Matt Jones:

Matt Jones here. If you want to check out the video version of this podcast, click on the first link in the description.

Luke Kosmanis:

Well, it's just become normalised, hasn't it? And that's the unfortunate thing, is drinking and being hungover in Australian culture is just normal. And then when you step away from it, like you have, you understand how much better life can be and the energy levels that you have. And you wake up and you're feeling fresh and your levels of clarity, you're just focused on business and you're smashing it.

Matt Jones:

Tradies and contractors making over $50,000 a month in revenue. I will guarantee you 30 qualified leads in the space of 90 days or it is free. You heard that right, it's 30 qualified leads in the space of 90 days or it's free. And you're probably sitting here thinking, what the heck? That's a ten X result on what I'm currently getting from my marketing. And that's the point. We have finally cracked the code. We've got this amazing new process, it is working and we are absolutely rolling this out big time. Head across to tradie.wiki/offer. That's tradie.wiki/offer. Fill in the form, book a time.

Luke Kosmanis:

To have a chat and we look.

Matt Jones:

Forward to helping you grow. Ciao, Luke. Welcome to The Site Shed podcast.

Luke Kosmanis:

Thanks, buddy. It's good to be on here for the second or third time around.

Matt Jones:

I feel like we're walking on eggshells here, so we're just going to try and roll the dice. Tech issues.

Luke Kosmanis:

Yeah. That's why traders should just stay on the tool sometimes.

Matt Jones:

Welcome to the show. I just actually read through the email intro you sent me before we jumped on this call, and I was just thinking how relevant and what a good topic this is, because I've never covered anything like this and I've got a bit of, I suppose, insight to this recently myself in the space of some of the things we're going to talk about today with the detrimental habits that we sort of get tied into, especially here in Australia, as a bit of a culture related with things that I suppose sometimes we should probably do less of.

Luke Kosmanis:

Yeah, definitely agreed.

Matt Jones:

And it kind of becomes, I guess I mean, I'm sure you're going to get into this and get a lot more experience with me than this than I do, but I've recently stopped drinking for a couple of months just purely because I wanted to focus on some big goals that I had with work, and I just didn't want to be cloudy. And truthfully, I don't really drink a huge amount anyway because I've got two little kids and it's a punish, like trying to pretend to tend to them at three in the morning when you've had a few too many drinks. But it's amazing how much even just taking two and a bit months off drinking, how much you realize it's part of your identity and you go out to hang out with mates or something and they just think you're like an alien because you're not drinking. And it's just like that. And sometimes even I had some mates that didn't even want to come around because I knew that I was off the booze. We'd have nights here. I've got like a bit of a boys set up here with darts and archery and whiskey and all this stuff. And no one wanted to come around because I wasn't drinking whiskey or whatever. I was like, wow, it's really become part of my identity.

Luke Kosmanis:

Yeah, not just your own identity, but just like, culture, isn't it? You can go into depths about the insecurities of why we drink and being uncomfortable in social situations, but it's just culture. Just like it becomes part of what we do and it's like, oh, that's weird. If you don't do it, it's like, well, kind of not.

Matt Jones:

Yeah, obviously this whole conversation is very, I suppose, individualistic with people. Like, everyone has their own experience with these things and I don't know if it's necessary. I'm a firm believer of just taking things in, not overdoing it. Like, little things at a time kind of thing. You don't need to go overboard with it. And I guess for some people, it's not that case. Like, some people with these addictive personalities and whatever, it's probably better that they can it all together. I can't really relate to that, though. I've never experienced that sort of thing.

Luke Kosmanis:

Yeah, I'd agree, man. Everything in amounts, right? But I feel like even my story where it started was I was every weekend, like Friday, Saturday, Sunday, like, getting on the booze, getting on the bags, getting on just this constant cycle from 18 to 26. And it just becomes, like you said, you take two and a half months off and the clarity that you get and just like, the focus and drive that you get from not doing these things, it's just like a numbing agent to what's potential in your life. That potential in your life. I still enjoy a drink here and the occasional night out. I'm not against it. I think it's healthy to have those nights in between just to sort of remember how shit you feel the next day.

Matt Jones:

But just in moderation.

Luke Kosmanis:

Yeah, exactly. But I think it's hard to well, for me, someone like me, I have an addictive personality. Well, I did anyway, before I did all this work. And that was like, you have one and then you have two, and it's never just one. You always end up absolutely smashed and it's 04:00 a.m. In the morning and you're still going and you're looking for the next packet or whatever it is. So I didn't know how to handle moderation and I know a lot of Tradies don't either, so I guess it's just like figuring out what works best for you but not shaming yourself about it either. Not being like, oh, you're a fucking dickhead for doing this. Just being like, okay, cool. Where's room for me to improve?

Matt Jones:

Yeah, it's a tough line in the sand, I suppose, that you've got to draw internally in order to take that step. And that's the hardest part, right? It's like taking that step and like you say, you don't really need to have to hide it. I know at one point I went through something like 20 OD years ago, and at that point in time, I sort of just completely disassociated myself with an entire group of friends for the space of, like, 18 months. So I was like, if I'm ever back around that group, it leads me down the wrong path and I just don't want to be. And I look at that now and I go, man, that was just like you were just being a chicken shit because you just didn't know how to man up and confront it properly and say no. Whereas now I just go, no.

Luke Kosmanis:

You've lived a life. I think it's an interesting one, isn't it? And I hear therapists and stuff talk about junkies and when they go through therapy and they go to what do they call it, where they go like, AA, yeah. Where do they go? Rehab. Rehab, right. And then whenever they go back, the time that they relapse is the environment that they surround themselves in. So it's like, yeah, there is a line between distancing yourself from an environment and I think when you first go down the path of wanting to better yourself and not drink and not get on the drugs, that is a good idea because you'll find that half the time it's not you that wants to do it. You're just in the environment. Everyone, once again, it comes back to the culture. It's like, yeah, let's just have a few. Let's just talk shit. And then it becomes fucking, oh, yeah, I'm already in the situation now. Let's just go.

Matt Jones:

So tell us a bit. How about what you do and how you got to where you're at now? Because you've been on a bit of you mentioned before you touched on a few little things within your journey, but you got a pretty cool initiative you have underway these days, don't you?

Luke Kosmanis:

Yeah, I've done a lot of personal development work. I've done a lot of trauma clearing work throughout my life. And I came to the realization that I want to create a better world. And I know from the fact that relatability wise and what I've been through, I can help Tradies. Because from everything you can think of in the trade industry, I've done it, like working in commercial, working in domestic, starting my own business, scaling that to seven figures, doing podcasts, doing personal development, doing everything in between. I can do it. And I feel like I can relate to a lot of Tradies. So for me, it's just like seeing what the industry has been like being in it myself, understanding what needs to change and what can be improved on and then just being like, fuck, why not be the voice that can help people become better? Because I have a vision for the future that it's focused around men being better, men being more grounded, being more strong within self. Like you were speaking about earlier. How you get past that point of needing all these impulsive things and then being able to live a better life and create your own business or do whatever that looks like in the future. So for me, that's what I want to do. I just want to create a better industry. I see a greater industry that we all know can exist.

Matt Jones:

Yeah, that's it. And you know what? So much of the issues that I see, even from my day back in the trades, I feel like it's almost systemic. And so many of these problems that are around which are related to drugs or drinking or gambling and whatever it might be, so much of that is kind of just passed on systemically through generations and through industries and it almost becomes the norm. And I kind of feel like if there's one good thing that social media probably has done today, it's sort of brought an awareness to peripherals in that space where before, when you didn't have all that stuff, you were basically exposed to whoever you hung out with at work. And then all of a sudden you kind of have these broader pictures and realizations of alternatives.

Luke Kosmanis:

Yeah, I agree with you, man. And I think the interesting thing about being a tradie is it's like the camaraderie when you're on site, you're having a good time, but you're working so hard, like physically demanding and then you've also got the mental capacity as well of having to work things out and problem solve. It's a long week. I get it. At the end of a long fucking week, I get why it's culture. Just I want to crack a beer. I've had a long week, I'm tired, I'm exhausted. This is just a relief. But like we said earlier, it's not being able to moderate and be able to do things in small doses. It's just like, let's fucking go as soon as we have that first beer.

Matt Jones:

I think as well, the reality is, and I don't know if this is just like as a result of me getting older or whatever, I don't want that beer or two beers or ten beers to affect other areas of my life professionally. For example, I don't want to be cloudy and make poor calls because I've had too many whiskeys one night. Or I don't want to not be able to get up and go to the gym in the morning because I feel too shit because I'm too hungover or whatever it might be. So there becomes like this, I guess for me anyway, it's like this battle of it's, one or the other. And so now I've got a fridge full of non alcoholic beer and people come around, they're like, what? Because I still enjoy having a beer on a Friday night, but I just don't want to wake up with a hangover.

Luke Kosmanis:

Yeah, well, it's just become normalized, hasn't it? And that's the unfortunate thing, is drinking and being hungover in Australian culture is just normal. And then when you step away from it, like you have, you understand how much better life can be and the energy levels that you have and you wake up and you're feeling fresh and your levels of clarity, you're just focused on business and you're smashing it. And once you get a taste of it, it's like, okay, I'm going to be addicted to that taste, instead of the taste of waking up and feeling like a dickhead on a Saturday or Sunday morning.

Matt Jones:

I'm really interested in your take on doing things. I firmly believe that, again, different types of personalities. Mine is not even remotely addictive. And you were saying that you did come from that. I can easily just not drink for a couple of months, not have a problem with it, focus real hard on something, set a goal, hit it and then go and celebrate, have your beers or whatever and sort of work. In these cycles, I find it very hard to be on all the time. I am never on all the time. I'll hit things within a few months and just smash the heck out of things and then I'll just be like.

Matt Jones:

But I'm sort of in control. I feel like I'm in control of it. And again, having two little kids is a real it's quite sobering. It's the last thing you want to have to deal with. That level of responsibility as well is something that kind of is always playing in the back of your mind. It's like, well, no, you literally cannot have any more beers because you got to drive home or you got little ones to take care of, you got to shower and feed and all that kind of carry on.

Luke Kosmanis:

Yeah, well, I mean, like you said, you said it real. Well, life ebbs and flows, right? So I'm similar now. So if I look back to who I was and who I am now, my personality isn't so addictive. You look at it back at why I was drinking back then and it was a bunch load of insecurities and childhood trauma that I was dealing with and this need to people please all the time. Like half the time I was out for the fact that I wanted friends. It was never about what I wanted, it was always about the external and it was never about the internal. So now when I can go enjoy drinks and I had probably like six or seven on the weekend and that was over an entire day and I was like, Cool, it's time to go home. I'm good now. And I think that takes a little bit of time of getting used to and a little bit of conditioning into getting into that sort of personality or that identity where you can become that and you can just be okay with having drinks. But when you first start, I think sometimes you need to just go cold turkey and fight through the pain for a little bit, maybe.

Matt Jones:

Yeah. I think one of the big things I appreciate how hard that is for some people when they've got and again, like for you guys out there listening to this or watching this, I get it. When your entire social circle, identity, whatever it is, is tied up in a circle that just has always done something a certain way or has expected something. No, we go to the pub on Fridays and we drink ten schooners. That's what we do. We've always done that. It's a hard thing to break because where else do you go if that's your entire circle of influence?

Luke Kosmanis:

Yeah. It's difficult to break free from an environment and find a new one, especially overnight. It's not something that you've bonded with these people for 10, 15, 20 years, however long it's been, and then you sort of wake up and start to realize that, hey, this isn't I'm feeling a little bit like an outcast here. I don't want to be constantly doing the same thing over and over and over again, which is kind of where I was at. But, yeah, like you said, I have a lot of empathy because it's not fucking easy to just wake up one day and go, no, I'm not doing this.

Matt Jones:

One thing I do find, though, is truthfully. This is probably not a good approach because it kind of plays to there being an excuse not to do things the way you did. But if I have something that I'm working towards, if I'm training for something, or if I'm got work focus and I don't want to drink, I'll use that as the reason to not engage where in reality, you shouldn't really have to have an excuse. It should just be, well, no, I just don't want to anymore.

Luke Kosmanis:

Yeah, but it is. It's always good to have a dark side, to head to the light. There's not one without the other. But look, if you can channel it without having to look at it in a shameful way, because I don't look back at my past and go, Fuck, you're an idiot. I look past and go, okay. That's what I needed to do in that time. I needed to exert that energy in a way, for me to learn and grow into the individual that I am now. So it's like, Fuck, you've got a beautiful story right now. I don't think there's anything wrong with drinking and doing bags every weekend. It's like okay, cool. Maybe you don't want to do that now. Maybe you want to evolve into the next evolution of yourself and become a better person and that's fucking awesome. I hate when it's shamed upon because life's fucking tough. There's a lot of tough shit going on. So I can understand why you want to have a drink here and there. I could get it.

Matt Jones:

Yeah, I think that's the key. Just having being in control and doing things within moderation. I mean, I was the same. I partied like an absolute fucking rock star, man, for years. Loved it, but just grew out of it. Eventually I just got bored and just started affected training and performance and I was like, it's not really worth it. Then as you get older, married, kids, blah, blah, blah. That kind of like things just take know one of the big things for me and it's a hard thing and I relate to people that aren't in the like we just packed up and left where we lived. We got right out of Sydney and moved up the north coast and we didn't know anyone. And so that made life easy because I had no one to go to the pub with. So the wildest nights we have are like sitting around the fire drinking a couple of glasses of shiraz or something.

Luke Kosmanis:

Yeah, you do that. It's good to avoid. But then you get to a point where you realize or if you want to, but you got to integrate into new societies and you got to welcome new people in and that's where it gets uncomfortable again. But I don't mind that. Just leaving and heading up north, I.

Matt Jones:

Reckon really from my point of view though, for people out there, that if you know that's you if you know you got bad habits and things or more to the point, you need to develop better habits, let's put it that way. There's a lot of really good resources around to help do that. I'm sure you've read it, Atomic Habits. That book just changes everything. It's just such a great way to help you formulate process within your life to develop positive habits. I just love that book and there's so many other books like it and places you can go to. But essentially for it to happen, you have to decide no one can motivate you to want to do it. I remember going through this myself and I was like, man, every time I drink now, I just feel shit. I just feel shit. Not even like hungover shit. Just like a dark cloud shit. And I was like, just going to stop doing this.

Luke Kosmanis:

Yeah, well, because you realize how well you can perform and the energy levels that you can have. The amount of times that I've wanted to get home after a long day at work and have a beer, but it's like, no, I'll hit the gym, I'll cook a nice meal. Because as soon as you hit the gym, you cook a better dinner and then you have a better sleep. And it's just like a cycle. But if you have that beer, you parked on the couch and you're feeling miserable and feeling fat.

Matt Jones:

And there's loads of research too, which I don't know if it's entirely true about how I don't know if you've followed much of Craig Ballantyne stuff or perfect day formula, but he's a big no booze advocate these days. And it's all like all the science around how you sleep better if you don't have alcohol in your system and all this kind of stuff. I don't know if it's ever really been my experience, but it's probably truth. I mean, essentially you're poisoning yourself.

Luke Kosmanis:

Yeah, I hear about that all the time. And they say even just like one drink, one beer is the same as having five beers. When it comes to sleep, there's no difference. As soon as whatever the chemicals are.

Matt Jones:

In it, you may as well have five.

Luke Kosmanis:

Yeah, well, you may as well.

Matt Jones:

Sure. If you want to feel even worse.

Luke Kosmanis:

The next day, go for it. I was actually listening to this podcast the other day and this guy ran 200 miles or something and he was just like, said that exact same thing. He's like, yeah, if I ever going to have one, I'm going to end up having five. Because just like it's the exact same, it's going to affect my sleep the same way.

Matt Jones:

Really?

Luke Kosmanis:

Yeah. This guy was running fucking ultra marathons. So good on him.

Matt Jones:

Yeah, man. Yeah. What does the process look like? What are you doing out there? Is it a program?

Luke Kosmanis:

Yeah, currently at the moment I'm just doing like a two day event, but targeted at trade, business owners or anyone that's like a tradie, working for someone looking to start their own thing or just get into the business side of things because my event's more about changing the individual instead of just giving them the business stuff. Because you'll find a lot of business coaching out there. It's just like, yeah, do this, this and this. And then it's like even like you talking about atomic habits. It's like, yeah, I could read that. But if they're not ready for that, they're not going to implement anything that they fucking read. It's just like a total for me, it's like there's a two day event where we go, okay, the first day and a half are just like values, vision, mission, legacy. Who do you want to be? What is your vision for the future? And then get super clear on that. And then we spend half a day just smashing out a business plan for the future. And then also what I'm working towards as well because I really do want to help as many people as I can for the future, which isn't right now. I want to start speaking to companies and start speaking on stage to as many traders as I can and just help them wake up, like you said, raise the awareness, help them wake up to a little bit more about what's possible. And I just want to build a lot of better cultures on site because fuck, when I had my company, one thing that I focused on the most was like just culture, making sure my guys were happy, they were working hard and doing the right thing, obviously with a bit of harshness to keep them going. But to create a culture where guys can rock up to site, they fucking want to be there, they're energized about the day and they're having a good time instead of being like, I don't know if I want to be like, go to my boss, like he's a fucking dickhead. Like he yells and abuses me. I don't want to be in those toxic environments. So yeah, just really just trying to make the industry a better place.

Matt Jones:

It's amazing how as well the fish rots from their head down. You really see a couple of young guys working with me now locally. We've got quite a big team offshore and it's very hard to maintain that culture. It's very hard for them to see your lifestyle and the choices that you make in order to make better decisions and have better outcomes. A couple of young guys working with us now locally, they do kind of see more of the decisions and I suppose why decide to do things? And that is kind of like you can see them taking that sort of stuff on board, which is good because I didn't really have that influence back when I was their age. And again, you led down paths according to who you hang out with and who you take advice from and whatever. And whether you like it or not, as a business owner, that is a very often you you're kind of the people they go to, whether consciously or subconsciously, they're looking for you, to you for leadership and they're looking to you for habits and see how you do things and that stuff rubs off on people.

Luke Kosmanis:

Yeah. And I like what you said, man. It's exactly why I run my events in person. Because the level of connection that you'll get online, it's never the same, right? Like you're saying you've got guys offshore, you don't have that connection and they don't get to see what you're doing on your everyday to day. Because I'm not going to fucking post on my social media everything that I'm eating every day, the training that I'm doing, all the regimes that I've got because I'm like, I'm not going to fucking post that. But when you spend time with someone and they see you for who you are and they see the health and the confidence showing through, it's like, okay, fuck, that's someone that I want to work towards being. And that's the beauty about in person stuff. And you know what? That might limit my numbers, but for me, the change starts small and it ripples itself out.

Matt Jones:

Yeah, totally. Cool, man. Well, look, it's been a good chat. Is there anything you wanted to discuss any further?

Luke Kosmanis:

Look, not really, man. I'm happy to keep this short and sweet, but if you guys are looking to watch me, I got some blogs that I'm fucking chucking around. I'm trying to create some fun stuff and trying to just get my message out there as much as I can and help anyone that I can. I'm always just open to having a conversation with anyone that's listening, that wants to grow their business or just wants to get themselves in a better headspace about partying on the weekends and better in their life and whatever that may be. So I'm always open for a chat. It doesn't have to be salesy. It doesn't have to be anything like that. I just want to help you out.

Matt Jones:

Yeah, totally. I mean, it's much the same as the reason why the site Shed exists. It's there as a resource for people to basically fall on and connect with people like yourselves. And, yeah, if you guys are out there and you are struggling with any of that sort of stuff, then reach out to, like, you've got Luke here. I'm always happy to connect with you through the Facebook group and that kind of stuff. It's not like it's an uncommon conversation, to be fair. I'd be surprised if there's many people exposed to any sort of trade coming through the system that have not sort of had that kind of realisation, you know.

Luke Kosmanis:

Yeah, for sure. It's definitely more aware.

Matt Jones:

And if you haven't yet, it's probably coming. Although, to be fair, I imagine we're probably preaching to the quiet or to a degree, people that are sort of listening to this are probably largely a bit more in control or I don't know, maybe not.

Luke Kosmanis:

Yeah, that's fair enough, man.

Matt Jones:

Cool. All right, man. What's been good? Thanks for coming aboard. Where can people get hold of you?

Luke Kosmanis:

Yeah, so my website is almost up and running. It should be up and running in the next week, but just follow me on Instagram, The Conscious Tradie or on YouTube. The Conscious tradie got content posting out every day.

Matt Jones:

The conscious tradie.

Luke Kosmanis:

The conscious tradie. Yeah. Jump it in the bio below.

Matt Jones:

Rock and roll. Thanks for your time.

Luke Kosmanis:

Appreciate it. Thanks, man.

Matt Jones:

Keep up the good work.

Luke Kosmanis:

No worries. Cheers.

Matt Jones:

I hope you enjoyed that episode of the Siteshed podcast. If you like the sound of 30 qualified proposals in the space of 90 days, I just want to recap, head across to tradie.wiki/offer, watch the videos, fill in the form and make sure you book a time to have a chat with me. This is for businesses that are making $50,000 a month in revenue, are located in Australia, New Zealand, Canada or the USA. And you're a trade business or a contractor that works with project based work head across to tradie.wiki/offer? Yes, I realised it sounds too good to be true. Trust me, it works. Do it now.