take somewhere between six months and two years. They were separated from their family that entire time waiting for the answer on their 601. Many people couldn't do that. They couldn't afford to be separated from their family for two years. The Obama administration very easily implemented a change in the regulation it was very easy to do, took only a couple months where he said we can do this inside the United States if your only inadmissibility is having come across the border and being here longer than a year, and that's called a 601A and that was super easy to implement, and it made it so much. There. Hundreds of thousands of families could now benefit from a waiver that they it was too scary to take on beforehand, and or financially impossible.
Speaker 2:
So what? And then what happened? So the Trump administration came in and obviously their mission was to gut government from the inside, and you know there was a giant brain drain that went on. But so what did they do?
Speaker 1:
That program still exists but because of the loss of workers, it has ground to a very slow crawl and 601As that were once being approved in about four months, are now taking the current processing time, I believe, is 29 months. Yeah, and that's and that's mostly, I will say, due to the fact that so many people left the USCIS, left immigration, because they were like I can't work in these, I can't work in this environment, I can't work in these circumstances, I'm out.
Speaker 3:
Well, it also seems like that's a growing trend, because if we're looking at just the state of the US right now, you've got auto workers on strike, actors on strike, teachers are leaving in droves.
Speaker 3:
It seems like these, you know, people that were instrumental in making things go forward have left in droves because they're being treated terribly, they're not being paid properly and they're constantly under threat of bureaucracy that's making their already underpaid job that much harder. So it seems like our main issue that is underlying in all of these things is a class-based issue, in addition to the xenophobia, the white supremacy, white nationalism. So how do we combat the attitudes around that? Because it seems like this has been our stand in not just one area, but 10.
Speaker 2:
Yeah, you know, yeah, almost, it almost is there, almost because you have a, you have a resource problem. Then when people are leaving and then you need to refill a lot of these seats and stuff like that, and then you also have. I think, like you said, it's a class.
Speaker 3:
it seems like a class problem that we're not properly employing enough people, we're not properly applying enough resources, but also the resource problem is that you put somebody in a room and said we're going to put you in this room, we're going to give you this problem and we're going to give you a sharpie and an exacto knife and call it a damn day. And so it's like, okay, if I don't have the right tools, how am I going to do it?
Speaker 1:
And I also like to interject that that class issue is also part of, and intertwined with, the way we approach immigration, which is we are going to create a sub-level of workers that is not protected and that will allow us to continue to depreciate wages for the masses. And then, especially in red states, the attorney general, the attorneys general of these different red states, will not protect the workers, however, if those attorneys general did take the position like in massachusetts before I was a lawyer, I was a professional dancer and I was a community organizer and, uh no, no.
Speaker 1:
African, afro, brazilian afro cuban but I still dance, I still dance.
Speaker 2:
I know I have friends who are strippers. I love them.
Speaker 1:
But here's the thing about that intersection of class and xenophobia that works out brilliantly for the conservatives, who want to keep funneling money up to the top, is as long as you have an underclass that cannot fight for their rights, then you have got wage depression across the board.
Speaker 3:
And then you've also convinced the poorest people that are fighting for those same wages. But they were born here. You've turned those people against the underclass that can't fight for themselves, because you've demonized that underclass and you did. And I just feel like that demonization is specifically targeted at poor americans, because they're the people who are going to buy it first, because they just want to look for a scapegoat, and the people who have no defense are easy scapegoats.
Speaker 2:
Yeah when you like. How do you sort of keep going at it when it seems like, systemically, there's this, this giant hurdle that that's around now? You're in florida now, and is it? Uh?
Speaker 2:
I guess I'd love to know the the difference between what is sort of a climate change, uh war on drugs kind of discussion when we're talking about a influx of uh migrants at the southern border and the more true from what I understand, the more true reality that most of the people just outstay their visa. So the real immigration problem it's it's sort of a straw man argument to say that I mean, obviously there's a problem at the southern border that is, that is a legit humanitarian, whatever we want to categorize it, but that, like you said, you've got a ton of people to come in through the Canadian border, a ton of people that come through that just outstay their visas, and so when you wake up in the morning and you're kind of you know, is it? I guess my question is, how do you sort of how do you find your footing or your grounding in though those sort of truths or or or situations?
Speaker 1:
I learned a long time ago that there's very little eyes an individual can do about the larger problems, and that started actually with climate change, because one of my best friends went on to become the head number cruncher for the first climate change report for the UN and I know how bad it actually is and it's really bad and we don't need to have a discussion about that today.
Speaker 1:
Um, so I realized I need to focus on what's right in front of me, and that's what I did when I was a community organizers. I focused on problems that were right in front of me. I also I worked with acorn, which is now gone because the Republican party destroyed it through subterfuge, but that's a different story. And again, we I just I look at something from a very micro level, not a macro level. Every day it's like these are the people I'm trying to help and how can I help them? The best that I can, because I don't have the possibility of making these large legislative changes, and I've been waiting to see these large legislative changes for over 30 years.
Speaker 1:
I don't see them coming. I wish I did, I don't. I don't believe they will happen, and I think part of the reason is because the powers that be are both Republican and Democratic and they don't want to see us make more money. They don't want to see us get ahead. They want to maintain the status quo. But that doesn't mean I can't fight for my individual families and get them back together do you?
Speaker 2:
do you find that that is the case? Because obviously I don't want to necessarily turn it into to specifically Republicans or, to your point, democrats, but one. We're just at a place in history now where you know John Boehner is Republican, for a good example, his house is. It's not even recognizable. That's why you have Mitt Romney leaving. That's why you have Liz Cheney saying that you know, with regards to Jim Jordan, that he has, no, he cannot be trusted to to back up the Constitution. You have people that they are legislative terrorists, to use Boehner's word on Jim Jordan. I guess my question is one side is probably, you know is would be for at least trying to find solutions or trying to, to try to improve the situation. The other side is for defunding and then pointing the finger right like take, taking the money away from it, and then saying see, it doesn't work. Well, it doesn't work because you've defunded you started it.
Speaker 2:
Yeah, you starved it to death and I feel in that, in that aspect is there like because, as if you group together, you know the, the writers, for example, you, they prove out here in California that, okay, there is leverage that you have. And I feel like, as immigration attorneys, you guys, you know, do you do find situations where you guys band together for to sort of make, put you know, political hay or to make the you know to make noise as a group where you're saying, okay, this is, this is what we need, this is what we need, and I, you know so.
Speaker 2:
For somebody that says, well, how could I help, how could I sort of pay attention to this from outside and and feel like, okay, well, it's not completely hopeless, you know, you, there's yeah, there are definitely different groups, and there are different groups that people can get involved with whatever their interest is.
Speaker 1:
It doesn't have to be immigration um the question the question is you know what?
Speaker 1:
what are we trying to accomplish right? And? And for some different groups there's different legislative things that they're after. So there is a organization that works on specifically LGBTQ issues amongst immigrants and how to try to get more legislation passed that will be beneficial for them. Then there's, like the overarching ALA has its own. The American immigration lawyers association has its own legislative side that's always trying to push for legislative changes and organize around that. Again back to the way our system works. It's based upon money and lobbying. Immigrants don't have big money lobbyists in in the capital they don't, and even though ALA has a few, we don't as as a group. And back to workers in general, haven't because of the breakdown of the union. I, as a union baby my mom was a union head, my dad was a union head. I am so happy to see that people are finally realizing hey, wait, unions actually do serve a purpose. They're not just corrupt, um yeah, yeah, but you know back to my issue.
Speaker 1:
As far as the immigration, the powers that be both sides of the aisle are benefiting from the system the way it works now. They just are and because of that I don't see it really changing in a large way. And then some ways that really are very humanitarian. Back to Biden could have made so many of these changes overnight and he hasn't, and so many of them are from a humanitarian standpoint. Now there have been a couple other things that he's done. I'm happy about them. I'm happy that we're allowing people to come in from the Ukraine, from Venezuela that's awesome. That's great. There's a small number from Haiti as well. That's great, but there there are different administrative changes that would help. And then there are obviously, is the larger legislative change which, by the way, back in the day we had both democratic house and senate. They could have theoretically passed some immigration reform and they didn't even come close that's true didn't even come close, they didn't even touch it.
Speaker 3:
Now also, it seems like, aside from the xenophobic response, the white nationalism response, to me one of the things that we haven't looked at is the practicality, because, okay, when Ron DeSantis made all those sweeping, like you know, I'm gonna send people to Martha's Vineyard.
Speaker 2:
But then there weren't even his. They were Texas, that part.
Speaker 3:
But what I noticed was there were all these. So I follow these two. They're like Mexican-based TikToks, right, and they're One's a Mexican-based TikTok and one's a Cuban-based TikTok, and they're just like the people who live in these regions that will talk about like okay, here's what's happening in these streets. And so the Cuban TikTok was showing that there were whole construction sites like almost partially abandoned, like all this stuff was delayed and it was because of Ron DeSantis' immigration stance. So you would think that at some point just pure greed would show that the more you deny immigration to some of these underserved minority groups especially, you've kind of screwed yourself out of a labor force because you're not paying you know classic minimum wage to your workers. So it's so interesting that these people are so against something that they exploit on a regular basis.
Speaker 1:
Well, I'm gonna say I'm here in Florida and Ron DeSantis is a very interesting case. Because of what you just said, many of his largest Republican supporters came out and said to him directly, either in the media or in private what are you doing?
Speaker 1:
What, and I've been super curious as to what he does think he's doing, because we have double-digit inflation here compared to the rest of the United States. We have repercussions that are gonna come from not having people to work on these construction sites and not work in the farm that we're just starting to see now. I am very deeply concerned about what's gonna happen to the economy of Florida in the next year and a half. But again, cutting his nose off despite his but, he's still hero to hero, by some, by some. Well, it's losing.
Speaker 2:
It's losing. He's definitely losing ground, since, I mean, he rose to power by kissing Trump's ass and basically realizing everything is theater nowadays, and so I feel like the Martha's Vineyard thing was theater and it backfired on him. I feel like even, to some degree, the Disney pushback backfired on him. Oh, the Disney pushback was hilarious because I was like you don't want to rumble with the mouse boo boo, you don't want to do it. The mouse will cut the mouse. The mouse will shiv you, it'll shiv you.
Speaker 3:
The mouse has been the mouse for a million years.
Speaker 1:
Well, even the Martha's Vineyard, my friend, rachel Self, is the lead attorney to help out the immigrants that were got off the plane in Martha's Vineyard and she's working on the criminal charges that are being brought against to Santa's based on that.
Speaker 2:
Now these are criminal kidnapping charges that I am sure are going to go forward and they better hey look at that, so we can leave on a good high note. I love that. That's good news. That's good news Before oh sorry, go ahead.
Speaker 3:
Oh, I was just going to say, if you weren't, what can our listeners do to assist programs that are helping especially underserved people that are seeking immigration or that need?
Speaker 1:
So I mean you can donate to different kinds of legal aid groups, but what I'm going to say and this is as my life as a community organizer people underestimate the power of a phone call.
Speaker 1:
If you want to see any kind of legislative change about immigration, about gay rights, about protection for different minorities, et cetera, et cetera, the best tool you have is to get on the phone with your congressperson and or, hopefully, and your senators, and say no, I insist on staying on the line until I get an aid to talk to me about this issue, because I pay my taxes, so I pay all of your salaries, and I need to express myself directly to someone who talks directly to my congressperson or my senator. Or I'd prefer to even talk to them and say I want to see change and this is why I want to see change. When I was a community organizer, I would have senators sometimes approach me and say Liz, I couldn't believe how many phone calls I got about that bill. And I go oh really, how many did you get? And they'd say 10. 10 phone calls was huge to them.
Speaker 1:
Now, granted, this is a state senator, but nonetheless, but still.
Speaker 2:
In fairness, most of them are over 100 years old though, so it's like you know.
Speaker 3:
Yeah, most of them, you know, don't know how to use anything past the iPhone 6.
Speaker 2:
Oh yeah, a landline phone, yeah so would it be Okay?
Speaker 3:
so let's just put this out there what if we consulted with you about just a little blurb that we could tell our listeners to use to call?
Speaker 3:
So because I feel like sometimes, unless people have like even just a small script, of this is what I'm looking for, this is what I want to be passionate about and this is what I'm asking you to pay attention for. So maybe it's on us to provide a little script like that to our listeners and perhaps we can consult with you on some things that we should be looking to say. I just feel like maybe if we have a more proactive approach, knowing that information that the calls, are the business, then let's come up with a script.
Speaker 3:
I know the few times that I've called my senators or my congresspeople I've had a script saying I'm calling specifically about this issue, specifically about this case, and I feel like just the specificity helps, because the specificity provides a certain urgency that just cold calling alone wouldn't do.
Speaker 2:
Yeah, I think what we might do is we maybe we'll put together a list of Because I know there's a website that has a list of numbers dependent on what state you're either in or that you want to help, and so we'll try and put that in the show notes in addition to we might call you for consultation and see what might be the best issue, especially as we get closer to November of 24. I think there's going to be a stark choice, even though, to your point, both sides sort of benefit from the issue. Using your Ron DeSantis example, right now, you guys missed out on a ton of tax revenue.
Speaker 2:
Ron, you missed out on a ton of tax revenue, so we'll put that in the show notes. Yeah Well, thank you, liz. We appreciate it a ton for you taking the time to talk with us and help shed some light on this, because I think it really is going to become a key issue in sort of this giant, ultimately as a power grab coming up in a year from now for the whole set of marbles, and so I think immigration is going to be one of those things where helping separate fact from fiction is just going to be really important and lift it up Any kind of voice that we can is what we do and what we appreciate you being here to do with us.
Speaker 2:
So thank you so much.
Speaker 3:
Bye.
Speaker 2:
Take care.
Speaker 3:
It's lovely to meet you. Hey everybody, welcome back. So I hope you enjoyed our wonderful interview with Liz. Wasn't she informative? I just learned so much, so I was really, really happy to get a chance to talk to her. And now we are going to debut a very brand new segment and it is called the Wish Factor. I wish a mother fucker would.
Speaker 3:
So in today's Wish Factor we looked at the housing issue that some people have when they rent their place out to renters. So I don't know if you've seen this, but there was this big story about how this guy Airbnb a room in his home and this lady took him to court, got him kicked out of his home and is basically squatting illegally. And she's able to do so because he made the rental in a way that bypass some permits that he needed. So because of that permit bypass, she's able to basically claim squatters rights when she made him pay her legal fees. There was another example that our producer Bree brought to us where she said that a guy was living in his car because he rented out his place to a guy who squatted illegally and now is Airbnb in his basement. So this man is living in his car and not getting any of the funding that his squatter is getting from renting his basement.
Speaker 3:
And this is where the Wish Factor comes in, because I wish a mother fucker would. First of all, I would raid Donovan at host so quickly. I mean, I don't know raid Donovan personally, but I know the ghetto versions and I feel like I would call Pookie and them. That's a Pookie and them situation, because I would get these people all the way up out of my house. You would never. And I saw the hue of these people in question and I noticed it was non brown, because I feel like brown and black people would have dealt with this in a Pookie and them fashion.
Speaker 2:
I feel like we're almost getting to that point where, if people feel that they can't get there, solve through the court system, then I wish a mother fucker would. What are you going to do? Just take them out there and get them out. Somehow There'd be a shotgun some damn where Honey Exactly.
Speaker 3:
That is crazy. I'd cut the phone lines, all the power would be gone, because I bet the power and everything is in my name. I would have cut that so quick.
Speaker 2:
I would starve you out Exactly. Figure out ways to do that.
Speaker 3:
I would get a slew of Negroes just to block the driveway, just so you couldn't eat of it. Hell, no, ain't a way.
Speaker 2:
Yeah you could play share her second album or her third album.
Speaker 4:
I would just have like you believe in life after love after love, keep banging that shit.
Speaker 3:
I know the one that did it for me. I remember when I was in college there was this girl and she was really obsessed with that song. I love you always, forever.
Speaker 4:
She was just having on a loop.
Speaker 3:
Sometimes it'd be like an hour of that song and I was like girl, I'm going to kill you If you I mean you need to have. I can't say you'll love me, love me forever, one more damn time. I would just put that silently and pipe it through the house in different ways, just like whenever she had a thought I'd be like I love you always, forever near and far closer together 3 AM Okay.
Speaker 4:
One free day. I will be with you. Every day, I will be for you. I mean listen.
Speaker 2:
I tell you what that's crazy. And you know, before we go, I brought in a Torah story today. You did, I did, I did. I mean there's so many of these and I'm looking forward to kind of putting these out there we need to make a Torah stories book.
Speaker 3:
I feel like we just need to profile all the musicians and roadies we know and we're like, give us your best Torah story.
Speaker 4:
It's a great idea Change the names to protect the people that will sue us.
Speaker 3:
I don't know if they had innocence.
Speaker 2:
See, I wouldn't even go in there. We were in Sweden one night and we were the crew not me, of course not. We're looking for drugs and we were looking everybody's. We're bound by the bus. It's like 2 am in the morning. This guy comes up and he's like you guys need something. And you know we're like, yeah, sure, we're looking. He's like what do you need? What do you need? You need you want baby, I get you baby. You want drugs, I get you drugs. We're like wait a minute, back up, back up, you get us a baby Baby, your baby Are people. Is that the first thing that you say is you're offering up a baby I'll take a baby Jesus.
Speaker 2:
And he was like no, we don't talk about this, but if you need a baby, I get you baby. So nowadays we always if we're like, if we're looking for something specific, we're like you want baby.
Speaker 3:
You want drugs.
Speaker 2:
I get you baby. So that's my tour story today and I feel that's good, that's a good one to end on.
Speaker 3:
That's a great tour story. You want baby, we get you, baby, we get you baby.
Speaker 2:
So make sure if you've got, if you are a roadie or if you're something like that, if you've got tour stories, make sure to hit us up at info at slap the power dot com, and if you wish, a motherfucker would on anything also hit us up either in the comments.
Speaker 3:
Let us know your wish factor. And also, we have a whole bunch of new subscribers, so we just want to thank everybody that has recently joined our little family. We're growing and we are really excited to be growing with you, so thank you for supporting us, thank you for tuning in and, just in general, thank you for riding with us. We're figuring this out as we go, but we're always growing in a positive direction, and that is because of you all. So thank you.
Speaker 2:
Absolutely so, thank you guys.
Speaker 4:
Slap the Power is written and produced by Rick Barrio-Dill and Maya Sykes, associate producer Rikori audio and visual engineering and studio facilities provided by Slap Studios LA with distribution through our collective home for social progress in art, slap the Network. If you have any ideas for a show you want to hear or see, or if you would like to be a guest artist on our show, please email us at info at slap the power dot com.