Board With Each Other
A podcast that looks at Board Games / Tabletop Gaming through the lens of playing as a couple or with a regular gaming partner. Hosted by Al & Hannah, We review a game each episode.
Board With Each Other
Episode 03: Stardew Valley - Brutalist Farming
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In this episode of Board with Each other, Al & Hannah tackle the board game re-imagining of one of Hannah's favourite videogames, Stardew Valley.
Stardew valley is a 1-4 player co-op game which despite its cutesy veneer has a rather brutal level of difficulty. But is it any good? and how well does it play as a pair - listen away to find out!
Hello everybody, it's Al here. Since we originally published this episode, it's come to light that I cocked up the rules, which I'm sure won't be the first time, won't be the last time it happens. During the episode to come, I went on a little bit of a tirade around the bundles within Stardew that were essentially impossible to complete. What I didn't know is you can spin hearts within the game to swap your bundles out. So there is a mechanism within the game that allows you to get past that. I was quite harsh on elements of the gameplay because of that rules mistake. So for that I'm sorry, and I just wanted to put this at the start of the episode to basically disregard my my little rant during the uh during the review. Anyway, I hope you enjoyed the episode. Bye for now. I'm Al Simpson and I'm joined as ever by my co-host, wife, and player two, Hannah Kelly.
SPEAKER_00Hi guys.
SPEAKER_02So today we are going to be talking about Stardew Valley the board game. Stardew Valley is uh a reimagining of the hits indie farming simulator, I guess I would say. How would you describe Stardew Valley the game?
SPEAKER_00Oh, I think farming simulator is a little bit hard, isn't it? I'm thinking about goat simulator and stuff like that. It's um it is a really lovely indie game, huge amount of depth to it. It lasts hours and hours and hours and is probably one of my preferred. Yeah, I've got a very soft spot for Stardew.
SPEAKER_02You plugged a lot of hours into it. It's it's very much sort of another take on the harvest moon and Animal Crossing kind of formula.
SPEAKER_00I've never played Animal Crossing.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, we've never had a Nintendo console, that's why.
SPEAKER_00But it's not about board video games.
SPEAKER_02No, it's not. But I thought we'd have to mention it because it is the the first one of these that we've done that is a reimagining of sort of an existing video game. I know there are quite a few out there. Um the the board game version is a cooperative ball game where you each player takes on the particular a particular role around farming. So profession, should I say, uh, which, if memory serves me correctly, are mining, fishing, foraging, and farming, unsurprisingly. And through those uh profession players, you basically have to do two things. You have to fulfill a series of random objectives that you draw at the start of the game, which they are four, and you have to complete a uh a community centre. So for those who haven't played the video game, the community centre is basically a repository for all the things that you grow and obtain during the game, and you hand them in and you get rewards. The board game version uh has six rooms within the community center, they all require different things. Again, they're randomized, some sometimes between a choice of five cards or a choice of three, and you have to deliver those. The requirements vary from room to room. Some of them are money, some of them are crops that you buy, others are things you forage, fish that you fish up, they can be minerals, all sorts basically. Any of the resources that you find in the game are represented again in the board game. Um, so on your turn, you basically get to do two actions and one move. So you can pick anywhere on the board to start. The board is comprised of basically the town that you live in, um, and some outskirt areas like uh different places to fish, the ocean, the lake, etc., uh, and the mines. And you can start anywhere, you can do an action, and then you can either stay where you are and take another action, or you can move along a predetermined path from one area to another and do a second action where you end up. Um when you move down a path, there's a series of what are called forageables on the board, which are basically face-down card tokens, and you you basically choose one of those that that borders the path you've taken and pick it up. You have a player card on which you have an inventory, which is very limited. You only ever have space for six items. You have a tool associated with your profession that you can upgrade as the game goes along to make you better at whatever it is that you do. And starting at the end of the first season, uh you start to uh get basically uh upgrades, which are almost like leveled leveled ups for your um for your profession. Game flows where you have four, you have something called the season deck, and you have four cards per season and then a fifth ending, end of the season card. The cards you draw basically you draw one at the start of your turn, and it will cause random events to take place. So that could be anything from a crow eating your crops to it raining, your crops getting magically watered.
SPEAKER_00Birthdays.
SPEAKER_02Birthdays, so friends you've made will give you gifts, um, and almost always you have the ability to trade, so you can sell things and trade things between players, which is very important. Uh, because it's the only way you get money, and also it allows you to give things that you have picked up and found to other players who may be able to make more use of them on their turn. There's also special cards, which are festivals, which each have their own unique properties when you draw them. Um the season deck is not the same every game. There's basically a much wider selection of cards for each of the four seasons, and you construct the deck at the start of the game, so there's there's a large degree of sort of random, so you don't really know what's gonna what's gonna come your way during the game. Um and that's basically it. If you manage to come Ah, yes, you can also make friends.
SPEAKER_00So there's a friends are a really important part of the game. So if you make a friend, um you get heart tokens, and you use those heart tokens to reveal bundles and also negate some of the negative effects that perhaps come up in game.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, absolutely. Uh spot on. So yeah, making friends is very, very important, just like real life. Um funny how you forget that part. Yeah, yeah. Just like real life. Um so I think that that's basically how gameplay flows, and uh in order to win the game, as I said, you have to complete all of your objectives, which could be things like make a certain number of friends per player, have so much money per player.
SPEAKER_00Number of animals per player.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, exactly. Um, and complete all of the community centre bundles. I think it's fair to say that unlike the uh video game version, which is very, very relaxing, Stardew Valley the board game is what I would term unrelentingly vicious.
SPEAKER_00The amount of turns you have to do an awful lot is is very little. Um, and seasons tick over at an astonishingly fast pace. I think spring is often gone before I've even worked out what it is that I'm supposed to be doing.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, exactly. Um I think the last thing I wanted to mention is there there are a lot of different mechanics in play. Basically, all of the various things you can do, so fishing or exploring the mine, which is a bit like exploring a dungeon basically, um, they all operate quite differently. Um so it's one of those games where it's not exceptionally complex, but there are a lot of rules. There's a lot of the there are a lot of different things you need that are very situational that you need to know how to do, depending on where you go. Uh, in terms of running time, I think what would you say?
SPEAKER_00I'd say an hour, give or take, maybe up to an hour and a half, maybe 45 minutes of the quickest. Yeah, an hour, yeah, give or take. So this was a Christmas present to me from Al because um I love the game so much and I'd love a video game. I have to say, I think they've done a really good job of representing the kind of heart of what Stardew Valley is about. Um, you get all the same characters and the villagers through there, so there's a real nice strong theme there. Planting and crops, that's that's there, and I think yeah, it really reminds me of the game. Also, as I play quite often, I hear the music in the back of my head.
SPEAKER_02Um I mean uh it is worth mentioning that the game is actually uh published by and at least partly designed by the the design of the game concerned Ape. So he he's published it and his name is on the credits. How much of the actual game mechanics uh he he was responsible for, I'm not sure. But in comparison to a lot of these sort of licensed IP games, I think he he obviously had a much uh much deeper involvement than perhaps some of the other ones we've seen in the past. I think it's also worth mentioning. I mean, I thought that the original sort of price point of this, I think it was like£55 or£60, was quite high. Uh a lot of game shops do damaged games, and something I never actually knew before this cropped up on my radar. And the description of it said, Oh, you know, there's some damage to the box contents will be fine. I was like, uh, okay, and it was it was literally half price. And it turned up, and there's a very slight dent in one of the corners. Um so for those of you out there that are looking for a bargain and didn't know this existed, um I mean, I obviously I do sell games on what have you now and again, but for the most part I just like adding them to my collection. If that's something that not that doesn't bother you, and you didn't know that was a thing, uh at least in the UK, I'm not sure about uh other countries, it's definitely worth a look.
SPEAKER_00Um we'll say nothing about you buying me a damaged board game intentionally. Let's just skip past.
SPEAKER_02I had our budget. Wasn't it only Christmas present.
SPEAKER_00And perhaps just before we get to our ratings, it probably is worth mentioning that this is an unrelentingly hard uh cooperative game, given how chill the actual video game is. I think we started off, they give you like a modified deck to begin with in terms of the season deck, so that actually you you you get a flavour of it and it's not too difficult. And our first few games were quite straightforward, but actually we haven't won in a while. Yes, it's been a long time since we've won.
SPEAKER_02And it's not been close either.
SPEAKER_00No, no, it's been it it has been very, very difficult. And I I mean that doesn't bother me.
SPEAKER_02No, no.
SPEAKER_00I'm okay with that and I'm okay with losing. Um, but for other people it might be quite a challenge.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, it can it can be. I mean, there's elements of this I'll touch on when I for some of my scores, but there are elements of it that can be unrelentingly unrelentingly brutal for want of a better term, and we play quite a lot of co-op games. Um for such a happy friendly skin game, it's like oh it's really quite jarring at times. It's like, why is it so vicious? Um but yeah, I think it is a very good point, and well done for mentioning it, because if you like your co-op games very, very tough and you get the replayability from you know being able to play them over and over again because you can't beat them, great. But if you're somebody that gets quite frustrated with something, um maybe, maybe just sort of an advisory sticker there for you. Okay, so I guess on to scoring then. Would you like to kick us off?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, so for those of us who might not have listened for those of you who might not have listened to us before, we start off by scoring the general game and then we go into our couple's rating. So our first scoring criteria is components, so the box itself, what it comes with. Um what I would say is that it's a fairly nice box set. What I love about it is it's got an awful lot of tokens, but it's got a really nice storage system.
SPEAKER_02Oh yeah, absolutely. Um I will second that. It's one of the few games I've played where there is a space for everything in the inserts, there's no modifications required, and you don't have to add anything to it, it all just fits back into the box.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, and because of that, it makes it really easy to set up and set down because all these tokens are all nicely organized and ordered, and you just plant them down on the table in the nice insert, and that's fabulous.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, and there's a really nice tray for all of the various plant tokens because there are a lot of different tokens, so you've got bags for some of them where they're supposed to be shuffled, but for the ones that you just want quick access to, they're all just there, so you just pick them off this big tray. Um, although saying that, it's a bit of a table hog.
SPEAKER_00It is, isn't it? Yeah, you definitely have to stretch the table out to be able to play it. You've got quite a large board, and then you've got all these gobbins that go through it. Um what I'd also say is that you've just got standard player pieces.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I I that's one of the things that I'm not super happy with either. In terms of your actual player, it's literally just a small plastic chess porn.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_02And I feel like they put so much effort into the rest that they could have done something a bit cooler with that.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_02It just feels a bit compared to the rest of the components, it just feels a bit cheap and a bit of a cop-out.
SPEAKER_00Even if it was a bit like a Monopoly, monopoly playing piece.
SPEAKER_02That's my thinking. You know, you could have a little, whatever the tool is, you could have a little version, plastic version of that. Um, it would just add a little bit of character to the game, whereas that kind of saps it a little bit, with everything else being so so nicely done. So what would you score it?
SPEAKER_00So seven. I'm I'm quite happy with it. I think the player pieces could do with improvement, but aside from that, yeah.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I give it a seven as well. I think um the only things I mark it down for is it seems more of a table hog than is is necessary for a while. Like when we play something like Gloomhaven, I don't mind us taking up the entire living room, but this it just feels a bit overkill for the level of game it is for some reason, and the the the player porn, so yeah, I give it a seven as well. Okay.
SPEAKER_00Um so then our next rating score is complexity. Um what do you reckon?
SPEAKER_02Um this is a funny one. I I don't think it's an overly complex game. I think all of the the rules are, you know, they they're all I wouldn't say simple, but they they're all fairly understandable. What I find is a bit niggly is the number of different systems in play. I find even after I I think we must have played it about seven or eight times now, I'm still having to refer to the rule book quite often because there are either there's either things that we haven't really used very much, so you forget and you've got to go back to oh now I'm in a situation like cracking open geos, for instance, got a now system for that. Um and some of the systems around, like the exploring the mine, for instance, are actually a little bit fiddly.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, a bit clunky.
SPEAKER_02A bit clunky and a bit fiddly. And yeah, because of that, it it just sometimes it breaks the flow a little bit, having to to go back and check. Um there's not uh there's not like a a one sheet either. I imagine you could download one, I'm sure somebody who bought Game Geek or what have you has created like a bit of a cheat sheet for it just as a reminder. But yeah, it is a little bit clunky in that way. Clunky, not janky. I think everything's fine, but it it just it takes a little bit more referring back.
SPEAKER_00And I think what I find is that we tend to gravitate to the same certain areas, so there are things that just seem unnecessarily complex. So you mentioned geodes. Uh we don't particularly use that mechanism an awful lot.
SPEAKER_02No.
SPEAKER_00So it feels over-engineered for what it is.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, some of them feel a bit excess to requirements almost.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. I mean, in in terms of um AP, you No. You yeah, you it's one of those games where you just uh you're almost blinded by so many options that you have to go into almost the elf space, don't you? You're just like, I'm just gonna do I'm just gonna do this and see what happens. Um arguing about rules, I don't think there's no I don't think we do.
SPEAKER_00I think we have to refer back to the rules, um, but I don't think there's a huge amount of arguing about it. Um and uh like I say, I think there's plenty to do on your turns, although your turns are quite restricted. Um there's there's plenty there.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, there's plenty of options. Okay, what did you score?
SPEAKER_00So I scored it a seven, mainly because I think it's quite easy for people to pick up, and I don't think it would be particularly complex. Um but equally I still feel there's a lot to do and there's a lot of variety, but yeah, I absolutely agree that it's a bit clunky in places.
SPEAKER_02I gave it a five. Because I just think it could be it could be smoother. So that brings us on to shelf life, uh, value for money and replayability.
SPEAKER_00Um so I'm probably gonna let you start this off because I think you've probably got stronger feelings on it than me. I mean, I could play Stargy Valley endlessly, be it board game, be it whatever.
SPEAKER_02Um yeah, I do think this has a shelf life.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_02I think um I I I'm not done with it yet by any stretch of the imagination. I st uh we played it a couple of nights ago and I really had fun. Um but I do think it will stop once you you sort of crack it and you've seen everything it has to offer, I'm not sure there's going to be a huge amount to pull me back. Um I also think in terms of value for money, uh if I paid full price for this, while components are okay and everything, if I look at other similar priced games, I feel like it's probably a little bit inflated.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I would agree that I mean is there is it a limited print run thing?
SPEAKER_02I have a feeling it might actually be out of print now. I'm not sure whether they're going to print it again. I don't quote me on that, I haven't I haven't checked, but I feel like around the time that I did find it for you, the reason I found it uh a damaged copy was because I couldn't find it in any of the traditional game stores. Um or when I say traditional game stores, I was from a traditional game store, um, but they didn't have any sort of new copies and stock, so I don't know where what what its status is.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, and I think whilst you know your objective tokens and your community centre objectives will change with each game, the basic mechanics don't really. And so whilst again you might choose different professions, you're still kind of facing the same cards over and over again with a similar playstyle, whereas other games we played actually they will play completely differently each playthrough. This isn't really the case, it's still the same game, just slightly different challenges, or slightly more challenging, slightly less challenging.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I'd second that. And I think the professions don't have the market impact on the game that you think they would.
SPEAKER_00No, they don't. I remember us like really, really, you know, kind of arguing or debating about who's gonna take what character um and what profession. Um, but actually these days I don't think it really particularly matters. And I would say also that we tend to play just one player each. You could absolutely take two, but that just makes the game more challenging in some ways because it's a number of player maps, so you'd have to have four times ten gold per.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I was gonna get onto that in the scalability section, I think, because I think it's fair bit to talk about there.
SPEAKER_00Okay, alright.
SPEAKER_02Um, okay, fine. So, yeah, I gave it a five.
SPEAKER_00Uh so I gave it a four.
SPEAKER_02Fair enough. Yeah, okay.
SPEAKER_00Although you know I will still probably plug hours away at it and make you play it because it started with Aggie and I started you back.
SPEAKER_02That's fine, I'll be along for the ride.
SPEAKER_00Um and so then our final category under general is fun. Um, and so how much fun you have whilst you're playing it?
SPEAKER_02I'm about to go on a bit of a rant here, I think.
SPEAKER_00Shopping folks. I'm gonna pour a glass of wine.
SPEAKER_02So I, as I'm if you've listened to some of our episodes, you'll know that I do love a bit of luck and a bit of random in my games. One of my pet peeves is arbitrary losses in either uh in in competitive or or carb games. What I mean by that is something just happening on a turn that basically makes you lose the game. Uh I mind it a bit less if there's no luck involved and I've just done something really stupid. That's fine, I can swallow that a little bit easier. But when it's just blind luck and something can happen, that means the entire game is a wash. I see that as a design flaw personally. And what happens with this is some of your community centre bundles they're not revealed from the start of the game, and you have to acquire hearts from making friends in order to reveal them to know what you need. Uh, two of them can have things that you need that only happen in certain seasons, and as happened a few games ago. Uh we f we flipped uh one of the bundles over in summer, and it required spring, which is the season before crops. There is no mitigation for that. There's no way you can get around that through playing the rest of the game, no amount of money or other resources or anything. That is it, you've lost the game right there and then. So that was literally a 15-minute game that we just bang, you've lost. And that I am not a fan of.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. And I think the way we've played subsequently is to kind of take that into consideration. So if we've not revealed those bundles, we'll try and stockpile the things that we think we might need. Um, however, that's just making the game more challenging for yourself in the long run. And in spring, which is obviously like the first season that you come to, actually that has a huge impact then on the rest of the game.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, absolutely. And you also you end up making tactical decisions to mitigate the possibility of that happening, where in reality, if you knew what you were striving for, you you make other tactical decisions, yeah. And it leaves you in a weakened state if it turns up the flip side, as happened in our last game, where we didn't need any of that, and we basically just not wasted our time, but we could have been doing something a bit more uh a bit more helpful. You can also get really screwed over by luck, particularly around the fishing mechanic and the exploring the the mines mechanic. They're based on dice rolls, and with action, the action economy being so precious in this, if you waste a few turns, you may as well pack the game up. Yeah. Um and by wasting a few turns, you could literally have four or five bad rolls of the dice where you don't get anything that you need, nothing helpful. You can you it's not a kind of game where you every time you try you'll get something. You can literally turn up blank and have a wasted action.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_02And the game can just run away from you very very quickly because of that.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, absolutely. Uh the mine I think can be particularly frustrating because actually if you get a duff mine card, so you you have different levels than the mine, but you can also descend a level and so you get to flip over a new card and that will tell you what resources you will win if you roll a Jujumo and a heart for example. And actually if you get stuck on that floor, yeah that can be really problematic.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. And it's a great shame because when it does all work it's a really fun co-op. It it you know the the theme or the R work and everything of you know you can feel like you're in you're in the game as such in the video game almost. So it's a great shame that I feel like they just didn't quite nail some of those mechanics. I'm sure people have house ruled it away to a certain extent but again I I I can't think myself of a way of doing it though and then not make the game too easy. So I I feel like they just they they they took a slight misstep with some of the mechanics and didn't really think through or perhaps it would be perhaps as well as they should have done or could have done. Yeah perhaps but again if you're the kind of person that that doesn't mind that and you you know luck's gonna screw me over I'll just reset the game and start again then that might not be an an impediment for you but it it did it didn't make me angry. It just it it made me uh I left I I've left so many great co-op game sessions where I've lost and gone that was a great game a lot of the time when I lose in this or we lose in this I it just leaves leaves me feeling a bit deflated in a way because I feel like we've lost not really due to the choices and decisions that we made.
SPEAKER_00And because maybe because Stardew Valley the the video game there is no winning there is no losing it is just a game that you play you know and so maybe you don't have that you know in the same way.
SPEAKER_02Yeah maybe yeah.
SPEAKER_00That said I am a I I like to restart games an awful lot. It doesn't bother me anywhere near as much as you no I don't so um for that reason I gave it a six but I would agree with you that I think you know that it it's not a different game each time you play it and so it does have a shelf life so I gave it a six.
SPEAKER_02Yeah I gave it a four which is harsh I think you know but I I don't it almost speaks to oh you I I hate it. I don't hate it I really like the game I just if they made a couple of different design choices it would be a 708 for me. It's just irritating I think the more I play it the more they niggle.
SPEAKER_00Yes I can see it being one of those ones that you don't want to play anymore eventually you're like done. But it was my birthday present my discounted damaged birthday present yes and you're a simp for star Jew I get it so you know we'll be playing it till we're 60.
SPEAKER_02Okay. Alright shall we go on to our couple ratings then? No, should we do the final scores for general Okay so if I figure all those up we end up with five point six we always round up so that gives a general rating of six.
SPEAKER_00That seems about fair and about it. Yeah I think that feels about right yeah okay on to our couple's rating then alright so our first category under couples rating is table talk so that's thinking about how much time you spend um interacting finding out about your your player too um where would you score it? How would you score it?
SPEAKER_02Um well probably talk about it first before I score it um I think it's really good for this I honestly do. I think winning or losing I mean a lot of co-ops you could say the same but I think you you genuinely it does make you really discuss what you're going to do and why you're going to do it. I think you have to talk things through you have to strategize together and there's a lot of celebration and commiseration with what people do what the other player's doing so I I think it's really good for that.
SPEAKER_00Yeah no absolutely I completely agree I would say that when we're playing we are probably talking about the game and what we're doing in the game.
SPEAKER_02We're both really engaged.
SPEAKER_00Yeah we're really engaged with it when you pick your um upgrades at the end of the season or if you get to pick two pick one quite often we'll have a conversation about what we think is best. Yeah um and you know we talked about the whole getting to know you factor well actually I don't know that I've seen you perhaps throw a strop about unfow I did I don't think I think that whole thing was quite new for me. I didn't realise that you were gonna react so badly to this arbitrary loss.
SPEAKER_02I was a bit like just just for the listeners' sake by by reacting badly she means grumbling I didn't you know flip the table and start throwing plates well no one's ever done that while we're playing a board game.
SPEAKER_00You came pretty close a scythe fine I'm still I'm still th thinking about divorce I'm still thinking about it. Right so I gave it an eight yeah I gave it an eight as well absolutely completely agree. Yep okay uh so next one Hannah would you like to yep so this is if it's uh a competitive game then co competitiveness or if it's co-op then a co-op rating um what we also talked about as well is the idea of quarterbacking yeah so I have a feeling this is not how we play it because I think we're level pegging in in this but I think that there is a very high propensity for quarterbacking absolutely potentially the worst I've ever seen yes actually I was thinking about this today I completely would agree with you I think if you've got somebody who perhaps is a little bit shyer or a bit quieter who's not familiar with the game you would completely take over and say this is what you're gonna do and this is the best course of action and the other person wouldn't get a look in.
SPEAKER_02It would turn into a seller game with somebody rolling dice occasionally yeah um yeah it it's it's great if you're on the same page and you're both approaching it in the same way and you genuinely are cooperative but yeah I mean even you compare it to something like pandemic this is worse for that. Yeah absolutely um if somebody wanted to take over it would completely ruin the experience of somebody else and somebody could very well take over through no fault of their own I think the game is just built that way.
SPEAKER_00I I actually think that even us and I think we we try quite hard not to do that when we have new players and we're in reducing them to board games I think even then it would be very hard not to do.
SPEAKER_02Yeah the temptation to do it would be very very difficult particularly because it is so punishing yeah I think I think that's probably the X factor that makes it worse. I think rules wise you compare it to something pandemic or something of that ilk the propensity is roughly the same but it is such a punishing game that the temptation is like oh no don't do that you've got to do this.
SPEAKER_00And action economy is so limited because you cannot waste a turn I found myself in a situation where I've accidentally wasted a term because I hadn't thought of three and I was a bit like yeah and so I'm screwed now. Yeah. Um and I think that's possibly its biggest downfall. However that's not how we play and that's because of who we are.
SPEAKER_02No it's not but I think when we when we devised this category it was always about the potential for that and potentially marking it down for that and for that reason I'm giving it a five.
SPEAKER_00Okay so I gave it um an eight because that's not how we play it um but I mean maybe I'll I'll downgrade that a little bit maybe to like a six.
SPEAKER_02Okay fair enough yeah because I I just think the the the capacity potential for it there is really really high and if that is if that is a potential problem for you then I I would steer clear personally.
SPEAKER_00I definitely wouldn't be playing this with somebody perhaps who I was newly seeing you know husband number two backup husband semi-husband whatever you want to call him uh whatever judge but yeah I I think I think it works because we have a have a system and we've been playing and we've been playing for a long time but definitely um not for a new person or I definitely have to bite my tongue.
SPEAKER_02Fair enough okay so our final category is scalability and FOMO would this be better with more players do you feel like you're missing out with playing with only two No. I would agree.
SPEAKER_00Is it a really really succinct answer? No absolutely not um so I kind of touched on this to begin with or earlier on we play with two player maps because actually you largely have decided that it would be easier because your main objectives are they scale they scale so rather than needing say 10 gold per player so a total of 20 gold we'd actually need 40 and getting 40 gold is a lot harder.
SPEAKER_02I um I don't think it really matters either way I think it would it it would be fine but I definitely don't see the need for additional players and I think given the quarterbacking that we've talked about I think actually it's better that we picked up the game at the same time and we played it played it best two yeah I mean when when Hannah's talking about we play with two player mats what she means by that is the vast majority of co-op games we tend to play two handed so Gloomhaven for instance we play with four characters we control two each pandemic we usually play with um one each and a float one each and a and a float don't call them a floater random that we shared player control a shared character or floater which is now what it will be known as for the end of time. So we we usually if it's a co-op game although Marvel Champions again was exceptional but I think Marvel Champions is so complicated with with playing two two actual hands or just no definitely not but in the classic sort of co-op you have a character and you play the game we tend to play with two or have a floater um we don't we don't get thing you talk about floaters in restaurants I'm sure um moving on uh yeah I don't it it doesn't add anything to this I don't think I think it would detract actually I think it would I think it would detract I think I mean we haven't tried it cars on the table we haven't tried it but I think it would make the game even more difficult because everything scales all the objectives and community centre bundles scale with the number of players and because the action economy is so tight and so small I don't think adding extra people would necessarily make achieving those goals any easier you just have to get more stuff. So it is the opposite of why we would score it low so for that instance I've given it a nine.
SPEAKER_00Oh so I've given it a ten. Yeah fair enough I just I don't I don't think adding a third player would make any difference whatsoever.
SPEAKER_02Plus the downtime we talked about it taking an hour to an hour and a half I think if you played a genuine four player game with this it would double the the time. The amount of discussion and strategising you may disagree.
SPEAKER_00Yeah I I don't know that I particularly disagree with that. I particularly agree with that I think it I I I I think you would still have the same conversations and I think you'd probably react more to what was happening on the board so actually yeah I think it would obviously run you a longer time but I don't I don't agree with that.
SPEAKER_02Okay well there there we go. Okay so that gives us a couple's two player rating of uh 7.5 which rounds out as an eight that's surprisingly high and I think still higher than Marvel Champions. Quite possibly um I mean I I guess I agree it's it's a decent to middling game that's really good at two players.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. I think I think I would I spend 50 quid on it for a two player game?
SPEAKER_02Probably not and I think the overall game I think I think the overall game needs needs to be a bit better but it does play really really well as two which is always the lens that we look at things through.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_02So if it seems like your bag and this is your your kind of situation and I assume by listening to the podcast it is then might be worth a might be worth purchase.
SPEAKER_00I think there's probably something that I've been thinking about a lot about Stargy Valley that hasn't kind of come up. What I would also say about it which is kind of frustrating is that I find we tread the same paths because you've got only the option to move once and have your two actions the path that you tread is actually really quite narrow so it's always the same slots that we go to forageables and that doesn't matter because the forageables are randomised each gameplay and also each season but again it just kind of feels like there's so much of the board that we're not really exploring because your your action economy is so limited you've got to be really beelined and you've got to be really rejective.
SPEAKER_02I'd agree with that and it almost does feel like you're missing out a little bit as well because you've got all these mechanics and all these different things that you can do but you actually end once you get to know what's required by a lot of the bundles and what have you you you find you you end up doing the same thing as I think in a lot of our games I'm just constantly down nipping between the mine and making friends or the lake fishing and making friends and you're Geodes is a really good example.
SPEAKER_00So last last game like we got uh Jojo Tile which said that we couldn't crack geodes or it cost us more to crack geodes and I was like well it doesn't really matter because we haven't got we haven't got time for that we haven't got time for that we've got we've got a water crops. And almost just feels like extra govens on there that you don't really have to use as the game which is because the whole point of Sarji Valley is it was this is really immersive experience where sandboxing didn't really matter if it took you three years to you know fill up some chickens.
SPEAKER_02Yeah right uh so I guess that is that so yeah as we said a middling game that is really good for two players if that is your bag. So I think next uh episode we're going to be talking about calico obviously we've got all our social media uh platforms up so if you want to engage with us on there that'd be great uh join the conversation I'd love to hear other people's experiences with the game am I just being precious about the uh the randomness or if people got similar feelings.
SPEAKER_00And have you ever bought any discounted board games what steals and what bargains did you get? I'm always up for a good bargain.
SPEAKER_02Even if it is for a Christmas present or we're just going to default a Facebook group into like bargain hunts board game edition yeah I'm I'm okay I'm okay with that. And obviously if you uh want to leave us a review on your podcast medium of choice uh that would be greatly appreciated. Uh but until next time have fun be good to each other and play lots of games
