From Chaos to Command: Mastering the C3 Method for Leaders w/ Disaster Patrick

Disaster Patrick, known for his innovative approach to disaster preparedness, is a seasoned expert with over 20 years of experience in crisis management. Renowned as the Indiana Jones of disaster prep, Patrick has revolutionized the field by integrating creative solutions such as building emergency shelters with Lego blocks and setting a world record for 28 hours of nonstop CPR. His unique methods and universal techniques empower individuals from any background to become proactive disaster responders.

From setting world records in CPR to rescuing 240 cats in a single evacuation, Patrick shares his cutting-edge insights on preparing for the unexpected. This episode introduces listeners to the concept of transforming disruptions into opportunities rather than viewing them as mere threats.

Patrick emphasizes the importance of mindset shifts in leadership, arguing that senior leaders must adopt a more proactive attitude toward disaster management. By envisioning a disaster as an opportunity for growth, leaders can facilitate a culture of resilience and adaptability within their teams. Additionally, Patrick discusses the significance of practical experience in preparedness, urging leaders to engage in realistic simulations to fortify their organizations against unforeseen challenges. His C3 Method—Command, Communicate, and Carry Out—provides a strategic framework for leaders to empower their teams and transform everyday disruptions into a competitive advantage.

Key Takeaways:

• Disaster preparedness can be an opportunity for personal and organizational growth rather than a cause for fear.
• Leaders should focus on creating a mindset shift, viewing disruptions as opportunities rather than threats.
• Patrick's C3 Method—Command, Communicate, and Carry Out—helps leaders develop a strategic approach to disaster management.
• Real-life simulations and practice drills tailored to mirror potential crises are essential for genuine preparedness.
• Empowering the right individuals at unexpected moments can significantly affect the outcome in crisis situations.

Notable Quotes:

• "Prepare for a disaster, and you'll never experience one."
• "Command, Communicate, and Carry Out—these core actions can transform everyday disruptions into a competitive advantage."
• "A resilient leader isn't just ready for disaster. They're ready to empower others and let go of control when necessary."
• "It's crucial to shift from seeing disruption as a threat to viewing it as an opportunity."
• "There's no good day for a disaster, so why not prepare for the worst or most inconvenient day?"

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www.leadershipmomentspodcast.com
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Follow Tracy-Ann Palmer on Instagram @tracy_ann_palmer

Transcript

Walk The Talk As Leaders

SPEAKER_03 0:01

You have to walk the talk. You have to be authentic as a leader. If you're not doing it, they see that.

SPEAKER_02 0:07

It is entirely universal. There's other people who are going through this.

SPEAKER_03 0:11

For me, a great leader needs to be able to marry three things: vision, systems, and people.

SPEAKER_02 0:20

Welcome

Welcome And Meet Disaster Patrick

SPEAKER_02 0:21

to Leadership Moments. If this is your first time, and if you are returning, thank you for your support.

SPEAKER_01 0:26

This show is about leaders from all walks of life, leadership tips, and maybe even a little of what you wouldn't expect to help you in leadership.

SPEAKER_02 0:35

We would appreciate it if you tell someone else about our podcast as we strive to support all leaders that want to just be better. Let's get on with the show. Today our guest is Disaster Patrick. Disaster Patrick is not the typical disaster expert. No doom and gloom, no scare tactics, just real actionable insights from the forefront of the world's toughest disaster challenges. Between setting the world record for 28 hours of nonstop CPR, building emergency shelters with Lego blocks, and evacuating 240 cats in 90 minutes, Disaster Patrick's mission is to push the edge of what's possible in preparing for disaster. He has had over 20 years of hands-on experience and crisis-related certifications that have translated into universal techniques of personal leadership, which make it possible for people from any background, regardless of life situation or even disability, to become elite disaster responders. Disaster Patrick is the Indiana Jones of disaster prep fearless, practical, and always a step ahead of the chaos. His lessons keep people safe, focused, and ready to face any crisis on hand. As Disaster Patrick says, prepare for a disaster and you'll never experience one. Let's jump in. Disaster Patrick, I'm so excited for you to be here today because you're going to tackle things a little bit differently, but something that all leaders think about all the time, either in their personal life or their professional life. And so I want to dive right in and I want to ask with your mission to change how the world, you know, thinks about preparedness, what's the biggest mindset shift that you think senior leaders need to make in order to get there?

SPEAKER_00 2:19

Well, first of all,

Break The Rescue Fantasy Mindset

SPEAKER_00 2:20

thank you very much for having me. I'm excited to talk about this topic. Um and what I the answer to your question is that is that there is this rescue fantasy that most leaders assume that in a crisis, that there's going to be some higher authority, whether it is a public sector agency like the government, or it's going to be a board of directors, or it's going to be experts, it's going to be banks, somebody, the insurance company, is going to arrive to save them. And the shift that I want leaders to make is this you are your own first responder. You have to be your own first responder. Because I mean, in the 2025, you know, Pal Cazine fires out in LA, uh, people realize the hard way that, for example, mass alerts, you know, wildfire alerts don't always come in and they're always not always right around the corner. And preparedness is really realizing that you have to be able to survive with what is in the room right now, with what you have available right now, the resources, the personnel, the policies, everything you have now, that is what'll best put you in a position to be successful.

SPEAKER_02 3:21

Yeah, I really like that because you're right. You're the first responder. And whether you want to believe it or not, it's really important. So, really good insight there. Now, part of your philosophy to disasters is that, you know, you don't have to destroy and that they can actually strengthen you. And so for leaders who've seen disruption as a threat, what's the first step to seeing opportunity instead?

SPEAKER_00 3:46

What I

Use What You Have To Win

SPEAKER_00 3:47

always say is don't look at what you don't have. Look at the utility of what you do have. Uh, what I say is don't look at what's been destroyed. Instead, look at what has been revealed. And so you have to really look at your what we sort of consider your low-value assets, right? So basic supplies and things. But if you can find a way to make everything work together as a team, then what you've done is you've built a resilient system within what you already have. You don't have to add additional resources because you have already maximized uh the re the ability of your current personnel uh to be successful. So, for example, I recently uh did the ultimate sort of low-value asset. Uh, I literally took school supplies from a regular classroom, you'd find any elementary school in America, and I turned them into a U.S. fire service compliant wildfire shelter. So I just used supplies. You found, you know, I we used aluminum foil and poster boards and and and art supplies and yard sticks, and we created a wildfire shelter. And if I can do that with a glue stick, imagine what your teams can do with actual resources. And it's something I test when I go to corporations all the time. We'll literally do things where we'll take off the supplies, we'll do something, and I'll say, okay, we're gonna, we're gonna build a command center here with nothing else external, because once again, you become your own first responder.

SPEAKER_02 5:09

Yeah, yeah. I really like that. It's it's a half glass full, right? View, which is what we try to do is leadership all the time. And I know in my coaching, that's what I try to do is look toward the positive side and what do you have available and what can you achieve? And a lot of times we can achieve more than what we realize, but when we really look at, you know, what's in front of us. So I love the way that you think about that. You know, a lot of organizations they practice these fire drills. I've done many tabletop, you know, disaster recovery plans and trying to think about how we're going to prepare for if and when the event does happen to be able to mirror reality. And so, how do you recommend that leaders design experiences that build the real preparedness?

SPEAKER_00 5:50

When

Why Most Drills Make You Weaker

SPEAKER_00 5:51

I talk about drills, I really am very, very strict about how I like to have them run because what I do is I see so many drills that are what I call Shakespearean drills. And that's what I see. So essentially what happens is uh they will say, okay, uh, we all know what we have to do. You know, CEO is going to be over here, the C-suites are gonna be over here, senior managers over here, and lying people here, and you're gonna do this, and you're gonna do this, and you're gonna do this, and you're gonna do this. And then the reality is that never works. That's never true. And in fact, what I've actually told corporations before that I've sat in rooms when they run drills, they've actually said, they said, Well, what do you think of our drill? And I said, This drill actually made you less prepared, not more prepared, less prepared. And they'd say, Well, I don't, I don't understand. How could you, how could you feel that way? And I'd say, because you are using something I call a magic wand. You are assuming all these people are gonna be available. You assume that everyone is gonna instantly have the resources that they need, they're gonna have the communication methodologies in place, they're gonna have the communication mediums, they're gonna have the message in place. Everything is gonna be cohesive, and there's way too much magic wanding. So, this is what I do. I'll go to corporation, I'll literally say to everybody, uh, Wes I walk in the room, they'll have me in there. I'll be talking to senior management. I'll say the first thing is I don't want anyone to introduce yourself. I don't want to know who anyone is. I don't want to know what your position is in the company. Don't care. And then I'll take a bunch of people, I'll take a list of the employees of the company and I'll say, I want this person, this person, this person, this person. And then I'll put all those people in a room and I'll say everyone else just has to observe. You can't be involved. And these are just random employees who have never worked together before. It's a mixture of management and line employees. And I do that because I want to force the company to see how it plan how a plan will work under actual conditions. I want to put it under that crucible of a real disaster. Because a real life doesn't give you a 40-page manual for a disaster plan, right? You really, a lot of things are about figuring it out on your own, developing solutions as a team on the fly. I mean, when I built the wildfire shelter, my team was a seven-year-old. It was me and the seven-year-old building this thing. We didn't have a corporate strategy. We just had clear goals, basic tools. That is how you build appropriate muscle memory, is that you force it. You force it so that you have to improvise because that is the way actual disasters work when there's a disruption at the company. It's gonna happen on a random day. Uh, there was actually a funny comic, my uh father used to. He actually framed it and he put it on the wall. And uh one of the things that the uh comic said was it said, you know, um, did this uh did this disaster occur? I mean, sorry, are we gonna run this drill on a random day? And they say, yes, it's incredibly inconvenient. Uh, can we do it on this day? No, it's incredibly inconvenient. And he says, that's the perfect day. The more inconvenient the day is to run the drill, that's the day when we need to run the drill. Because when you do do that, that simulates what the actual conditions are gonna be like. When you pre-arrange it and you have a bunch of people sitting around talking about things under ideal conditions, that tells you absolutely nothing and gives you a false sense of security.

SPEAKER_02 9:04

Yeah, I love that. There's no good day for a disaster, right? And so why not prepare for maybe what we would be the worst day or the most inconvenient day? So I love the way that you put that. I think what's really interesting there is how you randomly pick people and put them in a room. I've been the opposite where we have everyone in the room, and then we will randomly pull people out during the event saying they're not available anymore, they're not available anymore. And we actually take the people that are most active. So I love the flip on that, on how you do that.

SPEAKER_00 9:34

Yeah, one of the other things I do is I actually will do this. Uh I do do this a lot in healthcare. I have a lot of fun, fun with this. I'll put all the employees in the room, okay, for a shift, and all the management will be there, administration, the director of nursing who's the highest healthcare professional of, you know, in a facility like that. I'll have everybody, the director, everyone, in a room, and I'll say, uh, who's been here the least amount of time? Who knows this place the very least? Who knows the least amount about how we do things here? And there will inevitably be someone in the back, you know, averting, you know, averting their gaze so they're because they don't want to make eye contact with me. But then somebody raises their hand and I said, How long have you been here? Oh, I've been here, you know, 10 days. I'm like, perfect. Perfect. You see this big old disaster plan? Yeah. You're gonna run it for the next two hours by yourself. You are gonna lead. You're gonna lead the crowd. And does it mean it's gonna happen in real life? No, but does it mean it could happen? Yes. But what's the better element to that is it tells me an awful lot about the quality of that disaster plan. I I've actually run into disaster plans where I've seen them from F500 companies, and I'll literally take take the binders and I'll tear them up and I'll say, these bot these disaster plans aren't worth the paper they're printed on. Well, we paid $300,000 for them. Then you wasted $300,000. These plans are not useful. Because what happens is is if these are if, you know, the C-suites know how to use them sometimes, but when they don't, if when it's a regular employee, do they know how to activate things? Do they have the keys? Do they know how to do the so when you don't empower people at the bottom, then what happens is you have people on the top who may or may not be available, who are we're supposed to be run running everything. The philosophy comes again of I don't have to take care of it. Senior management will handle it. I don't need to learn it. The C-suites will do it, I don't need to do anything, the managers will handle it. And I flip that on its head and I turn to the facility and I say, the people on the bottom are now in charge. And the people who are on top, you do exactly as these people tell you to do. Period. Or I don't have them at all. I've had CEOs before who like, you know, well, like I'll have them like running around doing things and they'll inevitably try to say, no, we need to do this. And I'll say, you know, you're sort of violating the magic wand rule today. So I'm gonna have you set aside for about 45 minutes and you can watch, but you can't say anything. Because again, I want to see if employees can use the plan, because if they can't, it's a waste of time. The plan's a waste of time, the training was a waste of time, and the drill is a waste of time.

SPEAKER_02 12:00

Yeah, I love that. And that's extreme, you know, it's excruciating sitting on the sidelines like that, not being able to say anything when you're a leader. But I love that you put them in that position because it can be very real. Uh, there's things that happen with all of us every day for sure. Now

The C3 Method In Plain English

SPEAKER_02 12:15

you have a C three method method. I'd love for you to go into that and describe like how leaders can use this to transform everyday disruptions into a competitive advantage rather than a constant firefighting.

SPEAKER_00 12:27

Well, when we talk about it, uh the C three method is this it's command, communicate, and carry out. And I'll talk about each three. But those three things are the critical elements that break that really awful philosophy of I don't need to do it, senior management will do it. I don't need to do it, the government will handle it. Someone will rescue me. I'm not gonna be my own first responder. The C3 method breaks that and says, uh-uh, you are the first responder. And instead of just simply saying that out loud is sort of an interesting catchphrase that you that you'd hear in some motivational speech, I take it to the next level and I say, in your disaster plan, it needs to be embodied in the culture of the company. How do we activate the plan? So, what is what is command? Command is the most important. I pretty much say to people, look, whenever there's a disruption of any kind, this is the philosophy you need to take. If I do nothing, no one else will either. If I do nothing, no one else will either. That changes your mindset from if I do nothing, that's okay, management will handle it. You see how it delays and wastes time and causes additional issues and it disempowers people, versus saying, I have to do this on my own. Hence why I during drills, I'll literally take people in the back, the most inexperienced, and say, if they can't choose your plan, then what's the point of having one at all? Every single person in the facility should be able to pick up the plan and read it and use it. And so commanding is more than just set management saying this is a catchphrase where we're gonna put in the break room. It's during trainings. You turn to people and say, if I'm not here, you're gonna take over. If things are happening, you need to work together, and that's what happens. And so what you suddenly do is you turn people from a bunch of lemmings who don't do anything to an empowered workforce, which is what we're trying to do in our corporate functionalities, and we now bring them together with a management technology that says, now I'm in charge. The second part is communicate. So we talked about commanding, now we're talking about communicating. Communicating is really about making a team, a team effort. Can and this is a question I always ask can your employees form a team? Do they have the ability to do that and function effectively in a disruptive event like a disaster? And so when I look at plans and I see, well, CEO's the only one with the keys or head of maintenance, only one with the keys. There's no other way to get them. We don't have them in disaster backpacks. The disaster backpacks are locked up. When I hear about employees who tell me and this does happen, I'll get phone calls sometimes saying, hey, listen, like I'm pretty much told that if I try to access the plan, security will ask me why I want it. Okay. So that's a culture that's very, very problematic. And so what I say is, is you've got to allow people to form their own teams. That's why in drills, I force it. I force people to have to when I when I run tabletops, I literally will have random managers who I make sure I've never really worked together on anything. And I'll, you know, and random people who can flip through the plan because during a tabletop, every single person should have a disaster plan in front of them. Every single person. So that if they don't know the answer, they should be able to look in there and find the answer. And if they can't, that tells me a lot about the plan. I don't even have to touch a piece of paper. I can instantly know it isn't going to work. And then the last one is carry out. Basically, can you do tasks? Does do we have the resources? Do we have the ability to take out the tasks that we need to do? Have people been trained? Have we an active disaster plan? And so these are things that I look at and evaluate. And that C3 method, again, it's not some complicated system. It's just a system that I've used with small businesses. I literally will show up, I won't have a piece of paper, I won't have a pad, I won't have a phone or anything. I'll just sit in there and I'll say, I'm gonna evaluate your plan. They'll be like, how? And I'll be like, I'm just gonna read through it. We're gonna do a drill right now. Right now? Yeah, right now. And we're gonna, and that forces them uh to put them in a position to be to to uh to have to develop. Do we have the ability to empower people? Do we have the ability to form teams? And do we have the ability to carry things out? I can find that out in 15 minutes without using anything else and without having to run a four-hour tabletop drill. I instantly found out right now in 15 minutes. Does this plan have a chance of being successful?

SPEAKER_02 16:54

Yeah, love that. So command, communicate, and carry out. Uh and what I like about that is it's not just in the moment, like there's things you can do today to start building that culture and empowering your employees to be able to do that. Um, so it's natural to them, it becomes natural. Yeah. So

When One Person Holds The Plan

SPEAKER_02 17:15

I'm curious, what do you think is one uncomfortable truth that leaders need to know right now?

SPEAKER_00 17:21

That if the survival of the organization is dependent on one particular person, your plan is going to fail. One of the things I teach, and the reason why I talk about the C3 method, again, I went when I keynote, I talk about this, but it isn't just that. It's actually when I'm in buildings, when I'm with people, when I'm with my clients, we say, how is it that we can empower the people all throughout the organization? And that requires some very difficult conversations. I can't tell you the number of times where I'll go into an organization and they'll say, Patrick, Patrick, Patrick, we have written a beautiful business continuity plan, which for those of you don't know what business continuity plan is, essentially is a disaster recovery plan. So I'll and I'll say, okay, great. I'll say, uh, you know, who has it? And they'll say, well, the continuity planner does. And I'll be like, has anyone else seen it? No, no one else is allowed to read it. No one else is allowed to read it. It's about your process recovery. How do we know what's in it? Well, we're not really supposed to. It's considered a security matter. Business continuity plans are not a security matter. And for those of you who are listening to this who have business continuity plans under lock and key, I will tell you that my father was a continuity planner, my grandfather was one. I'm the first third generation continuity planner in human history. And I can tell you that continuity plans have no business being behind security doors. They are things that people have the right to know. How do we recover? Do we even plan to recover? And these are things that become really important. But if what you've done is, is you said, well, you know, the whole, you know, everything relies on one person. So you know what? We're just gonna leave it to them. Again, if I don't do anything, that's okay. Management will handle it. If I don't do anything, the CEO will handle it. I don't do anything, FEMA will handle it. I hear these refrains all the time. And again, without picking up a piece of paper or glancing at a disaster backpack that hasn't been touched in a year, I can tell you right now that that plan is going to fail. So you have to be prepared. So for those of you who are listening to this who have not done this, you need to think about this as your uncomfortable truth. I want you to take your employee who has the least experience. I want you to hand them the disaster plan and put them in charge for 30 minutes. That will tell me everything I need to know as to whether or not you have truly empowered every single person at the company. Can they take command? Can they communicate and create a team? And can they execute the tasks that you're asking them to do? Can they carry those tasks out? That's what tells me so much. I mean, when I was doing the shelter play, the wildfire shelter with school supplies, I had a seven-year-old and I, we were literally sat there and said, here's how we're gonna build this thing. We're gonna put the yardsticks together and we need to make sure we give room so that we have the aluminum foil and we can put the binders together, all these things. And again, it's empowering people because I say if I can empower a seven-year-old to help me build a wildfire shelter, I think you can get grown adults to activate a disaster plan that is well mature. But again, it doesn't come down to paper, it doesn't come down to equipment, doesn't come down to technology, it comes down to empowerment of the individual.

SPEAKER_02 20:27

Yeah, so true. And I love that. What an easy thing to ask all our listeners to do that you could easily just grab someone and do that with with your disaster recovery plan. So it seems so easy and how revealing it will be for sure. I'd

Empowerment That Saves Real Moments

SPEAKER_02 20:41

love to hear an example of like where empowering the right person, even in the unexpected moment, how it made all the difference in the crisis. Do you have any examples that you could share about that?

SPEAKER_00 20:52

Well, I'm gonna talk about the shelter that I just built. Uh, okay. So what I did was uh I had a seven-year-old with me. His name was Liam. Okay, and Liam's a seven-year-old, and he could have just stood around while I built everything. Well, I did everything, but I didn't. I turned to him and I said, I'm not building this shelter. We are gonna build this. And so I listened to him and said, Here's how we're gonna build these things. And I said, What would you think if we did this? Because ultimately in the end, we were gonna put him in there and I wanted to make sure they had room for him. And so everything we built, I listened to suggestions and things he was saying to me, was saying, you know, we even though there are all these technical requirements, that's fine. I turned to him and I said, What do you think would additionally make you comfortable in here? Because a shelter isn't just about putting you in some hot box. What it's about is putting you in a position where I can make you successful in the future. How can I build this shelter so that you would actually use it? It isn't just something that I'm just doing for some theoretical purpose. And so what I did was we built this thing together and we ensured that we had the right poster board, and he cut it to the ends to make sure that it fit the And that's what happened. And in fact, I even got the idea to do this thing because I was at a school one time. And uh what I did was I was at I was hired by this charter school out in California. And they said, um, you know, would you be willing to write our disaster program and train everybody? And I said, Fine. I said, You understand, I'm also going to train the kids. And they thought that was really weird. And I said, No, no, no, I'm going to train the kids just as much as I train the teachers and the principals. And they said, that's fine. So what happened was I went to the I went to a classroom and I said to everybody, you know, if there's ever a disaster of any kind, and I don't care what it is, you are not to leave this room without two things. That red backpack in the corner and the roll sheet. Right. So the roll sheet basically said who what kids are here and what what kids are sick or at home or whatever. And so I told the kids we're going to pick a captain and a vice captain right now. And so we picked the captain, we picked the vice. The kids did. I didn't do it. They did. They picked the captain, they picked the vice captain. I we picked a couple of other people as backups because of that. Everybody, there was plenty of people. All right. About six months later, I got a phone call from the school. The school actually had a real fire. Um one of the science annexes caught fire. And so that classroom had a bunch of kids, and that day they had a substitute teacher. Say it a guest teacher. And what happened was the instant the disaster happened, the fire alarms go off, and the teacher went ran out of the room and told the kids, okay, let's go, let's go. And the kids were being, you know, hurtled out of the room. And the captain and the vice captain remembered what I told them. They grabbed the backpack, they grabbed the roll sheet, and the teacher didn't realize it until they got out to the field. And the teacher suddenly realized, oh, I gotta run back into the building to get the backpack. I gotta run back in the building to get the roll sheet. And the kids handed her the roll sheet and the backpack because they remembered it. And the reason why they did is because I told them you take command, you communicate, and you get it done. It's not on anyone else. It's not on teachers, it's not on principals, it's not on cops, it's not on firemen, it's not on EMS professionals, it's on you. And that when I did that, the kids were able to respond in a tremendous way. They can be such a they they can be such a great group of teams if you empower them. So for all those out there who have corporate teams, that's what I try to do when I work with you is I try to say, how can we develop those teams? And I encourage you to develop that on your own of saying, how can I develop that culture of teamwork in disasters? When you do that, you would be amazed at what people will do if you give them that basic trust.

SPEAKER_02 24:44

What a great story. I love that. And I'm so glad that everything worked out for that school and those kids and the and the student teacher as well. Uh, it's so amazing. And what I love about that is I actually was just talking to a client the other day and we were talking about empowering their team. And, you know, sometimes people need permission to be empowered. You would think that it just comes naturally, but it doesn't. And sometimes you just have to say it out loud, which is your command part, right? Which is saying you need to take command, do not assume that someone else is taking it. Uh, so I really, really like those pieces. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 25:18

Yeah, and no, that's what I try and do, is I try to encourage CEOs, especially to say that. And what I actually encourage them to do is actually say, when we do trainings, I want you to come in the room and I want you to look at everybody and say, I agree with what this guy is saying. Because otherwise sometimes they'll say it and then they'll say, Wow, he doesn't really mean that. Well, no, no, we really mean that. No, that's what he means.

SPEAKER_02 25:35

Yeah, you force it, right? Right. Yeah, that's right.

SPEAKER_00 25:40

I'll tell the CEO, I need you to tell everybody what the expectations are here. And so it's not always a CEO, you know what I mean. It's some C-suite person or a C senior manager who says, Yep, this is what we're doing. And when they do the drill, that's where the rubber meets the road because I'll literally say, Hey, this is more than just, you know, the person saying it, he or she, CEO say saying this. We're actually doing it in the drill. And they actually see the fact that the CEO is backed off. It isn't just some guy in a uniform who's here for two days and leaves. It's, you know, we actually did the drill and we actually were executing this as part of the culture of preparedness that we've developed as part of our disaster program. And that's what really will make it successful.

SPEAKER_02 26:19

So and we don't have much time, but I have to ask, because you've been doing this for so many years, then we all learn as we go. Like right now, you have a lot of experience. You're very clear on how to be successful and helping people build these plans. But can you just give one quick example, possibly, about, you know, maybe another organization or something that you've done where you learn something new that might be helpful for our listeners, just to kind of remember as they're building their plan.

SPEAKER_00 26:45

I recently

240 Cats And The Adaptability Lesson

SPEAKER_00 26:46

uh did a video where I had to evacuate 240 cats in 90 minutes. And so I developed a methodology for how to do that. And so I went to this organization. It was a cat shelter, and it was filled with pee people. And I said, Okay, guys, I've developed this great method. We're gonna do this stuff, and you know what I forgot? Cats are not human beings. Cats are not people. There's a reason why they just say hurting cats, and that is such a funny cliche because it's so important for people to realize there are going to be elements that are going to fight you, even when it is in their best interest. So in this case, we were trying to evacuate them for a simulated wildfire. Well, the cats ran away, they didn't want to do it, they were like hiding and cowering, as I I could totally understand that. And one the lesson that I draw from that is, and that video will be coming out in April. I'm actually really excited about it, is that when when we are working in disasters, we have to remember things are not gonna run according to plan. If you remember what I mentioned earlier, I said Shakespearean drills, meaning we always think, okay, this will happen, then this will happen, then this will happen, then this will happen, the end, and that's not the way it works. It's like we plan for these three things, and then the next 10 things go way off the rails. That's why the C3 method is so powerful because it forces you to think, okay, we have a team, we're empowered to do things that allows us to adapt, that allows us to have options, that allows us to do things. So when things were going off the rails with the cats, I turned to everybody and said, we're gonna switch this up, we're gonna change what we're doing, and that's gonna make all the difference in the world. And it did, and we were able to do it. But again, you have to have that adaptability. If you have a rigid corporate structure that you are married to, then that is going to hinder your disaster program because people ultimately will think it won't, it doesn't really matter what I say. My uh what I my entire job today is to listen to what someone else has to tell me.

SPEAKER_02 28:51

240 cats. Wow. I know people that try to look for their one cat for days.

SPEAKER_00 28:57

That that's also me a lot of times, too. When I'm trying to I had to evacuate my home a number of years ago and I had a cat, and she was she used to be feral, but she would she end up being house cat, and she was hard to find. And so, like, that was one of the things I got the idea for. And I was thinking, there's gotta be a better way of doing this. So I worked with my team and we we developed some some really cool stuff. But it it's a fun challenge, right? Because it's a microcosm of what you're dealing with in real disasters because the cats could represent your employees, the cats could represent your resources, the cats could represent clients, the cats could represent the disaster itself. Anything can go out of control, it's that adaptability that really demonstrates are you really disaster resilient or not?

SPEAKER_02 29:35

Unbelievable, unbelievable. Well,

Resilient Leaders Learn To Hand Off

SPEAKER_02 29:37

thinking about resilient and all that, I'd love for you to just kind of finish a sentence for me to give our listeners something to think about. And that's a resilient leader isn't just ready for disaster, they're ready to what?

SPEAKER_00 29:49

Hand it off to someone else. That they're prepared to hand off their responsibilities to other people. If you are so tied to I have to run everything, if you are so tied to that, I I can't believe the number of I can't tell you the number of times I'll go to organizations and they will say, Oh, we have to have Mary. She's the only one who knows these things. She's the but we have the most brilliant disaster plan in the world. But Mary's the one who knows everything. And I say, I have just revealed your first flaw. I have just revealed that. A true resilient leader is the one who says, it's not about me, it's about the organization as a whole. And so when someone is able to hand it off to someone else and sit on the side, that is a true resilient leader, one who can sit there and watch their team be successful without them involved.

SPEAKER_02 30:41

Wow. I did not expect that answer. I think it was great. It's so hard to let go of the people that we really entrust in certain things, right? To build that trust and them being able to let go of it and so important. So I love that. That's beautiful.

SPEAKER_00 30:58

Yeah, it's fun. And it's always fun for me because I love watching leaders squirm. I'm actually I've actually been a CEO for 15 years. So I know what it's like to have to stand and say, As a matter of fact, my mom was a principal of an elementary school, and so I ran and drilled there. My mother is this really sort of gregarious German lady and is so used to it. She's a wonderful person. She really loves the she really loved the kids. She's actually retired now, but she loved the kids, she loved being involved. When I had to turn her and say, Mom, you're not going to be involved in the drill. You should have seen the look on her face. Because I said, I have to see, are you empowering your own employees? And some of my mom, being my mom, trying to tell people, you got this. Just make sure you do this and make sure you do that. I go, no, no, no. On their own, mother. On their own. And this is really fun to see that to watch leaders do that because it just forces. It goes, we can see this doesn't require hundreds of thousands of dollars, doesn't require difficult things. We can reveal these problems right away and fix them. They're not hard to fix, but they do require a cultural ship. And a lot of times leaders take a little bit of time to adjust to that, let's just say.

SPEAKER_02 31:56

Yeah. All right.

Rapid Fire Questions And Mindset

SPEAKER_02 31:59

Well, there's that sound. It's time for our fun questions. Are you ready for those questions? Sure. All right. Are you a coffee person or a tea person? I'm a tea person. Tea. Okay. And do we uh what kind of tea? What's your favorite tea?

SPEAKER_00 32:14

I drink uh usually uh fruit-based teas because I don't drink caffeine of any kind. So I like fruit-based teas. So things like pomegranate tea. I was in I lived in Hawaii for about a year. I had a disaster contract there. It was a hard, hard, hard place to live. I bet. Yeah, it was. It was one of those hardship posts that you always talk about. Uh, and I always had and I had pomegranate tea and I got hooked on it. And so I really uh so I end up having that whenever it's the winter time here in California. So yeah, there you go.

SPEAKER_02 32:45

Yeah. What I love is that you you bring so much energy in this conversation, and you're like, I don't take caffeine, right? So just think about for those listeners out there that you need your 10 cups of coffee before you leave the house. There is a way to bring energy without all that caffeine in your body. So I love that. Um, all right. Do you love a sunrise hike or would you rather unwind on a sunset cruise?

SPEAKER_00 33:10

I love hiking. I love being outdoors. Um, I love that intersection between humans and the environment. And there's so many studies which show that being out in nature really centers you. So one of the things I tell people when they say, when the when it when, you know, when they they uh tell me all the time, oh, you don't drink caffeine, I said, that's okay because I get to go in the environment and that relaxes me. It just feels so good to be in the milieu of our environment. And in California, what we have so many places where I can actually do that. So I love going out. I love hiking, I love interacting with people, I love that social element as well. So it's just really great to go out there because we have to enjoy our natural resources or we don't appreciate them. And they also allow us to center ourselves psychologically and think we have to remember we are even though we have jobs, we're busy, we got tasks. Taking a hike gives you a perspective that we are part of a wider ecosystem. And that gives us a better touch of who we are as human beings to the environment.

SPEAKER_02 34:07

100%. Finding awe in life is a beautiful thing, and it does really center you. And seeing nature around you helps you with that awe. Like just listening to that bird chirping in the background for a minute and just pause and listen to it, or hearing the wind through the trees, or looking at the mountain. I 100% agree with you. And you're right. There's so many studies behind it that actually prove it. So I love that. Absolutely beautiful. Well, Patrick, thank you so much for your time today. I think you gave our listeners so many great takeaways that they can put into action right away. And really appreciate everything that you offered today in our in our conversation.

SPEAKER_00 34:44

Yeah, thank you very much for having me. I thought this was a lot of fun. And for those of you who are out there doing this, remember this doesn't have to be hard. This doesn't have to be doom and gloom. It doesn't have to be blood and guts. This can be something that is really empowering. It can be a wonderful thing. I don't want you to think that disaster preparedness has to be that horrible, horrible chore that we never ever want to do. I want it to be something where we say, this is an opportunity that not only am I a resilient leader, but I am empowering the people around me to be resilient leaders as well. That is what will make the biggest difference.

Subscribe And Send Guest Ideas

SPEAKER_01 35:22

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SPEAKER_02 35:33

You can also send us a message on what you like and don't like or what guests you want us to have on the show. So until next time, this is Stacy Caster, and what does it challenge you won't change you.

SPEAKER_01 35:43

And I'm Tracy M. Palmer. Be the change you wish to see in the world.