What Should I Do If My Kid Has A Learning Disability? With Allison Robertson.

Summary

In this conversation, Allison Robertson discusses the topic of learning disabilities and the process of identifying and supporting children with special needs in school. She explains the different categories of disabilities, such as specific learning disabilities, other health impairments, emotional disturbances, and speech and language development. Allison emphasizes the importance of early intervention and the role of parents as advocates for their children. She also highlights the shift in education towards recognizing and celebrating the uniqueness of each student, including the promotion of trades and alternative paths to success.

Takeaways

Early intervention is crucial for children with learning disabilities or special needs.
Parents should be advocates for their children and actively participate in their education.
The education system is shifting towards recognizing and celebrating the uniqueness of each student.
Trades and alternative paths to success are being promoted alongside traditional college education.
Accommodations and individualized education plans (IEPs) can help students with disabilities succeed in school.
Parent involvement and education are essential for supporting children with special needs.

Chapters

00:00 Introduction and Recording Setup
00:46 Introducing the Topic of Learning Disabilities and Special Needs
02:15 Categories of Disabilities and Common Problems
03:43 Identifying Learning Disabilities and Seeking Help
06:28 Understanding Individual Differences and Redefining Success
10:51 Changing Stigma and Perception of Special Education
11:47 Modern Approaches to Special Education
13:10 Accommodations vs Individualized Education Plans (IEPs)
15:32 The Importance of Early Intervention and Ongoing Evaluation
17:24 Transitioning to College and Advocating for Accommodations
21:40 The Future of Education and Embracing Individuality
24:35 Parental Involvement and Advocacy in Education
27:57 Conclusion and Importance of Parent Education

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Transcript

0:00

Action action. All right good now hit this red button here And I'm gonna push this one up here Now we're recording Does it keep zooming out like that? Yeah, that's like the active. It's the You like it I feel like yeah, okay stairs. of sound for phones. Okay. All right, you ready? I'm Hey everybody, my name is Danny Dimas and this is the Earn Your Title podcast. I'm here in studio with one of my favorite guests. I'm gonna let her tell you what she does, how she does it before I do that. She is special because she's my sister and should be a good one. So Allison, we're talking about, we've been talking about school, going back to school. And specifically today we're talking about when your kids have problems learning and the different learning disabilities and the difference between maybe a disability and just needing a little bit of help and. That's what you do on a daily basis. So tell us what you do and then we'll start talking about the problems we might experience. All right. So I work at, I work for a company that contracts to charter schools and parochial schools. And I, my official title is psychology assistant. And I work with a school psychologist and I help identify kids who have needs, disabilities, have special needs, maybe kids that are struggling in school and need special education. So I help do that identification process and reevaluation process, as well as counsel kids that are just struggling in school. What would you say is like the number one or the top three things that when someone comes into your office, what is the problem they're having? And then what is the diagnosis? Or usually if you could pick top three or five, whatever it is, what is the, you know, a teacher or a parent says, my kid can't do this. And then you say, it's because of this. What are those things? So in So with special education, so if you're a kid struggling in school, there's 13 categories that you would look at and say, all right, a kid is struggling, do we suspect that there's a disability and would that disability fit within one of these 13 categories? The main top six or seven would be a specific learning disability. So that's kids who struggle in like maybe a specific learning component. So reading like dyslexia or math. writing, something like that. There's also what we call other health impairment. So those are kiddos that maybe have attention problems, ADHD, ADD. There's also one called emotional disturbance. And those are kids that are just really struggling emotionally and have difficulty maintaining their frustrations and emotions in the classroom. There's also speech and language development. So that would be kids who need a speech and language pathologist and they're struggling with their speech or language. And that would probably, and then intellectual disability, and these are kids who maybe have a lower IQ and just kind of struggling in adaptive senses and need help overall in all areas of their learning and education. So as a parent, I just went through this. My son, who I consider very intelligent, was struggling in school. know, when he was younger, it was a focus thing, and you know, we watched him progress and he was doing okay, but it was hard for him. And so we decided we're gonna go get some testing done. went to a therapist, which I thought was really good. They just said, yeah, I think testing would be appropriate. And we found out he has dysgraphia, which was just his ability to hear something and then write it down with his hands. And which is interesting because he could say, he could hear something and like Levi, just tell me a summary, like say it. And he was, he's great. He could tell a great story. You want to recap a movie? He's great, but he can't take that and write it down. What is the parent, what is, as a parent, what do we need to be looking out for? And then how do we start that process of going to get our kids some help? Yeah, so a couple things to know is every kid develops differently. And what most people don't really recognize is intelligence really levels out at about third grade. So that means we'll get parents in kindergarten and they'll have a kid who is struggling and they're like, my, you know, my five year old is not learning his numbers and he's really struggling in the classroom. And typically on that case, we would say, all right, well, let's give him some interventions. Let's give him a little bit of extra help. But at that point, he's five. Yeah. And they can develop in other ways. So, or you could have a kid that is like killing it in kindergarten. My kid's a genius, let's put him in gifted classes. And the reality is, is he's five. So let's wait, typically we'll wait to do any kind of evaluation until about second grade. And as long as we see a pattern through that, because kids, we always say a summer can do a lot for a kid. We see kids develop their emotions, they develop and every kid develops at different times. So one thing I would do is, I would look at your kid and say, all right, maybe they're just five and maybe they're a little bit more immature. Their birthday matters. If you have a kid who has a summer birthday and they're struggling in school, they probably could have gone either way. Maybe they're just, maybe they're the youngest in their class or maybe they're the oldest in their class. So that matters. But if you have a, let's say a second grader or a third grader and you see a pattern of difficulty, really you would at that point go to the school and say, I see that my kid is struggling and I would like some help with this. And you become the advocate for your kid. The truth of the matter is, is by third grade, second and third grade, hopefully the school has come to you and said, we have noticed that your kid is struggling in these areas. And hopefully there's some kind of intervention program that has started for your kid. And I think it's important, know, when you're, when you see your kid struggling and as a parent, you don't want to take that out like, what did I do to my kid? Or like, this is my fault because he's struggling. But I think it's important. And I think we're in a society now where people realize that it's okay if your kid is not like an amazing academic student. Like I know, like when I was younger, I think this was a do -miss thing. I struggled with spelling. Did you struggle with To the point where like, if I knew I had a spelling test, it was tears at home studying. I just can't hear a word. Teacher says a word, I have to write it on a paper. Maybe I have dysgraphia when it comes to spelling. And Levi, my son, was the same way. He just struggled, can't spell. And at some point, me and Andrea would sit down and Levi, listen, you only need to get through this. You have to try your best. You don't have to be an ace dude when comes to spelling. And I'm like, and don't tell anybody this, but when you get old enough, the computer's gonna spell for you. You just gotta get close. And I think we've created a society where there's some things that truly aren't a fundamental skill that we have to have. And my grandparents, they had to spell. because they're typing it on a typewriter with no help or they're handwriting it. And if you misspelled, you were seen as being ignorant or lacking education. Well now, I've got some people in pretty high levels, even with spell check, they'll send out emails, I'm like, my, did a three -year -old write this? But it's not as important. So I think you can kind of take some of the pressure away as a parent to say, I failed because my kid can't do this. There's a world where they can be successful without that skill. So can you speak to like, what maybe like, if your kid has a problem here, maybe he's a superpower somewhere else, like the balancing of that, maybe he's just not gonna be good at math and that's okay. Yeah, for sure. And I think the reality is not every kid is an A student and that's okay. Like I think we, like A has become the average and it's not. Like C's get degrees. And I'm not saying that kids shouldn't try their best, but I do think, and I see this a lot in this school, we'll have families who they have... four kids in the family, three are just doing awesome in school, and then they have the one kid who's getting B minuses, C pluses, and they want their kid evaluated because they think their kid needs special education. And we come to them and say, no, your kid just is not as good in these academic areas as maybe your first born was, or maybe the baby of the family was. And that's okay. So I do think setting realistic expectations around education is important. And also, When we look at kids, especially if the suspected disability is specific learning disability, we look at a pattern of strengths and weaknesses. you know, some people are really good at math. Some people are really good at English. And it's just a matter of, you know, they're going to excel in some areas and there's going to be deficits in others. And what we can do in the education system is help where those deficits are. I have twins and they were born exactly the same time they've been raised the same way. Finley, my girl, she is really good in math. She just has a math brain. She thinks in math terms. She does really good in math. Whereas my boy Eli, he's really good with language and he can read better than Finley can, but Finley does better in math. So if I compare the two, they're both doing well in school. One has a strength. in one area and a weakness in the other and the others vice versa. I can't look at that and say I did better for Finley or did better for Eli. They're just individual kids. And they're going to be different people. Exactly. Yeah. Okay. It is okay if your kid gets Cs in high school. He can go be successful. And even in like, you know, it used to be like going to college was the standard for success. Well, I think we realize it's not. Like a bunch of us in our generation have huge student loans for degrees that we're not using. And I think we can encourage our kids, hey, if you are not college material, that is okay, because there's a lot of other ways to make that successful life with not being good at math. And technology is changing that a lot too. I would encourage Levi, like buddy, your ability to talk to somebody is probably a better, more marketable skill than someone's ability to write a report. Because, know, chat GPT is going to be writing a report. So that's just, that's the truth right now. You still have to be able to process ideas and these things, but ultimately education is going to be different for way we see it. But I think when you think of special education, there's a stigma and it goes back to the way our special education was and what that meant for, you if you were put as a special ed student, what that meant from a social standpoint was pretty devastating. can you speak to now? Like what does it look like in today's high school, elementary? What does that look like? Yeah. And we do, we do see this. We'll have a meeting with a parent. say, all right, your kid is struggling. We're wanting to evaluate them to see if there's a disability to be put in special education, get an IEP or individual education plan. And they'll push back like, no, I don't want that. I was in special education and I was thrown in some classroom in the basement of the school with four other kids, two of them couldn't speak. And, you know, I felt like I didn't get a good education. I didn't get to have recess with my friends. And we have to tell them like, that's not how it is anymore. Really what special education looks like right now is maybe you're in the classroom and the teacher's teaching English and you have an intervention specialist who is like the special ed teacher. They come into the classroom alongside that student during that lesson and they may modify that curriculum a little bit, explain that a little bit, help them out with that assignment or during that English time they'll pull that kid out of the classroom and spend 20, 30 35 minutes with that student and maybe even in a small group. They'll have a couple of kids there and they'll modify that curriculum just to make sure that we're closing the gap where that is. But then it is very rare. I mean, it still happens some depending on the severity of a disability. But for the most part, your kid is going to look like every other kid in the classroom. And to be honest, as someone who pulls kids for certain things. kids want to leave the classroom and a lot of times I'll walk into a classroom and they'll say, Mrs. Robertson, you come get me today? No, this is not your turn, let me drive somebody else. So the stigma is definitely different and you can be encouraged that your kid will remain in the general education population. For better force. For better force, exactly, yeah. Can you speak the difference between like an IEP and accommodations and what that looks like? Yeah, so there's a couple of routes you can go. Some of you have heard the term 504 and that's an accommodation plan. So a lot of kids that we see don't need special education, they don't need modified curriculum, they just need accommodations. And a lot of kids who have attention problems will get put on what we call a 504 plan and that basically allows for accommodations. Those accommodations would be preferential seating, they get to sit in the front as opposed to the back, frequent breaks. Maybe they get a reduced workload. So every kid in the class has to do 10 problems, but this kid only has to do five because it takes them longer. Sometimes they remove the time restraints on these assignments. So those are your five of fours. I always like to tell the parents an accommodation plan is like, I normally wear glasses and that's an accommodation for me. I don't need the world to change. I just need to put something on to help me. see the world like everyone else sees it and that's kind of what an accommodation does for kids. We just put them at an even playing field with the other kids in their classroom. So that is a 504 plan that's like that is not considered special education, but a lot of kids get put on those plans and then kids that are really struggling when we suspect that there's a disability that requires modified curriculum. At that point they would go and get an IEP and that is quite the process. It starts with you might have heard the term MTSS, which is Multi -Tiered Systems of Support, or RTI, which is Response to Intervention. They kind of get put in this program, they get these interventions and they move up the ladder. And if we don't see progress, then we say, all right, this kid does have a disability, it's affecting their education, it's affecting their learning. So we're gonna give them an individual education plan that's gonna be geared towards this kid. And we're gonna... pull them out or push into the classroom and we're gonna make sure that this kid, we can help close the gap. Do you see any negatives or positives to getting the IEP earlier than later as far as like following them in the workforce or into college? Yeah, so I would say again, I always hesitate putting a kid on a plan really early because you know, the intelligence levels at third grade. But definitely if you're seeing your kids struggling, they need help. And that process starts with those interventions. So if your kid's not getting any intervention and they're struggling in school, you have to be the advocate that goes to the school and says, my kid's struggling. But what happens is when a kid gets put on an IEP, every year that IEP gets reviewed by the intervention specialist and the team that's in the school. So every year they're updating the goals, they're tracking the progress of the goals, and then every three years, that kid is getting re -evaluated. So if they get evaluated and identified in grade three and third grade, then at sixth grade, they're gonna get a new evaluation, we're gonna look at updated data. If they continue to qualify, then they're gonna qualify, and then in ninth grade, they'll qualify again, or maybe they get taken off. Most of the time, kids that qualify for an IEP don't get off the IEP. And that's okay. That's not necessarily, I mean, obviously you want to meet the goals. Some kids may never meet those goals and that's okay. We don't want to pull services from kids that still need them. Again, if you said, all right, Allison, you've had your glasses long enough, let's take your glasses off. Well, that's not fair for me because I'm not going to be able to see. Some kids just need glasses for the rest of their life. And then an IEP as far as going to college, that doesn't really transfer into college, but a 504 could. So you could get accommodations in college, which could be really helpful. Speaking at the college level, I teach at the college level. It's the fire academy, but it's still a college level courses. And the students that have them, IAPs, they go in and they, from what I understand, they register that, what it was, and then we can give it to them. But this is hard. And if you have maybe a college student, they now have to advocate for themselves. And I think that's probably the big difference between college and high school. In college they have to say, this is what I have. They have to go make it official. And then we get that paperwork back saying this cadet gets, does, has unlimited time to take the test. And it really can't help. We have students that struggle and if they fail a test, we have to have like remediation. So we sit down, hey, just letting you know you failed. It's not acceptable. You're not meeting the standard. And then we'll ask in high school, did you have an IEP or some type of accommodations? They're like, yeah, I did. Do you have them here? No, I don't. Why? Like I know they don't want a lot of them don't want to have to have more time, but sometimes you just have to have more time. Like, it's, it's okay. Cause the goal is not to, the goal is to test your knowledge. That just might take you more time. And I think that we have to get away from like, what is normal? Cause I like the idea of like, you know, like neurodivergence, you know, like that there's people that there's a spectrum of the way people think. And there's some things that seem negative, like attention deficit disorder. can seem really negative. In my world, the fire service, I would say over half the guys that I work with have some form of ADHD, whether it's a disorder, maybe not, but they're hyper, they're all over. And that is a huge asset because we have a word for when you focus at an emergency, it's called tunnel vision. And it's a negative word. If we showed up and all I can think of is there's fire blowing out this window and I fail to see the electrical line that's laying on the ground, I step on it and die. So it's a benefit to be able to kind of bounce around and move your focus. So that is a superpower when it comes to firefighting where in a classroom it's detrimental. And so I think it's important that you realize that your kid is not broken because they do things differently. They're different for a reason and they're supposed to do something else. The kid that's bounced around, he's not gonna be the accountant. The accountant's gonna be the kid that focuses and is good And he would be miserable if he were an accountant. I have a third grader that last year we were talking about an evaluation and he probably has dysgraphia. He has not been diagnosed yet, but in just kind of looking at everything, he probably has dysgraphia. And I talked to the mom and she said, I just don't understand because he can work on cards with his grandpa all day long and focus and be able to do things with his hands. And yet he can't copy from a board. And I told her, said, yeah, like he could probably, if he took long enough, he could write a three page report. but that would be excruciating for him and he can do it. It would just take a really long time. And I compared it to me. I'm not a marathon runner. I could run a marathon. It would take me about a month and I would be miserable and I would be hating everyone around me. But if you force me to do it, I could run a marathon. I would hate my life after that because I'm not a marathon runner. I don't have the training. I really don't have the ability right now. Maybe I could get there. I don't I don't want to. I don't want to run a marathon. But if you forced me to do it, I could. But I really enjoy other things and there's things that I really, if you put a basketball in my hand, I could probably run a couple miles dribbling a basketball during a basketball game and be really happy about it. So I think the important part is not putting kids in this box that says, all right, you got to write this report. This third grader, he's going to end up being a very successful mechanic or he's going to work. with his hands in some way, it's just not gonna be writing reports. And that's okay. Now we want him to be a well -rounded student, so we do want him to learn writing skills. We do want him to know grammar. There's some things that we, everyone should be a well -rounded person and that's important. But in the end, he's gonna live a really awesome, happy life, because he's gonna live on a farm one day and he's gonna. work on machines and he's going to do great. I think the point of education is that everybody, figure out where they're at and then you move them up. Yeah. Some acceptable level that we determine, but everybody doesn't have to be equal. You know, you don't have to have, you know, equal number of math, science, English, you know, composition, credit. You don't need that. Yeah. You're going to, and everyone's all over. The point is that if you started here with math, you should go here. Now some people start here and go here and that is okay. Yeah. And I, it's encouraging. think that the, the Educational system has realized that because for a really long time it was standard you do this then this Where do you see education going in the future? Like where is what's the the next newest? Types of education like I know in the community that I live in we had a meeting with the the school superintendent and she asked How can my students get access to and start learning about being a firefighter? You're being a paramedic non college -based futures. Where do you see? Where do you the education as a system as a whole going with kids who think differently? Sure. I think in general, we have learned that the trades are awesome. That if we can get some kids that college is not for everybody and some kids need to learn how to be an electrician or some kids are going to do really good as a machinist or whatever. So I think we've learned to really involve the trades in the education. used to work at a school that was a credit recovery high school. So kids that were really struggling in school, they would come in, they would do their regular classes, but there was tracks that they could go through. There was a business track where they could learn about business. There was a construction track where they would get a lot of their credits through construction. Their math credits were then cutting wood and learning those skills, which was really awesome. There was a STNA track so they could get into the medical field and learn kind of maybe how to be a nurse or how to just work as an STNA, which was really neat. So I think that's what's happening. And I'm pretty sure I read an article in Michigan that they are now requiring finance. I think they're requiring a finance course in every high school. And I think they're also requiring CPR for everybody who's graduating. Which that is very cool. That makes sense. Well, in the high school that the district that I live in in Barbaden, their big thing is, and I'm going to get it wrong because I'm on the spot, but I think it's... enlist or enlisted, enrolled or employed. And every kid that graduates from Barberton High School, as they walk across the stage, they're asking that they're either enlisted in the military, that they have a place of employment so that they're working or that they're enrolled in higher education, whatever that looks like, or a trade school, which is really cool. it's used to be you graduate, you go to college, you figure out what to do with your life. Now it's you graduate and maybe you go to the military, you enlist. Or maybe you get employed and you get a good job and you start working and making some money. Or maybe you go to higher education and figure out what you're gonna do. But I do think everyone has recognized it's not cookie cutter anymore and that's okay. And that we're celebrating people's differences and the uniqueness that they have, which I'm excited about. Is there anything I didn't ask you about that you'd really like to share about the accommodation process or parents interacting with their students or what? Anything I didn't ask, Well, I would just say, we see two types of parents typically that come in this process. have parents who are in denial. They don't want their kid to be identified. Maybe they, like I said before, they were in special education, they felt like there was a stigma around that. And for those parents, I would just say, open up your mind a little bit. It's okay for your kid to need help. That's not a death sentence. We want to help them. And in general, schools want to help. So if you get called into an office and said, hey, your kid's struggling, they're not trying to demonize the kid. They want to help them. So go along with that and ask as many questions as possible. But the other thing I would say is a lot of these schools have hundreds and hundreds of students. And if you see that your kid is struggling and they're not getting help, you have to be an advocate for your kid. You have to go into the school building. and tell them my kid is struggling and if the school's not listening to you, the best thing you can do is you can write a little note that says I want my kid to be evaluated or I want my kid, I need a meeting. If it's put in writing, they are required by law to respond to that request in writing. And if you feel like the school is not listening to you, you can write that letter and remind them you have to respond to my letter. and that is something important. So we have to be an advocate for our kids. We know our kids better than anybody else. And if you want your kid to get help, make sure that you go after it. Don't let them, don't let it be eighth grade and all of a sudden say, man, I wish I would have done this or this. Start it when they're young and allow that process to take place. just, I think your job is to ensure they're getting an education, which also means you have to be educating your kids. Sure. I think sometimes people I go to work, I my kids to school, when they come back from school they should be smart educated. That's not really how it works. The parents have to be involved. Like if your kids don't understand how a credit card works when they graduate high school, you failed. want the, it would be nice if the high school did that. But you need to teach, like my, Alison's here visiting from Ohio, my nephew who is, how old is Eli? He is seven. Seven. He helped me make breakfast and he, we had to combine something. to doubling the recipe and I would ask them, here's the recipe, now double it, what is that? And they had to use math. You have to be involved as well. As dads, this is our job. Educate your kids. If their high school's not gonna give them the hands -on stuff, that's on us. We have to do that. And I think it's important that it's not a separate thing. You should be constantly educating your kids. Now when they become teenagers, they might not wanna listen to you. You have to keep doing that. But it is important that we are involved. Well, and I think even in education, we talk about like, collaborating with the parents. Like we are a team. No decision gets made without the parents and the district and the teachers and the intervention specialists coming together and making that decision. you need to be an active participant in your child's education because it's important. That's awesome. Well, this has been the Earn Your Title podcast. This is my sister Allison, and I'm so happy that you guys joined us. I can't wait to talk to you later. Have a great day. Good. Is that okay? Yeah, it's good. How long did we go? 27 minutes. What's your target?