The Doing Business in Bentonville Podcast
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The Doing Business in Bentonville Podcast
Ep. 79 - The Corporate Compass: Guiding CEOs Through E-commerce and Beyond with Megan Marshall
Unlock the secrets to leading at the highest level with Megan Marshall of AIIR Consulting, who brings her expertise in executive coaching and organizational development to the latest episode of Doing Business in Bentonville.
Andy Wilson sits down with Megan for a fascinating look into the strategies that shape the world's most influential leaders and enterprises.
As the Chief Customer Officer and Head of Executive Coaching, Megan divulges how AIIR Consulting crafts top-notch leadership capabilities, ensuring their clients are well-equipped to handle the ever-changing global business landscape. Their conversation traverses the nurturing of coaching excellence and the critical importance of a community-centric, educational backdrop for professional growth, providing a rare peek into what makes a coaching firm truly transformative.
Venture into the thorny realm of navigating senior leadership roles, learning why CEO turnover rates are soaring and how retail's pivot to e-commerce is upending executive expectations.
Drawing from Andy's tenure as Walmart's former CHRO, he offers firsthand reflections on the steep challenges awaiting new CEOs, often underprepared for their daunting responsibilities.
The pair dissect the findings of a Stanford Business poll, revealing the glaring deficit of candid feedback and external advice for C-suite denizens, and underscore the indispensable lifeline that executive coaching provides.
The finale of their discourse introduces AIIR Consulting's AIIR Vista, a beacon for C-suite executives seeking to expand their horizons and enact lasting change with the backing of continuous, expert coaching.
And for a touch of levity, shared ties to Auburn and Alabama spark a bit of friendly academic rivalry, making for an episode that's as personal as it is professionally enriching.
Well, hello everyone and welcome to Doing Business in Bentonville. My name is Andy Wilson and I'm the executive leader, and we have got such a great podcast for you today. I can't wait to introduce you to my guest. She is really, really something. You're going to love her. I want to tell you she's so talented and we're going to talk about her. But, megan Marshall, welcome to the podcast.
Speaker 2:Thank you, eddie, pleasure to be here.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's great to see you. You're looking great, as always, and all the way from Philadelphia. We're just glad you're here and we're going to talk about your great company, air Consulting. Megan, I will tell you I know, when I seen you over a year ago, I listened to your presentation and, as you talked to the board of directors for a non-profit part of Ayer Consulting, a non-profit called Elevate, and, megan, it was just so good to meet you then and I'm so excited, as I mentioned, to have you on the program and we have a lot to talk about today. But before we get into our topic, let's talk about this great company called Ayer Consulting. Again, I mentioned, it's located in Philadelphia, but it's a global company. And, megan, why don't you just share with us the focus of AIR?
Speaker 2:Yeah, happy to. Thanks so much, andy, and it's a pleasure to be here with you for this podcast. So a little bit about AIR. So at AIR we really work to increase the performance of leaders and their organization, and we do this by fusing together our proprietary leadership framework, our proven approach to behavior change, which is really our AIR method, and our real world business expertise. So we fuse these things together to help our clients build better leaders, better teams, better organizations, in the hopes of really building a better future.
Speaker 1:Well, I will tell you, you all do a great job and for our viewers, we have a series that we've been working through with AIR and I will tell you, I want to encourage you to listen or watch each of the series because they're just excellent. And one of the things that I just am so impressed that Ayer does is how they really work with organizations and team members to improve effectiveness and performance on the individuals and, ultimately, the team. And I would tell you there's so much that you do, and we're going to get into that because Megan Marshall is the chief customer officer and she is head of executive coaching at Ayer Consulting. So, megan, tell us a bit about what that means. What is that role? Because it's extremely important to what Ayer does globally for their clients and the leaders they work with.
Speaker 2:Absolutely so. I lead our executive coaching services and AIR really started first with offering executive coaching. Our CEO and founder, jonathan Kirshner, was on track to become a clinical psychologist and he took a class on executive coaching and was amazed by this idea of the cascade effect and the impact that coaching can have, not just on an individual but, like you said, andy, on a team, on the organization and broader. There's such a tremendous amount of impact that can happen with executive coaching and leadership development. So in my role I oversee all of our coaching services and really serve as our executive coaching subject matter expert. And then I also oversee all of our coaches globally, so right now we have about 200. We offer services globally. So everything from interviewing to coach selection to training, onboarding, ongoing quality assurance and development those are all things that I oversee on a day-to-day basis.
Speaker 1:Well, one of the important things I see that you do and when we were together at the meeting last year, I know that one of the things you have is Ayer has such a high standard and expectation for the coaches, the thing that I was so impressed with, megan, when you spoke with us, you talked about that the importance of the coach staying equipped and ready for the latest information technology that leaders and company faced. You really talked a lot about that, yeah, so tell us how you keep your coaches so up to date and current on what's happening and what the future may bring to organizations and leaders.
Speaker 2:Absolutely.
Speaker 2:We have the best coaches at Ayer, and something that is really critical when we're interviewing is to bring on coaches that want to be a part of a learning community and constantly becoming better at what they do.
Speaker 2:So we do that through one.
Speaker 2:We have a monthly meeting called Discovery that serves as our kind of coach supervision meeting, where we share business updates and coaches will share about engagements that they're working on, because we understand that coaching and it might be weird to think about this, but it can be a lonely profession, and so it's very important that we are working together to make sure that we're supporting our clients at our very best.
Speaker 2:We also offer quarterly lunch and learns, where we're upskilling and training our coaches. We have a consultant community hour every three weeks where coaches come together in order to be able to support and dialogue over challenges that they're experiencing. And then we also and right now I'm really in the midst of planning this we have a annual coach summit that we'll have our fifth one this September, and so that will be an opportunity for all of our coaches to come together in person for a time of learning, aligning on air and really being inspired and working together. So community for us is very important and I really think it's a differentiator in terms of how we think about and support our clients.
Speaker 1:You know I do too, and we're going to get into some of the things in just a moment that more details. But I wanted to set the ground rules or just level the ground, if we are. So the people that are listening and watching us, they understand that the talent that air consulting has, that that talent is continued, developed and taught and coached themselves, if you will. And it's a great community of over 200 coaches that you talked about, and that's the hard work on the front end and very critical. So I want us to move and talk about some of the work you do with organizations and leaders, but is there anything else that you'd like to add that's so important that you do with your coaches?
Speaker 2:That we do with our coaches. I think we've really touched on it with the community and the support that we offer. I will say that we have a very robust onboarding process. One of the things that's really a differentiator for AIR is that we provide tech-enhanced coaching services. So at the end of the day, coaching is a human relational process, but we enhance what we're doing through technology. So we have a proprietary coaching platform called Coaching Zone that is there to be really a support throughout the coaching experience. So we do a lot of work with our coaches to make sure they're onboarded and in turn, that provides really important and vital talent and kind of coaching analytics back to the organizations that we serve, and I would say that's another key differentiator.
Speaker 1:That's wonderful, and I think that's why Ayer has become such a global company and so well-respected globally by companies and by leaders that are very involved in your services. So again, great job. You're doing great on that, because that's really key. Now one of the things we want to just sort of dive into, megan, is talk about what are some of the unique challenges that you see that leaders are facing at the top of the organizations, because, I mean, you have privity to all of this. You see it globally, you listen to the coaches, you hear the feedback. What are some of those issues to share with our viewers, and then you know what do we need to do about that?
Speaker 2:Yeah, at AIR we really have the opportunity to work with the senior most executives and we see this in data in terms of trends, with CEOs are leaving in record numbers. I actually saw a stat from Challenger that more than 1,500 CEOs have left their job. This, I think, was at the end of February. Challenger that more than 1,500 CEOs have left their job this, I think, was at the end of February and that there's a 49% increase from February last year to February this year in terms of CEOs that are leaving their positions and it's an astounding number. And so we think about what is it around senior most executives not being able to be successful? Typically, these are the best and the brightest in their fields. They move into the senior level roles or senior most roles, and really there's tremendous pressure to drive growth. There's geopolitical tensions, economic issues, unsettled investors, quarterly results, health challenges, things like aging, parents and other just personal life issues where it can become really really challenging for executives to succeed at the senior most levels, and I think I've even heard stories recently that people are having to move into C-suite level roles faster than ever before.
Speaker 2:I heard from an executive search firm recently that somebody that they might see ready to move into that CEO role. They might start interviewing for that role five years before they're ready and so really giving them the experience that they need in order to understand what's it like to interview for a CEO position and what's happening. They go to these interviews five years before they're ready and what happens? They get offered the job and it's like, wow, that's great, you think I'm ready, they're excited for me to take on this top role, I'll do it. But then when they move into that role, they're very unprepared. They are not given the time and space that they need in order to be able to get up to speed. They don't have time to settle in, they're expected to produce results really quickly and they need support in order to be able to think through and share their doubts, anxieties, frustrations and really receive support and guidance. And that's really what we offer through our executive coaching services at that C-suite level.
Speaker 1:Well, I had no idea that 49% of senior leaders, ceos, are leaving the positions. I did not realize that that is catastrophic.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's from a point in time this year versus a point in time last year. But if you look at the trend, it's trending up and this is continuing to happen, where the turnover is happening really fast.
Speaker 1:I can see now why you spend so much time with your coaches, equipping them, making sure they're equipped to handle this type of transition that's taking place at the top of these major companies, these global companies. Here's a question Do you see that it's a certain part of the globe that this is happening more, or is it just broad, that these CEOs… are leaving these positions at that rate?
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's a really good question. Honestly, I think I see the trend more by industry, I would say more so than around the globe. So, for example, I think the retail sector is really being hit hard and there's a lot of change that's happening there. So I think it would be more of a trend that's industry specific rather than globally. But it's a really good question.
Speaker 1:Well, you know, if you mention the retail, because that's my background retail and Omni Channel and that's much of where I spend my time with my podcast, and I will tell you. I see that and one reason is the transition that retail has taken to e-commerce and away from brick and mortar or brick and mortar and both. There's a tremendous amount of transition taking place in that entire industry and I can see that that would be definitely a major area.
Speaker 2:I think there's that I can think of. Even recently, you know, has it been over the past year. You know Bad Beth and Beyond, dollar General, walgreens. You know it's happening quite frequently.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you're right. All those is happening. Now I know that. Again, as you look at leaders and the challenges, are there any other challenges you see that leaders are facing?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think we've talked a lot on the big ones, I think overall ones. I think overall everything's moving very fast with technological advances, with AI, and I think mostly it's that they're moving into the roles too quickly, almost too early in their career, and so they're not getting that time to develop. Or maybe somebody wouldn't have taken on that top position until later in their career. They may be doing it about 10 years older, and one of my mentors likes to say it takes 60 years to make a 60-year-old and that you know, in some ways you need that experience and you don't have it, and you can't really gain it until you have those years. So what type of support can be given in order to set these leaders up for success?
Speaker 1:That's such a great point. I noticed there's a recent poll from Stanford Business that you mentioned. Can you talk about that?
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's a good point.
Speaker 2:It basically said that while nearly all C-suite leaders want outside leadership advice, you know most, nearly two thirds, don't receive it. And why is that? Why is it so hard for the senior, most leaders to receive advice? And you know it tends to be that the higher up that you go in an organization, the less likely it is to receive feedback. You know you hear that a lot about like it's lonely at the top. And, and why is that? And I'm actually, you know, curious your perspective on it too, from being, you know, a former CHRO at Walmart, you know, did you experience that? And what do you? What do you think about that in terms of not being able to get feedback when you're at a senior level?
Speaker 1:Well, you know, I mean we did we. We used outside coaching and internal also training development with our, but we used so much outside coaching for our C-suite level. But you are exactly right. When I read that I went. I remember this. It was first of all the C-suite level.
Speaker 1:Leaders are so busy, they're solving problems continually and all day long they're dealing with issues and problems and they don't take time to sharpen the saw, as Covey taught us. You know, covey leadership said sometimes you got to stop and sharpen the saw. And it was hard to get our leaders to stop and sharpen the saw and to get with subject matter experts and to really work on their individual development and work on their skills. Because you know you can't just in this environment, you can't just be an operator and just execute. You've got to have these, you've got to have the people skills, you've got to understand how to navigate those things and listen. There's so many other skills that great leaders must have today in order to be successful, and it was very challenging for us to equip them with those skills needed in order to lead a global company. And so we had the same issue. We did and we never solved it completely.
Speaker 2:Right, it's challenging. If you think about a CEO and let's say I'm a VP in an organization, I'm not probably going to go up to my CEO and say, hey, I really don't think you led that meeting most effectively. Ceos are like we want feedback. I have an open door policy. You know CEOs are like we want feedback. I have an open door policy. But there's this fear you know as an employee, that I thought actually share. It's not going to be received well, and you have you ever heard the expression you know like. You know no one will tell me my baby's ugly, kind of where it's like. You need that outside objective sounding board that can tell you the things that you don't want to hear in that trusted, safe relationship.
Speaker 1:Right, because oftentimes without that you're not going to receive it until it's too late, typically by the time the board comes and tells you it's not going well, they are already planning for you to leave, and that's what I think Ayer does so well, I think, with the coaches that I know, and then the reputation that you all have and what you've talked about, what you do with your 200 plus coaches.
Speaker 1:You really spend time equipping them to have those hard conversations with those leaders, and there is a right way to do that, and I have friends and companies that were you have coaches actually working with them and they tell me that that's one of the things they love about Ares Coaching is that they're able to sit down with them and tell them the truth. Then let's talk about how we solve this, let's talk about how we develop you. Here are the ways we can do that for you, and I think that's critical. And again, I have third parties that work I don't know if I've ever told you that or they work with some air coaches and that's exactly. They're very complimentary, but I think it comes back to what you said at the very beginning the work that you do and lead for the coaches. So I think that's critical. Keep that up, you're doing good.
Speaker 2:Thank you Appreciate that. I'd like to know who you know, but I really appreciate the feedback.
Speaker 1:Okay, now let's talk about something. What is trusted leadership advisory? Tell us about that. I noticed you have that, but I don't know what that is. What is trusted leadership advisory? What is that? Tell us about that. I noticed you have that, but I don't know what that is.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So that's really the space that AIR is seeing a lot of growth, and so this is moving from kind of more traditional executive one-to-one coaching to coaches, moving into the role of a trusted leadership advisor. And so when you think about traditional coaching as a coach, you really believe that the person that you're working with, the coaching client, has everything that they need inside them in order to be able to manage and handle the challenges that they face. Or, with a trusted leadership advisor, they really are bringing their expertise and business knowledge and using that trusted relationship in order to support their client. Using that trusted relationship in order to support their client.
Speaker 2:So at AER we have a definition that we use here for a trusted leadership advisor. So this is an external the external's key Elite coach or highly experienced executive development consultant who establishes trust with their client and plays a central role in the executive's ability to confront and deal with the complexity, ambiguity and intensity of their leadership role. So they are integrating their business knowledge with an insight-oriented approach and really serving as confidants to those that they work with. So, again, they're external to the organization. I think that's key. I think that there's a place for internal coaching and it being used effectively in thinking about overall leader development strategy. But I think for these C-suite positions, having that external sounding board is key. Second, being able to establish that trust with their clients serving as a confidant that's critical. That trust with their clients serving as a confidant, that's critical. And then really, the trusted leadership advisor is being more directive and challenging in consulting, more so than your kind of traditional executive coaching.
Speaker 1:Wow, I think that's wonderful Again, if you're listening to us and are watching this and you're working in a company and you work with a senior leadership or you're a senior leader taking time to this. What you just said is critical that trust advisor. Every leader needs that, no matter what your role is in the organization. If you have a major responsibility, you need to be able to speak with someone that you can trust, and I think trust is you know. I tell my team, I said you know some people will follow you as far as they trust you, and having a trusted advisor is critical. Building a team of trust and you as a leader the leader being a person of integrity and trust is critical, and I've seen that in my career, where when someone loses trust, they will eventually lose their role of responsibility. So critical. I love that. That's a great addition. Now, what else? Do you have? Anything else you want to talk about? Coaches?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so with our Trusted Leadership Advisory, how we do that at AIR is called AIR Vista and that's our name for our Trusted Leadership Advisory Services. And I love the name because you think about your career, what are you doing? You're moving up, you're moving up the ladder, you're ascending, you're working on your development and who you are as a leader. And when you think about Air Vista, it's really about looking out at a Vista. You have that 30,000-foot view. You're up at the top of the organization. But what we know and what I talked about earlier, it's really easy to kind of lose that 30,000-foot view. It can very quickly be bogged down in all of the pressures and the anxieties that come with being a C-suite executive.
Speaker 2:And so AirVista is our trusted leadership advisory model. That's really leveraging our air method. So I haven't said this yet, but air consulting it's spelled A-I-I-R, even though we pronounce it like the air you breathe, and it stands for a methodology for everything that we do. So assessment, insight, implementation, reinforcement. So AirVista is still leveraging our model. So assessment in order to change, you need to know what needs to change. So the you know the trusted leadership advisor here through AirVista, will conduct a 360 psychometric assessments, really helping the leader understand who they are and where they are in the context of this senior most role.
Speaker 2:You know, insight is about making meaning from those assessments and coming up with very targeted development plan goals. Implementation is about taking action on those goals and making progress. And then our reinforcement for us is critical. What we see is that it's not that hard to change. You know, many of us have New Year's resolutions, but how many of us actually keep them? So, coaching and really through our AirVista model, it's so critical to continue to practice new behaviors, continue receiving that support so that AirVista, you know trusted leadership advisor is going to be able to check in like hey, I know this is a pattern for you that you operate this way, how is this going? In this situation? They're able to pull that insight out to be able to speak to the current leadership challenges that the leader's facing. So that reinforcement piece for us is critical. So that's just a little bit about our model and about AirVisca.
Speaker 1:Well, I will tell you you did a great job summarizing Air Consulting, because that's exactly right. There's no. I mean you did excellent and let me say to all of our viewers and listeners today airconsultingcom you've got to go check them out. It's an excellent website. It lists all of their services, how they do it. You can really look at this company. You've heard from great leaders throughout AIR talk about their services, talk about how they work with senior leaders, how they work with companies. I highly recommend this great company. It's one of the best companies I've ever been part of. Megan, you did such a great job of talking about your coaches and talking about how much time you spend keeping them current and up to date and equipped to handle with what's facing leaders in these global companies. Great job today. Thank you so much. Thank you, great job.
Speaker 2:Wonderful talking with you. A pleasure to be here.
Speaker 1:Okay, now what we have to do before we let you get out of here. Okay, we got to talk about your education, because one of the things I'm so impressed with is that when I was reading her bio, at the very end of her bio, she talked about two things. One, she talked about her dog, a golem doodle, and I think that's awesome. But then there's this little word down there called war eagle. Now, for all of our friends around the world, let me tell you who war eagle is. To the Southern guy that went to the University of Alabama from an undergrad, we're competitors that War Eagle's from Auburn University in Alabama. I went to the University of Alabama and what are we doing? I couldn't believe. I read that.
Speaker 2:I know I was raised. A lot of my family is from the great state of Alabama. It's been hard for me not to pick up on more of my Southern accent here in this conversation, but was definitely raised with a love of all things Auburn and sports and SEC football. So enjoy the rivalry. I wish it would have gone better for us in March, madness you know. But Alabama had a good run there with the final four, so congrats.
Speaker 1:Yeah Well, megan graduated similarly from the College of Charleston with a BA in Corporate Communication, and then you received your Master's in Talent and Organization Development and Executive Coaching from McCoy School of Business at Queens University.
Speaker 2:Yes.
Speaker 1:Wonderful, wonderful education. Anything you want to talk about there, about your education.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think you know one thing that was interesting for me joining AIR I had a background in leadership development, but really working for both for-profit and nonprofit organizations, and so when I started at AIR, I wanted you know Jonathan, my CEO, you know he's the clinical psychologist and so I wanted more of the academic rigor in terms of how do we really think about how organizations change. And so that led me to pursuing my master's in talent, organization development and executive coaching, just to give me more of the research and the grounding as to why what we do has the impact that it does and how we can help organizations tell the story about the impact that executive coaching, team development and leadership development can have on their organizations.
Speaker 1:Well, you did a great job today. It's such a pleasure to have you on. I enjoyed our conversation, as I have with each of the leaders of AIR Again, great company. You've heard us mention Jonathan the CEO, founder, CEO and again, go to their website, airconsultingcom. You'll get to meet the people. You'll get to read much about the company and hear about the company through their videos and information there. And I will tell you, Megan, this has been such a pleasure.
Speaker 2:It's been good to see you, it's good to have a conversation with you and I hope to see you in person soon. Definitely see that. I think it's going to be right after Memorial Day that day, but really looking forward to that conversation with the top industry leaders. So definitely, if you go to our website and check us out, be on the lookout for information on that.
Speaker 1:OK, we'll put that on our website also GreenbusinessinVitainvillecom To all of our viewers and all of our listeners. Thank you so much. It's been wonderful. All of our viewers and all of our listeners. Thank you so much. It's been wonderful. We all really appreciate you. I was told just recently and I want to thank all of our viewers and listeners because you are just making it so wonderful for doing business in Bentonville I was told that we're in 22 countries now. So thank you, thank you, thank you for what you're doing. We appreciate your loyalty. We appreciate that you keep checking us out. Continue to stay with us. You can check us out on all the social media platforms LinkedIn, of course we're there. You can message us back on LinkedIn, of course we're. On Apple, spotify, youtube Check us out there. Or go to our website doingbusinessinbentonvillecom. Thank you very much, megan. It's been a pleasure. Thank you very much.