044: Birth Before and After Finding God (with Christine Hollis)

When you’re not in relationship with the Lord, and you’re going through something as life changing as birth for the first time, things can seem pretty scary, especially if you’re navigating something as serious as postpartum psychosis, but God can and still uses these incredibly emotional situations in our lives to draw us closer to Him. Hear how God was able to work through Christine’s first birth and postpartum by calling her to Him through the darkest period of her life, and then how He was able to give her supernatural peace during her second son’s birth as she chose to trust and surrender to Him.

As mentioned in this episode: The First Forty Days (book)

Transcript

Host: 0:03

Hi, and welcome to another episode of Surrendered Birth Stories. Birth Stories, Birth Education, and the pursuit of surrendering it all to God. Let's get started. Hey everyone, hope you're having a wonderful day. I hope June is going smoothly for you. Hope summer is just off to a great start for you. I know our family has been, our kids have been playing in the little uh, I guess you call it a kiddie pool or inflatable pool that we have on our back porch pretty much every day. Um it's one of we got it from Costco, one of those like eight by ten inflatable pools, and um they just have a blast in there. And honestly, I feel like as soon as I finally take them to a public pool, they're gonna be like, we don't want to play in that pool anymore. So I'm I'm holding on to it for as long as the thrill is there. But so far, so good. I think we've more than gotten our money's worth out of it for sure. And it helps because you know, with little kids and ones who aren't great swimmers yet, it's nice to not be able to have to work or not to have to worry about you know drowning. So it's great. Hang out on the back porch, have snacks, they play in the pool. It's a great, a great time. Upcoming. I wanted to let you know, we do have our upcoming childbirth class soon. So always do one per season for due dates for the next season, so like four times a year. So we're doing one at the end of the summer for fall babies. So if you are due September, October, November, or December, we have a class at the end of the summer. So it's gonna be July 28th is the first class on a Sunday, and all the classes will be on Sunday evenings. There are five classes and it goes straight in a row. So July 28th through August 25th, every Sunday evening in there from 5 to 7:30 at Definition Church in Greensboro. So if you are local, um please come join us for that class. Send me a message, um, let me know you're interested, or share this information with someone who you think might be interested. That is our next group class. I'm super excited about it. I love, love, love teaching childbirth classes. It's probably my favorite thing to do, maybe besides dancing or baking sourdough. I don't know. I have a lot of things I love to do, but I absolutely love teaching this class. So it's the first time we've made it five classes. It used to be four, but time and time again, I just feel like there's not enough time and there's so much information, and it's we have to go a little too fast. So we're spreading it out into five classes, and hopefully that will help with the pacing, which will be good. Um, so yeah, let me know if you're interested or if someone's interested, we would love to have you join that class with you know other groups of parents who are going through the same thing that y'all are going through. Now let's get into this week's episode. When you're not in relationship with the Lord and you're going through something as life-changing as birth for the first time, things can seem pretty scary, especially if you're navigating something as serious as postpartum psychosis. But God can and still uses these incredibly emotional situations in our lives to draw us closer to Him. Hear how God was able to work through Christine's first birth in postpartum by calling her to him through the darkest period of her life, and then how he was able to give her supernatural peace during her second son's birth as she chose to trust and surrender to him. Welcome to another episode of Surrendered Birth Stories. I am your host, Kayla Heater, and I'm gonna have my guest introduce herself and tell us a little bit about her and her family and her life.

Guest: 4:14

Great. Hey, Kayla, I'm so excited to be here. Um, just really honored. And uh, we were talking a little bit prior to recording about uh just uh hoping that this message that um I'm sharing and uh I think what you're creating here is uh to you know glorify God and just open a door to the amazing, like wonderful God that we serve and um just bring people to Christ. So hopefully I do that in uh um in my story. Um so yeah, I'm Christine Hollis. Uh I was uh um born in Greensboro and currently live in Kernersville with uh my husband and two kids. I have two boys, three and a half-year-old son named Sterling and a 15-month-old named Eli. They keep me very busy. Um, very busy. They I'm definitely a full blown boy mom. I stay at home full-time with them and we are always in the mud or in the creek or playing in water or um riding our bikes. Um, we're very active family. And uh um, prior to having kids, uh, I worked at Lululemon and uh um really enjoyed my time there. And I was also a CrossFit coach at various gyms in Greensboro.

Host: 5:22

Oh, cool. That's fun. I'm a boy mom too. I have four boys, so I'm right there with you. I mean, we're in the season of baths every single night right now. There's always dirt somewhere. Dirt, sweat, mud, yeah, all the things. Well, I'm excited to hear about these stories of your two boys. So why don't you um go ahead and start by telling us about your first pregnancy? How did you find out? What was that like?

Guest: 5:53

So um my first pregnancy was in 2020. I um I think I found out late February of 2020 and uh was uh not super shocked. My husband and I had been intentional about trying to start our family for probably about a year in late February, just was feeling a little off. So I took a pregnancy test, came out positive. We were both so excited, and then as y'all know, three weeks or so later, the whole world shut down. And it was it was just like we were in the twilight zone. My husband and I kept like over the course of 2020, we're just like, what is happening right now? So many things just got flipped on their heads in our lives, um, as well as so many others um that we know. And yeah, pregnancy was my first, was uh filled with uh unknown about whether or not uh he would be allowed in the hospital. I mean, policies were changing all the time. Um just anxiety about the world in general, so much was changing. And then um through that, there was also a silver lining of it bringing us closer together because uh I was still working at Lily Lemon at the time, and uh it was such a blessing. They um provided us with uh our full income during that time. We were staying at home and then eventually we went back in the stores at a limited capacity. Yeah, just was like very restful. And uh Chris was working from home as well, and it just brought us so close. I I think that out of all the chaos of that year, that was such a silver lining for us going into such a big change for us with the birth of our first kid.

Host: 7:32

So your husband's name is Chris and your name's Christine.

Guest: 7:36

I know. I joke that we're C squared.

Host: 7:39

That's cute. My husband's name is Chris, too.

Guest: 7:42

Oh, sweet. So lots of Christmas.

Host: 7:44

That's a good one here. Yes, it is. Um, so how did that pregnancy go physically then? Was it pretty smooth or were there any, you know, issues or bumps or anything?

Guest: 7:57

So it was a pretty smooth pregnancy. I um was really active prior to um getting pregnant and uh was still able to maintain some level of fitness, although it looked different having to work out at home instead of at the gym or going on runs. It just modified a bit. Um, but eventually the CrossFit gym I was going to open back up and we were working out outside. And so I was able to do exercises, felt really energized, didn't really have any sickness. I started to experience prodromal labor pretty early, which I can I'll go into the whole birth story later. But around like 36 weeks, I started to to get some prodromal labor, maybe even earlier than that. But yeah, pregnancy was was great, and it was the same way with my second one too, just felt really like energized and um didn't have much sickness at all, which except for I guess the first trimester fatigue, but it could have been a lot worse.

Host: 8:49

Yeah. Well, that's that's such a blessing. That's wonderful. So then how did you go about choosing your care for that pregnancy? Was it something you had, you know, thought about or researched ahead of time, or was that something you kind of had to do on the spot once you were pregnant?

Guest: 9:08

Yeah, I definitely was more in the camp of um figuring out on the spot. Um, for the first pregnancy, I uh knew I wanted a doula and uh um I stayed with my OBGYN that I was with. Um so I was at a practice in Greensboro, did the rounds at all the physicians uh throughout the pregnancy. My doula actually was my high school Spanish teacher. And uh become a doula, and so it was really sweet to have her there at the birth. Uh and she knew me too, which I felt like was was really cool. Um, especially with the with COVID being so limited with like the interactions that you get with with people.

Host: 9:45

That's really cool. Yeah. So were you planning a natural birth because you had a doula, or were you just trying to have her there for any kind of support and you were just kind of gonna see what happened?

Guest: 9:57

Yeah. So I had planned for a natural birth in the sense of like unmedicated. I was thinking having a doula would be kind of like having a coach for something. If you're gonna run your first marathon or you're going to go try something brand new, like you're probably gonna want a coach for that, somebody that's more knowledgeable than you to help guide you through it. And so that's why I wanted to get a doula.

Host: 10:18

I think that's wise. I think that's very wise. Okay, so then how far along were you then when you did go into labor? What did that look like?

Guest: 10:29

Yeah, so I mentioned the prodromal labor. I had padromo labor, the Braxton Hicks uh pretty early on. And uh being the first, uh, I didn't really understand what it felt like to truly go into labor. And so I was always like, oh, this is it. This is it. I'm having those contractions. And I finally went into labor, I guess, around uh 39 weeks and six days. So I was pretty much full term at that point. Yeah, the birth just was uh was my first night and day different than my second for a lot of reasons. But with that first, uh first of all, I think I should mention that my husband and I had conversations about our faith up till that point. We grew up going to church, but I think we kind of fell away. And at some point we felt very apathetic towards towards Christ and towards uh church in general, and didn't really have a desire to um to revisit that until we were ready to start a family and we realized like uh this pulling of our heart to try to figure out like what's missing and really just like the heart of what we want to bring into our family, like what do we value? And uh, and so uh we had started to have some conversations around faith that prior to Sterling being born. So to bring it back to that birth story, I uh started to uh have some consistent contractions. And uh at that point, being 39-ish weeks, uh I was already four centimeters dilated, fully effaced. And so uh again, like thinking, whoa, like I could really go into labor at any point now. And also with like the guidance of the doctors that I was I was seeing, they were saying the same things too. And so uh I uh wait at home for a little bit and then uh start to feel anxious about not making it to the hospital in time. And uh I think there's like a control that I was still holding on to of like my time. Like uh I'm I can have control over the time of when this baby is going to be born, like not really releasing it. And so uh I get to the hospital, Ardula is like, well, just text me if they admit you, because I don't know if this is you know real labor or not. We'll just see what what they say whenever you get there. And I get there and they have a tough time finding my cervix because it's far back behind uh um baby's head because he's so down in my pelvis. And uh they're like, you're seven centimeters dilated. Well, and I'm just like talking to them like I am to you. And I'm like, really? I don't think I I don't know.

Host: 12:58

How long had you been laboring at home for?

Guest: 13:00

Not long, only for maybe like four hours.

Host: 13:03

And how close together were your contractions?

Guest: 13:06

They were only like uh, I would say probably four to five minutes. Um yeah, so I I get to the hospital, they finally find cervix and say that I'm seven centimeters dilated, and they admit me, and we get really excited. And our doula comes and she helps me continue to labor and progress it. And then at some point, um, it stalls. And so we've been there basically all night. And now I think it's morning time, and they're like, uh, we probably could break your water in order to have the baby come faster in order to progress. And uh, I was really nervous to get that and the feeling of breaking the water because the cervical exam was so painful and uh just a lot of fear about getting them to break my water and having to experience that pain again. And so uh I ended up getting an epidural, which was not part of my original plan and hope. Uh and so uh get my water broken and after the epidural, and then uh things just kind of are at a standstill and uh just slowly moving along at that point.

Host: 14:08

So, did you stall at a seven then and stay at a seven like all night long?

Guest: 14:13

Yeah, so I hadn't moved past a seven, um, I think until and it's all kind of like fuzzy because at that point I'm I'm just tired. Yeah, and uh so at some point I am able to push. Sterling's heartbeat starts getting a little funky, it's like going up and down, and my husband notices it and is asking the nurses what they think, and they're like, uh yeah, maybe we should keep an eye on that. Like during contractions, yeah, during contractions. And then uh Jessica's like, uh I can or I'm sorry, my that was my doula. She's amazing. So she's like, uh, I think I see baby's head, like, let's push. Um, or do you feel like you need to push? Because she's trying to help me tap into that like feeling of uh um like an intuitive, like, let's let your body do what it's supposed to do.

Host: 15:02

Yeah. And this was your doula, who could see the baby's head?

Guest: 15:05

Yes. And so she's helping me, guiding me through all this process too. And all along, like she's asking me, like, is this what you want to do? Like, she's still trying to keep me on track, but also being very respectful of what I want in that moment too.

Host: 15:17

So, what time of day is this now? Just so I can get it.

Guest: 15:20

I think it's at like uh 12 o'clock at PM. So I get to the hospital at 12 a.m. and then they admit me. And now it's 12 p.m.

Host: 15:28

Okay, it's like 12 hours.

Guest: 15:30

Yes.

Host: 15:31

Okay. Had anyone checked you at this point? I mean, I assume you're complete considering she could see his head.

Guest: 15:36

Yes, yeah. I think uh at that point he was starting to crown. Um, I remember them saying that the doctor was in a C-section and that I needed to like wait in order to finish pushing. And uh um uh and then I think that's hilarious when people say that.

Host: 15:54

Like, I'm sorry, your natural body is going to have to wait in this moment because this other person who we want to deliver your baby is not there.

Guest: 16:04

I know, I know, and like really, and like I'll get to this later, but like with the second pregnancy, there was just such so much more um just knowledge I had behind uh so many things, planning and then with the birth for for that second one. But yeah, so they eventually like I'm pushing and uh and then his heart rate goes down really quickly, and they end up using a vacuum. And she's like, You have one push to get him out, or else we're gonna have to go for a C-section. And so uh I like pushed with all my might and uh he comes out, and uh I just remember this feeling of uh like disassociation, like I'm just not connected to this baby that came out in that moment in the way that I thought I would be. My body feels like way out of control. Um, there's a million nurses in the room that have just like swarmed in suddenly at the last second, which like thank God they did, because uh there are a lot of things that that can happen in that moment and uh they're all there to support at that point. And so uh yeah, that's just feeling very, very confused. And for the next like three days, just feeling very confused, like postpartum in general.

Host: 17:11

Where do you think that stemmed from?

Guest: 17:13

Well, I think uh lack of sleep, one. Um, I think two, just not really trusting God. Like I didn't have that relationship with him at that point. I didn't have him to rest on. And I think uh a lot of it was also being very naive. I uh had a lot of people that would tell me because I was active prior to getting pregnant that birth would be fine. Like you're fit, you're like in shape, like you've you've got some, you know, you're able to push through workouts, like you can definitely have a natural birth. And uh I think that fitness helps you in a lot of ways through pregnancy and through birth, but I think that there's a piece of that that's not true. That just because you're in shape doesn't mean you'll get the birth that you desire. There's other pieces there.

Host: 17:56

Oh yeah, and just because you're in shape doesn't mean it's going to be easy, especially if you're you know, focusing on what you're feeling. I'll say it has a lot less to do with your physical shape than it does like where you are mentally during labor. Absolutely. So you you're feeling disconnected from him, you're not feeling that instant bond, which also, you know, birth education background, epidurals can do that too. Like block all those hormones that are released when your baby's born. Um like you're still receiving the hormones, but your brain is not interpreting the way it would if you didn't have the epidural because of it's blocking that. And so your hormones can't be used to your advantage in terms of um bonding with the baby in that moment. Not to say that if you get an epidural, you're not gonna be able to bond with your baby, not at all. Because I had an epidural my first time and I definitely um bonded with her, but I was just saying like that could be just another piece of the puzzle that seems to be, you know, multiple factors here.

Guest: 19:05

Yeah, absolutely. I could see that.

Host: 19:08

So, how did how did that affect then um the rest of your postpartum?

Guest: 19:14

So uh lack of sleep from that birth experience and then uh just continuing to not be able to sleep while I was in the hospital, um, feeling unable to control my emotions, um, feeling extremely like leapy and weak, and a lot of anxiety about not being able to walk. I think I stayed in bed probably for that whole first like day afterwards as well, and uh just felt uh extremely weak. Uh and uh um yeah, the sleep thing was was the biggest thing. I had such an anxiety about sleeping, and I don't know if it necessarily stemmed from my worry that uh if I was sleeping, that Sterling wouldn't be taken care of, or like worry about worry about that necessarily. I think I just was so filled with like cortisol and stress. And uh um and just overall anxiety from probably like the last, you know, 2020, the whole year of just anxiety kind of being an underlying feeling. And uh yeah, forgot to sleep uh basically for three days uh that bled into uh eight weeks of uh honestly hell. It was uh awful. So those first three days didn't sleep. Uh, I ended up going back to the behavioral health center and uh um from women's hospital. Okay, so let me back up. So we get discharged from women's hospital, and then uh we go home. I try to fall asleep in my bed, and uh, I tell my husband that I'm starting to have really dark thoughts. And uh I'm able to rationalize like, I'm not sleeping. I know I just had a baby, my hormones are out of control. So uh these aren't true thoughts that I would ever act on, but I'm having them. And uh I'm really nervous, I'm really worried. And so my sister-in-law, who's a paramedic, uh, and uh my other sister-in-law who's in Charlotte, they uh immediately come in uh in order to help support us so that way I can go back to women's hospital. And then uh they end up admitting me over to the behavioral health center. And at that point, I'm going on probably four days of no sleep and I'm very confused as to what is happening, why am I here feeling like a prisoner um at the behavioral health center and uh just like at a loss for words and in an extremely dark place. Uh and it was like God that pulled me through that. And uh, I just throughout the next couple of weeks, uh, I uh kept going to like a dark place. And uh I just had this visual of like a golden lasso pulling me forward. That was like the only thing whenever I was in those dark times that was moving me was this like golden lasso of hope coming from God to uh just say, like, uh, I've got you. I know this is uh scary, but I need you to rely on me. And uh, so that's like that brought me to him.

Host: 21:59

I love that. I love the visual of that, like pictures, like when God gives us images and and speaks to us through through visions like that. What when you went there three days postpartum back to the hospital, was your husband with you or were you by yourself?

Guest: 22:16

So he was with me. He drove me to the hospital and um my sister-in-law stayed with Sterling. And uh it was so funny. I was like so worried about his sleep. I was like, he hasn't gotten any sleep either. Like, go home, like I'm fine. I'll be I'm I'm here at the hospital now, like they'll take care of me, thinking they'd probably give me an ambient or something.

Host: 22:35

Yeah, to help you sleep.

Guest: 22:38

Um and so he ends up leaving, and then I stay.

Host: 22:41

So your sister-in-laws are with your baby. So then were you um doing any sort of like pumping or nursing or what was your feeding journey like?

Guest: 22:52

So uh I uh um remember the lactation consultants coming in at the hospital. Sterling was latching great. I had milk uh that was coming out. I couldn't really comprehend what they were saying about nursing and like when the milk would come in and uh all of that because of just the state I was in. And so when I'm at the behavior health center, my boobs start to feel really hard and uh I'm like extremely sweaty. And uh, I think one of the nurses was like, I think your milk is coming in. And uh, and then I was like, okay, I'll call my husband and he can bring a pump. Uh and so he ends up bringing me my pump, and uh, I'm just there pumping, not really sure how to do it or what to expect whenever the milk is coming out, how much to expect, uh, and just trying to pump as much as I can while I'm there.

Host: 23:42

Okay, so how long were you there for? And did they give you some sort of diagnosis or were you like so?

Guest: 23:49

I was there for only probably less than a day. So I got admitted, I slept there that next night, and uh all this is happening in the course of like five days from the birth to the behavioral health center. And so I'm staying, I've only I only stayed there one night because the next day um I get a little bit of sleep that night. The next day I feel a little bit better. But yeah, I go to see they're like, you should go see some of the psychiatrists that are here. And so I talk to them and I'm like, here's like my full history of everything that is like my life. Here's uh what I just went through. I got admitted because I was having like these dark thoughts, and uh, I would never act on them. Like, I don't truly want any of those things. So I just was uh fearful because of even having these thoughts. So he the psychiatrist there wanted me to stay longer, but I was like, I need to be at home with my baby. And uh my husband was he was supportive of whatever I felt like I needed, but he was encouraging me to come home too. Like, uh, I think that you need to be around us. I think that um we can find you some care here at the home so that way you can be with Sterling, you can be with your baby.

Host: 24:57

Yeah.

Guest: 24:57

And so through that encouragement, I ended up advocating for myself to leave after spending the night there for one night.

Host: 25:04

So you felt confident after that night of sleep that you knew it was the lack of sleep and the hormones. And it sounds like you were pretty level-headed about what you were thinking about. Yeah. And just to give some clarity for people out there who are listening who might be confused, it's very normal for most women to experience something called the baby blues, which is just where your hormones are going crazy. You just had a baby, they're trying to leave your system, milk's coming in, all these things are happening, and you end up having really strong emotions and getting really sad, sometimes really anxious, really angry, things like that, just temporarily, just you know, but they don't stop you from living your life, and you still really love your baby, everything's really great. But when something like that gets worse and lasts longer, like more than the first couple days or first couple weeks, and gets more intense and starts interfering with your ability to live your daily life, that's when it stems into postpartum depression or postpartum rage or postpartum anxiety, um, things that are they're just affecting you. You're not able to go about normal activities because of all of those feelings. But what you are describing with the dark thoughts, and you don't have to name those dark thoughts either. We can probably assume in our head maybe what some of those were. But when you get to that point, that's where it is a borderline postpartum psychosis, is what they call it. Yeah. And you guys did the right thing by getting help, by going and seeking help if you're having thoughts like that. Now, thankfully, you you know that it was, you know, hormones and lack of sleep affecting that. But had you not gone and gotten help, had you not gone and gotten sleep, that could have easily gotten worse very quickly. And so you did the right thing by going and getting help. And I think that's great so that it didn't turn into you know full-blown postpartum psychosis where you're having completely irrational thoughts of doing things to yourself or your baby that would be, you know, detrimental and fatal and permanent. And so for those people out there, postpartum psychosis is not anything to ever mess with. And if you feel like, even for a little bit, that you have something, that is something where you want to go seek help immediately. But it sounds like you did, and you got some sleep and you got, you know, the help that you needed and you had that level head, and then you were able to then feel good enough, both you and your husband, about coming home and kind of reuniting and starting starting to bond with Sterling.

Guest: 27:46

Yeah, absolutely. And uh um, that was my big worry was postpartum psychosis. And it was a term I hadn't heard before. My doula mentioned it because I told her what was happening. And so I had a really big fear of that because it's scary. Going to go to the behavioral health center was absolutely the right thing. As traumatic as it was, it was the right thing to do. And uh eventually I was able to get on an antidepressant. And uh my husband and I felt like we were able to have resources, thankfully, that we could uh help support to kind of bring me out of that spot. So going to therapy, going uh and getting on the antidepressant. I uh listened to uh a lot of prayer at that time too through uh the Christian hypnobirthing app. And uh um yeah, I mean, through all that, I was able to claw my way out of out of that darkness.

Host: 28:39

How long did that go on for?

Guest: 28:41

It went on for about eight weeks until things started to turn turn the corner.

Host: 28:45

Okay. I'm glad you were able to get that help that you needed. That's that's wonderful. I'm glad that you guys took advantage of the resources at your disposal because I feel like a lot of women don't realize A, that that they need help, or or B that there are resources out there to help them.

Guest: 29:04

Yeah, and I think that there's a lot of shame that's felt around it, at least I did, of uh shame and embarrassment. Like I can't believe I'm going through this. Um and uh not really wanting to speak about it because yeah, just like fear of uh of what others might think. Yeah, I think just like again, just have those feelings of like shame and embarrassment.

Host: 29:27

Yeah.

Guest: 29:27

And then like I said, the birth story for my second was so night and day different. And uh it was just uh it was very redemptive, very healing.

Host: 29:36

So then how did you and your husband go about deciding to have number two?

Guest: 29:42

Yeah, so no with number two, we were um, I was really nervous to get pregnant uh again. And uh I got pregnant again at 18 months uh with uh Eli. So Sterling was 18 months, Eli was you know conceived around like April, and we found out right after my sister got married in May. And uh yeah, I was very nervous getting pregnant with a second, nervous that something like that would happen again um throughout that year. Um, like I mentioned, with God was using that in order to bring me to him. We had started to go to church and found a great church to go to for us at that time that we were in, and ended up getting baptized and uh started uh reading scripture more and uh really understanding more about like his love for us and what it means to trust him. And uh we knew that we wanted the second at some point and uh I wanted the kid, we wanted the kids to be close. And so we just felt like it was the right time to try again and we ended up getting pregnant pretty quickly, and so uh yeah, I got pregnant with uh our second one and throughout that pregnancy, just really focused on like releasing control. And uh I uh I had like a scripture verse that I a scripture that I was using as just as like a guiding light through that pregnancy. And uh it was uh Philippians uh four verse six. And uh that was just like I said, just like a light for that pregnancy. It was like a lantern to help guide to guide us. And uh I think he was able to bring in like me two different resources uh that uh I hadn't considered before because again, just naive with that first pregnancy.

Host: 31:16

Philippians 4, 6. That's be anxious about nothing, pray about everything. Is that that verse?

Guest: 31:23

Yes, yeah. Um, yeah, I just I love that verse. It's uh I think I have it. Oh wait, um, yeah, it's do not be anxious about anything, but in every situation, by prayer and petition with thanksgiving, present your request to God, and the peace of God, which transcends all understanding, will guard your hearts and your minds in Christ Jesus. Um, yeah, so that just like really spoke to me during that pregnancy. Um, not only the part about don't be anxious about everything, but in every situation, uh, by prayer and petition, give thanksgiving. Like just thank God and have gratitude for um everything that He provides us with. And uh um so that was the overall um scripture that was guiding me through that pregnancy. And then um uh we ended up switching to another church uh that is right in our neighborhood, actually. So we get to walk to church every Sunday, which is such a blessing. And we're just it's a close-knit community. We immediately felt uh welcome as soon as we came to the first service. Uh and I love that it's a type of service where people can like raise their hand and say, Pastor, I have a prayer request. Do you think we could pray about this? Uh or like I have a question about what you just said about that scripture, about that like sermon. So uh we just felt like it was a it was a good fit for us. Uh and uh just learning so much about about God, uh um, even in this in this current season I'm in too, like there's just such a depth to his love for us and uh um his mercy and goodness. And yeah, still still figuring it all out too, and like all the theology behind it and and all that. Um so anyway, second birth, all the pregnancy again, felt fine physically, mentally, starting to feel more and more energized and excited and just like connected to to Eli. Like that was something that I did differently this time, um, among other things, but really focusing on uh putting my hands on my belly and imagining him, imagining me holding him, thanking God for him, and uh really trying to connect to him as like a baby and not just this thing that's kicking me.

Host: 33:29

Right. How do you feel like your new faith played into planning your second birth? Did do you feel like that affected your your plan? Did you guys, you know, make any changes in terms of what you were planning to do for the second birth?

Guest: 33:48

So I uh I felt like I was just much more trusting of of my body, um, much more trusting of the Lord, but the body he gave me and uh my body's ability to he gave me this baby, and I'm I have the ability to to birth him. And uh just much more trusting of the process and seeing like birth is this beautiful thing. I remember watching birth videos with my first and being like, whoa! But with my second, I was like, this is so cool, this is just miraculous! Like, what a miracle that we get to witness and that we get to experience, and uh just being like such a celebration and excitement around the birth instead of like this anxiety that I had with the first.

Host: 34:31

I love that. I had a similar experience. I I didn't even want to see any birth videos for my first because I was so freaked out by them. And I just remember like the three I was forced to watch. I was just like, oh, ooh, yeah, like I don't want I don't want anything to do with that. Um, but yeah, I felt really similar. After I had my first, I was like, oh, this was amazing.

Guest: 34:53

And I want to see all the birth videos. Yes. And I think that there's like a I mean, uh even at the root level, I guess just even like at one layer of it is just a desensitized desensitization, right? That like in our culture, we don't really see birth that often, except for maybe in like home high school. But it is such a natural thing. And uh if you're going to go through it, then it I think it makes sense to like witness it often.

Host: 35:21

Right. Yeah. That's because hundreds of years ago, you you would have like oh well, okay. At least if you were the female in the family, you know, you would have witnessed, you know, your mother, your aunt, or somebody, a cousin, you know, going through birth before you had to. So it was a lot less, you know, scary and a lot more normal and just regular.

Guest: 35:45

Yeah, absolutely. One other thing that I was just thinking of uh was uh I still just to mention, like I still had some anxiety during that time too. So I don't want to make it seem like, all right, I'm a believer now, like no anxiety. Because I I mean I still struggle with some anxiety and I struggled during that pregnancy. And uh the difference there was I I felt like a true peace and rest whenever I was talking to God about it, and uh didn't have that same thing with with the first because I didn't have a relationship with him.

Host: 36:13

Yeah, it makes such a difference. So tell us about the second birth then. How did it go? How did it all go down? So it went down very quick.

Guest: 36:23

It was it started to become very similar to Sterling's in the prodromal labor. And uh I knew wait as long as you can. Um, I had even talked to my doctors. I switched providers at that point. So I'm at another practice sets of Winston that I love. I think it's very patient focused. They take their time with their patients. Um there's midwives mixed with OBs, and uh um I just feel very heard and respected. Um, asked them all the questions about which positions can I deliver in. Because at that point, I'd done tons of research about different birth positions and uh many other things related to birth. So yeah, felt very supported and trusted those providers. And so uh had that predominal labor for a bit. And uh at 40 weeks, I ended up getting a membrane sweep uh because uh um my doctor again just said, like, hey, you're just at like again, four centimeters, like you're fully effaced. You could get a membrane sweep if you want, but you don't have to. I was just like, well, we'll just see what happens. It could work, it could not. And so I get it at 12 p.m. on my due date. And uh he's born at 4 p.m. Oh my goodness. I labor at home for about three hours. Labor picks up fast and furious. Uh, and uh I get to the hospital and I'm in that like active stage of labor. I can't talk, I'm sweaty, I'm having to stop and moan and do my breathing exercises uh um during contractions. And uh, as they're doing the check, uh, I my water breaks and uh um and then uh I uh I end up switching to getting into all fours um to labor. And then uh he comes out in two pushes. And uh it's just incredible. Like uh the doctor comes in right at the right time. All the nurses at the hospital were just incredible. They were so supportive. Um, the birthing suite that I was at had the birth tub, but I got in for two seconds and was like, I need to push, like I need to get out. Oh yeah, it labored on all fours for maybe like five minutes and then felt like I needed to push and uh definitely went through that last stage of uh I don't want to do this, I don't think I can do this, get me out of here, fight or flight. So it's and uh yes in my mind I was like, okay, that means he's almost here. Right. And uh um, so then uh yeah, two pushes, he comes out and uh um they hand him to me from underneath uh and I cut his umbilical cord. And uh I just like am able to pick him up and kiss him and hold him. And it's just like again, so healing, so redemptive, and just uh yeah, just very, very empowering. And uh um, you know, God be the glory for all of that. Like uh by his grace, that was that was what happened part of the plan. So I'm just so incredibly grateful. And it was just again very healing.

Host: 39:15

So then didn't did you feel like that instant bond and connection with him that time?

Guest: 39:20

Yeah, I did.

Host: 39:22

I'm so glad. And I mean, I don't want to assume, but do you feel like that played into how your postpartum went the second time around?

Guest: 39:29

Yeah, absolutely. I felt so calm and so peaceful. I even sent my husband home to go check on my son, Sterling, um, and say goodnight to him, leaving me at the hospital with the baby to have some cuddle time and nursing him and everything. And then he went to go pick up Indian food for us. And uh it was just uh yeah, I just felt very calm and peaceful. And uh it was almost like uh like it had just happened, obviously, but it was almost like nothing had changed, except for everything had changed. I don't know if that makes sense. It was like uh I'm still the same. Person that I was prior. And uh um, I think that there was some fear, of course, of like the postpartum coming back. So we had talked to our provider about that and uh um had made sure that there were like things in place if things did go south again. But uh yeah, felt very calm afterwards, felt very much still like myself, uh, and uh yes, very peaceful.

Host: 40:22

Good. I didn't ask, so were you able to continue nursing your son the first time?

Guest: 40:28

So I stopped about eight weeks because uh of the sleep situation.

Host: 40:31

Okay.

Guest: 40:32

Um I just really needed to prioritize sleeping and so uh um stopped nursing in order to focus on sleep.

Host: 40:40

Yeah.

Guest: 40:40

For Eli, we figured out a good strategy for us in order for me to still be able to sleep, but also have success with nursing as well.

Host: 40:47

Oh, okay. So did you go on to nurse Eli then for a while? I did, yeah. I nursed him until he was one. Oh, cool. I love this. I love, I mean, obviously, I don't love that you had the first experience that you had, but that you were pulled into a relationship with the Lord because of that experience and and he was able to give you this other experience that helped, you know, redeem that situation and and make it seem for like he worked it all together for good. So what do you feel like? Is there anything else that you haven't mentioned that you feel like God taught you through all of these experiences?

Guest: 41:29

Um well, I think I mentioned the just ultimately trusting him and like his plans. And uh I think what else he taught me was uh to uh surrender to him, to rest in him. And uh um like I mentioned with the anxiety, like anytime I would feel that like casting that onto him would be through prayer, through uh scripture and uh um meditating on that, you know, through uh my young adulthood, going like through college and and into early 20s, uh I uh I think I've tried to find uh some solution to the feeling of unrest that I think we all kind of have a little bit of uh personal development books, uh and uh um even like dabbling in crystals kind of playfully, not even seriously, but just like like I'm the solution to my own problems kind of thing. I've just realized like we're not the solution to our problems. We uh are broken in a broken world, and the only person that can redeem us and can be sufficient is Christ.

Host: 42:33

Right. Amen. So then going through this, you know, mom of two, um, two totally different experiences, what advice do you have for other moms out there?

Guest: 42:47

I think uh one thing would be that if you are having a tough time in the any season of pregnancy, birth, or postpartum, or trying to get pregnant and to just seek seek help, and I think uh get curious about your faith and uh yeah, your relationship with God, relationship with others around you and and leaning on those that love you. And then uh for the postpartum period, I think that you should plan for that as much as you plan for the birth. So in your birth plan, and then even in just after baby comes planning for baby, I'm gonna do the nursery and all that, like all that can really wait. I it's totally fun and super cute, all the baby things. So, but they're very minimal. And uh really the priority is taking care of them, obviously, but also taking care of yourself and uh thinking about your postpartum plan as much as you're thinking about your birth plan and uh also talking with your partner about the expectations that you both are going to have for quality time with each other, for sleep, uh and uh um and thinking about the sibling too. So uh one thing that Chris and I did the second time that we felt like was was uh um really successful on our journey with breastfeeding was uh we did shifts. So uh he would do uh let's say from like 8 p.m. to 2 a.m. of watching the baby. So he could sleep and I could sleep too. That's when I would focus on sleeping. And if the baby woke up, he would just bring him to me to nurse and do everything else. So if he was crying and fussy or if he needed a diaper change, I knew I could rely on Chris to do that and I would go back to sleep. And then from maybe like 2 p.m. or 2 a.m. until like seven would be my shift. And that's when I would do what he was doing, and he knew that all he had to do was sleep. So I think doing something like that and just thinking through the like logistics of taking care of baby and making sure expectations are clear and that your needs are getting met as well. Um, and also eating nourishing food too. I read uh I can't remember what it's called, something about the first 40 days, I think.

Host: 44:59

Yeah, that's exactly what it's called. The first 40 days.

Guest: 45:02

That was uh such a good book. Uh um the recipes are really good too. And I made a few of them, uh, froze them, I made tons of bone broth uh and uh just uh didn't stick necessarily to like only eating like warm foods or that sort of thing, but definitely eating like nourishing foods uh um during that time.

Host: 45:23

Yeah. That's great. Yeah, that's a great book. And I can link that in the show notes. Um, because that is a book I recommend for sure. I actually read it for the first time this past pregnancy for my fifth, and I'm like, why didn't I read this sooner?

Guest: 45:38

Wow. Yeah, did you feel like it made a difference for you too?

Host: 45:41

Oh yeah, and it's funny because I I don't know if this is because I read about it or if it's because I I really did crave it, but like this time I really did and we were going into the fall, so maybe that was part of it, but I really did want just warm, home cooked food. I didn't want takeout, I didn't want like anything from a restaurant or anything. Like I wanted whatever I had to be made at home. And it's funny because it was like, you know, people would bring us food, which was amazing. And I, you know, my husband and kids would be off like eating, you know, burgers, fries, whatever. And I was just like, I want some really protein fiber-packed oatmeal, like really hot, warm with like pecans and pumpkin and like all this, like it was just like, but that and that's all I wanted. Yeah. Um, so it was funny that um, yeah, I'm like, did the did the book play into that or did I really want that? I don't know, but it worked out well. Well, do you have anything else you want to share before we end?

Guest: 46:48

I think I want to say too that like uh I didn't have that initial connection with my with Sterling as a baby, like as soon as he was born, but we have such a solid connection now. So I I think I just want to say that too. That like if you're not feeling that like immediately after birth, like hang in there, it'll come. Like that love will you have that special bond still. Yeah. And uh um, because I was a little worried for a while that like oh I let him down, like he's not gonna love me. And uh it's just not truly he's such a sweet kid.

Host: 47:17

Yeah.

Guest: 47:18

And then the other thing too, I did a a fitness program through my second pregnancy that I really liked uh and a birth course through Mama Stay Fit. Um, love, love, love their content on Instagram and uh um they're in North Carolina too, but I did a birth course with them back in January that was just awesome. I think that they have great resources. Um, so just want to plug that in there too.

Host: 47:41

Does it have like like pregnancy fitness and like postpartum fitness and stuff like that?

Guest: 47:47

Yes. So it's a midwife and a doula. The doula has their sisters, and um, the doula is also an exercise scientist as well. And so they have uh resources related to pregnancy, birth, and uh um postpartum through exercise, and also the birth course I took was through them as well. And so they have I liked it because it was like, here's what's anatomically happening as the baby's like coming down, and uh um different exercises or movement patterns that you can do in order to help your pelvis move for like the outlet, the inlet, the mid-pelvis, and uh um so that was all like new information to me. And just uh I think visually seeing that and hearing that in the birth video like made so much sense prepping for the second one.

Host: 48:34

Yeah, yeah, like knowing the different parts of the body and how they're moving as the baby's coming out.

Guest: 48:40

Yeah, something about that visual clicked.

Host: 48:43

Good. It probably helped that you are also a fitness guru, it sounds like already.

Guest: 48:49

Maybe not guru, but um definitely interested, interested in all that. Thank you so much for having me. It's just uh such such an honor.

Host: 48:59

Thank you for doing this. I've really, really appreciate it. Thanks again for joining us today. You can reach me at Surrendered Birth Services on Instagram or email me at contact at Surrendered Birth Services.com. Be sure not to miss an episode by hitting subscribe. Also, we love for you to leave a review of the show so that more people like you can hear more stories like these. If you really enjoyed this episode in particular, please take a screenshot and post it to your Instagram story tagging Surrendered Birth Services. If you're interested in taking my childbirth classes, birth consultations, or having me as your birth doula, please click on the link in the show notes to take you to my website for online and in-person options. Just as a reminder, this show is not giving medical advice. So please continue to see your personal care provider as needs arise. Also, if you'd like to be a guest on the Surrendered Birth Stories podcast, please click the link in the episode show notes to get in touch with me. We hope you have a great week. And remember, learn all that you can, make the best plans, and then leave it in God's hands.