Batting Average Is Everything with Online Leads with Cleve Gaddis

Real estate success is about connecting with people. It's about understanding their needs, building trust, and being present when they need guidance.

In this episode, we chat with Cleve Gaddis, an Atlanta-based real estate expert with over 25 years of experience. Cleve’s a co-owner of Modern Traditions Realty Group, founder of a real estate investment firm, host of “GoGaddis Real Estate Radio,” and a real estate coach. 

He has been making waves in metro Atlanta real estate since 2000. Cleve works as a Co-Team Leader at Modern Traditions Realty Group, where he helps both clients and agents make smart decisions.

Cleve shares a fresh approach to leads— paying attention to clients who want to move but feel stuck due to market conditions. Learn how you can connect with them and build a deeper trust. He also emphasizes that quality conversations are far more valuable than a long list of cold leads. Every interaction has potential—even if it doesn’t turn into an immediate sale. 

Do you want to be someone who stays on top of the client’s mind when they’re ready to make their move? 

Listen to the episode now as Cleve will share actionable tips you surely won’t want to miss.

Specifically, this episode highlights the following themes:

• Understanding the real causes behind lead conversion challenges
• Strategies for turning seemingly low-quality leads into valuable opportunities
• The significance of providing tangible value in every interaction

Links from this episode:

• Listen to GoGaddis Real Estate Radio: https://gogaddisradio.com/
• Checkout Cleve’s website: ClevelandGaddis.com

1ae5b43598204883b524f061d4880e6d10fca88c (for podfollow.com)

Transcript

Cleve Gaddis [00:00:00]:
If we as agents stopped looking for people who wanted to buy or sell and were ready, willing and able to do that, and started looking instead for people who wanted to sell or wanted to buy, who felt stuck, it's way easier to find people who have a plan for doing something, meaning have a idea to do something, but they don't know how to do it. And so when we call somebody and they give us an objection, hey, I can't move forward because interest rates are too high. That in itself is something that is holding them back. That's easy for you to connect with them on, and then it's easy to offer a solution.

Matt Fagioli [00:00:43]:
Hey, guys, welcome back to the Doorify Real Estate Podcast. I'm your host, Matt Faggioli, and I have a special guest today. I always tell people it's old friend or somebody I've known a long time. I've known this guy. Oh, my gosh, I don't even know one at 30 plus years. Way beyond before real estate, for me.

Cleve Gaddis [00:01:01]:
Anyway, maybe even a little longer than that. Over 30 years.

Matt Fagioli [00:01:04]:
Oh, man, we're old. We're old. We're old.

Cleve Gaddis [00:01:07]:
We are.

Matt Fagioli [00:01:07]:
Guys, I want you to meet Cleve Gaddis. Cleve's been a top real estate broker for 25 years. But while he still operates a significant real estate franchise and team in the Atlanta market, he also is a coach to some major, major players across the country as one of the. The key operatives within the Workman organization. And I reached out to Cleve, I said, I'm looking for new ideas, new information to share with the members at Doorify about how to go rock their business in 2025. And he was like, man, I got it. So that was a long way to say. Hello, Cleve, how you doing, man?

Cleve Gaddis [00:01:48]:
Man, I'm doing great. Thank you very much for having me. Do you mind if we just jump right in?

Matt Fagioli [00:01:53]:
Yeah, dude, jump in. If we're gonna rock 2025, what are we doing, how we do it?

Cleve Gaddis [00:01:57]:
So, and this is. I wanna focus on something very, very specific. And, you know, there you. You know people like. I know people that are exceptionally good at providing service in real estate, meaning when a client gets saddled up with them, you know, they are into everything. They will fight for the client if they need it. They will do what needs to be done in order to make it work. And I know a lot of those people who have that mentality who should be able to make as much money as they want in real estate because they're so different than their average competitor and they have a hard time finding new clients.

Cleve Gaddis [00:02:30]:
And to me that doesn't make any sense. Meaning how can the people, and I hate to say this, we've got some, some people who are not the most honest and ethical in our business. But anybody who's been in the business for a while, we know that that's the case. We've got people in the business who don't have any scruples and they make plenty of money. And then you get somebody who can actually provide really, really, really great service that would be meaningfully important to the consumer and they have a hard time struggling. And so I started thinking what is causing that problem? And number one, in many cases they're not generating leads. And this conversation is more geared towards someone who is generating some leads. Maybe they're doing some Google pay per click or buying some realtor.com or something like that.

Cleve Gaddis [00:03:12]:
Maybe they've got one of the big high volume lead gen platforms and they're generating some leads. But what's interesting is from a motivation perspective, I as a real estate agent get more excited by somebody that I come in contact with who is ready, willing and able to move forward buying or selling a home. Now I know exactly what to do with those people. The issue is that's not where all the good leads are. All the good leads are the leads that flow through the system that say I'm not ready yet or I can't qualify because of interest rates or whatever it is. That's where all the money is. The problem is, is most agents, and I'm talking about those agents who have a good heart who could truly help people, they don't know how to move that process forward so they can get themselves totally connected with that consumer. And so I want to talk about the concept.

Cleve Gaddis [00:04:05]:
Do you have any questions you want to ask so far, by the way, I know I'm going a million miles an hour.

Matt Fagioli [00:04:10]:
Well, you know, I had the benefit of reading your notes about this, so I'm not sure if I'm jumping ahead or not. But I love the fact, you know, maybe I'm stealing your thunder, but I love the idea of just increasing the number of times that you're in front of people. And I know that's where you're going to take us. And I think that people, as soon as you start talking about leads and lead conversion, even if you're a person who does that, there's this sense of like, well, I kind of already know what I'm doing or I know what this is or this guy's not gonna have anything new to tell me. And they're not thinking about at bats. And so I hope that was helpful and not.

Cleve Gaddis [00:04:42]:
No, you totally, totally have it. It's how do we have a meaningful interaction with nothing between me and the consumer? Over zoom, face to face, whatever that looks like. How do I get them to know me? Because getting them to know me and getting them to know you, there's always that chance that they feel permanently attached to you. So when you think about it, if you did it correctly and somebody says, well, I'm not going to sell for three years, and you say, well, that's exactly the reason we should go ahead and meet, talk about this now, because you'll have time to get stuff done, things like that, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Well, once you and I meet together and I genuinely serve you, I give you something that you receive from me and you can benefit from with no strings attached, at the end of that appointment, I give it to you. And so that's the little concept that sparked a light in me thinking, wait a minute, when a consumer meets with us, there is a cost to them. I was doing some research recently and I came across something that is Adam's equity theory of motivation. And if you don't mind, I'm going to read this to you, which is boring, but I want to read it to you because it's fascinating to me.

Cleve Gaddis [00:05:50]:
It says, Adam's equity theory of motivation says that to be motivated, individuals need to perceive that the rewards they receive for their contributions are fair and the rewards are similar to those received by their peers. If individuals perceive their rewards are not fair, they will feel distressed and try to change things to create a sense of fairness. So Zillow lead comes in. I'm using that because that's the big elephant in the room. Customer wants to see a Property tomorrow at 10:00. Agent sets the appointment. Agent shows up for the appointment. Consumer doesn't show up, it's because they don't recognize the value they're receiving in that meeting.

Cleve Gaddis [00:06:30]:
Because, man, anybody that's smart enough to punch in a code on a cell phone can open a lockbox. And I'm not talking bad about our fellow real estate professionals. I mean, there's some great ones out there, but consumers don't look at it and say, I need you to get into that place. But they do need things from you. And so I thought about this. Let's just say I'm the consumer, you're the agent, you're setting an Appointment with me. There is a cost to me when you think about it. I have to invest time.

Cleve Gaddis [00:07:01]:
I have to invest in someone who may not. Now, you would be able to give me some great service, but if I met with 10 agents, not all 10 of them can give me great service. So there's a chance I could get hooked up with somebody, that won't be helpful for me. And most importantly, I have to let my guard down to let you inside once we meet face to face, which means Matt Fagioli might say, oh, well, I'm already in. I'm in. And you know what? I don't want a lot of people to think that they can just be in and take whatever time they want and things like that. You know, life is busy. And so when we set a meeting with someone, the value we provide must meet or exceed the perceived cost of the consumer.

Cleve Gaddis [00:07:49]:
And this happens with anything. And it's very simple. I can tell you got a question brewing, by the way.

Matt Fagioli [00:07:56]:
Well, I just always think about. For some reason, I always compare this initial engagement to walking onto a used car lot or a new car lot, for that matter. And that sense that you have in your mind that everybody can relate to, where you're like, man, okay, I'm gonna walk up on this guy, and he could be the greatest guy in the world, or he could be a bozo, and it's. It's a. It's a jump ball. And, you know, but I want this car, and I got to make this. You know, I got to take this risk. And then every word that comes out of that person's mouth for the next 60 seconds is going to determine the trajectory of the whole interaction.

Matt Fagioli [00:08:31]:
Right. And. Or value in that 60 seconds.

Cleve Gaddis [00:08:35]:
And if we wanted to be truly honest, you don't walk up to this person thinking he'll either be in the good camp or she'll be in the bad camp. You walk up to them, assuming they will be in the bad camp, meaning just. Just based on. And it's. It's just based on prior experiences. And so in order to get someone's attention, we must serve them regardless of whether or not we have an opportunity to move forward with them. So could I give you an example of how this might work?

Matt Fagioli [00:09:04]:
Absolutely.

Cleve Gaddis [00:09:05]:
So, and these are simple things, and I'm trying to keep my examples focused on items that agents would provide. Anyway, so, Matt, you and your wife want to see a property. I'm going to meet you tomorrow at noon. You seem to be motivated and ready to go, but I want to make sure that once I set that appointment, you get connected with me. Meaning where if something changes in your day, you're going to say to Sherry, hey, we really need to go, because Cleve's got this thing he said he's going to give us, and I want to make sure I go get it. So we got to make sure they are motivated based on the value. And so I might say something to you like, hey, Matt, when we meet tomorrow at 11 o'clock, take a look at that property on Mathis Street. I'll bring with me what I consider to be a secret weapon.

Cleve Gaddis [00:09:47]:
I'll bring an in the know neighborhood report that includes all of the market activity in Sunnyvale over the last 12 months. It'll include homes currently listed, homes currently under contract, homes closed, and homes that have been rejected by the market, which might be some real interesting opportunities. Would it be okay if I brought that and gave it to you tomorrow?

Matt Fagioli [00:10:07]:
Man, Cleve, I love. I just want to stop for a second, though, and go back to point out that there's such a difference between what you just did, which only took 30 seconds, and, hey, I'm gonna bring you this report right where there's. You just went through the detail to explain to me the value of this thing you're gonna give me and think.

Cleve Gaddis [00:10:28]:
About it for just one second. What did I promise to give you? A piece of paper, a CMA that I can run through the listing service. Just like that, I could maybe print out a copy of all the listings. So here's the deal. Every single person who's listening to this podcast already does things for their clients that other people do not do that are designed to really educate them. So all I'm talking about is selling in advance the things you're going to do for them anyway, so you don't even have to create anything new. Now, I called it the in the know neighborhood report because I need to name what it is. Because when I say, Matt, I'm going to bring you this report, then you start thinking, oh, okay, so the reality is he's going to give me something that I can take with me after the call and, and, or after we meet.

Cleve Gaddis [00:11:24]:
And that is very, very, very important. Can I give you another example on the buyer side?

Matt Fagioli [00:11:28]:
I'm not, I'm not done praising you. I'm not done praising you for this one and making sure that. Skip over how important it is. The, the words that you select and the detail that you go into in describing what this thing is. We've now Just spent five minutes talking about something that's dead simple, that we all take for granted, that, you know, you go, well, I'm gonna bring you this PDF and that's the end of the conversation. I even love, you know, you used a phrase, properties that have been rejected by the market. I've never heard anybody say that in 20 years. And that's just an expired listing.

Matt Fagioli [00:12:05]:
But, man, it sounded so much better the way you said it. And so wouldn't it be valuable here in this first week of January, if you agents who are listening to this, whether you're listening to the first week of January or the third week of January, whenever it is, if you took the time to script out the first time, because you know you don't want to sound scripted, of course, but what if you thought through everything? If nothing else, just go write down what Cleve just said and say it like that. But the value of thinking that all through. What am I going to call it? And what are the key phrases again? Anyway, I don't know if you comment anymore on that.

Cleve Gaddis [00:12:39]:
No. So you're exactly right. It is the naming of what you do that gives it the power. So I don't know. Matt, when you were just rocking and rolling, doing tons of transactions, did you ever get any phone calls at 10:00 at night about stuff that were really not important from clients who thought it was the end of the world?

Matt Fagioli [00:12:54]:
Absolutely.

Cleve Gaddis [00:12:55]:
And it's because we sell ourselves as the solution to their problems. We are, we are not the solution to their problem. The systems that we apply in our interactions with them, those are the solutions to their problems. And when you rely on a system instead of yourself, you can have a more balanced life. Can I? Let's go into one more example.

Matt Fagioli [00:13:16]:
Absolutely.

Cleve Gaddis [00:13:17]:
One more. Love this one. So you and Sher, we've set an appointment. Our plan is to meet tomorrow at 3 o'clock on Lake Street. So when we meet tomorrow at 3pm at the house on Lake Street, I'm going to bring with me what I call my Motivated Seller Index list. Okay. Now, I'm going to prepare specifically for you based on your geographic area and your criteria. It'll include a list of all homes currently listed where we believe the seller could be significantly more motivated than the average seller in the market.

Cleve Gaddis [00:13:50]:
And if any of those seem like a possibility for you, maybe we want to explore those as well. And I want you to think about the genius of how easy this is. You're going to provide a standard MLS search for the client's Preferred area, including only homes that have a recent price reductions, homes that have been on the market for longer than the market average market days on the market in the area, or homes that are back on the market. Because with all confidence, I can tell you that the day after a seller makes a price decrease, they have shown to the world, I am more motivated to sell my place.

Matt Fagioli [00:14:25]:
Mm, that's awesome.

Cleve Gaddis [00:14:27]:
Think about just called a motivated seller index. And I don't know about you, but the last time I went into the listing service, I pulled up, I said, show me all the homes in Sunnyvale. And it pulled up. All the homes in Sunnyvale, all the ones that had a recent price reduction were in a different color. So I just go click, click, click, click, click. And you can search for how long things have been on the market. So it's easy stuff to do. But what, how many, if you had to guess, how many other agents would offer something like that to a consumer?

Matt Fagioli [00:14:57]:
Well, they all would. They just wouldn't say it as well.

Cleve Gaddis [00:15:00]:
No. Again, no. Thank you for clearing that. So the truth is they. Let's, let's, let's further define that they would provide it to them without even mentioning the fact that they're going to do that. So they would leave out the offer of providing that. And I think you are absolutely right. We believe in, especially those of us who have been in the business for 25 years, we think that everybody already knows the things that we know because we know it all right? And the truth is nobody knows anything about what you think about real estate and the type of services that you can provide unless you tell them.

Matt Fagioli [00:15:40]:
Dude, that's so good. I want to go back to hit the punchline. I want to go back to the beginning because the biggest thing that I took away from the notes that you sent me about the conversation that we were going to have is this idea that the entire mindset is wrapped around the number of conversations that you're going to have. And what that excludes is I didn't take this crappy old Zillow lead that might be garbage. And a. I didn't go into it with that mindset. And baby, you didn't say anything about evaluating the quality of the lead. You just said, I want to go have a conversation with this person.

Matt Fagioli [00:16:18]:
And my thought is too, you don't have to be thinking about the quality of the lead if that person's willing to sit down and meet with you. And your perspective is, it might be three years from now. It's a quality interaction. If they're willing to show up and meet with you. It's a quality interaction. So your whole thing that you had laid out for me was about, well, what if you just thought in those terms? How many meetings am I going to have? How many quality conversations am I going to have?

Cleve Gaddis [00:16:45]:
Think about this. I remember four or five years ago, you called and said, hey, can I take you to lunch? And we ate lunch at the most amazing restaurant in Atlanta, Waffle House. And we met about halfway between where you live and where I live. And once you and I sat down and broke bread together, when you left, did you feel closer to me or more disconnected from me? I felt more connected to you. Even though I'd known you forever, I felt. I felt more connected. I feel like relationship was kind of revived. And for sellers, potential sellers and potential buyers, when you meet with them face to face, you are investing.

Cleve Gaddis [00:17:20]:
Especially way before they're ready to do something, you are investing in them without any regard for whether or not they do business with you. And that is in today's world, where we move so fast and most people are focused on themselves, even the best people out there are sometimes more focused on themselves than other people. It makes them feel like, hey, Cleve or Matt really poured into me, and I love the way that feels. And so now, after we've met in the first place and you send me, let's just say you send me an old drip email campaign that's not even any good. It doesn't matter to me because my connection with you is different. All I need to see is your name, and I have everything I need because it keeps you top of mind for me. So it's. When you think about.

Cleve Gaddis [00:18:05]:
You said something just a minute ago. You know, lower quality leads higher qual. And the truth is there's no such thing as low quality, high quality. It's just the timeframe for doing a transaction, which is what you were alluding to anyway, and I agree with that. But if we as agents stopped looking for people who wanted to buy or sell and were ready, willing, and able to do that and started looking instead for people who wanted to sell or wanted to buy, who felt stuck. If I just said to you, matt, I'm gonna give you a thousand phone numbers, and I want you to call all thousand of these people, and all I want you to find out is, do they have plans for real estate? And has the economy over the last couple of years put their plans on hold? What percentage of that thousand you think would say, heck, yeah, I'm stuck in this house, and I've been needing to move on for three years. And so it's way easier to find people who have a plan for doing something, meaning have a idea to do something, but they don't know how to do it. And so when we call somebody and they give us an objection, hey, I can't move forward because interest rates are too high.

Cleve Gaddis [00:19:10]:
That in itself is something that is holding them back. That's easy for you to connect with them on, and then it's easy to offer a solution. And I'll give you an example. You and I were having a conversation. This is make believe. I'm role playing here. A few days ago, said, you want to buy a house. You said, I can't afford to because interest rates are too high.

Cleve Gaddis [00:19:27]:
And then I say to you, hey, Matt, I don't know if you've ever heard about this system, but we have a system called the interest rate offset. Now, not saying that we can make this work for you, but the system will actually calculate the additional interest you'll pay over what you'd like to pay. And then it'll give us an idea that if we can offset that cost by a decrease in sales price, which is very possible in today's market or maybe through some consular sessions, if I could offset the first five to seven years worth of additional interest payments, would you consider moving forward? And that is so powerful because I'm taking something that we would do to educate people and help them understand, and I'm putting it in a system where I can give it to you to say, hey, or what about this? What about an appreciation offset? In most cases, especially in North Carolina, houses are appreciating enough so that the even someone who pays more money in interest than they want to, they wind up in a better position at the end of the year because they paid 2% more than they wanted to an interest. But the house appreciated 5. But we don't give them those things to help them move forward. We all know them. Everybody out there knows them. In fact, most people who are listening to this podcast could probably talk about it more genuinely, even better than I can.

Cleve Gaddis [00:20:43]:
It's just they don't have that tool, they don't have that resource or that mindset to move it forward.

Matt Fagioli [00:20:49]:
Man, that's so good. Well, it's all about perspective, and you gave us some fresh perspective for the new year. So, Cleve, I really appreciate you being on the Doorify real estate podcast, my friend.

Cleve Gaddis [00:20:59]:
It was my pleasure. And I'll come back anytime you want.

Matt Fagioli [00:21:02]:
I'll see you back here soon. Bye, y'all.