Family Disappeared

"Where Did My Mom Go?": A Child's Terrifying Introduction To Parental Alienation Part 2 - Episode 80

• Lawrence Joss

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In this episode of the Family Disappeared podcast, Lawrence Joss interviews Dana, a previously alienated child who has grown into an adult and author. Dana shares her journey of healing from childhood alienation, the complexities of reconnecting with her mother, and the challenges of navigating family dynamics. The conversation emphasizes the importance of community support, the lessons learned from regret, and the power of choice in moving forward. Dana's insights provide valuable guidance for others facing similar experiences, highlighting the need for education and self-empowerment in the healing process.

Key Takeaways

  • Being an alienated child is part of her experience, not her identity.
  • Reconnecting with estranged parents can be complex and requires readiness.
  • Navigating family dynamics is challenging for alienated children.
  • Community support is crucial for healing and understanding.
  • Education about psychological abuse can empower individuals.
  • It's important to express one's truth for personal healing.
  • Regret can be a powerful motivator for change and growth.
  • The power of choice is essential in moving forward after trauma.
  • Healing involves facing uncomfortable emotions and experiences.
  • Service to others can be a transformative part of the healing journey.

Chapters

00:00 Introduction to Alienation and Healing

04:24 Reconnecting with the Mother

11:30 Navigating Family Dynamics

20:12 The Importance of Community and Support

26:27 Lessons from Regret and Healing

34:46 The Power of Choice and Moving Forward


Dana Laquidara - https://danalaquidara.com/


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This podcast is made possible by the Family Disappeared Team:
Anna Johnson- Editor/Contributor/Activist/Co-host
Glaze Gonzales- Podcast Manager

Connect with Lawrence Joss:
Website: https://parentalalienationanonymous.com/
Email- familydisappeared@gmail.com

Speaker 1:

My even deeper hope is that adult alienated children will come across it and handle things better than you know, differently than I did. It might be too late for me, but it's not too late for a lot of adult alienated children.

Speaker 2:

There was a time in my life when I was overwhelmed and underwater. Those days are the inspiration for this podcast. This is by far the ultimate healing journey for all of us. Healing ourselves emotionally, spiritually and physically is paramount to this journey. From this place of grounding we can all go out into the world and change all our interactions and relationships. We can engage people from an integrated and resourced place. This is a journey of coming home to ourselves. In today's episode we'll start to explore some of these issues. Let's begin the healing journey today. Welcome to the Family Disappeared podcast. Hi, my name is Lawrence Joss and welcome to the Family Disappeared podcast.

Speaker 2:

Today we have part two with Dana, a previously alienated child who now is an adult, an author, someone that is constantly speaking out about her experience with parental alienation as a young person, as an adult, and also someone that is very clearly letting you know that early on she identified as an alienated child and that was who she was. And, as she's done her own healing work, that now being an alienated child is part of her experience and it's not who she is. And by writing her memoir and coming on the show, she expresses the healing that comes with that, the cathartic experience that comes with that. So there's a lot to listen to in the words, but there's also a lot to track in Dana's behavior to see, like, what is a path forward? What could that look like? So an incredibly rich show coming up. Thanks for coming out to join us. If you're new to the community, welcome to the community.

Speaker 2:

We have a plethora of resources in the show notes. We are a 501c3 non-profit and we can use any contributions that are available to you and uh, and that might be financial and that might be just saying, hey, this, this would be a great guest on the show or here's a suggestion. You know all contributions are welcome and everything we do is free and we'd like to keep it that way. There's also a link in the show notes for our free 12-step program, which is open to previously alienated children, young adults that were previously alienated, parents, grandparents that are alienated. There's meetings specific for each group and there's meetings that are together as well. And what a great free resource. All Dana's stuff is in the show notes. I'd love to hear from you at family disappeared at gmailcom, any suggestions, likes, dislikes and remember, like comment, jump into the conversation. We want to know what we've missed, what we should continue talking about, what maybe we shouldn't talk about again. All of that is welcome and, yeah, let's jump into the show and see what happens next.

Speaker 2:

There was a great moment in the second part of the interview with Dana today that that she's talking about what it's like to address the alienating parent and have her say and as as I'm thinking about that and you'll get to listen to this in a second like at times when I've spoken to my daughters about part of my experience, I thought it was important for them to know the story. You know what I mean, to know what happened, and I've shared little bits and pieces here and sometimes it's gone well and sometimes it's been a nightmare and I wouldn't suggest people doing that until they're in a place of healing and understanding and both parties are really resourced. But in telling my story it wasn't really for anyone to hear, but it was for me to say out loud. So in retrospect, actually getting to say some of the stuff to my, my children, when they're not developmentally in a place or resourced enough, or maybe I wasn't developmentally in a place or resourced enough. Not that they're good or bad or I'm bad and they're good, it just wasn't a great strategy. Like me, getting to say that out loud is a cathartic experience and it's for no one but me and the.

Speaker 2:

The neat thing about like a 12-step program and the free support meetings that we offer is a place I get to talk about the stuff out loud for me and I don't need to put that on anyone else and I can share with a community that can understand and that you don't need to explain anything to. So if you've never experienced the support and love in the 12-step community and any kind of support group or community, the 12-step might not be the path you choose to go. But I'm saying anything and I might reference 12-step get support, fight, find people with similar experiences, not people that haven't had the experience, because in the similar experiences there's a container. That's how. That's just priceless, priceless, priceless, priceless and uh, and that's enough for me.

Speaker 2:

Let let's hear what else Dana has to say and put on a seatbelt, remember to take plenty of breaths and pause and take some time if you need. And again, let us know if there's any questions or any nuances that I'm missing during the interview that you'd like to hear more of. Let's hear from Dana now. Yeah, just your curiosity and wanting to understand how the world works, and then the ability to get back into your body and start to ground and find yourself sounds incredibly loving, kind, healing and created space for you for this next chapter of your life. So you're 26, you're pregnant. What's that moment that you decide, hey, it's time to reach out to mom. What, what happened? Did it just? You wake up one morning like what, what did that look like?

Speaker 1:

I remember feeling this maternal instinct and I always knew I would be a mother or wanted to be a mother, and I remember this feeling of a mother wouldn't actually just leave her children, I mean, unless something had gone terribly wrong. It just goes against nature. I can't imagine how a mother would do that. And again, I had memories of my mother as this gentle, loving mother. It's not like I remembered her as drug addicted or abusive or anything like that. So I just thought it doesn't make sense that she just abandoned us. And I have a daughter now and I want to just look deeper into this mother-daughter relationship that went terribly wrong and that I missed out on. And so I reached out to her and asked if she wanted to get together, and she did. And so we met halfway between our two homes at this big shopping mall. And you know, she was a stranger to me at this point because, again, I didn't have access to the feelings of love, and I think you really have to be open to building a brand new relationship perhaps if you don't have access to those feelings.

Speaker 1:

Well, that day was. It was very interesting. I remember thinking, seeing her and knowing, oh, we look alike and we have similar temperaments but we're strangers and we sat down in a coffee shop or restaurant and I heard her whole story and it resonated of yes, of course. Of course this is how it happened. I knew it all along, so none of it was really surprising. And I wish I could say at that point we just reconnected and lived happily ever after. But it didn't go that smoothly. You know, it was a, it was the beginning of something, and I wish I had been, we had both been yet more ready than we were at that point.

Speaker 2:

And out of curiosity, you said you couldn't really feel anything. Your mom was a stranger, just kind of like meeting her for the first time as an adult. And as you're talking to her, did you access feelings of love, hurt, anger, Like did you actually feel something at that time in your body?

Speaker 1:

I felt a lot of empathy for her. You know her telling her story and I also attempted to tell her a bit about how it was for me. But I also sensed that was really hard for her to hear. So I held back because I think she needed to believe that I was okay during all that, during those years, and so part of me felt like I have empathy for her and she's a loving person and my mother. But I also still can't share all of my feelings or what happened with me, my perspective and my experiences. I can't it's not, I can't share them with her fully because it's too hard for her. So, but the grief came after I went home. It was like an iceberg breaking up and just all this grief of wow, I was robbed of my mother, she was robbed of her children, this shouldn't have been and then anger toward my father. So those feelings absolutely came up in Warheart.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, that's a lot to process in this idea, when you were talking to your mom and you couldn't really share your story and you had to basically take care of your mother. You know, to some degree Do you regret that, would you have liked to have shared your story more fully or just wasn't the appropriate time, and you're really happy with that decision that you made.

Speaker 1:

I feel like it was the right thing to not go more into. You know my story of victimhood. I would have liked if she understood what it was like for me. I think now parents have so much more awareness and so much more information available to them of you know. This is what the alienated children's experience is and this is the trauma for them.

Speaker 1:

But she didn't have that back then. So I completely understand the limited information she had and also why it was hard for her to hear that. It was so hard for me. You know why she needed to believe that I was okay, that my father had been a decent parent, and of course she wanted to believe that. So I wish I had done more of trying to just start a new relationship with her from where we were and less wanting to talk about the past.

Speaker 1:

And I know this is probably a bit unusual, because usually I hear alienated parents being told don't talk about the past with each other and just, you know, have coffee with them, just listen or be in the present for now. But I actually wanted to bring up the whole story and talk it through and think that was really hard for her. I think it felt like I was wanting to just rip the bandaid off, like let's just talk it all out, face the pain, and she didn't have the tools for that at the time, and that was you know. Looking back, I wish I handled that differently, and so, even at 26, I don't feel like I was adequately prepared for this reunion. I feel like I would have done it so differently today.

Speaker 2:

Well, that is super, super powerful and just this idea of adults you at 26, and your mom was probably in her mid 4040s coming into a conversation and still still being ill-equipped. It's a super challenging conversation to have and how do you navigate the past and how do you just go forward and not talk about the past? It sounds super, super crazy. Making actually. But this idea that, um, you say that you have some regret, that you would have liked to just meet your mother where she was and just seen what it would be like to have a conversation with this person about what was happening in the present moment and, potentially, what the future could look like. That's one significant thing I heard you say you'd like to change. Is there anything else about that initial meeting or the initial reach out with some experience and some time, that you think you'd like to do differently or would have liked to do differently?

Speaker 1:

Yes, I wish that I had really faced my fear over reuniting and realized how much I was over focusing on my father's reaction to it and my sister's reaction to it, and even my stepmother, and you know what would they think and what would they say and how will they handle this. And you know, can I really keep it a secret? And if I don't keep it a secret there, you know I will be exiled from that family of origin. I wish I had faced all of that head on, perhaps stayed in therapy through it, because I think I could have used some support and seeing it from my own perspective instead of in this codependent way of. You know I'm going to upset the apple cart and the status quo been more just acknowledged that I what thinking about, what did I want and what did I have a right to.

Speaker 1:

And I think you know that's that's the thing with, even as adults, alienated children can be so committed and programmed to keep one parent happy or, you know, satisfied that they completely miss what they want and what they deserve and that it's their life and there is empowerment in their own choices. And, yes, it will upset the other parent, you know, if you choose to share it and you don't even have to share your relationship. But if you choose to or need to or you have to build a tolerance for their disapproval and let their disapproval show you who they are, you know they're disapproving of you having an adult relationship with your other parent. What does that say?

Speaker 2:

Well, that's super powerful when you talk about this process that you're going through as an alienated young adult and thinking about the other relatives and your sister and your dad and the stepmom and all these intricacies that are coming in, because when I'm listening to your story I don't even think of that because I've never had your lived experience. But hearing that is really poignant and powerful and such a great lesson for us parents and grandparents to understand another complexity of just a child reaching out and all those other leverage points and pressure points. And then I think you said the most important stuff is you lost yourself again, like what did you want? What did you need, what was really important in your life? And, yeah, unwinding that programming that you're talking about, that's insanity.

Speaker 1:

Right and I think that, having been through really any abuse as a child, but certainly this type of abuse you have to. What I learned very late was you can't always trust your emotions. So it might actually feel good to appease the parent who wants the alienation to continue. And I do recall the first time I addressed it with my father and I didn't have the knowledge that I have now. So when he told me how he felt like a victim and how he thought he was doing what was right, I didn't have the knowledge yet to say, oh, that's the script of the alienating parent. Of course he's going to say that that would have been helpful if I knew. Instead, it just felt good to say, okay, okay, dad, I understand. It actually can feel good to do the wrong thing. It can feel good to relinquish your power of choice because you've been programmed to be so hyper-focused on keeping that parent's emotions regulated. So sometimes you have to decide.

Speaker 2:

You're ready to be very uncomfortable for a very good reason feelings and power and agency to your dad is so familiar that it makes sense, because the familiarity breeds comfort and you think you're getting some relief. But in in reality you're just kind of perpetuating the alienation yourself right at this particular yourself oppressed yeah yeah, wow.

Speaker 2:

Well, that's craziness and just for like for parents out there that that might find themselves in a similar situation. Looking back on this reunion with your mother, what would you have wished would have happened differently with this meeting with your mom? From the parents' perspective? What would you have liked her to show up with? How would you like have that to be indifferent to? Maybe, I don't know, hold you in a different way?

Speaker 1:

I think that she was careful to not push herself on me and she was afraid understandably that you know what if it didn't work out? She was afraid of being hurt Again. She was already traumatized. She was not healed from her trauma at all and, yes, of course I wish she had done more healing. I guess I wish she had had well, I don't want to say more courage, because I do think she thought she was doing the right thing, but had reached out to me more instead of feeling too afraid to push herself on me. I wish she had suggested, you know, let's meet again. How about this day? How about that day?

Speaker 1:

Because it was too easy and comfortable, in a way, for us to both go back to our respective lives and do this dance of, you know, fear and hesitation and you know, letter writing and eventually emails, but not very much meeting up in person, and her waiting for me to suggest it, me waiting for her.

Speaker 1:

I don't think either of us were ready or very well equipped for a really successful, lasting reunion. So it was pretty messy and I felt like I wanted her to understand the position I was in and how scary it was for me, and she made a comment at one time of your father controlled me through our marriage and now he's controlling you. And instead of just reflecting on that, I sort of snapped at her and said, well, you're the one who left me with him. Said, well, you're the one who left me with him, because I think part of me felt like, well, of course, I was four years old when I was left with him to, you know, survive. So I think I just needed her to understand the programming a little more, and I don't fault her at all for the approaches she did take. I mean, you know, no one has no one has a roadmap for this.

Speaker 2:

Right, that would be useful, and the thing that I heard you talk about a couple of times was continuing therapy through this reunion and I'm thinking having more community to be able to talk to about this. Other people that have had experience, like in retrospect, if your mother had some kind of community someplace where she was processing and getting support, if you had community someplace that you were and get in support, like that would be something you'd suggest to anyone listening to the show that's in this position from either direction. Go, do some work, go get some resources, build some kind of community. So when you step into this, you're not stepping in it by yourself or with this default family that has all their own opinions and stuff going on. You're actually showing up in your own power.

Speaker 1:

Yes, absolutely. That's such good advice because you can feel like you're the only one who has ever gone through this, that surely no one else is experiencing this. You know until you learn otherwise.

Speaker 2:

And you spoke also about this thing when you were reconnecting with your mom about who was going to make the next move to to arrange the next meeting, and you were in fear and self-doubt and she was in fear and self-doubt and you both had your lives going on. How would you talk about that today if you were to do it all over again and you were just having this conversation with your mom right now and you just ended the conversation? What would you ask for? Would you bring up, like the subject, so there would be some kind of container or some kind of agreements before you left the table so you could navigate this more easily?

Speaker 1:

Oh, that's a good question. I think it would have been helpful to well. I mean, if the two of us could have gone to therapy together, perhaps for a few sessions. That might have been incredibly helpful. Or at least you know each of us separately, I think if we had agreed upon, okay, once a month let's meet in the same place, and just had that routine, that would have been nice.

Speaker 1:

And if I had, just as I've said, not put so much focus on how will I explain to my family of origin that we're reconnecting, you know, if I just didn't focus on that at all and built up a relationship with her, then I could have dealt with. You know, how do I deal with my family of origin, because I, you know, I had support from my husband completely of building this relationship, and I was a mother at the time, of young children too, though, so I was very caught up in that and being present to my children, and there were concerns of my sister also had young children. We spent some time together. So now there are cousins and another generation, and well, if I'm going to say, oh, and, by the way, I'm having a relationship with my mother again, of course, intellectually I knew I have every right to, but emotionally that programming was was still there Like well they'll, they will all reject me. And then I've upset everything and I wish I just didn't put so much weight on that.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, I can't imagine the pressure of that, of being that four years old, losing your mother, and now you're at 27, 28. You have your own kids and you're at that same decision point where you could potentially lose the other part of your family, depending on what you're you're doing Like how. How do you even process that? That sounds crazy. And having young kids did your mom get to meet the kids? Did that ever happen? And if it did happen, what did that look like?

Speaker 1:

It did happen, and she was very happy to meet them. They were very young, and I think they were just a small handful of times that we met together with my children, though, and then things took a negative turn, where I can't remember the exact details right now, but it was, I guess, a series of events and it is all in my memoir. But she eventually moved away and our communications dwindled after that, and it's partly why I wrote the book, though, because I have such deep regret of that time and of how, of what I could have done differently and I'm sure my mother had some regret too, but I, you know, we can only control what we do and I certainly held regret for that time, and I thought well, if my story can shed light for somebody else, perhaps for other adult alienated children going through this, they might do something different, because you don't want to live with that regret of not reaching out to that parent or not, you know, doing your best to reestablish connection.

Speaker 2:

Sure, and just for some perspective. This was like 28 or so. You're just getting to meet your mom, and then how many years did you have some form of contact? And then when did she move and the contact dwindled and then has it ended. Is your mom still with us? What does that look like today?

Speaker 1:

She's not with us anymore. She died. I think it's been about three years now I did. There was, oh, I think, over 10 years that we did have some contact. She also tried reaching out to my sister. My sister didn't respond.

Speaker 1:

I think that was traumatic for her and she eventually became pretty isolated, very isolated where she was.

Speaker 1:

She was in another abusive relationship because, as I said, she never healed from her first abusive marriage and so she went into another one and then a third, at least three, you know a third abusive relationship that she was in currently when we were reconnecting, and so I'm not sure how much of it was my sister not responding to her, how much of it was the reconnection with me not going smoothly or how much was the abusive situation she was in at the time that led her to really just, I think, self-protecting and isolating, and then I just couldn't reach her anymore as much as I tried.

Speaker 1:

So there, you know, there was some, a lot of regret there, and there was she came to visit her mother in the very you know, not that many years before my mother died herself. She was visiting her mother, who was very sick at the time, and so she was back in my area and we hadn't seen each other in a long time not since she'd moved away and so I arranged for us to meet up. I went out there to visit her and to see my grandmother again, who I had stayed in touch with. I'm glad that we had that day, you know, to see each other again before she went back home to Arizona, and that I was able to tell her that you know she was a good mother and that I loved her. So I did have that, but I had regrets yeah, a lot of regrets.

Speaker 2:

You said that you wrote your memoir you know who an alienated daughter's memoir because you wanted to share your experience with other folks that are that are going through this. And, as you're talking about regret and stuff that you wish would have been different, like what do you want to share with folks out there that might be in a similar situation that to you were when you were in your, you know, mid 20s? What would you like to suggest? Let them know things you would have loved to have done different or suggestions you could make to them? You know, just just to get that out there.

Speaker 1:

I would say to those people learn about coercive control, learn about psychological abuse and how to self-differentiate from your family of origin, how to recover from codependency, from putting your energy into appeasing the person who had coercively controlled you. I think you know education. Learn about that. There's so many. There's so much information now. There are so many people that can help you learn about that Jerry Wise, dr Romani or Romano there are many.

Speaker 1:

And those therapists or psychologists don't just talk about parental alienation. In fact, they might not talk about it at all, but you can glean a lot of insights from just learning about that psychological abuse and how to go through the discomfort of recovering and healing. And I understand people wanting to avoid that and stay numb to that or just avoid it altogether because it's a dark place to go to face that abuse. It's really can be scary and dark, but your happiness and your growth is on the other side of that and there's no way around it. You've got to go through it and and the reward is there and the healing is there. So, yes, it takes courage, but you've got to do it.

Speaker 2:

you've got to do it yourself, or you know with help, but you've got to make the decision and it's worth it so I'm hearing education, doing your own immersion, emotional and spiritual work, getting into some kind of grounding, embodying exercises, yoga, like all those things have all been transformational and you talk about your experience in your memoir, with all these different tools, I'm presuming.

Speaker 1:

Yes, I do. I do at least touch upon it.

Speaker 2:

Just to circle back to your dad. You have this conversation with your dad, you hear his story and he's giving you the script, the program. He's just kind of like you know, pushing on those buttons that he installed and you're ready and giving you the script and you're like, oh cool, and kind of like, step back from that. What happened in your relationship with your father after that? And what does it look like today? Like how has that changed or not changed?

Speaker 1:

yeah, yeah. So I broached the subject with him in adulthood at one point and it didn't go well and I backed down and I was not fully educated on alienation at that point. And then many more years went by, just you know, things went along pretty status quo. I was just quietly in touch with my mother. And much more recently, very recently, just a few years ago actually, it was after my mother died I had a conversation with my sister and I said I am going to tell dad that our mother died, because that's a normal thing to do, to tell your parent that your other parent has died. And I'm not, you know, I'm done normalizing things that are wrong and toxic. So I, finally, I got up the courage to call my father, but I knew that I wasn't calling just to say that. I knew I was calling to say everything I hadn't said yet and to not back down. And so I did. On that phone call I told him you know my truth and I didn't back down. And at the end of the conversation, at one point, he said well, if you need to disown me or write me off, I understand I'll be heartbroken. Disown me or write me off, I understand I'll be heartbroken, but to me I interpreted that as I felt like he would rather cut all ties than be in relationship with me if I was going to persist in that this was the truth or that his wife, my stepmother, was going to hear about it my truth. And so we hung up and weeks went by and my sister was trying to get him to reach out to me, and to no avail. And then I made the decision that if I couldn't be in a room with my father, how would I go to my nephew's wedding, for example, or a funeral or some event that my adult children wanted to go to, and my or something, with my sister? And I did not want the drama of a complete cutoff of oh, we cannot be, you know, in a room together where you've cut all ties. And so I did not regret the conversation because I didn't expect I think you can't go at it expecting the person to apologize or take responsibility I really just did it for myself, because I needed to express and say what I needed to say and to just speak my truth.

Speaker 1:

And to you know, I speak about the topic and I write about the topic, so I felt like I owed it to myself and even to my father to say this is what I believe and I talk and write about this. I didn't get into my memoir with him, but I need to say the truth in order to live in integrity on this. I can't let you think I believe your narrative for another day. So I did that and after the weeks went by without speaking, I finally reached out to him and said let's have coffee. We met for coffee and, as you might guess, he said things like well, I was really blindsided that after all these years you would bring that up.

Speaker 1:

If you had a person who was physically can handicapped and they couldn't walk, you wouldn't meet up with them and say, damn it, why aren't you walking? Just walk, you know, in frustration. So I just said you know, dad, I'll agree to, we'll just agree to not address this topic again. And we haven't and we don't spend much time together. I completely accept the limitations of our relationship. I mean, they've been there all along, but I can be at a holiday gathering with him, I can be at a wedding that he's there, we can have pleasantries and I feel calm about it. I'm not triggered, he can't hurt me. Now I feel very just healed and accepting of the past. Because what is my choice? What are my choices? It's better to I feel like I'm at a good place and I even have compassion for what got him to the point where he would do what he did.

Speaker 2:

Right and I'm hearing that conversation with your father was super healing for you. You got to have your voice. You didn't need to shut down or take care of anyone. You just showed up for yourself and also love the decision to just meet your dad where he was at Like. Once you got to take back your power and take back your life and stuff like that that he just didn't become that important anymore.

Speaker 1:

Exactly yeah.

Speaker 2:

That's super cool and, as we're getting near to to wrapping up this interview, which has been incredible you've been fantastic and so many insights and revelations and thank you so much for sharing your story so vulnerably this, uh, this idea of your writing your memoir, of your newsletters, of talking about the stuff that, this idea of service like how has this transformed your life by stepping into this part, of bringing this attention out to people sharing and again, service I'm really like how has service changed your life?

Speaker 1:

I certainly felt or feel vulnerable, sharing and even writing and speaking about it even today a bit because part of me, because I know that there are people in my life who this is their worst nightmare. You know that I'm saying and writing my truth, so I always have to live with that a bit in the background and writing my memoir. It was not completely unselfish, it wasn't completely an act of service, it was also that I needed to. It was my way of making what happened matter. You know, I feel that my mother was diminished, that my, that I was diminished in what happened and it was my way of sort of, I wouldn't say, setting the record straight. But here's my truth, here's how it happened for me. I needed to do that for myself, but in doing that for myself, I have heard from many alienated parents that it was somehow helpful to them and I'm glad for that. I hoped that as well, and I think my even deeper hope is that adult alienated children will come across it and handle things better than you know, differently than I did. It might be too late for me, but it's not too late for a lot of adult alienated children. So I also am cognizant of not making it my identity.

Speaker 1:

You know, being an alienated child, I write about other things. There's always that undertone of healing and authenticity and in everything that I write. But I write about other things as well, in wellness and parenting and in various things. So, in fact, my next book I'm calling Now or Never. I don't know the subtitle yet, but that's what's in the works and I'll be sharing a bit about it in my newsletter. But I'm really really intrigued by the power of choice in the present day because, no matter what has happened to us and you know plenty, plenty of people have gone. Many, many people have gone through trauma, some, you know, some worse than what I have gone through, and so it's really important what do we do with it now and what are we choosing every day to do that is healing and not harming ourselves? We have so much power to choose what we do every day.

Speaker 2:

Well, Dana, thank you for that. And I want to just capture that one little nugget you just shared at the end there, with this idea of that early on we identify as alienation and alienated child and alienated parent and as we go through recovery, that is part of our story, but that is not who we are, that we do not identify with that as we start to recover, and that's a whole show on itself. So I'm not going to dive into that. I'm just going to say thank you for bringing that up and using that as a moment to close the show and thank you for coming out and sharing your story. And again, all of Dana's information is going to be in the show notes, her memoir. There'll be a link to that. There'll also be a link to her newsletter and other ways to get hold of her. And what a phenomenal conversation. Are there any last words you'd like to say as we're saying goodbye to anyone out there? Dana.

Speaker 1:

Well, I just want to say thank you to you for having me and for the work that you do, and I welcome people to reach out to me through my website or my newsletter and, if you are alienated from a child, to not lose hope and to take good care of yourself. Thank you.

Speaker 2:

Dana Wow, these are like big, long wows. What a great service Dana has provided to the community today and to me personally to share her story. And again, I love hearing of nuances that I haven't thought of yet. There's times along this journey I read the books, I talk to the professionals, I have the privilege of doing a bunch of different interviews and I think I know something. And then I talked to Dana and she shares a little bit of nuanced intricacies that I just take for granted in this healing journey. So I just say thank you for this.

Speaker 2:

I then this part about I used to identify as alienated and now alienation is part of me. Thank you for the place about, like the, the complexity of having a conversation with your father and, uh, the fear about losing your sister and the other siblings and the other family and just getting left alone again. You know and thank you for really talking about you know coming back to yourself and finding your voice and finding yourself and being able to communicate in a way that was in alignment with who you are today. And then that's part of your healing journey and from that first conversation with your mom at 27, 28 to that conversation with your dad just the trajectory that you shared of how you evolved as a human being and you were finally ready to have that conversation in your own agency in a different kind of way, and that's the story. That is beautiful. Thank you, dana. Again, all Dana's information is in the show notes.

Speaker 2:

If you have anything you want to throw out to me or the team over here because I'm just happen to be one person on the team there's a bunch of people contributing and making this possible, and it's not just me. I'm just a small cog in the mechanism and I'm grateful that I get to be this piece of the cog for right now. So thank you for coming out to play today. Love to hear from you Like, share, donate if that feels appropriate to you. We would love your support and no one's told you yet today.

Speaker 2:

I love you. We would love your support and no one's told you yet today. I love you. I love that we get to do this together and it's crappy that we're here at the same time, but what a great thing that we have a place to be today and if I don't see you in a meeting, I hope to see you around the podcast neighborhood. Have a beautiful day. Thanks for taking the time to join me on this episode of Family Disappeared Podcast. Do you know someone who can benefit from what we're discussing on today's episode? If so, please share this podcast with them and anyone else in your community that might be interested in changing their lives. Together we'll continue the exploring, growing and healing journey. I will see you on our next episode. Until then, happy days to all.