A Life in Six Songs

Ep. 13 - Sumeera Younis: From Emotional Farewells to Social Justice

• Season 2 • Episode 13

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On this episode, we sit down with Sumeera Younis, a native Pakistani who grew up in Michigan, did a pit stop in Istanbul and now lives in Washington DC with her husband and three kids. Join us as we hear about Sumeera’s immigration to the U.S from Pakistan with the song “Pardesi, Pardesi,” and then being exposed to the political messages in Rage Against the Machine in car rides to high school with her brother. Sumeera shares the stories of graduating from law school and studying for the bar exam, with the help of “If You Tolerate This Your Children Will Be Next” by Manic Street Preachers, and falling in love with her husband through “Temptation” by New Order. We close out our conversation with the documentary Searching for Sugar Man and the song “Sugar Man” by Rodriguez, and then, Sumeera’s moving story of fertility treatment through “The Waiting” by Tom Petty and The Heartbreakers. Pull up a folding chair, grab a drink, find a spot “around the fire,” and enjoy the conversation and community. 

Connect w/ Sumeera on her Instagram 

Follow your hosts David, Raza, and Carolina every other week as they embark on an epic adventure to find the songs that are stuck to us like audible tattoos that tell the story of who we are and where we’ve been, to help us figure out where we’re going. It’s a life story told through 6 songs.



WHO WE ARE

DAVID: Creator & Host @ALifeinSixSongs

Drummer | Educator | Philosopher | Combat Veteran | PTSD Advocate 


CAROLINA: Co-Host @ALifeinSixSongs

Storyteller | Professional Facilitator


RAZA: Co-Host @ALifeinSixSongs

Lawyer | Producer | Solo Project: Solamente | @razaismyname


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Copyright Disclaimer: Under Section 107 of the Copyright Act 1976, allowance is made for "fair use" for purposes such as criticism, commentary, news reporting, teaching, scholarship, and research. Fair use is a use permitted by copyright statute that might otherwise be infringing. Non-profit or educational use tips the balance in favor of fair use. The original work played in this video has been significantly transformed for the purpose of commentary, criticism, and education.

Speaker 1:

I don't know.

Speaker 2:

Hey everybody, welcome to another episode of A Life in Six Songs. I'm your host, david Rees, and I'm joined by my co-hosts Carolina and Raza.

Speaker 3:

Hey, hey.

Speaker 2:

Hello For those of you new to the podcast, each week we embark on an epic adventure to find those songs that are stuck to us like audible tattoos, that tell the story of who we are and where we've been, to help us figure out where we're going. It's a life story told through six songs. We approach our conversations with love, kindness and curiosity to counter the prevalence of hate, anger and judgment in the world. Our goal is that by listening to these stories, you can bring more love, kindness and curiosity into your own life. With that, let's go have a listen together. Our guest today is Samira Yunus. Samira is a native Pakistani who grew up in Michigan, did a pit stop in Istanbul and now lives in Washington DC with her husband and three kids. She loves comedy and goes to the comedy cellar anytime she's in New York. She's perpetually writing a book and always trying to figure out her purpose. Samira, welcome to A Life in Six Songs.

Speaker 3:

Thank you so much. That was a great description. It's like I almost wrote it myself.

Speaker 2:

It should sound familiar. Yes, so before we get into your six songs, we'd like to start off with sort of a little warm up question, a general question, and so just briefly, you know, what role does music play in your life? How do you see music fitting into your life?

Speaker 3:

That's a great question. It's funny because I don't think of myself as like a big music person. And it's funny because I don't think of myself as like a big music person and then, answering the questions, I was like, oh, I do have a lot of musical influences and it has been such a huge part of my life. Like my husband is definitely an audiophile, he had like a radio show and his brother and sister they're all just like they're very cool, right, like they know all the bands and they don't listen to anything mainstream and even a bit snobby about, about okay. So I think I always just kind of felt like you know, music's not really my thing, but then I also go to any concert that I can and constantly listening to like music podcast or um, you know, just listening to music all the time. So it is a wonderful. And I think for a while I had that a print said like without music, life is a mistake.

Speaker 2:

Oh yeah.

Speaker 3:

In my house. So I definitely think music is amazing. I remember during the pandemic when we kind of had a reckoning of thinking about artists' contributions to our lives and you know so many artists really suffered, especially live musicians.

Speaker 2:

Yeah.

Speaker 3:

Time period, and I think people really realized oh, this is just such a part of our life and it really enhances it in such an incredible way. Yeah, I think I probably fall in that camp too. You kind of take it for granted, but then you realize that it just makes life so much better.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, no, I appreciate that response so much too, because it perfectly fits in with our show and the whole message we're trying to get out is that, you know, we tend to. We can think of these people that are the music people or the you know, like you said, almost music snobs in that way, and I feel that same way. Even being a musician and kind of living in the world of music for a lot of my life, I didn't really enjoy a lot of music conversations because I always felt it was this sort of kind of snobby thing of just like, well, let me tell you why the music you like isn't as cool or good as this other thing or something like that. And so I just really love what you said there about how, like, when you stop and look at it, you really realize how, how important music is to your, to your life, and so I appreciate that. So thank you for sharing.

Speaker 4:

For your first song. What is a song that when you hear it, you're just instantly transported to a specific time or place, and where does that song take?

Speaker 3:

you.

Speaker 4:

So let us know We'll. We'll hear a bit of a clip of it and then we'll talk more about it on the other side.

Speaker 3:

I think one of the songs that does that there's so many, right, as you're doing this kind of exercise, you really recognize that. But I was born in a small village in Pakistan and we used, you know, many immigrants. You go back every opportunity that you can, but that never is your home anymore, right, and the same thing with your adopted country where you immigrate to. It never feels quite like your home too. To this day, when I stay home, I still prefer to Pakistan, even though I go like once every eight, nine years at this point and this song that my cousins used to always play when we were leaving. So if you're familiar, if you've ever I guess you two haven't, but Ressa might be familiar with this especially back in the day when, like, technology wasn't so readily available and communication was more difficult, when you would go to Pakistan. When you're leaving, like the whole village comes, you know, like everyone, to see you off. It's like such a just, such a part of the culture and it's just considered like proper etiquette, so everyone's coming, and then my cousin would always play the song for this and my my translation is probably not great, but it's like like a foreigner or someone from another land and so, which basically means like, um, like, like, uh, the traveler, foreigner, please don't go and leave me, and it's just, it always just would make me cry so much so I'd always be like looking in the back of the car, like, very cinematically, like tears are falling down my face thinking of this song yeah

Speaker 3:

so much changed every time you left Pakistan, right, like we would go pretty often as kids, like every year or two, but inevitably someone would have passed away. Someone that's like very close might get married, and now you don't get to see them as much, or someone will have had new children. So life would just, it would never be that moment again. It was just so clear at that moment and so it was always very emotional for me, and that song always takes me back to leaving Pakistan and heading to the airport.

Speaker 2:

Well, let's take a quick listen and then we'll talk some more about it on the backside.

Speaker 1:

Like an immigrant's anthem yeah, remember me, don't forget me. Yeah, it's really beautiful.

Speaker 3:

How does it feel listening to it now? It's funny because so much has changed in the intervening years since when I first used to go to Pakistan in the late 80s and 90s and then you graduate and you go to college and also subsequently so much of my family has immigrated to America. So on my dad's side we were the second family to come. My uncle was the first and he sponsored us, so we were the second family, and then my mom's side we were the first and I don't think anyone else came for like 15, 20 years. But since then now you know, we immigrated in 88.

Speaker 3:

Almost all of my parents, siblings are here, so it doesn't have like that same emotional feeling. But I think I really long for that childhood too, because it's interesting how different the relationships are. Like I was so close to my cousins when we go back to Pakistan and maybe it's just because the visiting time is so finite that you just are like it's so intense and and then they moved here and we just weren't as close. It was so funny, maybe because oh sure and stuff.

Speaker 3:

But it was just, it was just such a space and time, and so I think, thinking of that too, I just it makes me sad a bit to think of how much life changes, you know, and relationships that were so strong not necessarily aren't as strong but aren't close in the same way anymore. It's very nostalgic.

Speaker 1:

Don't we have this like running theme of music that our cousins introduced us to? I know, I think so too. I know I think so talked about it, david, I think you did as well, whether it's siblings or cousins, but but you know other other family members and relatives, um, you know, sort of like sharing little sets. You know, back in the 80s that's what we used to do and just introducing each other to the music.

Speaker 3:

But yeah, this one definitely reminds me this particular track is from the raja Hindustani soundtrack and I'm sure you'll remember like back then you listened to like a tape, right, you didn't have all sorts of different. So that whole collection of songs is just. I think my mom must have just played that again and again and, you know, in our tape player in the car, because just for the end of the 80s and early 90s I just remember all of those songs being such a part of my life. And one thing else I'll mention it's like such a gift to have that language and be able to kind of listen to the songs that your parents and grandparents listened to and a really vivid memory I have from pakistan, even when I lived there.

Speaker 3:

I moved when I was five, but it's like one of those poor memories that stayed with me is like so in in Pakistan, you have these like woven beds. They're they're made of like a rope material called Sherpa ice.

Speaker 3:

Everyone kind of just sits outside on that and the sun, you know, you catch the sun and my grandma would just put her tapes on and there's like these very old, classic, beautiful songs, like haunting voices, and so I just remember, like the sun hitting my face and laying, you know, out in the veranda and my grandma is just sweeping with her her broom around me and the tape was up playing, and so sometimes when I hear some of those old songs too, I just feel like right back to being a little kid and just in the village. It's a really wonderful thing yeah, it's.

Speaker 4:

I feel like you are described. So I'm an immigrant also. I was born in south america and I used to visit you, know, annually, exactly like you're saying, like it was summer or like the holidays or whatever, um, and I feel like you're describing my experience exactly like I. It would be time to come home and I would like sob on the plane I was like I don't want to leave my cousins. I don't. You know. I remember one year begging my mom if I could stay my mom's, like I don't know, like you know what I mean, and so just hearing you like describe it you know we come from two very different regions of the world, but that experience I was felt the same.

Speaker 3:

Such a universal immigrant experience and if you speak Spanish then you know it's just like that gift of the language is so immense to tie us back to basically some of our you know either our familiar or our own roots and I feel so grateful for, like the music, being able to access that, like I was saying, it feels so keeps me so connected.

Speaker 3:

Right, because, as we'll talk about, I'm sure you guys talk about all the time on the podcast, like music is such a part of culture in so many ways and so I feel like when you don't know the language, you do miss out a lot in terms of being able to experience one of the core stones of culture yeah, do you play this type of music for your kids Like?

Speaker 2:

is it in your like?

Speaker 3:

instrument.

Speaker 2:

I was like no, no no, but more of that thing I know just from you know a lot of immigrant stories. It's sort of like you know the kids that are born here in the States. It's sort of like there's this pressure to like to, like you know, assimilate to the culture here and they might not have that connection to the culture back home.

Speaker 3:

And so do you play a lot of of the more traditional music in your house and are your kids kind of connected in that way or yeah, my kids definitely, because we we they've only watched which could show that, but it's a bollywood movie and there's a lot of them aren't really age appropriate. My kids are 5, 7, and 9.

Speaker 3:

And it's like even in those like the themes are a bit like horrific, but that's pretty clean and so they watch it. So they know all the songs in that and I just listen to Desi music anyway. So my parents are playing in the house and they'll know some of the songs and stuff and they can sing along a bit, even though they don't have the language themselves, but they definitely.

Speaker 4:

I think that's a part of their life. Yeah, yeah, all right. Um, let's, let's chat about your next song. Um, for your second song, what? What's a song that is just intimately connected to another activity, could be a certain book or a location, or a trip. Um, what would be that song for you?

Speaker 3:

yeah, it's a song called if you tolerate this, your children will be next. I don't even know if that's the name of the song, but it might be and by the manic creatures who are this welsh band and they're very just eclectic group of people really interesting band. But this song particularly I don't know why it got it was. You know, I had a whole playlist for studying for the bar when I was finishing with law school and for some reason when that song came on I just like put it on repeat and literally for like two months I just listened to that song on repeat thousands of times. But it's so connected to me taking the bar exam or studying for the bar exam and then taking that.

Speaker 2:

That's awesome. Let's take a listen and then we'll hear more about it.

Speaker 1:

And if you tolerate this, then your children will be next, next, and if you tolerate this, then your children will be next, will be next. Will be next.

Speaker 4:

Will be next that's a good song. I remember that song, listening to it in college. I didn't know that was the name. Well, I studied around in England and it was super popular on the radio at the time.

Speaker 3:

Oh no it's iconic, that part, the opening that you played for me. That's what I think of when I think of this song. Yeah.

Speaker 1:

So what was it about this song that tied it to the bar exam? Just completely random.

Speaker 3:

Yeah, but in retrospect, what a great song, right.

Speaker 3:

Yeah, absolutely what's going on in the world with social justice and activism and thinking about that. And I think this was like kind of like I don't know if it's a protest song, but it was maybe a Spanish civil war, maybe a Spanish civil war. It was a response. The song was written about a conflict and you know just how people, like regular people, kind of joined in to fight and so if you just think about law and you know Reza probably can relate to this Most people going to the law think they're going to help the world and do like really significant things. It really is like an activist foundation that I think a lot of my friends and I myself came from, and then you're a securities lawyer one day. But maybe at that time that song also kind of felt relevant to what I thought a legal career or just what my place in the world should be.

Speaker 1:

I think by the time, even if we start with that aspiration, by the time the bar exam comes around you're like nah, I just want to make money now, Just need a job, I need a job. It's funny.

Speaker 3:

I did work at some nonprofits and things and you also like, just that idealism you have is quickly stripped away because you see how inefficient or like the drama within these organizations, how ineffective they are, and so at that age you're just so dumb that you think that you know change should just happen like that and you've done something. And why aren't things better now? And you're thankfully, with the decades that have passed since law school, realize, okay, you know, the work is the work and that's all it is. You just do the work and then change will come. But it won't come like this. You know it won't come in that moment. You need it to, you have to.

Speaker 2:

Really it's a long game, it's a marathon and so you that's your only part in it yeah, by by lots of us doing small little things in our day-to-day work. We can, we can, you know, push that needle just ever so slightly. But yeah, that youth idealism, you think you're going to be the one to come in and you're just like I'm gonna fix it all.

Speaker 3:

And then, yeah, reality sort of smacks you in the face but it's also good to have those, that useful optimism, and you know, you see what, totally, absolutely a few times. So it's literally the only thing in my mind these days, and then I think, the next song that we're going to talk about, in the band too, just being such a musical activist, but, um, what the kids are doing right, like they do have this certain naiveness, them, and that's wonderful, because that's what allowed them to be so impactful and just say yeah and just also have such moral clarity that I think that you, you starts to become more ambiguous as you get older and it seems like there's more on the line. Point, you're just like well, this is right and that's wrong, and I don't need to know any more than that, and I think, if you can preserve that, as you get older.

Speaker 3:

That's wrong and I don't need to know any more than that right. I think if you can preserve that as you get older, that's a wonderful thing, but it is. It does come a little earlier, easier at that age, and so it's been really inspiring for me to see like these students and their activism yeah, yeah, it can.

Speaker 2:

it can help to wake up the rest of us who have maybe gotten a little bit entrenched in just the day-to-day of life and you know, paying bills and all that yeah absolutely.

Speaker 3:

That connection too, because I think a lot of us in general, just when you're at that age probably, unfortunately we've had wars for decades, so you know most of us when we're in college probably had one war or another that we were protesting against or other injustices, and so it's easier to relate. You see that, and you're reminded of a version of yourself that maybe is not at the forefront right now, it's not your primary identity and I think that's why also so many people have coalesced around them with the communities in different universities where they have people come just to create barriers or to support them and show them that love which I don't know. It's all been so beautiful to me that particular aspect and really has gives me hope. It's often so beautiful to me, that particular aspect and really has gives me hope, as I think a lot of people you know the kids are okay and you see, all of that right.

Speaker 3:

You know this, this generation that we, kind of written off as just being social media obsessed and vain and all of these other horrible things are, still have a moral integrity that most of our leaders globally don't.

Speaker 4:

So I'm always saying how impressed I am with this generation. They are mobilizing, they are organizing like young and they're not taking any shit and I love it.

Speaker 3:

I love it, like parent WhatsApp groups of like who have university students and like they'll get so riled up and they're like we're going to go do this Like back off. The kids are so organized, they know what to do. They have, like, you know, like violence interrupters there. They are not doing anything inflammatory, like it's just so well done and organized. I'm just like when I go to this stuff too, I'm just like taking notes for just work, or like parties.

Speaker 3:

Yeah, absolutely and just like taking notes for just work or like parties. Yeah, absolutely. Having like a handicap place and having like a sign language interpreter and just the thought and like inclusivity, it's like very impressive in the organization. They're going to be writing books.

Speaker 1:

A lot of times, I think it is kids. I mean, you know, there was a time when we were kids. We're clearly not anymore, but I think it's definitely, you know, whether it was the Vietnam era, wars or any other conflicts. That's the one that I think is most getting, compared to the current college protests because of Colombia and things like that. But, yeah, it's kids. Kids are the ones who move things and, like you said, they have that just almost naive sense of right, wrong, yes, no, very black and white, and they're able to sort of cut through the BS and just say, look, this is what's right and this is what's wrong, and then you can have a complete difference of opinion about what it is that they're, that they're protesting. But, yeah, give it up to kids.

Speaker 3:

Um, it's so funny the black and white point that you make. Like people in in my age group and especially being in dc and and so close to the hill, people will say like they don't you know. And hillary clinton just famously said this like they don't know you know the history. Like they don't you know. And Hillary Clinton just famously said this like they don't know you know the history. And they don't know the nuance. And there's like ambiguity and I was just like no, a kid's head being blown off. I don't need any context, I don't need anything beyond that fact for me to have an opinion that is 100 percent unmovable. And you know, I get that, that and I think at that age they really still get that that some things are black and white and right. Of course you know other things are now, but there are certain things like that are happening now that it's beyond the pale of we need to look at new ones.

Speaker 4:

It's so right, I mean this generation, unlike any generation before it, has grown up around active shooters, like they've known violence since they were tiny.

Speaker 3:

Yeah, Right, yeah, yeah, we empathize to, even though it's so monumentally different but that terror of living in fear, right, the anxiety of living in fear, and just that it's so much real for these kids somewhere else. I think they really just get it in a way that maybe our generation doesn't. We haven't had that same experience, like just the delicateness of life you know, put up most of us and of course people have different experiences, but most of us do up in relative safety.

Speaker 2:

Sure, absolutely, totally. And and just going back to the song that you know, kick this off this conversation. You know, if you tolerate this, your children will be next Right, and it's this, this, this sense of like. No, you can't allow this. You know, and like you said, it's a very simple black and white message of just, you know, no, babies being killed, children being dismembered and things, no, no, we're not talking anything bigger about that. We're not going to solve every problem in the world. We're not making any claim about it, it's just no.

Speaker 2:

Right we should agree on that.

Speaker 3:

That's not okay that's the right line, that we can all be on the same side, and fundamentally, I think most people are. This is something I know also that, like we talk so much about how polarized our country is and you know, it feels like people just hate each other, but that's. It's such a narrative that's either in the media or online, it's in in a virtual world. In the real world, I just don't see that existing. If I talk to a neighbor that might be, politically or otherwise, completely on a different spectrum than I am, they will recognize my basic dignity and humanity and talk to me, and if my kid is sick, they're going to come and help me. These fundamental things. I think people are still fundamentally good, no matter where they are in any spectrum, and that's been my lived experience. And so sometimes, when I get a bit like disillusioned or unhopeful, I just go outside and talk to somebody and you're like, oh, you know, we're okay. Actually, we're still okay, because that fundamental goodness exists in people.

Speaker 4:

I like that.

Speaker 1:

True.

Speaker 4:

Love that. All right, let's move us ahead. I don't feel like we could talk to you for like a really really long time. Then it'd be a really really long show. So feel free to just mow the earth back anytime. That's that's. That's my role here. I'm like time keeper. All right for your next song. Um, what was a memorable time when you were exposed to a particular like new band or artist's music? Um, what was the song maybe? Who exposed you to it? Who played it for you?

Speaker 3:

This question took me back to high school with my brother. So my brother's a year and a half, two years older than me and we used to ride in together and it was his car and his music choices 100%. He used to always play Rage Against the Machine. So I'm seeing like maybe some of my worldviews are influenced by some of the music, and Rage is just. You know, Rage Against the Machine is just like one of these iconic bands that are just so political and just so anti-establishment and just really had such strong political messages in their music, and Bulls on Parade is a song that comes to mind in that era.

Speaker 2:

All right, let's take a listen. If you haven't heard Raging Against the Machine yet anyone out there, here's what it sounds like.

Speaker 3:

We're winning now. We're winning now.

Speaker 2:

The microphone explodes. Shatter made the mold. Need a drop of hits like De La Oa. Get the fuck off the commode With a short shot Short will make the bodies drop yeah, it was. It was hard to pull out a 30 second clip for this song.

Speaker 3:

Um, I definitely wanted to have that guitar part in there because that's such like a key component of that that song, so yeah, yeah, it was hard to pick a rage song too, because then, as I was like thinking back, I was like there's some like um bullet in the hat, like people of the sun testify killing in the name of like. Each of those is just like are like so and like just really sticks with you.

Speaker 1:

So did you go see them when they played in dc I didn't know um one of what.

Speaker 3:

That and tom patty are like two musical acts that I'm just like so bummed that I missed out on it.

Speaker 2:

Right now I'm just like if there's a concert, just go, because yes seize the day there's a message for everybody listening or watching go see the show, yeah go see the show and you going to have a headache all day the next day, which is my situation. Yeah, yeah, yeah, cause there's bands for me too that you know I never saw, and now you don't have the chance cause they're not around anymore or whatever.

Speaker 3:

And yeah.

Speaker 1:

So in our, in our like internal chat, I'm going to share a couple of videos from that show, the mosh pit. That was Capital One Arena, I guess it was what two Augusts ago. Yeah, they played two nights. I went to one, I think the other one was on my son's birthday, so I couldn't make it.

Speaker 3:

You could have taken him. You're like son you're four, son you're four.

Speaker 1:

But no, no, he's uh. So, uh, yeah, no, I I have two teens and, um, yeah, oh, he would have been, he would. He would have loved it.

Speaker 3:

I'm just I don't yeah, yeah, yeah, I missed it, I just feel like I inherently don't go to any concert at capital arena because it's just I hate that venue. You know parking, and then we have like 9, 30 clubs, so it's like you have that musical experience or even the anthem is amazing.

Speaker 3:

Now I feel like it's yes, and it's very cool because you still feel like you're always part of the show. You can get on the floor. For me I think this was one of your other questions, but for me, like listening to live music is just a religious experience, like there's nothing like that when you are there. 930 Club really encapsulates like that feeling of it being like church you know, where you're singing together.

Speaker 3:

You're so connected and everyone's bodies are moving together and it's just such like. To me, that's one of the best experiences when you're seeing. I've seen so many great uh great bands at 9 30 and to be able to just be like this far away from people that you loved and listened to for so long is really incredible totally that's an absolutely iconic um venue 9 30 club.

Speaker 1:

Right, I mean it's, it's one of those old dirty grimy, but just there's, just you walk it's. It's like the cbgb, the dc, right, right, yeah, yeah, um, just so much history there.

Speaker 4:

Yeah, yeah, very cool so you, you listen to this song. You know in high school right, and sometimes you know at that age you kind of rock out but you're not really like listening to the lyrics did. Did their political leanings, like? Did they resonate with you? Did you kind of understand what you were listening to at the time?

Speaker 3:

no, I was just like it's loud, it's mad, and so I had no idea, or I was probably half the time telling my brother like turn this shit off and you know.

Speaker 3:

So I my know, going back to what little sisters are like is you know, but now it's just, it's so. It was just a part of that part of my life. So I know the lyrics and now it just they love it Right, and I don't know when I actually became a fan on my own, but it probably wasn't until like college or after law school or college, so, but he also, the other thing he also always listened to was the doors, so it was like we had the balance of like you know, like hello, I love you, and people are much more mellow and I'm sure he listened to other stuff, but those are the only two I remember.

Speaker 1:

And I feel like I know all of their songs so well too. For that same reason, you sound like my sister, who was on the show as well, and and quite a few of the songs were like oh yeah, you know, I like this song because I introduced her to it, and so I have two siblings and they're all in this area and the sort of DC area.

Speaker 1:

Oh you're so lucky and yeah, when we've, we've, I think, just like your family and your sibling experience. It's like you know, we've introduced each other to the different music and um and gone to a lot of the same venues here capital one, you know, anthem, uh, 9, 30 club, a few times um, so, yeah, yeah, it's, it's uh.

Speaker 3:

It definitely sounds very, very familiar my sister has, like she just loves, like white boy rap artists like Eminem. You know, we grew up in Michigan so of course, like everybody, oh, sure, yeah, yeah like Macklemore, who I like never listened to or heard of, and then he's been very active.

Speaker 3:

So when I've been going to yes and stuff he's spoken at a few, and so he recently released Hintz Hall, which is just kind of like really that same vein of political music, and so I think Tom Morello had tweeted like this this song is like the most rage against the machine. Oh yes, rage against the machine.

Speaker 2:

Yes.

Speaker 4:

Oh, now I listen to it.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, that was awesome to see. Yeah, yeah, absolutely, yeah, absolutely. I was going to ask just you know, because we talked a little bit earlier how, like, when you're finishing law school and you're like I'm going to change the world and I'm going to fight for justice and you maybe have not moved away from it but your job and your work is kind of you know, there and you're doing it, how do you balance the sort of you know, political leanings and that sort of thirst for justice and then maybe working at an institution or in a large organization that maybe doesn't move as fast, Because I think it's something I know, I struggle with it and I think a lot of people do. So I was just curious, how do you find that balance?

Speaker 3:

Yeah, I think the wisdom of age has just been like we just do work and you let the world will not unfold as fast as you want.

Speaker 3:

I actually, like you know, I'm a public servant. I work for the government and I do think I think my work is important, so I have that. At least I do think it helps regular people as, being immigrants, and even though I've always been in finance in my legal career, so I've always been exposed to different types of, like investment vehicles and just the whole fun family kind of world I didn't have a 401k, I think, until I came to this job, and part of it was like my parents, like I think they never made more than $20,000 a year in their life, like they were truly working class and they never invested a cent of the money that they made and the idea was always like this is our money, it's safe and, especially when you come from countries where there aren't like robust financial markets, it's not really like something that you would trust your money with and, as immigrants, I think it's very much so like keep the money under the mattress.

Speaker 2:

Under the mattress.

Speaker 3:

And even like I worked at a law firm and then I worked at a fund and I still had that same mentality where I was like it's greedy to want your money to be more than it is. Like I made $100. I have $100 and I'm thankful for that $100. And to make that $100 continue to work just seemed greedy or wrong. I think it's a real immigrant mentality not to participate in the financial markets.

Speaker 3:

And it wasn't until much, I think, when I turned 30, I read like Mr Money Mustache, I got obsessed with this concept of fire and started investing and my money has made so much money. Especially We've had pretty strong market runs in that time. And now I see so much of America. Not just immigrants but other minority communities don't participate in our financial markets and I do think that's a problem. So I think the investor protection work that we do and like just keeping them strong, is important, so like. So that's lucky for me that you know I do feel grateful that my job is, but I think when I was younger I would never have thought of like that being important, Right, but you need that too, right?

Speaker 3:

That is also a part of like how our country stays strong, but also how we make sure that the average person kind of has like the ability for social mobility, which is, you know, this is a true, like the true American dream, I guess, and a lot of people have a lot of thoughts about that. But for my family specifically, it really has. You know, we've been able to do so much in one generation in terms of the quality of life that we have, you know, for me and my siblings facing things, or like the loud things, but sometimes it's education and like immersing in the fundamentals that can you know exactly to your point, like make generational change yeah, one of my colleagues does this thing, where he was telling me earlier in his career he provided like technical assistance to all these different countries and like one of the things that they did was like kind of make the derivatives market available to farmers.

Speaker 3:

So like I don't remember where it was, but let's say Nigeria these farmers didn't know like the price of their crops and so they would sell it on a day and not get like the true price or they wouldn't get paid till a month later. And they just implemented these like very basic changes which now gave like millions of people access to like getting their money in a more timely way, but then also being able to participate in, you know, like divergences in price and the arbitrage that you can do. So that was like in his career. He's probably impacted like hundreds of millions of people who didn't have access to this financial freedom that they now do globally. So it's like you know, agencies are bureaucratic, they're designed to be slow. It's not, yeah, like the flashy work that you know sometimes you attribute with activism, but I do think that's been a great thing for me to learn as I've gotten older, and also just like being able to provide for your family is. You know, there's something?

Speaker 2:

no, one can't do Me.

Speaker 3:

To be able to support my family and also have spent time with them is like such a gift, and I feel like my career has given me that too.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, no, I appreciate that and you, you know, cause a lot of times in like social justice movements or whatever you want to call it. You know we have this problem of moral purity with it, right, like if you're participating in any of these things that need to be fixed or cause problems. You're not an activist in that way. And I think your response kind of gets how you thread that needle in that way. You thread that needle in that way and like, yes, there's institutions out there and they're not perfect and they might be harmful in certain ways, but there's also very real, you know tangible things that can be done that will help people right and help people that have been hurt in that sense. And so, yeah, I just appreciate that response and how you talk about how you thread that. So, thank you.

Speaker 4:

All right For your next song, because you know, as we move through life we have lots of transitions and things right. The only thing constant is sort of change. What is a song that you associate with a weighty transition in your life and what was that transition with a weighty transition in your life and what was that transition? The song and the transition.

Speaker 3:

Yes, I was quite young when I met my husband and my husband was born in Wales and he grew up in the UK and so he was exposed to all sorts of music that I hadn't heard and I just didn't have like a large you know amount of music that I was really familiar with. So when I met him he would send me all these lyrics that I didn't have like a large you know amount of music that I was really familiar with. So when I met him he would send me all these lyrics that I didn't realize were like very famous English songs. I just thought they were like poems he was writing.

Speaker 2:

Passing him off as his own.

Speaker 3:

And I think he didn't even think that, because he was like of course, everyone knows these songs, right.

Speaker 2:

Right, right. I don't need to cite this.

Speaker 3:

Did people know that song? I thought it was so obscure but for him these were just such major, huge songs and so he was exposing me a lot to Pulp and New Order, verve, blur, oasis Songs bands I never heard of, river, blur, oasis, like songs, like bands I never heard of, and so I was really mixed up thinking that these were like. He was just this poetic genius and such an insightful soul. That's hilarious.

Speaker 2:

Actually one of the songs that he sent during that time was Temptation by New Order, and so I'll let you guys play a little bit of that.

Speaker 3:

Nice, yeah, let's take a listen. So a little bit after that he goes oh, you've got green eyes, you've got blue.

Speaker 2:

And then I was like wait, wait a minute, I have brown eyes.

Speaker 4:

That's hilarious. I googled it. I was like, oh my god he's not writing this.

Speaker 3:

Oh, my goodness, I used to like dissect it all because my husband didn't tell me he liked me for a really long time, so he just sent me these songs and stuff. And then I'd like dissect it all because my husband didn't tell me he liked me for a really long time, so he just sent me these songs and stuff. And then I'd like dissect it with my girlfriends and be like you would have sent like these songs if you didn't like the person right Like look through the lyrics.

Speaker 3:

Right, have to interpret, yeah yeah, it's like that's romantic right.

Speaker 2:

Oh, and such a like, oh, such that. So brought me back right as you said that, that thing. I remember that of like trying to find the perfect song to send to someone, to like just get your feelings across, or whatever, and like, yeah, this is gonna get it perfectly say it's probably like how he won me over because they were just like.

Speaker 3:

You know, he himself is not the most, uh, empathetic person. He's kind of like, you know, very level-headed and stuff. But through the songs he really like and the bands and the music that I was exposed to, like, still like, if I hear those songs, I'm just like, just feel this. You know, over the years we've been married over 20 years that love doesn't have the same shine always.

Speaker 2:

Sure, sure, sure. You got to remind yourself.

Speaker 3:

Ups and flows Right and you try to remember like how did this start? How was it so? Cause you know at that time it's so intense and wonderful and like listening to those songs really does help take me back. I might do that this week. Pull out one of the mixtapes because he, he would write all this.

Speaker 4:

you know the the tracks on there yeah, that's such like an act of love yeah like speak to the radio, right, like you had to wait.

Speaker 3:

Oh my god, they have like hit play or they have to buy the.

Speaker 2:

CD for a song and not all the albums were available here. You know, we're all broke kids, so it was definitely a fact of love. By definition, we're talking about songs from our past, right, because we're talking about songs before today, right, experiences before today, and the goal is not really to get caught in nostalgia, but it's to remind our connection with music. So, going forward, we reclaim it because, just like we were talking about with the youth movements and the kids are always the ones with the moral clarity and they kind of remind us like hey, wake up, don't get caught in the. You know, that's the same thing I think we're trying to do here to remind ourselves like no, we always have access to these, these songs and this music and this connection to it, and so we want to remind ourselves to do that.

Speaker 3:

So I love how you just said like I'm gonna go back and, yeah, get them and stuff, because, yeah, like all parts of ourselves, right, like that person that I was falling in love and being in college, or that person I was studying for the bar and all those aspects of it. Like we forget, right especially, I don't know, like it will, probably similar age group where you're like your kids and your job and like so you know, somebody once described it as like life loses a certain excitement because all the big things are kind of. You know you found your partner right or what your career is like.

Speaker 3:

They're kind of settled and so you don't have that same, like you know, wonder of the world it's easy to forget that, but it's like those, that all those parts of me are still a part of me and I'm, you know, I'm a parent now, I'm a securities lawyer, but I'm also like all these other very fun parts of me that I think on a day-to-day basis you can kind of lose track of.

Speaker 1:

That's precisely why we're here talking about the things that make you you right yeah.

Speaker 4:

I'm having all kinds of thoughts about that right now, like just the way you're putting it, like thinking back to that younger you and what you know, what would you say to her back then? You know, what advice would you give to her? And then talking about our kids and like what are our kids listening to right now? That's going to be like imprinted in their life story. It's like totally getting me to think about all this stuff.

Speaker 3:

Now I'm getting existential Right Just like lay back and let it Right, Just like lay back and let it go of. You're a Pakistani, American securities lawyer and a mom, right? Okay, that must mean she's this type of person, right?

Speaker 2:

And through all of these stories we're seeing how we are all so much more than just these narrow roles we play, and we can forget that even ourselves, I think.

Speaker 3:

Definitely, and those parts are so fun too right Like just thinking back on that or just like somebody. I mean, I still like kind of dance very stupidly all the time, so thankfully I preserved that part of myself nice that part of you that's like loose right yeah easy to come tight as you grow older. So having those reminders of what makes you just feel kind of not not worried, yeah, kind of carefree. Yeah, carefree, that's the word.

Speaker 4:

Totally All right, we'll stay stuck on this prompt.

Speaker 3:

Let's put a reza a little bit to take it down.

Speaker 2:

Holy carefree. Oh my God, I was going to say let's all go dance after this. You know carefree, but make fun of Raza, that works oh goodness, um.

Speaker 4:

So, uh, we don't tend to talk about movies too much, so I love that you answered this prompt, um, because I just like I'll hear a song and it'll like instantly make me think of a particular movie. So, um, I love that you have this. What's a song from a movie that is just seared into your mind? You can't think of the movie without thinking about this song, and vice versa do you guys know this movie?

Speaker 2:

no, I don't I don't, I don't. I had to look it up.

Speaker 3:

Yeah.

Speaker 2:

So you're going to teach us all about it.

Speaker 3:

A lot about it. Sorry, this part will be short. Okay, all of your weekend homework and then please email me. Do it tonight, because it's movie night. It's Friday. You got to watch Searching for Sugar man. It is the best movie. It's like I remember where I was sitting. We lived in Georgetown on this. I literally can remember the experience of watching this movie because I went through so many feelings and like at the end it's like for me this is very oversold. There's like enlightenment, where it's just like the world is just amazing. That's all I'm going to say. I'm not going to tell you anything else about it.

Speaker 3:

Okay, I'll come back in five years, like when I'm a celebrated novelist, to be on your podcast again and you guys are like top of Spotify. We'll talk about it, but now the song is Searching for Sugar man. Okay, right, but now the song is Searching for Sugar man.

Speaker 2:

Okay, right, here we go by.

Speaker 1:

Rodriguez. Sugar man, you're the answer that makes my questions disappear, sugar man, cause I'm weary of those double games.

Speaker 2:

Just giving some people some context for it. So Rodriguez was an American artist in in the States. This is a 2012 documentary film searching for sugar man, and it was by documentary. Okay, yes, and it's by two. Correct me if I'm wrong South Africans that did it.

Speaker 3:

I think so, because that's where he had really gone he had really gotten huge success.

Speaker 2:

He wasn't as big in the States, but really big in South Africa, and so the documentary is about searching for sugar man and where Rodriguez in America and you know, just it's such a fantastic story.

Speaker 3:

I don't want to tell anything about it Because for me I was like a joke some comedian tells. But it's really like so accurate for me because I moved around a lot as a kid, so my education is not so complete and particularly with history, like I don't know, anything. So he's like he's watching a movie about Pearl Harbor. He's like, how is this going to end? I'm like I don't know anything.

Speaker 1:

That's hilarious.

Speaker 3:

Other than that, I'm just like what's going to happen. This is a movie that a lot of the excitement is, because you don't know what Sure.

Speaker 1:

Right, right so.

Speaker 4:

Okay, all right. All right, that's our homework.

Speaker 1:

There you go, work is set yeah.

Speaker 4:

About it Will do Do.

Speaker 2:

What, what is when you said it was it was. You know I know you don't want to like talk about the movie itself because you know spoiler alert and everything like that, but as far as you and you said kind of like this enlightenment feeling, so what is something you got yourself for the movie? You know there was you before you watched it and then the you after it.

Speaker 3:

And what do you think was a change that you had? Or well, some this concept that I'm kind of obsessed with. I'm very like into technology and I want us all to just live in a virtual world. And you know, I'm ready to be chipped the second it's available. So that's kind of like my bias going into this.

Speaker 3:

But one of the things like I'm always so fascinated by is that we have interacted with so many people over the span of our lifetime. Like I could have driven by you guys one day we could have been in the same coffee shop working or we could have been at the same concert, but it would take like a lot of digging and talking to get to that. And I think it's such a to me that that just is such a wonderful thing. Something about that makes me so happy. But I wonder, like in the future and I think there's probably a Black Mirror episode about this already but where we can just kind of map, you know, and this book that the Candy House, I think it's called that I recently read is where like everybody's consciousness is like uploaded, who opts into it, and then you can see like light from all these different people's experiences. But I just feel like one day we'll have the information where we'll all know like, oh, I've met you here and here.

Speaker 2:

Right, right, you'll just know Right.

Speaker 3:

And this, this, this kind of like this movie kind of evokes that same feeling in me of like such things are happening in the world, like really miraculous type things, but we might not ever know it, you know amazing in this, in this case, like these two documentarians you know, unpacked something really remarkable that had been happening and it was really changed lives. Yeah, wow, that Wow.

Speaker 4:

That always not always, but that's something that sometimes with documentaries like blows my mind. When you set out to film something with no like no knowledge of what you're going to find at the end and you invest all of this time and work and crews and following and, like you know, invest all of this time and work and crews and following and like you know, such that when these crews like stumble upon something remarkable or like tie a story together, like some of it feels serendipitous, some of it feels, you know, I always think when that happens it's like super, super cool.

Speaker 3:

Yeah, documentaries are amazing. I mean, I always like shy away from watching them because in my mind they're so boring. They're such an intellectual.

Speaker 2:

Right, right right.

Speaker 3:

They have such an innate bias against them and whenever I watch one, I'm like whoa, that was amazing, you know, especially when they're kind of personal stories about people.

Speaker 4:

Right.

Speaker 3:

Yeah, beautiful.

Speaker 4:

Right, I hear you. Sometimes I'm like I don't want to be sad, be sad. Is it going to be sad?

Speaker 3:

because there's like enough in the world. That makes me sad. That's the problem.

Speaker 2:

I need like a happy, inspiring right or or you're just like you know, like you said, oh, it's friday night and you just want to want to wind down with a movie night. You're like I don't want to like have to learn something right now. Like I love learning, but like sometimes you're just like I just don't want to learn something, but it's so many, yeah, documentaries, yeah, so like can be so much more than just that, the conveying of information.

Speaker 3:

Right, it's, it's, it's it's really so much more than that, I mean that's because I think now there's so many of these like food that you know, and health type documentaries that seem right, have an agenda, and so I think that has probably also kind of biased me against them where the agenda feels too strong.

Speaker 3:

But then there are these beautiful documentaries that are just storytelling and it's such a wonderful way to tell the story, especially when the documentarian doesn't know the ending. You're like right. So you're like oh, this is. It's so fun. You feel like you're there without having had to do all the work right, you're just along for the ride.

Speaker 4:

Yeah right, totally, all right, we we are at your last song we?

Speaker 3:

we had us one, I think too, but that's my kids. As soon as we watch any movie, they're like is this gonna have a happy ending? Like that build up, and they're just like no, are you sure? And then it gets worse before it gets better. Do you know? It's like the children's movie it's going to have a happy ending, don't worry.

Speaker 4:

Right, right, unless it's. Bambi. Does Bambi have a happy ending?

Speaker 1:

Oh, no, it does not.

Speaker 4:

Oh well, during the like really really sad part at the beginning you know mom and the whole thing, like I cried apparently so hard in the theater, my mom had to take me out.

Speaker 3:

And so I never watched it. Yeah, I've never seen it.

Speaker 2:

So it's on the agenda for the weekend too. Maybe that's why I'm good Searching for sugar band and Bambi.

Speaker 1:

I think we really need to have sort of an offshoot of the podcast, like from the movie perspective. We've thought about it, we've thought about putting it up on our Patreon page. A life in six movies.

Speaker 4:

A life in six movies. I'm down. That would be really hard.

Speaker 1:

I feel like it would be a really long podcast, six movies, god podcast six movies god, maybe a life in one movie.

Speaker 4:

There you go, pick your one movie. Yeah, all right. What for this last one? Uh, what is a song that's helped you through a difficult time or situation? Uh, what's the song? And, and if you're comfortable sharing, what was the situation?

Speaker 3:

yeah, for sure. You know I I got married very young, at 20, and it's a. It's a joke, like a lot of people ask me if it was an arranged marriage because I got married so young and I say like my parents, gave up everything.

Speaker 3:

They had, the only life that they had ever known to immigrate like with three little kids. They had no money. They had to like move to a country that they didn't know the language, didn't have a job and it was not so they could marry me off at 20. That now should be my fate.

Speaker 3:

So no, this was not because of my parents, it was my own stupidity Also a happy ending here but I had to convince my parents and my mom was just like you're not going to finish college, you're not going to go to law school. And I was like I promise I will, um, and she's like you're going to end up having a baby and then you're going to see like all of your life can get derailed. So I really had to comfort her and even on the day of of our Nikah, like our Islamic marriage she was like we can still say this is an engagement party, samira, no, no, you're very young. And uh, no, we went ahead with them. That was wonderful, but, um, the thing about having the kids was, uh, something that we did want to wait on. You know, we were so young and we decided to wait, and so I was like 27, I think, when we started trying to have kids and it didn't really work out for us.

Speaker 3:

So it took a long time to four years before we had a kid and in in that time period we had to like you know you try and you don't. I mean, I think there's good articles about this, but it's so amazing how little women know about their own bodies, like all this time I thought I was going to be accidentally getting pregnant and it just happens and I'm like, oh, actually, you know, if any of you have children, you know there's very specific time that you can actually only have a baby and it's not just going to happen, and so it didn't work out in the beginning. So we started exploring fertility treatments and so, within this whole like fertility community of people who are trying to get pregnant, there's this concept of the two week wait. So it's like on the forums, like to WW, but it's a term that anyone who's kind of gone through the longer road to having children is familiar with, and so I went through, um, the hundreds of these you know well that's wrong.

Speaker 3:

Half a hundred of these um waiting periods and so whenever I was in the two week wait, I'd always listen to Tom Petty's the Waiting.

Speaker 1:

Let's take a listen. The waiting is the hardest part. Every day get one more yard. You take it on faith. You take it to the heart. The waiting is the hardest part. The waiting is the highest.

Speaker 3:

Yeah, I'm so emotional just even hearing that song. It really takes me back and I know so many people in my life still who want children, who are still in that waiting period and, like your heart just goes out to those people that are still like in that. But, man, yeah, that that song really will take me right back. And then you know there's the lyrics that you played. It's like you take it on faith, you take it to the heart.

Speaker 2:

The waiting is the hardest part what you think is the hardest part. Yeah, so, other than listening to tom petty, how did you kind of navigate that that time period? How, how did? How did you? Because it, like you said, it's this thing where you're like, you're so hopeful for it. Right, it's this, it's the thing you want, but you kind of have to manage that hope because you don't know, right, you've got this waiting, and so for you, how, how did you balance?

Speaker 3:

and it must feel eternal, like those two weeks yeah, it's funny because I'm like the most stupidly optimistic person that you'll ever meet, and so every month for like 48 months, I was like this, is it, I'm pregnant? Like it, like it. Literally it was just like this ricochet every you know 21 days or whatever, being like, oh no, I'm not pregnant. I actually wrote a piece at that time called A Life in Months and I think for anyone who's kind of going through that fertility experience.

Speaker 3:

that's really your life is just you know, and you don't do anything. You make all your plans around it, like traveling, especially when you're in the fertility as we did, like six IUIs and then three IVFs, and so it's just so much coordination, like so many doctors appointments and things like that. But I think my optimism did help and also I was lucky. I had a lot of miscarriages too along the way. But you know, like everyone kind of has their, their strengths and weaknesses or their challenges and blessings, and for me one thing was like it never hit me that hard, like the miscarriages were always kind of easy for me to accept. It was very much like and I hate this expression and I, you know I wouldn't project to anyone else, but for me it was like that there was a reason for that. Like you know, I wouldn't project to anyone else, but for me it was like that there was a reason for that.

Speaker 3:

Like you, know, there's no abnormality or there's some other issue. Maybe that was like the next evil dictator or fascist. That wasn't me. Thank God he's not going to be born. So you know, for my mind it was always like that. I was like, oh good, the world has been saved again by my miscarriage, thanks.

Speaker 2:

Wow, that's a good way to think about it. Yeah, I mean, and that takes a special approach to be able to do that right, because so often we just get caught up in the quote-unquote failure of it. Right, when something doesn't go the way we wanted, we think why me, why is the world not working out for me? And so being able to have that perspective of saying like no, there's, there's a reason, like that might have been the, the new dictator that we didn't want, right, so it's, it's a good thing in the grand scheme, right yeah, and I didn't do anything.

Speaker 3:

I just want you to have that. Maybe it's like rage against one of these, like musical influence along the way, and myself something planted it in there. Yeah, so that was fortunate, but that song definitely helped and I'm sure, a lot of other music as well.

Speaker 1:

It's such an amazing perspective to have. I was just thinking that, yeah, it's probably, you know, to some it would be the worst, and it would be the worst outcome, the thing that you want most, and it's just not happening. And then you know on repeat, basically, um, and but, but, yeah, but, but. Your perspective on it was, is, is just, I mean, the only thing that I can think of is like the eternal optimist.

Speaker 3:

It's, it's um, amazing, yeah it's funny like on this comedy bit now and it's like because if you have kids, you know it can be very hard. There are many challenges to being a parent. Especially for me, the young kids was pretty easy, but as they go older I feel like a lot more of a responsibility to them, whereas before you just kind of keep them alive and you know they're so cute and it's. I found that part to be easy, but now, just like the magnitude of the responsibility of not totally fucking them up is, you know, pretty immense and yeah, not only giving them that care but to be using them to be decent people, and so I find it more difficult now, particularly and so I have this whole bit which was like the universe kept trying to help me be like you don't have to be a parent.

Speaker 2:

We're giving you an out.

Speaker 3:

We keep giving you an out One thing I've never done is listen to the universe. We're just like no, no, it's me, universe. I'm going to do all these interventions and spend, you know, hundreds of thousands of dollars, and then some of the days when it's very bad.

Speaker 2:

I'll just look at my husband and we're like for us, this is so our fault.

Speaker 3:

Yes, I'm, being a parent, very grateful for it and uh, you know, I I do uh tell some of my friends that where I was like, look, you know it's hard and but one day you'll have forgotten it so much You'll hate being a parent. That's how much on the other side of it you'll be. Give them hope. Like you know, you'll forget all of this completely Right, but you know I truly love being a parent, in case my kids somehow ever get anxious.

Speaker 4:

It's, it's so true. So, david and I have a daughter. She's, she's so true. Um, so, david and I have a daughter. She's she's 18, and so sometimes people with younger kids will ask us, like you know, does it get easier? And I'm like no, like it's just a different hard, right exactly to your point, like when they're little, the heart is just trying to keep them alive. Don't touch that, don't stick your finger in there, don't fall in there, don't get hit by car, you know. And then, as they older, it's just like a more like emotional, intellectual hard, like social media and self-esteem and mental health and your relationships, and like it's just a different it's just a different kind of hard.

Speaker 2:

You just you just get to control less and less of their world as they grow. Right, when they're young, you control their entire world, and so that's kind of what. When you said at the it's, it's easier than that's how I kind of think it. It's like, yeah, cause you're in complete control of everything. And then as they grow, you've got to, like you know, take steps back and back and back, and that just gets hard.

Speaker 1:

It's hard. Yeah, none of it gets easy. It's just different challenge um mine um so my 15 year old is starting to drive and I've never been more.

Speaker 3:

And then the next thing will be okay, going off to college, and then, whatever you know, it's all a challenge, it's I literally cannot think of that stuff like the stress of you know I I can't even get my head there for driving. I'm just like they will have self-driving cars by the time my kids, hopefully. I just kind of stave off that anxiety.

Speaker 3:

And then they're all going to go to the same school. I told them already we're going to live five minutes from them and the three of them have to live in an apartment together. So this is my plan is then they'll have each other to kind of watch out for each other. But man, yeah, I'm not looking forward to that.

Speaker 4:

Yeah, you're not wrong. They might have self-driving cars, and then I think you don't have to white knuckle it, we'll just move.

Speaker 3:

I mean, we live in the city now so they don't really have a need for it. So maybe we'll move to New York. Really, they won't make sense.

Speaker 4:

Yeah, yeah, no need for a car there, you go, there you go, which is the highway in this area at night in the rain with a kid who has his learner's permit and that's it.

Speaker 2:

Quite an experience.

Speaker 1:

I was the person that was one that night.

Speaker 4:

There's just nothing like being in a vehicle with zero control and a child has your life in their hand. Like you know what I mean. There's just there's like nothing you can do and you're just like break, break, break, like.

Speaker 3:

I didn't say that. That's like. One good metric of like knowing you're old is when it looks like there's literally a 10 year old driving cars.

Speaker 2:

Right.

Speaker 3:

Should I call the police? What's going on?

Speaker 2:

yes, yes, oh yeah, we've got a toddler driving over here. This is not okay oh my goodness definitely the point of like.

Speaker 3:

I remember when I was pregnant I used to just like that because I was like, I always know what this baby is, I control what it's getting. You know, I, even back at that point, I was aware of how that was just fleeting. And you know, each moment now they go to school and they can read. So, like, once they can read, right already they have all these worlds accessible to them. You know I can't read every single thing and nor would I want to kind of, you know, add it to heavily what they're reading. But it's, you know, add it to heavily what they're reading, but it's, you know, it's only nine and seven, the girls. And I'm like they'll come up to me with ideas and I'm like, oh, what did?

Speaker 2:

you hear about this.

Speaker 3:

Oh yeah, I just need Susie in this book is dealing with it. I'm like okay, well, talk to me. Something like that never happens, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, something like that ever happens, yeah, yeah, yeah, it's. It's that tough challenge. You want your kids to be, you know, achieve more than you, or be more worldly than you, or have a wife like you. You, you want that, but it's tough when it happens because you're like it's a challenge to you too and so it is. Yeah, it's tough again, controlling that world. Right, when you control the whole world, that's real easy.

Speaker 3:

Then when you don't, becomes harder absolutely I love traveling and I think of the traveling I did in my 20s and like hopefully my kids will have that experience. But, oh man, I made so many bad choices, situations that like in hindsight I was like I'm so lucky that all of my paths were just so good, you know.

Speaker 2:

Right, right, you know I'm lucky to be here right now, yeah exactly so hopefully that same good energy will follow them.

Speaker 3:

That's like such a fun part of life, right Like that first time that you go out into the world and you're in a new country or a new culture, and they can't take that from them either. That's true.

Speaker 4:

That's true Part of the experience. Well, Samira, how does it feel to hear your life reflected in these six songs?

Speaker 3:

Oh, it feels great. What a good life. You know I love that Nice. Yeah, I feel just even doing the, the questionnaire and reflecting it just makes you. You know it's easy to lose sight of how good the path is right, how good the journey is, and all the wonderful things that have happened along the way, so thank you for that.

Speaker 2:

Yes, oh, that's awesome. Yeah, we're glad to have you on, we're glad to be a part of it, but we're not done yet.

Speaker 1:

Raz has got our lightning round for you yeah, first of all, thank you, um, and that was probably the most perfect answer that we've heard yet about. You know now, looking back at your life in these six songs, so really appreciate that. Okay, lightning round. So what was your first, last and best or favorite concert?

Speaker 3:

My first was probably Oasis, but I don't remember it. I literally had to look through my emails to find that. My husband confirmed it for me because it was like his favorite band. The last concert oh, I have no idea what it was. We've gone to a bunch so I couldn't tell you that. I think I've written it down. But my best and my next concert is Pulp, which was literally like the most transformative, like amazing experience. We went to New York for the show and jarvis cocker is just the most phenomenal entertainer. All the music is so good and we've been waiting for them to tour like literally. I've had alerts and just looking like we'll go around the world for this, but they're coming to new york, they're coming to the us this year and so in september we're going to go see them and probably do back to back shows like this. I asked if you saw some artists like I don't know if I going to go see them, and probably do- back-to-back shows like this.

Speaker 3:

I'd ask you if you saw some artists. I don't know if I'll get to see them again.

Speaker 1:

Where are they playing Do? You know the venue.

Speaker 3:

No, I can send it to you.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, that sounds awesome.

Speaker 3:

I'm so annoyed I can't remember the last.

Speaker 1:

It'll come to you Second to last. Yeah, second to last.

Speaker 4:

It's the last one you remember.

Speaker 3:

I'm not a good on-the-spot person, guys, I have no idea. It was somebody from the school too. That's why I want to remember it, because I was like, oh, you know who it was. I remember now Because I just listened to them on a podcast the Killers and it was such a good show, how do you forget the Killers? I know I know that the anthem oh.

Speaker 2:

Killers. Didn't we see the Killers at the anthem, or did we see Killers?

Speaker 4:

No, we saw Walk the Moon at the anthem. We saw the. Killers when we lived in Miami. It was the first. It's the story I I told the first concert I ever took you to and you just stood there like this and I was like he hates it. He's having a horrible time and I didn't realize that. That's how david communicates. That he's like totally into the music is that. He's just like standing there absorbing it and I was like absorbed.

Speaker 4:

I was like this guy hates like my favorite band, like I don't know if this is gonna to work. They put on a really good show. They do?

Speaker 3:

I remember my husband was like do you want to go see them? I was like, oh, I don't know. Do I really know their songs? Then I was like, oh, this song, there's every word to it. They're just really prolific. A lot of hits.

Speaker 1:

We saw them at the Merriweather Pavilion in Maryland a couple years ago. They opened with Mr Brightside. It's like we can go home now, that's right, it was a fantastic show.

Speaker 3:

I saw Robin at Merriweather when I was nine months pregnant. There were all these really young girls around me. I was just like. She's doing a lot of dance, super pregnant, bopping around. She is just like super pregnant. She is going to have this baby.

Speaker 4:

Oh my goodness, merriweather Pavilion or Post Pavilion is an outdoor amphitheater venue. It's a good venue. We saw AJR there. It's really nice. The field, the lawn area is really nice. It's like really nice, the field, the like lawn area is really nice. Yeah, it's a good place.

Speaker 3:

So far, though, I always have to think twice Like do we really want this?

Speaker 4:

Right Right, it's a trek to get out there, all right. So in the few minutes we have left as we're getting ready to sign off, sumira, if there's anything you've got going on that you think people might be interested in, or if anyone just really really resonates with your story and would like to maybe reach out to you, how can they do that?

Speaker 3:

Yeah, nothing to promote except Free Palestine. Please keep keeping at it. If you're listening to this and doing it, don't give up. All the small work really does add up, and literally all I post about on my Instagram. So if you ever want to know your action item for the day, there's usually something there. So that's really the only thing I want to say.

Speaker 4:

I love that. That's wonderful. Thank you so much.

Speaker 3:

Thank you all so much. This was super fun.

Speaker 2:

All right, everybody, remember to like and subscribe, share this episode with your friends and your network so we can get these stories out there and we will see you next time on a life in six songs.

People on this episode

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David Reese

Host
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Carolina Reese

Co-host
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Raza Mahmood

Co-host