WhatNot x Harmony of Hustle

In this episode I did my first live stream podcast on whatnot and talk about the card business and veefriends as a whole. 

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Transcript

Journey of Building a Company

Speaker 1 0:00

This podcast . For those of you who don't know , it's one I started about two years ago and basically it started as a way to document the journey of me building a company . So if you want to listen to the full thing , definitely check it out on Spotify . And I want to start bringing it to whatnot , because I know there's a lot of people on here who have businesses or like business and obviously , as a part of the podcast , I'll be giving away some VFriends cards because that's obviously we're on a VFriends stream , right . And today I just wanted to talk about it's been a while since I've done an episode , so today what I'm going to be talking about is kind of what you don't know until you get to three or four years in . One of the things that took me the longest thing to learn and I learned this painfully was , for any of you who are trying to start a business or you do start a business the decision making . The stakes are way higher because obviously your money's into it . One of the things that I made the mistake of very early on was the appearance of success and wanting to go super quickly to actually make money , because obviously when I started my water treatment company . It was all the money I had from building another company and I think , as a business owner , what can really mess you up is previous success is not indicative of future success and different industries are completely have different obstacles you have to you have to overcome , and I remember at my height of my business , we had 25 people working and I , you know my ego was getting stroked to that point because I was like holy shit , when I started this , this company , um , you know , I I was thinking that it had to run like the last company I helped build , which was really big . And unfortunately , the more people you guys have , especially you're looking at starting a business , a lot of times you're going to have more bloat . We were doing so . Right now , the company we do about 1.1 to 1.2 million a year in top line . Previously we were doing about the same , but I had 20 more people and , as a small business owner , you always think you need more people to make the business function and that's actually not the case . What you need is to have more A players than anything else and unfortunately , you don't really think , you don't really know what an A player is until you actually get to experience them and I thought at the time I had a bunch of A players and I didn't . So last year we actually completely slashed the workforce and now my company is me and two other people . Yet we have made more money than we ever did and we're actually way more efficient than we were previously , which is freaking crazy because it forced us to grow into a different model . So now we do virtual appointments instead of in-home appointments and I didn't realize how much money I was burning . So , even though we were doing 1.2 million in top line , once I actually got a bookkeeper brought in and I didn't realize how much money I was burning . So , even though we were doing 1.2 million in top line , once I actually got a bookkeeper brought in and I looked at the revenue we were doing , we were actually losing anywhere from 5 to 10K a month .

Speaker 1 3:14

Fucking insane right . So there's a quote I love and it's the fastest way to 5 million is not the fastest way to 20 million . And that is so true because I think whenever you start a new adventure and if any of you guys here are looking at starting a new business , there's a lot of inherent fear in that . I was . I was actually talking . I think I was talking to if Joel's in the chat .

Speaker 1 3:35

Um , we had a long conversation and one of the biggest things about starting a business is that inherent fear of what if I fail ? What if I don't make enough money ? How do I do all these things ? I don't know how to do , and what I made the mistake of doing is I tried to outsource that fear very early on and if you actually listen to some of the earlier episodes of this podcast , you'll actually notice that I kind of talk about this . I was like oh , I got all these really good guys I got bringing on who are going to handle operations , handle product development , handle all these different parts of the business . What's funny is if I had just done it myself because these people ended up not being good , they ended up stealing money from the business and they ended up , you know , being let go regardless . So at the end of the day , I had to figure it out anyway up being let go regardless . So at the end of the day , I had to figure it out anyway .

Speaker 1 4:30

If I had just accepted the fear at the beginning , I would have saved the business a shitload of money , and I think at the beginning it's being okay being afraid and understanding that you kind of have to be and instead of trying to find people to quickly solve those problems , or because , let's say , you don't want to learn how to build a website , as like a small example , or you don't want to learn how to build the operations of an organization , like how to hire HR or how to get payroll taxes sent in , or how to do your annual filings with the state these like really annoying dumb things that you have to have in a business . If I just learned those that have hired in for that , I would have been way further along and the business would be in a much better place . Um , because then you also build you as the asset who has to learn all those skills to then implement and find a

Learning Business Lessons the Hard Way

Speaker 1 5:14

players who you know can actually execute . Um , funny enough , I now have actual eight players on the team and it's a night and day difference because the ? A players take things off your plate and if you work for a company right now and you're looking , hey , how do I become the top person in in my industry , best way is take things off the leaders plates .

Speaker 1 5:35

The , the people at the top , generally don't get any support because , especially as a small business , everyone thinks small business owners are making a ton of money and that is not . Not how that works , especially in the first I'd say , one to five years , unless you're coming in just incredibly capitalized , like you did , some good financing rounds Maybe you guys had some investors or things like that that came in Then , yeah , then you know you absolutely . You absolutely then could be making money , but most of the time you're not being able to take things off . The leader's plate will propel you , and that's what my two people do . Now I have a lead installer who's an absolute savage , and I have Michelle who runs now my back office , who literally does everything , and that took three years to cultivate and about 50K in stolen revenue to get to that point .

Speaker 1 6:25

So for those of you trying to start a business , don't make the same mistakes that I made . All right , um , it's not , it is super , not glamorous . And uh , I will tell you , if your goal is to make money , um , starting a business is not the the best way , believe me , and that kind of leads into like whatnot right ? Everyone here that does collective VFriends has seen just how insane this community is , and me , being a business guy . Even with my own company , I have now branched off because I want to start building the ClearWave brand into the whatnot VFriends brand . Any kind of business you want to run using those same business principles is super fundamental . So , with this , learning what I learned from the water business , where I went super , super quickly , brought a lot of people in now we're doing it super slow and building the foundation the right way , and I'm bringing that into the whatnot streams . So that started by setting money aside to buy into breaks and then buying into bulk cards , so that way , we have inventory for these streams and we're doing it at a very slow level . Um , it can be easy .

Speaker 1 7:29

So , especially for you guys who are interested in maybe , uh , becoming more invested in online shopping and starting to pursue that as a career path which , guys , you absolutely should If you are , uh , if you're at all interested in , you know business and you love trading cards this is an insane opportunity for you to get involved in it and , especially with the VFriends community , they are incredibly , incredibly supportive . Doing it the right way is super important . So , let's say you don't have a ton of money to invest . Well , where can you get the best bang for your buck . Well , right now , a bunch of the supply has been ripped . Well , right now , a bunch of the supply has been ripped . So there's a ton of people with a bunch of inventory who aren't sellers or just collectors , who would love to make you know 30 to 40 cents on a dollar on their VFriends collection . So if you want to get into the business , say , okay , I got $300 . Find someone that has and Discord is a great place for this find someone that has a bunch of bulk , buy it and then start doing single streams .

Speaker 1 8:26

For any of you who follow , or in or plugged in to some of the biggest streamers out here , what ? What is one of the most fun shows right now ? It's the AM show , right , am sports cards and his show is so fun because he has so many breaks . He's put a ton of money into , into uh , oh , mine , I appreciate , I appreciate that um , but he's put a ton of time buying . You know breaks and cards and cases and you know to have this amazingly big stream . But me and uh , me and him had a conversation and , for those of you who don't know , he's been doing this for the past five to six years just in the sports card world and it started off super small . So for anyone here that wants to start that is the name of the game Find some money that you can invest into the business , whether it's 300 , 500 , a thousand , get your spreadsheet built out and basically all you're going to do is say , okay , I'm going to try to find collectors I want to offload if they're at between 40 to 70 cents a card , get those cards in and then you sell them as singles on a show and you make anywhere from 15 to 20 cents a card . Right , and it's not going to be a ton of money . You're not going to get rich overnight doing this by any means , but you start to build that base , you start to build that community , and that's the same thing that I've had to do now with the water company . You know we're going to get real , real on this podcast .

Speaker 1 9:39

Um , like I said , if you want to see the journey and see all my mistakes I've made , go to episode one . I've documented it from day one , um now till year three , so you can see the growth in even my own mindset , as I've grown as an entrepreneur over the last three years running a legit home service company , and you know there's so many things that I've done differently . Now , like even in my marketing , I am trying to keep things super lean and I'm trying to go slower . I'm not trying to beat my competition into submission right now , and that was something that was so important to me when I started my water company was I just wanted to absolutely annihilate my competition . I wanted , you know , I just I'm a competitor so I wanted to just rip their throats out , and it basically put the company in a position where we had to keep selling and do better each month because we were overextending our marketing spend . And then , when the van broke , we didn't have enough money for that , so we had to take loans out . And then I had people that stole money , so then I take loans out

Revenue Doesn't Matter, Profit Does

Speaker 1 10:35

for that . And so that was a symptom of just trying to grow so fast to hit these stupid arbitrary numbers . A symptom of just trying to grow so fast to hit these stupid arbitrary numbers . But that was indicative of a really bad problem where my last , my last success almost ruined this one .

Speaker 1 10:53

So for those who don't know the backstory , I got out of the military after 10 and a half years , got into our treatment , started making about 20 K a month in commissions . Um got recruited to help build a solar company as a startup , like a straight startup , and obviously the last company I was at I was making good money but it was such a large company I had no growth . So I went to the solar startup and in 12 months I grew that sales team to where they were doing about 600K in top line revenue and then after that 11 months we did $25 million in top line revenue . I think I made about 350k that year was roughly what my , my , my bring home was . So it's completely changed my life and unfortunately , uh , the ownership at that time was doing some stuff that was out of control .

Speaker 1 11:36

So I made the decision to leave and go out on my own . Why ? Because I just spent the last year building this other company . I felt very confident that I could do it again . Fun fact , sales skills and business skills don't translate as well as you'd hope they would , and I learned that the hard way .

Speaker 1 11:50

But because I had this huge success and I was leaving a team that was already big and cranking , I tried to implement that within my own business my new startup business . That was mine , and because I had just done 25 million in someone else's business , I was like , okay , these are the numbers I need to hit in my company and it conflated what I thought was possible . Just because I was able to do 625 million in a year in that business had no bearing . That I could do it in my business and , to be honest , I wasn't capitalized enough to do it in my business . Right , I had to buy inventory equipment this and , to be honest , I wasn't capitalized enough to do it in my business . Right , I had to buy inventory equipment , salaries , marketing , all these other costs that I just didn't quite understand fully . So I rushed which is funny because Gary V just talked about this on his stream , so this is actually pretty funny I , uh , I rushed to try to get those arbitrary revenue numbers .

Speaker 1 12:40

And here's what's funny , here's what's really funny that first year I hit one of those arbitrary revenue numbers . I , we did 950 K the first year . That was the goal . The goal is 500 K the first year , a million the second year and then , guess what ? The second year we hit 1.1 million in top line revenue . But I was chasing the wrong thing , because guess how much money I made on all that revenue . But I was chasing the wrong thing , because guess how much money I made on all that ? Zero literally made nothing . Um , in fact , we were losing money .

Speaker 1 13:09

Uh , because we were spending so much just to hit these numbers , we were overextending our , our service area , we were wasting money on gas , you know , we were rushing to get talent in because I had to fill the demand and I had to fill the install schedule , and all these things were happening at once and I had to still pay back , you know , the money that I had put into the business at the beginning and we had cars end up breaking . So this , all this stuff started happening and I was like , well , shit , what was the point of even going for these revenue numbers if I didn't make it ? And that was a hard lesson . That revenue does not matter , profit matters . And there's an amazing book for any of my business owners out there which is called Profit First and it is basically how to be profitable from day one . And you would think like , oh yeah , justin , you know , as you start a business , profit should always be top of the mind , but it's not a lot of times .

Speaker 1 14:08

Revenue is because it feels good to say you did a lot of sales , it feels sexy to say , oh , my company did a million in the first year . That feels good , cool , it doesn't actually matter . Like now , with the gift of hindsight , I would much rather do $500,000 a year , but I keep 40% of it or 30% of it and build it that way , um , but the slower you build it , to be honest , the bigger the thing can actually go . And here's what's hilarious . I'm sure a lot of you are hearing this and you're like I have heard this before , I have . I know you got to build slow . Oh , I know you shouldn't trust partners right away . Oh , all these things , yeah , I did too .

Speaker 1 14:47

But the problem is when you actually are in it , you always think you're the special snowflake . I don't know what it is and I've seen , I know so many other small business owners have had the same dilemma where you've worked with somebody who you think is an A player and you have this , this good relationship with him , so you're like , oh , he'll be good , this will be the exception . Or you're a hard worker , so like , oh , the reason why other people can't keep up with this type of pace is because they're not hard workers . And you insert all these reasons why you think you're going to be the exception to the rule and you always see your circumstances different . I know I did and uh , yeah , it ended up just biting me in the ass the same way it bites every other entrepreneur .

Speaker 1 15:25

So you know if I could have gone back three years from now and just said , hey , justin , let's just keep the . Don't even build a big team from the beginning . Just do whatever you can do until you literally can't do it anymore . Do what you can do , sell , sell everything until you literally can't sell anymore , and then hire sales people on and then hire back operations guys on and then , you know , stay in your little market for as long as you can , um , or if you didn't like the market , just move to a whole new market and just build there first . That would have if I had just done that from the beginning and again , you can never , you can never go back , right , um , this company would be insanely big , way bigger than we were now . We'd be profiting . We'd be profiting , profiting probably 50k a month in cash flow , um , and we're not , and that is indicative of decisions that were made . Um , you know , we had a .

Speaker 1 16:17

One thing I did I spent . I spent 20 grand on uh

Building a WhatNot Business Strategically

Speaker 1 16:20

building a partnership with a big box chain . I'm not going to mention who the chain is , enough to say that you guys would know you would know the chain if we said it . And I thought that would be a huge money grab because I saw other companies that had that partnership who were doing it . The problem was they were bigger , they were more established , they had bigger service areas they could cover . More established , they had bigger service areas they could cover and because that initial investment , because they were bigger , they were able to actually survive that hit and that blow and continue to restock the stores .

Speaker 1 16:49

I didn't so very quickly , I couldn't afford to stay there and because of that partnership they took a huge amount of the actual revenue . Huge amount of the actual revenue . So if I sold a deal , that store got about 20% of that deal . So , also being smaller , I had the unfortunate disadvantage of not having good enough you know , good enough margins on my equipment . I was spending way more on equipment . That was , you know , some of the biggest lessons I've learned . And now the good news is the business is in a better spot . We're building slowly . I have completely converted the company into a virtual model which is going to significantly help our margins and it's actually worked out way better . It turns out a lot of people enjoy not having people come into their homes , so that's been a huge , huge win into their homes . So that's been a that's been a huge , huge win , huge , huge win .

Speaker 1 17:46

Um , but , yeah , guys , that that kind of wraps up this show . Obviously , I have the um . I have you know . If you guys aren't collecting V friends , definitely get in there . If you guys want to get into some single streams , I'm going to be hosting a single stream later on today . Um , definitely make sure you guys bookmark that . If you guys have business questions , I do home service , okay , and I , like I said before , I am building up my whatnot business um as well . My hope is to have a really cranking um whatnot business here in in the next two to three years .

Speaker 1 18:15

What discord are you in um are you talking about ? For the v friends cards in particular , like how to how to source those ? Yeah , so , for the V friends cards in particular , like how to how to source those ? Yeah , so , for the V friends cards , I'm just in the V friends , the main V friends discord , so there's a channel . If you go check out the V friends channel , you can actually say , hey , I'm looking to purchase these types of cards in bulk . But , like I was saying , so , if you go into that discord , you can actually put a . That's what I do .

Speaker 1 18:40

I put messages in there , uh , in the marketplace , and just say , hey guys , I'm looking to collect , uh , a bunch of bundled uh base cards or refracted cards or manga cards , because there's a ton of people in there who just don't want to sell them on eBay or they have a huge collection . Um , I probably have 1300 cards coming and I got really good deals on them , and then again we'll auction them off , on , on , on my whatnot streams , and you know you're not going to make a huge margin on it , which is why you need to get them for cheap , because , at the same same time , you can't auction these things off for an absorbent price on here , right , and then you buy them , yeah , exactly yeah , or you give them away , right , you give these away . And here and here's the thing , right , especially at this stage , right , if you guys are are new , new to this um , and you guys are looking at um at at starting , at starting like a whatnot ? Business , uh , or live selling , which I I think is such a great idea . Um , yeah , it grows . Coach just killed it .

Speaker 1 19:38

Right , community awareness is , is , is the key key . It's not even so much about making money , especially early on . All right , making money should be the second to last thing that you're thinking of . You want to just try to give away as much as you can and then get to a point where your community is so big that in year two , year three , you know you have a ton of people coming to your shows . Um , sorry , I'm gonna reset the camera guys . Um , you have people coming to your shows . You have , um , built that trust .

Speaker 1 20:12

But here's the thing . There's also really good opportunities If you guys want to do like a AM streams a good example of this . So there are breakers who have not a lot of followers in them and you can get spots for super cheap . So the way I look at it is , the breaks are , are is gambling , like , especially now , cause a lot of these hits are already out there . If you're going to do , if you're going to do the breaks , you're definitely gambling . So you want to make sure that your , your risk is low , especially if you don't have a big bank roll to cover it . The benefit is , on these low breaks you can get some big hits right . I've got some of my biggest hits from low stream breaks where I got in for super cheap so that's the name of the game there .

Speaker 1 20:51

Then in the second place for really rare cards is look on eBay . Ebay like there's auctions on eBay guys . I got a 25 manga the other day for 50 bucks Okay , 50 bucks . I got a V friends manga off an eBay auction and I just had to take the time to scroll . A lot of people don't want to take that time to scroll . That I did . I went and found it , so I'll run that on stream and that's going to be a huge hit right for for the stream . So that's another way AM streams right , these big streamers so singles and auctions are a great place to do it .

Speaker 1 21:19

I'm going to tell you a funny story and this is the economics of how au I think this was probably two weeks ago . Am was running stream and I was literally just getting a shit ton of cards off AM right and he ran a Bethany Frankel of 10 , which I ended up purchasing . All right , I bought the Bethany Frankel of 10 . I think I bought it for 70 bucks , came on my stream . I ran it at a dollar , right , yeah , coach , yes

Community Building vs Making Money

Speaker 1 21:45

, coach , remember this . So I bought this of 10 for 70 bucks . I ran a mine for a dollar . It sold for about 180 bucks . I almost doubled my money there , which then allows me to buy more cards .

Speaker 1 21:58

Right , because , again , community building , right , especially the start of this , it's all community building . So if you're trying to make money the first couple of years , don't do it . You got to build a community first . You got to build the trust . Right . And I've also ran yeah , am runs good deals and guess what ? We get killed all the time and in that example I didn't get killed and the main difference was there was someone in my stream that wasn't in AM stream that really wanted that entrepreneurial card . Right , there was more demand for that one card . So in that instance I made out . I also ran a Y2K that got sold for 50% less on my stream . So it all equals out anyway .

Speaker 1 22:36

The point is , as long as you and I again treat it like a business track your numbers , track your spreadsheets , I highly recommend you start out doing the bulk buy strategy . That's what I did , you can also . One thing that I'm doing as well I'll give you some inside baseball is , now that VFriends has been out for a little while . People have base sets they've just completed . So I just bought a base set for super cheap off eBay . That base set's going to come in and guess what I'm going to do on stream when it gets in ? I'm going to run a base set auction so someone can just buy an entire base set Because have the time to do it , do it . A lot of people don't have the time . They only have a couple hours maybe to go on your , your auction , your stream , and if you can offer that service to them , they'll jump right in .

Speaker 1 23:15

Breaks will break you . I'm new . The kids get , yes , breaks . Yes , breaks will break can break you for sure . Um , but breaks can also get you out your name out there into the community , right ? That's actually how I kind of got started and whatnot is .

Speaker 1 23:27

I was in so many breaks and I was always buying the skeleton spot for exorbitant amounts of money . Um , you know , people start to to to learn . You know who I was . So I write that off as a marketing cost , right , it is what it is . Um , you know I was . I'm in almost every stream , right . Why ? Because I want to be a part of the community and I want to give back . And now that I have more inventory and I've started to build my own momentum , now I'll do things like last night on . You know I didn't have a lot of time last night but I went into AM stream , bought a card and gave it away . Why ? Because it builds brand trust and loyalty . I have a ton of cards I'm going to be selling anyway . You know there's a lot of right . Give as much as you can for free . It's typical and I'll quote Gary on this one Jab , jab , jab , jab , right , hook , right , give , give , give , give , give , give , ask , right . And that's why these $1 auctions are great .

Speaker 1 24:17

As a small streamer , I know I'm gonna get killed and you can ask anyone that's in this stream . Who's watched me for a while knows most of my streams . I get murdered because I don't have very rarely do I have more than 50 people viewers in my streams , but then every now and again I get more and then , you know , it goes up . Um , but I do want to try to list these on whatnot , or at least do the purchasing through whatnot Um . The reason why is selfishly , um , I want to be , I need to get to premier shop status , um , as a business , um , the , the , and especially if you whoever here wants to start a whatnot business or start building it , the thing that's going to just murder you is the payback times .

Speaker 1 24:54

So , cashflow business , one-on-one Um . If you have a low cashflow business , it's hard to grow the business and when you start on whatnot your cash , you're not a good cashflow business . Um , it takes me , uh , anything I make on whatnot , if I do a stream and I sell it , it takes me at least 10 to 15 days normally to get paid , because we don't get paid until the equipment arrives at the destination Um , and then it's a few hours after that and depending even , and I send out next day , um , but depending where people are located , it might take longer for packages to get there , which usually takes four to five days , um , and then it takes about another day for whatnot sometimes to register it . So building up to where you can get instant payouts is huge , which is where I'm at right now . So this , hopefully , for you guys who want to do a whatnot business , this is kind of a nice , nice , live way for you to see it being built in real time .

Speaker 1 25:46

Because you know my goal is in the next two years is when , you know , I'm thinking , when v friends tops chrome 3 comes out . That's where my head , my head is right now . I want to be at that point when chrome 3 comes out that I can absolutely buy a bajillion cases , break them all and be one of the top v friends uh streamers on here . So you see this collection back here , right , I have the entire Skelly collection , almost I got the sketch cards , I have the black . I have no five manga come and all this stuff Right , um , yeah , everyone , yeah , everyone starts somewhere .

Speaker 1 26:23

But all these right here , like here's the , here's the reality , guys , there's going to be a point where I'm going to want to make a make a big bet , right , once my community is big enough and people trust me enough and they start coming to my streams and you know I I do have that reputation in the space I'm gonna want to make a big bet and I'm gonna want to have like a big , rememberable stream , something like am , or you know , last sunday when they ran , was it like 10 cases or something I'm going to want to need to do something like that , but it's going to take time , so that entire collection at some point is going to get sold . Why ? Because I'm going to try to grade it , hold its value , but at a certain point that entire collection back there is going to be incredibly valuable and it's going to make more sense for me to sell it so that way I can

Long-Term Vision for Growth

Speaker 1 27:03

pursue the bigger goal of building a bigger and bigger brand within the Whatnot community and within the VFriends community . Obviously , it's going to suck to lose a collection , but you always got to remember what your priorities are and what your goal is . Right . I want to provide as much value to the community and have a massive , massive stream and continue to grow the business , because I am super passionate about business and it'd be kind of fun for everyone here to watch it happen in real time . Yeah , big bets are fun .

Speaker 1 27:26

I've made a few on breaks that have not worked out , and then I've seen some where I've chickened out and then they would have hit big right and that's again . It's the same thing with my real business and I have an open collection . Everything's always for sale for the right price and I'm always buying new things Absolutely . Yeah , yeah , and everyone has different ways they want to collect . Some people Um same thing for mine , um , it'd be . It would take an exorbitant amount of money for me to sell my Scully collection right now , but it could happen , um , but you know , I've been documenting my journey in my water treatment company for the last three years and I'm going to be documenting the whatnot journey as well and that should , hopefully , you know , you guys should see it happen in real time and , honestly , if you guys like that and you guys want to do it , you should just copy it .

Speaker 1 28:16

I am successful in the singles auctions because I copied AM's format . He was one of the biggest singles guys on there . I knew I couldn't get his inventory , but I knew I could at least do the format . And his format is so good for new collectors because , yeah , some of the stuff goes for more than it's worth , but a lot of that stuff goes underpriced , which builds a lot of inherent trust . And in the sports card world the singles are huge and in VFriends it hasn't really been a thing yet . So think about this If you can become the first in something , then you will have that market cap and you'll be known for it . Am is obviously at the peak of that .

Speaker 1 28:59

My vision , my goal , is to hopefully one day catch up with that and do the same things , um , and so that way there's multiple streams that people can go to at different times , um , and can still get the same value , which I'm super excited for . And who knows , it may not work out , but the nice thing is I do have a current business , so I'm able to cross pollinate per se , uh , the water company and this , and that's exciting . I'm excited to see where it goes . I can tell you this I definitely enjoy whatnot and doing whatnot streams 10,000 times more than my water treatment company . Dealing with homeowners and doing home service is so frustrating , I couldn't even tell you being able to open cards and trade cards and sell cards , even though right now we're below break-even . It's so fun , I love it .

Speaker 1 29:48

Yeah , you got to be consistent , man . You got to have a long time horizon . The truth is , any business will succeed on a long enough time horizon . The thing that screws businesses is either you run out of money or you just give up too soon . But every company , if you take it to its natural extreme , will be successful , like if you could have enough money to do anything for the next 50 years , it would succeed . The biggest thing is people and what's great about this and again , if you guys are just tuning in and you can listen to all my other podcasts about me building the water company the biggest detriment to big business is the people .

Speaker 1 30:22

The nice thing about this is , realistically , for everyone here who wants to get into like a whatnot , live selling . You don't need it , you don't need people , you just need you right , and it's going to take a long time for you to get to the point where you need to hire a team , right . That's when you're at the point where it's like , look at what Gary and his team does , where they're running streams 24-7 . That is the difference . We're going to end it here . We got real work calling . I love you guys . We'll talk to you soon . You , you , you .