Redefining Wealth and Building an Abundant Life on Your Own Terms with Dr. Chelsea Turgeon

🎙️ Welcome back to another insightful episode of the Physicians and Properties Podcast with your host, Dr. Alex Schloe!

💡 What if you could stop chasing income… and start allowing it to find you while living in alignment with your purpose?

In this episode, Dr. Schloe sits down with a guest who’s redefined their entire relationship with money. Together, they dive into the mindset shift from rigid salary dependence to a place of trust, abundance, and diversified income rooted in sharing your gifts with the world.

🏠 If you’ve ever felt stuck in a job just for the paycheck, or wondered how to build multiple streams of income that actually align with your values—this episode will challenge you, encourage you, and free you.

💡 What You’ll Learn in This Episode:

✔️ How to shift from needing one job or one income stream to trusting in multiple
 ✔️ What it means to “let go” of controlling how money flows to you
 ✔️ Why alignment with your gifts can be more lucrative than chasing the next deal
 ✔️ The difference between hustling for money vs. magnetizing it
 ✔️ What physicians and professionals can learn from entrepreneurs who’ve mastered flow
 ✔️ How to reframe your identity around money, career, and personal worth

🔥 Key Takeaways:

✔️ Freedom isn’t just about financial numbers—it’s about detaching from control
 ✔️ Trusting the process can unlock greater income than grinding ever could
 ✔️ Your value isn’t tied to one title, job, or paycheck
 ✔️ Income can be an overflow of living and serving from your highest gifts
 ✔️ Physicians are perfectly positioned to reinvent how they earn, give, and live

If you’re ready to stop white-knuckling your financial future and start building a more aligned, abundant life—this episode is for you.

If you want to learn how investing in real estate can give you the freedom to practice medicine and live life how you want then check out the links below:

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Transcript

Dr. Chelsea Turgeon:  I think I have a very flexible relationship now with like.  Like money and earning money and like,  you know, I don't have a sense of  I need this one job to pay me this salary to this thing. Like, I just am feeling like,  what are my income sources and like where, which ways are the money coming to me?

And  yeah, it doesn't feel like I need to control it in any one way. It's like I just can sort of trust that it's coming in while I'm sharing my gifts and it just feels a lot more freeing.

 Dr. Alex Schloe: Welcome to the Physicians and Properties Podcast, the show where we teach you how investing in real estate can give you the freedom to practice medicine and live life how you want. Doctor, doctor, doctor, doctor, doctor. Now here's your host, Dr. Alex Schloe. 

 

 Hello everyone and welcome to another episode of the Physicians and Properties podcast. I am your host, Dr. Alex Schloe,  and today we have a really special episode with Dr. Chelsea Turgeon. She is an incredible entrepreneur. She was an MD who turned six figure coach. Bestselling author, global Traveler, and we talk a ton about her amazing travel experiences and these awesome bucket list experiences that she's had.

She's also the host of the Life After Medicine podcast, and we talk about her journey in medicine and how she just kind of felt stuck after graduating med school  and. Starting her O-B-G-Y-N residency, and she resigned  from residency during the second year and bought a one-way ticket to South Korea to teach English, and that led to her ultimately creating a thriving coaching business, living more of a digital nomad life, and experiencing an absolutely incredible amount of freedom, which is what she.

One it. That was her dream, and she has been able to achieve that, and she loves  teaching others how they can get unstuck  in their job as a physician or a healthcare worker.  This was a really cool podcast episode, and we mention at the end a virtual summit called Pivot Potential that will be happening in June that she's putting on that's completely free and it's gonna be an incredible opportunity.

So  without any further ado, let's get started with today's episode with Dr. Chelsea Turgeon.

 Dr. Chelsea Turgeon. Welcome to the Physicians and Properties Podcast. I'm so glad to have you  as a guest on the podcast today, and you're calling in from Mexico City, which I think is the furthest that someone's  called in from to be a guest on the podcast, so that's really cool as well. How are things going?

Dr. Chelsea Turgeon: So good. Thank you so much for having me. I'm excited for a conversation today.

Dr. Alex Schloe: Absolutely. I've, I've been following your journey on LinkedIn and it's been absolutely amazing to see, and really cool to see life after Medicine and everything that you talk about there in that space.  But before we get to that and everything that you've built, do you mind just sharing a little bit about yourself?

Dr. Chelsea Turgeon: Yeah, absolutely. So I grew up in Alabama and I was very in like small town, rural Alabama. I went to undergrad there, med school there, all of that. growing up I didn't not like I had this big dream to be a doctor.  No one in my family was a doctor.  I just knew I wanted to help people. I loved psychology.

I was a big nerd in personal growth, and so I would  literally have my parents drop me off at like books Ilion and it's like really? Before internet is like, you're not like finding blogs and stuff on the internet. So I'm like going to books Ilion and.  I would read, like go to the self-help aisles and read  different books.

And I felt like such a loser. So I didn't wanna tell anyone. I was like telling them I'm going to study. But then I'd go and like read all these books about like happiness and  the psychology of rejection. And  so I just always had this drive towards learning about psychology. So then I majored in psychology.

In undergrad and in my limited mind, the way a lot of us view careers, it's like career paths have major and then major unlocks these options and then you choose between these options. It's kind of how we're  viewing career in this really linear way.  And so I was like, okay, major in psychology. What can I do with that?

 I can. Go to grad school and like get a PhD in psychology and like be a clinical therapist was one general thought.  And then the other one was  med school and do psychiatry. Those were kind of, I was like, those are my two options. Although there's so many more than that. But that's what I thought  when I would present this to people,  I would get so much validation around, oh, like  med school.

 You must be really smart if you go to med school.  I, and so I would just like pick up on this of like.  Okay. I think I'm gonna do med school. 'cause anytime I share that, people are really impressed. And I think this is how a lot of us  kind of go through and make our early career decisions. Maybe not exactly for validation, but there's a lot of superficial factors that go into it.

'cause  we don't know ourselves, our frontal lobes are not developed and we just like,  we don't have a sense of like who we really are or what our values are. And so  like,  these are the things I'm using to make, these are like my metrics for making my career decision. So I choose to go into med school  for, for all of those reasons and.

 I get into med school, I quickly realize psychiatry is not what I want to do.  Like  the doctor patient relationship that I see within psychiatry, I'm like, no, no, no. This is not what I want. I didn't like doing the,  the mental status exam. You're kind of just like,  like judging them  the whole time, which is just like what you're doing.

You're observing them.  But I, I'm like, I don't feel like I'm relating to them. I feel like I'm.  Putting them in these boxes and  that, so that didn't feel right. So then I was like, crap,  now I'm in med school, what do I do?  And I, I didn't feel like I could just stop at that point,  nor did that seem like what I wanted.

 So it's like I need to choose something else. So I ended up choosing  BGYN. Truthfully, because it was the one I hated the least out of everything else. And I think the way, the reason it appealed to me was because I have a DHD where there's a lot of action that happens.  And so, you know, you go to internal medicine and it's like  I'm falling asleep.

'cause we're just like sitting at a table  talking all day and I'm like,  this cannot be my future. So then I was like, oh, but an OB GYN  were really active. So I literally, again, kind of superficial reasons go into that, choose that.  And I get into my residency and just pretty soon realize that's, it's just not the right path for me.

Like it never was.  You know, I've,  through this whole thing, I'm choosing things for the wrong reasons. When I say wrong it,  the reasons that are not correct, because they're not based on my own true path. They're just based on random factors that seem relevant since the time. And so yeah, I get into residency realize it's not the right path for me  and do like soul searching work, which we can go into more detail about.

But then I just make the decision during my second year of residency that I'm.  I'm just gonna leave. I like hit a point of burnout.  It was sort of this moment of like, let me just, I need to make a decision one way or another I'm gonna leave. So I decided to resign and I wasn't resigning to like go do something else in the medical world or  go into pharma.

Like I was like,  I'm gonna drop out of residency and then buy a one one-way ticket to South Korea. '  cause that's a good idea. Like honestly, when I look back I'm like, what was I doing? But it totally worked out. So, yeah, bottom one way, take it to South Korea. I started teaching Eng.  I got a job there teaching English, and then like  on the side I was learning how to build a business.

 And so that's really what I've been doing since then.  I've  been building my business and traveling around the world and  you know, we can go into many more details about it, but that's just sort of  the short-ish version of  my backstory.

That's an amazing  story  and, and  super relatable journey. I'm sure  that there's plenty of folks who,  you know, were. In med school and, and realize like, this isn't my path. Or in residency, you know, similar to you and you're like, Hey, this isn't my path. And  a lot of times I feel like we get tracked by the golden stethoscope of like our golden handcuffs of like, Hey, we,  we've  gone down this path and it is a respectable career field and we're doing a lot of good.

And then it's kind of like, oh man, what do I do? I've already put forth all this time  and effort and not to mention money that goes into that.  And so it's really honorable that you. One, realize like, Hey, this path isn't for me. And two, that you were like, Hey, I would much rather pivot and go figure out my path in my life instead of sticking with a profession that I didn't love, you know?

And I think that that is, is probably something that folks  have struggled with to some degree. And maybe not to the degree of like, Hey, medicine's not for me, or  This isn't for me. Or, but maybe to the point of like, Hey, maybe I need to think about. Going and doing a, a fellowship or, or  maybe even doing another residency or something like that.

So thanks for sharing that and being

vulnerable in that regard.

Yeah. Yeah. I think it's hard to admit that the thing you, you are.  Pouring your heart into,  you're pouring time, you're pouring money. You're like the thing you wanted at one point, and then you put so much into it and then you get it.  It's really hard  to look at that and be like,  actually, this isn't what I want anymore.

 Maybe it never was. Maybe it was at a point and now it's no longer right?  But it's just so hard to look at your circumstances and just be like,  that was a good guess, but it's actually not it.

Yeah,  absolutely.  So South Korea, how'd you land on that?  That is not the place I would ever expect. So how did you

end up gonna South Korea?

 I love people's responses to that. So sometimes when I tell my story, I'm like,  let me give as few details as possible  and just like see what they're latching onto so that then I like can go further. 'cause sometimes I think it's fun to just  say it for the shock factor because.  Yeah, it doesn't make any sense.

Right.  So, because if you also know other things about me, like I didn't travel at that point.

rural. Yeah. You mentioned rural Alabama. Stayed in Alabama for med school. Stayed in Alabama for residency, like. It, it sounds like not a whole lot of travel outside of Alabama, so yeah, that's what makes the South Korea more shocking. The

only 

kind of wild.

your story more wild would be North Korea, I think

so. 

Yes. I love that. I love that. For me, that's not, that's not what happened. I wouldn't have been able to go there. It would've been a different  story, a different timeline for sure.  But, so South Korea  it sort of came through like honestly, a process of elimination. And so  what I did was I moved through a process called Directional, I call it now, directional clarity.

At the time I. I didn't call it anything 'cause I was just like,  what do I do? But when I,  when I look at it now and I guide clients through it now it's like directional clarity. And so what I mean by that is  I had this desire to,  I was like, I, I want to leave  medicine. Like medicine is not it. Like that felt so clear.

Not this,  what felt less clear was what is my this  Right.  I, but I don't know what else.  That's another reason it's, it's very difficult for people.  To to leave  because there's this known entity that they maybe don't love,  but it's known.  And until you're replacing it for something known and something you're excited about,  it's hard to just walk towards an ambiguous blob of, I don't know.

 So  one way we work around that is directional clarity. And so it's like, what do I know?  The things that felt really true for me at that point were, and it didn't quite make sense, but it just felt really true.  I wanna be outside.  I want to have the ability to work from my laptop, from a cafe and then travel anywhere.

 That's like honestly what I knew  and, and I didn't know if I wanted to be an entrepreneur. I didn't know,  like there was a lot of pieces I didn't know, but it felt like that was enough to get started,  right? So, so then it's like, okay, what do I do remotely?  I don't exactly know, but whatever it is, I can't just do it right away.

 I'm gonna, it's gonna take time to build up or like, maybe it's a job and I have to train for a thing.  So like I had this idea that, like  the thing I want,  I can make it happen, but I don't think I can like support myself on it right away.  So then what does that mean? I probably need to get some kind of income source, 'cause I'm a resident and I don't have any savings.

 So it's like the moment my resident salary is done,  I'm living with my parents and I was like, that's not what's gonna happen.  So, so it's like I'm just kind of going through this whole problem solving process of like.  I need a runway. And so in my mind I was like, whatever. My remote laptop thing is unknown.

It's gonna require two years for me to build it up. I just decided this  two years for me to build it up.  So I need a job I can do for two years that pays my bills. That doesn't suck so bad that I'm  burned out by the end of it.  You know? I was like, I just need like a make ends meet job.  Pay the bills. And then I was like, but I wanna do it like abroad.

Like if I wanna start traveling, I wanna just already travel.  And so one of the things I found is like you can just teach English abroad and  places that pay best are Asia. I. That's where they like give you room and board, they give you healthcare. They, you know, they give you all those things. And so I was like, well maybe I'll just do that.

'cause  it's like I don't have to,  I was on a residency salary, it's not like I was making a ton of money. And so I just like found this, I had found this idea and I was like,  let me just try that. I wanted something I could get easily. I didn't wanna have to like interview for jobs and make that a big thing.

 I wanted it to be a job. I could just sort of.  Quote unquote, like phone in where it's not like a lot of mental energy. And so yeah, I learned you could just get certified online to teach English as a foreign language and then you could just get a job teaching English in South Korea. And so  I just did it.

 And then South Korea, like it was, I don't remember exactly why I chose South Korea, but it was something like.  The money they paid you and the benefits you had, like it just seemed like the best package deal.  And then it's also more of a  developed country as opposed to going to like Vietnam right away, or Thailand or Cambodia, you know, I was like, let me go somewhere where like  it's really built up so I don't shock myself too much.

Yeah,  absolutely. And Korean food is amazing,

so 

is,  and it's the best in Korea,  so if you like it outside of Korea, you have to go because it's, 

Well, my stepmom is half Korean,  so I'm like, and she says the same thing, and I'm like, I, I have to go there at some

point. I am still active duty in the Air Force for a little while longer, so Korea is not someplace that they like us to go unless we're being stationed.  So that I'll have to wait

for a bit.

But one 

have your stepmom. She can bring you the food, so you're good

Yeah, absolutely. Yeah.  Were you making more teaching English than you were in residency if you were to like  figure it out Hourly.

 hourly. Absolutely.  Even if I figure it out based on I got an apartment paid for in South Korea,  so I wasn't paying that.  Right.  And so if we think take home after like  taking the apartment out of it, I had more in my pocket at the end of the day.

Is wild.

 By working 35 hours a week, not even the whole time. I had to be in the school during 35 hours a week,  and then I got a big bonus at the end.

So I don't even think I calculated all of that into it,  but even just like my monthly stuff, yeah, like one day at the end of my contract, I just had like $7,000 deposited into my account and which I didn't realize was happening. And so it's like if you factor all of that in, it was a much better gig.

 That is wild that you can  make more teaching English in Asia than being a resident OB GYN physician. It's crazy.  That's

so cool. And what a cool experience for you. What were some things that you learned in that journey? You know, as you were  teaching English, you're probably processing a lot and I'm sure,  and feel free to speak on it.

I feel like, I'm sure it was a difficult process for you to realize like, hey, this isn't  residency's not right for me, it's time to hang up the white coat.

I'm sure that was a difficult process. And then  moving from Alabama  to South Korea like I'm sure a lot of things were going on. So what were some of those emotions, things that you were experiencing during that time?

Yeah, and just a quick correction. It's really not that important, but I actually did residency in Pittsburgh, so I was,  I was there for like a year and a half. And so then I,  so I had a, you know, I had a moment in a big city with an airport, but, but yeah, moving. No, no,  it's all good. I didn't share that before, but yeah.

So going into South Korea.  And, and just, so it's like  basically what I did, and when I look at it now, it's  when I look, when I started doing my life coaching certification, the thing they call it that I did is like  habitat liquidation,  where you change your job,  you change your  environment, and you change your friend group.

Like I changed literally everything about my life in like a week. And I did it very quickly. So one week in February, I was in the hospital. Finishing up, you know, I had already turned in my resignation, but I was finishing stuff up and then the next week I was literally in a classroom talking to third grade Korean students.

So it was like, what

It's

jarring

Doesn't get any faster than that. Yeah.

It just not, it was jarring and I think for some people it would not work for me. I think it was good because  there's, I don't know, there's something that happens when you have, like you're, you're working hardcore all the time, and then you have downtime. And you don't really know what to do with yourself.

And so I think for me it was a good titration, like a down titration of, okay, I was working 80 hours a week in the hospital ish.  And then now I go to this place where I have a full-time job, but it feels like a part-time job. So  one of the things that happened, which is so funny, where  I looked at my schedule, there was this one moment where like someone was trying to ask  me about a weekend, like, oh, well what if we do this this weekend?

 And it was like a few months in advance  and my first thought was, we have to check the call schedule.  And then I was like, no,  I don't have to check  the call schedule. And then it just all hit me.  I have every single weekend off from now until forever.

That is a blessing.

like the why, it just felt like  so much freedom.

 I was like, I can't ever imagine someone complaining about a nine to five.  You just go Monday through Friday, how is that a problem?  And so, so that was like really cool to have just weekend freedom.  And it's like I started to titrate my freedom. So, so that was one big thing that was like, incredible.  One thing that was interesting  was noticing like when I felt the need to still identify myself as a doctor.

 So it's,  it was so interesting where  I'm meeting people, right? And a lot of people doing this are  kind of fresh outta college, and they're like doing a gap year,  right? And so sometimes I'm, I'm just like, yeah, I just left the states too, and I don't feel the need to like go deep. Like, you know, if I'm meeting someone and we're going deep, like I don't, it's not like I'm hiding my story.

 So there's some times where I just like  don't need to point it out. But then there's some circumstances I think when I would feel more insecure or something where I was like.  I need people to know that  I went to med school and like,  but there was, it was interesting how it would like come out and I was like, oh, wow, I'm still clinging to that.

 I'm still like needing to identify myself in that way. And so that's something that happened during that year and it,  and it just sort of gradually started to go down. But that was, it was a weird, like, identity shift. And that's something I work with my clients through as well is just,  I mean, you identify so deeply by your profession and so then when you're not that anymore, there's, you're just a little disoriented.

 Yeah, that's definitely something I've come across. This will, this will probably be close to episode 100 of the podcast and it's, you know, folks that have left medicine, that's  definitely something that they struggle with is like,

Hey, what is my identity outside of the white coat?

And you know, of course we all wear multiple different hats, you know Spouse or partner, parent, doctor, all those sorts of things. But it seems like you're right, like  the profession identity really weighs heavy and I think maybe heavier for doctors just 'cause it take,  takes so long, so much effort, so much time and energy  to become a physician  that, it's a respected thing in society and I think that, you know, we, we value that as well and we want people to know, like, Hey, look at me, I'm a doctor.  And  so I, I can't imagine that would be difficult. That was something I was gonna ask you, so thanks for,  for you know, letting me know. How long did it take before you felt comfortable, you know, just not even bringing that up at all, if you didn't need to.

Yeah, and it was less time as it was replacement identity, I guess if like, if that's what we're  going into it.  Well, okay. Yeah, so it was less time, it was more one discovering who I actually am outside of medicine. Because I just like, you don't really have time to develop other identities. They're just sort of stunted because you're just, you know, spending so much time on that.

 So now that I had more time, it's like, oh, now I really like to hike. And so I hiked the whole island of that I was staying on in South Korea.  You know, 'cause I'm not casual, so it was like  264 miles. Yeah.  So I hike that.  So it's like now I have different interests I'm starting to identify with. Now I have.

 Like this new thing I'm starting to build, right? I'm starting to, I'm training as a life coach and as a part of that, I challenged myself. Again, I'm not casual, I challenged myself to do a hundred hours of coaching, just like for free. And so every English teacher on the island,  I'm like, Hey,  do you have something in your life you wanna work on?

Let me coach you. I wanna practice this skill. And so  it's not even that I stopped identifying as a doctor or like that went down, it's just other ones went up.  And I think that's the best way, in my opinion, to replace it because then you're not in this like identity deficit if that's the thing.  You're just developing other parts of you and then it just doesn't feel relevant anymore.

That is really cool. I, I don't wanna gloss over the 264 mile hike around the island.  I'm a huge, an avid

hiker as well, so  I would love to hear more about that. How long did that take you? What did that journey look like for you?

Yeah, this is so cool. This is a very uncommon thing that people do in South Korea, like people don't really know about this, but I was staying on an island called Juju Island, and on that island there's a series of trails that goes around the outside. So whenever you do get to go to Korea, this, I feel like this would be really cool for you.

 And they're called the Olay Trails and there are,  you get like a passport. And I think there's how many there? Like 20. 20 something different trails. Right? So they're divided into different trails and you can do the whole thing. So some people go in and like.  They're on vacation and they hike the whole thing.

 I was doing it on my weekends 'cause I had my weekend freedom.  So every weekend I would just like take a bus to wherever I had  left off before and I would do maybe like one or two of the trails depending on how long they were.  And so that was, yeah, that was just sort of my weekend project and I got to see parts of the island that none of my friends saw.

I was taking buses to like the middle of nowhere. And that was so rewarding. I like, and I feel like that was me. That's how I sort of decompressed from.  The hospital. It's like sort of walking around the island every weekend in nature by the ocean. Like I think that's what helped me  just release a lot of the stress that I experienced.

I bet, I'm sure that was such a great time to process and think through, you know, everything that you experienced and what you are  looking forward to in the future and probably, you know, think through vision and what was next for you

going forward as you started your coaching business.  Correct me if I'm wrong, I think I saw that I.  Juju Island. It's JEJU, right?

 I think I saw, isn't that like the Hawaii of Korea or something like

that? Isn't 

what they say. Yeah, 

gorgeous? Yeah. I thought I saw something  about that. 

Yeah. It is beautiful. I haven't been to Hawaii actually,  so I don't know  the comparison, but  it's beautiful. It's large. It's a really big island, so if you're going from,  I lived on the other side away from the airport, so you're going to the airport,  the bus ride is like an hour and a half.

 That's the short part of, like, it goes longer the other way. So it's like a pretty big island. But yeah, it's beautiful.

 That is cool. Yeah, I would love to do that sometime.  Well, let's talk about, you know, what was next for you. So you mentioned you had,  you're giving yourself two. Years to build up something else and you're like, Hey, let me find kind of entry level job. Obviously teaching English is, is not entry level and is incredibly important, but  you're like, Hey, let me have those two years and, and get established and start my next thing.

So  what did that path look like? How did you figure out that coaching was gonna be the, the path forward for you?

Yeah, so that started to develop even before I left for South. Career. That actually started to, not necessarily just coaching, but the things that were coming to me were writing. I,  I loved writing, I wanted to write. And then like traveling, obviously that was part of it. And then  personal growth in some way.

And I didn't  quite know about coaching yet, except I did, but maybe I forgot that I knew because actually when I was. Transitioning from med school to residency. I don't know why we have a bubble coming up, but my hand gestures sometimes make it do things. I was transitioning from med school to residency and feeling a lot of,  what I'll describe is I felt like I was on a conveyor belt  headed towards a trash compactor with no way to get off.

And so I felt like residency was like this impending doom where I was gonna be squashed like a,  a car into a compact ball and there was no way out. That's what it felt. And so I'm dealing with this as I graduate med school, even though  like matched at my top choice residency, like there was nothing about it that I didn't choose.

 It just felt like and then my sister was working with a life coach at that point and she was telling me about it and I was like, who, what is, what is this?  What are you doing?  So I actually did work.  For like a few months with this life coach that my sister like recommended to me and we just emailed.

We just had like an emailing thing,  but then I remember at one point she sends me an email and she's like,  yeah, I'll still be responding to your emails this week, but I'm in Rome so it might be during a different time. And I was like, wait.  One, we're talking about really cool things that I'm interested in.

Like we were kind of going through this one book and like  doing the book together and she's helping me like do the exercises. So it's like already, this is a really fun conversation. I'm paying you to do this and you're traveling. What?  What are you? So I think I had a moment then.  But just promptly forgot about it  for like a year and a half until then.

 Then I'm leaving and then I like,  it kind of hit me again like,  oh,  she did that. Like  that's a thing. So then like coaching is part of my world, but I, I think travel blogging is like my first thing. For some reason I'm like,  I wanna travel, I like writing, I'm gonna travel. So in my mind it's some version of travel blogging and coaching, but I don't know how those will go together.

But I'm like, I think they just go together  somehow. So I started my blog even before I left for South Korea, I started my blog and I would write every week, and then I started my coaching certification. So it was all starting to happen in the background.  But I quickly realized  I do not like writing about travel.

I don't like giving people directions like how to get to the trailhead or what, you know. I was like, I don't,  I don't care. I liked writing about. Just like deeper stuff and like philosophical stuff. So I was like, I love writing, I do love traveling.  I don't like them together.  So, but I kept my blog, I kept writing, and then I was doing my coaching certification and coaching people.

And so then it just sort of became, didn't feel like a decision as much of the evolution to like, well, I'm gonna have my own  business and it's gonna be blogging and coaching.

 Yeah, so that's just what I was starting to work on in the background while I was in South Korea.

That is cool.  Yeah. Well, what a, what a cool exposure, you know, initially and that does sound awesome to be like, Hey, I'm gonna travel in Rome and sorry I'll be a little bit late, but let me keep in contact with you that flexibility and freedom is a lot  of what folks are looking for. And I know that you're all about developing. Developing a mindset of freedom and

so that is, that is really cool. While you were in South Korea, how did you start laying the foundation for the business? You mentioned you started coaching  for free to the

English teachers, but how else did you start going and  what were maybe some initial pitfalls or difficulties that you faced starting your business?

Yes. So I, I did the coaching right and that was huge. I cannot recommend enough how much, how important it is to just get started and just start taking action because we can get in our heads, we can think like, okay, well what is the program I'm gonna offer? Or what is my niche gonna be?  And like, I did not know any of that,  and I'm just.

 Putting myself out there and like showing up and like  talking to people. And actually what's interesting is the first few clients I got were from the travel blogging course that I took.  Because during, in the travel blogging course, I was really active in the Facebook group, so I was like, well, I basically have no friends now because I left residency and no one there is friends with me anymore.

And that's totally fine. That makes sense.  So I was just sort of like, I need community. So I was just weirdly active in this Facebook group. And then I just started connecting with people and like reading all their blogs and from doing that, I built connections with people who were kind of trying to develop themselves.

And then once I started doing coaching, I asked them.  Do you wanna do a free coaching session with me? And then a lot of them actually turned into my first clients. 

 That is awesome. 

yeah, so I, I would say for laying the foundation, I cannot emphasize enough. It's the foundation is just you taking action.  Like you just go,  I didn't have like a business bank account or an LLC, I didn't have any of these things set up.

 I was like, okay, I think they could just pay me on PayPal. Like I just started putting myself out there and. Asking people to, to work with me without having any clue what my niche was or any clue what I was doing. And so I just feel like that's so important. I was like, what's it called?  Like absorbing everything I could about business.

So on my way to and from School every day  I would be listening to podcasts of like just bus online business stuff. So I was like learning a lot of stuff there, but I, you could do that and not make any progress if you're not taking action. So I would just say  the biggest thing I did was just like put myself out there repeatedly.

I. Put a blog out every week to like that. That was huge, right? Committing to putting out one piece of long form content every week. I'm sure you feel this with putting the podcast out, like any sort of commitment to creating content regularly and putting it out into the world that develops muscles and skills within you.

 So that was huge. I think most people, if you wanna have  an online  business, any sort of personal, brand based online business, you need to  also be a content creator.  And so you really do need to learn those skills.

 Yeah, I completely agree. And I, I feel the same way about long form and  just consistency. And  you know, I think, and I'm really glad you mentioned, I think a lot of times folks think they have to,  you know, have the perfect name for their business and set up their LLC and know exactly what they're gonna offer  and,  you know,  become viral TikTok stars and all the above just to get started, right?

And  you're you're  living proof that that's not the case. And, and

my buddy Brian Lubin, he started Action Academy,  he did the same thing. He just

like, he just. Put himself out there.  And he, he created this course 'cause he is like, Hey, I think after I did all these  free coaching calls, this is what people want.

 He sent out an email and was like, Hey,  here's a, a course that I put together, I think it was like 40 or 50 hours. And he said, next thing you know is he made a hundred thousand dollars through PayPal. And he is like, oh.  I don't think this is how I'm supposed to do this,  but he did it. He just had the consistency and he just took action.

And that's what's so

important because  as doctors, we want to know all the facts, right? We wanna know all the information, we wanna know all the data and try and make an informed decision. But you just have to be willing to trust yourself and  trust the consistency and the grit that you had to get into medical school and get through residency and  become an attending or whatever that may be.

 You had to have that grit and consistency. You can totally. You know,  make a successful business as well if you just continue with those steps, but you have to take action.

Yeah. Yeah. And I think you're bringing up such a good point where like  there are certain parts of like your doctor brain and the skillsets that are incredible for business and there are parts of your doctor brain that are  gonna sabotage your business. So it's like  really knowing when what I tell my clients is.

You need to know when to tap into your med school energy and when to let it go.  And med school energy for me is like dog of determination, consistency, show up, like I'm gonna  get it done.  And that's great. That's like a really important thing.  But then perfectionism and like, you know, trying to get the right  answer and, and trying to.

 I'm like comparing it to med school 'cause that  is what feels most relevant for me. But like trying to  do the right thing to get honors on a rotation, like calibrate, you know,  you're trying to cater yourself to like a rubric or a algorithm or whatever it is, and like getting approval and validation from other people.

It's like that is not it for medicine. You have to like approve yourself for, sorry for entrepreneurship. You have to put your own approval in yourself and no one's gonna tell you that it's the right thing and so you just have to decide.

 Yeah,  I completely agree, and you have to just keep it. Iterating and trying again. And  you know  what I tell folks too all the time, the worst thing that can happen  is your present day reality, right? Worst thing that happens is I bet on myself and I go be an entrepreneur and maybe cut back from medicine a bit, or I  decide, Hey, I'm gonna quit medicine completely and I'm gonna bet on myself and I'm gonna build this business.  Worst thing that happens is just.  Go back and become a physician again.  Like

 there's plenty of jobs.  There's  a that you could, you could also go teach English in South Korea and, and still, you know,  survive and thrive. And so there's like,  there's so many opportunities out there that you don't have to be so fearful of.

 What's the other side look like?

That's such a good point where  it can be kind of  confronting to be like, actually you're in your worst case scenario.

Yeah, it's true.

 But it's true. Like, I mean, maybe it doesn't feel like a worst case scenario. Maybe it's fine,  but you know how to get back here  so you're good.

Yeah, that's, that's exactly right. Well, I know that you, you built up the coaching business and what, what was the initial, you know, you're starting to get paid clients and you're starting to grow the business and you're learning all these things.  Did you, did you  hit a point where you're like, Hey, I'm, I made it like I, I have, I have  arrived where I wanted to be.

I've hit my goals now I'm able to leave that  job teaching English and just fully go all in on the business. What was that like for you?

Okay, so I did it messier 'cause I'm me.  So I actually just left the job after the first year because I was like wanting more,  even more freedom,  right? I got greedy with my freedom,  but I had my weekend freedom and I was like, this is great  and  I don't. Wanna necessarily just be in one place from eight 30 to four 30 every single day.

 And so I was starting to get restless, you know, and wanting to, to go and do something different.  So I actually found out you can teach English online  as well,  right? So there was a point where I had like three jobs where I was teaching English  in person,  starting to teach English online to build up my students, and then doing coaching and stuff on the side.

 So then I left.  The,  the in-person job because I was having this other side income and then I even graduated that to,  I started this, found this really niche company that teaches  let's see. It,  it helps.  Chinese students who are like going to boarding school in the UK and it's mostly the UK who are doing really advanced things.

So I was actually teaching AP bio  to  Chinese  students to go to boarding schools. Like it was a very  odd situation, but it totally worked and it was  fairly good pay for  what I was doing. And so that was my side thing for a while.  And I was able to do that. I did that I think until 2022. So that was almost.

Like two years after I even left South Korea. So it was really a three year time period where I had  other sources of income supporting me  alongside my coaching business.  And then, yeah, early 2022. I can't remember why I decided, 'cause I, it's not that I had fully made it income wise. I like, I had some really good months and then some months not so much, but I was like, you know what?

I just wanna.  Leave this teaching job and I'm just gonna go full in on the business. And then  I did that in January of that year. And then that was my first six figure year, like six figures in revenue.  And so  I guess that would say it when I feel like I made it, but I, I don't know if I even, yeah, I don't know if I feel like I  made it, but I'm not in a negative way.

It's just like  I am,  I've always just been doing it,  you know, like I just get to like, I think just anytime I'm.  Like working with people and they're paying me and I love what I'm doing.  That feels like a made it because what else do I want? Like someone to pay me to do something I love and then they get benefit too.

Like, what else could I want?

Yeah, that's a, that's a much better answer. Yeah, I think, I think you probably made it  when you got on that plane and you started heading to South Korea.

 I think that's probably when you, when you really made it and but yeah, it is so cool to just hear your journey and,  you know, it sounds like, correct me if I'm wrong, it, it sounds like You've had a lot of unique opportunities come your way and you're just like, Hey,  I'm just gonna try this and see what happens and trust. It's all gonna work out and I'm gonna keep working on these other things in the background and these are just gonna be  awesome experiences, even if they don't work out that I'm gonna have,  that's gonna add to my knowledge and my experience down the road.

Yeah, I think I have a very flexible relationship now with like.  Like money and earning money and like,  you know, I don't have a sense of  I need this one job to pay me this salary to this thing. Like, I just am feeling like,  what are my income sources and like where, which ways are the money coming to me?

And  yeah, it doesn't feel like I need to control it in any one way. It's like I just can sort of trust that it's coming in while I'm sharing my gifts and it just feels a lot more freeing.

That is so cool. It's so cool to  hear, you know, the passionate income that you have and that you just love what you're doing and helping others and. You know, I feel like as, as physicians and just entrepreneurs, like we feel so much more fulfilled than we're helping others and when we're serving others.

And so  when we can tie those two together, oh, it's just absolutely beautiful. And that's, that's what we love about assisted living. So we invest a lot in residential assisted living, and  we love that because you can.  Invest in an incredible asset class, but you can also provide exceptional care for seniors who need it most.

And  you can't get that anywhere else in real estate investing. I mean, you're not gonna like go buy an apartment building and feel that same fulfillment. And so it's it's, it's something that I would encourage folks to think about, like, how can I blend  my passion with service and make money as well?

Of course.  And and go from there. So it sounds like you're certainly doing that with your thriving coaching  business.

Yeah. Yeah. I love, I love that you're doing that. 'cause it's not just like, it becomes not just real estate. There's like. A deeper meaning behind it. And I think where there's that meaning,  it's like something that deeply matters to you. There's like a values alignment. There's just  more of a pull and more of a fulfillment that happens.

Yeah, absolutely. We talk a lot about how you can have growth, freedom, and purpose all within that one asset class, and

 yeah, absolutely love it. But but no one's here to hear about me. They wanna hear more about you. So in, in regards to the coaching business, what does that typically look like for you?

I know that you're.  Living the digital nomad life. So tell us a little bit more about what that looks like, although it sounds like settled down a little bit in Mexico City.  But tell us a little bit more about that and the freedom and flexibility you have with coaching. And  if you don't mind also just sharing what it looks like to work with you as a coach.

 Yeah. Yeah. So we'll do just like lifestyle first, because I think this is. When I look at the life I'm living now, it is actually exactly what I dreamed of when I was in residency. So when I was in like my point of burnout in residency, I did a phone call with a physician burnout coach, and she asked me like a very standard coach question now where she's like, if I had a magic wand and  you know, you could have anything you wanted, like what would your career look like?

And the things I described, I was like,  well, I want.  Like a spacious morning, you know, I wanna wake up and be able to meditate without having to get up at four 30 or,  and I wanna just, you know, have time for me in the morning in a, in a relaxed way. I wanna go to a cafe and like work on a laptop and,  and then like, I like what I'm doing.

I don't know what it is. I like it. And then I can go anywhere, like  I just described.  Kind of simple actually, but it felt like  wildly out of reach and. That is my Tuesdays or my Wednesday. You know, that's just  actually my day-to-day reality right now. Which is so cool. And then there's things I didn't even know to ask for that have happened as well, where it sounds unreasonable.

Like I, I feel like I've done an unreasonable amount of bucket list experiences for my age.  I. Turned down a trip to the Northern Lights this January because I was like, you know, I just did a bunch of bucket list things and I think I need to space them out.

That's a great problem to have. What are some of those bucket list things that

didn't really stand out for you?

Yeah, so last year was just incredible year and I think that's when I started, I was like, you know, I'm, I need a little stability. 'cause I was just traveling around. So last year I went to the Bolivian Salt Flats. I went hiking in Patagonia in like Argentina. I didn't do like the debut trek, but I was like hiking and I lived in Patagonia for like seven weeks and it was like immersed there and hiking like every day.

 So cool. Then I did. What else did I do? Oh, I went to Mongolia and I lived with the like Kazakh people in their yurts and I got to talk to them about I, okay, we got to, we had a translator and like a guide and we got to ask them, we got to sit down with its family 'cause we were staying with them  and we got to sit down with them and ask them questions.

And so the question I asked them was like, what is your biggest source of stress?  Because I was like, do they have stress? Like is stress a thing? And it took them a bit to like translate it. ' cause I think stress is not quite the concept. But then his response was a one word.  He literally just like through the translator, said winter.

And then he was like herding animals in the winter.

Wow.  Yeah. And, and that's probably not a source of stress for a lot of, you know, us in America. 'cause we're just stressed about so many different things and worried all the time.  That is, that is wild. That's such a cool experience. And  Patagonia is, is on my bucket list for

sure. So.  Once once that happens, I'm gonna wait until the boys are a little bit older and they'll remember it.

We have a four and a half year old  and a almost 1-year-old, and so once they're older, that'd be a really good family trip to do.  But yeah, we just, we just love being outside. We live in Colorado and so we're,  you know, always in the Rocky Mountains and we're getting ready to go to Yellowstone Glacier in the Tetons, and it's just like, Hey, this, it's just such a beautiful world that's been created and, and we need to explore it.

And  something about just being out in nature and  having that time and that freedom to reflect and think and  just. Be present is amazing, so I'm

sure you felt the same way in Patagonia and on your journeys as well.

Yeah. And one of my favorite things too, it's like I love like disconnecting and unplugging. Like when I was in Mongolia, I unplugged.  I also, like in the same year I went trekking in Nepal and I like unplugged for that. And so like, that was incredible. But then I also love sometimes like  just  working from a beautiful place.

 And it's like,  actually that adds a lot to me. Like not just being there on vacation and recreating, but like also being there on  and then doing a client call and feeling like I'm  contributing something and then going back to enjoying myself. Like it just feels like this into  integration where I feel like my life would be less if I was just for some reason fun, fully funded and not working and just traveling.

Like there's something about actually. Working and creating an  output in a way that's passionate. And while doing these things, it, it all just like makes it all just more meaningful.

Yeah, I feel the same exact way. We, we did about three weeks camping last about three and a half weeks camping. Last fall.  And it was an amazing trip. We went out to Yosemite and great Sequoia and Kings Canyon and all these incredible places.  And my wife, she's an entrepreneur as well, and she's absolutely amazing.

But we, we realized we were kind of getting like a little bit stir crazy 'cause we really just tried to  completely unplug,

which is amazing.  But then we realized, hey, like.  It's okay to do a little bit of work. And then same thing we found like, hey, this is like kind of nice. The kids are sleeping in the camper, we're outside by the fire.

Like just cranking out some work on our laptops for a couple hours, like this feels great. So  we did, we did decide to get startling for this trip and we're like, okay. Like when the kids are down and we're feeling that

urge, we'll just open up the laptop and get some work done and go from there. 'cause  I, I feel like I'm that type of person that's always gonna build, always gonna work.

Like  I'm never gonna be the guy who's like laying on the beach shipping my  ties.  Just forever.

I want that freedom and flexibility to go to the beach on a Tuesday and set my ties if I want to,  you know,

and so that that's what I'm striving for, you know, in terms of my freedom and, and  really heading towards that direction, which is awesome. But but yeah, I love that. I think it, you know, something about creating  working in a beautiful environment and having that freedom and flexibility to be active and be in nature and then come back, get work done. And it's crazy how productive you can be too

when you've kind of.  And refreshed and rested and then  you know, hit the work hard for a couple hours.

So, yeah, I

love that. 

yeah, yeah, It's cool because, you know, you're not like, it's not a pressure to do it, but it's like, I could do it and it would enhance things to do it, and you know, like there's just a, it's just extra.

Yeah, absolutely. That is awesome.  Well, I want to be respectful of your time. I know you have a awesome virtual summit that's coming up here soon.  Tell us a little bit about  that, and then how folks can reach out to you and connect with you if they wanna do coaching with you or learn more about what you do.

Yeah, so I'm hosting a virtual summit. It's the first annual one, but I anticipate it being  something that happens very  frequently,  and it's called Pivot Potentials. It's a career re-imagining summit for healthcare professionals. The reason I created it is because. I kept getting questions like, what are my options?

Or like, I'm, I'm here, I wanna be able to do this, but I feel stuck. I just kept getting the sense of stuckness from people I talk to people like, you know, physicians in Facebook groups in like from my podcast. It just feels like people, like you talked about earlier, like  there's the golden handcuffs, there's  physical reasons, emotional reasons, whatever it is, people just feel stuck.

And I was like, I don't.  There's only so much I can say on one podcast episode or  within one blog post, or one webinar that can really help people get unstuck. So I was like, I wanna create  an experience.  So it, to me, it doesn't feel like it's just like a summit. It's not people coming to just like,  talk at you.

Not that that's what summits are, but, but it's not like a series of disjointed lectures. It's like there's a transformational experience that I am creating.  So  day one is  careers uncaged, where we look at.  All of the things that are keeping you stuck  and we just hand you  a key to like unlock it.

 There's a quote that's like, we're all living in cages with the doors wide open. And I, I really think that's  how most of us are. We like think we're in cages, we've built up these cages, but if we just dismantle some of the things that we've put there,  we see we're actually free.  So day one uncaged, I have speakers coming in to talk about  like being uncaged from money.

 Being uncaged from your degree,  like everything that we think is holding us back is actually a portal to  moving forward.  Alright, so that's day one. We're getting uncaged.  Day two is careers reimagined.  So we are,  now that we have freedom,  right? You can kind of  open up into this new horizon, but it's like,  what do you do with it?

Right? When I was. In South Korea, looking at all my weekends, I was like, what do I do with it? I had to reimagine my weekend, so I  got this hiking project to do,  right? So it's like we're reimagining  what actually could you  do with your career? We're reimagining your definition of success,  your relationship to work,  your  relationship to money.

 There's just like all of these things we get to reimagine what we thought was a linear path.  Like,  does a career need to be in this one trajectory where you like, get a degree and then just go, like,  can we redefine it?  So we're re-imagining everything on that day,  on day three, which is the final day.

 I wanna make it really applicable and like really wanna bring it home. And so what we're doing  is it's like a career storytelling experience. So I like, I kind of picture it like we're. I don't know if you've ever been to a storytelling night, but I've,  I've been to some and like, it's, it's actually really magical  what happens where  there's just so much like resonance in people's stories.

And so people are gonna be sharing stories of  just like how they pivoted, right? It's like pivot potentials, re-imagining how they pivoted, how they reimagined. They're just gonna share their real time stories. And so we have  multiple storytellers on that day, and the goal is just like.  You can see through other people's like messy lived experience that this is also possible for you.

That sounds amazing.  Pivot Potential Virtual Summit. It's

gonna be mid-June, mid to late June, it

Yeah. Yeah. June 20th through 22nd. It's totally free to sign up.  All I want is for people to get unstuck.  I literally just  want people to know they can pivot. Know that there's options, know that there's a way out, and  I wanna elevate the conversation around careers in the physician space, because I think the conversation is so limited and so narrow and scarcity focused.

It's like,  I don't know, it's just like, oh, can I do MSL or could I do U? Like, there's just so many, there's so, so few. There's not  enough imagination and I just wanna elevate the whole conversation so that we,  we've realized you can actually do  anything.  When people come to me and they're like, what are my options?

I'm like, I don't even understand the question, because your options are literally anything. What you're like,  you have a graduate degree, you're from a developed country, like. What do you mean? What are your options? Like you can literally do anything, and so I just want people to realize that for themselves.

That is awesome. Well, I'm excited to hopefully attend I think

we're gonna be in Germany  during that timeframe doing some traveling. So hopefully I'll be able to attend that summit, but I think that that is an incredible opportunity for folks and I think that  those are the rooms that you want to be in, right?

That.  The summit you know, being surrounded by people who are gonna build you up, who are gonna show you that these things are possible  is, is where you need to be.  And,

and that's the only way that you're gonna get unstuck. That's the only way you're gonna have  that encouragement and that accountability to take action and get going and get started on this incredible journey towards freedom.

So you're a amazing example of that, and this has been an incredible, incredible conversation. Thank you so much for coming on the podcast.

Yeah, I've had so much fun. Thanks for having me.

Absolutely. Thanks. Well, with that  it's been Chelsea and Alex with another episode of the Physicians and Properties Podcast signing off.

 Hey, real quick, if you're still listening to this, I'm assuming you got value from it, so I need your help. Specifically, my two year vision with this podcast is to help 100,000 physicians learn how investing in real estate can give you the freedom to practice medicine and live life how you want. There are two main ways that a podcast grows.

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