How To Buy 26 Doors In 24 Months Using Creative Deals With Dr. Erin Hudson

🎙️ Welcome back to another eye-opening episode of The Physicians and Properties Podcast with host, Dr. Alex Schloe.

💡 What if the fastest way to financial freedom isn’t “starting small”… but taking bold action on a deal so good you figure out the money later?

In this episode, Alex sits down with Dr. Erin Hudson (Doctor of Chiropractic)—a physician-turned-investor and serial entrepreneur who went from 0 doors to 26 doors in 24 months, completed 231+ buy/sell transactions, and eventually scaled into multifamily ownership with 2,600+ units.

Erin breaks down how she bought six rentals at once in Indianapolis from Southern California (without knowing exactly where all the capital would come from), how she used relationships, negotiation, double closes, and scarcity to scale, and why integrity matters most when real estate punches you in the mouth.

This is a masterclass in momentum, mindset, and building a legacy that outlives you.

🔥 What you’ll learn:

• 0 → 6 in one move: Why Erin bought all six rentals (not one) when the barrier to entry was low—and committed before she felt “ready”
• Finding the money later (responsibly): How she pulled together capital through creative options (including lending + leverage) because the deal was too strong to ignore
• Investing outside your backyard: Why she chose landlord-friendly markets with lower barriers to entry instead of overpriced coastal real estate
• The “law of the first deal”: Why the first leap is the hardest—and how momentum follows action
• Rinse-and-repeat deal stacking: How she structured deals to sell two and keep one “for free,” then repeated the process
• Integrity under pressure: The story of the fraudulent title company, the financial loss, and the decision to still do right by her investors
• Single-family → multifamily pivot: The moment she realized she’d been playing “Monopoly on Vermont” and could start aiming for “Boardwalk”
• How to pick sponsors/operators: Why the property is the horse—but the operator is the jockey
• Legacy + kids + money: Practical ways Erin teaches her kids wealth, ownership, and discipline through real assets and transparency

🔥 Key Takeaways:

• The deal can pull you forward. If it’s truly a home-run, you can often solve the capital stack after you commit.
• You don’t need to invest where you live. Go where the math works and the rules protect landlords.
• Confidence comes after action. Most people wait to feel ready—winners move, then grow into the identity.
• Real estate is a team sport. Relationships and operators matter as much as underwriting.
• Integrity compounds. Your reputation is an asset—protect it, even when it costs you in the short term.
• Bet on the jockey first. The sponsor/operator’s track record and character will decide whether the deal survives reality.
• Legacy is taught, not told. Your kids learn money by seeing how assets work in real life—n

If you want to learn how investing in real estate can give you the freedom to practice medicine and live life how you want then check out the links below:

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Transcript

 Dr. Erin Hudson: I did not just buy one. I ended up buying all six. Why? Because the barrier of entry was so low, it seemed like it was impossible. It was $50,000 for roughly a 700 square foot house that was renting for $800, so I could not just buy one. I ended up buying all six. Here's the real truth. I didn't know where I was gonna get the money from. I just knew that it was such a good deal that I was gonna find a way come hell or high water to purchase all of these homes for $300,000.

Dr. Alex Schloe:  Welcome to the Physicians and Properties Podcast, the show where we teach you how investing in real estate can give you the freedom to practice medicine and live life how you want. Doctor, doctor, doctor, doctor, doctor. Now here's your host, Dr. Alex Schloe. 

 Hello everyone. Welcome back to the Physicians and Properties Podcast. I'm so glad to have Dr. Erin Hudson joining us today on the podcast. Uh, there's been multiple attempts, so I'm glad that we're able to get this recording, , going today, she is a physician turned investor, serial entrepreneur. She's an operator in the multifamily space.

She went from 26 doors that she acquired really quite quickly, which we'll talk about, to over 2,600 units. And a seven figure portfolio. Erin's journey has been awesome to follow. Um, she is a blend of grit service, intentional wealth building, and she's awesome. So, Dr. Erin Hudson, welcome to the podcast.

Dr. Erin Hudson: Wow. Wow, wow. That's quite the intro. It is so good to be here. Thank you so much for having me. Yes, I'm in healthcare, but I just wanna make a quick correction. It's actually Doctor of Chiropractic, but yes, it's an honor to be here for sure.

Dr. Alex Schloe: Hey, still counts. That is

awesome. Um, glad glad you're here and thank you for, for what you do in the chiropractic space and in the real estate space as well. So I love

it. Uh, more and more of us, you know, in the healthcare world, need as much information and knowledge as we can get. 'cause we did not get any financial education in med school or chiropractic school  I imagine as well.

So, all the, all, all the more. The better. So really excited, to, to follow and, uh, share your journey. let's start at the beginning. You know, you trained as a, a chiropractic physician, or a chiropractor, and, what drove you into that career field? What did that look like for you? And then we'll see how that drove you towards real estate and financial freedom as well.

Dr. Erin Hudson: Awesome. Awesome. Well, initially I actually wanted to be an obstetrician, and then it turned into, look, I was an athlete growing up and I had two uncles that work. Chiropractors had very successful practices and they had. Freedom, a different kind of freedom that you and I are gonna dig into and talk about shortly.

But they had freedom where they were their own boss there. It wasn't patient a, patient B, they really got to know the families. They enhanced their life and wellbeing and it was really, really attractive, especially since I wanted to have a family of my own and I certainly wanted to become my own boss.

So that was really how, it got started with moving in that direction. Um, I will tell you this though. I grew up in a home, Alex, where my parents worked nine to five, building somebody else's dream, and I was kind of known as the odd duck of the family.  I just was the girl that kind of was the one drink the Kool-Aid and my four brothers and sister were like, oh gosh, now what?

She got on her mind. So I've kind of always lived that life of just knowing deep down inside that. I'm a chick on a mission, I'm an entrepreneur at heart. I'm free spirited and I've got a lot of grit, as you said. And so, with that being said, I jumped into practice and look, I loved my practice. I had a couple practices in Southern California, and I will tell you along with that practice came 30 other headaches.

I mean team members, of my staff that I had. And what I will tell you is during that time, I ate work, I breathed work, I slept with work. It literally owned me day in, day out. Many of you can totally relate, but we are the last to be paid. We make sure everybody else is well taken care of, and then we are the last to be paid.

And what I noticed as I was in practice over the 13 years is that reimbursement started to get less. And less and less. And, uh, I really wanted to move into something where there was a little bit more freedom and real estate really got me excited. And then I will tell you that once I decided that I was gonna pivot into real estate, full-time.

 And we'll get there. I will tell you this. Remember how I said that my family thought I was a little bit crazy and lost my marbles, but drinking all the Kool-Aid, well, so did my colleagues, because all they could see on the outside were these successful practices that drove troves of people. Droves of people into my practice.

And so when they knew I was leaving to move into the real estate space, they too, along with my family, thought I had lost my marbles. But what they didn't realize is that, um, I wasn't truly in private practice. Even though I was in private practice, I really wasn't. 'cause I was linked up with the healthcare system and they're the ones that have ultimate control.

So Alex, I feel like you and I are winning because we found the breakthrough. And when you jump into real estate and you learn how to make money while you sleep and you get to have true freedom. I'll pause there because you can tell I'm getting excited. You just can never look back. And so there's something incredible that comes from creating your own destiny and making moves that others are just afraid to make.

So I'll pause there, but that's a nice little start. Can you relate or what Alex?

Dr. Alex Schloe: I can absolutely relate. And that's, that's a, that's a great way to start things off. 'cause a lot of folks who are listening to this podcast are probably coming from a place of burnout, uh, a ba uh, place of fatigue. They, they feel like they don't have any autonomy or control, and they're trying to figure out, okay, how can

I get some degree of financial freedom so that I can start.

This kind of snowball generation of financial freedom to ultimately buy my time back to gain that

control back again. And so I'm really excited to talk more and more about that today with you 'cause you've done it. Uh, I'm doing it right now and it's just been awesome to be able to pivot and, and practice medicine.

Not 'cause I have to, but because I want to. And so it's a great way to do it. Erin, was there a specific time in your practice where you're like, Hey, it, it is time to go all in on real estate, and what were some of those like kind of beginning tips, tricks or resources that you used to get started in, in real estate?


Dr. Erin Hudson: Man, that's such a loaded question, but I will start with this. I always knew that I wanted to get into real estate. I really just didn't know how. I didn't know how because I felt like I had odds against me. What do I mean by that? Well, number one, I didn't grow up from a wealthy family. And number two, I lived in Southern California, Huntington Beach to be exact, just outside of LA between San Diego and LA.

And it was like a million dollars for a rental property that was 1950 built and 1500 square feet. So that is not favorable. So I kind of had the. Odd stacked against me a wee bit, which means we have got to break outside, open up our eyes, be willing to look in other places other than where I live. And a lot of investors that you hear.

You hear people say, invest in your backyard. I could not invest in my backyard.  So of course I had to do some research and I really started to, uh, just investigate just different states and what made the most sense, guys, what do I mean when I say what made the most sense? I was looking for states where it was landlord friendly, meaning that I could get a tenant out in 30 days if they did not pay their rent.

In California, you could squat for two freaking years for and live for free. So I certainly didn't wanna be that landlord that owns something and never received pay.  And then number two, I wanted to know where was the lowest barrier of entry? What do I mean by that? Like I didn't have buku and buku of cash just sitting in the bank.

I wanted to know where can I get the best bang for the buck? And for me, I will just fast forward it. It was Indianapolis, Indiana. And so what I did is I said, oh my gosh, I'm highly interested. I wanna move to this. Area, and I know this sounds a little woo woo, but I put it out in the universe and I said, look, I really wanna move.

This is the area that I'm going towards. And I kind of had a little bit of a big break. I walked into the gym one day, and I'm kind of fast forwarding this for you. I walked into the gym one day and one of my buddies said, Hey, I know you really wanna invest in real estate. Listen, I've got this friend who's got six properties.

Y'all are never gonna believe. Where were they located? I lived in Orange County, California. Y'all, where were they? Alex,

Dr. Alex Schloe: Gotta be.

Dr. Erin Hudson: Indiana. So I said, you gotta be kidding me. Long story short, we went and had dinner together with his buddy that owned the properties. I did not just buy one. I ended up buying all six.

Why? Because the barrier of entry was so low, it seemed like it was impossible. It was $50,000 for roughly a 700 square foot house that was renting for $800, so I could not just buy one. I ended up buying all six. And let me pause right there, Alex, because. Most people would say, well, where the heck are you gonna, where'd you get the money from?

Here's the real truth. I didn't know where I was gonna get the money from. I just knew that it was such a good deal that I was gonna find a way come hell or high water to purchase all of these homes for $300,000. And so what I did have, I think I had like $150,000 in the bank. I just went and found money in other places.

Sometimes you dig a little deeper. Where did I find money? I don't know. Have you ever gotten those checks in the mail that you can write a check? Well, I maxed out that credit card real quick, and I used that, and then I struck up a deal with my father-in-law. And he was my lender for I think a hundred thousand dollars.

The bottom line is I found a way to make it happen, and that was my end, and I knew it was so good that I had to figure out how I was gonna make it happen. And that was the beginning of investing in the single family space

Dr. Alex Schloe: That is awesome. Yeah, well, way to go from zero to six. So a lot of people are like, holy cow, that's crazy. Um, which is awesome. And way to take action. I mean, that's the big thing. And I think I wanna foot down point you said like, if you know you have a really good deal, it's risk mitigated like. Go all in you.

You can find the money if the deal's good enough. And, and you did that and, that is awesome.  What was it like, was there any like mindset shift that happened for you when you were like, okay, I'm going from no real estate living in Huntington Beach to, I'm buying six homes in Indianapolis, and this seems

destined. was there a mindset shift that happened for you where you're uh, you were like, Hey, holy crap, this is happening? Or, or did it just kind of work itself out from that perspective?

Dr. Erin Hudson: listen, let me just tell you, I, I'm just a girl that thinks big and I wasn't afraid because here's the thing, I'm not the specialist when it comes to property management. But here's the thing. They already had property management in place, and if I were to tell you, let me just tell you a little bit more about that, guys.

Life is a negotiation. Everything you do is a negotiation. When someone tells you no, you find a worker. I will find a worker and figure out another way to go about it and skin the cat. For example, when I took over these properties, there was already property management in place. Three of them were being rent rented, or I'm sorry, managed by a section eight.

Uh, management company and the other three were being managed by another management company. And so when I got the six assets, both the management companies said, Hey, well can you bring all six of those properties and put 'em under my management? And guess what? The other guy said the same thing. And here was my response to them.

You know what? I love that you're hungry and you want all six of these, and I would love nothing more than to give you all six of those. But to be honest, I'm gonna be, I'm gonna see who takes care of me better. Is it gonna be you or is it gonna be you? And whoever takes me in and treats me like family and does me good, guess what?

You're the one that's gonna get my six properties. So we'll see where it goes. Right? And so there you have it. It's about making sure that you have the right teams. And I think from there, Alex, it made it really, really easy after those six to go bigger and to go bigger. And so I think it's just the law of the first deal.

It's the breakthrough. Your girl didn't just start with one, she started with six and everybody else might be, that's crazy, but how can you really lose when you're, uh, the cash flow on these puppies were just ridiculous and could service the debt and then some, right?

Dr. Alex Schloe: Right. Yeah, it was, it was secure. Uh, it was risk mitigated, like just great, great

opportunity from that perspective. Well, I know you went from six to 26 fairly quickly, so let's, let's

talk a bit more about that. What was next for you after the initial six home portfolio?

Dr. Erin Hudson: Yeah, so listen, within 24 months, I did acquire 26 properties, but I wanna be very, very clear about this, and this is part of the strategy and I love sharing stories because they really help you understand who I am as a human. And I hope at the same time as you hear this, not you, Alex, but all of your listeners out there, that there's always a way.

It's about solving problems and figuring out how you can go bigger and at the same time, remember, you don't have to do it alone. Get creative. That's the most fun part about this whole entire space. There are so many ways to skin a cat. There's a way to help everybody win because at the end of the day, it kind of is a team sport.

Even though it wasn't when I first got started. Um, so lemme tell you, I ran outta money real quick, right? You already heard I borrowed from my father-in-law. So listen to what I did. This is really, really wild. Um, I was the chick that found out after I bought those homes. My property manager, I love people, so I just water the seed of just people and how can I help you and so on and so forth.

And I shared with them, look. I really want one of them in particular. I really want to acquire more homes. I'm super hungry. I've got cash, guys. I didn't have cash, but I put it out in the universe like I got cash. I wanna acquire more of these. Can you help me? You help me, I'll help you. You help me acquire properties, you're gonna be managing 'em, right?

 And so check this out. He goes, listen, Aaron, you got ripped off. And I said, what do you mean? He goes, you paid $50,000 for these and I could get you the same house for roughly $35,000. 30, 35,000. I said, you gotta be kidding me. I said, well, show me where they're at. Let's, let's do some magic here. Long story short, he started to bring these homes to me and I couldn't believe it.

I didn't feel like I got ripped off y'all. It was like that was my barrier of entry, right? Like I had a pay to play. And you get, and then you figure out the goodness, right? And so let me just tell you what happened. Remember I had no money, but in Indianapolis, I learned something bef when I decided that I was gonna go into that market, that there was something called a double close.

I didn't know a whole lot about it. Um, Alex, you're familiar with the double close, right?

Dr. Alex Schloe: am. Yep. Yep.

Dr. Erin Hudson: okay, so check this out. I said, listen, I don't know a whole lot about it. And we certainly didn't have chat GPT at that time, right? So what did I do? I looked up a title company, the one that I closed with, and I had called them, and there was a lady by the name of Sally there.

And I'll never forget this, I called her up Ring, ring, ring. Sally, this is Erin Hudson. How are you? Well, I'm good. She didn't really know me. But anyhow, when I started to talk to her, I said, listen, I just wanna see if you could help a girl out. And she's like, well, what do you need? And I was like, listen, I heard there's this thing called a double close and I'm just wondering, could you like walk me through how you go about it?

And so I've got my little stick it pads and she's like, okay, well first you have, you know, you're gonna buy a home and you're gonna buy it from Bob and let's just call him a. And so you would take the A and you tied up a contract with him and you're B and you're gonna buy that for $50,000. At the same time.

You guys are gonna close on June 1st, and Erin, you're gonna go find somebody else. Who's gonna be C and you're gonna close the same day, but you're not gonna close for 50,000. You're gonna close for 60,000. And then C, the person that's buying it for 60,000 is gonna send his money to title and close on it on June 1st, and that 60,000 that goes in there is gonna cover your 50.

You'll have extra of 10,000. Did that make sense, Alex? I hope I somewhat

Dr. Alex Schloe: No, that was good. Yeah,

Dr. Erin Hudson: so check this out. I'm like, wait a minute. Could you repeat that? Okay, great. And I'm taking ferocious note. Long story short, that's exactly what I did. I ran outta money, right? So I had to get creative, so I did a little bit of, of the double close.

At the same time, I also did this, this is a true, real deal. I bought three properties for a hundred thousand dollars. I turned around and I sold two of them for the same a hundred thousand, and I kept one for free, and then I would rinse. Repeat that game, and especially for all you women out there. I'm gonna say I am on fire for women to win in this space because I hate to say it, but it is kind of a man's world, but not for long.

Dr. Alex Schloe: Yeah. You

Dr. Erin Hudson: Not for long. But here's the deal. US women out there, I know some of you can relate. You wanna go to the Marshalls or the TJ Maxx so you can get the cutest outfit versus going to, um, Nordstrom. Because if you go to Nordstroms, you can get one outfit, but for the same amount of money, you can go buy three outfits at Marshalls or TJ Maxx.

It's the same concept, right? Like you just wanna get a really, really good deal and there you have it. So I was able to rinse and repeat. And within two years I acquired 26 rental properties, making some pretty insane, awesome mailbox money. I can make money while I sleep and I just was on fire for it. And I'm gonna pause here in just a second, but I wanna share with you.

When you get out in the marketplace and you're making big moves and people are watching, right? As a matter of fact, there was a, um, a growth event that I would go to like three times a year, and the lady that put on this event would call me up to the stage and she would wanna highlight all of the goodness that unfolded in my life because it made her look really, really good.

Like I was one of her students, and I was like, kept climbing the ladder. So what arose from that? All of these people that are out there at these events see her highlighting me and the growth happening exponentially. So all of these people started calling me and wanted me to help them get an investment property and, and so I think this is really crazy, but it's really, really true.

Within three years, I did over 200 buy and sell transactions. Uh, to these folks and check this out. The biggest thing that is mind-blowing to people is this, guys, I had 26 rental properties. I had never been to Indianapolis, Indiana. Hold on. It gets better. I did not have a website. I did not have an assistant.

I did not have another building. I did not have a phone number. It was my cell phone number. People were calling and 231 deals, and not one of my investors went to Indianapolis, Indiana. Why do I share that? It's not to say, oh, I'm so great and this, that and the other. There's twofold that come from this. If people know you, like you and trust you, they wanna be linked to you.

Right. And then the other thing that I wanna share from what, um, I just shouted from the mountaintop about this, is I hope that some of you that are afraid to take action actually just heard the call. I told you all of the things that it could have been objections for me to move forward and transact business, but I didn't let it stop me.

So I hope this resonates with you and it makes you go, oh my gosh, if this broad over here can do it  and have success, and she's not even a real estate agent. She's just crafty and likes to negotiate and at the end of the day, help people win at the game of life. Then guess what? I think you can do something too, and this may very well be your call to rise.

Dr. Alex Schloe: Let's go. Alright, we'll wrap up the podcast here. Uh, no, that was amazing. Uh, I think, um, yeah, I mean, it's so many, so many things to take away. I think it boils down to, to kind of three main things. One, your, your willingness to take action. Two, your, your growth mindset. Set and then your willingness to just help other people win and, and

realize like, this is just such a relationship game.

Real estate is like you mentioned, a team sport. It's a relationship game.

And that mailbox money was coming 'cause you put in the work to find a good property manager who, who managed the properties well and partnered with you and you took care of him and or them and they took care of you. And, uh, that's, uh, that's the way to do it, man.

I love it. I'm fired up. I'm ready to like run through the wall or something. Uh, 'cause 'cause that is good. So the 231 deals that you did from, from folks, just really kind of no website, no business, really? No, no marketing. None of the above. What was that like for you and what, what came out of that for you?

Dr. Erin Hudson: I could go in so many directions, but there's a couple things that I wanna say about that is, look, we have to make the most of our time. We are only given such a short little bit of it. And how can you, you know, when you start to do this industry just in real estate, you have to go one to one. And the most beautiful thing that happens as you start to build, you no longer have to go one-to-one.

It becomes one to many. I hadn't had that much success. You know, out of the gate with it. But I will tell you, when all of these people started to reach out to me, I knew between all, 'cause remember, I was slinging these deals between seeing patients, y'all. And so what I have to tell you is this, it got to a point that I couldn't take those calls anymore.

So what did I do? I put on a webinar. I put on a webinar, invited whoever wanted to come, and I shared them. I shared with them, not that I'm the expert, and come with me. Come with me. Come with me. I did a full disclosure. I said, look, I've been at it for two years, two and a half years at that point. And I said, here's what I've been able to do and I would love to help you win.

Right? And I will never forget this one person puts in the, uh, puts in the comment. I have a question for you. I wanna say foolishly, maybe not foolishly. I took the question live and I said, what can I do for you? And he goes, listen. He goes, I just have a question for you. Why in the world should I go with you?

You've only been doing this for two and a half years, and company A, B, C in Indianapolis has been at it for 10 and a half years. Why should I go with you? And I remember feeling like there was a frog in my throat and I swallowed and I said, you know what? I said, you are wise. You are one wise guy. You probably should go with company A, B, C.

They've been at it for a really long time. At the end of the day, I'm just sharing with you authentically what has worked for me and how I could possibly help you get in for a lower barrier of entry than company A, B, C is gonna get you in for. And I remember getting off that call and thinking, holy smokes.

I'm so glad that I was just authentic about answering that. But here's what I learned from it. When you take things off the table. You are true and authentic and have integrity. People wanna work with you even more. And that opened up the floodgates. And so from there, guess what I did. How many of you remember BiggerPockets?

BiggerPockets has this little, I don't even remember what it was called, but you could go in and put your numbers of the property that you're looking to purchase. You could put what the property management is, the 10, all the different things, and then you could add a little picture of the house, what it looked like.

Here's what I did. I would go and I would find these homes that I was gonna buy, and I would put 'em on a little performa. And from that call, I had folks just lined up that wanted to buy homes. And so I just said, you've got to create scarcity at the same time. And so I said, look. We've got a whole slew of investors, so I'm gonna give you two options.

Performa one with this property, performa. Two. If you want one, let me know. You have 24 hours to make the decision, otherwise it's getting passed to the next person in line, and you can go to the back end of the line and you can wait. Not that I didn't have people waiting, there were people that were hungry for this, and that worked for me that I, I don't even, it just made it up and it just worked.

And then, lo and behold, 231 deals

Dr. Alex Schloe: That's awesome. Yeah.

Uh, shout out to shout out to BiggerPockets. That's where a lot of us, uh, probably got

Dr. Erin Hudson: I got started.

Dr. Alex Schloe: Um, yeah. That, that is awesome. wow. Um, lots of different ways that we could take this too. I think, you know, you had mentioned pre-recording, that you did have some kind of failures and stumbling blocks along the way, and, and certainly, you know, a lot of folks listening to this are, are like, man, real estate can be tough.

It can be unforgiving. What are some, what are some failures or, or some learning opportunities, if you will, that you had along the way?

Dr. Erin Hudson: Man, I had a, I've had a handful of, that's the thing, right? Like our life's like on social media, just like look like the highlight reel of the best life, right? It doesn't come without having to lick those wounds. There are many that I could tell you, so I will tell you I have had massive epic fails, but those epic fails have been far surpassed with all of the wins.

 And had I been the weenie and given up when things got hard. Or shit hit the fan and I just turned it out and left. Guess what? It wouldn't be just a failure for me. Alex can relate to this. This would be a failure to my legacy. I've got five kids and I run and I build for them because I am changing my generation, like the legacy that you know, from what my parents had.

And not that they did it wrong, they did the best that they knew how the thing is. When you know what, you know what you know now. You can't look back and do it differently. It's all about that family. So, look, I've had massive fails. I mean, look, I'll tell you with all of those transactions, 231 transactions, probably one of the biggest things that blew my mind.

That also, um, things are tough when things go wrong. How are you gonna respond? Are you gonna cheat the system? Are you gonna do what's right? And I will share with you one story that just literally just came to my head. There was three homes that I was purchasing, and I actually branched out a little bit in Toledo, Ohio as well.

But Indianapolis was my main area, and I actually had bought 10 homes there. And then all of the sudden I had three homes that I was set to sell to three other people. And I will never forget this, the three people, different individuals send in their money to title and I'm supposed to be collecting on all that money.

'cause I owned those three homes. I bought them first and then I sold them to them. Um, and those three homes, they sent their money in. I called title to find out where my money was. I hadn't received it. The next day they said, oh, it's coming. And something in my gut told me otherwise. It did not feel right, and I will tell you right now, listen to your gut folks, and this is, I've had a few gut checks in real estate, but I, I knew it wasn't coming.

Something told me that money was not coming. Lo and behold, I found out that, uh, my money disappeared over $125,000 disappeared. It ended up being a fraudulent. Title company that I had already transacted 10 other deals with in the previous 12 months. And it was a big Ponzi scheme of multiple millions and millions of dollars all within a four day timeframe that all of this went to hell in a handbag and multiple other entrepreneurs that had been duped all at that same time.

So anyhow, here's what I'm gonna tell you from that. I never got the money. Therefore I really don't have to release those three properties to those three folks that came in and bought these properties. But in my every fiber of my being. Told me, stay true to your word. Stay true to who you are. I had to lick my wounds.

I gave those properties over to the other folks, and I walked away with a big loss, right? And so, look, I will tell you, in real estate, they all can't be winners. But you definitely wanna do your due diligence. And who would've ever thought that I needed to do due diligence on a title company that I had been referred to from another friend?

Right? So. Anyhow. Um, that was a big lesson, but also it's a great reminder of who I am and integrity comes first. And if you put people first and you do what's right every single time, you can't help but to win. And people will know you as a leader and a person that does right by others. So,

Dr. Alex Schloe: Absolutely. Thanks for sharing that. I can't imagine

going through that. And you're right, the title company is not the person you think you have to do diligence, uh, on. So, uh, man, sorry that you had to go through that, Aaron. That's, that's

rough. Well, I know you, I know you pivoted ultimately, uh, you know, uh, into multifamily.

So let's talk a little bit about what drew you to multifamily in that transition and what that's

looked like for you as well. If you don't mind.

Dr. Erin Hudson: yeah, no, absolutely. So I'll try and make this story quick, but it's an awesome one. Um, I'll never forget, a friend came and said, Hey, listen, there's this multi-family event. It's a two hour course, they're gonna just teach you about multi-family. Uh, come with me. I was that girl that said, hell no, that's not for me.

I am not a multi multimillionaire and only millionaires buy apartment buildings. That was my stereotypical view on apartment buildings. They're just for billionaires, millionaires, and billionaires. Long story short, we went to that event. I sat in the front row begrudgingly with my arms crossed, and I was like kind of annoyed that I was there.

And, uh, within quick amount of time, I felt like all of a sudden the Red Sea had parted and I felt this moment. And what do I mean by that? I don't know. I feel like probably all your listeners have played the game Monopoly and I felt like this girl that had been playing Monopoly and landing on Vermont.

What is Vermont in Monopoly? It is the cheapest rent that you can collect. Right? Well, I had been playing Monopoly with my little Vermont's in Indianapolis, Indiana, and I just found out, not that I'm just capable, but I'm worthy. I'm worthy to land on Boardwalk every single time, and I will fast forward that with this girl rolled up her mat literally burned the boat and within six months I was out.

I brought in other doctors to my practices and I literally packed up my kids. We moved to Texas because it was the land of opportunity and California was not, and uh. I went all in. I knew that I had to leave. If I was gonna leave and jump into multifamily. I knew that I could not be one foot in and one foot out.

I knew that I literally had to make, take the pay cut. Right. And I dug in for, from 2017 to 2019. And in June, no, uh, may of 2019, I fir, I purchased my first apartment building in, uh, Texas. So pretty wild. Pretty, pretty wild. But I did join a, I joined an educational group. I think I paid $60,000 or something like that because I knew this, I knew that, it was a team sport in multifamily and I knew that I needed to know my craft in and out, upside down, inside out, because.

The single family, I was not dealing with anyone else's money. When I had the 26 properties, I did not have any loans except for what I owed my father-in-law, and I got him paid real quick. I did not have any partners in my practices. As a matter of fact, I didn't even have any debt in my practices. At all.

So I was not a chick that wanted to take on all this extra debt, but in multifamily you have partners. And so the fact that, you get to work with others is cool, but the thing that is the most freeing is you get to play in your lane. It is your biggest strength and where it is, you flow there with ease and it is enjoyable.

So I'm gonna pause there, because what I mean by that is, in the single family space, your chick that was working hard, slinging deals, was finding the deal, finding the buyers, finding the money, finding every ask, every part of it. I was wearing a hat for every single thing. I was a one man show and then to go into multifamily and for us, you know, there's four people on my team, but I get to stay in the lane where I most efficiently flow, and that is in the investor relations director of equity relations, raising millions and millions of dollars to the tune of over a hundred million dollars.

Why? Because I'm really good at it. I love people. I love money and I love to see people win. And when people know that you are trying to help them out of the goodness of your heart because you want to see them uplevel and build a legacy that's not, that you can't destroy, people feel that you cannot fake it out.

People can smell manipulation from a mile away, but if your heart is in the right place, man, you can't help but to have success. For sure.

Dr. Alex Schloe: Absolutely. That's awesome. Yeah.  If I didn't know you at all, I'd be like, yep. You're definitely on investor relations for sure. 'cause you're, uh, so good with words and encouraging and you can just tell that your heart is in the right place. And so, that is, that is awesome. well, let's, let's talk about multifamily.

What do you feel like are some of the unique advantages of multifamily investing?

Dr. Erin Hudson: Oh my word. Where to begin? I think there's a few things. Look, um. I love. I will tell you what I love, love, love. In the single family space. When you bought a single family rental property and you went to go sell it, it was based off what everything in the market was selling for around there. Well imagine for a second.

What if you got to link arms with an incredible team, like with what Alex is doing and his crew? What if you got to link arms with an incredible team that has a track record that knows the asset in and out? How powerful it would be if it was all predicated off the earnings of the bottom line. So lemme break that down for a second.

When you are buying apartment buildings. You are looking for an asset. Let's just paint the picture real quick. You're looking for an asset where, let's just say that the market is renting for a thousand dollars per unit. You can rent an apartment for a thousand dollars, but what if you find an apartment building where they're renting for under market, the current owner, maybe they're 80 years old.

I'm using a story of ours that they're 80 years old and it's not a thousand dollars. They're renting at $800. Why? Because they have the screwed up mentality that they think, oh my gosh, if I raise the rent, 'cause I've owned this for 30 years and I have tenants that have been here for 20 years, that they're gonna exit out.

But what they don't know and they don't realize is that that tenant is not gonna be able to go anywhere else where they can rent for $800 or for a thousand dollars. So it would behoove them to raise the rent for a hundred, you know, to that a thousand dollars mark. Well, that's when I don't know, Alex or myself or our companies are gonna swoop in and say, well, my goodness, there's already a margin right there of $200.

Hold on. What if it gets better than that? Not only that, if you go in and you renovate that unit that you can add an additional $300, renovate the unit. Come on, let's break it down. If you go in and put $15,000 and red the kitchen and put new appliances and carpet and wallpaper, or take off the wallpaper, then guess what?

You get that $200 increase in rent. So. Now all of a sudden you found a way to take the 200 because of the market, and then another 200 after you did the rental, you just increased the rent $400. Okay? But that's not just on one unit. If you have a hundred unit apartment building, multiply that puppy times a hundred.

Anyways, the sky's the limit. So let's continue to like stack. We're just gonna stay at a high level. So if your income comes in and then you minus all the expenses that it costs to run that property, you're left with your bottom line. That's called your net operating income. Well, here is the goodness that net operating income, the sweeter we make that.

The more valuable the asset becomes. It is not based off the apartment down the street that sells or the apartment three miles down the street because it truly is based off how great you are at, at really walking through. Getting those tightened expenses down and increasing and juicing that bottom line, it's really gonna dictate what you sell that apartment building for.

And I know with my team what our capabilities are. We're really, really good at decreasing the expenses and increasing the bottom line and turning around and selling that puppy. That's not meant to sell until year five. We end up selling it at year two and a half or year three. And that's where it's at.

So I'm gonna pause there, but I hope that made sense.

Dr. Alex Schloe: No, that made a lot of sense. It's, it's great. And the, the amount of value that you can add is massive. I mean, the, the $400 difference times a hundred, and then you look at NOI and cap rate, and you're like, we've just generated. Uh, millions of dollars in, in value that is added based off that asset. And so that's where the real strength of commercial properties multifamily investing really is, is because it's, it's not based off the comps like, like you

mentioned, it's not based off the single family house down the street.

 It's based off income that can be generated, what the cap rate is at that time. And oh man, it's a beautiful

Dr. Erin Hudson: Let's, that's, that's one though, Alex, like, that's why I'm telling you like, I feel like I gotta get on my soapbox. So there's a great, beautiful way to increase the income, but check this out. I don't know if any of you are following about bonus depreciation. Like, come on, could I get a like an Amen. So check this out.

Our bonus depreciation just got brought back to a hundred percent and so I don't wanna get too far in the weeds, but it changed and it went down. I think our last was, we only got 60% on that bonus depreciation. It's now brought back up to a hundred. Uh, a hundred percent. So what does that mean? I don't know.

Like, I'll give a kind of a roundabout idea. Let's just say that you're putting a hundred thousand dollars into maybe one of Alex's storage units or, or I don't know, an apartment building. If there is a write off, that one can get. Let's just say that if you put in a hundred thousand, you can expect roughly, let's call it to be, say, $50,000 of that a hundred thousand that you could get as a write off.

Okay. Well. Now that the a hundred percent has come back, it's a hundred percent of, call it that 50,000, whereas last year it was only 60% of that 50,000. So why do, why is that a win? It's because, listen, we are all, especially healthcare practitioners, are looking for a way to decrease their taxes. Now, I don't wanna get too far into the weeds on this, but, uh, for, in most cases, unless you're a real estate professional, just a quick little drop.

You have to have 750 hours that you are in real estate working. It tolling it all a year. And if you're not, then you have to take that tax deduction. When it sells at year five, regardless either way, whether it's today or it's in five years, there's a way for you to, to win mightily and decrease your tax, um, your tax deduction and liabilities, or let's just call it your tax liabilities.

There's a way to decrease those tax liabilities. And so what if you could get in, uh, the blocks and you were investing in one property every. Single year. Well, of course, as it starts to roll, those deductions are gonna come every year as you're in the blocks and you're doing this. So it's really about wealth creation.

We're gonna preserve it, we're gonna protect it, we're gonna grow it. And I think the other thing is this, I don't know about you, but I'm not a fan of the stock market, right? Like it goes up, it goes down. And as we start to get older, we don't have time to make up ground. And so I would rather put it in something like such.

That. Number three, we all know that rents are going up. They, if you look over a 10 year time period, you tell me when you can look back at a 10 year timeframe where rents were less than they were 10 years. I mean, it's no matter what. Time is would time. Val, um, uh, I'm sorry. Rents are only gonna continue to go up, whether you're in storage, whether you're in, you know, healthcare, whether you're in, multifamily and that type of thing.

So it's just a matter of time and I'm sure I'm missing something else that you could add there, Alex, but those are all great reasons why we love to invest in real estate.

Dr. Alex Schloe: So many great reasons. The appreciation, the depreciation, the accelerated depreciation, the tax benefits, the debt pay down. I mean, there's just so many great, great ways, uh, to win, you know, and put it all together and it's just absolutely incredible. Uh, I love it. Well, I want to be respectful of your time, but I do want to talk about family and legacy.

You, you

mentioned you have five kids, you're building this for them. Um, and I've seen, and it's been really cool to see you kind of involving your kids in investing. Why is that

important to you?

Dr. Erin Hudson: Oh man. You're gonna, I feel like I need tissues when we start to talk about this. I just think, look, I, I know I've said a little bit about it before, it's just like, look, I didn't come from a super wealthy family and they certainly didn't own real estate, and I just think it's so powerful. Um, when you learn this to be able to pass it off to your children, what better way?

same thing Alex. I don't know about you, but growing up my parents didn't talk about money. We certainly didn't talk about at the dinner table, um, ROI, cashflow retirement. Those were not terms that were flung around my dinner table. So my hair raises when I say this because I am here to make a difference and an impact.

Not just for my children, but for their children's, children's, children's children. So when you walk into my, I just moved into a new home, so it's not on the wall right now, but in my home, in my office, I have a whiteboard. And my whiteboard, my children can attest to have all the assets that are on that we've purchased within our company and our.

Look, we're at like 26 properties that we've purchased. I think in 2021. We purchased 15 apartment buildings alone, so I know what we're made of. But look, when you come and you find one of these apartment buildings as an operator, I wanna be very clear about this to the listeners. There's something called an acquisition fee.

And an acquisition fee is something. Absolutely hands down, you want to make sure your operators are getting an acquisition fee because they are working on your behalf day in and day out to find the best properties that have the most upside, that are in phenomenal markets, that have great demographics, that have lots of different companies that are doing business in that location.

They're gonna go out there, they're gonna walk the property, they're gonna shop the comps that the list goes on. They're gonna go find loans, they're gonna find the best loans. They're gonna make sure that they make it advantageous. And for doing that, they get something called an acquisition fee. Not to mention, they have to babysit this asset and make sure it performs over a five year timeframe, so they are earning their cut.

So don't be upset when you see an acquisition fee.  It is well deserved. Now, going back to my whiteboard on all of these assets that our company is purchased to the tune of 25 of 'em,  their acquisition fees that are paid, and you better believe on that whiteboard, are those acquisition fees. And it is not to be braggadocious.

It is so that my kids, every time they pass by the door and they see my whiteboard, they know what's coming up. They know if another asset's being purchased. They know if, uh, how much I'm gonna make off that they know how, how much their mama made every single year. Why? Because that's on the whiteboard too.

I didn't grow up from that. I want my kids to be so tuned in, not to be all about money, but but to understand that they're in control. And if you write it on the board, you see it, you eat it, you breathe it, you drink it, you like, you embody it. And my kids don't have a filthy fill about money. They know that they have to work hard in order to earn that money.

Right. Look, in my house growing up, my parents said to us, we don't have the money. We don't have the money and so I grew up hearing we don't have the money and I swore with every fiber in me that I would never walk around saying I don't have the money. I would say it's not a wise purchase. And so my kids know we wanna put stuff into an asset that's gonna make them money while they sleep at night, right?

So I encourage you, I don't care if you're a doctor and you're not in real estate, start putting that money up there  and let your kids see where it's going. Why? Because you work really, really hard. To bring home the bacon and it's important and you're doing your child a service by letting them know how hard it is for us to live, to pay all the bills and all the things we have to do to keep the lights on, and for them to be able to live in a beautiful, healthy, warm home.

So shall I pause there or go into what I do

Dr. Alex Schloe: Uh, I just wanna say I I love that. And, and I think that that is, is huge. And, and, and we had similar upbringings, money was kind of like a, a, a curse word, if you will. And similar, similar, you know, humble beginnings from that perspective for sure. And I felt the same way. I was like, I never want my kids to feel like that waiter, that pressure of money and where's it gonna come from and, you know, all those

sorts of things. So I think that's amazing. Uh, I do want to, uh, just throw a funny story out there real quick. I asked my son, Jackie's five the other day. We were talking about money and we were talking about the house and, and who pays for the house and all those sorts of things that we live in. Uh, luckily we house hack our basement, so our tenant pays for it.

But,

I asked him, I said, Jack, how much do you think it costs to for a house? How much money and he is like, oh, I like, I don't know, $59. And I was like, oh, don't I wish Pal don't, I wish. but it led

to like a really good conversation of kind of explaining, Hey buddy, like not only do we have to pay the mortgage, we have to pay for the electricity and the water and the, you know, all

these other things. And he had no idea. And so I think it's really important to even just have those simple conversations, even when they're five years old. cause they're gonna, they're gonna start picking up those things and they see. Your kids see how hard you're working. My kids

see how hard I'm working and they, they really start to value money more so, and they see, Hey, dad and mom works really hard for that. I wanna do the

same thing when I get older. So,

would love to hear any other tips or tricks.

Dr. Erin Hudson: Yeah, I love that you touched on that. I've got a couple things that I will tell you that I think are great for listeners to hear is that, um, we're not meant to live comfortably like we're supposed to be comfortable, but we're not. Everything in our life is not supposed to be just sheer comfort.

A a few things with my kids. 'cause kids just really are what get me going. I will tell you. Also in that beginning stages when I was buying a, a single family rental properties, guys, it became a game. That's what I was getting at with, with the whole shopping at TJ Maxx. I'm sorry, I kind of lost you on that.

On that part is like, if we take every dollar off the table, it adds up. And when you're buying these $30,000 homes, we're able to acquire more. 'cause we're not buying the prettiest Nordstrom outfit. We're buying of, you know, three of these. Smaller little outfits or smaller houses, right? Like they're, we don't need, it's not to feed our ego.

We don't need to have this beautiful investment property. We don't wanna be slumlords, but we just need to be able to acquire. So at a very, uh, when the kids were at a very young age when all this was going on. They would ask for stuff at the store and I would say, no, I'm sorry. That's not a wise choice.

And they, I will never forget my child at 11 years old saying, oh, why? 'cause you just wanna go buy another investment property. And I laugh about it because I'm like, I love that. That's what they're saying and that's what they're thinking, right? But guys, it doesn't matter. How much money, you know, even if you start to make a ton of money, you still want to be making sure that you're doing all of those things and you're not going, oh my gosh, let me just go live lavishly.

'cause I built it. So like for example, I, you know, I've just moved into a new house. I wanted something smaller. I've got, you know, the 4,300 square foot home that also had a mother-in-law suite. And when I was living in there, and I hate to go there, but look, I went through a three year wild, crazy divorce and I'm living in this house and every dollar just matters anyways, right?

But I have this mother-in-law suite and uh, I ended up putting a tenant in there and I ended up renting it out. And my kids go, what in the heck? That's the mother-in-law suite. What are you doing renting? Now guys, get your fillers and thinkers out there. This was 275 square feet, tiny. With its own little kitchenette bathroom.

I was renting it for a thousand, $25. It was the most beautiful teaching moment to tell my children. Why would I let that thing just sit there? I don't have a mother-in-law or whatever that needs to go move in there. If I can make that sucker churn and bring in cash. So the thousand dollars that I brought in, well guess what?

I showed them that that was the payment for the rent for my daughter's school, right? So I'm like that. Is paying for that. Right? And so it becomes an absolute teaching opportunity for them that they've always got to be thinking like that. How can we make that make money? How can we duplicate that? How can we make it our bitch?

Dr. Alex Schloe: Love

Dr. Erin Hudson: like, how can we get it to go right?  And so anyhow, one other thing that I will share with you that was really powerful. Look, getting into the multifamily space, my kids couldn't really easily get into that, right? My oldest daughter, she's 27 now. She bought her first, uh, single family rental property in Indianapolis at the age of 16.

Okay, well, how did we do that One? Let me just tell you the story 'cause it's super cool. She was 16. She wanted a car. She only had $5,500 in her. No. Yeah, she had $5,500 in her bank.  And I said, listen, you can go get a rent, uh, a car, used car, or you could take that money that's in your bank. We'll put it in a Roth ira and I will give you, I'll sell one of these homes, these $30,000 homes.

To your Roth ira, I'll only make you pay $5,500 for it. So she got all mad and was like, I just want a new car. And I said, listen, just sleep on it and let me know what you decide in the morning. I don't care if you do or if you don't, but if you have your own car, you're paying for your own gas and you're paying for your own insurance and you can continue working out my practice right.

She wakes up the next day and she goes, okay, fine. I'll buy it with my Roth ira, like I'll pissy. And I was like, well, you don't have to. She's like, no, I want to because it's an asset. Like I know I need to. Right. So you're teaching 'em at a young age. So that was one. Well, then going into the multifamily space.

Guess what? The kids can't get in that space. So what did I do? We had, we had a home on five acres and it was an Airbnb and we buy everything with intention for multiple options. Right down at the bottom there was a pond down there and I wanted to put tiny homes down there and, and so we built.

Shipping container, tiny homes. And my kids had their own little, uh, Airbnb that was down by the ponds. And what I would do is they would be the one to manage that and greeting the guest and everything. And this was back in 2020 and they were greeting the guests and everything. And then. I said, listen, if y'all want payout, we're gonna do quarterly payouts, but I need a spreadsheet.

And then together we're gonna go through the dailies to make sure everything we gotta dot the i's, cross the T's and make sure they're accurate. My daughter at the time who's 14, my son was 15, my daughter who's 14, goes, mom, I don't know how to do an Excel spreadsheet. And my son, who's 15 goes. Oh, it's okay Taylor.

I'll do it for you, but there's gonna be a 5% fee of your earnings. So it just created this beautiful, like, it was always a challenge and who's is doing better? And it was like this around the dinner table of, you know, who, who's was outperforming, right? So there's always ways to get your, your kids involved.

And let me just tell you from the shipping containers at, you know, the three of them that we had there. It literally opened up a door because they were so successful. And then we went on to create 'em at the lake with 27 of 'em I have on Waterfront, and then by the wineries we've got another 15. And so it just birthed all this excitement and so there's just multiple assets in real estate that our family is in, and it's, it gets me, it lights me up to be able to talk about it with the kids.

Super fun.

Dr. Alex Schloe: That's so cool. Well, and they, they're learning a skill that really matters, that's really gonna translate, right? This isn't, this probably isn't something that they were getting, you know, or would not have gotten in public school if that's the case.

And so what a cool skill to teach them and, and show them the, the hard work that you're doing, but also

like bring them along on the journey.

And I think that they just absolutely love that. And no doubt that's gonna set them up for success and their kids up for success. And the, the whole. Family tree. So that is amazing.

 Well, Erin, I want be really respectful of your time. I could talk to you for like another hour easily. Um, but I wanna be respectful of your time.

What are, what are some of the biggest mistakes you see new investors make? And then I want to follow up with how folks can reach out to you.

Dr. Erin Hudson: Yeah. Nope. I think that  I would tell you probably the biggest thing is that, um. I like to say it like, a horse race. You've got the jockey, you've got the horse. And this is my analogy for it. I think that the general public that wants to invest, they tend to get tantalized by the horse IE the property.

It's in this beautiful area in Dallas. It's a 2025 build and it's so pretty, and then I think that they get tantalized by that, but they should be getting tantalized. By the operators, the company. IE we call that the jockey. So when you go to the horse races, you don't wanna be betting on the most beautiful horse.

You wanna be betting on that jockey because at the end of the day, the jockey's the one that gets that horse across the finish line.  And so, let's dig into that real quick, a little bit deeper. You want to make sure that the team that you are working with has a track record that is. Stellar. Yeah. They can go and buy 25 apartment buildings like we have.

But how many have we exited out of? We've exited out of 10 of 'em. What is the track record? Erin, what was your exit like? What was the actual return annually? How long were you in them? And you want to make sure that they have a great track record, but above. All, here's what I would say. You want to dig in, learn about that team, and when I send people to my website, I tell them, listen, I can talk numbers to you all day long, but what I would love more than anything is for you to go to our website.

Learn about our team, read their bios. You're either gonna get a feel good there that says, Ooh, this aligns. They're all about philanthropy. They help people that can't help themself and they support the vets or whatever it may be. You want to make sure there's alignment there because if there is alignment, then you check that track record and then it is a absolute yes.

So anyhow, that's the advice that I would give there because look, we have to understand that not just because we're educated, Alex doesn't mean. It's a tough craft to learn the ins and outs of everything. So you have to be reliant and have a trusting relationship with that person that you are looking to work with because it's not just for a short time.

Usually it's a five year, you know, that you become partners with. So you just wanna make sure you're working with the right crew that has good heart, has your best interest at hand, and they're not, uh, money hungry suckers. They're just ones that want to grow wealth and continue to do that year over year.

Dr. Alex Schloe: Love it. That is a great answer. Well, Erin, this was powerful. Thank you for showing us. You know what wealth is all about and it's more than numbers for sure, and

it's about that freedom and that legacy and the purpose, all of which you really embody. So thank you so much for that.  How can folks reach out to you if they wanna learn more, they wanna potentially invest with you, our partner with you.

Dr. Erin Hudson: Sure there's two ways. You can actually just go straight to our website, which I would encourage you.  it's the quatro way.com and that Quatro is, well, it's T-H-E-Q-U-A-T-T-R-O-W-A y.com. And then you can always find me on LinkedIn, Instagram, Facebook, Dr. Erin Hudson, or uh. Go there. That's probably best.

And listen, I will tell listeners, anyone that has questions and they would love to get on a call with me, I would be more than happy to give you 15 minutes of my time and we can just explore and see how we can help you move your needle forward, answer any questions you have, because if I help other people get what they want, I already get what I want.

And it's about sowing goodness into the world and being a resource and other people have helped me, so I'm here to help others.

Dr. Alex Schloe: That's awesome. Well, you've no doubt helped a lot of people today.  I really appreciate it. Thank you so much for your time.  And with that, it's been Dr. Erin Hudson. Dr. Alex Schloe with another episode of the Physicians and Properties Podcast signing off.

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