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The Doing Business in Bentonville Podcast
To create an ecosystem that connects leaders of all kinds – industry, community, student, educational, civic, investment and entrepreneurial – to help overcome Omnichannel Retail barriers through exclusive, insight-rich content.
The Doing Business in Bentonville Podcast
Ep. 149 - Curiosity Over Comfort: The New Framework for Modern Teams
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Leadership longevity requires constant evolution, yet most executive training programs rely on standard, outdated checklists that ignore human behavior. When organizations focus solely on tactical metrics, they alienate their teams and fall into predictable operational stagnation. True market resilience relies on building an infrastructure capable of navigating volatility without fracturing company culture. In this episode, host Andy Wilson sits down with Rachel Heisten, founding partner of Life Work Talent, to break down the mechanics of modern organizational design and leadership development.
What is the critical difference between complicated tactical problems and complex human relationships in the workforce? Rachel Heisten shares her strategies for managing the unlearning curve, escaping the functional expert trap, and shifting company metrics from simple headcount to dynamic skill count. We also look at the underlying brain science that drives our instinctual craving for comfort over workplace courage.
Executive growth is that true development requires a high degree of intentional discomfort and intellectual humility. Moving from a technical expert to a human-centered leader means facing internal biases, navigating professional isolation, and doing the slow, unglamorous work of building long-term talent pipelines. Viewers will walk away with a practical framework for integrating work and life, alongside actionable methods to foster deep corporate curiosity.
If you care about organizational agility, scaling human capital, and sustainable succession planning, you will get a lot from this conversation. Subscribe to the channel and share this episode with a peer who is currently scaling a team. What is the biggest corporate habit you realize you need to unlearn to better support your people? Let us know in the comments below.
Welcome And Why Rachel’s Here
SPEAKER_01Hello, everyone, and welcome to Doing Business in Bittenville. I'm Andy Wilson. I'm the executive director and the host today. And I will tell you, I have been looking forward to this podcast for some time. I met Rachel Houston a several weeks ago at one of our live events in doing business in Bittenville. And when she and her team, I met her, a couple of other people from her team, and when they started talking about what they do, I said, okay, here's the thing, Rachel. We got to get you on the podcast. You're right. Here you are.
SPEAKER_03Here I am.
SPEAKER_01Welcome.
SPEAKER_03Thank you. Thank you so much for having me.
SPEAKER_01Oh, yeah. Thank you for being here. I will tell you, they have we're going to talk about such a you, and I'm going to say a very unique company called Life Work Talent. She's one of the founding partners of the organization. And I'll tell you that I have got such a really unique way of working with leaders. You know, today, you know, leadership is changing, it is revolving. And to be really current in the future is so important. And, you know, we don't want we don't want our leaders to be left behind. And so I really want you to talk about sort of high level first, Rachel.
What LifeWork Talent Actually Does
SPEAKER_01Okay, talk to us about life work talent. Okay. What is it?
SPEAKER_03What is it? That is the million-dollar question. So thank you for that super nice introduction. At Life Work Talent, we do something that sounds very simple, but that actually we enjoy doing so much because it is actually pretty complex and very fun. We help organizations build exceptionally strong leaders and teams. We do that though in a variety of ways. We offer leadership development at all levels of the company. So we don't just work with executives, we don't just work with brand new leaders. We offer leadership development at every level. We do a lot of executive or leadership team assessment and alignment. So there's a development component to that, but oftentimes it's not so much about skills as it is alignment and integration within an executive team. We do a lot of executive coaching. And then we offer strategic advisory services for organizations who are looking to nurture and build the culture that they want. They're looking to align just really, really strong people processes to their people strategy and a few other little things, but those are the high-level big kind of services that we offer our clients.
SPEAKER_01I love this. And we have to unpack all that. Sure. Okay. I mean, this that's that's a great powerful statement, you opening statement. And I really want to unpack that. And let's let's talk first about this whole focus around human-centered uh leadership and culture and and you know, this this whole thing you do around organizational design. So talk about unpacking some of those things you said, because um it's very interesting.
Human-Centered Leadership And Life Work Integration
SPEAKER_04Okay.
SPEAKER_01How you how you're gonna do all that work. So, how does someone begin? Sure. Okay.
SPEAKER_03Sure. And and maybe a good way to kind of frame that would be what is our approach? Yeah. So I like that. We have clients from every industry. You know, uh, we've worked with startups, we've worked with well-established big companies that operate globally. So when when someone comes to us or we seek them out, right, what makes LifeWork's approach a little different? I think the first thing is what you mentioned around our uh our kind of the underpinning of what we do is about harnessing what we believe to be the incredible power of the human-centered leader. So the origin story of LifeWork was really about that, about us coming from a large corporate environment. And one of the values we wanted to bring into our organization was really two things. We believe in the power of human-centered leadership, and we also want to help other leaders and people integrate, not balance, their life and their work. So integrate your work and your life to find purpose and to find meaning and to find joy in what you do. And so that's kind of the underlying kind of value system. How do we tackle all those things? We take a um, we meet clients where they are. So we have worked with organizations who are really kind of building some of the cultural and process infrastructure and their leaders from the ground up. Maybe they don't have anything in place other than they have some pain points. We talk to them, we learn as much as we can about their organization, and then we are able to put together solutions for them, working with them. But first and foremost, really building that relationship. We don't take a one size fits all approach. Uh, we have been in positions before where we needed help and and we felt like kind of we got that one size fits all approach. And so what we're offering is something that is a little step further, getting to know where the organization is, what their pain points are, and then solutioning for that. That's kind of a start.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, that's great. That's really good. You know, one of the things that I was doing my research um and my career was at Walmart, and some uh a lot of people know, and and when, you know, grew up I grew up there and and and fortunately got to stay there almost 30 years. And and you know, one of the things that Sam Walt taught us, and I won't ever I won't ever forget this. And you know, I was a trainee and uh we got 300 of us, that's all we were, 300 of us and assistant managers in the company. Sam called us to Little Rock for a meeting, and we're sitting he's on the stage with his yellow legal pad. He looked at at all of us, you know, and he said, the most consistent thing at Walmart is change. So, you know, I want you to talk about this exceptional leadership angle that you have. Because when I read that, and you talk about leader, you know, life work emphasizes that leaders must be so exceptional. I love that. It doesn't matter how fast change comes. When I read that statement, I went, okay, you're you're there. You have you you are focused in on change. So talk about this unlearning curve and to change. Talk about how that works and how you work with people on that.
Thriving Through Constant Change
SPEAKER_03Yeah. Um, I love that story about even maybe a few years ago change being constant, right? Yeah. Um, you know, I'll back up just a little bit. And um at LifeWork, we approach exceptional leadership both from a we have to know and and approach our work with a very current lens, which currently changes again, a foot. Um, and it always has been, but it feels like change and volatility and uncertainty just keep kind of climbing and climbing and climbing. In our executive coaching practice, one of the themes that we often find when working with leaders is that they are desperate to get past the change, right? They're they really, really want to get some help so that when they're on the other side of this big thing, then things will slow down. Then things will be normal for a while. And what we work with leaders on is completely changing that mindset in that it's probably not gonna slow down, right? You might get through a project, you might get through a transition, but that if the mindset shift for truly exceptional leaders is such that, yeah, change is a constant, but we're not trying to just survive it and get to the next thing. We're trying to build mindsets and deep in our human skills to thrive in it, right? So the exceptional leader not only understands logically that change is something that they have to navigate and often lead a lot of other people through, but that they embrace it, they understand the discomfort, and they are able to build strategies and tools to thrive through it. So that really answered kind of the change element, right? And we have ways to do that. That's through coaching and we also have some leadership development programming around how to build that change framework.
Unlearning What You Thought You Knew
SPEAKER_03What you mentioned about the unlearning, we we often say that, you know, we hear a lot about skill building and we think that's awesome. And that's a huge part of what we do. Um, learn it, having a learning culture is so important within organizations, and we can come in and help them build that. But what is actually we think sort of this mega competency of leaders of today is not just learning new stuff. That's that's hard and fun, but what is not as fun and what is even harder, but maybe more valuable, is unlearning the things you thought you knew.
SPEAKER_01Well, I I think that is such a critical point when you talk about that, you know, because and and that's really what Sam was telling us. Yeah. You know, uh when when he, you know, when I first heard that, I didn't know a lot because I just started with the company, you know, you know, yeah, you know, so I was in early 20s, so you know, just out of school. So, you know, it wasn't it wasn't about so much of our unlearning at that point. Sure. It was learning. But as we as we grow and develop and mature as leaders, there are things we have to unlearn. Yes. And and um sometimes you have to unlearn a leader that you have worked with.
SPEAKER_03Yes.
SPEAKER_01I mean Yeah, absolutely. It wasn't a good leader. That's right. And that's right. You you've developed some bad habits and thoughts and actions in that space. So you get into that. Yes.
Curiosity Builds Trust Through Listening
SPEAKER_03Yeah, and it's powerful. One of the ways that we do that is we work a lot um building the skill of curiosity. You know, sometimes we kind of think about curiosity as just being something that we're born with or is more innate. And perhaps that's true to some degree, but we actually think it's a skill that you can learn and apply. And so we actually teach that um there are actually enemies of curiosity. And one of them is the lack of kind of the intellectual humility. So, sort of the more you think you know, the less curious you are. We also talk about how just experience can be an enemy of curiosity. The more experience you have, the harder it becomes to unlearn and be super, super curious about not just the world around you, but we also focus in on the more curious you are about the human beings around you, the stronger leader you'll be.
SPEAKER_01That is so powerful. And I'm I'm so glad that you're talking. I don't hear that talked about. And being a curious leader is so important, no question about it. But the way that you just described that, and and not only it's not about it's just not you, but it's everyone around you. Yes. And uh, that's powerful.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, we actually um we have built into one of the sessions that we do a quiz essentially where you can find out how curious you are as a baseline. And what we find is that you can be really, really, really curious about yourself as a leader and what you're bringing to the table on what you're kind of your own inner um, you know, things you grapple with, curious about others and curious about the world. And it's sort of you have to have all three in order to have the curiosity. Curiosity also just builds trust.
SPEAKER_01Yes.
SPEAKER_03People feel seen and heard when you are curious about them. Um, and it also requires two skills that we also work with, which is really exceptional listening and inquiry. Inquiry for the sake of truly understanding versus just gaining information.
SPEAKER_01Okay. I smooth it. That so good. We could stay here all day. We could. I mean, it's so good. We could. And um, okay, let's talk about you. I
Courage Over Comfort In Leadership
SPEAKER_01another thing that I've I've learned about your organization, you you talk about courage versus comfort. Okay. How do you help a leader distinguish between comfortable culture and I and again uh your sort of courage being about how do you how do you do that? Because I found that interesting.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. Well, you know, as human beings, we are all wired for comfort. So we actually, in some of the work that we do, we take a very amateur kind of brain science approach um to to learning, which is we're actually all kind of hardwired for comfort and in some ways laziness because our big old prefrontal cortex takes a bunch of energy. And right, because like it's sort of how we were built, you know, biologically is that man, we want to conserve our energy.
SPEAKER_04Yeah.
SPEAKER_03We want to be comfortable. Well, guess what? We don't, we don't learn and get better when we do that. So we often joke a bit that what we do for a living is we make people mildly uncomfortable. Sometimes a little more because we know that growth happens through discomfort.
SPEAKER_04Yeah.
SPEAKER_03So we don't want, you know, it's not your role as a leader to be like unpleasant or uncomfortable, but if you don't feel that ping of discomfort, sometimes that probably means you're not learning and you're not building those muscles. It takes a lot of courage to be uncomfortable, especially in some situations. You would be, you probably wouldn't, Andy, but we are sometimes amazed at wonderful, exceptional leaders running an organization who still feel tremendous fear around uncomfortable conversations. And they're struggling usually with some sort of internal discomfort. And we don't want to call it lack of bravery, right? Instead, we flip it and say to be truly courageous as a leader, working through that discomfort, not avoiding it, often that's where you have the breakthroughs with a team member you're struggling with. That's often where you're gonna have the breakthrough to work through your burnout, is by demonstrating the courage to be uncomfortable.
unknownWow.
SPEAKER_03It's hard to do. And I say all of that, knowing that me myself struggles to be courageous enough to embrace discomfort. And you know, the the great thing about that, I guess, is that that's one of those very complex problems that AI is not gonna solve. Yeah. That's gonna remain a uniquely human challenge, the complexity of being brave and embracing discomfort as a leader. And that's what we work with leaders on.
SPEAKER_01Wow. Well, you talk about the expert trap.
SPEAKER_03Yes.
SPEAKER_01Okay. That called my attention.
SPEAKER_03Okay.
SPEAKER_01Okay, because all uh your organization has caught my attention, quite frankly. And and and um, I mean, again, to our to our viewers and our listeners, um, we're gonna announce this later, but we're gonna have a second podcast soon and we're gonna talk even, we're gonna go even deeper. Don't stop listening now because it's gonna get much better in just a few moments because we're gonna talk about the future of work. And so you want to stay tuned on this. But now you talk about the expert trap.
The Expert Trap And Losing Empathy
SPEAKER_03What is yeah, what is uh yeah, so that's kind of what I was referencing earlier around. Um, you know, you get you get really good at stuff and you learn about a lot of things, and you've been doing this leadership thing for a while and it's going pretty well. Sometimes, though, we get stuck in a trap of when we are the expert, it diminishes our ability to really empathize with other people. Alyssa and I work with um uh CEOs who are man, they are experts.
SPEAKER_04Yeah.
SPEAKER_03But sometimes they're trapped in sort of a level in the organization and also their own kind of sphere of expertise that it can actually inhibit the way that they are empathizing and understanding other people who are not in that situation, right? So um, it also can be kind of isolating. The ex part of the expert trap is that you feel sort of isolated in that expertise, and that's where the unlearning comes in. A great example of that is um oftentimes we have leaders in organizations just pushing and driving change, right? Because the world around us, that's what it's requiring. Well, they are situated in a position in the organization where they see things at a different level or they have expertise around what the world is requiring. And sometimes that means it actually becomes very difficult for them to put themselves back in a place of somebody who's not an expert and somebody who doesn't understand. And we help leaders figure out that gap and then how to drive the change that they are implementing with the expertise, certainly, but also with the deep empathy needed to bring people along, not just push it forward.
SPEAKER_01You know, I think one of the things, and I've and and I'm I'm sure a lot of us um when you're you're talking about this trap, this expert trap, you know, one of the things I was thinking about as I was uh again listening to you just now, and also my research is that there's leaders I know that's forgotten more than I know.
SPEAKER_03Sure.
SPEAKER_01That's sad.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Because you get in this trap. And then you call it and you get in this trap where you know you have so much knowledge, so much experience, but you're you're not displaying that. You're you're not engaged in it. Like you said, it gets to a pretty lonely place. Yeah. That's a sad place for a leader, I think, because you're you're really wasting your talent and ability to lead when you get there. And so that is a trap.
SPEAKER_03Yes, and I would add to that, it you know, at a certain point, your job as a leader is not really to be an expert. I mean, certainly your expertise is very important and your experience, but and maybe you have expertise in certain, you know, human skills or certain um industry, you know, specifics. But we also work with leaders, sometimes that expert trap means they are struggling to transition from functional expert or tactical or technical expert to my job now is not really to be an expert, it's to be and on those things, it's to be an expert on these people around me.
SPEAKER_04Yeah.
SPEAKER_03And how I can, with more expertise around them, transform the organization to reach its goals through my under my deep understanding of these people and human behavior. So we say that as leaders progress through an organization, the the expertise they need to gain is first and foremost a deep expertise in human behavior.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_03And understanding there. And that I think is also less lonely.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_03And maybe less sad because then they get to share it with others.
SPEAKER_01Right. Good, good client. Okay, we're gonna talk about a couple other things. Um,
Future Of Work Moves To Skills
SPEAKER_01I want to talk a bit about the future of work. Okay. Okay. And then also for our viewers and get uh listeners, I want to we're gonna talk a bit about culture secession. Kind of. Um and there's so much more we could talk about, but but definitely we're gonna spend a little time there because as as you have sort of led us through this process that you have and and this, you know, it's really interesting. I I mean, like I said earlier. So, okay, you can't open your laptop phone today without reading about AI.
SPEAKER_04Yeah.
SPEAKER_01I mean, it's you know, and and it's it's everywhere. Yeah. And it's gonna stay now.
SPEAKER_04Yeah.
SPEAKER_01I mean, it's here and it's gonna be it's gonna impact our lives. Yeah. It it's already impacting our lives. Yes. Uh so um again, uh talk to us about uh your thoughts around this, you know, that we're going from headcount to skill count. You know, the skill focus. And and um when we met, we just we have uh uh AI and people live event doing this bills when we met. And we were talking about, you know, this movement from head count to skill count. And, you know, so talk us about how you know how you approach that now in your in your space.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, uh, I mean, totally seriously, I would hate to fall into the expert trap and say that I also have all the answers because I definitely do not. So another element of what we kind of work with leaders on is just sometimes saying, well, I don't really know. I don't know these answers, but here's what I do know. Like, so I think when it comes to AI, you're right, it's it's here to stay. It it is going to be transformative in ways that many of us we're not sure yet, but we know it'll be large. And so what we say is when it comes to the future of work, we approach it as a we have trends, we can see where things are heading. We don't have those final answers, but we do know that the way human beings are gonna show up in that rapidly changing environment is probably not gonna be much different than how they showed up during the pandemic or during any other massive technological change. Now, this one may look different and it may be more rapid or it may have transformation at a scale that we've yet to see. But when it comes to the things that people are going to do and feel and behave around it, those are things we actually do now.
SPEAKER_04Right.
SPEAKER_03We know that there's going to be a lot of fear when we say the words head count, skill count, that immediately just triggers fear. Sure. For a lot of people. And so the to your point around the skill transfer, many, many, many AI skills, certainly. And at that event that you referenced in conversation with a couple of the panelists, I asked them what do you see as being a really, really critical leadership skill? And they said, well, first and foremost, leaders need to be using the AI tools. They need to have fluency and proficiency there for credibility's sake, right? And because it can help them. But when it comes to the, I guess, non-AI skills, the human skills, that's kind of where we often come in and help build the things that the leaders of the future are going to need. To your point earlier, when you were kind of like build exceptional teams, we say we don't know for sure what the future's going to look like. We know it's going to be very different. Build leaders and teams so strong that it actually doesn't really matter how fast it comes, because you will have leaders in your organization that people trust to lead them through it. That's high level, Andy.
SPEAKER_01No, it's it's good though, because you know, you again, it goes back to your original conversation earlier about how you need to be curious.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_01And yeah, because it's it's not gonna go away. AI is here to stay, and it's gonna be part of our lives. Yeah. And it's gonna be part of our leadership. And and you know, this the simple approach is to use AI to be more productive and efficient with your, but you've got to know your skill. You've got to know your space there and your leadership. And how are you gonna use that to make you more efficient and productive?
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_01And uh so Yeah, and absolutely.
Complicated Versus Complex Human Problems
SPEAKER_03And um, one of the ways that we look at it, I don't know if you um have read or you follow, I was a famous writer and professor Arthur Bricks. Um, I love him, I love everything that he writes. And he he talks about in this particular space leaders understanding the difference between complicated problems, which are problems that AI can help us solve. Right. Those kinds of things, though, are once we find a solution, it can be replicated and we can become more productive and more efficient. And that's awesome. So using it to solve those challenges is we we think where the future is headed. But complicated problems are different than complex problems. Right. Complex problems are things like how to motivate other people. Complex problems are how to build um a culture within your organization that's like kind of becomes its own organism. Complex problems are how to be in a relationship with somebody at work or in life. And those are the kinds of really complex problems for which there's not like a solution. It's not like we can just solve relationships. If that was the case, a lot of people would be out of work and probably very wealthy because they've come up with that. Those complex problems are the things that we as human beings will work on our whole lives. And as leaders, they're the hard people things that we need to work on, those skills, the skills necessary to cut to not solve, but tackle the complex human things within the workforce in the future. That's what life work does helping build those skills.
SPEAKER_01Okay.
Succession Planning For The Long Game
SPEAKER_01We have to we have to move to because this was so interesting again in my research. We have to move to secession culture.
SPEAKER_00Okay.
SPEAKER_01I I like what you said. I caught my attention. You said that you know, that you compare hiring to a marriage.
SPEAKER_02Well, so then you re then it in or you says, you know, it and it it can also lead to divorce later. That's right.
SPEAKER_01So uh so uh anyway, I I think you you your company has a very uh unique what focus around secession and culture aligned uh angle, if you will. So talk uh talk about how you know life work focuses heavily what we call the long gang.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. Okay.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Okay. So talk about that.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. So I mean, just to back up a tiny bit, our approach, you know, when we meet clients where they are is sometimes they're they're feeling a pain point that can be at least partially addressed by something that happens quickly, right? We need to change a behavior, we need to teach a specific skill, right? And those things are great. Our approach always, though, is okay, that's awesome for today or next quarter, right? What are we doing or what can we help you do to think about this for the next three to five to seven to 10 years, right? So how can you build? There's a skill building element, but you don't build complex human skills in a day or in a workshop, right? That is something that we work with organizations to build the frameworks for to implement into their processes and systems and into their culture so that five, 10 years from now, they have developed a learning culture or they have developed internal talent to the point where those human skills are commonplace. And so when it comes to succession planning, you know, I used to work in succession planning a lot for a great big company, and they still struggled with it. And one of the reasons I think so many companies do is because they focus a lot on skills. There are a lot of often assumptions made regarding human skills based on somebody's other kinds of skills. Right. And so where we often see organizations struggle is investing the same amount of time and attention and resources towards developing a leader's complex human skills as their functional skills or their technical skills, or maybe the foundational management skills. And that's often where we help them really think it through. Or they have names on a paper, right? And they're they're slotting them into roles. Well, have you thought about the human skills necessary for that role today versus five years from now? That's the kind of kind of discussions that we often have. So that they're actually building pipelines, not for the way the roles are today as much as in the future. And of course that's hard because we don't know for sure what it's going to look like. But oftentimes that level of kind of granularity looking at the both technical, functional, and human capabilities for the future aren't built into the development of their leaders today. And that's where we can help them.
SPEAKER_01Right. This is great. Okay. Um as we think about your company for a minute, let's go back. Okay. And you know, we as our beers and the street saying, okay, now this is interesting. It's this is interesting. I like where this is going. You're you're not only focused on the day, you're talking uh you're building a leader for the future, all of that. So how do they find if you know how do they find you? How do you know you're in Missou Joplin, Missouri? Yes. Okay, which is a great little town.
unknownOkay.
SPEAKER_01Yes. But okay. So talk about let's let's let's go back up now a bit and and and let's talk about your company a bit more and let's let's talk about your team and let's do some of that. Okay. Because I think we've I think you have done such a great job of uh of of really getting people to think about themselves and the opportunities and things like that. You've done an excellent job so far. Thank you. So talk to us about your company.
Who LifeWork Serves And Why
SPEAKER_03Yeah, so at LifeWork, um, it is two people, uh, myself and Alyssa Owsley, who wasn't able to be here today, but we are the founders and the lead consultants in our organization. Uh we are based in Joplin, Missouri, because that's where we live and that's where we um had a previous career working for a great big company. Um, but we have clients all over. So we have clients all over the US, quite a few sort of in the regional Midwest corridor, um, and then a lot of local clients as well. We work with organizations, like I mentioned earlier, kind of of every stripe. We have a lot of nonprofit clients. Um, we have found that many of the leaders working for nonprofits are some of the most lonely because they report to a board, maybe, or and don't have a team of peers, and it can be hard for them. Um, we also we've worked with many small organizations, those trying to transition from sort of a culture of founder personality to a culture of scalable people processes. We've worked with those organizations. And then we have a lot of clients that are big companies. Maybe we work with one of their major divisions or we partner with somebody within their um senior HR team to bring coaching to their leader. So we can do that in a variety of different ways. Um how do they find us? Yeah.
How To Reach LifeWork Talent
SPEAKER_03Well, you can go to our website, lifeworktalent.com, and there's a way to just reach out directly. Um, I'm hoping that whenever this gets recorded and we share it, people can reach out to us via LinkedIn or email, call me directly. They can reach out to us in any way. And then we are here in Northwest Arkansas very often um trying to meet as many people as we can in the different industry spaces to make additional connections.
SPEAKER_01Well, I will tell you what I have, you know, meeting meeting both of you, uh spending some time with you, and then our time on the uh on Zoom working through our questions today. Um, and then the what I'm reading about your company, I'm so impressed. I'm so impressed with what you're doing. And because of your approach to leadership, leadership development, your approach to the future of what work looks like, and and preparing the leaders for the future. Uh I am, and I and I just uh highly, highly recommend to all of our viewers and listeners to to really research your company, check your company out. We live like that. And uh because I would tell you, I I think I think these uh uh I think you've you're on to something, Vic, here. I hope so. And I I really do. And that's why I want, and I said earlier, is that I want you and Lisa to come back. I want I want you to come back. I want to talk much more about your company and get more in detail uh with what you're doing and how you're doing it. Now, um if you had to leave us with a couple of things as leaders, okay, what what would you leave us with?
Purpose And Meaning Beyond AI
SPEAKER_03What would I leave you with? That is a great question. I think I would leave leaders with uh a couple of things. One is as we talked about before, leadership can be a little lonely. Um, but it can also bring great joy. And myself having been a leader of many people at one point. Now I don't have a big team, right? But um I remember very distinctly, often feeling the tension between a little stress, a little loneliness, um, some imposter thinking, right? Uh lack of confidence at times. But also I experienced just great fulfillment and meaning and joy in the relationships that I built and being able to achieve something of purpose and meaning with a team of people that you like and enjoy and respect. I think that goes back to the origin of life work, is that we ourselves have felt and lived all of those things, which is why we think our life and our work should be integrated. And for any leader out there who's not sure if they're ready to meet the needs of the future, that's okay. We will always struggle with that. We will know if you ever get to the point where you're sure that you're ready, you might you might re-rethink that, right? But that there are people out there just like you that might have those thoughts and wonder and maybe not the confidence. And if you want to talk to me and Alyssa about it, reach out to us and we can chat with you and see what might be helpful. But I guess what I to sum up, um we love what we do because we get to help other leaders find purpose and meaning and help their teams find that. And I think at the end of the day, we can talk about AI all day long, every day, probably for the rest of our lives, but that's not gonna bring us purpose and meaning. Right. It's kind of who we are as individuals and how we interact with other human beings that will not change. And that I think feels very comforting with all the noise and distractions and changes around us. It's very comforting to me to know that those things won't change.
SPEAKER_01Right. Wow, that's powerful. It's so it's been so wonderful having you on. It's been great. Yeah, he's done such a nice job. Uh, and I really do recommend to all of our viewers uh and listeners to really check to check this great company out, Blathwork Talent Consulting, and check them out. Uh, you'll see their approach, you'll you'll see uh how they do it. And then, of course, you met Rachel. So, Rachel Houston, it's been such a pleasure to have you on doing this bill. And I can't wait to talk much more about this leadership for the future and and and all that. We're gonna get that done.
SPEAKER_03We are happy to talk about it and geek out on it anytime. So you just give us a call and we can we can have a pre-call and we can geek out on it a little and then we can come here and talk to you again.
SPEAKER_01Okay. So
Host Closing And Listener Links
SPEAKER_01again, to our viewers and listeners, thank you so much. It means so much that you are you have taken us around the world. We're in over 100 countries today and over 2,000 viewers a day. So thank you for that. You can reach me on LinkedIn, message me if you have recommendations for the show. We'll definitely take that in consideration. Also, make sure you check out our website. We have such, we have so many now new video shows. I want you to check them, check that out. Some great hosts that are just doing such a great job. You I think you will love that. And then, uh, of course, every week we uh send out a newsletter and then I'll write something on TC. So you can check that out too. Thank you again, Rachel. Thank you for being here. Okay. Goodbye, everyone. Have a great day.
SPEAKER_03Bye-bye.