One Year In Portugal: An Unfiltered Recap

19 - In this episode of The Language Experiment, Kaisa and Camillo sit down to reflect on their family’s first full year of living in Portugal. From leaving Canada to navigating cultural surprises, adjusting to a new environment, and balancing multiple languages at home, they share the highs, the challenges, and the lessons learned along the way.

Discover what it really feels like to uproot a multilingual family, how language dynamics shift in a new country, and why Portugal turned out to be the right choice for them. Whether you’re curious about expat life, raising bilingual kids, or simply love honest storytelling, this episode offers a refreshing behind-the-scenes look at their journey.

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Transcript

Kaisa: 0:01

Hello and welcome to another episode of The Language Experiment.

Camillo: 0:06

Hey everyone, welcome back.

Kaisa: 0:08

So this episode is called Our First Year in Portugal, the Unfiltered Recap. So actually we decided to, do this kind of a casual episode where we're just chatting between the two of us and, talking a little bit about how our first year in Portugal has been. So actually now it's been one year and one month that, since we moved here.

Camillo: 0:32

Yeah. I think it's gonna be interesting to give this little perspective to everybody that is listening to us to understand how the change have impacted po potentially the languages around our families, the kids, and so forth.

Kaisa: 0:50

let's talk a little bit about how it all started. So just a little recap of why we decided to move from Canada to Portugal the main reason was that we wanted to be closer and more accessible to our family. So Camillo's family lives in Brazil and my family lives in Finland. And, when we were living in Canada, we were pretty far from both of our families. And while my family was able to visit us. Every now and then Camillo's family was not able to visit us at all. So there were, of course, other factors as well, such as the pandemic that changed a lot of both of our families', travel plans and things like that. And then after the pandemic was over, the flight prices had just soared. So it was very difficult to, to find, reasonably, priced flight tickets.

Camillo: 1:49

Yay. On top of all the difficulties the pandemic ended up bringing. Our parents are not getting younger, right? So the long flights were actually really challenging for them. For them. it was getting really tiring to, to be able to, your parents, for example, to visit us more often is not getting, easier to anyone, not even for us to actually get the family and leave Canada to VA to visit either Finland or Brazil. So we, we were looking for something that would make sense from the family point of view, from our immediate family point of view perspective, such as we need to move to a country where the girls, need to adapt, but the level of adaptation shouldn't be too high. Also for us to the point that we didn't want to move to a country where everybody in the family would have to learn a new language and adaptation would become way more, difficult than it should be.

Kaisa: 2:49

Mm-hmm. Yeah. That was an important factor for us. So of course it is possible and, and we can see that a lot these days as well. There are many people from all over the world moving to different countries, especially Portugal, and many of these people don't speak the language at all. So they start learning before they relocate or they start learning only when they get to that country. And while it is doable, I think it, it is definitely much more challenging and depending on what the language of that country is, the level of challenge also varies. And I think Port Portuguese, while it's not the most difficult one based on other people's experiences, it's also not the easiest.

Camillo: 3:33

Yeah, absolutely. And I think on, on our configuration, our family's configuration, Portuguese was already part of it, so we kind of eliminated, this, or no, we didn't eliminate because the two Portuguese are different and you have to navigate through those differences and adapt to those differences. But we eliminate a major part of it. And what we didn't want to, to have to go through was because all this adaptation with language was already being done in Canada because of our main language. And when I say our main language, my, you and myself. The girls were leaving the community language within French and learning. And, and, if you watch my interview with, Philip, on the past episode, you see that, you'll see that he says that the French you learn in the Portuguese, you catch, and the girls were catching this English, while living in Montreal. But we were doing the adaptation at home with, with Portuguese and Finnish. So to move to Germany, for example, we have another, adaptation that we need to go through. We didn't want that new one. So although we have, within our listeners families moving to a completely different country where nobody speaks the language, and if this is your first move, we will never discourage you to do that. We have, we already did that, but we didn't want to do it again.

Kaisa: 5:05

That's right. Yeah. I think there were a lot of challenges anyway, so we were definitely looking at a country where some of the language related concerns would be somehow alleviated or that we would be relatively prepared for that change already. So yeah, I'd say that was the main factor for moving and choosing Portugal out of all the countries that we could have chosen. So then thinking about the early days after we moved, what are some of the things that come to your mind? Some of the surprises, the challenges,

Camillo: 5:47

to me, I think, I was, I was really well adapted to Canada. I've never felt, Too different there maybe because of my own personality. And when I came to Portugal, what I, what, I think what struck me the most was how similar everything was from Brazil. And, what I'm saying is not even the, the Portuguese society itself, it's more like the environment around me is. the architecture for obvious reasons, the architecture are really similar to, to the Brazilian, setup. And, people here, although they're a little bit more closed, they're way more open than the, the Nordic countries. And we see that when we go, to a restaurant where everybody speaks to us, but also with the kids. And they're really, they're way more touchy. They like to, to, touch the kids on their hands and tap them and kind of tickle them and say, Hey, how you doing? So these kind of things where the difference more the, the, the, the biggest difference for myself, is, is kind of give a step back when it comes to the surroundings, because Canada absolutely doesn't look like Brazil at all. And when you come back, you kind, I was kind of feeling that, oh, I'm, I'm back where. I used to be. And then once you start living the Portuguese Society and interacting with the Portuguese people, then you, then that's when you see that indeed they are different. But at the same time, there's a lot of things that I could identify and kind of recognize, oh, that's why we do things like that in Brazil. It's because it comes from here. We just, I dunno, we just put a little bit of different seasoning on the behavior or something like that.

Kaisa: 7:47

That's funny. So you could recognize the heritage.

Camillo: 7:50

Yeah, absolutely. I, I can, I can absolutely understand, a lot of Brazilian behavior, after living here in Portugal. And, and it's not that they're equal. I understand, for example, that the Portuguese people are way quieter than the Brazilian people are in general. But at the same time, you see things that at, I don't know, some, some, some things that, how they deal with, let's say a specific problem within society and the Brazilian people do, and you kind of, oh, I understand where, where this comes from. If it's bureaucracy, if it's if it's traffic, if if it's the, the line of the supermarket. I can see these traces then. And then I'll be, oh, I understand why we do the way that we do. I understand why we adopted this kind of behavior. And of course, like I said, it's ob for obvious reasons. And yeah, it was just weird for me to come back to this.

Kaisa: 8:50

I bet. Yeah. For me, the early days, the early months, I don't even know if I remember what happened during the first months because it was a time of just. Major overwhelm and there was, there were so many things to take care of and we were so tired from the, from the move and the preparation that had lasted for a long time, several years. And then once we got here, there was more stuff to do and in a strange environment. And, yeah, it was definitely pretty overwhelming. But then on the other hand, I also started noticing some things that were similar to me. So certain supermarkets or certain ways of doing things that actually reminded me of Finland or reminded me of Europe overall. But then the majority of things for me were definitely new. I think Finland and Portugal are very different in many ways. They're almost the more, almost the opposites if you think on the scale of, of Europe. They're very opposite in, in many things. But I think there are also some similarities. Like you said, Portuguese people are a bit different from Spanish or Italian people. They're a little bit more melancholic, they're a little bit more quiet, and those are very Finnish traits. so I found that, I found that interesting. but overall, I think during the early days and I still feel that, yeah, Portugal still feels very exotic to me and at the same time familiar because, because it's Europe.

Camillo: 10:31

Do you think Portugal could be a Southern Finland?

Kaisa: 10:35

That would be nice. I think a lot of Finnish people would really appreciate that. So, the next thing that I was thinking is, of course, it's hard for us to talk on behalf of our kids, but what do you think was the, was our kids' perspective on Portugal, especially in the beginning?

Camillo: 10:52

I had this conversation a few times with our six years old one, and I was asking her what she thinks about Portugal, in different. Times of our move. In the beginning, she would say that she didn't like it and she, she would say that she wanted, she missed, Canada. She wanted to go back. She missed her friends. And most of the sentiment, I understand it was because of her friends. She was, right in the beginning of this social life, this, this self-identification of social life. Right. Go. She had moved from daycare to school. She had, although she was in preschool, she was still in this, she was already in this school environment. That would be the first school of her first cycle. So she was already getting familiar with teachers and the environment and the facilities. So everything was being born. And then we moved her. to a new, completely d sorry, a completely new place. Understandable that she would feel like that. But then months were passing and she started the new schooling, past September, and she started to make new friends and she started to, to go through all those changes that are expected. And one day I asked her again, so, do you like Portugal? How are you feeling? And she said, that she really liked her new friends. She really liked the school and, and that, and that was, was already a com a hundred percent change from the first, from the first answer. Then I don't know what, what happened. We were talking about similar stuff and. I think I said that I miss Canada at some point, and this was another day and she said, oh, I, I also miss Canada. but you know what, dad? I really wanted to go to Canada, but my school should be this one. I wanted this school with my friends in Canada. So you see that on this answer? She kinds of, yeah, still misses Canada was where she was born and she was, starting her social life there, going to friend's house after school or during weekends. But at the same time, she already started adopting the new country and now she already prefers the school in Portugal with the friends in Portugal because that's where she spent most, of her time now. interacting with them, playing with them, going to play dates and birthday parties. You see that the social life is being built, her mind is changing. She still loves where she's from, but she loves to be here.

Kaisa: 13:47

Yeah, that's, that's really true. And one year is a relatively short time, because I mean, we were six years in Canada and then here in one year we can see that she has already started laying down her roots. And of course the progress is going to be slow. It's gonna take multiple years. But I think this is a very good start. And I agree. I think we've found a great school and a great take daycare for them. And what has made the adaptation really easy is that we have met so many nice people, not only from their school and daycare, but also from the Finnish community, from our neighborhood, and just all over the area where we live. And there are all kinds of activities and events. There are actually way too many for us to attend 'cause we also need to relax sometimes. But there's always a place where we can go, like some kind of an event for kids or a festival or something else, and we can go there and meet new people or meet people that we already know. And this is, this is very special, I think. And it's, it's something that didn't exist in the same way in Canada. And then also our girls are both one year older. So also the social socialization and how they make friends and how they, how they become more, I guess, outgoing and brave. That also changes. So I think both of our girls. They are, they're a bit shy and they were definitely shy in Canada. But I think the level of shyness has shifted this year. And part of it is, is that they are growing older, they're learning new things, they're being exposed to different things. But definitely another aspect is this amazingly warm community and amazingly welcoming people that we have met. I think that has helped a lot.

Camillo: 15:57

Absolutely. And, just trying to switch a little bit back to the, to the topic of the podcast, how that, influenced, our six years old language, for example, is also part of this adaptation.'cause I can see already, it's been a while, but I can see already she, completely adopting the European Portuguese language. And her accent is changing the terms that she used. they, they are changing. She's adapting way too well. So, so basically, if by any chance you're listening to this episode for the first time, sorry if by any chance you're listening to the podcast for the first time and you picked up this episode. I always, spoke Brazilian Portuguese to my kids since we live in Canada, and Kai has always picked Finnish. So her Portuguese was Brazilian to the point that when she started school here in Portugal, the kids asked her if she was Brazilian and she said, no, my dad's Brazilian. Okay, but you come from Brazil. No, he comes from Brazil. I come from Canada. I am Canadian. And that just messed up the other kids' brains because they kind of, why are you, why are you talking about, do you speak Brazilian portu? And now I can see her using the pronouns that they use here for specific, situations. I can see that she started to name, things differently such as buses. She was talking to me about taking the bus now to going to our school event and instead of using the Portuguese term, which is bu, she used otca, which is what they use here in, in Portugal. the same for vans we use, we just got the English word and we call it van in Brazil, but he or she says, and this really shows how well and easily she started to adapt to her environment, adapt to the new language. yeah, the, the, the accents changing. The rs are, are, are rolling a little bit more. So it's, it's interesting to, to see it to the point that I, I'm already suggesting to, I already suggested to her so we can switch. I would speak French, so I don't want to lose my French. she, initially she was a little bit, on the negative side for that. Afterwards, after we received Canadians from Quebec here where everybody speaking French, she got interested again. She started to sing some, some, some songs in French. So I think I need to pick up that hook and fly with it.

Kaisa: 18:47

Mm-hmm. Yeah. And I think now we finally, well we made a lot of friends during this year. But it has mostly been other internationals, Portuguese people, Finnish people. But, I think now we, we might have a couple of potential friends, new friends who, who are from France, so that would be, that would be pretty exciting. So maybe we can have some play dates where we all only speak French and, yeah, let's see how it goes from there. And, speaking of the kids' perspective, so for our younger one who is now three years old, I think, well her, her, her perspective is a bit of a mystery, but, I can see that she is starting to understand the different places. So she knows that before we were in Canada, now we are in Portugal. And during Easter I was able to take a two week trip to Finland with the girls. So. So, although she has been, they have both been in Finland before, but for our younger one, this is definitely the first time that, that she, she knows that she's there and the first trip that maybe she can remember when she's older. And there we saw my parents and other family that they are familiar with. So, so now she, yeah, now, now she understands that different countries exist and now we live in Portugal and but we can also go to Finland and Canada. But then sometimes it's funny because when we are here at home and suddenly you go to the supermarket or you leave the house, and then she asked me, where's papa? did he go to Canada? Well, no, no, no. He, he just went to the store, so, yeah, so, so it's, it's sort of still the, the perspective is not, not fully there. And also I think even for our older one, like now they, they think that we can just decide to go to Canada this weekend and, and we can just do it. So we try to explain to them like, well, it's, it's, it's not that easy. It's not that close and we need some planning and we need to take vacation and this kind of stuff. But,

Camillo: 21:04

well maybe when we buy our private jets, we'll be able to do it.

Kaisa: 21:06

Yeah. Maybe, maybe when our financial situation changes drastically, it'll be different. But, yeah, so, so it is interesting that. They are starting to have this perspective of, of the world. And of course we are often studying, studying maps and showing them where the different countries are. So it's, it, it's really interesting. But I think, so far, even for our younger one, I think she really likes it here. She enjoys it and I can see how she's also opening up, she's speaking more, her speeches is developing. I mean it's developing at its own pace, so definitely a little bit, slower than for our firstborn. But she speaks Portuguese, she speaks Finn. We still read to her in French every now and then. And she's definitely starting to dabble more with English as well. So if they watch tv, they listen to music often there's some English there. And yeah, I think what has really helped. Us keep the finish going in the family is that, yeah, we've been able to go to Finland. My parents have visited us multiple times. We are very involved in the Finnish community. So Finn School in Lisbon is every other Sunday and I think we are there almost every time. So we have, we have met all these finished families and other Finn speaking kids and that has really helped. And also just outside of finished school, we do birthday parties, play dates. We even did a little trip in June, together with everyone who goes to finish school. So I think all of this, all of this is just amazing exposure that maybe we didn't necessarily have in Canada.

Camillo: 22:55

yeah, and I think our listeners can see that we. We really try to do, and we live by what we oftentimes comment here in a podcast. It's what we try to do with our kids is basically what we are trying to shine a light on when it comes to multi language, children, multilingual, sorry, multilingual children. It's, it's the, the adaptation is the mix of strategies is to understand their environment and see where the kids will sh will shine more and try to adapt. That strategy is trying to build communities where time and place takes place. it's, it is the Sunday on the finished school. it's the, the, the time that we read in French is in and so forth. So even when I'm reading French, the kids, I don't comment on the books in Portuguese, you comment in French, it's the French time at that, at that specific time. So we. We are always trying to adapt to the situation. We're always trying to adapt to the place that we are, the people that are surrounding us this way, they always feel confident. They, they don't feel shy when I speak in French or when I ask them to speak in French because, well, dad is speaking French right now. Why can't I speak French? Why can't I answer? And suddenly, when we had, people in the house speaking French, you can see their, their eyes shining and look at it and just waiting for that opportunity to give their opinion also in French and, and, and was great to see. I didn't know what to expect after almost a year. but it was great. And it kind of sparked that little flame of curiosity to the point that now we were asked. To read the books in French. Oh, can you read my, my, this one in French and the all that because of those little interactions and strategies that you go around and put in place.

Kaisa: 25:01

It's true. Yeah. And I, I'd like to say that as exhausting as this whole process of relocation has been, so it was multiple years of research and planning and then execution, then the actual move. And I would say that now one year in, it's still not over, we're still in the process of adapt adaptation. We're still in a process of putting our house and our life together here. So we still have some unpacked boxes. We're still missing a lot of furniture. And, these things just don't happen fast. and especially when you have two, two kids and you work full time, it is not easy to make anything happen fast. And I would say that most days we are pretty tired. but this LA language, so speaking our own languages and trying to keep the exposure for the other languages. So English and French is something that we have ingrained in our life so deeply that we don't consider that extra work is just something that's part of our family. And, we will, we will keep it up and we're not even considering it as this extra work. So most other things are extra, but that's something that's just part of our life and, we'll, we'll keep going with it. And we hope that the children are perceptive to it. And so far they have been.

Camillo: 26:32

Absolutely. This is our life I'm not considered as an extra part of our life. And you mentioned, for example, the, the, the English and French and I, I think it's interesting for people to see what we mean on what we mean. Well at least an, a result of all these strategies. English for example, wasn't the language of choice back in Montreal. French was the, the community language school, daycare. And when we were on the streets, at least when I was looking for services and we go to restaurant, I was always speaking French because work, my work, our work is in English, so I didn't want to get rusting in French, so that means outside of the house, I'm going to speak French because I need to exercise. That's my personal thing. And English was always being worked on because my work's in English, and we speak English between ourselves, but what that mean to our kids, we have our six years old, for example, where English was picked up based on our dialogues, since we don't speak English direct to her based on potentially music or some cartoons that she watching every now and then. Great. We go to, someone else's party and that person speaks English and then we are always, always interacting in English. So these kind of English is the English that she was used to. Then we move to Portugal and everything surrounding the community. Portuguese, she starts first cycle and one of the subjects is English. And she finds boring. She finds boring because on the first cycle and the first year they were, they are starting here, learning English and to her was too easy, wasn't challenging, and she came back home complaining because she wasn't speaking English already and was to me. It was amazing to see that coming from her. We had to talk to the school and the teacher, and afterwards they came out with a plan. It would be a little bit more challenging for her. So can she can be a little bit, she can engage more with the content and she's doing great. All based on the English that was picked up We never spoke English to our kids. We never had this, oh, you are in a French school here, but I'm going to put you in an English course, in parallel because I want you to learn English. She learned from the specific bubbles that we would insert her as a, let's say as a passive listener while we were in friends' houses, while she was listening to you and me talking in the house while she was listening to music or watching something. And then she goes to school and for the first year she's just crushing it.

Kaisa: 29:43

It's true. It's true. Yeah. I think that's, that's been interesting, like now seeing her test results at the end of the year and throughout the year on, in, in first grade, is that Well, she's, she's doing great overall. She's getting the best grades in, in all the subjects, but what impressed me the most is that her Portuguese and English are excellent. so that, that makes me feel that we made the right choice. And, because of course, like I was ready to, I don't know if it was, I was expecting, but I was ready to accept that she would have challenges with Portuguese because it's a different kind of Portuguese. And, you know, she has, she has always spoken Portuguese. You have always spoken Portuguese to her, but. She didn't have the Portuguese community. So essentially the kids that she's now studying with, they should, they should be ahead. And I guess in some way they are ahead of her in the language, but at least based on how she's doing in the classes, the way that she is writing, the way that she's reading and her test results, it does not show any signs of her being behind at all. And she's actually ahead of some people. So I guess that just speaks of the effectiveness of our strategy on you speaking in Portuguese to her since birth. And of course, I'm sure there's a factor. I'm sure it is a factor that she's a person who is good with languages and really likes languages, so that definitely helps as well.

Camillo: 31:20

Yeah. And on that, on that, comment on the being, either, Behind on Portuguese. I've noticed that on the academic Portuguese, meaning the grammar that you're being taught in school, the exams that you need to go there, she is, basically native, right? She, she goes on a Pluses and A's and, and the same as the Portuguese kid that was born and raised here. And then when it comes to. Being behind the Portuguese, I've noticed that she's behind on the day-to-day Portuguese on that cultural Portuguese, which comes with the references that she didn't have in the beginning because she was in Canada. So a lot of things that she comes to me and sometimes she asks, I noticed that I was because of a specific cartoon or specific, figure from tv or was Christian Ronaldo that does something and then in school, all the kids, they do it. So these kind of cultural references is where her part is, is lacking for the moment. But at the same time, after a year, I started to notice that she comes to me with a reference that I don't pick up because the kids are talking about something in school that happens in the Portuguese, kids' culture. I'm not part of it. I'm never been part of that. So sometimes I missed out on something that I, I, I need to ask her, what it is. But from the academic point of view, she's really good to the point that we had her, the school had this, reading competition, and she went all the way to the final and she didn't go to the final itself because she's really shy. The final would be on this, improvised stage where all the classes would be there watching people reading texts. And her teacher came to me and said that, Hey, she's not there today, because she didn't want to go. She was too shy, but we had to find a replacement. And she had commented that, the day before, two days before with us here in the house, that she didn't want to go, that she was shy, that she didn't feel good. We tried to have some sort of incentive for her saying like, Hey, this is great. But when I was talking to the teacher, I said basically this part of, the conversation that I had with us that I had with her. And I said, look, you were born in Canada. You learned Portuguese, from talking to dad and reading some books that we had, and you were already getting to the final. Competition of reading in Portuguese in a country where Portuguese is the mother tongue and you, you are not born and raised here. This is amazing. And the teacher was encouraging her as well based on like, yeah, this is great. And I think that these shows how, how much she loves languages, how much she pays attention, how much she wants to, to understand it, and all the question that comes. But also that if you stick to a strategy and really want, your kid to speak any language, and if you dominate that language, if you are the best teacher who can be.

Kaisa: 34:43

Exactly. so thinking about everyday life here now, we have more or less fallen into a rhythm of where the girls go to school and daycare, where we work and we receive guests every now and then. Actually quite often. And during weekends, we hang out with friends, go to birthday parties, go to play dates or different kind of activities. I think something that feels feels super normal now that didn't really feel normal before is that I definitely feel that we are less isolated than in Canada. And I'm not quite sure where that feeling of isolation came from. So of course, one part was that we didn't have family nearby, and that basically hasn't really changed because we are not in Finland, we're not in Brazil. So our families have better access to us and they've been able to visit, but they are not here on a daily basis. But somehow I don't feel as isolated as I did in Canada at all. And of course, I think one reason is that, again, our kids are older because when you have little kids or little babies, that tends to be. Really isolating. So you are not able to go to places and do things and see people in the same way and you're much more tired than you, than what you normally would be. But then I think one thing that I notice here compared to Canada is that normally during the weekend if you don't have anything to do and you just text or call someone and suggest that maybe we should all go to the beach or to the park or anything, I feel like everybody's generally available. So I feel like we're doing so many more social things here than we were in Canada and whereas in Canada, I feel like many people were either too exhausted from the week to, to do anything during the weekend. And I feel like that was our case too, somehow, or sometimes. That you would just have to catch up with everything at home during the weekend and catch up on anything house related. And then another thing was that a lot of people were totally wrapped up in the scheduled activities during the weekends. And of course I think here people also do activities, but I see that way less so. I feel like people's schedules are way less full and kids' activities are much less scheduled than in Canada.

Camillo: 37:32

Yeah, I think part of it, makes sense due to, let's say geography itself. the weather during most time of the year invites you to go outside, although during the winter, the Portuguese people, they don't go outside often because to them it's cold. And us it's not, and we want to be outside and if it's rains, we want to be there. But also I think, the way that our life changed. in Canada when we had kids, like you said, you get, small kids who are more restricted on movement and you are more tired at the same time. When our first one was getting into the age that we would be able to have an activity, active, let's say young parents' lifestyle, the pandemic hits. So we stay two years, virtually two years without being able to move around doing what kids' parents do. Then we come back afterwards, we are trying to adapt the new life, whatever new was, and you have the responsibilities that start like, the first year, for example, when we thought that we would have our kids, our, our, our daughter in the, in, in the daycare, then you have basically no daycare. Then it comes back. And you have a different adaptation. And so all that, mix of things allied to the fact that you are in a different country away from your family and your family cannot visit. I think I have this feeling of isolation a little bit more, let's say out there. And, and it's not necessarily the, the truth, but was our truth. And now when you come to Portugal with a five years old, turning six, turning seven, really soon, then the, the two years will become three years old. So it's kind of, it's more, you have more time and you have more access to things. Family comes visit way more often. Friends that we made in Canada. Come to visit us. So it kind of, the locals that we would hang out on the weekend, they're coming, they're crossing the ocean to visit us. Our family are visiting us more European friends that wouldn't go to Canada for any given reason, they are go, they're now coming here because it is closer. I think this feeling of, interaction and socializing is higher because of those reasons. We, we are now in a place where we didn't know anyone, but we have at least three different countries where people come from to visit us.

Kaisa: 40:28

It's true. Yeah. And I feel like here also because the culture is slightly different, like you mentioned before, people are much more open to kids and interacting with kids. So here it's easy to go anywhere with our kids, whether it's the Carnival party, whether it's, so we recently went to this place called, KidZania in Lisbon, which is a place where this kind of like indoor place where kids can role play different professions and they can learn the KidZania, they can earn KidZania currency for doing these different jobs. And, Just in a place like that, you, you strike up a conversation with some couple and their kid and, this happens to us everywhere, whether it's at the park, whether it's at the grocery store. So I feel like especially Portuguese people sometimes are just looking for a way to start a conversation and, it often starts through our kids. So I think, people are very eager to interact with you and, and it's nice. I think it's, it's a good way to socialize our kids and make them more brave in using their Portuguese and, and making friends and, and things like that.

Camillo: 41:49

This episode is not sponsored by Kazana, but Kazana, if you're listening to us, we are open.

Kaisa: 41:55

So I guess to wrap up this conversation, maybe, is there anything that we've learned during this first year? I mean, of course there's, there's lots, but maybe something that would specifically have to do with multilingual parenting. Any kind of insights from our first year?

Camillo: 42:20

I think, insights themselves, let, let's say new insights. I, I don't think I had the time to think about it actually, but like I said, a few moments ago, I think this move, this ear, gave me the confirmation that sometimes, Whenever we're talking about these strategies, I had this a little bit of doubt when I was talking about the strategy because I was already established in a place and I had the, basically the, the plan in front of me. I just had to to follow. So when I was talking about strategy, and even when we're talking about conversations on the streets with people, friends, talking about the podcast and talking about all those, different strategies that we are, that we are discussing the podcast, we also had this, this thing of, eh, but I'm not moving. Right? it's different from some questions that we see online. And now I did move and I did move, and I can actively work on the strategist from scratch from this perspective of I was. Already in a stable condition, and I made a move that brought chaos. How do I fix things? How do I move from point A to point B? And I, I don't lose quality on the, on the subject, whatever subject it is, if it's finished, if it's Portuguese, and so forth. And day after day, I started to see the, the strategies being put in place and the, the bubbles being formed and the kids being comfortable whenever we we're, we were, on those situations. I, I don't have new insights, but I can say that there's no single strategy for you to, to, to adopt and follow. It's always about, no. What those strategies are and apply them based on your own situation. Don't go. I, I would say don't go to any, don't, don't follow any kind of advice. That is, you know what, oh, Paul is the strategy to be and follow nothing else works, or time and place is the, there's no single strategy. our brains are completely, different. Our kids are different from ourselves. Environments are different. Try to apply several different strategies based on your life.

Kaisa: 45:14

Mm-hmm. Yeah. I, I completely agree. And I think, what I've learned this year is that when making a big move and this kind of a big life change where it's not only you but it's also your family, your kids, I think planning is so essential. And I think that's one part where we, we put, we put a lot of effort into planning and thinking about what it is that we want to do in several aspects. Not only in terms of language, but also in terms of where we want to live and why and what kind of school we want our kids to go to and all these, all these other things. There are a lot of tiny and a lot of really major decisions and we didn't take any of those decisions lightly. We really thought a lot about them and even when some of our decisions were, Let's say unpopular or when we told other people about them, they said that we were crazy. So I would say a couple of examples were that we decided to buy a house remotely, site unseen in Portugal. Instead of renting somewhere for a while, most people told us that we were absolutely out of our minds, but we knew that it was the right decision for us. And while it wasn't easy, it was definitely the right decision. and always try to make decisions based on your situation and not based on what other people think is good or bad or, or normal or abnormal. So good planning and very thoroughly thinking through these important life decisions based on your family needs is really important. And this whole experience has just solidified that, And, of course it would, it would be easy to just say like, yeah, whatever, we'll, we'll decide on that later, or. Whatever, we'll do this now and then in a year we'll see how we feel when it comes to these big life decisions. Maybe it's not the best approach. Okay. So I think that's a good recap of our year and we would like to say to our listeners, thank you so much for sticking it with us and thanks so much for your messages and emails that we always receive and, sometimes. When we're still in the thick of it and still in the middle of putting our life together here. Sometimes it is challenging to stay motivated and keep, releasing episodes, but all those messages from, from you really give us a lot of inspiration. so please keep them coming. If you have any questions, if you have any comments, if you have ideas for future episodes or interviews that you'd like to hear, please let us know. Our contact information is gonna be in the show notes. and that's it. Any last words from you, Camilo.

Camillo: 48:22

Thank you and we'll see you in the next episode.

Kaisa: 48:24

Bye-bye.