Studio Sessions
Discussions about art and the creative process. New episodes every other week.
Links To Everything:
Video Version of The Podcast: https://geni.us/StudioSessionsYT
Matt’s YouTube Channel: https://geni.us/MatthewOBrienYT
Alex’s YouTube Channel: https://geni.us/AlexCarterYT
Matt’s Instagram: https://geni.us/MatthewIG
Alex’s Instagram: https://geni.us/AlexIG
Studio Sessions
65. Attempting A Low-Stakes Space For Photography And Conversation: PART 2
WE STILL HAVE NO NAME... We spend most of this episode wrestling with what to name our new gallery space. The conversation moves through dozens of possibilities—from "Synchronicity" to "Room" to "Keyframe"—trying to find something that isn't pretentious, that wears well over time, and that captures the intersection between a photography gallery, Josh's furniture showroom, and a functional creative space. We talk about Star Wars naming, city names, and why the best names feel obvious once you hear them.
Beyond the naming problem, we dig into what this space actually needs to be. Not a stark white-wall gallery, not a packed vintage shop, but something in between—a place that feels lived-in and functional while still formally presenting work. We discuss projectors versus CRT TVs, lighting strategies, and how to arrange furniture so the space encourages conversation rather than commerce. The bigger goal emerges: creating a scene in Omaha for street photographers and creative people, a place comparable to Warhol's Factory or the Neistat brothers' studio—somewhere work gets made because there's a community constantly pushing each other. We talk about curation philosophy, the difference between selling objects and presenting a way of seeing, and building trust with an audience by being selective about what gets shown. -Ai
If you enjoyed this episode, please consider giving us a rating and/or a review. We read and appreciate all of them. Thanks for listening, and we'll see you in the next episode.
Links To Everything:
Video Version of The Podcast: https://geni.us/StudioSessionsYT
Matt’s YouTube Channel: https://geni.us/MatthewOBrienYT
Matt’s 2nd Channel: https://geni.us/PhotoVideosYT
Alex’s YouTube Channel: https://geni.us/AlexCarterYT
Matt’s Instagram: https://geni.us/MatthewIG
Alex’s Instagram: https://geni.us/AlexIG
I think there's like other stuff in there too. So it's sort of like if you have to use it. I'll I'll but it's like a tour bus, you know. I don't know if you know the number one rule on the tube rock tour bus. You cannot shit on the tour bus. Not even the talent can. That's unfortunate. I'm out then.
SPEAKER_01:I'm out. You gotta tell the driver to pull over it. Yeah. Can we build a restroom into that back room? Something. What are we doing? Um all right. So do we have anything to add, I guess, to the context? And then I mean, I just I almost think we just do an ideation. Like we've got essentially an hour. We'll just do an ideation and it went to end.
SPEAKER_02:You should see the conversation I was having with ChatGPT last night. I actually got to a point where I pay the$20 a month to have it. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:And I was like, Did you hit your usage limit? Yeah, I hit my limit for the day.
SPEAKER_02:It was like you've hit your whatever, like upgrade to pro. I'm like, there's a limit. I mean, I sat there for like an hour. It must have been an hour going back and forth with with I call her her because I have a female voice, but going back and forth with her about trying to come up with words or phrases that capture these ideas about about it. But they were born out of what we talked about earlier, the um like you said, destiny and all that. You know, I know we're kind of using some of the cornier words here. Um, but you just call the gallery synchronicity. I know.
SPEAKER_01:So like there are not that would look cool on a door.
SPEAKER_02:It's kind of a new tech startup.
SPEAKER_01:I mean, whatever you want it to be.
SPEAKER_02:Sure. Um I mean, I had uh just put down like like I had was trying to talk to her about we gotta stop anthropomorphizing this thing.
SPEAKER_01:You were trying to talk to this language module.
SPEAKER_02:Trying to talk to it about um like a like a a place that represents the threshold between um uh like like two destinations, like thinking of you know, we're typically referred to as the flyover states, you know, in in Hollywood circles. Um, they referred, you know, is it gonna play well in the flyover states? Keep flying over, buddy. Um you know, and I had named my production company Midland Pictures, not just because this area is called the Midlands, but because like I was like, Midland, that's like just kind of an interesting word that represents sort of like this in-between place. Um, and that was really interesting to me. Um, but it was uh tough coming up with words that didn't feel pretentious and full of shit. Um words that were like, Oh, that's interesting. Because like I feel like Josh's shop, but Josh's shop for everyone, just so you know, is called Lost. Oh, yeah, it was Modern Mayhem, wasn't it? Yeah, that was his persona, like not like persona, like he like would jump into a room with a bunch of like fucking leather on and like screaming shit. But like his his sort of like art artist moniker for the curation that he does was modern mayhem. Um, but the shop was always called Lost. Gotcha.
SPEAKER_03:Gotcha.
SPEAKER_02:But I like I like I when I told me the shop's called Lost, I'm like, yeah, yeah, that's right. And like that's what you want when you name something.
SPEAKER_01:You want people to be like it can't be something though that we like we can't just pull from something that's like a word from a thesaurus. No, a hundred percent. Like it's gotta be something that we're both like hyper familiar with, but that's and immediately are like that's yeah, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_02:And me talking to it about these ideas, and then like give me 10 words that are evocative of that idea. Yeah, it's like it is literally just a brainstorming. So you have a list.
SPEAKER_01:What do you have?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, I mean go through some. These were words that were most interesting to me. Um, fly over, Midland, not because I actually think we would use it, because I already have that for my production company name, but that was just a word that does something for me. Um scene as an S E E N, hear, H E R E, Window, Flow, Intersect, Encounter, Path, Paths, Pathways, or Pathway, Weave, Crest, Colonnade, Promontory, Drift. Um, this was going into like like words that we use on the podcast all the time, like the soul of the thing, soul, pure, truth, center, constant, void, and then like the Greek word for the indescribable element that made up the universe, uh, aether, A-E-T-H-E-R, Aether. Yeah. No, those hit me. Yeah, and it's not necessarily like these are words that we would name the space. It's just these are words that were of all the words that were presented to me, the ones that made me go, that's interesting, but not necessarily that's interesting. Let's use that as the name. It's like there's something there that's interesting. What about like a room from purgatory? A room from purgatory? Yeah. Like, like that's the name of it. Yeah. Room from Purgatory. Maybe.
SPEAKER_01:Room. I like the room. I just like the idea of room.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, I had that as well. Um, the thought of that a lot.
SPEAKER_01:Um Purgatory is a very cliche kind of idea, though. Yeah, it's like um it's so is fly, like flyover. Not not 100%. I'm just like, these ideas are very like just uh there's they're too familiar, there's too many associations. Exactly. You're gonna shoot yourself in the foot before you even get off the ground. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:And many of the examples it gave me, the words it gave me, were like eye rollers, you know, like why are you even suggesting this? I need something that's more, but then but then it would go like way too out there, like, oh, how about the Greek word kairos for time and this and that? I'm like, nobody nobody knows, like that's so pretentious and full of shit. Dictionary scare sorrows. Kairos K-A-I-R-O-S. I'm like, no, nobody's it's like that's so toity toy and bullshit. But that's what that's kind of the thing with Josh calling the shop lost. I'm just like, God, it's just like you're gonna hate it. Oh yeah, what?
SPEAKER_01:Do you want me to this is all right. Key frame. A moment that felt innocuous at the time, but ended up marking a diversion into a strange new era of your life. A chance meeting you'd think back on for years, a harmless comment that sparked an ongoing feud and idle musing that would come to define your entire career, a monumental shift secretly buried among the tiny imperceptible differences between the ordinary day, one ordinary day and the next. It's interesting. So the the word keyframe is the Yeah. I just think of keyframes, and so do you, because you're you're like final cut coded in here. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:I don't know. That's interesting. Keyframe.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:But yeah, it's like I want it to be a word like that that's not obviously on the nose, it's not epic. Yeah, it's not um, it's sort of subtle and poetic, and you have to think about it for a minute.
SPEAKER_01:Fitzcaraldo.
SPEAKER_02:But and that's why I love like um, you know, part of um you think about naming things, and there's like two sets of names that blow me away that they even exist and work so well. And one of them is Star Wars, like all the names in Star Wars, like Lando Calrycian and the Great Pit of Carcoon, and all the shit he came up with, and I'm like Star Wars. I'm like, how the fuck did he name 10,000 things and like every name is perfect?
SPEAKER_01:Like then then just the idea of like he settled on the on Star Wars, yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Like if you would have gone like this, the intergalactic or he had some crazy names like you know, he you know, he had like something this the Tales of Anakin's Star Killer from the Journal of the Wills was the original title, like Jesus Christ. Yeah, yeah. But then the other set of names are most of the cities and states in our country. Chicago, Seattle, Colorado. I'm like, how do you get more perfect names than that? You know, like they're just This is cool.
SPEAKER_01:Fool's Guilt. Fool's Guilt. Yeah. A pulse of shame you feel even though you've done nothing wrong.
SPEAKER_02:Huh. Yeah. I don't know. And like some of the places you could go to with naming a place, like you could go to like, oh, what's all the parts of a camera? What are like the things that you can do? Yeah, I don't want to do I don't want to do that.
SPEAKER_01:I'm not suggesting that, but like that's sort of the well, because then you're also limiting it to just like I I don't want to limit it to just photography. Right. Because it just who knows. Yeah. Who knows? Exactly.
SPEAKER_02:You want it to be very open to whatever. And you want it to not, you know, uh yeah, and that's the thing. There's a there's a lot of ingredients. Um and not to not make it sound like it's compli there there are several ingredients, you know, it's a it's a three-four ingredient dish here, but but the name has to like touch on all of them. It it again, it's it's you'll know it when you hear it, and with how we are and how we probably will be with Josh and even Obed to a certain extent, I would not be surprised if like whatever comes up and you know Obed could randomly throw out a word and we're like, What did you just say? Yeah, oh shit, yeah, yeah, that's it. You know, like that and this is the other thing about the process of ideation. Like, part of me goes, This is happening because we waited for it to happen. Yeah. Versus like forced this idea that we wanted to make something like this and we did it before we were ready, we did it before it was ready, we did it before we knew what it was and what it should be. I don't know, there's something about like it coming out of nowhere and all of the aspects of it from the low-key nature of it to you and I just sort of being in a certain headspace in where we are with what we're doing, just kind of coalesced.
SPEAKER_01:That's the word coalesce. Pretty sure that's actually a gallery name already in Omaha. Yeah. Is it actually not uh who knows? Coalesc. I like like the passageway gallery because it's literally just in that building. Yeah. I do like very simple things, but I like something again, like uh just you know, again, getting back to that frame idea. I like something that is pretty, you know, it's durable, it's pretty fresh when you get it, but it can take it it can wear into itself over time.
SPEAKER_02:Yep. I think that you know obviously we can we can continue to ideate um here you know any time, any chance you can or just write down words or phrases that are interesting to you in regards to this. Just write them all down, like take notes on them any chance you can.
SPEAKER_01:We want to get a painted door, is what I think we're we're we're thinking about. So yeah, we're trying to find something that's like pleasant to look at. Obviously, not too Yeah. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Huh. And you know, it I yeah, it'd be interesting if there was like if there was a way to feed the transcript of all of these podcasts and have it have it like come up with what not like the words that we say the most, but just like what are the most interesting words or phrases we've said in our conversations? You know, we've obviously talked about stuff like ontology and we've talked about um you know public relations, we've talked about just our own uh my own, you know, struggles and issues with everything. And again, most of that is to just like get the get the get ideas kind of flowing and just literally brainstorming words and phrases that are just interesting. Like don't judge them, don't throw them out, but don't also say, Yeah, that's it. Like when you said room, I'm like, that's interesting. Yeah, it's interesting enough to put it on a piece of paper and hold it.
SPEAKER_01:Because it is a room, and I'm like, oh. I uh I don't know. I was talking to somebody the other day and they mentioned like uh what's the in um Radio City? Rainbow Room? Rainbow Room, yeah. Rainbow Room. I was like, that's cool. Well it's interesting too obviously too, it's been timeless. It's proven to be timeless.
SPEAKER_02:There's something interesting about if Josh sets it up with some of his furnishings, you know, like not that we're like setting up rooms within the room, but there's like a little bit of a room vibe, like, and there will be because he's gonna have like a lamp and a table and a chair, and it'll like, oh, it's kind of like a little room over here.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. But then like it's like the favorite room in the house, or like this is like the studio. Yeah. That just that head space of like I just like how rooms even like anything, just rooms get this identity or this um status that they adopt over time. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Like I mean, yeah, just think about like studios where amazing records have been recorded, or there's lots of there's lots of examples, but it's like, oh this is something that kind of transcends the well and it's you know, and it's it has other meanings as well that are interesting, you know, like space, like give them room, like give, you know, give them, you know, there there's there's there's some nuance to it that's interesting as well.
SPEAKER_04:But you can't go to the room because then you have that movie. Yeah. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:And then you're getting into kidnapping vibes. Yeah. Yeah, room is interesting. There's something about that that is interesting.
SPEAKER_01:Hmm. What did you what did you end up? Did you come up with a like a name for your studio? At home? Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Just no. No. I I like I call it the back studio, I call it back studio. Because it's the one in the back. Yeah. Um yeah, and like just to name it on like the home app, just so like if I wanted Siri to turn lights on and stuff, I can have a name to call it Back Studio. Back room. The back room. The back the dark room. I kept talking to uh to it last night about Thank you. Like, give me all like every word or phrase you can think of that just like touches on this idea of this impossible intersection. You got a watch battery got watch going on? What is that? Like uh the Russian uh writer in Seinfeld. What is that the beeping? I guess it was the pocket organizer from no idea what that is, to be honest with you. Interesting. Just a tracking device. Well, or it's a timer for a bomb incendiary device.
SPEAKER_01:Well, if this podcast doesn't go live, then this is definitely the most interesting episode we've done. Oh great.
SPEAKER_02:You guys trying to think up words. 17 minutes or uh uh I was just trying to have have it come up with words that just like this idea of how how impossible it is for someone taking photographs to intersect with someone who does something really uh interesting or profound or something very subtle, but it's you know, just has all this weight to it. Um and I was I was getting into the weeds. I'm like, are there can you like are there are there poems that are about that idea? Not specifically with a photographer, but just like intersection and destiny and the improbability of it all, and like just start shooting me words and phrases from all from all that stuff. It was like I can't show you the text of the poem because of copyrighted stuff. I'm like, well, just tell me your favorite words and phrases from those from that stuff. And again, you sort of like felt like, well, I'm I'm I'm farther, farther along than when I started, but I'm not that you know, this was worth doing, but I I really didn't get too far uh along with where I wanted to go. But yeah, you're just hoping to hear that word and you're just like, yep, that's it. For me, that's it. I'm gonna present that to Alex and the crew, and like obviously if they don't like it, no worries, but like that's that was the one for me.
SPEAKER_01:It might just be one of those things where we just need to go live for yeah 30 days.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, and there's no rush to name it. It's like we gotta like, well, we gotta buy the domain and we gotta you know set up our email addresses and like uh you know none of that. None of that, yeah.
SPEAKER_01:I do think it we need to let me out, Alex. Get like a mailing list or something. But yeah, that's what that B bing was.
SPEAKER_03:That's what that pound thing was. Oh there's a room in that cabinet. I uh where's Audrey?
SPEAKER_01:I do think that like a mailing list is the one thing because we talked about like doing an Instagram, and I was like, I don't want to do an Instagram. No, and maybe it's worth doing like I don't know. Who knows? Not my vibe though. I think a mailing a mailing list would be great though.
SPEAKER_02:Something, yes. Some some place, some digital place to to connect people or get them access to stuff. But yeah, I don't know that we need to go so far as create an Instagram. That's that's too much work.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, I don't even mean like the act of creating it, but like, oh well, are you gonna post to a story or we're gonna post like maybe it's maybe it's like a Google number in a mailing list and it's like, yeah, we'll text you or email you whenever we're having an event. Yeah, something. And it's like there's no there's no obligation attached. If you want to come, come. Like if you're interested in reading what we're talking about, check it out. Yeah whatever. Doesn't really matter.
SPEAKER_02:Or like we stick a piece of paper to the door and that lets you know that when the next event is, and you gotta actually just come down there and check it out. Yeah. Like we'll put a piece of paper up that says the date and time of the next event. Some people would kill us for that.
SPEAKER_01:They'd be like, we gotta go somewhere.
SPEAKER_02:Go over here and um like if it was a thing though, like then somebody would be like, Oh, I'll you know, post a picture to my stories or whatever, and you can check it out. I wrote something about similar to that.
SPEAKER_01:Um like putting all this effort into finding it and watch, it's gonna be complaining. Yep. Dud. Blue.
SPEAKER_02:That's what you wanted to tell me.
SPEAKER_01:I don't even know if it's here. Oh, yeah, I had this idea of like no phones in the space. Yeah. I don't know if that's reasonable. Yeah, I don't know how you would um do that. I mean, obviously you're like sharing information or whatever, but something like a note on the door, even if it'd be really cool if it was hand painted into the door. Like, hey, this is a space for ideas, connection, and like experience. Like please keep your phone. Yeah. You just set the expectation up front. Yeah. I don't know. Might be a dumb idea, but Well, you know the
SPEAKER_02:The the flip side of that, and I'm not saying this is it this is it, but like is there a way box next to the door or something? Yeah. But sorry. Is there a way to create an experience that makes people forget about their phones? Yeah. And that doesn't mean like, okay, we gotta have a punch bowl and we gotta have a DJ and we gotta have limbo contests, you know, but uh you know, like, you know, I g like my one of my desired outcomes from an an event there or an experience there would be people going, I I didn't oh shit, I haven't been on my phone for two hours. You know, like they just it just didn't occur to them.
SPEAKER_04:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Um yeah, I don't know. I I I I feel like if you if you if you start putting like a structure on how they're gonna experience it, it like affects it. Yeah. So like to me, the sort of like come in and make this what you want of it.
SPEAKER_01:I like the idea of like giving permission though. Yeah, you don't need to be on your Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:I also just kind of go, I'm just gonna lead by example.
SPEAKER_01:I'm just gonna not I guess the reason I say that is I just rem I've talked about this before, but like the hip-hop scene in like Tennessee. Yeah. And in like 2014 to 2018. I just, and this was a decade ago at this point. Yeah. I just remember going to these events and they're super cool, hyper creative, and there's like light displays and just people doing really cool stuff, custom merge, yeah, streetwear, you know, there's obviously music, um, people drinking, people having a good time, like not in a but not in like a rowdy way, like a very just creative space. And you'd see this. Yeah. Or taking pictures to prove that you're there, right? Because it's it becomes a social currency. Right. And I'm just like, I don't want that. Yeah. I mean, but then again, like I understand the appeal or the the benefit of social currency to an extent. Like, look where I am, and then other people show up and it becomes a bigger thing than it is. So you need that to an extent. Yeah. Just as operating.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. I mean, whenever I go to the a priori events, I I kinda I have had a few times where I'm like, well, nobody's really on their phones. Like, they'll use and be like, well, what's your Instagram so we can connect, or we what's your number? You know, like they'll use it as a tool, occasionally take a photo, but I don't know. I I I I felt very good about those events where everybody seemed present and um and not in their phone. Obviously, people, you know, I I don't recall seeing anybody just sort of like off on their phone. Yeah. I don't know. Uh my gut instinct would be would be to just keep it open and as as little sort of like communication of of how to do the experience as possible and just see what happens. Yeah. Um and again, lead by example. You know, if I'm there, I'm not off in the corner because I'm feeling introverted and you know, staring at my phone.
SPEAKER_01:We could call it like here now.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Be here now.
SPEAKER_02:The bad example is present, you know.
SPEAKER_01:Like just be here. Be. We'll call it be. We can't do the one word name, I don't think, because we've got workshop, which I guess is technically two words, but yeah, it's it's I think branded as one, but one. Yeah. And then you've got lost. Right. We gotta break the trend.
SPEAKER_02:No, yeah. I mean, to me, I say, I say whenever the word or phrase comes up and we know it's it, uh, you know, like I'm not gonna, I don't want to let well, it's only one word, but I'm like, that feels like the right, the right word. But I hear you. Yeah. And what's funny is I was the opposite. My thought was, well, they're all one-word names. We should really move toward just keeping keeping the rhythm of it by having a one-word name.
SPEAKER_01:What is it? Joe's is it just Joe's Joe's collectibles, yeah.
SPEAKER_03:We should call it something like that. Matt now. Rick's pictures. Picture gallery. Yeah. Right. Yeah. Pick pictures. Picture pictures. Just picture picture room. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:That made me think of like uh the the music room to sell more pianos and to have people justified to have pianos in their homes. Doing the music, yeah. They designed homes to have a music room.
SPEAKER_01:It'd be funny if we named it the music room, because this podcast is already named Studio Sessions. Yeah. And whenever I tell anybody, they're like, you know, there's like studio sessions is like a a very common like musical. Yes, yeah. Have some studios. I'm like, yeah, I I I'm very aware of that. Great. It's yeah, I'm just like, this is what we did, and it was the right thing.
SPEAKER_04:And yeah.
SPEAKER_01:We ran with it. So yeah, the music room would be funny. Right. Yes.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, I don't know. It will it will surface.
SPEAKER_01:Amazing. So do we want to talk about maybe we shelve the name and we just talk about the concept a little bit? Yeah. And try to nail down what we want out of this. Like, what do you see in your head? Like put yourself in that quote unquote grand opening. What does that look like for you? And we can start like melding these visions together. Like, do you want me to describe what's in the space, or do you want me to describe Yeah, like what's in the space? What's the what are the vibes like?
SPEAKER_02:I w I see it as having sort of like the being the middle ground between what you would see a traditional um photography gallery to look like, which is traditionally, in my experience, a lot of photographs on a wall in a stark space, usually white walls with a concrete or hardwood flooring, you know, that kind of thing. The occasional, maybe a bench or a uh something like here or there for people to sit on while they experience the gallery, not necessarily to view the photos, but just to have a place to sit down. Um, and there's not much else in there. Um on the flip side of it, you know, Josh's shop, which is like very tastefully packed to the gills with a lot of stuff. And even my own studio, I see something more in the middle where it almost feels like the arrangement of the furniture and a lamp and a shelf is almost like a little piece of art in itself, like a snapshot of a of a place that we've all imagined but have never actually seen, uh, or a memory of like the way our living room was when we were a kid or at our grandparents' house or something like that. And then the photos on the wall being sort of this in between where it's sort of like formally displayed like a gallery, like photo, photo, couple stack, little one, you know, like like where it feels very intentional to feel like a photo gallery, where it's sort of like a little bit of that, but then also like a little bit of these look like the stuff that's hanging on the wall in your apartment or in my house, you know, but without it like being meant almost like you're doing a photography show from like your house or but there's enough of a of a of a heightened nature to it where it feels comfortably different, where you're like you need a second to kind of know what it is and interpret it, versus feeling like you accidentally walked into someone's apartment. Like I don't know that I would want to go that far. Yeah. Um, but I also don't want it to be so stark and minimalist that it's very obvious that you're in an art exhibit. Yeah. Um and the only thing I think that that, and this is where it would be interesting with Obed's work, is how can we put it in there so that it feels like part of a very sort of minimalist approach to the shelves and the decor that you've got.
SPEAKER_01:That's the biggest thing. Like, I want to make sure we're not signaling to anything that it's a showroom, that it's a shop, a shop, right? So, like that was the only thing that was kind of ringing in my head yesterday when we're having the conversation. Yep. Was like, like I get it, you can stage a shop really well. Yep. And I I don't mean this like in a disrespectful way, but it's like I don't want this to because when you're in a shop, your mind is on commerce, it's not buying something. I'm here to buy something. So how do we like subvert that idea in a way that is like obviously he still wants to display his stuff and I'm sure he actually wants to sell his stuff. Yeah. Um, but yeah, where does it like it just feels like somebody who's really into pottery? Right. And they're collecting pottery, and they didn't want to move their pottery when two guys said, Hey, I want to rent this room and do an art exhibit. Yeah. So where's that where does that meet?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, and I wouldn't want like, you know, well, hey, these four dining room chairs, you know, I really want to move them. So like we're gonna set them in the shop in a way where this is a great essentially a bench for people to sit on if they want to sit. That's a little too, but that's a little too, I don't know, intentional or something.
SPEAKER_01:It's gotta be functional. Like it's gotta be, in my mind, it's gotta be a very fun, like there's places to sit and have conversations. Yeah, like like this space is hyper functional, right? Like the table is here to have conversations. Yeah. The chair is there to read. Yeah. Or to what the desk, that desk is to do one type of work, that desk is to do a different type of work, like that area is for like archiving. Like everything has like a very it has like a zone. Yep. And so in my mind, I'm like, I want to capture that energy. Yeah. Especially if it's gonna be more than just a gallery, like if it's gonna be a place for people to come and like not completely lean into that. Like, I don't just want to make like a hangout space, but yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Right. But yeah, something that's like this this fascinating kind of orbit of the of the three, you know, it is it's a it's a gallery, an exhibit, it's a showroom for furniture and um, you know, uh little hard goods, but it doesn't feel like any of those things. Yeah. Yeah. You know, that's there when you think about it, but it's not what you think or feel when you enter the space. Yeah. But I also want it to feel very familiar.
SPEAKER_01:Having movies playing constantly on a projector.
SPEAKER_02:And it could be it could be some.
SPEAKER_01:Slide projectors that you can pro music, obviously, I think is gonna be a big deal. Yep. Lighting, very not just like all everything's light, like very intentional lighting.
SPEAKER_02:And I think it'd be interesting to sort of like to think about it not being a gallery, it not being a showroom, it not being um uh you know, like uh like a museum exhibit of what a living room looked like in the 1960s, but like something that m blends all of those eras together, so that not only is the space sort of um loose as far as what we're we intend to for it to be as far as exhibiting art, selling things, you know, whatever, but that it's also like the time, the era aspect. It's not like okay, well, this is the stereo from the 80s. We want an old hi-fi, you know, like in the thing, because like Josh's stuff feels like the 60s, so we're just gonna go all in on that and like have people think like they're they're again walking into you know the set of I think if anything, it's yeah, it's just 2026.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, a mix of all the these holidays. Everything is relevant, everything is in play.
SPEAKER_02:And again, I think you know, when you're in the space and you're and you're putting it all together, I think between the three of us, it's sort of like my hope is that we're all open to the feedback, we're open to the to the input, and that we all to varying degrees kind of know what what it should be, and we're all gonna help each other to kind of realize the best version of what it is. Yeah. And that's not to say that there might not be like a a little battle that has to happen, you know.
SPEAKER_01:Um I think as long as we keep it though, where it's just the in a way, like the best idea rises to the top. Right. I'm not saying that one person's gonna have the best idea, but it's like just keep it in like it in an It's not a thing about your identity or your creative identity. It's just like we're all giving ideas here, and one's gonna rise to the top.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:And if we're true, like just be true to the creative process, is what I'm trying to say.
SPEAKER_02:In a long time, well, I think two is around kind of way. Something that'll be important for all of us, especially with Josh and Obed being people that we haven't we, you know, like you and I can kind of are or can get on the same page fairly quickly just because of how much how many touch points we have. But there could even be once it's official, yeah, we want to talk through our intentions with this, yeah. And not just like what kind of outcome we want or whatever, but like our approach is around this idea, yeah. And all of our decisions are gonna filter from that. Yeah. You might be thinking, just just because you we haven't talked for uh about it, you might just be thinking like, this is a place to store my stuff, and it's a place where I can offload some, like a showroom. Yeah. And while that's great, what if it is that?
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, but it's it's like everything for us is gonna filter almost through the the the It's gonna filter through one, is this what we want it to be, but also like we're I think we have a very short timeline to see if this is if there's a proof of concept here for something right that's a more accessible space. And so yeah, it's like if there's something where oh, this is really killing the uh like the ability for this space to be used as a collaboration or you know, presentation or whatever, like it's it's killing the ability for people to like sit down and have conversations, or I don't I don't know what the example would be. Then we're gonna be like, hey, we need to not do this. And then it's like through the aspect or through the the this is a shop mentality, it's gonna be like, well, what do you mean? But it's like, well, that's not what we're looking at. And I think we need to be very clear with that up front. Like, hey, we that's good for Josh and Obed too. It's like if this works and we're not just like, oh, that was fun in a couple of months, and we it's not gonna be a thing any longer. I think that's good for them. So yeah, I don't know.
SPEAKER_02:I think you know, fortunately too, that you know, the the stakes for Obed are probably a little bit higher, but for Josh, they're relatively low where he wouldn't um, you know, he's sort of like just happy that that the financial aspect is off his plate. And I think for him, even though I think he'll end up getting inspired and really want to contribute to what it is once he kind of catches the vision of what we're thinking, um, even Obed to a certain extent. Um, I think because you know, the three of us would be paying for the space, Josh would, you know, to kind of take, yeah, like kind of be like, look, I can do my vision over here.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Like, I want to help support you guys. If I have a strong idea, I think he would voice it.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Especially if he really knew what we were going for. Because Josh just like kind of he's really good at like knowing when a and I don't want to say like vibe, like the energy of a thing that is already happening. Like he knows like how to foster that. He like knows what the ingredients need to be and how to kind of put them together. And you know, he and he has enough uh of a lack of ego that when something he tries, maybe because of a commercial force, like I'm gonna cram all these clothes on one big old rack in the middle of the thing.
SPEAKER_01:The new shop is much improved. Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_02:And it's gonna get even better because those circular half circle racks are gonna get condensed down to a single rack along the wall, so it'll be even more open in that center area. But um he he will, you know, he'll he'll shed that as a as a choice because he knows that it's it's not working or there's a better way to do it, which is which is great. Yeah. Some people are just like, well, this is what I decided, and even though I have a feeling like it's committed to it, I'm digging in. Yeah, yeah. So to go back to what started all this, that is what I feel the space should be. And I I want people to feel like they don't have to tiptoe around and they're not allowed to sit down, like like it's like what are the rules? Like, I want to just like them to immediately feel like they could plunk down on a Davenport and stare at the TV and vibe out to whatever movies are playing or whatever video clips are playing or whatever. Um, you know, I I do want to be careful that it's like not too unfamiliar. Like if I had a uh any pushback on a projector, it's like most people don't have a projector in their home. Is there like an old CRT TV on a cart that's more interesting?
SPEAKER_01:That's the thing about like most people not having a projector. But when you're at Page Turner's and they've got the projector going, you're like, and I haven't experienced that.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. And we have the projector in Josh's shop, and it's definitely cool.
SPEAKER_01:It's cool. Yeah, I there's something about the physical quality of like light being thrown. Yeah, and I think it's interesting.
SPEAKER_02:It's not me saying like that's a hard class for me.
SPEAKER_01:Plus, the uh the other the upside to a projector is the ability to like you could do a presentation on it, or you could like there's just a lot you could do live shares, it just opens the the space for a lot more.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Um, but yeah, absolutely. I think like that's where that's why my mind goes to that. The lighting's already crazy in there, like yeah, it's just gonna be figuring out what that looks like. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:And I think those are the conversations that you have. You say you throw out this kind of well, what if the projector just sort of feels unfamiliar, you know, and then like the other person goes, Well, have you thought about this, this, and this? And then it's sort of like, oh yeah, I I see what you mean. Yeah, my little little flare-up of a concern is wiped away because I I now I get what you're saying.
SPEAKER_01:I I just yeah, like it's I think of the I always think of this fucking uh have you seen singles? Yeah, it's been a long time. Yeah, he's talking about the super train, yeah, and he's like, it's got this crazy urban planning idea, and he's just like, Yeah, we're gonna invest millions of dollars into this train. He's like, Yeah, what's the idea? He's like, We're gonna have good coffee, we're gonna have good music, people will park their cars, people will ride. And it's like that's kind of the vibe here. It's like we're gonna have good coffee, we're gonna have good music. That's right. People will ride. Yeah, that's that's the that's the hype.
SPEAKER_02:Maybe they don't, but I don't know, man. I mean, I I I I think there could be something there. I think I I you know part of it too is like do we have enough time for it to become that? You know? Like, is there enough time? How often are we gonna have to be down there having it open? Because if you know, if you think about two months of it being live and you do just like one night a week, I mean, it's you get eight shots at it and you're done.
SPEAKER_01:And maybe there is something where like once the space becomes I don't know. We'll have to we'll have to figure it out. But you need to answer the question for you then. I answer the question. What do I see it as? Man, I mean I I kind of already have I I just want it to be like it's the place. It's the place where people come. Like it's it's the it is the cornerstone of the you know, street photography, um art photography, but not in like a not in like a doing it, I don't know, just like you watch walkie-talkies and there's like all of these people that are shooting in New York. And yeah, I mean it's that. Yep. It's that. It's that, yeah.
SPEAKER_02:You know, it's just and it's all those people, it's that and it's the Christmas party for all those people who are on the walkie-talkies, and they're all just like they all get together in the room.
SPEAKER_01:And it's but it's constant, and it's like a place for the people for pe those people to go and hang out and see other people's work and talk to people. It's like studio, like what studio uh what was uh Studio 54? No, what was Warwall Studio?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, I forget what he called them. Um but I know what you mean. Yeah, it was a scene, it was it was the place that everybody got to get.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, like Stephen Shore's hanging out there and Warhol's there, and any like McJagger's there, and like everybody is just there sharing ideas. Like, yep. I mean, you've got so many people who are iconic American artists who were just yeah, oh yeah, I'd go and hang out there. Or like you watch these old nestat videos in that space, yeah. And it's like you and uh if you watch the Nestat bros, it's like yeah, Van Nystat. Oh yeah, Greta Gerwig's helping like yeah polish that leather couch, or like, oh yeah, the guy cutting that wood in his underwear, that's Josh Safty. Or like, yeah, you know what I'm saying? It's like that. Yes, I want that.
SPEAKER_02:And I think the advantage of that when everybody's sort of like a part of that action, that scene, that place is there's a feeding off of that that leads to, I feel like more work getting made. Like not only because there's a place to talk about it, there's a place to show it. There's a place to be envious, there's a place to be, yeah. And I mean that in the best, you know, there's a place to be to be sort of challenged to do more, do better, um, make more work.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. And it's right here in Omaha. It's not, oh, I have to go to New York, I have to go to LA. It's like everybody's working with the same source material. Like go out and work. Yep. And you know, this is I don't know. That's what gets me bumped. That's that's what I see. I I really like the execution, I just want it to be functional. Right. I just want it to function for that purpose and whatever it becomes, it becomes. But yeah. That's kind of the the one thing that I have in mind. It's like I want it, I want that. I want I want a scene. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:And yeah, and if people have like um, I don't know, if they've made some zines and they have copies of it, like I want them to bring their work down there and have it accessible um for people to check out. Yep. And like, I don't know, if they if like somebody was like, hey, I've got a slide projector and a bunch of slides of my work. I've never had a place to put it. Can I, you know, at the next thing, can I grab some wall space and just like have my slides run through?
SPEAKER_01:And I I want it to be I want it to be, you know, I don't want it to just be how do I say this? Like this is gonna sound crappy, but um you think of like like I don't just want it to be like, oh, I've I have a bunch of pictures and I want a place to say it so I can take an Instagram photo of me being in a gallery. Right. Like I don't want it to be, I want like to be in the space, you have to take the work seriously. Yeah, like you can't just be like, oh, this is the very first thing I've shot, and I don't really think about this that much, but I post these on Instagram. Right. And this sound like I so I I sound really this sounds shitty, and uh, you know, it's this is gatekeeping. Yeah, I don't that's not what I'm trying, but do you understand what I'm saying? Like I want it to be curated to the point where it's there's an expectation on the artist side to where we're all pushing each other to create better stuff and interesting stuff, and then there's also there's also a trust. If you're a radio station and you play the same like shitty songs, like so many galleries in Omaha that just put up mediocre work, and I mean that in a way where it's I don't mean mediocre work, like I mean, just listen to any episode of this podcast. I'm not trying to be critical, I just mean work that doesn't have any kind of perspective, any kind of respect for what came before it, any kind of like personal vision.
SPEAKER_02:It's just somebody saying something with the work, yeah.
SPEAKER_01:And so I want to be really careful to not do that, yeah. And to build a level of trust with the audience and with the the work with the the artists who are submitting things, but I also don't want to be like oh I did it, you know, that's not the vibe.
SPEAKER_02:I think really what you're talking about too, and like it's like I think at first first hearing you say like our galleries in Omaha that are making mediocre work. I think what and for you know, correct me if I'm wrong, this goes back to the title of the episode a few back. I think sometimes you go into a gallery and you're like, this person who is artistic and creative made an object, and that object is meant to be bought and then put as an object into another place, a home or an office or whatever, versus, and then forgive me for not having the exact wording, but a way of seeing, I think was the well said, yeah. Yeah, yeah. And that's more of the desire. And I think what you're talking about too is the participants, not people who present work, but all there's some way that the vibe and energy and the way that it's led, and the way that it feels like people are sort of like in that groove where it's like we're not here for these objects and us as self and ego and all of the stuff. It's a it's a surrender to that way of seeing, and I am here open and deceptive and ready to I don't know, yeah, break out of.
SPEAKER_01:I don't want it to be like this was the place that I bought this painting, right? Or this was like this was the place that I bought this photograph. Yeah. I want it to be this is the place where I first encountered this idea, yeah. And that it went on to inform everything. That's what I want.
SPEAKER_02:Well, and I've heard a lot of people talk about street photography. I was just watching one of Teo Crawford's videos this week about um just him like shooting with a Leica, and the video was very Leica-centric, but he had this other photographer who let him use her M6, film a 35mm M6. Well, not that there isn't, not that there's a digital M6, but um uh and she talked about, and this is a similar experience for me when she first saw a street photographer. She was like, wait, this is something you can do as art? Like, oh yeah. And I think for me, when you showed it to me, I mean, I literally I don't, I don't know. I mean, yeah, I'm sure I went to like a I think I went to like a Pulitzer Prize winning um foot photography exhibit at the Durham, and a lot of the photos are you know from photojournalists, but they're essentially shooting in a documentary style that is evocative of street photography because it's the ruins after a war, or it's you know, um it's uh a New York City street in the 60s with you know these those kids. But it's empty. It's empty. Um and it has that kind of connection to what we understand as sort of true street photography.
SPEAKER_01:So I almost think hearing you say this right now, I think we need a list. And it's just written word on the wall with all of the photographers and filmmakers who have like inspired us. Yeah. And we just add to it. Yeah. Like I like like hearing you talk about that, I'm automatically like, oh, like William Klein, or like you know, we talk about Alex Soth or just yeah, just a list. Yep. And so if somebody comes in and just takes a picture of that list and is like, okay, I'm gonna go home and Google every one of these people, yeah. That's something you take away from it. Yeah, here's an a possibility to open your mind to something.
SPEAKER_02:And it would be additionally awesome to have some, you know, some books or something there where somebody could, you know, see the connection between what's exhibited there and um and the artists and their work that I wonder if Jackson Street would partner with us. I think, you know, it's certainly possible. Especially right there. Yeah. I don't know if they would um anyway, yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, yeah. I'm just spitballing. Absolutely totally. Yep. No, I mean you you summarized what I was thinking. Well, like that's it. It's not if you're creating work to sell work or to build a brand, quote unquote, then maybe it's go to a different gallery. Right. I don't mean that in like a disrespectful way. I don't mean that in a in a snobbish or in like a but it's that's not what we're making this for. And so, you know, I want to make sure we're also very selective in what we because you build trust with an audience and with yeah. Yeah. And um, but then I also want to I don't want to be like become the bad guy, right? Quote unquote. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:And I think that's the kind of the the the the magic for me of street photography is you don't go out there and make something. And there are photographers that do incredible work by crafting something. Um, and I don't want to make it sound like street photography, there isn't craft to it, but you know, like Gregory Crudson, you know, like he stages his photographs, right? And they're fucking amazing. Yeah, you know. Um, and that is its own thing, like the level of detail, his passion, his commitment, like there's just something else going on there. When it comes to street photography, it's the the thing that gets me is it's sort of like you're this open receptor to something happening. Yeah. And you don't necessarily you make a photograph, obviously, and and the in the the making of the thing is in like the openness and the being there and paying attention and listening and seeing it develop and understanding, like read, like feeling the emotional energy, all of that stuff. Um but it's also something that just it just feels like it's something that just sort of happens inexplicably. It's like that intersection of like sort of like preparation and luck. Um and it lends itself to there not being any bullshit. Yeah. Like it's it's it's like it requires that.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, it it it is it is if you're not willing to just surrender to it, yeah, you're not gonna Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:And there's certainly opportunities to do like sort of cliche work or inauthentic work, sort of like the lost left and right. We got one more. We got one more. The the sort, you know, um the the the typical photos that you would think that you know end up in dentist offices or you know, hospitals and all that stuff, and and you know, a little kid drinking at a fountain, you know, you know, like stuff like that.
SPEAKER_01:But there's nothing wrong with that for what it is, yeah. Just it the the problem arises when it's trying to be something else. Right. Yeah. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:So there yeah, there's something special about that that I don't know.
SPEAKER_01:Momentary bliss.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:It had been a golden afternoon, and I remember having the familiar conviction that life was beginning over again with the summer.
