Pat, Nicole and Patti: A Collective Vision for Inclusive Leadership

What if fostering inclusivity and promoting women in leadership could improve the workplace?  

Join us as we celebrate a decade of impactful conversations with Pat Jones, the founder of the Women's Leadership Institute podcast, and Nicole Carpenter, the director. This special episode is rich with personal anecdotes, as Pat shares heartwarming traditions of generosity with her grandchildren, and Nicole discusses adapting family rituals to keep her teenagers engaged. We reflect on the transformative Elevate Her Challenge, a beacon of progress for over 350 companies in Utah, with Zions Bank leading the charge in supporting gender diversity and fostering inclusive workspaces.  

From boardroom dynamics to personal growth stories, we wrap up a decade of progress with a collective vision for inclusive leadership, emphasizing the need for allies and advocates to champion female leaders in all arenas.

www.wliut.com
@utwomenleaders

Transcript

Speaker 1 0:05

Welcome to Elevate a Women's Leadership Institute podcast, where we showcase stories, celebrate successes and shift culture. Hello and welcome to another episode of Elevate, a Women's Leadership Institute podcast out our year, our decade of this podcast in showcasing stories of companies and how they've taken the elevator challenge of showcasing alumni and the amazing things that they have done and all the people adjacent to that who move this work forward in our state. So, to kind of wrap up, this year we have brought back Pat Jones, who's the founder of the Women's Leadership Institute, and Nicole Carpenter, who is the director, and we're going to have a conversation kind of to bookend this year with you. So thank you for being here with us this year and for sharing these conversations.

Speaker 1 0:52

Pat and Nicole, welcome, as always it's a pleasure Thank you this feels a little formalized you know, according to our normal conversations, but because it is the holiday season, we always ask guests something personal We'd love you to share, like a holiday tradition or memory or something about that.

Speaker 3 1:09

As we begin the podcast, Sure, I'll go ahead and start. I have four teenagers at home, so I'm finding that traditions that worked when they were little don't work so much anymore. Traditions that worked when they were little don't work so much anymore. I found one thing that I like to do is ask my kids at the beginning of the season what their favorite tradition is or their favorite activity, to make sure that we include everybody's favorite. But most importantly, we just have to include food, because they just want to be there for the food. So we have crepes for breakfast on Christmas morning and that's a favorite. Christmas pajamas are a favorite. I've leaned into charcuterie boards and everybody loves those. So really it's all about the food right now.

Speaker 2 1:59

It's always about the food.

Speaker 3 2:01

It used to be about Santa Claus and toys and fun things but now it's just fun, just different.

Speaker 2 2:08

Food is fun how about you Pat.

Speaker 2 2:10

Well, I agree that these traditions change and I think we need to be okay with them changing. I know for me it's very different now. I think in the olden days, if you want to call it that, that we received maybe some clothing or just an outfit for school for Christmas and then for Easter, and nowadays everybody just goes and gets what they need along the year. So those needs are not there. So I think people are looking for experiential things with their families. But in what I've adopted in the last few years is I have 11 grandchildren and I.

Speaker 2 2:51

We kind of talk about that in the year of bringing some money with them and we go to desert industries and we just select. We kind of take turns. We watch as everybody does this, watch for people that might need an extra boost, and it's really interesting to see these little kids really see people instead of just walking by them. They're, they're looking for certain things. Then after we do that, we all watch them as they. We watch them, choose the person they want to give to, and then we go back and we have them write their experience down and then on Christmas Eve when we have our family party, they talk through that and just talk about how they felt doing that.

Speaker 2 3:37

I'm trying to get them to save money during the year where they can give their own money Right now, I hope that. But what I'm going to do this year is just ask them what would you normally buy if you had $50? And so I think that will help them. See, you know that this hopefully it'll be a little painful for them at least be able to see the real reason why we want to do it.

Speaker 1 4:00

Yeah, yeah, I love that. Thank you both for sharing right Food is super important and also remembering part of the season. Yeah, yeah, I love that. Thank you both for sharing Right Food is super important and also remembering part of the season. Yeah, for us we I'm I'm not creative enough, probably not consistent enough to do Elf on the Shelf, but we do count down 12 elves elves. So every year the elves are the same and one of them really likes shiny things, so they hide in really shiny things. One of them really likes sugary things, right, so it might be find in the sugar bowl or like in the candy, and then we set them underneath the tree and so we know it's a countdown I have an eight year old, so I'm still working on the magic part of it, you still have lots of magic.

Speaker 1 4:43

Which is fun. Thank you for that. I appreciate knowing your traditions and a little bit about that. So as we wrap up this year, I want to overview our main programs the Elevate Her Challenge and a decade and 350 companies throughout the state, across all industries. As we look back on the Elevate elevator challenge, it came in a dream we talked about that in the very beginning in January having a product for WLI. As you look back over the decade, what have been some standouts in how companies have embraced the challenge and the changes that they have made in their companies? What are some standouts for you?

Speaker 2 5:29

Well, I would say, of course, science Bank. Who, scott Anderson, was our founder.

Corporate Sponsorship and Cultural Change

Speaker 2 5:34

Yeah, it was his idea, and when he asked me to run the Women's Leadership Institute 10 years ago almost to the day actually it was clear to both of us that Utah needed this. The perception that people had about women in our state, especially those that lived outside the state, was harming our ability to attract and retain talent here, and so to see Zions Bank as the leader and what they did, they really was, they were and are still a pioneer, and that, I think, was something that other companies wanted to follow. So it's given them some structure on how to do it, which has been so important. But I would say Garf, the Garf Enterprises, automotive and, of course, the other enterprises they have. They have Larry H Miller companies.

Speaker 2 6:27

I mean you look at our sponsors CHG Healthcare and Enbridge, formerly Dominion Energy so many great companies that have sponsored us over the years really believe in what we're doing and I think they're changing the culture internally.

Speaker 1 6:42

Yeah.

Speaker 2 6:42

And they're seeing results from that. They're seeing an ROI that is going through the roof for them.

Speaker 1 6:48

Yeah, I love that We've had. We did have Ken Garf on the podcast. We've had Jenny Teamsma and Sarah Starkey from Larry H Miller tell specific examples of how they've done that CHG Healthcare. We talked last time about their maternity and how they've saved a million dollars in being able to retain those mothers who want to come back to work. So excellent examples, thank you. Well, we need to add too.

Speaker 2 7:13

We need to add the Clyde Companies.

Speaker 1 7:15

And Clyde Companies. Yes.

Speaker 2 7:16

Huge male-dominated industry in building roads and asphalt and gravel and those things. So they have really done well too, yeah.

Speaker 3 7:25

It's also been interesting to see how effective the Elevate Her Challenge can be in smaller companies as well, and we've been naming a lot of our larger companies that we work with, but I'm thinking of DPS Skis, under the leadership of their former CEO, alex Adama, and the change that he was able to make when he prioritized it. I'm thinking about Clearfield City and how engaged they are and they're always involved in the things that we're doing with the Elevate Her Challenge and making a difference within their organization, and really what it comes down to are the companies that decide. This is what we want to position. The Elevate Her Challenge matters to us. We're going to make it part of our company culture and, whether you're a large company or a small company, we can see that change happening.

Speaker 2 8:13

And I love that we're statewide. We're really leveraging our footprint throughout the state, whether it's Cache Valley, washington County, kanab. I mean companies are really wanting to and they want to have the same experiences that we have along the Wasatch Front, and so we're finding ways to make that happen.

Speaker 1 8:32

Absolutely, nicole. I want to come back to a comment you said about small and large companies. My first question is do you feel like there's a different implementation for large as opposed to small? And then I know you went and did a lot of work with alex and his teams. Is there anything? You want to share with how they specifically did really well in adopting the elevator challenge. Yeah, that's a great question.

Speaker 3 8:55

They absolutely have different approaches the larger companies and smaller companies and a lot of it has to do with resources. I think that the companies have right. Sure, a larger company could very well have an entire team working to implement the Elevate Her Challenge. At the same time, a larger company that does not have a top-down approach and have the C-suite on board, they won't be successful. So these larger companies that we're talking about, they still have bought in and they have that top-down approach as they're working to set these goals and make these changes. The smaller companies in a way, it's easier for them to have a top-down approach because there's fewer people to get on board right.

Speaker 3 9:34

And if you only are in Utah and you don't have other facilities and other places, then you don't have to worry about what are the other branches going to think? And so sometimes it is easier for the smaller companies to get on board. However, when they don't have the same resources as the larger companies, that's where we've been able to come in and do our best to help them either start an ERG or participate in their ERGs, help with team trainings, help the CEO of these smaller companies, spread the vision to the employees so that it is felt company-wide and make it part of their culture.

Speaker 1 10:17

I love that. Thank you for sharing the difference. And it's not one is better than another. They both have pros and cons, yeah for sure. So, pat, you often introduce the Elevate Her Challenge to CEOs and people in the C-suite as you talk to them about the value of gender diversity. Whether that's the business case or the moral case, or whatever it might be, what do you feel like is their biggest? Oh, I didn't know that. Or oh, I can see that there actually is value. What are a few of those that you've encountered over the decade?

Elevate Her Challenge Benefits Companies

Speaker 2 10:50

Well, it's been very interesting in working with Barbara Annis and the gender intelligence group over the last 10 years because that was really a wonderful find for me personally to understand, through neuroscience, the complementary differences between men and women's brains and how we think differently. Not one is better than the other, but we're complementary and the value that that can bring both into the workplace and at home. If you ask people which I always do when I'm speaking do men and women think differently? 99% of the time they'll say yes, we do, but they don't know how that affects things, they don't know why and they don't know the impact of that on the ROI oftentimes. So I like to tie that together. One of the things that companies are seeing and they're very interested in is when you elevate women, your ROI increases. Your ability to attract and retain talent increases, especially bringing in other women. Women attract other women in a workplace.

Speaker 2 11:54

And then also keeping your employees happy. So all of those good things happen when there's an intentional effort to elevate the stature of women in companies, not just because they're women, but having a pipeline, not to make men and you know feel like they're second, but to intentionally plan ahead and work to mentor women and sponsor women within the company so that they know there's a pathway for them and they have people watching their back that are watching out for them. That's where you see success.

Speaker 1 12:31

Yeah, I love that I. I feel like oftentimes when we talk about DEI or belonging or inclusion, semantics matter because people believe it's a zero sum game. Right, If a woman takes the spot, then it takes it away from a man. But very much that is not what we're in the business of and I love that. You just pointed that out, Pat, that it's the complementary differences and the complementary differences whether it's gender or personality or whatever it is actually improve a company Like that's. That is in the statistics over and over again, that you get a better product, you get a better company. So complementary differences, you'd say, is one of the biggest ahas people take away and and then figuring out how right, the how of that.

Speaker 2 13:17

What I've loved is watching companies that take the Elevate Her Challenge improve their communication internally. So it opens up a new door for them, conversations that they hadn't had before. For instance, you know why does a woman go into the bathroom and talk to other women about some bad behavior of a man they work with? You know we encourage women not to do that. We encourage women to, you know, take that person aside and gently, but honestly and respectfully, tell them you know what they didn't appreciate and what they would have preferred them doing. And so we really do believe that men are advocates and allies of women. Men are half of our board. As you know, we love working with men. They're important in all of this process. So helping them understand the role that they play and the value that they will receive by working hard to elevate women they work with.

Speaker 1 14:16

You also were nodding your head on that. Do you have something you wanted to add to that, nicole, about?

Speaker 3 14:19

conversations About conversations. Yeah, yeah, I just love that a piece of paper or an idea has been able to shift the way a conversation starts, and it's just been fun to see how a room can have a conversation around the six pillars in the Elevate Her Challenge without pointing any fingers yeah, without shame or blame.

Speaker 3 14:44

Without blaming how did we get here? What mistakes were made? Like those conversations, they will eventually need to be made, but in that moment people can just say these are the goals that we want to set and that's been a fun thing to see that positive launch.

Speaker 2 15:02

And I think it's also fun to see women realize that they have a responsibility too, because men we know from research men oftentimes feel like they're walking on eggshells, or that they don't know what they can say to a woman that they work with eggshells, or that they don't know what they can say to a woman that they work with. And so what the Elevate Her Challenge has done is open up permission for people to talk about these things in a way they haven't before, and it really solidifies the loyalty and the camaraderie within a company. When there's an openness and it's okay to talk about this, and in fact, if leadership opens that up, then you know that's where you really see value.

Speaker 3 15:42

Yeah, yeah, and the conversation's different now than it was 10 years ago, yeah. Like like talk about how hard it was to get companies to even listen about the Elevate Her Challenge in the beginning.

Speaker 2 15:53

Well, I think they were. Some of them were ready, they just weren't sure what it was. But absolutely, we see people that are jumping on Nicole. That's a great point, jumping on, you know. Oh, so other companies are doing it. Well, we need to, you know, be there too. But really where the magic happens is when they do follow the pillars that we have in our Elevate Her Challenge. And they're seeing the ROI. They're seeing retention rates, for instance, improve. They're seeing the communication within their companies improve. So we're seeing tangible results. How we measure them has been a difficult thing over the years. And then I think scaling is. Another challenge for us is helping companies know the value, whether it's in St George, their companies, or Logan, or you know different parts of the Wasatch Front. It's a huge value for them to understand what they can get if they're intentionally working on this problem.

Speaker 1 16:50

Yeah, I love that you pointed out the value, not only internally right within their own teams and having those crucial conversations right that we talk about in our programs, but also just as a good business practice. It's a good strategy practice to know how to make your bottom line, to know how to 86% right of consumer decisions are made by women, so it would make sense that you have women and other diversity in those areas. I know that's one thing this 10 years we've really tried to do is quantify and as we've quantified from zions and chg and others, it's millions in savings over the decades that we have helped companies with, and um ken garf often says that when they sought to elevate their women, they actually elevated their whole workforce and I love that idea right, Because it creates abundance, which is actually what this is all about. Is abundance, absolutely yeah. So, as we pivot into our programs which came out of the how, how do we do this elevator challenge? One of the ways which we facilitate that is our programs.

Speaker 1 17:58

Pds has been around for the political development series 10 years. That's where we started. Then we went to CDS, which has been around for six years, our career development series for mid to senior level women. We now have Rising Leaders, rls, which is in its second, third year, starting third, starting third, yeah. And we also have next chapter, which will start in January, for those women who, after an extended absence, are wanting to come back into the workforce. So we're really hitting the pipeline all along the way. So I just want to talk a little bit about our programs. A decade is a lot of speakers, speakers, and one thing often that I know, pat you say, is it's really important that we have quality speakers who speak to the importance of what the women are doing in the workplace right, we care how you dress, but more than that, we care how you can carry on a hard conversation, right about your boss, Like you just mentioned.

Speaker 1 18:51

don't go into the bathroom with your girlfriends. You can do that too, but please also know how to have the conversation. So let's talk about our programs a little bit. I know that we all adore the growth of our over a thousand alumni throughout the state. I'd love you to share some experiences of the programs whether it be speakers or alumni, or companies that have really stood out to you over the years.

Empowering Women Through Leadership Development

Speaker 2 19:16

Well, I'll mention one, and this one is a little more recent, because we've had amazing speakers, and I think they're not just speakers, they're listeners, and you know there are people that are in oftentimes in that industry, and so they've had experience, but they have expertise. So I would say the quality of our presenters and our listeners is extremely high. Just as an example, though, that I just thought of is Joseph Grenny, who wrote the book Crucial Conversations and was a New York Times bestseller for a long time. It's a wonderful book, and he spoke last year for the first time and is coming back again this year. Well, his speaking fee is extremely high, uh, other places, but, um, my husband and I went to. My husband knows him fairly well.

Speaker 2 20:03

We went to lunch with him and I told him what we were doing and I asked him if he would speak and I wondered what his speaking fee would be. Well, he offered to do it for free and has offered to come back, um, because he sees the value and he sees the changes in the faces as he's teaching these just extremely important skills to women, and so it gives him something inside that a lot of our speakers do, and I would say this is my biggest pleasant surprise is the willingness and the desire and the passion that these expertise experts in the fields are willing to offer in many cases offer for free to help women be elevated in the state of Utah and that has been such a joy and such a generous gift to us to have the quality that we do, including the supreme, the female supreme court justices in our state, thanks to one of our board members that helped that happen. But just everyone is working together to make sure that we offer the best quality that we possibly can and they are getting it.

Speaker 1 21:13

I love that you touched on that. The speakers that you ask are more than willing because they know there's a need. Right, that goes back to the value too. Thank you for sharing that. Joseph Grinney definitely blew my mind, and it was fun to see women be like. What I remember from him is the lag time right Between when something happens and addressing it, and the longer the lag time, the more you let it go, the harder it's going to be.

Speaker 3 21:43

So even just that one tidbit has stuck with me and I'm not on it for a year just thinking about it, nicole, yeah, I'm reminded of one of our first years in the career development series.

Speaker 3 21:52

Utah Valley University hosted us and we heard from President Tuminez and I just to this day and we heard from President Tuminez and I just to this day. That was one of my favorite presentations. I can relate to her in like she's like just this tiny little spitfire and I'm five foot one and she's like several inches shorter than me and she just was amazing. I mean, she commanded the room, she spoke about confidence, she spoke about creating your leadership path and I was just really impressed with her and the message that she shared with our career development series. But also they were fantastic hosts and you know we were honored to that. They would share their facility with us and she was great.

Speaker 2 22:38

You know, as you talk about that, the importance of women learning and knowing that they don't have to be what we call a leader, that they are a leader and they're an influencer regardless of where they are. They don't have to have a title. This is one of the things that I think our women are learning in these programs is that they have influence, that they are gaining confidence in many cases, some of them already have it you know.

Speaker 2 23:07

But it is a little bit more difficult for women historically to feel like they, you know, can and do the same things that and take opportunities that are out there for them. So I would say this is one of the great joys that I have had is to watch these women understand their value and to take their rightful place in whatever leadership or influence role that they have.

Speaker 1 23:34

Yeah, that is a great point and I think one thing coming into this that I have really appreciated is, um, the word that's in my mind is executive presence. Right, like you remember the president's presence yes, more than what she said. Like when we go in for CDS into different companies and the executives come in and oftentimes they're men. I'm thinking of, like Scott Beck with CHG and seeing how that executive presence just really encompasses all the people on his team. Getting access to be able to see what that looks like and feels like, I think is really invaluable.

Speaker 1 24:25

I remember when I started in the political development series as a participant. I still remember one of the it's going to make me cry, it's so silly but one of the ladies, as she walked in to give her speech, just came with such an energy and presence that I was like I want to be her. How does she do that? Like the words she said and how she held herself. That taught me volumes. You know that you could read in a book, but experiencing it, I think, is something really magical you learned very well.

Speaker 3 25:02

Well, thank you. I love your vulnerability and I think that that is one of the things that makes our program special is that we're able to create a safe space for that vulnerability.

Speaker 1 25:14

Yeah, that's a great goal.

Speaker 3 25:15

You know I'm thinking about our career development series. One thing that has been standard always is our month one.

Speaker 3 25:22

We do a predictive index assessment and we do something called the career drivers exercise, which used to be owned by Instructure. Now it's owned by Bridge, for those of you that are listening, and it's like card game, essentially about what matters to you, and I know it's going to be me. I can't even tell you the number of times I've seen these women who are strangers They've just met. They've been paired off into pairs and they're going through this card exercise and they're trying to decide what matters to them and in that moment they're so emotional and you can see it in their eyes and you can feel it in their heart, like it's like palpitates through the room as they're doing this exercise, and that moment when they realize what really matters to them, and then that sets the foundation. I mean that's pretty powerful stuff.

Speaker 1 26:14

I love that you said that they realize and they also have permission. I feel like Pat, as our leader, is so good at giving women permission, both by your example and how you've set this up. Maybe women are motivated by money, maybe they're motivated by flexibility, maybe they're motivated by recognition and all those things matter. None are better than another. It's just understanding yourself right and then showing up authentically and in that presence.

Speaker 2 26:39

I think when you get older that's you know I'm getting up there I think you can evaluate more clearly what matters to you and I love what we've come to, my husband and I. We talk about this. In Finding Forrester there's a line that said, yes, I accept the good and the bad, I accept all of it. And I think, as you look back through your life, everybody has stresses. We have challenges to accept those things and to learn from them. But to accept them and not live in the past but live in the present and hope for the future and enjoy life and have a zest for life, that's what I'm learning as I'm getting ready to retire and I'm really grateful for that.

Speaker 2 27:28

I'm grateful that I can look at it through that lens. Yeah, you know a lot of people don't have that opportunity. So I it's not lost on me that I'm I'm very lucky and I'm lucky to have you both. I mean you know that I adore you. I mean what a gift it is to work with people that you love. I mean literally love and respect, and I have had that honor for the last 10 years.

Speaker 1 27:53

Thank you. I think there's a great synergy when we find how much we care about these women and the companies who are supporting them. Yeah, um, we did. Um, we did have Doug and Janine on our podcast talking about a little bit of what you just said of, yes, the past happened, whatever's holding you back or whatever. Um, maybe you did have a bad experience at a past company or whatever that is and that needs to be seen and witnessed, but don't live there, right? I love the quote. If you're going through hell, don't build a house there. I love that. Just keep going, just keep going. Ride your bike past it. That's right.

Speaker 2 28:35

Before we move on from our programs, anything else that either of you want to share about them, Well, I think they're all complimentary, you know, as I started the political development series right after I got out of the Senate, so it was more for practical reasons. I knew the players, I understood, and so I started that just a few months after I was asked to run the Women's Leadership Institute. Because I do believe, and I always talk about this, but the importance of being involved in politics is extremely important for women in particular, because I lived for 14 years in the legislature and I was oftentimes the only woman on many of my committees, especially in the Senate, where there are so few women, and I saw the, the, the, just the issues that were so important to women and women have so much more experience in, typically in healthcare, education, environmental issues, gun laws and those sorts of things. I could see the lack of, of, uh, framing that from a woman's perspective, and so I do believe that running for office is very different than other kinds of leadership, but it helps develop those leadership skills. The ability to speak in public, the ability to write, those are all important. Problem solving, critical thinking, persuasion so many of these skills are honed when people, women in particular, run for office, and so I'm always, you know, being an evangelist for that, because it's important to have a voice, but you really have to have a vote to impact policy.

Speaker 1 30:15

Yeah, I know, as I do the social media, and I follow people who participants who've graduated from PDS who are currently running. I'm always like you did it, go for it. You know, and they're on both sides of the aisle and they're running in different races, but I'm just so happy to see that they are engaging and you know their highs and their lows and embracing all of that as they go through it. Anything else about programs you want to share, nicole?

Speaker 3 30:42

It's been so fun to see the growth of the programs themselves, but also the women in the programs. As we approach our sixth year of the Career Development Series, the women that we're working with behind the scenes to make it happen for other women within their company are the women who were in the program several years ago. So there's this internal growth and this ladder, this pipeline, whatever you want to call it where they are alumni, they're evangelists, they're making it happen for other women in their company and that's so fun to see.

Speaker 2 31:18

I mean you think about it. We have trained hundreds of women throughout the state of Utah literally in one or more of our programs and I'm realizing it now because I have. I can't go very many places where someone doesn't come up to me and go.

Speaker 3 31:35

I was in your career, I'm like tell me your name.

Speaker 2 31:38

I am so sorry I cannot, because they think you know. Hopefully they think they're the only one in there. We would love that.

Speaker 1 31:45

Yes, we would love that, but.

Speaker 2 31:47

I mean just in there, we would love that, yeah, we would love that. But I mean just, it's so inspirational to to hear those, the testimonials and the experiences that they had where they grew. They, you know, they felt influenced, they met new people, they have more confidence, and it's just probably a lot of people are really down in the dumps today for a variety of different reasons, and I'm like I am very optimistic because of the great women and men that we work with in our industry.

Speaker 1 32:19

Yeah, I love that, pleasantly surprised by people who participate with us, whether in our programs or our board members, or people who are adjacent to the work that we do, who want to turn around and reach back and bring others along with them. Right, because they could just learn for themselves and be like that was great. But more often than not, we see that they want to turn around and bring others along too.

Speaker 3 32:43

And I'm always surprised, usually at our graduations the number of times I hear the phrase this changed my life, that speaker changed my life, this experience changed my life, whatever it is that they're referring to, over the course of that program that always, it always touches a special part.

Speaker 1 33:01

Yeah, it's meaningful.

Speaker 2 33:03

I think that that's what women are looking for today. We always have, but I think it's stronger today. Where women are looking for meaning, you know, it's not so much the salary although that's helpful it's not other things. They're looking for flexibility too. I mean there's other things, but really what women are looking for today is making a difference, not just with themselves, but in their communities, in their families, in their country, and I think it's stronger today than ever.

Speaker 1 33:34

They want to have an impact, for sure.

Speaker 2 33:37

Yes.

Speaker 1 33:38

So all you women who are listening to this, we are enrolling for all of our programs. If you want to have an impact, please go to our website, wwwwliutcom. We could speak for hours. I could speak for hours on all the inspirational things and all the women and just the ripple effects. The ripple effects of the work we've done you know yes, it has a little bit to do with us, but really it has a lot to do with the women in the companies is immense and it does radiate statewide.

Speaker 1 34:14

I want to move on a little bit to our board members, because as we talk about a decade, we have to acknowledge that some of our board members have been with us the entire time. Why? So let's just talk about the board a little bit. Why is it important to have people on the board who really care so deeply? What has it done for WLI to have people who've been there for a full decade? That seems to me like that's pretty uncommon to be on a board, you know, for a full length, like that. But I'd just like to talk about board members a little bit.

Speaker 2 34:50

Well, when I was first asked to run the Women's Leadership Institute and needed to put together a board yeah, there's a decision to be made. And I had been on many boards and still am, so. They're all different. Everyone that I sit on has been different, some of them I've chaired. Everyone that I sit on has been different, some of them I've chaired.

Speaker 2 35:08

But I had to make a decision. Do you ask people to be on the board who are available, maybe not as influential, but they have a little more time, or do you ask people who have maybe more influence in the community? That has less time? And we, of course, we wanted men and women, so that is has been equal from day one. Yeah, we. That was very important to us and I wanted to get a variety of industries and backgrounds and, of course, make it as diverse as we could. But I would say our board really, we have an advisory board and an executive board and because of that decision I made to choose people who were more influential, a partner in Parr Brown, being able to have a personal relationship with our Supreme Court justices.

Speaker 2 36:13

And he's the very person who has arranged that. So just the influence that they can have with getting the right people that can be our speakers and just guiding us in a way where they've had the expertise in knowing how to run a nonprofit and I lean on them how to run a golf partnership. There's another thing we do, by the way, in southern Utah, copper Rock, and our partnership there with Dan Gomez, who's a golfer and has stepped up. So we have these amazing people that just are so generous with their time, are willing to step up and they, I would say the biggest thing, they have a passion for the work.

Speaker 2 36:53

They see the value in it personally, but they want to share it and they like each other. They enjoy each other's company and our board, so it's been delightful. They're very special.

Speaker 1 37:08

I agree. Thank you, Nicole you were an original board member.

Speaker 3 37:17

Yeah, I was, and you know we could have a whole podcast about how that experience was a catalyst to so many different things and the things that I learned being on that board and the places that it's led me, and talk about how you felt a lack of confidence when you first got on there and how that changed quickly.

Speaker 3 37:34

Yeah, I may have shared this on the first podcast, but, um, for those that haven't heard that, I was like the one thing that wasn't like the others on that original board. At the time, I had just published a book and I was running an online community for overwhelmed moms and Pat had interviewed me and selected me for the board to represent that demographic, which wasn't represented by anyone else. And I remember sitting next to the CEO for Questar Gas in one of our board meetings and I'm like are you kidding?

Speaker 2 38:07

me.

Speaker 3 38:07

Like what am I? What am I doing here? I don't belong here and of course, they didn't make me feel that way. Our board our board members were very welcoming and kind, and not not once did they make me feel that way. That was just imposter syndrome. Um, speaking to that point and growing, yeah, and like what, I'd never been really in that corporate side. I didn't even know what board responsibilities.

Speaker 2 38:33

So I'm going to interject. She was our one of our best board members because she asked, she wasn't afraid to ask questions and she had great ideas and it's like everyone respected her. So you were experiencing something very different than the rest of us.

Speaker 3 38:49

Oh, that's nice to hear. That's what I leaned into, because I was like, how can I bring value Right? And I know that I can summarize conversations, I can be a little bit strategic and I can listen and I can lean in, and so I did the best that I could and it and it was real transformative for me and it just led to so many things. So those relationships that I have with those board members are very important to me and some of those original board members I still love running into in the community and, um, it's just, they're just, I consider them my friends and I'm just grateful for those relationships. Yeah.

Speaker 1 39:30

I think it's really cool, the continuity between being a board member experiencing the only right. So for you women out there who are on your first boards or you show up and you think one of these is not like the other, know that you are not alone.

Speaker 3 39:43

Lean in.

Speaker 1 39:45

Yeah, and then watching the continuity of that as you have become the director and are working with the board Like it's been a really beautiful experience, relationship and synergy to see that. So it's fun. It's fun to watch the process. So, as we wrap up, pat, you mentioned in the beginning that you will be retiring and so as we close this 10 years in a decade, I want to talk about that. Talk about your retiring, what your plans are. Also talk about, like how you wrap up a decade and what does the next decade look like for this work of belonging inclusion, or even the next five? I feel like it's changing so quick and in so many ways. What does the landscape look like from your perspective?

Speaker 2 40:36

This has been. I've had several careers. Perspective this has been I've had several careers. I was a business owner for many years and president of Dan Jones and Associates and co-founder, so I was in the research business for a long, long time and then I had my political career. So this is really my third career.

Speaker 1 40:52

Are you going?

Speaker 2 40:53

to have another one. I don't know, we'll see.

Speaker 1 40:55

Nicole and I both laugh because we're like, of course We'll see Nicole and I both laugh. Because we're like, of course that's awesome.

Speaker 2 41:04

You never say never.

Speaker 3 41:05

You just don't. That's what I've learned.

Celebrating Progress in Women's Leadership

Speaker 2 41:07

That's what I've learned over my long life. But I would say this one is probably the most meaningful to me because you actually see results. To me, because you, you actually see results and and you and I've just known, when I was first asked to do this because of the intersection of my political career and my business background, it seemed like a natural, and I'm sure that's why they asked me to do it. But to actually see, but to start something absolutely new. I mean, scott told me here's what I want More women in business, more women a senior level, more women on boards, more women in politics. And in 10 minutes I had my next career, not knowing I'd never run a nonprofit before. I'd never run anything like that.

Speaker 1 41:50

This is your only story, right? Nicole just shared hers.

Speaker 2 41:54

Yeah, I mean. So I think what we've done in 10 years is establish a very firm foundation for some products and a product and opportunities that are highly relevant, not just to individuals but to the state. This is changing cultures. It's changing the way people outside of Utah view Utah. It's helping to form and shape that. So I see that as our first 10 years and I think we've been quite successful.

Speaker 2 42:26

Some things haven't worked as well and we've, you know, had to modify some things. You know, raising money is always a challenge. You know, especially nowadays, it's a little harder for non-profits to raise money. But I am so excited for my successor whoever that is take this to the next level, because I think we have a very firm foundation we have. You guys are amazing in your, in the work that you're doing. You make things happen. You know I'm sometimes just the face and and you guys make it happen, so you just deserve so much credit for making this a success. I just think the opportunities are greater than we can even fulfill. That's where I'm at. I I'm so excited to see this bloom.

Speaker 3 43:15

I love that, Nicole thoughts oh, that's hard. See this bloom. I love that, Nicole thoughts oh, that's hard. That's a hard comment to follow. It's been cool to see the the views of gender diversity, diversity in in general over the last 10 years and how it wasn't even something that companies really cared about or spoke much to 10 years ago.

Speaker 3 43:35

We had to convince them that there was a business case to make this a priority clear back then, and then all of a sudden it became important and the thing. And then we have our pandemic years where flexibility and women in the workplace become even more relevant. And then this last year we've seen the pendulum start to swing back the other direction with some like anti diversity, quality things, even so much as legislation. And so I wonder, like I, I I want our organization to be able to continue and I want our, our value for people to know that diversity matters, Just like you said it's. It's for everyone.

Speaker 3 44:21

You know, just because we're elevating women doesn't mean that the whole boat isn't rising Right, and I hope that the culture that we're in creates space for that and that, you know, time will tell what our views around gender diversity and diversity in general and DEI and all of those conversations look like. But I'm confident that WLI can shine in that space and that we have a lot to offer. I would love to see the cohort side even expand even more and reach even more women, and I think there's a lot of need for that. So that would be great yeah.

Speaker 1 45:08

I see a drone flying over the state and women are just out on their rooftops right Waving WLI or like leadership or whatever it might be. Thank you both for sharing your vision. I also agree that WLI and the way we approach things has so much value both to companies and individuals, and I think really it comes back around to where we began with education and a conversation at a time right Helping people understand what this really is. Again, it's not a zero-sum game. It brings value to everyone, both individually and as companies, so I'm excited to see those conversations continue and include more and more people. No one will ever replace Pat Jones. We all know that. Yes, they will. No one will ever replace Pat.

Speaker 2 45:58

Jones. We all know that.

Speaker 1 46:02

Yes, they will. Someone will continue to lead, but you are distinct and many people in the state know that. So, at the end of this, thank you. Have granddaughters and daughters and we have daughters. What do you wish for your daughters in the next five years, in this space of belonging?

Speaker 2 46:27

I would wish my granddaughters and daughters to continue hopefully feeling this, that they have the confidence and the responsibility to be an example, to do good, and the way to do good is to set a good example of not living by everybody else's rules, but to be honest and respectful about what they want, and to intentionally think about what it is that I want and then communicate that to the right people, which is what a message that I always like to give.

Speaker 1 47:01

Yeah, great, great closing Nicole.

Speaker 3 47:04

Yeah, I want my daughter to know that she has options. That's what I want her to see. If she wants corporate America, then she can go grab it. If she wants to stay home, I want her to see that those are all options to her and that that path is visible, no matter what area she's coming from.

Speaker 3 47:22

And then I hope that she sees that leadership looks different, that there isn't a mold, that she has to fit into to be a leader, that it can look like anything and that she already is a leader in her own right. She just needs to step into that, and then I also hope that I'm raising some allies in my home as well. And that the boys that I'm raising are the ones that can stand beside our future female leaders and advocate for them when they're not in the room.

Speaker 1 47:50

Oh, I love being brought in them. Yes, amen to that, my daughter. I think what I've learned is it's important to show up. It's important to show up. It's important to show up when you're the first person in the boardroom. It's important to show up when you get a new assignment. You're like, well, how am I supposed to do this? Um, it's just important to show up and see what you can do Right and to believe in your own leadership and not tap that down for anyone else, and not to be afraid to fail 100%.

Speaker 2 48:23

Yeah, to take calculated risks and if you fail which is really kind of a misnomer you'll learn from that. But that's something I think we do well in trying to communicate that yeah.

Speaker 1 48:40

Yeah, Just keep going and growing. All right, ladies, as always a pleasure. Thank you so much as we wrap up this 10th year and here's to 10 more.

Speaker 2 48:50

Yay, raise your glasses. That's right, you have your ears on your head.

Speaker 1 48:57

Yes, all right Till next time.