In the Podlight: LaChanze - Inclusion Behind the Scenes on Broadway

Summary: In this conversation, Tony Award-winning Broadway actress and producer LaChanze discusses her work as the president of Black Theater United and her mission to create a more inclusive and diverse Broadway. She shares her journey as an actress and producer, the importance of representation in the industry, and her commitment to bringing the work of overlooked artists, such as Alice Childress, to the forefront. LaChanze also talks about her production company and her passion for increasing and diversifying audiences in the theater. 

Takeaways:

• LaChanze is the president of Black Theater United, a creative collective aimed at raising awareness and promoting inclusivity in Broadway for black performers and artists.
• She is committed to increasing and diversifying audiences in the theater, and believes that representation is crucial in both on and off-stage roles.
• LaChanze is passionate about bringing the work of overlooked artists, such as Alice Childress, to the forefront and giving young artists the opportunity to have their voices heard.
• She has launched her own production company, LaChanze Productions, to have more control over the creative process and to support and develop new talent.

Chapters:
00:00 - Introduction to In the Podlight and Guest LaChanze
06:05 - Discovering the Need for Diversity and Inclusion in the Entertainment Industry
13:05 - The New Deal: Reforming the Industry for Equity and Inclusion
17:26 - Navigating Microaggressions and Ageism in the Entertainment Industry
21:29 - LaChanze Productions: Empowering Underrepresented Artists
27:21 - The Legacy of Alice Childress: Bringing Overlooked Artists to the Forefront
32:05 - Taking Control: Launching LaChanze Productions
37:42 - The Importance of Love and Resilience in LaChanze's Life
41:57 - Closing Remarks and Lightning Round

Connect with LaChanze on Instagram/Threads & X
Connect with Caroline on Instagram
Connect with Grant on Instagram
Connect with In The Podlight on the Website

Check out & join Black Theatre United on their website
Check out The Outsiders on Broadway – tickets available through their website
Check out Kimberly Akimbo on tour – tickets available through their website

 The Team:
Caroline Liem – Producer & Host
Grant Kretchick – Producer & Host
Cris Graves  - Producer & Editor
David Margolin Lawson  - Composer
Emily Yaneth Perez – Administration
The Lee Agency - Press Agent
Brandon Mills - Cover Art Photo Credit 

In the Podlight is produced in collaboration with Pace University – Sands
The thoughts, opinions, and views expressed by the guests, hosts, and producers of this podcasts do not necessarily reflect those of Pace University.

Since 1906, Pace University has been transforming the lives of its diverse students—academically, professionally, and socioeconomically. With campuses in New York City and Westchester County, New York, Pace offers bachelor, master, and doctoral degree programs to 13,600 students in its College of Health Professions, Dyson College of Arts and Sciences, Elisabeth Haub School of Law, Lubin School of Business, School of Education, Seidenberg School of Computer Science and Information Systems and, most recently, the Sands College of Performing Arts.

Transcript

01.02_LaChanze - Inclusion Behind the Scenes on Broadway

[00:00:00] Grant: In the Podlight is hosted on SANDS Talks, the official podcast platform of the SANDS College of Performing Arts at Pace University. 

[00:00:07] Caroline: Hi, I'm Caroline. 

[00:00:08] Grant: And I'm Grant. 

[00:00:09] Caroline: [00:00:10] Welcome to In the Podlight, where we spotlight creatives from different identities and experiences. 

[00:00:15] Grant: Join us as we illuminate how they blaze a path forward through the challenges and [00:00:20] opportunities of a post pandemic entertainment industry.

[00:00:22] Caroline: With a career that has spanned 38 Broadway seasons, we are so fortunate to be in conversation today with Tony award winning. [00:00:30] winning Broadway actress and producer, LaChanze. She's an inspirational artist and activist who operates from a place of what can be, not that's how [00:00:40] it is. Through her work as president of Black Theatre United, a creative collective aimed at raising awareness and advocacy for a more inclusive Broadway, both on stage [00:00:50] and behind the scenes for Black performers and artists, she's changing the face of professional theatre.

[00:00:54] Grant: LaChanze really is a force. She has so much to share with us. We chat about the important work of Black theatre. [00:01:00] The New Deal, her own journey as an actress, and what inspired her to become a producer and soon to be director. There is so much for our listeners to take in, [00:01:10] and hopefully inspire them to shine.

[00:01:11] Caroline: Let's shed some light. 

[00:01:13] Grant: LaChanze welcome. We're so thrilled to have you with us. so much for joining us. 

[00:01:19] LaChanze: I'm [00:01:20] thrilled to be here. Thanks for having me. 

[00:01:21] Grant: So we're just going to get right into it. First. I just want to say like you have just been on fire lately, and we just want to congratulate you on, I [00:01:30] think your most recent Tony win with the outsiders.

[00:01:33] Grant: And of course, launching your new production company, which we'll talk about a little bit later, but you're a busy woman and we're [00:01:40] glad to have you here and congratulations on all your recent successes. 

[00:01:43] LaChanze: Thank you. Thank you so much. I'm happy to be here. And yes, I am a busy woman and that's B. I. Z. Z. Y.

[00:01:49] LaChanze: [00:01:50] That's what I say. Busy. 

[00:01:51] Caroline: Well, let's let's start at the beginning. We'll just we'll touch the beginning a little bit and then move us forward into today and beyond. [00:02:00] So we know you were born in Florida. You grew up in Connecticut. As far as, you know, acting and you're so prolific in your work. When did it begin for you?

[00:02:09] Caroline: When did [00:02:10] that theater bug bite? I'd have to say 

[00:02:11] LaChanze: I was about 12 years old and my dad was military, Coast Guard. So, I was born in Florida, but I lived pretty much [00:02:20] up and down the east and west coasts of the country. Because oftentimes we were living on bases where postcard families lived. So the reason I [00:02:30] landed in Connecticut, cause my parents separated, my parents divorced when I was about 12 years old.

[00:02:35] LaChanze: And so we then moved to live with an uncle in New Haven, Connecticut. [00:02:40] And when I was there, it was the first time I had learned about Broadway through commercials. So in the mornings, I would be eating [00:02:50] breakfast and the tri state area, we would all get the, the show commercials. We would see them and growing up in Florida and Maryland and everywhere else.

[00:02:59] LaChanze: We lived in [00:03:00] Massachusetts. There were no Broadway commercials showing you the shows that are running right now. And I would say to my mom, oh my God, what is that? Mom, I want to go see a show. I want to [00:03:10] go see that. So she took me to my first Broadway show, which was Chicago. And I said, this is my tribe. Now, prior to that, I've been studying [00:03:20] dance most of my life because every town we went to, my mom would put us in whatever local.

[00:03:25] LaChanze: Dance school was because it was the four of us and we didn't have, you know, friends every year we [00:03:30] moved. That was how we were able to easily be acclimated to the neighborhoods that we were in and the communities that we were in because we were involved in whatever arts program. My brothers played, [00:03:40] played football and they also both were musicians.

[00:03:42] LaChanze: One's a drummer, one's a trombonist and a composer. And so we were inundated in the arts and I just got the bug [00:03:50] when I saw a Broadway show. I was like, These are my people. This is my tribe. This is where all the things that I love to do, dance, sing, and act are combined. [00:04:00] And this is, this is my, these are my people.

[00:04:02] Caroline: That's amazing. Well, speaking of people in a tribe, it's important to have like minded people in your art, but it's also [00:04:10] important to see yourself and to believe that there's a place for you. And I love the way you so eloquently put this because you're moving around so much. We're [00:04:20] so curious, who was that for you, who inspired you to see yourself in the work to say, I'm going to pursue this.

[00:04:27] LaChanze: I had a dance teacher. When we [00:04:30] first got to New Haven, there was a school called the Bowen Peters Cultural Arts Center. She's no longer with us, but it was basically just an [00:04:40] afterschool dance program. And because again, we were moving around so much, those were my friends. That's where a lot of my socializing happened.

[00:04:47] LaChanze: So the dance program, [00:04:50] we learned everything tap ballet, African, modern. We then became sort of a little bit of a troop and we would open for amazing dance [00:05:00] companies like the Catherine Dunham dance company. And so in performing with this dance troupe, Angela Bowen Peters. Spoke into me, she [00:05:10] literally spoke into me one day after a performance that I was just one of the dancers and said, you are a dancer, you have the ability to [00:05:20] be someone really special in this performance and I see you and that little sentence, I don't even know if she had remembered, she's no longer with us, how she poured into me [00:05:30] confidence and helped me to see that I have something that is of value.

[00:05:35] LaChanze: And could be utilized, I should pursue it. And when I [00:05:40] applied for college, I applied to two universities. My first one was an HBCU Morgan state university, and I went on a theater scholarship, and then I transferred out to the university of the arts after [00:05:50] that, because my dad said, you can't be the star of everything as a freshman.

[00:05:53] LaChanze: So, and I was, I went from being the top of the food chain to the bottom of [00:06:00] the food chain, because at the university of the arts, I was accepted on conditional status. I was not accepted right away. So it was a life learning lesson, but I am [00:06:10] very ambitious and headstrong and I love a challenge. And so I took it and here we are.

[00:06:16] LaChanze: It's beautiful. 

[00:06:17] Caroline: I have one last question around this. My [00:06:20] background is a casting director and it's really important in the conversations that I have with producers and directors that we make space for [00:06:30] all kinds of backgrounds and voices. For you, I'm wondering, you know, when did it start to make sense to you that there was a need for people of color to [00:06:40] come to the table in the way you have?

[00:06:42] LaChanze: So, as you know, I've been an artist for decades and it's truly my passion, but having been in this industry for so many [00:06:50] years and seeing all sides of it, from being an ensemble member, which was the beginning of my performance career, to then becoming a lead in a play. Was a [00:07:00] journey. And on this journey, I saw how there are so many disparities that particularly with men and with women, and then all the directors were male, predominantly white.[00:07:10] 

[00:07:10] LaChanze: All of the costume designers were female, predominantly white. There were roles that were pretty much consistently the same people in charge. But as a [00:07:20] black woman, as a black young woman at the time, I felt like I was oftentimes the only one in the room. I was the only one. Unless it was a black show, then I was [00:07:30] one of the black performers.

[00:07:31] LaChanze: But when it came to the creative teams and the producers and those making the decisions for the types of work that are being done, I never saw myself. [00:07:40] I never saw any leadership in that area with our union all across the board. And I'm an advocate for black rights and black representation. [00:07:50] In my whole life, I've always been that way.

[00:07:52] LaChanze: I was very fortunate enough to have a very revolutionary relatives, my aunts and uncles, they would host [00:08:00] Black Panther parties in the basement. And I was very much that little girl with the Afro pic saying, right on, right on, you know, so I was taught this Black pride and Black [00:08:10] resilience. Very young, very, very young in my childhood, starting at age five.

[00:08:14] LaChanze: So when I got into the industry and into commercial theater, I saw the disparities and I saw how [00:08:20] there was so many of us that were not being represented and COVID hit and I was waiting and waiting and waiting for things to click, to shift back to normal. And as we all [00:08:30] knew it didn't after two weeks, it didn't happen.

[00:08:32] LaChanze: So I felt like I needed to take control of my life. I needed to take control over what I can contribute to this industry. And that's when me and a [00:08:40] few of my colleagues founded Black Theater United. And after founding Black Theater United, David Stone, who is one of my dear friends, and who is also my mentor, [00:08:50] knew that I wanted to get on this side of the table because I've always had a bug in his ear about wanting to produce.

[00:08:55] LaChanze: And he pretty much. sat me down once a week for about eight months and [00:09:00] taught me the business from his point of view and had me join his two shows, which were Top Dog and Kimberly Akimbo. And I doubled my expectation that he asked of [00:09:10] me, which was just to prove to him that I was serious. And I just felt like we needed to, I need to have a seat at the table.

[00:09:17] LaChanze: And so here I am. 

[00:09:18] Grant: Amazing. And you mentioned David and I have to say. [00:09:20] Give a shout out to him. He's been also very generous with me and with our students at Pace for a number of years. Just a really stand up guy. You mentioned Black Theater United, which of course [00:09:30] you are currently the president of. It's dedicated to educating, empowering, and inspiring justice and equality for Black actors and actresses within the theater community.

[00:09:39] Grant: A number of major [00:09:40] achievements, and for our listeners who may not know, you pulled together theater owners, producers, unions, and two groups of creatives. One, directors, choreographers, music directors, designers, [00:09:50] And another with casting directors, composers and playwrights, et cetera, et cetera. You discuss reforming the industry for equity, diversity, inclusion, accessibility, belonging, with a focus on black [00:10:00] professionals.

[00:10:00] Grant: Can you talk to us a little bit about some of those initial goals, where those initial goals are at today? And what's next for Black Theatre [00:10:10] United? 

[00:10:10] LaChanze: Well, the document that you're referencing, which is our mission, is called the New Deal. And when we formed in 2020, after the horrific murder of George Floyd, [00:10:20] we felt that while there are so many amazing groups within the commercial theater community, like Broadway Cares, Equity Fights AIDS, or you name all of the different [00:10:30] groups that are formed, we felt that as theater professionals, We are always in support of every movement, whether it be LGBTQ, whether it be whatever marginalized group that [00:10:40] needs support.

[00:10:40] LaChanze: We feel that so many of our theater friends come together in support, but here we were in this moment in history where this man was tragically murdered in front of the [00:10:50] world. And we felt that our community hadn't galvanized in outrage over this. So that's when we decided instead of pointing fingers and saying, why aren't [00:11:00] you doing something for us?

[00:11:01] LaChanze: We felt that we'll do it for us. So we came together, me, Audra, Norm, Stokes, Wendell, Kenny, Billy, Anna [00:11:10] Deavere. It's 19 of us, the list goes on. And we got together and we said, our combined power and experience, together we will be a force for good. And so we wanted [00:11:20] to create this space, not only for performers, Meaning actors and actresses.

[00:11:25] LaChanze: We also wanted to inform the community at large that [00:11:30] commercial theater is a worthy occupation. And not only on stage, but there are so many jobs in, in commercial theater. That [00:11:40] could be great opportunities for some of these young black people who want to come into the theater, but don't understand that it even exists.

[00:11:47] LaChanze: And so a large part of our mission with the new [00:11:50] deal is to inform so many kids and people, not just black kids, that there are jobs out here that are worthy jobs, union jobs, [00:12:00] that you can have a large career with benefits and pensions by working in the theater. And no one's going to tell you that, but us.

[00:12:06] LaChanze: So the new deal is highlighting all of that, all of this [00:12:10] commitment from the theater owners, from the casting directors, from the general managers now, from everyone that wants to make sure that we no longer go back to the [00:12:20] time where Black people were not equally represented in every area of commercial theater.

[00:12:25] Grant: It's fantastic. And that Mission is taking shape. It's, it's succeeding. [00:12:30] Is that by your estimation, would you say, what are the new objectives? Where's the next step for, for this, 

[00:12:35] LaChanze: for the new deal? 

[00:12:36] Grant: Yeah, 

[00:12:36] LaChanze: well, we're, we're increasing our numbers of signatories [00:12:40] because this isn't a legally binding document, but to have someone like Bob Wanko be a signatory, who is the head of the Schubert organization to have someone like Nick [00:12:50] Scandalius, who is.

[00:12:50] LaChanze: A part of the Needlander organization who runs the, that organization. And then so many other leaders, Bernie Telsey to be a part of this, who was one of the top casting agents, [00:13:00] as you all know, to have them become signatories that agree with the document. They are then taking the document and implementing it into their.

[00:13:09] LaChanze: [00:13:10] So where we are right now is we are increasing our numbers of signatories and getting more and more people committed to this mission of equality for [00:13:20] all in commercial theater. And one of the tenants is no more all white creative teams. Now I know that doesn't sound like a big deal, but when you look at my career, the [00:13:30] body of work I've done, I've only been directed one time by a black person and that was on my most recent show, which was.

[00:13:39] LaChanze: trouble in mind. [00:13:40] And I've had a career of when you look at the body of work that I've done, Color Purple, Once on this Island, you name it, all the stuff I've done, Company, all of it, [00:13:50] even the film work. It's all except for Spike. I did work with Spike Lee, but all of the work that I've done has largely been by white creative teams.[00:14:00] 

[00:14:00] LaChanze: And listen, this is not to say that I did not enjoy and love working with these leaders in our industry. I just feel that as a Black woman telling a story about Black life [00:14:10] and Black experiences, it would be nice to have someone who is of the culture to help with some of the shorthand. You know, like when you're with your family, you have shorthand, you communicate things [00:14:20] easily and able to relate to the other person without having to explain as much.

[00:14:23] LaChanze: And sometimes in these rooms where I might have a white male director, I might have to inform him that, listen, a black [00:14:30] woman would never say this. And I've actually had a white male director. Tell me I, when I went to him and I said, a black woman. Of this age [00:14:40] would never use this word to describe her body.

[00:14:42] LaChanze: And he said, I think she would. And it was kept in the script. And he is talking to a Black woman. He said to me, No, I think you're wrong, LaChanze. [00:14:50] I think she would. Now, have that been reversed? And I told him what I think a white man of his age would do. And he said to me, No, it wouldn't. I would have to say, You're a white man.

[00:14:57] LaChanze: I trust you. I understand. But uneducated [00:15:00] thinking and entitlement is what has been pervasive throughout my career. So bringing it back to Black Theater United, all of us have these stories. Every single [00:15:10] one of us have had these stories in some fashion or another, wardrobe, hair, you name it. It's been all kinds of issues that we've had to deal with.

[00:15:17] LaChanze: And so we came together [00:15:20] to fill the gap in that. Also, if there's a young artist who's on a job or on a show and they feel some sort of subjugation or something happening with them that isn't fair, they can [00:15:30] reach out to us. And we will stand in the gap for them as well. So we're, we're really advocating on behalf of black bodies, black talent, black, black lives on and off our stage and across our [00:15:40] country.

[00:15:40] Grant: It's such a, just a really great resource for our listeners to know about. I think that's, it's so important. 

[00:15:46] LaChanze: And it's so easy to join us. Just go to our website, black theater, united. com, [00:15:50] and you can join us as a black theater, as a black member, or you can also join as an ally. And we have just as many allies as we do as members of the [00:16:00] organization.

[00:16:00] LaChanze: Because we want this. This is just not for us. It's for all of us, just not providing this for all of us to come together because when we ride all those rides, 

[00:16:09] Caroline: I think [00:16:10] one of our guests for the season might actually be casting your play Wine in the Wilderness. An ally, a casting director, a dear friend of ours, Victor [00:16:20] Vasquez.

[00:16:20] LaChanze: He's wonderful. His taste, his taste and his eye are just so exquisite and he has He has a pulse on, [00:16:30] you know, the hot new talent out there and, and always ready to move forward in a positive way. So I really am happy and grateful that we have. Victor [00:16:40] on our team for, for casting. I'm really grateful. He's one of our stars.

[00:16:44] Caroline: So many people are experiencing all kinds of marginalization. And as you've [00:16:50] mentioned, it comes in many sizes, shapes, orientation, colors, ages. I really love this quote. That you've shared, but the industry's telling [00:17:00] me, Oh, you're aging out of certain roles. Actually, what I'm doing is aging into certain roles, right?

[00:17:06] Caroline: And so at this stage in your career, you are on [00:17:10] fire and, you know, harnessing your expertise, harnessing your maturity, your wisdom, and you're so good at it. So. Would [00:17:20] you share, are you still experiencing these kinds of microaggressions, this, I mean, you've touched on a little bit, are you experiencing ageism, is there [00:17:30] these microaggressions with regards to race, to gender bias, you know, these microaggressions with regards to We always are 

[00:17:35] LaChanze: experiencing them.

[00:17:36] LaChanze: I mean, that's just a part of being in America. You are a woman, [00:17:40] Caroline, I don't know your ethnicity, but you clearly are a brown woman. And so I'm sure you experience It literally is a condition that [00:17:50] we live in, live under. So yes, to answer your question, yes, I do experience it. But the difference with being a woman of a certain age, being a Black woman in my midlife, who has had this [00:18:00] experience, it does come with wisdom.

[00:18:01] LaChanze: So now there is, maybe when I was maybe 25 years old, I would react in a certain way. to microaggressors or I would walk [00:18:10] around with them and hold them in my body and I would just absorb it and not understand why I felt anxious or what was happening with me later or why I would avoid certain [00:18:20] spaces because I didn't want to feel that being, being othered.

[00:18:23] LaChanze: I didn't want to be the only one in the room, which is often the case when you are a student. A person who has success in leadership, [00:18:30] many times I'm in a room and I'm the only one that alone is a microaggressor because you have to be hyper aware of yourself and what may come, you may get certain looks.

[00:18:39] LaChanze: [00:18:40] Then again, you may have wonderful people that are in support of everything that you do and are welcoming. But the idea that I have to deal with that and prepare myself for that, when I walk into a [00:18:50] room, it's exhausting. And now. At this stage of my career, I'm experiencing ageism because like I said, and I meant this, I have aged into this time in my life where all [00:19:00] of the experience that I've had for 40 years in this industry, 38 Broadway seasons, I have experienced a whole lot of stuff and I'm not going [00:19:10] to let someone else's opinion or thought of me.

[00:19:13] LaChanze: Determine me from what I know is destined for me to do. And so part of my desire, what [00:19:20] motivates me, what inspires me to do this is because I have, first of all, I have two daughters and my daughters are two young black girls in America, two chocolate, little black [00:19:30] girls in America. We've had to grow up with all kinds of issues of being other and to make it a better world, if I can for them and those and others that come [00:19:40] behind them is I have to use my platform for good and I have to educate people.

[00:19:43] LaChanze: I have to show them that my race and my gender isn't the leading factor of my wisdom. It's that I know [00:19:50] this because of what I've experienced in my life. And we can get past my race and my gender. You will see that I am not. Only qualified to do this great job that you will benefit from it because you have me on your [00:20:00] team because you have a person who is resilient, who has gone through some stuff.

[00:20:03] LaChanze: And I can stand here with that experience and say to you with wisdom and knowledge that I know [00:20:10] what needs to happen now. And I am not shy. I have no problem speaking my mind. My family likes to say, it's the sag in me because I'm a Sagittarius and we like to fall forward. [00:20:20] We may fall, but we're falling forward.

[00:20:21] LaChanze: So, um, it is. Definitely a part of my nature is to just go for it. But seriously, I just, I deal with things all the time. I, I [00:20:30] see how certain women, men around me are being treated, and I'm at the place now where I can either call it out if I choose to, and sometimes I will, depending on who the [00:20:40] audience is, or sometimes I don't choose to call it out.

[00:20:42] LaChanze: Other times, I'll just choose to stand in the place of, of my power and leadership and show them that I can do this. And be evidence that [00:20:50] I can do this as well and that we are formidable leaders. I do think that that is one of the issues that we have in our industry. Those we don't have enough leaders in society overall, in my opinion, we don't have [00:21:00] enough people that are willing to take a risk and put their stick, their neck out and be a leader today.

[00:21:04] LaChanze: There's just so many ways that people can tear you down with this, with access to social media, [00:21:10] and we're all so ready. To find fault in the moment we have that little kernel of an issue with anyone, we blow it up and people are afraid of that. I [00:21:20] get it afraid of it, but you got to put your Kamala Harris pants on and know that you can still do it in the face of all of the obstacles.

[00:21:27] LaChanze: And so I'm feeling my Kamala Harris. [00:21:30] energy today. 

[00:21:30] Grant: You talk about falling forward. You recently really so recently come to the producing part of it and you've had so much wonderful success. I'm wondering if some of that [00:21:40] falling forward is just like, you know what, I'm going for it. But in that going for it, what is it that guides you to identifying projects that you think bring in a new [00:21:50] audience?

[00:21:50] Grant: I'm aware that part of what your mission is or drive is, is not just to find inclusion and belonging in all of the aspects of commercial theater [00:22:00] making, but also finding the new audience to diversify the audiences. So what is it about the projects or what guides you when you're choosing a project that says [00:22:10] this is going to introduce live theater to new audiences?

[00:22:13] LaChanze: Thank you. That's gonna be that question, Grant, because that is my sole mission. That is the main reason I wanted to become a [00:22:20] producer, is because I want to increase our audiences. I want to diversify our audiences. I want to expand our audiences. As we all know, since COVID, [00:22:30] so many of our mature community is not coming back, and they just not have come back into the theaters.

[00:22:36] LaChanze: And so I felt like it was a good time to come into the [00:22:40] theater and have an opinion about the types of shows we see. So the three things that I look for in any piece of work that comes, any pitch, any script that's sent to [00:22:50] me are, these are the three things I look for. One, you have to know your audience.

[00:22:54] LaChanze: You have to be able to look at the piece and say exactly who the audience is. If you're pitching it to me, you [00:23:00] need to be able to tell me my audience is going to be of this demographic, this race, this is who we're going after, this age, this is who we're going for. It has to have that. You have to know that.

[00:23:09] LaChanze: Secondly, [00:23:10] you have to have a commercial viability. It has to make money. I'm a producer. Sorry, it's gotten, but you have to be able to earn or [00:23:20] at least grow to earn. It has to have commercial viability. That's very important to me that you can be, if it's a play that maybe one day could become a Netflix series [00:23:30] or streaming platform, or that can become a concert or that can become a movie or that can be grow, that can be done in Asia, that can be done in Africa.

[00:23:38] LaChanze: That can be done other places. [00:23:40] So it has to have commercial viability and last, it has to have heart. It has to move you, me to move you, to feel something that you haven't felt when you walked in. It has to make you laugh, make you cry, make you feel, make [00:23:50] you think, make you identify with something in the story that reminds you that we are all human beings and we're all human beings.

[00:23:56] LaChanze: Celebrating our humanity together in this moment. And [00:24:00] those three things I think usually for me are the guiding factors that, okay, let's go into it. Outsiders for instance, when I, we all know the outsiders, well, a lot of us do because we had to [00:24:10] read the book in middle school and might've seen the movie.

[00:24:12] LaChanze: What drew me to the outsiders is that it had all three of the elements that I, that I definitely see are the pillars, but it [00:24:20] also is a piece that I feel will grow and will. Be more inclusive the more it goes along. For instance, we already set up our tour. We're going to take it on the road. But this is the [00:24:30] kind of show that will be done in high schools.

[00:24:32] LaChanze: That would be done, you know, in colleges that will be done years from now, and people will still be able to feel this joy, feel, [00:24:40] identify with these characters. And one of the main reasons is because these are young men and women that are experiencing prior to cell phones and internet, they're experiencing how to [00:24:50] connect with each other in a really visceral way.

[00:24:52] LaChanze: And I think a lot of that is lost. In our current time today with our young people, they're having a hard time to connect with each other because they're looking [00:25:00] down at their screens and what the outsiders is giving them an opportunity to experience is real connection, looking up, talking to each other, feeling and the bullet feeling like there's a [00:25:10] moment of bullying, know what that feels like, really feels like how you deal with it, the drama of what could be experienced in that.

[00:25:16] LaChanze: And I wanted our audience to live fully in these young men's stories. stories [00:25:20] and young women's stories. And that is what's happening. People are coming back again and again, and again, they're bringing their families and they are bringing every generation, every generation is coming. Young [00:25:30] kids for the music and older folks, just because I remember the book.

[00:25:33] LaChanze: I just think it's great. And so I look for the same thing with Jaja's African hair braiding. Another show that I produced is [00:25:40] it was the first time. That African women saw themselves represented in commercial theater on Broadway. And I literally was walking around Harlem with [00:25:50] flyers. I went to every African hair braiding salon and I spoke to the owners.

[00:25:55] LaChanze: I said, I had a big meeting with them. I had my braider. Call everyone together and I [00:26:00] said, I will make each and every one of you ambassadors. You will be ambassadors for the piece. You will come down, you will have discount codes, and your clients will be able to come and see the show. [00:26:10] We've raised the demographic, the highest demographic, of Black women coming to the theater, Black people coming to the theater, by 29%, more than it's ever been in the history of Broadway.

[00:26:19] LaChanze: [00:26:20] So this is the kind of stuff that I want to happen for us. Because the truth is my generation is aging out. Like we are, we're aging into careers, but we aging out of everything else. Cause we're old. [00:26:30] So it's not for me. It's I'm not doing this for me or my generation. I'm doing it for my daughter's generation and the, those that come behind me because you have the largest audience, so they have [00:26:40] to know that live theater is for them.

[00:26:42] LaChanze: And this is yours. And the only ways to make that happen is for them to see themselves In the stories and in the [00:26:50] situations and just what they want to see in the art. And it needs to look like it does when we walk out of our houses. That's the other rule for myself. I need my audience to look [00:27:00] like it does when I go to home goods or when I go to, you know, the grocery store or the dry cleaners.

[00:27:06] LaChanze: I need those people that I come in contact with, [00:27:10] everyday people, to be the people in the audience. And that's what I'm trying to work towards. It's 

[00:27:14] Grant: interesting to me because I want to pivot towards Alice Childress, who I see, I think, on a pillow behind you. Is [00:27:20] that her face? That's 

[00:27:21] LaChanze: her. She is the angel on my shoulder.

[00:27:24] Grant: So you already mentioned Trouble of the Mind, for which you were a star in, and now you're also be making [00:27:30] your directing debut with Wine in the Wilderness. Alice is one of the, I think, only Black women credited with writing, you know, across four decades. And the [00:27:40] stories, you know, predate the 1980s. So, you know, 60s and 70s.

[00:27:44] Grant: So here you are bringing a piece of material from a while ago into [00:27:50] new audiences. Why this play? Can you speak to, can you speak to Alice? Can you speak to why she's so important? Why it's so important to bring her work [00:28:00] forward in today's times? 

[00:28:01] LaChanze: So Alice Childress, her story is just so, so heart wrenching and I identify with her story.

[00:28:08] LaChanze: Alice Childress came [00:28:10] to Harlem. She was living in Delaware and then she came to Harlem to live with her grandmother. And it was a, it was a tough time for her. She didn't know where her people were, so to speak. So she [00:28:20] discovered it somehow became a part of a theater company in the community. So that her, her grandmother kept to keep her out of harm's way.

[00:28:26] LaChanze: She put her in this theater group and she She started working on set. She started [00:28:30] working in the crew and then she started acting. And then she said, well, I want to write stories. I want to write my own stories. And so all of it started out of a need to be a part [00:28:40] of something and to be away from trouble.

[00:28:42] LaChanze: That's how it all started for her. No college. She didn't go to college, no college education, none of that. But she would write stories about her [00:28:50] experiences in Harlem and the people around her. Now, Alice Childress. Was a fair skinned black woman. And she spoke a lot about how being a fair skinned black [00:29:00] woman, she was not allowed to do certain roles because all of the role, most of the roles that were hiring that were written for black women of that time, the late fifties, [00:29:10] early sixties were domestic roles.

[00:29:12] LaChanze: And oftentimes lights, lighter skinned actors. weren't cast as domestic. Darker skin actors were cast as domestics. So there were [00:29:20] more roles for someone like me and less for her. And she, and she really struggled with that. So she just started writing, writing, writing, commenting on her community, commenting [00:29:30] on all kinds of issues, but she wasn't taken serious.

[00:29:33] LaChanze: She wasn't given the ability to get produced often because of her truth. And the thing of what [00:29:40] makes her so brilliant is that she wasn't trying to call anyone out. She wasn't trying to shame anyone. She was just setting up the situation to, so that you can be, you can be inspired to think. And [00:29:50] that's what all of her work has done.

[00:29:51] LaChanze: And as you may not make, you may know, maybe audience may not know that Trouble in Mind would have been the first Black play produced on [00:30:00] Broadway back in 68 had Alice Childress agreed to changing the ending to make the white protagonists more likable. [00:30:10] She decided not to do that. Therefore her play was not produced until I did it in 2021 in its original form.

[00:30:18] LaChanze: What that was produced by [00:30:20] the Roundabout Theatre Company. So she would have been the first, but she said no. So she died a pauper. She died with nothing, with this body of work that has never been produced. And before I [00:30:30] leave this planet. Her entire canon, I will do my best. My mission is to produce every single one of her plays and some form of passion, every [00:30:40] single one.

[00:30:40] LaChanze: So I just got chills, just like you name all of these writers, all Neil Simon, just like their body of work. We don't have hers and we need to have hers. So [00:30:50] that is one of my missions in life because. She's brilliant. Did you know that she was Lorraine Hansberry's mentor? 

[00:30:56] Grant: I don't think I did know that. 

[00:30:57] LaChanze: So Lorraine Hansberry, who [00:31:00] wrote Raisin in the Sun, was her mentee.

[00:31:02] LaChanze: So when you know that that's a kind of brilliance that this woman was, you know, her knowledge that she was sharing at [00:31:10] this time, and she was just overlooked. I feel like that's a travesty for so many of our young theater artists in our society. Her work is brilliant and [00:31:20] we need to have it. And it should be in the top of our choices of plays that we produce and revivals from that period.

[00:31:26] Caroline: Well, let's talk about your production company. [00:31:30] So in this post pandemic, post strike time. So. You know, in this, okay, so in the, you launched LaChanze [00:31:40] Productions and of course you've been producing, we've already mentioned that, that has already been part of the conversation, but it is also relatively new, so relatively new to producing with [00:31:50] this avalanche of success that's happening, you also managed to thrive, but you're also bringing others with you.

[00:31:56] Caroline: So can you. expand a little bit about the [00:32:00] catalyst for you to become the conduit for opportunity in a time when opportunity is so especially needed. 

[00:32:07] LaChanze: Thank you for that, Caroline. I tell you, I needed to [00:32:10] launch LaChanze Productions because I needed more control. That's really it. As a producing partner, you work with a general partner who's like the main producer who's who [00:32:20] brings the idea of the story to the table.

[00:32:22] LaChanze: For instance, on The Outsiders, I use that again, the lead producer is the Araka group, which is Matthew and Michael Rego. They're brothers. They're [00:32:30] really great men. But this was their idea. They pick the designers, the cast, they pick everyone, the marketing team, the general manager, the lawyers, they just pick everyone.

[00:32:39] LaChanze: And then they [00:32:40] come to someone like me and say, Hey, will you please partner with us to produce this show and bring all the stuff that you bring to it? But that's after the fact that all of those decisions have been made. I want to be at the [00:32:50] table when those decisions are being made. And the only way to do that is if I'm in control.

[00:32:53] LaChanze: And the only way to do that is if it is my production. And so I felt the need to be a part of it, getting it going. Now, [00:33:00] again, I don't have the deep, deep, deep pockets, like some of my colleagues, where they can just write a check for a show I have to rate. So I go to individuals and I say, listen, would you invest in my company?

[00:33:09] LaChanze: [00:33:10] Promise you we're going to do good work. I promise, promise, promise. And if you could just help me support my, my company, then I can get out there and start looking at some of these young playwrights, looking at some of these [00:33:20] young creatives who are not being listened to, who are not being heard. If they see me, they're like, I trust LaChanze.

[00:33:26] LaChanze: I will share. My script with her and they [00:33:30] know that I will read it. I have a staff that reads everything that comes my way. And it aligns with my mission. If it aligns with what we're trying to see [00:33:40] in the, in the world, then I will develop it. And so that's what I needed my production company for is because I need a space to hone and develop work and give these young [00:33:50] artists an opportunity to really see themselves and have their work produced without being encumbered by someone else's.

[00:33:57] LaChanze: Decision on if it's worthy of being done right now, because I [00:34:00] think that just like Alice Childress, if there was someone of her time that really believed in her and wanted her work produced, she would be like August Wilson. The work would be done, but she was a [00:34:10] female, she was black, and people just didn't invest in her like that.

[00:34:13] LaChanze: I want to be able to invest in artists and all artists, not just young black artists. Young male, female, white, trans, [00:34:20] everybody. I want everyone to know that I am here. LaChanze Productions is here in representation. It has to have those three elements that I mentioned earlier to consider it. And if it [00:34:30] aligns with my mission, then we will see if we can get it under development.

[00:34:33] LaChanze: To me, that's the most important way that you can really affect change is by being the change. Not just saying, Oh, why [00:34:40] aren't people doing this? Why don't people like my work? How can I get involved? As an artist, sometimes, particularly young writers and entertainers. You almost feel invisible until someone says, [00:34:50] okay, I see you.

[00:34:51] LaChanze: And then you're encouraged to keep doing it. It may not be successful that first time out. It may not even be right the first time out, but it's encouraging and it's inspiring to [00:35:00] keep honing your skill and your craft. Because I believe that if you have a vision for your life, a vision for what you want, a vision for what you do, then it is meant for you to do like, I don't see [00:35:10] myself as an aerospace engineer.

[00:35:11] LaChanze: I never have ever considered that for myself, but I have seen myself hosting amazing events, doing things. Like I've always seen myself in a leadership capacity [00:35:20] as an artist. So I say to young artists all the time, young people that I mentor, I say, what do you see for yourself? And if they can answer that question, then that means the vision is there for them.

[00:35:29] LaChanze: And then they need to [00:35:30] go get it. But if you say, Oh, I don't know, then you don't know. And then someone will tell you what you're supposed to be doing. Someone will say, Oh, you're supposed to be working at McDonald's. Oh, that's what you're supposed to be doing. [00:35:40] And that person will end up working at McDonald's because they don't have their own vision.

[00:35:43] LaChanze: So I encourage young artists and young, not only artists. The young people in the world, whatever your vision, [00:35:50] whatever you feel inside, whatever that, whatever inspires you, whatever you connect with, that feeling is there for a reason. It's because it's a part of what you are destined to do. And [00:36:00] so I try to communicate that as much as I can.

[00:36:02] LaChanze: I 

[00:36:02] Grant: love that. So we are sort of to our last question. I think we forgot to tell you, we do have a three sort of three, sometimes five quick [00:36:10] questions called the lightning round at the end that have nothing to do with any of this. That are just, It's fun and silly to get you to know you. But before we get to that, our usual, our closing question is usually, you know, you give these [00:36:20] interviews, you're, you're high profile, you speak a lot, you have a great and wonderful platform.

[00:36:25] Grant: The question we always ask is, what is something that no one's ever asked you that you [00:36:30] thought, damn, I I wish somebody would ask me that. Whether they haven't had the guts to do it, or whether they just haven't touched on something. Is there something inside of you that says, you know, [00:36:40] I never get to speak about 

[00:36:41] LaChanze: this.

[00:36:42] LaChanze: So interesting. That's so interesting. I love that question. I would have to say it's in the area of love for me. So [00:36:50] many people know of a tragedy in my life. I lost my husband in 9 11. And so a lot of people approach me with warmth and kindness. There's this [00:37:00] empathy for me. And it's always in the form of, you know, you're amazing.

[00:37:04] LaChanze: You're remarkable that you were able to survive that. But no one ever asks me how I feel about. just losing the love of [00:37:10] my life. No one ever talks about the love that I, that I crave and require and, and what that has done and how it has affected my life, not having him with me. No one [00:37:20] ever asks me about that.

[00:37:20] LaChanze: They just make assumptions. 

[00:37:22] Grant: You know, that's a big, scary question to ask somebody because you're not sure if they're ready to answer it. And you're not sure if you're ready to receive the answer. It's a very [00:37:30] profound question. Does it inform what you do? 

[00:37:32] LaChanze: Does it inform what I do in terms of my profession?

[00:37:35] Grant: However you want to answer it, your profession or your life. 

[00:37:37] LaChanze: I like to tell people, you [00:37:40] know, this is what I do, it's not who I am. And so it doesn't really inform my choices as my, who I am. It doesn't inform that, but it is very much [00:37:50] a part of what I feel we all need in order to be the best expressions of ourselves.

[00:37:56] LaChanze: It helps to have love in your life, and it doesn't [00:38:00] always have to be romantic love, but to have had it, and then to have lost it, it's a soft spot for me, but that is, that is the question that no one asks me, and so that's how I'm [00:38:10] answering that. 

[00:38:10] Grant: That's beautiful. Thank you for sharing that. And we'll just pivot to three fun questions that hopefully don't trigger too much thought, but just answer.

[00:38:18] Grant: Caroline, you want to go? 

[00:38:19] Caroline: What [00:38:20] is a favorite family tradition or chosen family tradition? That pops in to 

[00:38:27] LaChanze: mind every birthday in my home, [00:38:30] we wake the person up with their gifts and we sing to them very early. So like 6 a. m. since my daughters were born, bust open their doors with [00:38:40] Candles, cake, balloons, presents, happy birthday to you.

[00:38:44] LaChanze: And we wake them up with a big rousing. And, and, and it's funny because as [00:38:50] my daughters have grown into this, now they do it to me as the older that they've gotten, they, Nia, now on my birthdays with hats tossed into my room and with [00:39:00] gifts and presents and candles. And I have to wake up leery eyed. You have to read every card to open every present.

[00:39:06] LaChanze: And you have to do that or you can't go, you can't go back to sleep. And then [00:39:10] someone brings you something to eat. And that's just a family tradition. Me and my daughters have been doing that since they were really little. 

[00:39:15] Grant: That's really fun. All right. It's an Olympic year. And I read, I think recently that for the first [00:39:20] time, the gender is 50, 50, 50 percent female participation and 50 percent male participation.

[00:39:25] LaChanze: Yeah. 

[00:39:26] Grant: If you could compete in the Olympics, what sport would you compete in? 

[00:39:29] LaChanze: [00:39:30] Track and field. 

[00:39:31] Grant: Yeah. My thought as a dancer, you were going to definitely have something like a gymnastics 

[00:39:35] LaChanze: Are you kidding? I am haulin behind, baby. I [00:39:40] am hoppin the hurdles. I am, oh, I can feel 100 percent all day long. 

[00:39:46] Grant: Okay, and one more, last, one last question.[00:39:50] 

[00:39:50] Caroline: What's the first music you ever bought or the first concert you went to. Earth, Wind 

[00:39:56] LaChanze: Fire was the very first concert I went to. I was 15 years [00:40:00] old, went with my girlfriend to New Haven Coliseum to see Earth, Wind Fire. And I would have to say the first music that I bought, I had an aunt, a young aunt who was [00:40:10] really into music and she would always teach me a lot about great, great, great artists.

[00:40:14] LaChanze: And I'd say the first album I bought was a Tina Marie album. And you want to hear the funny story is I went to [00:40:20] the record store and I said, I'm here to buy Tina Marie through the fire. And they were like, okay. And they brought this album over to me with this white girl on the cover. And I [00:40:30] said, no, no, no.

[00:40:30] LaChanze: I want the black Tina Marie. And they were like, girl, this is Tina Marie. Okay. I know she sounds black. I know she's [00:40:40] seen with Rick James, but this is her. I'll never forget. I was like, no, not the white Tina Marie, the black one who sings through the fire. A young male person [00:40:50] like showed me on the album cover, through the fire, Tina Marie.

[00:40:54] LaChanze: I was like, Oh shoot. She's white. Anyway. 

[00:40:57] Grant: That's fantastic. That's 

[00:40:58] LaChanze: awesome. 

[00:40:59] Grant: We [00:41:00] can't thank you enough for this interview. I was warned by Greg and David that you were just going to be fabulous. And they were 100%. Correct. 

[00:41:09] Caroline: Wonderful [00:41:10] conversation. Just thank you for being so candid and just sharing so openly and fiercely.

[00:41:16] Caroline: Just love it. Thank you. 

[00:41:17] LaChanze: Thank you for having me. It's been really fun. [00:41:20] And thank you for asking me that good question. I love that I got to share that. No one's ever asked me that. So thank you. 

[00:41:24] Grant: Just wow, she's captivating. The way she cares about up and coming creatives, but also [00:41:30] how she wants to bring the work of artists who were overlooked in the past forward.

[00:41:34] Grant: It's such a beautiful tribute to Alice Childress. 

[00:41:36] Caroline: She is a true example of being the change you [00:41:40] want to see. Through her advocacy for black creatives on Broadway, by stepping into producing, having more control of the whole creative process, making [00:41:50] sure that representation is at the forefront. Forefront of all conversations.

[00:41:54] Caroline: A fierce artist advocate after my own heart. 

[00:41:57] Grant: You can follow LaChanze on Instagram threads at [00:42:00] Miss LaChanze and on X at LaChanze, 

[00:42:03] Caroline: and you can catch some of LaChanze producing work currently on Broadway by going to see the Outsiders or on [00:42:10] tour by checking out Kimberly Akimbo when it hits a town near you.

[00:42:13] Caroline: The links are in the show notes. 

[00:42:15] Grant: Thanks so much for listening to In the Pod Light. If these conversations resonate with you, follow on SANDS [00:42:20] Talks or wherever you get your podcast. Visit our website at inthepodlight. com. Until next time, step into your light. Since 

[00:42:27] Caroline: 1906, Pace University has been [00:42:30] transforming the lives of its students with bachelor, master, and doctoral degree programs with campuses in New York City and Westchester County.

[00:42:36] Caroline: For more information, visit pace. edu. The views, [00:42:40] thoughts, and opinions expressed by the guests, hosts, and producers of this podcast do not necessarily reflect those of Pace University.