The Tightrope: Balancing Career, Motherhood, and Everything In Between
Being a mother is wonderful, hard, and everything in between. Being a working mother is its own brand of chaos. Join hosts Jess Feldt and Daniella Cornue as they discuss the challenges and the triumphs of being a working mom today.
The Tightrope: Balancing Career, Motherhood, and Everything In Between
Modern Fatherhood: Part 2 - Expectations of Fatherhood Today
What does it mean to be a father in today's ever-evolving world? This is the question we tackle in our latest podcast episode as we journey through the intricate tapestry of modern fatherhood. Guiding us on this exploration, we have three extraordinary fathers – Ryan, Jorge, and Nate – each bringing a unique perspective to the table. Through their personal anecdotes and reflections, we dive into the fascinating changes fatherhood has undergone over the years, from traditional family structures to modern expectations, and the profound impact these shifts have on families.
The discussion takes a sharp turn into the realm of co-parenting and gender equity within the modern family structure. Inspired by the progress feminism and women's equality have made in the workplace, we delve into how this has reshaped parenting roles. From the challenges faced by older generations in understanding these new dynamics to the importance of open communication in maintaining a healthy family environment, our conversation paints a vivid picture of today's fatherhood landscape.
Wrapping up our episode, we examine the struggles men confront as they strive to balance their careers with parenting responsibilities. With societal norms and corporate structures often acting as barriers, we underscore the urgent need for progressive paternity policies and the importance of having a supportive community for fathers. Whether you're a new father seeking advice or someone interested in understanding the complexities of modern fatherhood, this episode serves as a captivating dialogue about fatherhood's joys, challenges, and the rewarding journey it encompasses. So tune in, lend us your ears, and let's challenge the norms together.
Thanks for listening to The Tightrope! We would greatly appreciate a review and a share if you enjoyed today's episode.
To connect with us further, please reach out to:
Jess Feldt: www.jessfeldtcoaching.com
Daniella Cornue: www.levillagecowork.com
You can also find us on Instagram, Facebook, and LinkedIn!
What do you think is probably the biggest influence your dad had on the way that you parent Vivie today?
Nate Cornue:The way that I parent my daughter is not like my father.
Daniella Cornue:Do you think that's because of like me, or do you think that's because of you and the expectations of fathers.
Nate Cornue:Today there's a whole different level of involvement that I can't just go to work for eight, ten hours a day and leave you to be the sole parent. It's not even like a question at this point, but it was the norm.
Daniella Cornue:Hello to all of our exhausted and exhilarated working parents and welcome to the tightrope, a show about balancing career, motherhood and everything in between. We are your hosts Jess Feldt and Daniella Cornue, and this week we're going to be continuing our conversation with our partners and friends who are fathers, and we're going to be talking about what it means to be a modern millennial father. Let's get into it, alright? So here we go with our second podcast with our partners and our friends who are fathers. Jess, what is the difference between this week's podcast versus our podcast that we did the last time with our dads? What's kind of the line of questioning and how are we elevating this discussion?
Jess Feldt:Yeah, I think in our first episode we gave our dads a layup, if you will. We've really just allowed them to talk about their experiences with fatherhood and especially those newborn years, right, and listening to the dads together commiserate and share funny stories and just being able to listen through those first couple of months of what it's like to be a father in that transition. That was really what we were capturing in the first episode, and today's episode we're going to dive even deeper to that. We really want to hear our dads share about what they see as the evolution of fatherhood and how does their fatherhood today perhaps differ from the fatherhood that they grew up with with their dads or those they saw around them? And so we're talking a little bit more broadly about fatherhood and society today, versus the last episode was really more about their personal experiences.
Daniella Cornue:Awesome. Yeah, I am excited to let our listeners kind of hear some of the things that they have to say, so I'm going to jump us right over into it and we can hear it from them.
Jess Feldt:Great. Welcome back everyone. We are here for round two of our panel with our dads today. We're really excited to finish off these two episodes here where we invited some of our favorite dads to talk about modern fatherhood. So, just to remind you, today we have Ryan, Jorge, and Nate, along with Dani and myself, here today, and in our first episode we really focused our conversation on the introduction to fatherhood.
Jess Feldt:We had each of our dads go across and tell their story. What was their first oh shit" Moment I'm a dad and what did those really early years of fatherhood, that newborn stage, look like for each one of them? And today we're really going to focus our conversation on modern fatherhood. I think we can all agree that there are some different expectations today for dads and there were in past generations, and so we're really going to dive into that and talk about what does modern fatherhood look like today from the perspective of our three dads that we have here, talk a little bit about their influences on fatherhood and also what they see going on in society today. So, dads, I want to welcome you all back, thanks.
Nate Cornue:Glad to be here. Thanks for having me.
Jess Feldt:Yeah. So our first question that we are going to get started with today and, like we did last time, just, you know, feel free to jump in and I will make sure we try and hear from everyone here but the first question that I want to start with today is is really starting to talk about your own fathers? We're really kind of going to jump right in Because, as we're talking about modern fatherhood, you all have a vision of what fatherhood looks like, either from your own father's or father's that you experienced growing up or just kind of society, and so I'm really curious to know how did the fathers that you saw growing up kind of influence your life and what you see as fatherhood today?
Nate Cornue:Wonderful.
Jorge Reyes:We'll take the first now.
Daniella Cornue:Let's hear from Nate first because I I obviously know your father and so it's been really interesting from my perspective because obviously, like, I think what makes being married really interesting sometimes is that I have my expectations of fatherhood based on my experiences, and then to get to meet your dad and and really see a completely different family dynamic and the way that your family rallies around your dad is is a really awesome thing to watch. I'd love to hear, like what you're just like, what your perspective is.
Nate Cornue:Yeah, I mean he's like the. It's the most traditional father that you could ever have and most traditional family structure feel like for that generation for sure. And he's kind of on the older end of that generation. He turns 79, 80 this year I think. So you know he's up there in age but you know it was a very traditional upbringing.
Jess Feldt:Can you tell me what you mean when you say traditional?
Nate Cornue:dad worked mom stayed home with the kids. Dad made the money, mom took care of the kids and cook for everybody and clean the house and and that was that you know she had. She worked a bit on the side and, you know, had her own projects and passion things that she was able to do, but dad was gone all day, went to work, made the money, came home and dinner was ready for him on the table and the kids were, all you know, kind of answering to him. But when he got home, you know he did take on that role of getting home and taking the kids from mom for a couple hours, like he. You know he did step in and do that. But you know it was just a very Norman Rockwell like town that we grew up in and it was just like very traditional in that sense, like the way that that the family dynamic was laid out and what the expectation was.
Daniella Cornue:It's so, Norman Rockwell like literally the first time that nature of me home I was like, is this a Norman Rockwell painting? It's very like, whereas like my family's chaos and a little bit dysfunction in the best possible way, like Nate's family, is like hyper functional and very like it's picturesque. It's crazy to yeah.
Nate Cornue:Yeah, so you know, as a father of six boys, my dad was the authoritarian for sure was able to lay the smack down and make sure that we were in our place, but he didn't have to look like mom did. She was able to put us in her face. But just a look. You know he was very much holler and scream at you to get his way and make sure that you were listening. You know listening to him and fighting about your rules, but you know an amazing father for sure.
Nate Cornue:You know I have so much respect for the man and he's taught us all as men so much about like how to be respectful human being and so much about work ethic and taking pride in yourself and your life. So you know he's really assumed an amazing role as a father. Now, it's not without this could be. It's like you know, we have inherited some things from dad that probably are frowned upon in this day and age.
Jess Feldt:What do you think is probably the biggest influence your dad had on the way that you parent Vivie today?
Nate Cornue:The way that I parent my daughter is not like my father.
Daniella Cornue:Do you think that's because of like me, or do you think it's because of?
Nate Cornue:I think that's because of you and the expectations of fathers today. There's a whole different level of involvement that I can't just go to work for eight, 10 hours a day and leave you to be the sole parent. It's not even like a question at this point, but it was the norm of that, so it's completely different.
Jess Feldt:So I actually want to jump to Ryan next, if we can because I love what you say. Well, I mean, it's true. Right, that was the norm. However, Ryan's experience with his dad, and then Ryan's my husband I know his family extremely well is completely the opposite, and I had the pleasure of meeting your dad.
Daniella Cornue:I think I've met him twice now.
Ryan Feldt:Yes, but just this last week.
Daniella Cornue:But this last week was the most recent time, and I've met your mom a couple of times too, and I just they're fabulous.
Jess Feldt:It's so funny. So, Ryan, why don't you explain a little bit about your experience growing up? Because there are some, obviously some external factors that played into that.
Ryan Feldt:Yeah, no, I mean that's crazy hearing that story. It's almost the exact opposite for me. So, first of all, I was born in South Africa and we emigrated here when I was six years old and at the time it was my mom's work that got us the entrance to the country. So, kind of by protocol, she took the lead for a while and was the only person that could work, but that just played what was already set up in our home in South Africa, where she was the breadwinner. She had the career, she was in a creative field, but absolutely the hardworking one. Nine to five or nine to whatever, some days I wouldn't even see her is what I was told when I was young. So yeah, she was absolutely the breadwinner growing up and then we moved here and it was the same. I mean, my dad is a very free spirited person, was part of some hippie type movements in the sixties.
Ryan Feldt:If anyone has ever seen a big fish, I literally think my dad is big fish in that sense and I'm kind of the son and we have our things to work on a little bit. But no, he's a larger than life character in that way and he was very involved with the kids. I mean, that's like putting it lightly, Like kids are his life, what lights him up, and now it's really fun to see what the grandkids the same thing is happening. Even though he's 30 years older, he has more energy than I do, which is crazy, but no so like growing up he was the fun, absolutely the fun, but he also was- how old is your dad really quickly.
Ryan Feldt:He's 71.
Daniella Cornue:Okay, so a little bit of a different generation, slightly younger. I think, that's important to like. Think about the different generational things.
Ryan Feldt:Yeah, so a little bit younger, but I think at the time it's still pretty uncommon early 90s in the US even.
Daniella Cornue:Oh, yeah, absolutely absolutely yeah.
Ryan Feldt:So I remember him always having fun with us and doing games and just he was always so involved Like he always said get stuck in. You never had to worry about splitting his attention, like it was there. But he also was a huge disciplinarian. You talk about the look, right, like maybe your mom had the look, my dad had a look and if he had that look, you are indeed in trouble.
Ryan Feldt:And he would yell and shout a little bit If that happened. It was so loud that you literally just like had to stop. It was just like you know You've got. So my mom was more lenient, I think, because she was away at all times. She felt guilty and then would come and the best thing I remember from my mom growing up was like she wasn't around as much as when she was there. She would just be like you know, on her lap and she'd be playing with my hair. It was like just very affectionate and I would go to her knowing, like if I needed like to do something kind of, you know, like I needed money or I needed something that was interesting.
Ryan Feldt:I would go to her, cause she, I think, was like wanting to make up for some of that.
Jess Feldt:So yeah, kind of the opposite of, I think, early mom guilt.
Daniella Cornue:I was going to say I'm like Mom guilt, we have to have these moms 35 years ago, it's crazy.
Ryan Feldt:I think mom guilt probably goes back more than 35 years.
Jess Feldt:So, Ryan, what do you think the influence of kind of the reverse right you had to stay at home dad for a while and then he went to work later when he could, but like very still involved. How do you think that influenced the way that you show up today as a father?
Ryan Feldt:Yeah, I mean I it's interesting cause, like I'm a very different person than my dad in many different ways and I'm pretty career oriented. I get that. I think my mom and my mom's dad actually. So watching my dad is actually helping me get out of. Not that I'm like a traditionalist or like thinking of myself that way. I just know that like I'm currently like more of the career focused person bringing home the bacon, as they say.
Ryan Feldt:But watching my dad it taught me that like the presence you want to have and just honestly, the joy that you can have from hanging out with kids. Like everyone's like, oh, they're a pain in the butt and they keep nagging and go away. But no, he's like if you actually just like look at them, engage with them, get curious, play their games Cause he was never shy or embarrassed to do that, even in public. I mean he embarrassed me a little bit, so shy, so I was like, okay, like to be a man isn't just to be the tough guy with the newspaper and kids going away. It's like, no, actually to lead into it.
Ryan Feldt:So I I feel like I strike a good balance with that. I know I can get frustrated with myself If I know I'm not engaging with the kids cause I'm stressed about work or I'm thinking about it. I can like sense when that happens and I don't think my dad ever had that, cause he was just like I wake up in the morning and this is my purpose and it's part of my purpose, but it's not my only purpose, especially right now, given our dynamics. So I often have to try to like I do have to turn it on, or more like turn everything else off, but when I do, that's usually a great experience.
Daniella Cornue:I'd love to come back around to that, like being able to turn it on and turn it off and compartmentalize, because I think that that's something that's so challenge, regardless of if you're a mom or a dad, if you're working. How to do that, I think, is fascinating.
Jess Feldt:Yeah. So, Jorge, I'm going to jump to you now, though. How do you relate to hearing these two different things and your experience? Yeah right, like we have a little bit of two extremes here.
Jorge Reyes:Well, my dad's younger. To give me a little bit of a profile, he was only 60. He had me when I was nine. He was 19. When he had me I was already the second kid. He's what you call an illegal right. He crossed over from Mexico when his parents died so he had a grocery store. His parents had grocery store in Mexico, and his parents died when he was about 15, 16. So one of his older sisters is the first to emigrate here and he basically got paid for it to come over. And so what's funny is like I was telling the guys how I went to Mexico City with my father. It's kind of surreal for me because I think I appreciate him and his story a lot more now as an adult, as a parent, than I did as a kid, because I worked for my dad since I was 12. He had a grocery store. He's an entrepreneur, so he took his the way that I see my father now versus the way I saw him then.
Jorge Reyes:He was very authoritative like you guys mentioned, he worked at a factory. He'd come home, he would not be able to talk to him for two hours and in between, like the hours of seven and nine, you might be able to get a football thrown at you, depending on the mood that he was in. But like he did everything. I remember we grew up pretty humbly in the South Side of Chicago and I remember having everything having the bicycle set up in the backyard, having bicycles, having things that I always wanted in terms of I never went. Wanting he was and, to be honest with you, I think, knowing what I know now, spanking was a lot less frowned upon back then.
Jess Feldt:But it was bad. Much more socially acceptable, and sometimes I'm like huh.
Jorge Reyes:well, maybe that's not such a bad idea, but you know he was one of those guys where you always got the like whatever it was on his mind.
Nate Cornue:You're gonna get.
Jorge Reyes:He wasn't gonna beat around the bush to anyone, much less his kids we had. There was four of us. I was the only son, three sisters, and you know, what I really find interesting is that I don't think I realized how much patience he had, knowing what I know now. Because, yeah, let's just say I was maybe not the best son Growing up. I crashed four of his cars before I turned two. Four I'm sorry, four, four four yeah, I got three speeding tickets in my first year.
Ryan Feldt:I thought I was a bad kid.
Jorge Reyes:Well, I was also driving to work for two of those which he owned the shop, so he could really say much about that one.
Ryan Feldt:But no.
Jorge Reyes:I think that you know what it's taught me now is that I really to your points about Hats. You know that time and that place of him not having a father figure of base off, like when I was in Mexico City. I'm using the internet to get me through parenting situations Like what do you do? Like you know you didn't have that back then, you had to make it up on your own and the fact that he was able to do that with four kids, with four or two and 25, was amazing.
Jess Feldt:Exactly. Nope, don't have me four kids before the end of 25, no thanks. So one thing I'm curious about because, Nate, you brought this up specifically when you were talking about it how you see your parenting is different now, because the expectations are different now, and so there was a the Pew Research Center and this is. This statistic is probably old, it's from 2011, but it's the most recent I could find. Shows that fathers have nearly tripled the amount of time that they spent with their kids today than they did back in 1965. So I'm curious, what do you think of this idea that fatherhood is a much more kind of an engaged sport today, than it used to be in the past? And kind of what do you see as the impact of this on kind of your families? Right, because it's not just a dynamic between you and a child, but it really it's a family dynamic.
Nate Cornue:I mean, to call it a sport is just completely off page. I mean, this is our lives and you know, I think that in our generation there is a huge push for feminism and for advancement of women in the workplace and everybody striving to get women equality in the workplace and the same opportunities and the same pay. And you know, it's just a completely different dynamic and, as a result, you know, the expectation is that the fathers are there to co-parent. You are expected to contribute just as much to that family as your wife or as your female partner, you know whatever. But I think that I mean, that's just a huge driving factor in what we're trying to achieve at this point. And so, as a family, yeah, we are constantly striving for co-parenting 50% contribution to the family.
Daniella Cornue:Yeah, and or equity right, we talked a lot about this. Where it's like I talk a lot about this with my girlfriends, where it's like you taught me this just is that it's. You can't have equality. There's no such thing as equality. There is no such thing as 50-50 all the time. That's impossible. You're going to make yourself crazy going after that. But just having equity in our household where we are supporting each other, depending on what our weeks look like, you know. So having those conversations like this week, I have this on my plate. Okay, this week I have this on my plate. How do we show up together? And I think the fact that you buy into that, how do I support you when you're in it?
Nate Cornue:How do you support me when I'm in it? How do we support each other when Vivi's a disaster?
Jess Feldt:It's going to rough couple of weeks, right? Well, and I think there's a key phrase that you just used, Dani, which is, like Nate has to buy into that too, right, because I think that is a lot of where, like the gender stereotypes come from is this is your role, this is your role, and there has to be agreement among both people in a partnership that know that is not your role or your role. It is our role together, and that's how we come up with whatever it looks like for us to be equitable.
Daniella Cornue:And I would even argue that in these traditional you know 50, 60s, you know generations that to them that was equity, right, that was their version of equity, because that was the standard back then. So I don't think that, like we were to talk to your, your mom I guess it's a question for you Do you think, if we were to talk to your mom about her and your dad's breakdown in the 60s or the 50s, that your mom would feel like they had an inequitable household?
Nate Cornue:No, not at all, but I think that if we try to sit down and explain to them how we approach our family dynamic and try to create equity, they look at us like we have three heads.
Daniella Cornue:I think you're right. I think that that's a big challenge, for we can get into that soon, but a big challenge for corporate companies that are led by men in their 60s and 70s and whatever else about what their versions of equity are versus what our versions of equity are in our families.
Jorge Reyes:That's funny Equity. To me there's a banker. I think like money first, but in a relationship status it's more about time, because that time is the one thing you can never get back and my mother, at the time when my dad started the business, she actually took out her 401k fund to go open the daycare and was declined. She was not a part of her business. So they pivoted. Based on my dad's experience, they were going to buy his grocery store with her funds. Interesting, interesting.
Daniella Cornue:I don't know that.
Jorge Reyes:Now he's semi-retired. He hasn't done much for it Because he owns the business out right, the building, free and clear, everything is now he's done very well for a man from Mexico without any kind of education. Maybe he got a GED or something because he had to. But when you talk to my mother about this because we have a very open communication level where I actually rely on her and her advice a lot in life about how to navigate certain things she always reminds me about this story when it comes to Mary's and I's work schedule, because we have very conflicting schedules. We are always asking each other and communicating. Without that communication, it doesn't matter how much money we're making, we'll fall apart, because the time is what really is a hindrance on what your aspirations and your partners are, and your kids too, because you can't to your point. If I know I'm burning at both ends, I can't expect to be a really good dad either in the present or the present.
Ryan Feldt:Well, I think some people in the modern world because the time constraints are there, I think instead of sometimes looking to each other, they look externally.
Ryan Feldt:So if maybe it's a more well-off family, that means like a nanny or someone else to take over, or let's max out the after school programs and whatever you're going to do, I think it's somewhat cheapens the experience, because then you're not going to time as the adult, you're just kind of like spreading it around.
Ryan Feldt:Because what I think is interesting not necessarily back to like our parents generation, but just like even longer back, kids were raised by communities, right, so there's like a lot of people helping out. And one of the negatives of this modern, like very free world is like you're kind of on your own and you can like self select into all these things, but then who's going to drive and coordinate and do all that to make it happen? So to me, like you almost kind of either like have to go that route or you have to sacrifice, you know, between the two of you together to, I'm not saying have a more traditional environment, but to be able to keep it within the nucleus, because I think today's world is like, well, you know, corporate world and our like very capitalistic environment. We try to solve these problems with more goods and services and, trust me, like I work for a tech startup, like I'm all about that, but I think, when it comes to family, like, yeah, you have to sacrifice to get that time back. You can't, you can't buy it.
Daniella Cornue:Right, you have to, you have to, you know. Well, and this is why and this is why in this it's such an American thing, honestly, where it's like, oh well, my kids are involved in 10 activities and now that my daughter is of age where she can be doing more activities, I have to stop myself and be like, no, am I doing this for her? Am I doing this because I don't know what to do with her?
Jorge Reyes:And I'm waiting.
Daniella Cornue:Actually engaging that's not so. That's what I'm hearing from you is like parents, instead of actually engaging with their kids in modern, they're hiring it out or putting them in another club or putting them in another, you know. So I, I catch myself, I'm like, okay, she doesn't need to be in six things, she can be in two things, and that's enough, and that's, and I need to just paint with her and I need to just be with her, and I think that's really interesting.
Jess Feldt:Or sometimes just let the kids be on their own. Yes, because I think I know, Nate, you kind of scoffed at the like engaged sport from fatherhood, but I think parenting in general is much more engaged than it used to be in past generations. Like, if you think about, I mean, I know with my parents it was like, okay, go outside and come back when the street lights come on. Yeah, like okay, I know we live in a big city and I did not grow up in a big city, I grew up in a suburb, but still, I think very few parents today would be like, yeah, I'm okay with my, you know, seven year old going outside and coming back with the street lights come on. I mean we feel like we need to orchestrate and plan and have someone available and have a parent all the time, kind of monitoring all of that, yeah, and so like, if we are, yeah, you better believe it takes both parents to do that, it can't just be one. Yeah, yeah.
Ryan Feldt:I think some of the best times kids have is when there's no, there's no set plan, there's no structure Cause otherwise it's like go do this, go do this, go do this, this, play date this thing. Even on the weekends we stack it up right. So then you go to these places and these kids are just like tired or angry or whatever it's like. I mean, I'm not trying to tell anyone how to parent, right, and our kids also have those problems, but I just find that we we pack too many things in there and it just and then we're like why are they having a tantrum?
Daniella Cornue:I don't understand. And then you like look at the schedule and you're like I'm tired and ready to have a tantrum and I'm an adult that has regulation skills. Yeah.
Jess Feldt:Yeah. So I'm going to continue to kind of blow this out, because we really started with your experiences with your fathers and how that impacted you and we, you know, zoomed out a little bit to what do you think about parenthood as the amount of time that dads are spending today and the expectations around that. But I'm curious to blow that out even further and say how do you feel that fathers are viewed in society today? And I mean that within, like the structures of support that are available, because I think as a society there's still sort of that traditional view right Of fathers being the main breadwinner and paternity leave is very few and far between if anyone has it versus, I feel, like expectations within, like individual family units and kind of the tension that that creates. So I mean, from your experience, what do you think that? How do you think society views fatherhood today?
Jorge Reyes:I have a lot of diverse range of friends, culturally and, I think, fatherhood. It's interesting how I knew these men before they had kids, now after they had kids, and really the diversity amongst them, I think, there's a lot of differences in how quote-unquote their societal pressures are on themselves.
Jorge Reyes:When I talk to my Asian buddies you know a lot of it is focused on like it's very pressured from the family at large. Me personally, in my culture, I know that my sisters think that I'm way too involved but I do way too much. I go above and beyond. I'm setting the bar too too high for everyone else Because they're very old school and they're instilling the men don't necessarily have to change they're machismo
Jorge Reyes:they're machismo and you know when I come in and I can have dinner ready and I know that I always calls on Mary's back cause she's always like, yeah, which I like to play whenever I wanna push her buttons play that yeah.
Jorge Reyes:You're like, but I know what I do. So I think you know cause I'm not an internet person, I'm not any social, real social media, but I do know that when I talk to my friends it's funny because, to your point early with the stats, I go to I'm a girl dad and I do do a lot of the routine stuff, but I'm very involved. In terms of when I did the dance recital a couple of days ago, like there's a little group of dads now that we all show up for each other and I'm like I can count on one hand how many times my parents half of it is because, again, my dad's very old school, we're just gonna. This is gonna be a very real conversation. So my dad, I remember telling him most in wrestling, he's like so you're gay. Now I was like no, no, I'm not gay, he's like you're wrestling, that's gay, I'm like thanks dad, thanks dad.
Jorge Reyes:So, but the funny part, though, is he's still a what, right, he's still a what, and he's one of very few dads who went you know, again. Like I grew up on the South Side, so like my black friends, my Mexican friends, we had a couple of Asian friends. Like there wasn't a lot of dads in the stands like ever, and so no matter the sport. And so now seeing dads become, you know, going to Girl Scouts meetings, it's fun to be able to have new friends through that shared commonality.
Ryan Feldt:Yeah, a couple of things I'll say. So one is like agree with what you're saying. Like kids going to Bateman now and there's like a Bateman Fathers Club and it's like I expected that you'll join, but like it's almost expected that. Like there's an organization that the dads are gonna partake and setting, that's like that's good. All this stuff we're saying is good. I think one thing maybe, because I just saw Barbie and this is like top of mind.
Jorge Reyes:It's like.
Ryan Feldt:I feel like, while this expectation has shifted to the co-parenting and we're talking about it, I think because either it's newer or men aren't as comfortable sharing their emotions or feelings there's less of like this is hard out there in the ecosystem in the world about being a dad, whereas Barbie will show us that there's plenty of people talking about the troubles and the strife of being a mom and complexities of that right.
Ryan Feldt:And I'm not saying like I think that's bad, necessarily. I think it's maybe that just makes the norm that maybe I shouldn't speak up. Maybe it's I'll seem weak if I say this is too hard and I think some dads have no problem complaining about their kids, but I think it comes from this like when she's no, like oh my God, what pain in the ass these kids are, versus like what are you really saying behind that? You're struggling, I'm having self esteem problems, whatever, like that is not quite the norm yet and I think that's not necessarily like the society's problem. I think it's just like somewhat of a gender thing that like what if there was a sequel to Barbie and Ken was having, you know, some of these feelings?
Daniella Cornue:Well, that's not what I love. I love about the Barbie movie not to like it's hashtag.
Jess Feldt:Spoiler alerts but like I love it, by the time this comes out, that will be way too long.
Daniella Cornue:I like it so, but I think that, like, what I love about the end is that, Ken, really. It really is like can you have to find who you are. Like, don't be like how do you want to attach it to me? Go be who you are without me. Yes, but I think that I think that that is so true, especially within Le Village and our community here, that our dads connect with each other and have real conversations, cause often I find that when men get together, it's like it's very like you said it's like very surface level and when it's like Nate, what did you talk about with your friends?
Jess Feldt:He's like I don't know, let me just like I asked Ryan the same thing after he comes back from his guys dinner and I'm like, what's so? What did you guys talk about?
Nate Cornue:Well, they were talking about golf and like the next fantasy was like but you know if you get together with a group of fathers, it is a little bit of a different dynamic.
Daniella Cornue:Ken.
Nate Cornue:I think that you know we don't come home and tell our wives about it. We talk about our families and we talk about our kids and whether or not it's complaining, or maybe diving in a little deeper about some emotions. We do do it promise sometimes.
Ryan Feldt:Good.
Nate Cornue:It's hard, though, because there's so many other men in my lives that are not fathers and they don't get it, they have no idea, and so like there's that societal pressure for sure, where it's just like I can't go talk to my buddy that's not a father, about being a father If he doesn't care, he doesn't get it, he has no idea what. I'm open to, this or what.
Nate Cornue:I'm talking about. So you know, in five years of being a father, I've definitely developed deeper relationships with guys that I probably wouldn't maybe have been friends with before, and you know, it's awesome. It's a great support system, it's a great place to be and to be surrounded with people that get in and are in the same shoes with you.
Jorge Reyes:And then that emotional support. It's funny because soccer season's coming up Coach for Shay's team and soccer coach and I have been together now for three years and we were texting each other about what happened with the collapse of the women's national team, the World Cup. It's really interesting because as fathers now we're like really diving into the emotional state of mind of those women and like how their emotions and egos were getting the best of them and like that emotional talk that you're talking about. Like I know I can't talk about my daughters or women's soccer to 80% of the men that I know Maybe 90, 95. And I'd lose their interest in the first two seconds of saying women's soccer.
Nate Cornue:It happens at work. You're kind of mentioning like the parental leave and whatever else. There's a lot of ground to be made up, I think, on that front.
Jess Feldt:Yeah.
Nate Cornue:I attended your session there on fatherhood and parental leave for all parents, not just mothers, basically and after that we did implement a new policy. We have a new dad, nice, and we gave him six weeks off with full pay, four weeks work from home following that. So you know, it's not like 12 weeks paid, but it's a step in the right direction, I think. And you know, what we can afford is a small business. So you know, but it's hard because you have to have these hard conversations. I think one thing that made that easy to implement was that the three owners of my company are all fathers.
Daniella Cornue:Well, and I think you're segueing into some of the questions that I have just about corporate responsibility to some of this and, like again, I'm so curious we talk about this a lot, Jorge, because obviously you work for a bank and very the traditional nature of what that brings to the table right and people that have been working in the same place for a really long time and again that are in their 50s, 60s, 70s, and what their expectations are for their male workforce and how that butts up against what the realities are for modern fathers. I'd love to hear you talk a little bit about that.
Jorge Reyes:Well, yeah, and banking is a conservative industry by nature, it's right, it's regulatory. And then to your point about old, 67 year old men. They're very, they're abundant, they're abundant. And well, it will find them. If that's your target demographic, you will find a lot of those. You know it's funny because, like some of it is ingrained. Like do I find, after working this industry for 15 years, I know I used to quit every two years. You're like I'm out of here. You guys don't get me. Until very recently. I've been with the same company now for six years and I've come to find the same patience that I find with my dad as when I wear my professional hat. I'm like, wait, they're 60. They have no concept of what I'm going through right now. And then they're had two weeks vacation, two weeks time off after you've had a kid. Why do you even want two weeks off? What would you be doing? So when you start there, you know it's very cringy on the surface, you're like, oh, this is probably not the best conversations. But then, when you start to understand where they come from and as men again, I'm very used to men being very unavailable emotionally, professionally, like I've never had a male manager
Jorge Reyes:that I've been able to have a connection with on a personal level. It's usually very business oriented, it's never very deeper than that. I've had the pleasure of working with some phenomenal women professionally in my life. Which very small windows. One of my best friends she's in San Francisco still I remember that it was right when Shay was about to be born and I was debating whether I was going to stay with this company or not and she pulled me aside and she really gave me one of the best pieces of advice family first. And you know just the whole speech and everything that came along with it was very impactful for me, very like. Without that. I don't think that I would have gone through the first child motions prepared enough to really absorb it. I think I would have gone through the process of trying to get back to making my back so I do. Leading the parenting to someone else is better equipped than I am.
Daniella Cornue:Yeah, I think it's interesting. So, Nate, you own a small business, right? So you're talking about, like, the impact of what making those decisions are. Jorge, you're talking about the effect he's like I'm getting another beer.
Nate Cornue:No judgment in this.
Daniella Cornue:But the end. Jorge, you're talking about the impact of really working in a corporate environment or traditional corporate environment and what that feels like. I'm interested to talk to Ryan and see you're in a startup environment and an entrepreneur.
Jess Feldt:But you're not the only one that picked these three men better, so crazy they're the three closest guys you could have got. Really.
Ryan Feldt:Yeah, it's hard for me to comment because it's like just looking at what startups are at the time of like. It's usually a very young group. You're moving very fast. It's a small team, so most people aren't even necessarily even at this point in their life, like, for example, at my company. I'm now the second oldest person at the company of like almost 100 people and the average age is probably he's not that old everyone.
Ryan Feldt:The low 40. The average age is probably 25, 26. And most of them, you know, are single, so I think that's like a whole separate issue from nothing to do with this, so I had very little bit of paternity either time. I think, in general, what we're saying here, though, is like, as the society has shifted, I think corporate world always lags. You know modern affairs because they're like conservative and you kind of need people to sadly like turn over and retire, honestly, for these things to change, like at a much longer view, I feel like, you know the societies move forward when it's like, you know, new people are charged Sadly, like that's. You kind of have to just wait a little bit for that to happen, honestly, and you know startups, maybe that's going to happen.
Ryan Feldt:I do think you know, in the tech world in general, probably one of the better industries to adopt a lot of new modern policies. If you get to be post startup and you're, you know, well funded, I think it's a great. You know you'll see some of the better paternity and maternity benefits, so I think that's a general good, but I definitely did not get back because I was in a startup, but that's a whole different risk reward calculation that we had to talk about that, Because I basically like, yes, I'm going to go into a bunker for about two years and we're going to be okay with that and like I joked about it like it was having a third kid was the startup. It cries all the time. It needs to be a middle of the night, like I'm not even kidding you.
Ryan Feldt:2020 was like I had two new kids. So, yeah, it's, it's tough and like, and then and there were women there too and and you know, one of my direct reports today like she's had two kids and she did some of that through it, but it requires some sacrifice, for sure, I think I had two weeks for both kids, but in general, I also have great flexibility in other ways. So now I'm working from home all the time. I set out schedule, so maybe less great out of the gate, but in this marathon that is parenting, it's actually been amazing. I feel like even a joke now in the next few weeks, like Jess is having way more fun traveling for work than I am and she owns her own business, so it goes both ways.
Jess Feldt:I really think it's interesting.
Jess Feldt:Something that I've gathered from here is, you know, at the very beginning of this talk about feminism and trying to help women catch up to equity in the workplace, and I think at the same time, there needs to be more people helping men catch up with equity in parenting and the system and the supports and everything that supports that.
Jess Feldt:And one thing that I immediately thought of as we were talking about this is now the father's caucus in Congress, where there are congressmen who are our age, our generation, who have young children, and it's dad who are baby wearing on the floor of the Senate and setting that example and starting a father's caucus to you know, forward family friendly policies within the government and that it's not just mom, moms and women anymore who are saying, hey, we're the family friendly side, right, but like dad's getting involved with that and really modeling that at the same time. So, as we wrap this up, because we're running out of time for today, I would love to go to each one of you with. My final question is say what support do you wish? Either you had or that new dads coming after you had out there to help them and their fatherhood.
Daniella Cornue:And I'm going to add on, I'm going to add on, so, supports that you wish you had. And then, if there's a new dad listening to this because that's our hope, right is that dads actually get to listen to this what if you could leave them with a little? Their own little nugget, right? Your own little piece of advice for a new dad of where, where they can find whatever it is that they need. What would you, what would that be? No pressure.
Jorge Reyes:I definitely think that dads ask the other dads dad related questions. Don't gloss over the little stuff into the details, because anytime my daughter is seven and two and everybody that I've meet who has older daughters just go get ready for fun, it's like okay what do you mean by that?
Jorge Reyes:You're like no, I need that, like I have sisters, but what do you know that I don't know, because I don't know from the eyes of a brother, not a dad. And so I think that when I talk to people who are new dads and I try to be as that tightrope to your point, not to be, not to gloss over and say, oh, this is gonna be perfect, this is gonna be the best, I try to be real, be like this is a lot of what you. You just decided not to have a life anymore and that was like that life before. And so I think for me I look for you know, if I was to ask for one thing is that it'd be fun if there was like a group for girl dads, especially because I know that the teenage years, or whatever everybody tells me I gotta be ready for, maybe give me like a starter course.
Daniella Cornue:I have like three required films for all. Three require films for all girls at there you go.
Ryan Feldt:Yeah, I think like what was like the one thing I would need or want. I think like it is just me speaking but I feel like women when they have kids. I think it's just more ways to connect with other moms. It's like you got the Pre partum class, the postpartum class, you've got this resource, and I think a lot of that now does exist for dads, because again, everything is becoming more equal. But I think it's either harder to find or not, something that I originally thought I needed.
Ryan Feldt:I'm usually a pretty independent, self-starting, like yeah, I got this kind of person, but I think parenting, all those things like yeah, I can like talk to Jess about it, but sometimes you want to talk to dads about it and I would say my circle Not a lot of the guys that I'm close with, even if they are dads go go there. So then it's like, okay, well then where can you go find that? And I've gotten, I'm getting there now, but I have a five and a three-year-old. I think maybe you've been helpful earlier, but that's also like the COVID years, so I don't know. It's a weird situation.
Daniella Cornue:I don't think it was out there. Ryan, You're like I mean.
Jess Feldt:I actually looked at one point because I know something that a lot of moms rely on our Facebook groups for moms. Yeah, and I can. I looked it up at one point. There are so many Facebook groups out there for months with like Tens of thousands of not hundreds of thousands of women on these groups, right, I found like one Facebook group for Chicago fathers and it had maybe 200 people apart of it, like not even remotely close to the same Scope of support there. And I know that social media and that tends to supports one gender to another. But it's community support, right, whenever way you want to look at it, it's community support.
Ryan Feldt:Yeah, and you know seeing that they went follow up was a great like an example of for the kids.
Daniella Cornue:Maybe the kids Like you know what are we doing?
Ryan Feldt:We're doing fantasy football, we're going to bar a drink with the underlying Theory is there.
Ryan Feldt:So I think, just to the new dad's listening like, just lean into that, don't be Like, don't like, don't feel like you have to have all the answers, like oh, I can't ask for help, or or other dads don't want to talk about that Obviously at least three dads here everyone's being very open about it. So I think I think that would be the biggest advice. And, like you hear so much and this is not just for dads but for all new parents like you hear so much about how hard it is and all the cringe stories and all that, but it goes both ways right, it's the absolute hardest thing you've ever done, but also the absolute best. So, just like, allow yourself to feel all the emotions and you don't mean you're not gonna regret it. That's what I would say.
Nate Cornue:Yeah, I kind of got a build on yours a little bit. I mean, you have to find that support system for sure, and yeah, it might not be on social media, but you know I had a great resource in two brothers that had kids before me. So I had you know, tons of support in places to go there to have a conversation about anything completely openly Super, you know.
Nate Cornue:But, you know, even you know we did the midwives program for, for prepartum and at At Swedish. And you know we did the the centering classes where we both went and we sat with other couples that were going through the exact same thing, first time parents. No clue what they were thinking too and. You know they provided a lot of support and a lot of insight, for sure, and nothing can prepare you, obviously, for what's to come.
Nate Cornue:But you know, I think trying to grasp onto some of those things really early on is a good place to be for sure. And then, beyond that, you know I, you got to advocate for yourself as a parent, as a father. Advocate for yourself in your friend group, at your workplace, in Public, you know, anywhere, like you know you, the first time you take your screaming baby out to a restaurant or onto an airplane. You know what. I'm a new dad and I'm trying to figure this out, so y'all can look all you want, but you know, here I am and I'm gonna do this because I don't, you know this. This is what I chose to do, this is what I want to be doing, this is my, it's my child. So, you know, just step it up and taking ownership of their role. I think it's important and you know it's like you.
Jess Feldt:Well, I want to thank all three of you for participating in our last two episodes and and just being really truly open and transparent and Starting these conversations that I hope Others will listen to. Women, you know, obviously, is our main audience here, but we'll invite their partners or send it to new dads that they know so that really these conversations and the support can get out there to other dads, because I think that you, you all identified something really key here is that really its community? Right, there's a lot that's out there. Fatherhood has changed, the way that society is evolving has changed, but what's really key in supporting all parents and especially fathers here, I think, is the creation of community, and so I just want to thank all of you for for showing up today.
Daniella Cornue:Today. Yeah, I was gonna say we got it All right. So that was our conversation with our dads. Jess, what do you what? What are some of the things that you got from that conversation?
Jess Feldt:You know, I think the biggest takeaway for me is that I actually have a lot of hope for the next generation. I think the biggest thing that I took away is that the fathers that we see today Are so much more involved, are leaning in so much more, and I think that you will really begin to see the payoff for that in the future generation of children that they're raising. I mean, I can say for myself, being a boy mom, I think the boys that we are raising today are going to see a different role for themselves within the family structure, and that really gives me a lot of hope to. I mean, we talk about career here, right, and motherhood and working motherhood, and I think what this will eventually trickle down to is cultures within workplaces. Yeah, absolutely, I think that Even now, even within.
Daniella Cornue:Honestly, Jess, within the last five years, the way that Nate goes to work with Vivie is different. It's different. He, you know, and he talks about that. He talks about giving those opportunities to his staff and recognizing that it has to be different. It cannot be the same. So we try to close this podcast down with what. What do we call it, jess? It's the in-between part.
Jess Feldt:You know we are the tightrope career, motherhood and everything in between. And so this is the recognition of there's more to you than just career and motherhood. Are we sure? I don't know, I'm just I'm sure, I'm sure.
Daniella Cornue:What's your in-between this week?
Jess Feldt:You know, my in-between for this week and, I think, long term is I'm beginning to learn Portuguese Because a little heads up for our listeners I'm actually taking the summer with my family to go spend six weeks in Portugal, and so I'd like to be able to talk to people there, so I'm learning Portuguese. That's awesome. Are you using an app or I am. I'm not getting paid to say this, but, yes, Duolingo Thank you, fantastic. Well, I don't think I can be Portugal, so I guess I'll just say we'll see you next time.
Jess Feldt:We'll see you next time Thank you all so much for joining us today on the tightrope.
Daniella Cornue:We know you really are juggling a thousand things and it means a lot to us that you listen in. If you liked this episode, please leave a like and subscribe to our channel. If you liked this episode, make sure you follow and subscribe to us on your favorite streaming networks. And, of course, if you know a mom that needs to hear this or a dad or anybody else, share us.
Jess Feldt:And you tend to hear mom saying where is my village, like, where is my support, where is my help? And I think it's a really interesting response to that proverb because if you go back to its roots, it's an African proverb and actually what it is saying is not that we need to help moms or that we need to help parents, but that collectively, it is actually the responsibility of the village, of the community, to raise a child.
Daniella Cornue:That's next week, so until then, just put one foot in front of the other. Thanks guys.
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