Reclaiming Time, Joy, and Fulfillment in Medicine with Dr. Mary Leung

🎙️ Welcome back to another inspiring episode of The Physicians and Properties Podcast with your host, Dr. Alex Schloe!

In this episode, Dr. Schloe is joined by Dr. Mary Leung, a hematologist/oncologist based in New York and founder of Shining with Gratitude MD. After reaching what many would call the pinnacle of success in medicine, Dr. Leung found herself trapped in a cycle of exhaustion, after-hours charting, and losing the joy she once had for patient care. During the pandemic, she discovered life coaching, transforming her mindset, her clinic efficiency, and her life.

Today, she shares how intentional mindset shifts, charting strategies, and simple gratitude practices allowed her to leave work on time with everything done and reconnect with her passion for medicine and her family. Dr. Leung now coaches other physicians to do the same: reclaim their time, protect their energy, and find fulfillment again in their careers.

💡 What You’ll Learn in This Episode:

✔️ How Dr. Leung cut her charting time and now leaves work with notes completed
 ✔️ Why intentional mindset shifts at the start of your day change everything
 ✔️ Practical tips to streamline your clinic, minimize distractions, and delegate effectively
 ✔️ How life coaching can save not just your career, but your personal well-being
 ✔️ Why sleep, gratitude, and goal-setting are essential tools for every physician
 ✔️ How small patient interactions create deep, lasting connections without taking extra time
 ✔️ The ROI of investing in yourself and why reclaiming your time is priceless

🔥 Key Takeaways:

✔️ You don’t need an hour to build meaningful patient connections, presence matters most
 ✔️ Setting daily goals and protecting your energy are critical to thriving in medicine
 ✔️ Eliminating pajama charting can transform your emotional and physical well-being
 ✔️ Coaching isn’t an expense, it’s an investment in your future freedom and happiness
 ✔️ Physicians have the power to reclaim their lives and practice medicine on their terms

From life-changing mindset shifts to tactical efficiency tips you can apply immediately, this episode is a must-listen for any physician ready to stop surviving and start thriving. If you're tired of bringing charts home, feeling overwhelmed, or wondering if there's a better way, this episode will inspire you to take action.

If you want to learn how investing in real estate can give you the freedom to practice medicine and live life how you want then check out the links below:

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Transcript

Dr. Mary Leung: Goal setting is very important and also attached with the goal is why, why do you want that goal?  So for me  is I want to  go home on time so that I can spend it with  my family.  So that's my goal for someone else, maybe to go to the yoga class or, do something that they enjoy, whatever it is. You gotta  remember  why you're doing it and remind yourself  throughout the day that, oh, I want to finish, you know,  on time and of course  once you see the results that, oh, I'm actually. Getting better of doing it, then  the more you believe in yourself too.

 Dr. Alex Schloe: Welcome to the Physicians and Properties Podcast, the show where we teach you how investing in real estate can give you the freedom to practice medicine and live life how you want. Doctor, doctor, doctor, doctor, doctor. Now here's your host, Dr. Alex Schloe.

 Are you a physician who is  stressed?  Overwhelmed,  burnt out,  drowning in patient notes.  If you are, then this  is the Physicians and Properties episode for you. I'm your host, Dr. Alex Schloe, and today  I'm grateful to have on the podcast Dr. Mary Leung,  who is a board certified hematologist and oncologist,  also a certified life coach who's passionate about  serving physicians who are  stressed, overwhelmed, and burnt out.

 She was working and charting many nights and weekends until life coaching completely transformed her life.   

Dr. Mary, welcome to the Physicians and Properties Podcast. So glad to have you on the podcast tonight, all the way from New York.  Thanks for staying up late to record this podcast. How are things going?

Dr. Mary Leung: Great. Thank you so much for having me.

Dr. Alex Schloe: Absolutely. I'm really excited to dive into your journey and everything that you've been working on. It's been  really cool seeing your journey on LinkedIn and all the wisdom that you've been sharing. So I figured, hey,  let's get that on the podcast so a lot more people can also benefit from it as well.

Dr. Mary Leung: Great.

Dr. Alex Schloe: Awesome.  Well, do you mind telling folks  a little bit about  yourself?

Dr. Mary Leung: Sure. So I, I am Mary and originally, actually grew up in Hong Kong and my  parents are still there. They're retired. They're both  physicians.  That's not exactly the reason why I became one, but definitely a big influence.  They never forced me to be one. I think my journey really started.

 You know, wanting to help people.  Very simple  wish and hope. And and I thought, well, being a physician that seemed to be the right fit for me.  So just work hard, you know, went into medical school residency.  And I,  I really enjoyed that. Long-term relationship  and that special connection  with the patient.

So I  also chose oncology  because of that.  And and then so fast forward to getting my first attending job after  Fellowship  was that I thought that I made it  right,  you know, the top of the world supposedly.  Then I found myself, you know, I, I joined this group practice, everyone's very nice.  But then I found myself just working.

Really, really hard to the point that I was getting exhausted. I was charting after hours  with full schedule. And at that time my, my kids were still young and  so I would just go home  after seven  and not having  everything done. Most of the nights only to see my kids. So they would still recognize me.

 And and then after  they went to bed, I would  be charting some more.  It wasn't really sustainable and, but I just kept doing it. Just going through the motions, the routine, and I didn't feel like I was enjoying practicing medicine anymore because I was just barely surviving  at that point.  So fast forward to the pandemic.

 And  you know, all of a sudden, of course the world kind of  came to a halt not quite in medicine. I mean, I was thankful that I was in, in kind of the first line of defense.  But we still had to see  patients, like chemo patients if they.  Didn't get treated, they would die, you know, type of situation.

 So, so then we, we tried to delay a lot of patients' appointments that are not  urgent ones.  And so  I was just seeing about a third of the patients that I normally would see,  and  I got a taste of going home on time with everything done. I was like, what is this?  This is wonderful, amazing. I mean, I didn't want to have the pandemic, but  something  amazing  came out of this  and I thought, well,  what if I could just do this?

 If you know  back  when, you know, if, if I went back to  seeing the full load of patients, which is  on average about 25 patients a day  with hematology and, and oncology patients, you know, mixed in.  So then  around that time  I got exposed to something called life coaching.  No clue what that was. I thought coaching was just for sports,  as you know, you played, you know, baseball, right?

 And,  and so,  so then  I, I was just  so desperate  that  I thought, you know what? Let me just try something new, something different. It seemed like, you know,  it worked for some people.  So I joined a women physicians group coaching program  by physician.  And and then at the same time  I was like, wow, you know, this is interesting.

 Talk about how. We, you know, we're affected by how we think about things and how we feel and how we act. And it just all makes sense. And no one taught  me  these things when I was younger.  So then, so then I wanted to learn more. So  I joined a certification program for life coaching too, around that time.

'cause I had the time to do it. During the pandemic, well, you know, like the first year or so  of the pandemic.  So, so then at the same time  in my  group coaching program, I just I just talked to one of the coaches I work with  one of them. And I said that, well, the biggest problem for me, for, you know, feeling so drained and really overwhelmed and burned out  was the extra hours that I was working.

 You know, I wanted to cut down on my charting time,  so, so then I worked with a coach and really  not just on the techniques on how to be more efficient, it's really the whole mindset shift that I learned and how to think of things, how to start my day and all these things. So in about three months, and  at that time  I was already back to seeing 20 some patients  a day  that  I was able to go home by five 30.

 With all my work done.  So I thought, wow,  that's amazing. Wonderful. And I had time to really spend with my family, you know,  quality time with my kids.  So then I thought,  what if I could just share this with other physicians and just help other physicians do the same.  So that's how shining with Gratitude MD was born.

 That, you know, I, I just want to help physicians, you know,  through my one-on-one coaching  to to, you know, who, who,  who is going through the same thing that I went through  to, you know, be able to. Leave work on time with everything done so there's no pajama time,  no charting at home on, you know, on the weekends or at nights.

And they get to,  you know, do what they enjoy doing  after hours and also maybe, you know, have the capacity  to  enjoy  practicing medicine again.

Dr. Alex Schloe: That's amazing.  Yeah. Well, there's definitely no shortage of physicians that can use some help  with this. Super important.  And you know, I think it, it's hard, it, it's really hard to find  that balance of getting everything done and the efficiency while also trying to  maximize your time with the patient  and form that relationship.

And it, you know, I mean,  you can certainly be staring at the computer and typing the whole time, but then it's like, well then you lose out on building that relationship and  looking the patient in the eyes and, and you know, being present. And  that's super important in medicine of course. And so it's definitely a balance that's really tough.

 To navigate.  So thank you for, for sharing that and thanks for doing what you do. 'cause the more  physicians that can get home earlier and spend more time with their kids,  the better physicians are gonna be the next day when they go see more patients. And so I think that that's really important.  It's also really cool, Mary, to see like how.

 Like you mentioned something  as ugly as the pandemic turned into something as beautiful as you  getting home two and a half hours earlier and getting to spend time with your family and not having that stress and that burden.  I always try and finish my notes before I leave. I don't bring my work home, I just never have.

 And  Yeah, I learned that early on and, and just was like, Hey, I'm just gonna make that decision. And  I've learned that like Parkinson's law, if, you know, work is gonna expand to the time that you give it. And so I just  try and try and slam through the notes as best I can. But I know, you know, there's times where I'm like, Hey,  my cutoff time is this, and if I still have notes remaining,  I wait till tomorrow, but I'm, or the next day.

But I'm so much.  More anxious. 'cause then it's like, well here comes another round of 20 patients, plus the notes I didn't get done yesterday.  Now I gotta try and get all those done, you know?  And so it certainly is something that a lot of us struggle with for sure.  What were some things  that you learned early on working with a life coach that was beneficial for you from that perspective?

 Dr. Mary Leung: Yeah, so I think one of the first things I learned is  really  how  we think about things. It's, you know,  so  if you're not conscious of what. Thinking then you, you are just kind of being controlled by your default thinking. Like, so say if you wake up in the morning  and you're, you, you're feeling tired, and what you're thinking is, oh, I don't wanna go to work today.

 Right. So how does that feel? You, you already feel the dread,  you know, you're already  like, kind of like slow and, and maybe, you know, because of how you're feeling,  every little thing can be annoying to you.  And and, and you kind of like, you know, doing things slowly as opposed to say, you know, if you wake up in the morning and you choose to think differently, say, if you choose to think that, oh, today is is another day for me to make a difference I always share, you know, with other people that  my favorite sentence for myself is,  it's going to be a good day no matter what happens.

 So, so for me, that is said.  Okay. You know, so I decide how my day is going to be.  I mean, I  don't get to decide what will happen, you know, like the little details of the day, but I  set the tone  for the day to start with.  And and then the, no matter what happens is that means that.  They're gonna be surprises, especially in medicine.

So if you're in emergency medicine, for example, forget it, it's going to be a lot of surprises, right? You don't know who is gonna be rolled in.  But even in the outpatient setting, like you in family medicine or me, you know, in in the hematology oncology clinic, it's that.  Sometimes, yes, you have the scheduled patients, but you may have some add-ons, you may have some patients telling you unexpected things,  you know, so, so no matter what happens or,  or technology goes down,  you know,  so whatever, which happens all the time

Dr. Alex Schloe: the time.

 Dr. Mary Leung: all the time.

 Exactly. Or the computer is thinking too long.  So whatever happens, it's like, all right, you know what?  This is a situation, I'm just gonna deal with it.  As opposed to you arguing with reality to say that, oh, it shouldn't have happened and that time would have been wasted. And you're ma wasting your mental energy  to rather than, you know utilizing and doing something more helpful.

So I think  really how you start your day and be  you know intentional  to choosing how you start your day is so important.

Dr. Alex Schloe: Yeah, I agree. I too often wake up with a, oh, I'm so tired, you know,  and then you just feel so much more tired throughout the day instead of waking up with that proper intention.  Do you have a morning routine that you follow, or kind of how you set your intention? Or is it more like, do you journal and write it down first thing in the morning?

Or  what's that look like for you? Kind of your morning routine as you're getting ready?

  Dr. Mary Leung: My morning routine is actually,  I, I do those journaling  thing at night before I go to  bed, so, so  kind of like,  I think  what is also very important is actually sleep.  You know, we, we gotta have enough rest because  when, when we don't get enough rest, physically,  you know, we're, we're, we're just not well equipped.

And that,  you know, our mind body is so connected that, you know, we we're just gonna be grumpy  all day  long  without enough  rest. And, and it's going  take us longer to make decisions and we make,  we're not going to be as sharp.  So I think sleeping is so important and, and,  and.  To prepare myself to doing that  is  to you know, just to quiet myself down.

 I have a quiet time routine that I, I also do a little journaling  and, and that's what I do.  And, and then I, when I sleep, I  just like.  This is my sleeping time. I'm not going to think about anything, you know  until the morning, because then  after a good night's sleep, then you, you, you're just gonna be rested, recharged, refreshed to face another day in a, you know, a better mood and really better  equipped both physically  and mentally.

So, so then after I wake up, it's, it's like I'm really.  Conscious of  what I'm gonna think.  It's like, yeah, sure. You know, I can think that, oh, I'm kind of tired. I don't really wanna go to work, but then I catch myself say,  right? Sure.  But then  a better way to think of it  is that, you know, I, I can focus on that.

It's going to be a good day,  and then I will just get it done.  Fast, you know? And, and I'm gonna manage, and  I'm going to,  you know  lead my team in the same spirit, which I do. You know, we have like a little  I guess that's, you know just to fast forward to when I'm already in the clinic time, you know, the, the routine is also, it's like  I usually go over, you know, my list of patients.

Quickly with, with my staff. You know, I work with a medical assistant and also a nurse and just kind of point out that, okay, this person needs,  you know, this patient needs what  that patient may need an injection, a calendar for the chemo, whatever it is. And,  and, or this patient, you know,  try not to have them,  you know, talk to you too much because they, they'll continue to talk all day long.

I mean, we love them. Yes. But  we gotta have, you know, set the time limits you know, like little things like that. So, so I think, you know, that, that routine is so important and, and  how you  also set the tone  for your clinic, you know, as I think as a physician, you're the leader of the team and and how, how, you know, what your attitude is like that really affects your whole team.

Dr. Alex Schloe: I love that. Yeah,  it, that's, that's awesome. My  gratitude is something I've been trying to work on my, my routine typically, yeah. I wake up in the morning, I go to the gym workout. It's right next to the clinic.  Then I go sit in my car read the Bible. Journal.  And that's when I usually try and, you know, write down some,  some gratitudes and, you know, just, just thoughts.

It's really like a stream of consciousness for me.  'cause one day I want to  be able to look back on those journals and be like, oh man, this is what  I was thinking about or doing or learning at this point in time.  Which is really cool. But I think that morning routine can be really helpful or nightly routine can be really helpful  to set that intention.

And, and,  you know, it's,  it's a really good idea to do that at night, to go to sleep,  feeling grateful for the day.  Having that intention already set and then you wake up in the morning and you're ready to go.  And I, I love what you said, that you're,  you, you may have that thought that you're really tired in the morning or you don't wanna go to work, but you reframe it.

 And I, I heard a, a great quote that's, that's basically like the only thought that you can't control is your first one.  And and I love that quote, and I've been thinking about it so much. I talked about it on the last podcast too, because I've just been thinking about that a lot of  like, just how much what we think about and what our minds occupied with, how much that impacts our today.

 And it's wild. I mean, even just thinking back to when you're mentioning like,  you know, patients are gonna ask for other things or  they're gonna show up late or  whatever it may be.  If family medicine that happens  all the time. You know, it's always the like, oh hey Doc, by the way,  I wasn't gonna mention it, but I'm having terrible

 Dr. Mary Leung: Always when you're at the door, right?

Dr. Alex Schloe: yeah, exactly. Yeah.  And and so I've really been trying to just to be grateful for the opportunity to take care of patients in their time of need.  It sounds, that sounds kind of corny, but it's true, and I've realized that like  when those things happen and you like take the extra time,  you get blessed in some other way, and that may look like  your next patient comes in and it's really straightforward and easy and takes a couple minutes and you're done and you catch back up.

Or  there's a no show or something like that. It's,  it the, the times that I get really worked up about it.  Is when  that doesn't happen. And it's just a worse,  worse outcome for me  and for the patient. And then the time that I just am like, you know what?  It's okay. Let's take that extra time. It's gonna be fine.

 It always works out on the end. So it's just really interesting.

 Dr. Mary Leung: It is so true. It always works out in the end. It's like,  so, so for me it's I would say on average, my schedule is that about every 15 minutes, it's a follow-up patient.  And on paper I have an hour for a new patient, but in reality, maybe 30 to 45 minutes because they always like to double book me for some reason.

 Well, I mean, I, I, I, I, I know what the reason is because I have a lot of patience, but and, and, and so the thing is, is like.  I enjoy having both hematology and oncology patients because,  you know, sometimes, you know, some  benign hematology patients are straightforward, so, so those are kind of my breathers, so to speak.

 And then of course there are these more complicated  oncology patients. Sometimes they may. You know, we may have to talk about  hospice, we may have to talk about progression of disease or side effects, or, you know, all these different things that will take more time.  So, so then, yes, you know, I will take the time when I need to use the time.

 But also at the same time is that  I realize that you don't need a lot of time to make that connection  with the patients. You, you know, you just have to be present  when you walk into the room  and you, you, you sense the atmosphere. Of the room, you know, you, you sense that if the patient is anxious or the patient is like, relieved or at peace, you know, then you kind of go accordingly  and you, you listen to what they have to say and, and see what the unspoken language is and, and you kind of like, you know, just address what they,  you know what they're telling you and, and that's the connection that they need.

That  okay. You know what?  I'm, I'm being seen, I'm being heard, I'm being cared for,  and that's all they need. And sometimes it's just really  two more extra sentences and that's it.  And so I think that's also one of the things is like  for me to let other physicians know that no, you don't need a whole hour  to connect with.

 A patient, you know, sometimes it's really just talking about something common, like  what sports you play or, you know  what show you watch and what books you read. You know, like, like things outside of the diagnosis itself. And, and that's our connection. And then we'll just continue the conversation the next time.

 And, and I think that, you know, of course, be mindful.  Of, of your clinic time, of your schedule, and, and I'm, I, I always do that. You know, even to this day that I, I've,  I, I would say that I've mastered the,  the, the time, time,  time part of things with charting efficiency. 'cause  these days I'm actually.  I'm done before five o'clock.

 So,  so with, with the 20 some patients, like yesterday I saw 26 patients. I, I left by four 50,  so, so you know, of course there, there are days that will take a little bit longer if they're more complicated patients. But I guess my point is that,  you know  it's always working.  And, and, and sometimes, you know, you may choose to spend more time with the patients  because that's what they need, and sometimes if there's just straightforward, you know, nothing to talk about, that's okay.

You know, then like, okay, I'll see you next time.

Dr. Alex Schloe: That's great.  Wow. 26 patients and, and you were done by four 50. That's,  that's awesome. I, I had a, I, when I see kids, I always ask them at the end of the appointment I'll say, do you have any other questions for me?  And it's.  Or do you have any questions? And it's really funny because  like the four year olds and the six year olds, the questions are so funny.

It's, you know, they're like,  I had one the other day, and he is like, Dr. Schloe, do you like chocolate? And I'm like.  Yes, I bl chocolate, you know? And one of 'em was like,  what's your favorite construction vehicle? I'm like I don't know, like a bulldozer. And he is like, you're wrong. It should be an excavator, you know?

And it's just really funny. But I had one, he was seven years old, and he said Dr. So how many patients do you see in a day?  And I was like, well, around 20. And he is like, 20,  that's way too many. And I was like, man.  This kid's seven years old, eight years old, and he gets it.  But I think that there's, you know it's, it,  the efficiencies that you've learned makes it where you can see 26 and really feel connected to them.

And I think that a, a lot of us, maybe, you know, some of us  physicians who are newer to the game  still have a lot to learn. And so I bring that up to ask like, what are  some tips and tricks that you've learned that have made charting more efficient for you  or some ways that have helped you streamline your, your workday?

 Dr. Mary Leung: Yeah, so  I'll just say first off is every day is learning and growing.  So. You know, I learn new things every day and even from my patients, you know, I, I learn new things.  So  I think one of the most important thing is you know, besides starting our day that we talked about is, you know, set a goal  for yourself.

You know, it's like, set a goal of  when do you wanna go home.  Like say if you are going home  after seven o'clock and still have  charts to be done, like I was  then you to set your goal  to go home by five. Right now it's not quite realistic. I mean, that could be your eventual like long-term goal, but maybe right now it's like  maybe I'll go home by seven with everything done and.

 You know, not bring it home, anything, and then just work it backwards like that.  So, so that goal setting is very important and also attached with the goal is why, why do you want that goal?  So for me  is I want to  go home on time so that I can spend it with,  with my family.  So that's my goal for someone else, maybe to, to, to go to the yoga class or, you know, do something that they enjoy, whatever it is.

So, so you gotta  remember  why you're doing it and remind yourself  throughout the day that, oh, I want to finish, you know,  on time because.  You know, so, so I think, you know,  just  that to be your backbone  of the day of how you operate is so important.  So next is really to believe  that you can do it.

'  cause if you don't believe in yourself or in, in, you know  being able to achieve that,  you're not going to put in the effort to do it.  So I think, you know, the belief part is so important. And of course  once you see the results that, oh, I'm actually. Getting better of doing it. It's like the the more repetition, the more you know that you can achieve, then the, the more you believe in yourself too.

So,  but you gotta start somewhere to at least have some kind of belief that eventually you can do it.  Next thing is very important is.  Focus, especially in medicine, we always get distracted, right?  Which I'll talk about in a second. But the focusing part is like, you really have to be intentional in,  in focusing you know, do one thing at a time.

 No multitasking.  I would say, you know, 'cause  we, we, we think that we're, we're like super human being that, you know, we're doctors, we can do everything and we can do multiple things at the same time.  Not quite. So, I mean, we can, we can do a lot of things, but just not.  Everything at the same time.

Because, you know, if we try to do three things all at once, it just means that  we are just  task switching from one to another and back to the other. And then it takes us  that much longer  to settle down in our mind to say, oh, this is what we're doing. I was like, oh, what, what, what was I doing again?  So, so it's just focus on doing one thing and then move on to the next.

So  meaning like say, you know, especially in the outpatient setting, it's like you want to  really see one patient.  Finish their chart, their orders, then know, you know, whatever it is related to that one patient before moving on to the next one.  So of course, of course, that  you, we have to talk about distractions.

 So the distraction part is I,  I,  I group that in two  different categories. It's like the external and the internal  distraction. So the external, it's like  things  that.  Seemingly not able to be controlled by you. So, so like, you know phone calls or are your staff member, you know telling you something  you know, those type of things.

So,  so I think in a sense it's like you can control that by  setting out.  Protocols  to,  to tell your staff that,  Hey, don't disturb me while I'm seeing patient. Unless, you know, like say if there's an emergency or some, someone is passed out or  something like that.  Right? So, so that would minimize the, the  interruptions.

 And and I think  that for example, the internal distraction is like,  you know,  your mind wandering.  It's like, oh, I wonder, you know what  is going to be for tonight's dinner, you know, something like that.  Or  or if you hear them notifications like, oh, I wonder what the  email is about or the text is about.

 So, so one thing you can do is, is really  silence your phone  or put it away.  I would say email  notification. Turn, turn off the sound  because you are just very tempted, even if you don't look at it.  Just  the second that you think about it, you're already distracted.  And if you do that multiple times a day, right, it's going to be  adding up to be minutes, because  I'll just say throughout the day it's like every second counts.

 So, so you really want to be mindful of that.  And when you're seeing the patient, you know, you really want to, you know, when you're in the room,  you really want to  pay attention  to what they're saying to you and.  If possible,  you know, see how your clinic is set up.  So, so for example, you know, you want to  set up the exam room in a way that, you are facing the patient.  And ideally also the computer is set up in a way that you can face the patient.  So for me, it's like I'm, I'm actually able to type the HPI,  you know, when, when they're telling me what's going on.  So, so then I don't have to lift through this again  outside of the exam room.  Right.

 and, and that's the same idea, is that, you know, you really want to try  to.  Finish your notes before seeing the next patient. So, so you're done with that patient, so now you can focus. So, so that's kind of enhancing your focus  on, on that next patient. And you can make better decisions that way.  And of course, you know, people  will  ask me about, oh, what about a scribe?

What about AI and all these things?  It's,  everyone is different. And, and also whatever resources you have.  Every, you know, institution is also different.  So you utilize whatever you have, you know, and and that's okay. It's like me,  I don't have a scribe.  It's just me and the computer and that's okay.

And I do use dictation, like dragon dictation. That's what we have.  It's great.  You know. So I do a  hybrid, you know, combination of typing in the room and then I dictate outside of the room, whatever I didn't finish.  So whatever works for you sometimes is just.  Trial and error. And you know, if you have a scribe, you probably have to  have to train  the person really, really well.

So, and, and that's okay. Of course, initially it will take you time, but  eventually you'll benefit from it so much, right? Of all the hours that you will save.  So  I think  those are  kind of like them.  I mean, you know, of course we can talk all about the technical aspects and,  and I think, but today  it's really more focusing on the mindset and, and kind of like  in general terms  what you can do.

And it's  actually doesn't  just apply  to, to practicing medicine in, in everything else too.  The other two things I want to talk about is delegation.  So, you know I talk about, I have a team, so, so it's like.  You as a physician, you,  you do your best to delegate whatever everyone else can do.  So like, say, making phone calls back to the patient, telling them to supplement iron, whatever it is.

So you delegate as much as you can because  that saves you so much time. '  cause when you call back the patient,  sometimes  they may say, oh doc, I want to ask you this too. You know, and, and that may happen less when it's the nurse calling the patient back, you know?  So, so you want to do, do, do that.  The other thing is, I'll just say it goes together. It's like you, you know, the practicing gratitude part  and also to celebrate, you know, really appreciate what you have.  And throughout the day it's like,  you know, there's really no set rule in celebration.  You know, say if you have 20 patients in a day after seeing two patients, you can just.

 Say to yourself, yes, I saw two patients, 18 more to go. You know, like,  you know, it's like 10% done,  which is like, you know, you want that boost of dopamine  to, to kind of like,  you know keep you going.  And of course, you know, another thing to keep you going is  really  a lot of us don't do. Is to take scheduled breaks,  you know, 'cause those are so important to really  keep your mind  fresh and recharge.

 Lunch break is very important.  I used to skip it. I  was thinking that, oh, I'll just, you know, work through the day, but then  realize that.  Second half of the day I was slowing down  and because I was having decision fatigue and I, I, I was like, really?  So I couldn't keep up with the charts  in, in the second half of the day.

So, so definitely,  if anything, at least take a lunch break.  Yeah.

Dr. Alex Schloe: Those are, those are great tips. I've,  I found for me a few things that have also been helpful, while also I love Dragon  do utilize an AI scribe, which has been really helpful.  And I also have a standing desk in my desk in my office and I got a treadmill  underneath,  and so I, I can dictate and walk at the same time.

 And that's been awesome. So there, like, there's been some days, especially Thursday afternoons, I have some  administrative time where I'm like, oh man, I just walked like five miles while doing my notes from the morning and doing this admin time. That, that's been huge for me to, to just be moving.

And I've,  I've found that like when I'm just sitting there trying to do notes, I get so tired and  get so distracted. But then when I'm walking and trying to do 'em at the same time, I, I tend to.  Probably take a little bit longer to get the notes done, but I'm able to focus a lot more so it evens itself out.

 But those are, those are some really great tips.  I need to,  I need to work on the lunch break one. I'm bad about that. I'm, I'm definitely eating and charting. 'cause I,  for me it's, yeah, our, our.  Duty day in the Air Force ends at four 30. So like, that's my goal. I was like, Hey, I wanna be done by four 30.

 Want to get home and, and spend time with the kids. 'cause  my boys, you know, they're young, they still go to bed pretty early. And so  that's tough too. And I think another thing for me that I had to learn was  just saying no.  And, and realizing that  every time I said yes to something that  did not directly correlate with  acute patient care  I was saying no to my family.

 And so I, I realized that early on, and that was really helpful for me too.  But yeah, I, I love that. And those are some,  some really, really great tips.  How have you seen some of those things translate into  your life outside of medicine and, and at home and so forth?

Dr. Mary Leung: Yeah, I think the biggest thing  is really how I feel. You know, I,  I think in the past, you know, before this happened,  I was always  exhausted, drained, and Easy to  feel angry and very stressed and overwhelmed. So, so those were my main emotions. I mean, I had  moments of happiness and all, but, but it was just more percentage of time, you know, being in those unpleasant emotions.

 And  now it's like I'm more,  you know, more time spent in  feeling grateful content and joy and, and really.  I  have the  capacity to connect with my patients, which I, you know,  this,  this is the reason that I went into medicine and me, besides having  helping people in the first place.  So, so it's kind of like back to, this is exactly what I want.

 I mean, not to say that there's, it's not, nothing is perfect.  There is still a lot of room for improvement.  And of course in the practice, it's like, if I have a  choice, it's like, would I see 25 patients a day? Probably not, you know maybe like 20 or so for, for me right now. And things can change.

Like, you know, if I,  when I get older, the, the numbers may change, like the way that I practice may change and, and that's okay. But I think for now  it's that I, I just feel like,  that I get to  enjoy practicing medicine and enjoy that teamwork that, that, that I have cultivated.  It's it's really amazing  and,  and I,  I just think that  if  more physicians can, you know, experience that,  then  maybe, you know, we will help,  you know, the healthcare system in a sense that there will be less of a mass exodus of physicians retiring.  And hopefully that when we get older  and when we're retired ourselves, then maybe we'll still have doctors to see,

Dr. Alex Schloe: Yeah,  that would be really nice.  I won't get you started on the healthcare system 'cause we both promised we wouldn't get going on that,  but, yeah, it's,  I'll just say it's broken and we'll leave it at that. Yeah.  That's great. Mary, if,  if someone's sitting here, they're listening to this and they're thinking about just getting involved getting a life coach,  what, what are some things that you would tell them or, or recommend they consider?

 Dr. Mary Leung: I would say that, you know, think about.  The why,  you know, why, why do you want, like what do you want to change from, you know, where you are now,  where you want to be, and how  that coach can help you do that.  So, so I think that's, you know, one of the things, and  you know, I, I always encourage people to ask for help.

I think for the longest time  I thought that, oh, I'm supposed to figure out everything myself. You know, I'm the doctor, of course, I, I. Course I'm supposed to know everything, even though I don't.  So, so it's okay to ask for help and please ask for help when you need it.  And sometimes it may be a coach, it may be a mentor,  you know, so, so you want to find someone who you can connect with and someone,  maybe even someone who has.

 That experience that you're going through, because then they know firsthand, you know, what, what is going on, even though your lives are different. But, but then that's kind of the special connection.  So I think that's a, you know, very important thing.  And I think the other thing is that some people may think that, oh, you know having a coach seems like it's a very expensive thing  to do, but then it's like, if you think about  really the return on.

 Of investment.  Say for, for me, it's myself  that yes, I, I paid like five digits of,  of, you know, coaching,  but it's like  the hours that I gained back,  you know, not, not talking about a year and, and for,  for, for the years to come that those are the hours that I gained back, you know, from,  from not going home.

 After seven, you know, it's like, it's like two, three hours a day at least that I gain back for  however many weeks and  years  that I work  and, and not just the time that we cannot buy back.  It's also  how we feel, you know, how I feel,  my emotional state, my mental wellbeing, my physical wellbeing,  and the connection I have with not just the patients,  with my family, with my friends.

It's like all these things that you.  Cannot necessarily  measured by you know, by, by the,  I guess the monetary means.  And also like just to explore, you know, having the capacity to explore  new things. Like, you know, we talk about, of course, you know  it's a,  talking about real estate investing.

It's like if you're barely surviving, if you're,  you know, if you're working till like 10 o'clock at night and it's time to go to bed, you know, and then just to start the next day, how do you have the capacity to even  think about you know having a side income to, to replace your current income as a, a, a, a clinician?

So, so I think it's like all these things and.  You know, it's endless benefits that  I have received and I want to share with other people.

Dr. Alex Schloe: I love that. Yeah, I think it's,  you know, return on investment, return on your time, return on your happiness, and then the return of your passion and what you love because you have that time back which is, which is really cool. So there's definitely a lot of different ways to think about that besides just monetarily, and I think that's something that's hard.

 For folks to wrap their,  their heads around sometime it's like, oh man, this is  really expensive. Is it gonna be worth it? Well,  think about, you know, like you mentioned, two to three hours back per day,  10 to 15 hours back per week with your kids, with your family, doing the things that you love.  Figure out  how much is that worth?

 It's worth a lot.  For sure.  I know it is for me.  Well, Mary, I wanna pivot a little bit. I know you worked on a new book. You wrote a new book called Made for More Two, where you collaborated with 17 different physicians on how it's possible to live life and practice medicine that the way that they want to.

 What were some things that you learned on that journey? Writing that book and, and collaborating with those physicians?

Dr. Mary Leung: So  this is the book?

Dr. Alex Schloe: That's awesome.

Dr. Mary Leung: Yes. And so it's, it's actually, first of all, I want to  you know, really give thanks to Dr. Una. She's the one who organized and collab, you know make this collaboration possible.  And I'm part of her, you know, in, in her group coaching right now. And, and I think  the experience is wonderful because I,  I never thought that I would say that  I'm.

 An author and it's kind of fun just to be able to share my own journey. You know a lot of what we talked about tonight  is, you know just to share that  Oh wow. You know, there's actually.  Actual life, you know something different, something more inspiring and hopeful for other physicians to look at.

 And, and you can actually have like say some, some of the physicians in there,  they have very  successful private practices be it in insured patients or uninsured.  I mean like, like their a fee for service, you know, type type of  practices or their coaches or their speakers or  they sell their own creations,  you know, their own products.

So it's like,  there are all these different things that  basically it's, we're sharing how we can. You know, carve our life, you know, our work life, our outside of work life to be the way that we want, you know, if we're intentional about it  and there's really a way to do it.  Yes, we, we talk about this a lot.

Like the system is broken, but it's like there individually we can do something about it. Just like me. It's like, yes, you know? If I have a choice, yeah,  I would, I would see less patience a day.  At the same time, it's like.  I'm,  you know, I am doing things to make myself more  efficient and, and, and to be  thriving instead of just surviving, you know, in this environment and and to help other physicians do the same.

Dr. Alex Schloe: That is great.  Well, if physicians. Is listening to this. They want to connect with you. They wanna learn more about how to thrive and  potentially join your coaching program. How can they do that?

Dr. Mary Leung: Yes. So you can visit my website shining with gratitude md.com  and my email is shining with Gratitude md@uhgmail.com because I'm really very grateful for what has  happened to me and sharing with other people. I'm also on LinkedIn Mary Long md.

Dr. Alex Schloe: That's great. Awesome. Well  Mary, it's been so great having you on the podcast tonight. Thank you so much for  sharing,  so much gratitude, so much wisdom, so many tips. I really appreciate it.

Dr. Mary Leung: Thank you so much for having me.

Dr. Alex Schloe: Awesome.  Absolutely. Well, with that, it's been Dr. Mary Leung  and Dr. Alex Schloe with another episode of the Physicians and Properties Podcast.

 Signing off.   

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