#65 | How Rock-It Moves the FIFA World Cup & The World's Biggest Tours

The Rock-It Company has been the logistics engine behind the world's largest music tours for 47 years. Every stage you've ever stood in front of — odds are, they got it there. This summer, they're doing that and something else: serving as the official logistics partner for the FIFA World Cup 2026, the largest sporting event in world history, spanning three countries, 16 host cities, and 104 matches.

Giggs traveled to Los Angeles for an inside look at the people and systems making both happen at the same time.

What you'll learn:

• What the control tower really means — and why 16 cities require a system, not just people
• Why anyone can move cargo in ideal conditions — and what makes Rock-It different when they're not
• How music touring expertise translates directly to the World Cup
• What it looks like to run the world's biggest tours and the world's biggest sporting event simultaneously
• Why "failure is not an option" is the operating principle behind every decision this team makes
• The stories behind the motto: Manila customs prayers, a 747 emergency in Hawaii, Metallica in Antarctica

Learn more about Rock-It at https://rockitcompany.com/

Featured Voices:

Alex Becker — Senior Operations Manager, Worldwide Events
Alex Becker has spent 13 years at The Rock-It Company, working across compliance, music touring, and sports operations before rising to Senior Operations Manager for Worldwide Events. He's been inside the FIFA World Cup 2026 operation since day one and leads the Control Tower team — the system responsible for keeping 16 host cities, three countries, and a continent-wide web of shipments synchronized in real time.

Justin Carbone — EVP, Live Touring
Justin Carbone is the EVP of Live Touring at The Rock-It Company, where he's led the company's music touring business through some of the biggest years in the industry's history — including a 2026 Parnelli Award for Freight Forwarding Company of the Year. If your favorite artist has toured the world in the last six decades, there's a good chance Rock-It's team moved the gear that made it happen. He marks 20 years with the company this year.

Nancy Alvarado — Director, Live Events Special Projects Management
Nancy Alvarado is a 15-plus year veteran of live event logistics, operations, and project management — a CAPM-certified pro who has spent her career navigating high-pressure, high-stakes environments. She started at The Rock-It Company in 2008 as an entry-level operator, built her own book of business, spent time in Fortune 500 corporate events, and came back. She now works alongside Justin Carbone building the Next Gen program to develop emerging artists and the next generation of agents.

Stew Heathcote — President of Live Events
Stew Heathcote is the President of Live Events at The Rock-It Company, overseeing music, experiential, film, and television across Rock-It's entire family of brands. He came to Rock-It after two decades at AEG Presents, where he led global partnerships and helped launch the marketing campaign behind Taylor Swift's 1989 World Tour — including an Emmy-winning interactive experience. Billboard named him a Brand Power Player multiple times. Before that, he led marketing at the San Francisco 49ers.

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Host: Nikki Sanz

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:00

Welcome to Rocket, the official logistics partner for the largest sporting event in world history, the FIFA World Cup 2026. Welcome to the Gigs Podcast. I'm your host, Nikki Sands, founder and CEO of Gigs. And today we are highlighting Rocket, the company that has moved the world's largest tours for the past 47 years. Every major stage that you've ever stood in front of, odds are it was probably moved there by Rocket. But this summer, they're not only moving the largest tours, they're moving the FIFA World Cup across three countries, 16 host cities, and 104 matches. We are here in Los Angeles to find out what that actually looks like and meet the people making it happen. Let's get into it. Thank you for having us.

SPEAKER_05 1:26

You're very welcome.

SPEAKER_00 1:27

So we're standing in the Rocket warehouse right now.

SPEAKER_05 1:30

Yep.

SPEAKER_00 1:30

You are managing the control tower. What does that really mean? What are you managing?

SPEAKER_05 1:34

I'm basically managing a team that is the air traffic control of the project, is the analogy I would best use. So we're not physically flying the planes, we're not physically driving the trucks. It's many folks across our organization that are operating, that are moving the freight, and we sit as a layered approach on top of that to ensure that everyone knows as they are flying their plane or managing their shipment or driving their truck, they know where to go, where to land, who needs to receive them, and just ensure we have that visibility across the organization and we can catch bottlenecks and critical issues that an individual might not see.

SPEAKER_00 2:15

What is a typical day look like for you as you're preparing for the World Cup?

SPEAKER_05 2:20

Right now we're in peak load-in. It's end of May, so a lot's happening. But a Tuesday right now I'm waking up and I'm checking our tracker. It's a system that we developed over a long period of time to essentially put all of the information in one place for that information to then funnel its way down to our on-sites and all the right people seeing the right things at the right time to execute on a daily basis with the biggest sporting event in the world. History.

SPEAKER_00 2:50

In the world history.

SPEAKER_05 2:51

World history, you're right.

SPEAKER_00 2:52

You're talking about managing a bunch of people and movements, but how many people are you actually communicating with?

SPEAKER_05 2:59

For me, on a weekly basis, it's in the thousands.

SPEAKER_00 3:04

What types of people, what roles are you talking to?

SPEAKER_05 3:07

It's people all across our organization, it's people across FIFA's organization, which is large, it's people across sponsors, it's suppliers, it's partners of every kind, it's their partners and their suppliers down many legs.

SPEAKER_00 3:22

Something that I heard that has not been able to get out of my mind is if you go to any of the 16 stadiums around Mexico, Canada, and the US, and you turn the stadium upside down and shake it, anything that falls out, Rocket got it there.

SPEAKER_05 3:37

Essentially, yes.

SPEAKER_00 3:38

So it's everything from the brand activations, the team jerseys, to like socks and merchandise.

SPEAKER_05 3:44

That's right.

SPEAKER_00 3:45

This is a big job.

SPEAKER_05 3:46

It sure is.

SPEAKER_00 3:47

You've had 13 years at this company now, so I'm sure that has helped with relationship building and with when something is going wrong, you kind of now can pull from all those years of experience to say, oh, this is what we do. But are there has there been in the planning of this World Cup any moments where you're like, how do we do that?

SPEAKER_05 4:07

In some ways, yes. I find that my experience of the company has put me in a unique position to help manage this sort of team and this level of complexity and volume and scale within our organization because I started in IT. Oh, really? I worked in compliance briefly. I worked in music touring for a while with my father. I then spent a lot of time with sports operating and managing on-site. So I've sort of dabbled in a lot of things, and I think that gave me a unique approach and ability to put a team together and a system process to manage all of this.

SPEAKER_00 4:46

And you're managing a lot. So this is the official FIFA ball that is being used at all the matches. But you told me something really cool before we started filming that you don't know who's actually going to make it to the end. How does this work?

SPEAKER_05 4:59

Yeah, so that is the knockout stage of the tournament. The knockout stage is where teams are going to start being knocked out of the tournament in real time as they lose potential matches.

SPEAKER_02 5:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 5:11

Part of that is when the balls are being displayed and used during the match. They're actually pre-printed with the logos or nations that are competing at that match. Wow. But we don't know who's competing during those matches until each knockout stage match completes. So it's a scramble every time a match completes. Okay, you now know this team is going against this team for the next match, which means the balls must get printed immediately and then sent by Express Air Freight to the next match to make sure they're there in time.

SPEAKER_00 5:45

And you guys are responsible for that, too. So is everything in here going to the World Cup?

SPEAKER_05 5:51

We do have some of the FIFA gear in here that are destined for SoFi here, one of the host city stadiums, but we actually have an entire other dedicated warehouse that is just FIFA.

SPEAKER_00 6:03

Got it. So this has other touring and everything else that y'all are doing. Show me around.

SPEAKER_05 6:07

Yeah, sure.

SPEAKER_00 6:08

Let's go. It's a really massive scale. Let's see. Two, six. Wait, did he get out of here? Alex, what is this? What was just dropped off?

SPEAKER_04 6:23

It is definitely FIFA.

SPEAKER_00 6:25

Hey!

SPEAKER_04 6:25

Oh city. Oh, this is on location. So it's uh a bar table. Furniture.

SPEAKER_00 6:30

Furniture.

SPEAKER_05 6:31

So this is maybe for like for for inside the stadium or for Yeah, mostly for inside, like VIP locations, lounges, athlete locations. So.

SPEAKER_00 6:39

And how long is it gonna sit here before it goes to SoFi?

SPEAKER_05 6:43

Sometimes it's a day, sometimes it's a week. A lot of the stadiums have space constraints, so it's a matter of deciding between the supplier, the stadium, the client, us, and FIFA. Is there space to take unassembled furniture into SoFi and then assemble it somewhere? Do we need to assemble it here, which triples the size and volume? So you need that many more trucks.

SPEAKER_00 7:07

Wow. And who's receiving it once you get to LA? Who's unboxing? And do you have a whole fleet of people?

SPEAKER_05 7:13

Yeah, it's a combination of sometimes they have their own crew, but you have to be accredited to be on site at the stadium. So most of the clients tend to not have their own accredited crew, maybe a few. And it's usually Rocket that is providing accredited hands and crew to be able to assist in building a thousand chairs.

SPEAKER_00 7:33

We're what about two weeks out, two-ish weeks out from the first match. Are you guys already loading in there?

SPEAKER_05 7:40

Oh, we've been loading in for three weeks.

SPEAKER_00 7:42

Really? Okay. So there are three countries, 16 stadiums, 104 different matches. From a logistics standpoint, what does that number actually mean in terms of movement?

SPEAKER_05 7:54

People might assume 16 stadiums, which means 16 load-ins and 16 loadouts. Because typically that's what a stadium tour might look like for music touring or for usual events. But in this case, it's essentially interlocking nonstop movements continuously across an entire continent. Because it's not one load-in at SoFi. It's a continuous load-in that is a constant like revolving door almost, where freight is coming in, it's getting assembled, pieces need to come back to be fulfilled somewhere else if they restock or if they need to replenish somewhere else. It's a never-ending interlocking web of movements across all three countries.

SPEAKER_00 8:40

So, y'all rocket. In addition to all the stuff you guys are already doing with concert touring, you have all hands on deck for this, I can imagine.

SPEAKER_05 8:49

All hands.

SPEAKER_00 8:50

Nonstop.

SPEAKER_05 8:50

Nonstop.

SPEAKER_00 8:52

I don't envy you guys. Where is this from?

SPEAKER_05 8:56

That is from South Korea.

SPEAKER_00 8:58

Okay.

SPEAKER_05 8:59

And it is for the World Cup.

SPEAKER_00 9:01

Do you know what's inside?

SPEAKER_05 9:03

I don't.

SPEAKER_00 9:04

You just need to know where it goes.

SPEAKER_05 9:06

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 9:07

Is this also for the World Cup?

SPEAKER_05 9:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 9:09

Jeez. That's crazy. So what is something that keeps you up at night on an event this large?

SPEAKER_05 9:16

Yeah, I so seeing is believing, I would say in my world, the unknowns at this point are sort of what keep me up at night.

SPEAKER_02 9:25

Like what?

SPEAKER_05 9:26

The unknowns of have sponsors activated yet? Have they made agreements with their partners and suppliers? Have their partners and suppliers given them the products yet to then be sent to an unknown location that we need to pick it up from, get it to a stadium? And there's just a lot of unknowns out there. Yeah. And those are the things that, you know, the control tower is built for. We're built to absorb and scale as the project kind of expands and contracts. But my entire philosophy in building it is to make sure it is sustainable in those contractions and expansions.

SPEAKER_00 10:02

Do you foresee that anyone will say last minute, like, oh, we gotta get this there and this there?

SPEAKER_05 10:07

It's every hour.

SPEAKER_00 10:09

Every hour.

SPEAKER_05 10:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 10:10

Leading up to the event and throughout the event.

SPEAKER_05 10:12

Correct.

SPEAKER_00 10:13

Yeah, it's gonna be a lot of emergencies.

SPEAKER_05 10:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 10:15

And you're getting married in the middle of all this, I heard.

SPEAKER_05 10:18

Sure am.

SPEAKER_00 10:19

This is a good timing. Yeah. What is a moment from the last 12 months that you're gonna remember forever?

SPEAKER_05 10:26

It's definitely gonna be when our tracker went live. It was many, many months of work by many departments across our organization to get it working. And now we have it, so shipments like this, where a crate shows up on site, if any instance comes up where there's an unknown that we need to look up, the tracker is giving people real-time information between the systems we have at play so they can quickly identify what is it that they're looking for, or what do they need to find, or who do they need to call, it's at their fingertips.

SPEAKER_00 10:57

Huge. For our audience, people that who have toured, they know the pressure of you know a truck not showing up or freight that needs to be somewhere. What is the FIFA version of that?

SPEAKER_05 11:12

From my experience in touring, you typically have if there's an issue, if there's an escalation, if you need to get hold of someone, you're usually dealing with one to maybe a handful of folks to deliver bad news or problem solve. It's a stage manager, a production manager, maybe it's a rental company that you're in touch with, but the FIFA version of that is a complex, deep web of connecting individuals through many organizations. So if something changes, if there's a problem, the question we constantly have to ask ourselves is who needs to know? Because that problem now affects potentially hundreds or thousands of people. It's not just the person you may have spoken to about the problem 10 minutes ago, it might also impact an entire functional area at FIFA, plus an entire work stream that spans across multiple companies, their suppliers, their partners. So that part of it can be a bit tricky to manage because it's not just reporting to maybe a few people, it's blasting information to the right people, which sometimes is hundreds or thousands.

SPEAKER_00 12:17

And it's around the world. So not everyone who's involved in the World Cup are act is actually in America, right? Correct. Is that who you're talking to? Does everyone speak English at least?

SPEAKER_05 12:27

For the most part. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 12:29

Is this even more collaborative than the Olympics?

SPEAKER_05 12:32

Much more.

SPEAKER_00 12:32

Were you involved in the Olympics?

SPEAKER_05 12:34

The last eight.

SPEAKER_00 12:35

Wow. What is the biggest difference of this one than the Olympics?

SPEAKER_05 12:41

For me personally, it's a much bigger scale.

SPEAKER_00 12:45

Okay.

SPEAKER_05 12:45

Usually for the Olympics, I'm used to working with a handful of NOCs, NPCs, or basically the countries.

SPEAKER_01 12:52

Okay.

SPEAKER_05 12:52

And in this case, we're dealing with the organizing committee, which would be FIFA, and all of the suppliers and partners and sponsors, and just many more organizations than I'm used to working with, and that basically extends to the company as well. We're not, we've never worked a project this large, and the world has never seen a project this large.

SPEAKER_00 13:12

Incredible. Why do you love it?

SPEAKER_05 13:15

I've always loved problem solving, and I've loved being involved in things that require developing and growing and adapting and collaborating.

SPEAKER_00 13:27

Yeah, I think you're literally in the control tower of that. So you're you're doing the right thing, and they're lucky to have you.

SPEAKER_05 13:34

Thank you.

SPEAKER_00 13:34

Alright, so I'm still learning this world. A term I've heard is the carnet. What is a carnet?

SPEAKER_05 13:39

Yeah, carnet is essentially a passport for commercial goods or freight. Oh, okay. So it's it's a way for goods to travel into and out of countries on a temporary basis without having to permanently import it like it was for sale.

SPEAKER_02 13:55

Oh.

SPEAKER_05 13:55

So if goods like touring goods or sporting event goods that are going to leave the country again, it's essentially a way to tell customs these are the goods I'd like to bring in, and they will be leaving. So it's an itemized list that tells customs, I'd like to bring in soccer balls and these things, and we promise we will take them out of the country so they have a record of what you're bringing in and that you will take them out.

SPEAKER_00 14:19

Got it. So in your 13 years of working rocket and working logistics and operations, especially with these massive events, has anything gone wrong?

SPEAKER_05 14:29

Things tend to go wrong in uh in the world that we work, but we are the problem solvers. We're experts at it. A unique one is probably pole vaults. Athletes tend that are pole vaulters, like to travel with their pole vaults if they can.

SPEAKER_02 14:44

Oh.

SPEAKER_05 14:44

And they attempt to, you know, speak with the airlines. Hey, I want to bring a 12-foot pole and check it as luggage. Is that okay? And you know, an airline representative might say, sure. Yeah. And then they show up, and it's certainly not something that they were actually prepared to receive. So we will get a call on a Friday that says, Hey, I need you to pick up a pole vault from this airport, and it needs to be in this country by Tuesday, and I need it delivered to the stadium by so-and-so time. Wow. And those are hard things to fly with their dimensions. That's wild.

SPEAKER_00 15:24

I've never used a pallet jack before. Can you show me how this works?

SPEAKER_05 15:27

Yeah, so its steering column is a little bit unique, but you'll see this is the steer. And on this little lever, you're gonna push it down when you want to control how high it goes. Okay. Because the forks are gonna go up to catch the pallet, depending on how low and high it is, and make sure it's catching on the bottom of the pallet. So if you wanted to raise it, you put it in the locking field, and then you're gonna raise it, and you see it's getting up from the ground while the wheels stay at the bottom. And then if you want to lower it, you're holding this. So essentially you'd be taking it over here. Oh well. There's nothing on it to keep it from How about me?

SPEAKER_00 16:15

Okay.

SPEAKER_05 16:16

Careful. Yeah, now we're in. And then we're gonna lift it.

SPEAKER_00 16:24

We go. Alright, your turn. I'm gonna lift you up now. Okay, here we go. Straight.

SPEAKER_05 16:38

Give it a good one.

SPEAKER_00 16:40

Keep going. One more. Okay, got it. Okay. All right. This goes down.

SPEAKER_05 16:48

Yep.

SPEAKER_00 16:49

There we go. Boom! Oh, sorry, I didn't. You're good.

unknown 16:55

Let's go, let's go.

SPEAKER_00 16:56

I have freight that needs to be going to so fi.

SPEAKER_05 17:02

Do you have any labels for me? How do I know where I'm going?

SPEAKER_00 17:04

I don't know where you're going. You tell me with your control center, okay? Let's lift this thing up and I'll be putting you in the truck. Stay right there.

SPEAKER_05 17:12

Okay. I'll stay right here.

SPEAKER_00 17:14

And so when I lift this up, do I just pull this rope?

SPEAKER_05 17:22

On that side? Roll up.

SPEAKER_00 17:26

Um, is it a button?

SPEAKER_05 17:28

No, it should be. You might have to unlatch it. Is it that's probably locked.

SPEAKER_00 17:37

Sorry. How does it work? This?

SPEAKER_05 17:41

Right here.

SPEAKER_00 17:42

Oh.

SPEAKER_04 17:43

Do you want to step on it?

SPEAKER_00 17:47

Got it. Okay, ready? Stand on your palate, Alex. And it's closed. We'll get you. We're gonna load you up on a truck. Beep. Hire me. You guys have uh health insurance?

SPEAKER_05 18:08

This is definitely not OSHA certified.

SPEAKER_00 18:10

Definitely not. Definitely not. Alright, here we go. Oh, there's a lock on this one. No! Alright, well, let me just pretend.

SPEAKER_05 18:26

Then I'm going in the truck.

SPEAKER_00 18:30

It's a so funny. Alright. It's good enough, right? Alright, I'm gonna release you now. Keep going. Just call me the next Rocket warehouse manager. Just kidding. Hired. Hire me, Rocket. What's up? We are in Atlanta, Georgia at the FIFA match between Spain and Saudi Arabia. We are waiting to go to the VIP lounge. Thank you very much to Rocket. They're the greatest. Kickoff has the gun. And we are literally on the field. Justin Carbone is the EVP of Live Touring at Rocket, where he's led the company's music touring business through some of the biggest years in the industry's history, including a 2026 Parnelli Award for Freight Forwarding Company of the Year. If your favorite artist has toured the world in the last six decades, there's a very good chance that Rocket's a team has a move the year that made it happen. So I get to sit down with Justin Carbon and thank you so much for doing this. Next month mark 20 years of working with Rocket. Congratulations, first of all. You guys have become the absolute dominator in the industry. What I want to know is how do you do it? Like, what do you guys do?

SPEAKER_03 20:22

What we do is in Rocket. We are afraid of the company and moving the rocket from A to B. However, everybody can do an ideal condition. Anybody can move cargo from when any to the next evening in the most perfect conditions. When the weather's good, when there's no delays, when there's no political or geopolitical uh environment to navigate when there's no strike or is there anything in that what we do is we do it within the most diverse conditions. Before I got in the world of mediatoring. Um I started in a general freight and then I did a small freight from the company, uh family company. Um worked there for about four or five years in the New York City area. And then in 2002, I moved my way into uh mediatoring. The first gig I ever did with a day one. I never wanted to be a person I was in the tour as I'm gonna show up in Miami. We got halfway the border, and I draw around.

SPEAKER_00 22:00

Oh my gosh. This is, I'm sure, one of the many billion things that could go wrong in getting people and things to shows. And if there's one thing everyone knows in the music industry is the show has to go on. Seats are sold, seats are filled. You gotta have the show. And for me, from where I'm standing of my experience in the industry, shows always go on. Gear always gets to whatever country it needs to get to. Rocket does like literally every artist over for what, 47 years that Rocket's been around. I'm assuming that requires relationships and just warehouse space around the world to use and all the connections to with um getting into countries. And out have do you guys struggle or have there ever been issues of getting gear into different countries? Sure.

SPEAKER_03 22:51

So going back to Rocket Cargo's roots in the 1970s, um, we are one of the companies that was the architect of getting cargo around the world. We're at the precipice in the forefront of moving into cargo into certain cities, such as taking Queen to Brazil for the first time. Um, opening up different markets, Southeast Asia, places in Africa. Uh we're the only company that's ever moved the cargo to and did a show in Antarctica for Metallica. What? Um there are places where people have come to us and said we need to move into a certain area or certain country, and we've had to literally write the book on how to do it. Um, taking the Rolling Stones to Cuba. Certain Wow. Certain shows like that. So um, yeah, we have the largest network in the world. We have the most trusted network in the world, and we also uh have long-standing relationships with lots of people in all the countries around the world.

SPEAKER_00 23:41

That's a secret sauce.

SPEAKER_03 23:42

It is. Our network is definitely our secret sauce.

SPEAKER_00 23:45

And I like how you said anyone can do this in good conditions, but most things are just not good conditions. Weather and uh everything.

SPEAKER_03 23:52

Look, from time to time we have great conditions. Yes. And it makes our job very enjoyable. And those are the days you can have a nice dinner once you delivered a cargo to a show and enjoy your evening.

unknown 24:01

Yes.

SPEAKER_03 24:01

Oftentimes that's not the case.

SPEAKER_00 24:03

I want to go into so you have your your first gig with Enrique Angles, yes.

SPEAKER_03 24:07

Who we still work with 25 years later.

SPEAKER_00 24:09

How amazing. What what cool full circle moment.

SPEAKER_03 24:12

Great artist, great partner. I wish we had all clients that were like that.

SPEAKER_00 24:16

Wow. Yeah. My first show I ever worked was Dolly Parton, and then I got to work a show six years later for her. And also, can everyone just be like Dolly? Wow. Take me into what you did next in your career and what led you to Rocket.

SPEAKER_03 24:30

So I worked at a competitive company uh in the early 2000s. Um, and then in 2006, I made the move over to Rocket, the Rocket Company, opening up an office in New Jersey, um, running that office for about 15 years, and then in 2020, I moved here to Los Angeles to help manage and run the live touring team.

SPEAKER_00 24:47

Why live touring? Why, why is that the direction you went?

SPEAKER_03 24:50

I was working in General Freight in the late 90s in New York City, uh, and a lot of my customers were in the live industry space, speakers, staging companies, lighting companies. I had no idea that Rocket existed. I had no idea that even an industry existed that was music touring or live concert touring. Um, like everybody else, I just like going to shows and enjoying them, never thinking about how everything got there.

SPEAKER_02 25:13

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 25:14

Once I had sort of roots in the freight world and I was understanding that it takes what it takes to move things from A to B, then we looked into sort of specialties. And some of my clients were sort of dragging me in that direction. And uh a competitive company called me out of the blue and said, Hey, do you want to come work for us? And that's what it was.

SPEAKER_00 25:31

That's too.

SPEAKER_03 25:31

Uh, I moved to New Jersey and uh that was the start of the career.

SPEAKER_00 25:35

Amazing. So you come into Rocket, you now are leading uh live touring, getting everything around the world. Some of um I see on your wall, we got Shakira, who's ending, closing FIFA, the World Cup this year, and then you got Katie Perry who's opening it. And so these are artists that you've worked with. In what capacity do you work with these artists? Who do you work with on the touring team, and how involved do you guys get?

SPEAKER_03 26:00

So uh the answer to the question of who we work with on the team is traditionally the production manager.

SPEAKER_00 26:04

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 26:05

That's where the relationship lies. I'm lucky enough to have really deep-rooted relationships with some of my production managers that have hired us to work. Um, the longer you work with them, the more they trust you, um, the more you produce results, the more they'll give you information to route things and and and work on the tours.

SPEAKER_00 26:23

Yeah. And so someone like Marty Home, who we were just talking about, who's right here, picture him over there. You've worked with him, I'm sure, for over a decade now at this point.

SPEAKER_03 26:32

So the first time I worked with Marty was on the Shakira tour in 2011. It's the first one. I'd been doing touring for close to 10 years at that point, and it's the first mega tour, large-scale tour with large aircrafts that I was responsible for running through South America and Central America. Uh Marty was at the helm, he was the tour director, and he was kind, and he was very supportive of working with the production manager and letting us run the show. There were all kinds of things that went wrong on that tour. Um, there was anything but ideal conditions on that tour. We had situations where planes were broke. We had situations where we had floods in certain cities in Brazil, which forced us to do back-to-back day-over-day stadium shows. One from Brazil in Brazil the next day in Lima, Peru.

SPEAKER_02 27:15

Whoa.

SPEAKER_03 27:16

Taking large-scale productions, 747-style productions, uh, finishing a show at midnight in Brazilia and delivering the next day at noon in Lima, Peru.

SPEAKER_00 27:24

Oh my gosh. Yeah. For a stadium show like that, how many aircrafts and trucks are you guys managing?

SPEAKER_03 27:31

Over the years, it's gotten bigger and larger scale for many, many reasons. Yeah. Um the production can have uh as tight as uh as one aircraft uh moving around, very efficient through the world. Uh we are now moving some start shows around that pr are in the nine to ten aircraft, nine to ten full 747 aircraft style productions.

SPEAKER_00 27:50

So relationships are the secret sauce of Rocket and of the people working at Rocket. And so that's how you've had these long-standing relationships. What are some other relationships you've had?

SPEAKER_03 27:58

From the Shakira Tour that we did, uh the production manager, who is a dear friend, called me up at one point around 2010 and said, Hey, uh, I'm at a crossroads. I'm gonna take one of two jobs. Um, I'm either gonna stay with Shakira who's gonna tour, or I'm gonna take this new artist called Katy Perry and maybe and see how that artist is gonna move forward. We had a long discussion as friends and as work colleagues, and he chose to go on the Katy Perry route, and we got involved in that train, which hasn't stopped in the last 15 years.

SPEAKER_00 28:30

No, it has not. I mean, it she doesn't keep I mean, she's got literally went to the moon, didn't she? Just now go to the space.

SPEAKER_03 28:36

Yeah, we weren't involved in the moon. We weren't involved in the moon.

SPEAKER_00 28:38

Did you move Katy Perry to the space?

SPEAKER_03 28:40

We did not. We did not.

SPEAKER_00 28:42

Rockets are next for you guys. Come on. Rocket car rocket.

SPEAKER_03 28:44

Rocket rockets.

SPEAKER_00 28:45

Rocket rockets. Might need one. That's cool. So talk about what that looks like of a uh emerging artist and what growth looks like with an artist.

SPEAKER_03 28:55

So from our perspective, we are a vendor on the tour. We are a cog in the wheel. And as an artist grows throughout their journey, we're there to support them in terms of what they want and what they need around the world to create their vision. An artist like Katie, in our opinion, sees uh the shows going around the world as they build her brand. Right. And so some of the things that we move around the world may not be technically for the show, they may be for some of the brand building. And it just becomes part of the cargo package. Um but it's really interesting, and it's one of the one of the joys of my career is to watch and work with an artist like that grow from a certain California, you know, into California Dreams was the first tour we did internationally through some of the other tours, Prismatic, Witness, and on and on. And as they grew and grew and grew, um, the staff stayed around and and you know, we really grew with that artist together. And it was, it was a joy and really a pleasure in my career to watch that artist grow and be part of it.

SPEAKER_00 29:49

Yeah. You all have become the experts in getting these touring shows around the world, which has led to this massive partnership with FIFA becoming Rocket becoming the official logistics partner for FIFA for the World Cup that's coming, the largest sporting event in the world history. That's a really big deal. You're also having world tours going on at the same time. How are you managing both?

SPEAKER_03 30:12

For 50 years, we've been perfecting how to move live events around the world and how to make sure, as you mentioned before, the show must go on.

SPEAKER_02 30:18

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 30:19

So taking that, those lessons learned and the architecture that we've built around moving large live events, we have partnered with FIFA to handle this large-scale event. My responsibility is to make sure that the live touring division and the live touring team has what they need to continue to grow and provide the best services for our customers. Um make sure that all the tours have all the resources and all the firepower that they need to make sure that their shows continue on while the company grows into uh supporting another large uh mega event like the FIFA World Cup. And while we're supporting the FIFA World Cup, we're also supporting some of the largest world tours in 2026 and beyond.

SPEAKER_00 31:01

Can you name some of those?

SPEAKER_03 31:03

Uh we're currently supporting Harry Styles, BTS, ACDC, and others.

SPEAKER_00 31:08

And do you also do arena size and and amphitheater size shows?

SPEAKER_03 31:12

Yeah. So one of the things that we're really excited about is making sure we're creating a next gen for uh the artists of the future. So we're constantly teaching and preparing some of our uh staff to go out and be the agents of tomorrow. Um we're calling next gen. And those folks are concentrating on the emerging artists and supporting anything from a band in a van with a simple customs clearance across the border all the way up through the theatrical process into arenas, amphitheaters, and eventually into stadiums. One of the things that we love working with, and as I mentioned with Katie, is working with an emerging artist, finding watching them find their footing and accelerating through the curve into larger and larger venues where we can then support them going around the world.

unknown 31:58

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 31:59

And I assume is it the same technique in that secret sauce that you guys have here at Rocket that's doing the World Cup? Is it the same way, or do you guys have to do things differently with specifics?

SPEAKER_03 32:09

There's definitely some differences. Okay. Um I think the mission is always uh failure is not an option. So, you know, that's sort of one thing that we've always been taught. Failure is not an option. One of the other ones that we've always been taught is sort of the approach determines a landing, which is something that the founder of the company had always installed and instilled into a lot of us and a lot of the staff, where hey, think about it, make sure you have a plan A, make sure you have a plan B. But at the end of the day, the show has to go on. And so I think we're bringing that thought process and that approach into some of these large mega events, such as the FIFA World Cup, uh such as supporting F1 races, supporting the Olympics, and some of our other divisions.

SPEAKER_00 32:54

How big is Rocket? How many employees do you guys have?

SPEAKER_03 32:56

The Rocket Company is about 1,200 worldwide. The Rocket Cargo division is about 300 or so.

SPEAKER_00 33:01

Aaron Powell That's not that many for doing the largest events ever. And do you have employees that are also touring with these shows?

SPEAKER_03 33:07

Aaron Powell We have lots of people that are uh responsible for a specific show.

SPEAKER_00 33:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 33:12

Uh and then we have certain employees that will be on site or attendance.

SPEAKER_00 33:16

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 33:17

Um we have people that are uh amazing at it and that's what they do as a living. We have people that are amazing that are, you know, at the control towers and making sure things are handled from uh an office perspective. Um but yeah, we have people on the road.

SPEAKER_00 33:29

It's a good gig. It's a world that again, when I was trying to look into this industry, I didn't know that this side existed. But people that are what would you say people at Rocket, um, employees that work here, your team, what would you say like are their top qualities that make them great at what they do?

SPEAKER_03 33:46

Everybody here has and we instill and teach, again, that failure is not an option. That is a lesson number one. Uh we look at things a little bit differently uh than say the General Freight Forward would look at it uh when their perspective is making sure they save and they have the most efficient way of doing it in terms of cost. Our clients, while they are very cost conscious and we are very budget conscious with them, know that sometimes we have to go outside the box and think things differently. As again, I mentioned, you know, ideal conditions are amazing. Sunny days, you know, no delays at airports. Right. Those are great, great days. Um, you know, but the days where things go sideways when somebody else that we're relying on doesn't do their job, we have to make sure 24 hours constantly monitoring, making sure that there's a plan B in place.

SPEAKER_00 34:34

Do you have a horror story that you know just pray never happens again or you learned it the hard way?

SPEAKER_03 34:40

I have many. A funny one would be it was a large-scale tour going through Manila. We had landed on the day uh we were supposed to deliver the cargo day before show. Okay. We were loading in that evening uh to tech. It was an outdoor show, so it was essential that we loaded that evening so they could program lights. We land early afternoon. I get pulled into we're in the Philippines, I get pulled into the customs office, and the woman who's in charge of customs was waiting on a signature from somebody downtown. It was a office of tourism. And she said, I think we should pray for customs clearance. And I kind of took it as a joke, you know, yeah, of course we should, you know, yeah, we should all pray. Pray for you. But no, we sat for 30 minutes in a prayer session in this woman's office in front of a statue and and literally prayed for customs clearance.

SPEAKER_00 35:27

And it came. It came. It came about about an hour later. Prayer works.

SPEAKER_03 35:31

Prayer works.

SPEAKER_00 35:31

Is it because maybe like she really did not think it was gonna happen for you?

SPEAKER_03 35:35

Yeah. I mean, she was a very religious wonderful woman, religious woman, and you know, um I don't know if it's a horror story, but that's a it's a fun story.

SPEAKER_02 35:43

That's a fun one.

SPEAKER_03 35:44

I mean, we've had all kinds of stories of you know, aircrafts because we don't own the aircrafts and we don't own the trucks and we don't own the the cargo vans. Um so we rely on other people's equipment, like most freight forwarders.

SPEAKER_02 35:55

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 35:56

But when they are grounded, when there's weather issues, when there's mechanical issues, yeah, there's all kinds of horror stories that we have to come and figure out.

SPEAKER_00 36:04

Is there a certain continent or country or city that there's like always issues?

SPEAKER_03 36:10

Definitely around the world. Uh I would say the more, the less industrious countries oftentimes are uh harder to work in because the system is just set up.

SPEAKER_00 36:20

Right.

SPEAKER_03 36:20

But oftentimes they're easier to work in because there's not as many controls in place.

SPEAKER_00 36:26

Oh, interesting. Yeah. And weather. What what state is the worst in the US to to navigate?

SPEAKER_03 36:32

Oh God. I'm I mean maybe Alaska. I don't know. They're all they're all pretty bad.

SPEAKER_00 36:36

Can you talk to me about Antarctica? How did that how did that happen?

SPEAKER_03 36:40

That was a Metallica show that happened about 10 years ago. Okay and one of the Rocket uh agents who was working on that took the show from the southern tip of Argentina into Antarctica and they did a show.

SPEAKER_00 36:51

That's crazy. Can anyone go to Antarctica? I don't not just anyone, no. No. Metallica can. Yep. Rocket can. What are some of the tours that you are working with this summer?

SPEAKER_03 37:00

We work with bands and tours of all sizes across all genres. This year specifically, uh, we're working with some of the genres we're very excited about. Latin music, um, country, national based music, and k-pop as they run around the world, global tours, uh, specifically some of the ones that are heading to regions and areas that they're not necessarily known for going to. Some of the Latin American tours that are starting to explore Australia, Southeast Asia, some of the country tours are starting to explore deep into Europe and down to Australia, uh, the K-pop tours that are deep into Latin America and around the world.

SPEAKER_00 37:35

So in 2026, obviously social media is helping these artists actually reach global markets and sell tickets to in places that they never thought they could. But I feel like knowing that they have a partner like Rocket would help them too, just knowing that, oh my God, we're gonna go to Asia now, we have no idea what to do over there. Well, you know, using Rocket, how do how do you guys see your involvement helping with this kind of explosion?

SPEAKER_03 37:59

Yeah, as fan bases grow uh more rapidly these days, um, the productions and the clients are coming to us with the need to now bring the full show around the world oftentimes. Uh so they can bring that to their fan base, um, not just to certain areas of the world, which traditionally there were certain areas where you could tour on the ground, maybe a North America, maybe a Europe, even into Australia, um, and some of the other markets would get a secondary or B-size show just because the economics. Now the fan bases are demanding these larger shows and the in the A-style shows, and they're coming to us and asking, how do we move this amount of freight? How do we move this amount of production during this time? And they're leaning on us for routing expertise, certain city segments and city pairs that make it more economical than others versus just going out and doing the tour. Um, so that's really become an important part of what we do in the last three to four years.

SPEAKER_00 38:49

Is that consulting and advising on here's what our experience has shown, talking with the artist management teams of kind of where to route? And that's really special.

SPEAKER_03 38:58

Yeah, and the clients really do rely on us for honest feedback in terms of what's best for the tour. And it's our responsibility to sit with them, help them route the cities, and help them route the tour and around in certain kind of time frames that makes it the most economical for them to move around.

SPEAKER_00 39:15

What do you see for you in this position with Rocket, with this growing live event, live touring market? How do you see this evolving over the next five to 10 years?

SPEAKER_03 39:26

I see exactly what we just talked about, which is fan bases are growing. Yeah. More artists are gonna go global, more artists are gonna build brands, which becomes in a very important part of what the touring economics are. Promoters can only give you so much money to go out and do a show because there's only so many tickets you can sell. The secondary money is the, you know, bringing the brand, bringing the experience, um, you know, bringing that festival vibe of the experiential side of it. Uh what else can they bring? What else can they bring the fan so that they can enjoy the experience?

SPEAKER_00 39:56

So we'll be talking to Stu about that. Correct. That's super interesting. Thank you so much, Justin. Thank you for watching. What a career you've had, and I'm I'm honored to hear this. It's a whole nother side of the industry that a lot of people don't know about. And so I hope that we can really bring this out. This is awesome. Thank you.

SPEAKER_03 40:11

I mean, I we represent an amazing team here at Rocket Cargo. There is, you know, hundreds and hundreds of collective years of experience here. I'm just lucky enough and happy enough to be here to help run the team and help help them be as productive as they can be.

SPEAKER_00 40:24

Amazing. And final question Who is your favorite act, favorite band to go watch?

SPEAKER_03 40:30

My favorite show. I'm gonna answer it differently. Yes. My favorite show of all time. People have always asked me, what was your favorite show? What was that one show that gave you the goosebumps? And there's a ton of them. Um, but in 2014, I was looking up to Weeb Soundgarden and the Lollapalooza show in uh Buenos Aires.

SPEAKER_00 40:47

Oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_03 40:48

80,000 people, first time they'd ever played it, and them being one of my bet favorite bands of all time. That's the goosebum show for me.

SPEAKER_00 40:55

Makes it all worth it. Yeah. I love it. Thank you so much, Jesse. Now we got Nancy Alvarado. So Nancy is a 15-plus year veteran of live event logistics operations and project management, a Capham certified pro who has spent her career navigating the kind of high pressure, high-stakes environments that most people couldn't handle for a single day. Let's be real. She's now at Rocket as a director of live events special projects management. Nancy, thank you so much for doing this with us.

SPEAKER_07 41:28

Thank you for having me.

SPEAKER_00 41:29

So I want to just take it back to the very first gig that got you into this industry.

SPEAKER_07 41:33

Oh my gosh. Well, I started my career here at Rocket in 2008. Um, I started as a just a general entry-level operator here, and I just did basic trucking and shipments for all a variety of our bands. And um I'm assuming that's like a starting role, right? Yes. Okay. So everyone here starts entry level into central operations or some sort of entry-level operator role. Cool. Where we just handle a variety of different bands or shipments or trade show exponentials, like any kind of variety of shipments.

SPEAKER_00 42:06

So is that like just to kind of understand how that whole world works and you're communicating with the transportation and logistics companies and the different air carriers and exactly.

SPEAKER_07 42:18

It's the nitty-gritty of like creating truck BOLs, which are like documentation that trucks need to in order to transfer freight from one place to another, creating airway bills, TSA stuff. It's a variety of different operational, like the dirty work. Yeah. So yeah, that's how I started my career here at Rocket. And then eventually I took on bigger projects and bigger roles and more client-facing. And then eventually in the last few years, I did my own book of misses and I was handling some bands myself. And then I I branched off into being like an official Rocket agent. Wow. Which is handling bands exclusively. And then from there I decided to kind of branch off and discover what else is next for me. And I wanted to focus more on corporate events and event strategy. And so I left in 2018. Were you doing logistics and and yes? Okay. Yeah, I was focusing on event strategy, about logistics, event planning. So it's a lot of trade shows and conferences for really large Fortune 500 companies. And then recently I just came back actually. So what was the reason for coming back? Well, I just saw I was keeping up with the news of Rocket. I saw everything that Rock, how Rocket was growing, and the company, all our different capacities have increased and just the general like excitement of the growth and future of the company. And so then I just started engaging a little bit with my past managers, and they're like, you'll be a great fit to come back and bring whatever you've learned. And you're kind of home raised. You're raised as a rocket person, so you'll understand the background. And uh yeah, and then I came back. That is awesome.

SPEAKER_00 44:03

And it's great that you were able to tackle new responsibilities. Yeah, yeah. Now that you're back.

SPEAKER_07 44:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 44:13

Cool. So 10 years to start. Tell me about that book of artists that you were working with. You don't have to say specifics, but what did it mean to kind of be working with them directly and managing them, being their agent?

SPEAKER_07 44:25

Oh, it was great. You become an extension of their production. Like they trust you as being part of their crew. So you get the calls late at night for things that break, emergencies or or just general advice. You you really become like you develop great friendships, even with some of them, that they just call you sometimes with like personal and family like updates. And yeah, it was great. But yeah, it started from you know planning a tour, getting their checklist, you know, set up with everything that they need to do to prepare the production managers to prepare for their upcoming tour, working with them on this on deciding, hey, this is gonna work out, this is too risky, I would do it this way. You become like an advisor and then eventually setting everything up. And sometimes if the project is l large enough, you are entrusted to go on the road with them and make sure everything is is moving along great. Very cool.

SPEAKER_00 45:24

Did you enjoy the touring part, the traveling?

SPEAKER_07 45:26

I did, I did. I did enjoy the touring part. You know, their gear is important, so we feel like we have to see everything, we have to see the transition, we have to see where everything goes. Yeah. To make sure that it gets to where it needs to get to.

SPEAKER_00 45:40

Yes.

SPEAKER_07 45:40

And knowing that your motto for you guys here is that failure is not a it's not an option, right? So the more eyes we have on it, the more comfortable we feel. Like, okay, let's make sure that truck is leaving. Okay, the truck is leaving the dock. Good, we're all good. Let me jump to the next place and make sure that truck is moving along. So, like, we're very, very careful with the journey.

SPEAKER_00 46:00

Y'all gotta be Tai. I mean, you gotta care about the tiny nitty gritties. We do. Do you have any kind of horror stories of things that just did not go right, but y'all still make the show go on?

SPEAKER_07 46:10

Okay, I was handling a band that had a super tight move. They were playing a festival in Australia. And it was because they had previous engagements in LA, it was basically they had one flight to make it to that one festival in Australia. And I won't say the band's name, but the gear had to go on this flight. And so the gear got on the flight, I was tracking it, I was talking to the airlines, everything was good. I was like, God, it's on the flight, it's moving. I'm tracking the plane, it's going across the ocean. We're all good. And then the plane stopped in the middle of the ocean. And I'm like, oh, okay, why is it stopping? It made an emergency landing in Hawaii because of a medical issue with a passenger. No. Because it was in a passenger plane. And so I was like, oh my God, that's horrible. First of all, I hope that passenger is okay. But what what do I do? What do I do? Get that plane in the air again. Exactly. So I quickly jumped on our, because we have a great network of agents and support anywhere around the world, which is our great benefit of being here at Rocket. So I called our agents in Hawaii. They were like, okay, we're ready to pull the cargo from the plane and we'll try to find another place, another plane from that takes off in Hawaii to meet your deadline. Luckily, the medical situation cleared up fairly quickly in order for the plane to continue on its journey. It was a little bit delayed, but the band made it and it got there right on sound check. So everything was good. But you had the backup. We had the backup. Our guys were like, We're we're at the airport, we're ready to pull. Wow. It was it, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 47:49

But are you that person in your personal life too?

SPEAKER_07 47:52

Always having a backup option. Oh, yeah. I mean, I already think of a worst-case scenario before something even happens. They're like, Why are you thinking like that before it even I was like, we always have to do a plan B.

SPEAKER_00 48:01

Like, you have to be prepared. That must be the criteria for getting a gig here.

SPEAKER_07 48:05

I mean, I think you have to be that way. I think we just have to have complete ownership of this is an extension of like us, a reflection of our like work ethic and you know, our passion. So yeah.

SPEAKER_00 48:17

I'm so not wired that way. I just like, oh, we get here, now we gotta figure it out. So I would be a terrible rock in the way. I'm glad you guys are handling that. It's nice to to know when people just have it. You just give the call, y'all figure it out. Yeah. With any kind of passport issue or going in different countries, that might be a problem. So, do you think that's why people really trust you guys?

SPEAKER_07 48:40

Yeah, I think that is the reason why we've been so successful all these years. We have one, we have a great network. Agents all over the world who are just like us. They're like, what do you mean? Okay, we're on it. We're jumping on this problem. We'll we'll have a plan B, we'll we'll find a solution together. And yeah, we have a great network, we have great resources. All our employees are completely dedicated to what we do. And like you said, we're all have that same personality. And yep, we work so closely to our clients that that's really our our success. And we're all we're all music lovers at the end of the day, too. We all want for people to have that experience, that live event, that concert. We all want them to have a positive experience.

SPEAKER_00 49:21

Yeah. And now the position that you hold, you're really helping usher in this next generation. Yeah. And and working with the newer artists or up-and-coming artists and uh also the newer staff members here.

SPEAKER_07 49:35

Can you talk a little bit about that? Yeah, yeah. So we're I'm working with Justin. We're developing this awesome project to really address both up-and-coming artists to make sure that they are know about our resources and they know about our company and they know us. Yeah. And also to address a lot of our agents and their growth and to to have a good, clear path for them to succeed in the company, learn everything we do and and really mentor and foster their growth. What led you to be wanting that role? Is it because you started almost 20 years ago? Exactly. Yeah, just because I personally I rose through being an entry-level ops person to to having my own book of business. So it was I would love people to have that same journey and realize how how great it is to be part of this company that has such a great network and resources. So how long does it take to like get it to uh fully wrap your head around all that y'all do? It's a lot. And I think with every shipment that's done, every project that people do, you just learn so much more. So the more people have exposure, the quicker they'll learn. Um, and definitely that's something that we want to to help foster here too, with that with the program that we're working on. We want everyone to to see all those experiences and to learn from them.

SPEAKER_00 50:52

Do you have uh a story that maybe it was working with a client or it was it was something with Rocket where you achieved something and you're like, man, this is why I love doing what I'm doing?

SPEAKER_07 51:04

Oh yeah. I mean, I personally like I my favorite band is Queens of the Stone Age. So just seeing them perform live in a concert, you know, and sometimes getting invited to to be in the front, or yeah, you know, the perks of the of the industry. Of course. Just seeing them and seeing the audience and their interaction with the band and how they react to the live music or the specific guitar that's being used or or the the audio equipment, like you just or their lighting or their whole stage performance. It's like, all right, this was all worth it. Like this is it. This is it. This is it.

SPEAKER_00 51:40

Yeah, you could just be working in other kind of logistics and yeah, this is this is it. The perks exactly right there. Um yeah, I asked Justin this too. What was your favorite, I guess, concert experience? Was that your favorite concert experience?

SPEAKER_07 51:54

Yeah, I I like the more intimate small concert because I I feel like that you you get more connected with the with the artist, what they're trying to do, what they're then you have like that eye contact and you're like, Yeah, I get you. I get you. And I helped put that together.

unknown 52:10

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 52:11

Right. That's a whole different level of enjoyment when you oh, do you have any advice for people wanting to get into maybe just live events in general, and then maybe why they should even consider coming into a logistics company like Rocket.

SPEAKER_07 52:23

This is such a great company where you learn project management. Like that is the core, like how to prepare for all the the possibilities that come, all the obstacles that might happen, and to always stay completely organized. Like it is a position where you learn all of your skills through this weird niche that we have of live entertainment logistics, but it it can be applied to anything in the world. Like it just teaches you a lot of good life uh skills in general. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 52:55

Yeah. That's amazing. So for you and where you're sitting and your your position here, what are you most excited for in your own growth and where you see the company going?

SPEAKER_07 53:05

So many initiatives that are happening right now that I am part of, and I'm working with different teams here on mainly just infrastructure and and systems and optimizing our operations. There's so many new technology, a lot of technology out there that can be utilized and really helpful for everyone to make to elevate us to even more. Um, those are some things that I'm really excited about helping.

SPEAKER_00 53:31

That's awesome.

SPEAKER_07 53:33

Well, thank you for doing this.

SPEAKER_00 53:34

Yeah, congrats on an amazing career.

SPEAKER_07 53:36

No, thank you for having me. Doing really exciting. Thank you for the combo. Yes.

SPEAKER_00 53:41

And and like truly doing things behind the scenes that never get the praise. And so that's something that I'm really passionate we are at gigs of really showing the faces of the people that make this stuff actually happen. So thank you so much. Yeah, no, thank you. Yeah, all right, now we have the pleasure of sitting down with Stu Heathcote. Stu is the president of live events at Rocket, overseeing music, experiential, film, and TV across the entire Rocket family of brands. He came to Rocket after two decades at AEG Presents, where he led global partnerships and helped launch the marketing campaign behind Taylor Swift's 1989 world tour, including the Emmy-winning Interactive Experience. Billboard named him a brand Power Player multiple times. And before that, he led the marketing teams of the 49ers, the powerful sports brands, and now he's running the whole live events team here. So, Stu, thank you so much for doing this.

SPEAKER_06 54:38

Thanks for having me.

SPEAKER_00 54:39

Your career is unbelievable. And just in talking before, you keep putting it to other people about how great they are, but this is all about you. I'm I'm amazed at your involvement in live events. What got you in? What was your first gig?

SPEAKER_06 54:53

I don't even know if it was a gig. It was I grew up as a basketball player and I was very fortunate to get into UCLA for basketball. Awesome. And so I love sports, and that was it. I had a very difficult childhood. So my my therapy was going by myself to a basketball court and shooting, and it progressed and I got better and better. So it was uh it got me into the dream school I always wanted to get into. And then, you know, along the way you get hit with the tough moments, right? I got called into the office, said that we don't have a roster spot for you this season, those kind of things. So do you stay at your dream school or do you transfer to a smaller school and play basketball, right? And so those are the things that, you know, I had to articulate. I had a lot of good friends, I had a lot of good friends on the team, I had a lot of that stuff going for me. So I said, I'm gonna stick this out. I've always wanted to be here, and I think it's gonna open more doors for me. So I had an opportunity, my agent got me a gig in uh Switzerland. So I played for a professional team in Switzerland for one season, didn't make much money, um, but I got to travel. I got a free place to live, I got to take the train to visit my friends from college. So it was an amazing experience, and it really opened my mind up to how much I love travel and how much I love experiences in other places. And so I traveled down, took a train down to Spain, and I met the president of the apparel division at Reebok. And uh, this is gonna date me a little bit, but we met at a payphone. He was calling home uh to check on family. Wow. And I was in line at the payphone, and I think I had a silly UCLA shirt on or something. So he said, Oh, you're American. Like, what are you doing here? Blah, blah, blah. And so we ironically stayed in touch. When I, after the season ended, I ended up writing him a letter. Um, he remembered me. He got me an interview in the Orange County office, the sales office of Reebok at the time with the regional head Joe Harlow. She played basketball at Duke. We had a nice little connection, but she said, for this job, you have no experience and you're absolutely not qualified. And I said, Okay, great. And I said, Well, if there's anything you think I'm qualified for as you move forward, let me know because I'm very passionate about sports and being in this industry. About six months later, they said, Hey, we have an entry-level position. We loved your passion. Would you want to come back and interview for it? And so started on the ground level, learned the industry, was in customer service working with some of the outside sales reps for I would say roughly a year, and got promoted into the team sports division. Um, I opened some doors for them at UCLA through the marketing department in Boston, and we negotiated the UCLA sort of 300. It was one of the first 360 footwear and apparel deals. Wow. Um at UCLA. And so I got involved with dealing with them. I was doing athlete contracts in different leagues, and then how do we translate those negotiations and those deals into selling at retail, right? Because you're really doing marketing, so it translates into sales, right? And so it gave me a great mindset on the sales side and the marketing side. I think being in customer service, working with sales reps, and then working with athletes to understand the marketing side and how we needed those sort of anchors. And then from there, as Reebok started to lose market share, get more out of Cleaton, go back to more casual footwear, I loved the sports and performance side and was recruited uh by Adidas to join them. So Adidas basically came and said, Hey, look, we're trying to get back because Adidas went away for a while. You guys are all probably too young to remember that. And then it came back in the late 90s and early 2000s, and it was like, how do we get back entrenched in performance North America on field sports? And so they had the idea that they wouldn't, you know, work with uh the NFL. Um so they that's when they called me and said, Hey, would you be interested in helping us do licensing deals with the NFL and then work to get on field? And so we basically had five teams that we had. It was when the league split up their licensing. So you had Puma, you had Nike, and you had Adidas, and we had the Patriots and the Chargers and the 49ers. We were executing the launch of the Houston Texans, and we had the Buccaneers as well. So it was getting to work around those teams. As I worked closely with the 49ers and got to know their president, they were like, hey, would you ever consider coming to run marketing and business development for us? Immediately after I agreed to do that, they suspended the owner and we had a whole transition, and it was a very different operating model from the new ownership to the former ownership, even though it remained in the same family. So it was really interesting for me to see how one owner looked at it and another owner looked at it. Honestly, like those tougher times are where you really get the education from. And so uh we went through kind of years of that. I was really desperate to get back to LA. I had an offer from the Dodgers, I had an offer from AEG. I chose to go with AEG because it was emerging. And the pitch from the old CEO was we're gonna acquire a lot of music businesses and a lot of music promoters, but I don't have the slightest clue how to monetize that. And I need your help to build that and run with the music division. And so I kind of became almost employee number one. So I was working on some sports projects there because obviously AEG owns the Kings and the Galaxy and teams in Europe and has a lot of entrenchment. They own a large percentage of the Lakers at the time. Um, but it was really the thought of okay, like we can take this like a stock and go up. So Golden Voice, Concerts West, Messina Touring Group, all these, you know, the all the big touring groups that are not Live Nation went under the AEG Presents Umbrella, which was AEG Live at the time. And then it was up to us to figure out ways to grow the business and get people comfortable, more comfortable with partnerships and broadcast deals, content, and all the things. So it was 20 years there. It was an amazing run. I got to work around some very legendary concert promoters, the Louis Messinas and the Paul Tillettes and the Paul Gongawares and the John Maglins and Larry Vallins, and these are I and Jay Marciano, of course, who's currently the CEO. So it was really a great education. And I had to go in as an outsider because I was always in sports and really prove myself to say, I'm not necessarily a sports guy.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 1:01:09

You know, because a lot of the music people back then, it was uncomfortable. It was like, you know, it was like putting on that uncomfortable leather jacket, right? You love it, but it doesn't quite fit.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:17

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 1:01:18

And then over time, it fits perfectly and you want to wear it every day. And so once they got comfortable with my personality and the way I looked at things and the way we approach things in a really thoughtful way, an intentional way, as opposed to a transactional way, we knew we could build things together. And so we had a lot of success on like the Taylor Swift campaigns, obviously, Paul Toulette's Bill Fold, Legends, how they built Coachella. Yeah. Get to see, have a front row seat and work with them on that. And uh, so a lot of really, really unique properties. I mean, there were hundreds of them around the world. And so it was uh it was a great time to be, it was a great time to be alive, as they say.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:58

Well, and I mean, you being a pioneer in all of this, the a theme that I was hearing in this whole story is that you just kept kept putting yourself out there and people were noticing. You weren't begging for anything, like the opportunities were coming to you. So it's telling me that you were proving yourself in whatever role you took on because what did you really know about partnerships when you started with Reebok? And then you learned that, and then you had to go into doing that with Adidas in a whole new world with NFL. How did you learn that? And how did you know that you could become the expert in that?

SPEAKER_06 1:02:31

Uh look, I think it's a lot, like learning is you have to be passionate about learning, right? I mean, then all of it, right? And every day is learning. I think kids in college, when I hear them, they're like, Well, I just want to get a job so I can get on with my life. Well, every day you're doing homework and every day you're reading, and every day you're learning about the industry, and every day you're learning about the people you work around, and you're learning about all sorts of different things, right? And so the learning never stops. And if you're humble in that and you read and you stay up on things, it's gonna kind of give you a little bit of a head start or whatnot. I think my approach has always been, you know, treat the security guard, treat any worker, any security guard at a venue, anybody the same, whether it's a legend like a Paul Tillette or whether it's someone that you're walking by and you see going into the office every day that has to check your badge. And and if you can treat everybody really respectfully and try to brighten up their day just a little bit, I believe that brings in a great culture. And when you have great culture, that's what really is a driving force. And I think there's challenges within that, right? But if it's not for them, it's not for them. It's like we we always said back in the day, look, if it's if it's impossible, just say no. If it's difficult, let's give it a try. And so you take the impossible and you move on. But if it's hard, that's kind of the fun part because the hard is the challenge, and then the challenge is the journey, and the journey is usually the fun part of the end.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:59

Boom. Something that you really enjoyed bringing to AEG was the relationship instead of the transactional. And I can imagine, did you learn that in brand partnerships through um with NFL, with all these different apparel companies? Partnerships require just relationship, which then can make you a lot of money. How did you bring that into AEG?

SPEAKER_06 1:04:21

Early on in Coachella, when maybe the festival wasn't as well known or struggling as we had an offer on a on a new music product. I don't want to mention the brand. It's a massive brand, but they were not entrenched in music and their credibility in music maybe wasn't where it should have been at that time. And so we got offered a crazy amount of money for the festival to be able to launch this product. And so I sat down with the creator of Coachella Paul Toled and I said, look, this is enormous money. This can catapult us. This is it. And he said, Listen, it may help us financially, but this product won't be around in a year or two. And I don't want to align this festival and this brand with something that won't be here in two years because it will damage the brand, it will damage the credibility of the brand.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:08

Wow.

SPEAKER_06 1:05:09

And so we passed on a big check. And, you know, there's partners, there's financial partners, there's things that put a lot of weight on that and a lot of pressure on that. But that was another moment and another nugget of you don't need to be transactional. Yes, you need to pick up business, yes, you need to sell deals, yes, you need to go after these leagues and all the things. But at the end of the day, the transactional piece of it is maybe not as powerful as looking at the long-term journey and the long-term vision of it. Um, so those there those were a couple examples of good lessons I learned along the way.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:41

Let's just look at what Coachella is now. It's I I mean, I know it as obviously a great music festival, one of the top, top destinations to go, but also it is brand activation central. And it's what so many other festivals are now trying to emulate. And so it's um let's get into Rocket. What brought you? From AEG to Rocket.

SPEAKER_06 1:06:02

I got a call from an old friend that was on uh the private equity side, and he was a part of the team that purchased Rocket many, many years ago. And when they were doing their due diligence, he called me. He's an old, an amazing human being. His name's Bill Lenahan. He was, how do I describe this guy? Just in case I get this soundbite, I have to send it to him. But he is, he's a North Star, right? So we went to UCLA together, dear friends, all American water polo player, road scholar candidate at UCLA, modeled on the side, went to uh Wharton Business School, lived in New York as a banker, hardest working guy you'll ever meet, one of the smartest human beings you ever meet. And I introduced him to his wife, so I take credit for that. They have two amazing kids. But he was part of the team that was doing due diligence on Rocket. And he called me, said, Hey, you're sitting in the Epicenter of Music in LA. I'm trying to learn more about the music business. I'm looking at buying this company Rocket Cargo. Is there any expertise you can give me on how tours are routed, how the infrastructure of touring works globally, all that stuff? So I said, Hey, why don't you come down, spend a week in the office? I'm going to introduce you to some touring legends and see if you can pick up any nuggets of information around that. And that'll be helpful in the transaction. And so he came in and did that. And fast forward, probably 10, 12 years later, um, he called me and he said, Hey, I was having, I was running down to get a coffee and I ran into a board member at Rocket, who's currently was owned by a company, ATL. And that board member said, Yeah, we have a great board. It's a lot of folks that are on the logistics side or the fray forwarding side, but we don't really have anybody that understands commercial on the board. And Bill said, Well, I have a really good friend that is an executive on the commercial side at AEG, should pick his brain. And he's built a lot of commercial organizations along the way. And so ended up talking to the gentleman. Then COVID hit. I did a couple Zoom calls with the CEO at the time, and they reached out and asked me to join the board. So obviously I went back to AEG and said, is this even okay? And they said, Yeah, it's a non-compete, it'll be good experience. So I went and did it. And then during that journey, we made the decision that we needed to hire a new chairman. And so there's a gentleman that's our chairman now, Dan Rosenthal. So we went through the interview process. Myself and the and the head of the board were very involved in that. And Dan is an Orstar. He's one of those visionaries. He is nothing is nothing can defeat me. Positivity, energy bust, lifestyle. You can't help but just want to run through a wall for this guy.

SPEAKER_00 1:08:50

Wow.

SPEAKER_06 1:08:50

And the rest of the team, I know, feels the same way. And so he trusted me enough to invite me into the room to sell the business at the time. You know, I think it really is a good example of, you know, John Wooden had this old saying, right? Just as a UCLA basketball knuckle, let's say it. But it was like, it's what you learn after you know it all that matters. And so you go into these things thinking, oh, well, I've done all these great things in the industry and blah, blah, blah. And so it really humbles you. You're in front of bankers, you're in front of people that are far smarter than me. Dan's far smarter than me. That's just you're listening and you're learning, and every question, there's a reason behind it. You know, Dan really said you have to listen to the question and understand why the question's being asked, what the motivation is, what was asked before that question to take you to that question, and what do you think is going to be asked after that question? And so he really had this knowledge of how these guys think. And it was an incredible learning experience for a long period of time. So I was really blessed to be able to go through that. It was a big reason why I wanted to come on board. I miss my dear friends at where I work for 20 years, and we still, a lot of them, we talk all the time.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:58

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 1:09:58

Um, because I learned so much from each one of them in different ways. So so much respect for that, and you know, a lot of respect for the lessons that Dan taught me along the way since joining.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:11

Wow. Since joining, how many years ago?

SPEAKER_06 1:10:14

Well, the board I was on for two years, and then I've been in this operator role for two years.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:20

What have you felt like is the biggest transition for you?

SPEAKER_06 1:10:22

I think going through the sale process was obviously very crazy. A lot of months in New York, right? Just trying to understand, you know, what pushes the buttons of the people, right? Because you really want to build culture. You want to have everybody rowing the boat in the same direction.

SPEAKER_01 1:10:37

Got it.

SPEAKER_06 1:10:38

And when you acquire a lot of new businesses and you bring new businesses on board, and people might have had a lot of passion for those businesses they were in before they were purchased, you have to figure out a way to bring everybody together. And that doesn't just mean personalities or culture. It means integration, it means brand integration, means a lot of different things.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:57

So, how did the FIFA relationship come to be?

SPEAKER_06 1:11:00

You know, I was on the board at the time, and Dan said, Hey, why don't you come with me? A gentleman by the name of Brent Nagy, who's also an incredible commercial agent. Um, he leads our mega event strategy. He leads how do we get into these bigger things, and he is super nice. He's built this amazing relationship with FIFA, really give him a ton of credit for that, and Dan as well, because these relationships are difficult, right? And they become your family, and sometimes family gets difficult, right? There's wants and needs and all those things. So we went back to Zurich and started the conversation. They didn't really know much about us, but it gave me a chance to see someone like Dan and someone like Brent and the head of our board, Andy Clark, be in a room and talk about the business and present. I happen to know the commercial person from my past life in the commercial side, uh Nick Brown. And um, those guys have really led this thing and done such an amazing job. Now it's about execution. Yeah. The teams are built. Um, you have great leadership in Ed Reno that Darren has really pushed people out into roles that they're going to succeed in. He's done an amazing job of identifying that. I think Ed Reno has done the same thing. We have Brandon Bowles, we have Nick Kashpark. We have we have a great team of people that are ready to lead and get through this event. It's the biggest event in the world. There'll be a lot of challenges, but we have the right team to pull it off.

SPEAKER_00 1:12:18

In world history. That's every world history that's ever been put on. Yeah. It's a pretty big task.

SPEAKER_06 1:12:24

Tiny little thing.

SPEAKER_00 1:12:24

Tiny little thing that y'all's motto is that failure is not an option. And so for the biggest sporting event in world history, there's a lot of pressure that goes into that. So you have to have the right teams in place for your role in particular. I love that you're talking about um with culture and making sure that everyone is pushing towards the same goal. What is that in your mind for FIFA in particular, the World Cup, while the rest of Rocket's business is still moving?

SPEAKER_06 1:12:53

Yeah, well, it's interesting, right? And it's we move what moves you. And certainly FIFA and the World Cup move a lot of people emotionally. Yeah. And so we're excited to see that play out. I think from the standpoint of how do we look at that business, right? So we have to deliver critically. The most important thing is delivering for FIFA and creating the best event with FIFA that we can, getting things to the right place, making sure the venues are all executing. We have a control tower approach where the information goes and gets distributed to the different places they need to be distributed to. But I think there's other two other circles involved in this. One is all the broadcasters, right? All those needs that they have. Now we may not have 100% of that business, but we have a really good portion of that business. And I think what that can do is then take it into the next mega event where we continue to work with those broadcasters, right? And so when you look at the third circle of it, call it, it is experiential and all of the other things. So yes, FIFA is a moment in time. There will be more World Cup, Women's World Cup in Brazil, but that's a little more centralized, right? So not as much movement across three countries, 16 cities. But what happens is you're then now have relationships with the broadcasters, you have relationships with those brands, those agencies, those experiential folks that are critical as you go forward. Because it look, experiential is trade shows and conventions and sporting events and music events and festivals, especially, and so many other things, right? And so how do we take that business or have the right analytics on how we look at going after the TAM and making it global and then building these relationships with the agencies and brands and obviously the other trade shows and conventions that we spoke about? So it's huge. So we have to get this right. Yeah. You know, again, failure's not an option. Um, and I believe we have the right team to do it.

SPEAKER_00 1:14:50

Talk to me a bit more about these experiential, it's it's more than just the event itself, it's the branded activations and the experiential components that you guys have to move. Can you talk about what some of those could be that have been in the past or what they're going to be with the World Cup?

SPEAKER_06 1:15:05

Yeah, I mean, look, it's the low-hanging fruit is kind of the world I come from, right? And so if you go back to a Coachella or a stagecoach or some of these other 40 festivals we had oversight to at AEG, all of those brands are what helps pay for not only the event, but the artists, bookings, and all the things, right? So you have to have the brand's involvement in all of these events, whether it's music, whether it's sports, whatever it might be. I mean, you know, you have now wellness exhibitions and you have, you know, museum exhibition. You have all these kind of things, right? That need to go from one place to the other. Yeah. So, you know, you might have an American Express that's at Electric Forest in the middle of nowhere. Work with Momentum who's our agency, and you get the Amex activations and you get them to Electric Forest. So that's just one of thousands of these opportunities.

SPEAKER_00 1:15:55

Especially now that everything is the value of having those in-person events around events is everywhere. Everyone's doing it now. Every brand has to do it.

SPEAKER_06 1:16:05

And and I think the crossover between sports and music, right? If you're when has FIFA ever done halftime shows at the capacity they're doing them now, right? I mean, Katie, who we've done her tour for many, many years. Uh, we did her tour when I was at AEG.

SPEAKER_02 1:16:19

Yes.

SPEAKER_06 1:16:20

Uh, we do her tour here at Rocket. Uh Justin Carbona, who you met earlier, is involved in that. Et Sol's involved in that, and she'll be performing at the LA Open or for the U.S. Paraguay match. So these things have connectivity. We have to get in and make sure that we're making sure that connectivity turns into business, making sure that we're driving the relationships, making sure we're pushing the commercial forward. And that, you know, that's going to be the key to our success going forward. But again, it's about the people. It always comes back to the people. And when you talk about Darren Brown and you talk about these team of leaders that we have, you know, you talk about Fritz on the art and car side, incredible leaders and but incredible human beings that are just really passionate about what they do. And I might have a fun history, but the things I've already learned from Darren Brown are incredible and next level. Angus, who runs our marketing, I learn from him every day. Um, so there's just that's that's where the important stuff comes, that's where the secret sauce comes in the people. And this is an asset light business with people that have been here for decades, and they are people that really care about success and getting things to the next place. Sometimes those emotions can be high because there's a lot of pressure on delivery. And so we just want to make sure that we're providing the best environment for them to work, the best environment for them to perform, and you know, all things move forward.

SPEAKER_00 1:17:45

And it's very apparent, obviously, in how much you guys dominate touring and music where I come from and where a lot of our listeners come from, but to see the expansion of this, that of what just showing the world what you can handle while still handling pretty much every major tour ever.

SPEAKER_06 1:18:01

So that and and and it's such a good point because we may have a significant amount of market share in global touring. Yeah, but we want more. So if you look back on festivals in general, right, festivals were culturally a European feel, right? And you look at Glastonbury and some of the other big festivals, no one really thought it could work in the States until Paul Tollette had this vision. But what's happened is, you know, when music and brands were not culturally appropriate, when everybody wanted to be indie, I'm not selling out, all those things. Well, now it's quite the opposite, right? I mean, you see brand activations almost as big as some of the headliners. You also see headliners showing up at the brand booths. You know, like an example in American Express, who has a relationship with an Olivia Rodrigo. She's gonna show up at that Amex activation because Amex might be a tour partner that's offering access to that tour. So the brand and the music infrastructure are becoming closer and closer. And that didn't happen 10 to 15 years ago. And so when you really pull it back, it's like, how do we figure out ways to get more entrenched and experiential because of what's happening in the music business and what's obviously been happening in sports, but more so in music now because all those music artists want to be aligned with these different companies that can elevate and expand their platform. And so, you know, it's about aligning with the right brand, but that right band wants to travel. Wow. And that's where we come in. And so whether they're hitting six festivals in the festival season or 20 festivals, we've got to get those activations site to site and we've got to move them the right way, and we gotta get them in and we gotta get them activated and set up so that they could perform for the fans because truly the brands are performing for the patrons now as well.

SPEAKER_00 1:19:49

And if you're gonna build an incredible experiential setup, why use it just one time? Move it around, do a bunch. Yeah, use Rocket for that. Yeah, I could talk to you for hours. But this was this was fascinating. Thank you for sharing your your career. We're all very excited to see what you guys do. Thank you, especially with this World Cup. It's awesome. Thank you so much.

SPEAKER_06 1:20:10

Thank you.

SPEAKER_00 1:20:11

Thank you to Rocket for giving us an inside look into the operations, logistics, and people that make the world's largest event happen. When you are watching the FETA World Cup this summer, just know that Rocket got everything to all 16 stadiums. Thank you all so much for watching and go you instead.