Why Does Family Court Feel So Unpredictable? | Parental Alienation

Lawrence revisits one of the most practical and requested topics in the parental alienation community: family court. Drawing from insights shared by family law attorney Rachel King, he explores what many parents wish they understood before hiring an attorney, representing themselves, or standing before a judge whose decisions may profoundly impact their relationship with their children.

The discussion focuses on preparation, advocacy, communication, courtroom strategy, and emotional regulation during high-conflict custody disputes. Lawrence reflects on how fear, urgency, and grief can influence decision-making, while highlighting tools that help parents stay grounded and informed throughout the legal process. For those navigating parental alienation and family court, this conversation offers realistic guidance, practical wisdom, and a reminder that living fully is not giving up, but an act of love and integrity.

Key Takeaways

• Understanding the judge's style can influence case outcomes
• Always review legal invoices and fee agreements promptly
• Sitting in court proceedings provides valuable insights into judicial behavior
• Effective communication and emotional regulation are crucial in court
• Preparation and knowledge of evidence rules can prevent case setbacks

Chapters

00:00 - Introduction: The Chaos of Family Court
01:02 - Revisiting Key Points from Rachel King's Interview
01:56 - The Importance of Court Preparation and Self-Advocacy
04:13 - Understanding Court Rules, Expectations, and Judge Behavior
06:32 - Managing Legal Fees and Billing Transparency
08:25 - Self-Representation: Pros, Cons, and Critical Tips
14:15 - Observing Court Proceedings to Gain Insights
16:01 - The Judicial Process and Judge Selection
18:24 - The Impact of Court Procedures on Your Case
20:47 - Continuous Learning and Emotional Self-Care
22:01 - Final Thoughts: Support, Resources, and Community

Support & Community:

Parental Alienation Anonymous (PAA): Join our free 12-step support group with 16 online meetings weekly for parents, grandparents, family members, and previously alienated individuals seeking healing and recovery.

PA-A.org: Parental Alienation Advocates is a 501(c)(3) nonprofit dedicated to fostering education, advocacy, and support for individuals grappling with the distressing impact of parental alienation, estrangement, erasure, and family disconnection.

All our services are free and sustained by grants and community donations. Your support helps us continue offering these vital resources.
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Email your questions or insights: familydisappeared@gmail.com
Like, share, and comment to help us reach more families in need.

If you wish to connect with Lawrence Joss or any of the PA-A community members who have appeared as guests on the podcast:
 
 Email - familydisappeared@gmail.com
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(All links mentioned in the podcast are available in Linktree)

This podcast is made possible by the Family Disappeared Team:
Anna Johnson- Editor/Contributor/Activist/Co-host
Glaze Gonzales- Podcast Manager

Connect with Lawrence Joss:
Website: https://parentalalienationanonymous.com/
Email-         familydisappeared@gmail.com

Transcript

Why Family Court Feels Random

SPEAKER_01 0:00

Are you in the middle of family court? Do you walk into court just like what is going to happen a day? Like you thought there was going to be some kind of predictability when you walked into family court. You thought you had understanding of how it was going to go. And every day it's like a different thing. The judge seems to say something different, or your attorney's giving you different direction, or the other attorney's throwing random stuff out there, and the whole process is just driving you crazy. There's a continuance, there's an emotion, there's paperwork, there's all this stuff. And on top of that, one judge can make different rulings than another judge. There's like a complete lack of inconsistency. Are you experiencing this? Well, I know that I did.

Series Kickoff And Community Resources

SPEAKER_01 0:43

Today we're going to be diving back into secrets lawyers don't tell you. And we're going to be revisiting an old podcast from an attorney, Rachel King, and talk about some of the salient points that she brought up as part one of two of our master series on family court, why it sucks, how hard it is, how to prepare for yourself, what's the best way to show up prepared and ready for what might and is going to happen. And if you're new to the community, welcome to Family Disappeared Podcasts. We've got 140 some odd podcasts already in the can, covering all kinds of topic. This full interview is already in there with Rachel King, but we're just updating it and adding some new information and bringing it down to the salient points because we think that's going to be really useful. And if you're a regular to the community, I hope you enjoy this new format. We are a 501c3 nonprofit. Please donate, support us. You can always reach us at familydisapeed at gmail.com. Love to hear your comments, suggestions, different topics, different ideas that you'd like us to talk about. And there is a free 12-step meeting, Parental Alienation Anonymous, that we always talk about. All this wonderful stuff is in the show notes. And that's it. That's it. That's it for me today. So we're going to be sharing about actional strategies. We're going to be talking about what self-representation can look like, what it can't look like, what the pitfalls are, what are the things that you might be able to do by yourself, and what are things that you actually need someone that's trained in the law to help you move through the process. And these are just different strategies and ideas that have been shared with us by multiple attorneys. And we are concentrating on one specific interview today, but we will be weaving in and out of a bunch of different resources that have been shared with the community over the past three years. And no matter what you take away from this episode, the idea that there is a judge that is going to make life-altering decisions in your case and how to prepare for that is the single most salient, important piece of advice that I've ever heard. And in all the different interviews that I've done, that is the one thing that I would go to immediately if I was going to get sucked into family court with a particular judge. And we'll get to that later in the episode.

Aligning Goals With Your Attorney

SPEAKER_01 2:56

So, like any other relationship, communication is essential. That includes with your attorney. Like if you have mismatched goals, you're going to waste money and time. Some attorneys communicate really clearly. Some you've got to go through 12 steps to actually be talking to their attorney, and you're always talking to someone underneath them, and they're just getting parts of the information. So it's really, really critical to understand what you want in this relationship. Like if you were going to go out into the dating world today and decide that you wanted to date, like you'd have to consider who you'd want to date, how you'd like to date, where you want to date, and why you want to date. And it's the same thing with any of these relationships, with any of these other stakeholders that you're going to encounter in the family court system and outside of the family court system. You know, this is all related to parental alienation, estrangement, erasure, whatever you want to call it. And there's a lot of funky stakeholders in this community. There's some people doing some wonderful work, and there's other people that are just trying to make a bunch of money. And then there's other people that are in between. So part of this conversation today is really how do we advocate for ourselves? How do we prepare ourselves? What do we need to know about going to court, hiring an attorney, what that looks like, advocating, advocating, advocating. And we can't turn around three years later, which I did. And I've heard other people tell the story and say, hey, someone did something to me. Like the information that's available now is incredible. I didn't have access to this. And so many other parents and grandparents and people affected by any form of this, whether the child, young adult, didn't have access to this kind of information. So it's paramount to prepare, listen, understand that you are getting into a relationship. Be specific about the questions you want to ask. You don't just read an ad that this person has experience with parental alienation. You want to know what that means, what it has looked like. So it's confusing because when you go to an attorney, at least for me, there was many things that I wanted at the same time, right? I wanted my kids back. I didn't want to waste a bunch of money. I wanted everything to happen really quickly, and I wanted all these different things and I had an expectation that all these things could happen at the same time. I don't want to burst your bubble, or if you're in the middle of this, the reality of it as you're experiencing now is it just takes time. You really got to align what your expectations are, what your value is, what your timeline is, and be realistic about it and really tend to what needs to get tended to in an orderly way. And it doesn't mean the other stuff is not important. It just means you're entering a house that has specific rules. Like some people say, hey, take off your shoes at the door. Like the court system has particular rules, laws, and inconsistencies, just like take your shoes off at the door might mean outside or inside, or maybe there's a shoe rack. And unfortunately, because the family court system wasn't set up initially to support families going through acrimonious divorce, going through fighting over kids and money and all these different things, like the rules are funky and they shift and change. And that lack of consistency makes it very challenging for folks navigating the system, especially with unrealistic expectations from watching a TV show where you go in, you demand the stuff, you're the good person, you're doing the right stuff, and everything works out in your favor. That's unfortunately a fairy tale. So let's see on what Rachel has to say about

Fees, Invoices, And Self-Advocacy

SPEAKER_01 6:21

that.

SPEAKER_00 6:21

Sometimes it's truly a matter of understanding the process. If you want to be done immediately, it costs money. You're either giving up the money you were otherwise entitled to, or you're paying money that you maybe shouldn't have because you're taking all of the conflict away.

SPEAKER_01 6:38

So this is going to sound intuitive, silly, useful, and scary, I think, all at the same time. Always review your fee agreements and invoices from your attorney. Again, we're in a relationship with someone. And unfortunately, there's multiple parties generally, I'd say most of the time, but generally involved in this relationship with your attorney, right? There's the secretaries, there's paralegals, there's all these other infrastructure inside. So when billing happens, you have multiple people doing multiple things at the same time. So part of your agency is to actually review the fee agreements and the invoices immediately when you get them and address anything that's coming up. And I know this might sound scary. And again, for me it did, because my whole fear of abandonment came up. I just want to get my kids back. I just want to get through this process. So if I actually say, hey, this is wrong, then they're going to stop working for me. They're going to stop doing that. And it's not like that. It's not personal. They're just doing their thing. They're running through a mechanism, and sometimes it's just through a machine or whatever it is. But part of staying sane and emotionally sober through this whole thing is advocating for yourself. Check the invoices, check the fee agreements, stay on top of it. I know I just buried my head in the sand for months. And then I pop out and I get stuff, and there's bills, and there's this, and then the inundation from the money that was just growing, you know, like a tree. And it's like, like, how can I keep paying this and doing this? And I'm just trying not to die. And I just want to see my kids. I just want to see my kids. Like, stop sending me papers with my kids. God, God, just bring up bringing up a lot of emotion. But I think you're going through this too. So it's really important. Advocate, look at these things. You need to need to, you don't need to do anything. Suggested is to create a healthy relationship in the beginning where you have boundaries, where you have expectations set, where you're actually calling people into a conversation if something doesn't look right. And this is one of the hardest things to do with an attorney, because if you don't set this expectation and you're not having these open and honest conversations, then unfortunately you're just falling into this flow of mix that's going on, and you kind of get lost in the system sometimes, even in the system on the people that are supposed to be on your side. And it is just a system. Unfortunately, you're a number in the system, and there might be 10, 20, a thousand people represented to some degree by a large law firm. Advocate for yourself. Rachel's going to talk a little bit about this from an attorney's perspective. And she's also going to tell you like this is what you need to do. And it's not personal. So let's jump into what she has to say.

SPEAKER_00 9:14

Read your invoices as soon as you get them from your attorney. And if you're not getting invoices, you want to ask for invoices so you can see where all of the fees are coming from and what they are. Many people sign their fee agreements without fully understanding them. And then they come back and they say, Oh gosh, I didn't realize this is so expensive. I'm upset with my fees.

Self-Representation, Deadlines, And Evidence

SPEAKER_01 9:37

Another big topic that comes up when we start talking about attorneys and fees and money and time and stuff is like, can you represent yourself? And part of the conversation with Rachel was, yeah, absolutely you can represent yourself, but you need to understand the legal standards and expectations. And it's critical if you don't do that. You're going to get lost and you're going to get sucked in a direction that you don't see coming because you don't know what the standards are. And it's counterintuitive because success is defined differently by law versus our personal experiences. Right? Like we might feel like we're winning a victory, but the law is actually supporting something else that's good and put in place that actually is not really what we're expecting it to be. So like the emotional highs and lows as you're dealing with family court are brutal. And again, if you're in the middle of this, like really, really, really resourcing yourself. And we're talking specifically about representing yourself, dealing with the attorney, how to advocate for yourself, but you need to be doing the emotional work at the same time. Whether that's through something like Parental Alienation Anonymous, the free 12-step program that's part of our nonprofit or another support group or through a spiritual support group, you need to be doing the emotional work. You need to be learning how to communicate. You need to be learning how to regulate yourself or somehow co-regulate yourself with some kind of practice before you go into court, before you show up in these conversations. Because the more regulated you are, the more emotionally prepared you are, the better you're going to be able to achieve the goals that you're looking for.

unknown 11:13

Right.

SPEAKER_01 11:14

And you're like, hey, I just want my kids back. What does it have to do with how I communicate or how I show up in court or if I regulate or co-regulate? Like you might not even understand what that means. But if like I'm having anxiety or I'm being super reactive, or I'm just, I wanna, I wanna win, I wanna win, I want people to hear me. If they just hear me, everything will be okay. All those things are gonna disrupt and throw your case sideways. They're not gonna be useful. It's not gonna be represented in a light where in an institution like a courtroom, they're not gonna support that. It's gonna usually play against you. So it's really important. I don't care if you're with an attorney, if you're representing yourself, is really taking care of yourself emotionally. And Rachel has some stuff to say about this, so we're gonna listen to that.

SPEAKER_00 12:00

Some judges will give you leniency the first couple of times you say it. After that, they're just gonna start ruling against you because you have to understand the procedures and the deadlines. The most successful self-represented individuals are ones that keep their emotions out of it and only apply the law.

SPEAKER_01 12:17

A really challenging part of representing yourself is the rule of evidence. And the rule of evidence, we're really concentrating on text, messages, photos, even testimony. You know, knowing what the evidence rules are prevents certain things from not getting accepted into evidence. Like a lot of stuff will get rejected if you're not fully prepared and you don't really know how to present the evidence. So representing yourself, again, we're saying yes, you can do that. And having an attorney or having another resource that can help you figure out how to do that in the best fashion is going to be incredibly important. So Rachel talks a little bit about the advantages about having an attorney and also some tips on how you can resource yourself in in different ways and what resources are available in case you do decide that representing yourself feels like the only financial avenue that's available to you, or maybe it's the only avenue that you really, really want to explore. So again, prepare, listen, and let's see what Rachel has to say about it as well.

SPEAKER_00 13:21

Your two disadvantages are one, the attorney knows the judge's lingo. And two, attorneys, we understand the rules of evidence, and the rules of evidence are probably the biggest hiccup that self-represented people have because they don't understand that you can get evidence thrown out like crazy because you didn't do the right thing.

SPEAKER_01 13:41

Okay. This is by far, in my experience, the best advice I've ever heard any attorney give.

Watch The Judge And Adapt

SPEAKER_01 13:51

And Rachel spoke about this more in depth on the podcast that we have previously done. It's like we need information. And in parental alienation, like so much of the information we're doing is we'll go into books, Google, friends, family, support groups, wherever, and we're getting all this information. Some of it's good, some of it's not good. We go to kind of like discern what to do. But one thing that you don't hear a lot of people doing is you don't hear a lot of people that are getting sucked into the family court system go in to sit in open court. And Rachel talks about this tip. This is a gold standard tip that she gives. She says, go sit in a proceeding that the judge is doing for someone else. See how the judge talks, what they listen to, what they reject, you know, what their cadences are, what their expectations are from their attorneys, from the people that are representing themselves, from the people that are being witnesses or supplying some information. It's an incredibly wonderful tool to get a step ahead of this massive ordeal you're undertaking. Go invest the time sitting in court several times with the judge that's going to be over here in your case. You're going to learn so much stuff. You're even going to have information to bring back to your attorney, possibly. And your attorney might know the judge and might know the cadences and how they present and stuff, but you can definitely change your behavior and modify what you're doing because you're going to see this judge reaming people out, getting frustrated, and you're also going to see the judge engaging with certain people. And you're going to have to figure out what it is that the judge liked about that, right? A judge is just another human being like you and I. They have a robe on, they've done whatever education and time they've needed, and now they're the judge. We need to understand. We need to understand how this person operates, moves, and we need to act accordingly in their space because it is their house. If they have a no-shoe policy, they got a no-shoe policy. Figure it out. And again, I'm so appreciative to Rachel for bringing this up. And uh, she's going to talk a little bit more about that right now.

SPEAKER_00 15:56

Family law court proceedings are open to the public. Watch the judge, how they react to certain word choices, what arguments they seem to appreciate and then rule in favor of. That can really help you as you're crafting how you're going to present to the judge.

SPEAKER_01 16:14

That's great information. You know, where Rachel talks a little bit more about this and the idea of uh, you know, kind of like going to a restaurant and deciding what meal we want to eat. Court doesn't work that way. You know, you get put somewhere and that's who you get to work with. And it's called um, I think she calls it forum shopping, but we're gonna we're gonna hear from her right now and she'll give us a little bit more information on the judicial process and the judge and how it gets assigned, and that's where you live. You know what I mean? Like you don't get a choice, you don't get to move generally.

SPEAKER_00 16:42

It's called forum shopping. It's not allowed. I am much more interested in making sure that we have a really locked solid strategy, and then again, going and seeing how this judge wants me to present. I am totally happy to change my presentation style for a particular judge. What is not possible is to decide that you don't like your judge's decision. So you want a new judge to file again.

SPEAKER_01 17:10

Rachel's gonna share some real life stories just to let you know about procedures and policies and the law and just to show how dramatically they can affect your lives. And uh, she used an example of a lady that trials to an a la marriage in uh Las Vegas. And uh it's funny because I can relate to how ridiculous some of the things that I've tried have turned out to be. In my head, they were they were great ideas, they were they were gold standard, but uh man, man, did they make a mess. But um, let's listen to the story quickly.

SPEAKER_00 17:45

She really didn't want to be married, and the judge, after all of this, looked at her and said, it just doesn't meet the legal basis of an annulment. So I'm denying your annulment, and you can go back to square one and file for divorce. And this poor woman was just sitting there like she was devastated.

SPEAKER_01 18:03

So I think the takeaway here is always consult qualified legal resources. You know what I mean? Whether it's hiring an attorney or going to some of the resources Rachel King spoke about or some of the news sources that are manifesting now, which I'm not up to speed on the AI stuff and what's coming out and what's useful and what's not. But educate, make sure you understand the lore, the procedures, the judge, because unfortunately, a step can have serious ramifications on your case. And it could be an extra six months, year, two years, three years. Like I see it all the time when people go in dysregulated and their behaviors cause the judge to have an idea of who they are, and then it's projected on them through the whole case, and maybe three years in, maybe there's a shift. So, like these things are important, you know, resource yourself emotionally, spiritually, you know, learn how to talk in a way where you're not just blasting emotion out because that's just not gonna work. You know what I mean? You need to be regulated, you need to find a way to take care of yourself, and there's so many wonderful tools we've spoken about on different episodes that you can go look to, you know, breathing, tapping, you know, you can Google it and find a bunch of stuff. So just to summarize the winning strategies a little bit more cohesively, observe your judge. Get to know your judge, their voices, their cadence, what they do in court. You know what I mean? Understand the rules, the procedures, the deadlines, especially, especially if you're gonna be self-representing, you need to educate yourself. And it takes a lot of strength and a lot of energy. And I've heard people be successful at it, and I've heard people make a mess of it. So take the time to educate yourself and keep emotion in check. Judges are gonna go sideways on you, other attorneys are gonna reference it and weaponize it against you. Take care of yourself emotionally and spiritually, and communicate. Figure out how you're communicating. Every email matters, every text matters, what's coming out of your mouth matters. You know what I mean? Maybe take a pause. Think about what you're about to say. Think about is it necessary to say this? Is it necessary to say it now? You know what I mean? You don't have to get everything out in that particular moment if you're not feeling regulated. But really be conscientious of the communication piece. It's it's it's paramount. It's a gold standard, like going to watch the judge. It might even be more important if I can't communicate clearly in an efficient way where I'm not just blasting emotions out and projecting a bunch of stuff onto people. I think in most situations I'm at a deficit before I even walk in the door. And some practical tips, learn from stories. You know what I mean? Rachel's new book. I think it should be out by now. Getting divorced now. There's also a self-represented workbook that that goes on it, and there's other tips that she has on TikTok and some other social media sites are fantastic. Keep keep learning, keep reading, keep listening to people's stories. The beautiful thing about the availability of all this information now is we don't have to make the same mistakes that other people made. Well, thank you for coming out today and playing in the sandbox. I hope it was useful to kind of like bring all this material together. And this is a part one of kind of like a mini masterclass. We're going to jump into a different attorney who has some different ideas and must probably reinforce some of these same ideas in an upcoming episode, which will, you know, be the second part of this masterclass. And again, incredibly useful to be prepared, understand the family court system, know what you're getting into. And unfortunately, it's in every part of the system. It's with the attorneys, with the therapists, with the ad lightems, even with the ex. You know what I mean? There's so many different places that we need to be cognizant and aware of how we're communicating. And again, it's wonderful to have you here. If you're new, welcome. Great, great resources in the show notes. All of Rachel King's information will be in there. If you want to follow up, listen to her old episode, or just uh get some information if it feels interesting. And uh, we are a 501c3 nonprofit, donate, right? You're not donating for yourself, as I say often, you're donating for the person that hasn't found us yet, so we can continue to reach out that we can continue to make free content. And hope you have a beautiful day. If no one's told you yet today, I love you. Family court system is brutal. And if you're in it, man, person, just get some help, get some support, join a support group. You know what I mean? Get professional help, whatever it looks like. You're gonna need that. It's a tedious, challenging journey. And having a community of people that have been through it or are going through it, but are also working on themselves emotionally, spiritually, physically, communicating is so, so, so, so valuable. So, so valuable to see people doing it a different way. Hope you have a beautiful day. Hope to see you around the neighborhood soon. Uh, like, share, let people know what we're doing. People need this information, especially around the family court system. And it might not be an acrimonious divorce, it might not be in parental alienation, but this is useful, practical for information for anyone that's struggling with the the court system. Okay.