1 00:00:01,762 --> 00:00:03,766 Speaker 1: Hello and welcome to the Bootstrapper's Guide to 2 00:00:03,806 --> 00:00:06,432 Logistics, the podcast highlighting founders doing it 3 00:00:06,451 --> 00:00:08,134 the way that doesn't get a lot of attention. 4 00:00:08,134 --> 00:00:11,067 We're here to change that by sharing their stories and 5 00:00:11,106 --> 00:00:12,570 inspiring others to take the leap. 6 00:00:13,699 --> 00:00:16,228 Speaker 2: It's a roller coaster ride that you might ultimately 7 00:00:16,248 --> 00:00:16,489 fail. 8 00:00:17,100 --> 00:00:19,068 Speaker 1: That's when I kind of knew I was on to something. 9 00:00:19,068 --> 00:00:20,646 It was very hard. 10 00:00:20,646 --> 00:00:25,486 It truly is building a legacy the more life you live, the more 11 00:00:25,486 --> 00:00:28,565 wisdom you have, Because we are where we're supposed to be. 12 00:00:28,565 --> 00:00:30,251 Kind of answering the call. 13 00:00:30,780 --> 00:00:33,207 Don't shoulder entrepreneurship on your own. 14 00:00:33,207 --> 00:00:35,112 I'm your host, Nate Shoots. 15 00:00:35,112 --> 00:00:38,168 Let's build something together from the ground up. 16 00:00:38,168 --> 00:00:43,185 Hello everybody, and welcome back to the show. 17 00:00:43,185 --> 00:00:46,694 For those that can't tell by my accent, I am from the Midwest. 18 00:00:46,694 --> 00:00:49,386 If you've been listening for any length of time, you figured 19 00:00:49,426 --> 00:00:49,526 out. 20 00:00:49,526 --> 00:00:52,412 It's distinctly Minnesotan and nearly Canadian. 21 00:00:52,412 --> 00:00:55,984 So I'm really happy this week to get to talk to one of my 22 00:00:56,085 --> 00:00:59,911 neighbors to the south, Chris Brewer, who is the CEO of River 23 00:00:59,951 --> 00:01:01,673 City Logistics, based in Iowa. 24 00:01:01,673 --> 00:01:02,956 Chris, do I have an accent? 25 00:01:05,402 --> 00:01:08,302 Speaker 2: I am not from the Midwest and I can pinpoint the 26 00:01:08,322 --> 00:01:09,203 Midwest accents. 27 00:01:09,203 --> 00:01:12,731 I think Minnesotans have a distinct accents and I think 28 00:01:12,871 --> 00:01:14,746 folks in Wisconsin have a distinct accent. 29 00:01:14,847 --> 00:01:17,260 Speaker 1: Oh yeah, wisconsin, for sure, that's right, I forget 30 00:01:17,260 --> 00:01:17,260 . 31 00:01:17,260 --> 00:01:18,364 You're from California. 32 00:01:18,364 --> 00:01:20,837 You moved to the Midwest at some point and now you've got 33 00:01:20,897 --> 00:01:22,742 offices around the country a couple of different places. 34 00:01:23,525 --> 00:01:23,805 Speaker 2: Yeah. 35 00:01:23,805 --> 00:01:27,635 So I moved here to go to college, played baseball. 36 00:01:27,635 --> 00:01:32,106 I met my wife like the first weekend we were in school and 16 37 00:01:32,106 --> 00:01:33,510 years later, three kids. 38 00:01:33,510 --> 00:01:34,251 Here we are. 39 00:01:35,260 --> 00:01:37,367 Speaker 1: First week of freshman year of college. 40 00:01:38,007 --> 00:01:38,228 Speaker 2: Yes. 41 00:01:38,650 --> 00:01:39,090 Speaker 1: Tell me more. 42 00:01:40,599 --> 00:01:41,700 Speaker 2: Oh man. 43 00:01:41,700 --> 00:01:44,864 Well, there's a lot to that story. 44 00:01:44,864 --> 00:01:50,111 I'll try to keep the specific details out, but I got invited 45 00:01:50,131 --> 00:01:54,075 to this house party, mind you, I flew to Iowa, having never 46 00:01:54,135 --> 00:02:07,123 visited the campus or the state in California, and coach, uh, 47 00:02:07,143 --> 00:02:08,669 coach of a coach, friend of a friend, set my tape to a couple 48 00:02:08,688 --> 00:02:09,091 different schools. 49 00:02:09,091 --> 00:02:10,918 Um, I get a call, they fly out, they watched me throw and they 50 00:02:10,979 --> 00:02:13,848 offered a full ride education, and it's pretty hard to say no 51 00:02:13,868 --> 00:02:14,151 to that. 52 00:02:14,151 --> 00:02:18,145 So, uh, say goodbye to all my family, packed up, uh, flew to 53 00:02:18,306 --> 00:02:18,627 Iowa. 54 00:02:18,627 --> 00:02:19,813 Uh, this is a true story. 55 00:02:19,854 --> 00:02:23,205 When I was flying into Dubuque regional airport, um, I 56 00:02:23,284 --> 00:02:25,971 legitimately thought the plane was crashing because I could see 57 00:02:25,971 --> 00:02:26,712 nothing but corn. 58 00:02:26,712 --> 00:02:33,264 I tell that story all the time as a proud Iowan. 59 00:02:33,264 --> 00:02:34,769 Now I love this place. 60 00:02:34,769 --> 00:02:39,526 It is the best place for me to be, it fits my character, my 61 00:02:39,586 --> 00:02:42,280 culture, it's the best place to raise a family. 62 00:02:42,280 --> 00:02:45,806 But to go back to the original topic, I just had to share that 63 00:02:45,847 --> 00:02:48,612 story because when I do share it with people they generally do 64 00:02:48,693 --> 00:02:48,913 laugh. 65 00:02:48,913 --> 00:02:53,687 But a city kid flying into the middle of corn and cornfields 66 00:02:53,727 --> 00:02:57,173 everywhere, you could kind of feel my sentiment there. 67 00:02:57,173 --> 00:02:57,753 Like it was a little. 68 00:02:57,753 --> 00:02:59,506 I thought we were going down. 69 00:02:59,506 --> 00:03:02,907 But no, I met my wife the first weekend. 70 00:03:02,907 --> 00:03:05,828 We didn't date until the following year, we were just 71 00:03:05,889 --> 00:03:06,401 friends she. 72 00:03:06,401 --> 00:03:08,127 She played on the softball team . 73 00:03:08,127 --> 00:03:11,647 So we we kind of intermingled with friends and stuff for a 74 00:03:11,687 --> 00:03:15,481 long time and um kind of gave it a go the next year and we've 75 00:03:15,502 --> 00:03:16,507 been together ever since. 76 00:03:17,381 --> 00:03:18,722 Speaker 1: Well, congratulations it's. 77 00:03:18,722 --> 00:03:21,180 We got a bunch to unpack there already. 78 00:03:21,180 --> 00:03:23,147 First, glad you made it to the Midwest. 79 00:03:23,147 --> 00:03:26,941 It's God's country. 80 00:03:26,941 --> 00:03:27,862 We love it here. 81 00:03:27,862 --> 00:03:33,375 To be a scholarship athlete requires a whole lot of not only 82 00:03:33,375 --> 00:03:35,500 skill but sacrifice and effort. 83 00:03:35,500 --> 00:03:39,430 That I'm 100% sure is connected to how you run your company and 84 00:03:39,430 --> 00:03:41,162 why you chose to start it in the first place. 85 00:03:41,162 --> 00:03:43,329 So we can certainly unpack that . 86 00:03:43,329 --> 00:03:47,562 But we can also unpack the family impact of 87 00:03:48,462 --> 00:03:51,729 entrepreneurship is not a individual pursuit, it's a whole 88 00:03:51,729 --> 00:03:53,271 family endeavor. 89 00:03:53,271 --> 00:03:57,391 So my first question is how would your kids describe what 90 00:03:57,451 --> 00:03:57,854 you do? 91 00:03:57,854 --> 00:03:59,379 What would they say to other people? 92 00:03:59,500 --> 00:04:04,704 Speaker 2: your job is so my son tells people that I'm a truck 93 00:04:04,723 --> 00:04:07,765 driver, which I think is awesome . 94 00:04:07,765 --> 00:04:14,491 My daughter, she's seven she just says that daddy is the boss 95 00:04:14,491 --> 00:04:18,994 of River City and she knows that we have warehousing, asset 96 00:04:19,053 --> 00:04:21,456 based operations and brokerage. 97 00:04:21,456 --> 00:04:28,221 So she at least has the concept down in brokerage. 98 00:04:28,221 --> 00:04:28,961 So she at least has the concept down. 99 00:04:28,961 --> 00:04:29,584 The funny thing I travel a lot. 100 00:04:29,584 --> 00:04:30,786 I'm still very involved in the business development side. 101 00:04:30,786 --> 00:04:34,822 I travel on average about 120 to 150 days a year, sometimes 102 00:04:34,901 --> 00:04:36,567 less, sometimes right at that number. 103 00:04:36,567 --> 00:04:41,161 But anytime my kids see an airplane in the sky and I'm not 104 00:04:41,281 --> 00:04:43,567 home, they tell mom that dad's on the airplane. 105 00:04:43,567 --> 00:04:46,464 Um, but they're little, they don't know any different, right? 106 00:04:46,464 --> 00:04:48,392 So I just think that that's really cute. 107 00:04:48,392 --> 00:04:52,927 Um, but yeah, I'm, I'm a truck driver and then I'm just the 108 00:04:52,966 --> 00:04:53,810 boss of river city. 109 00:04:53,810 --> 00:04:54,812 That's what the kids say. 110 00:04:55,000 --> 00:04:56,403 Speaker 1: If you had a seven-year-old who knows the 111 00:04:56,444 --> 00:04:57,627 phrase asset based. 112 00:04:57,627 --> 00:04:58,951 I mean, we're making progress here. 113 00:05:10,819 --> 00:05:11,100 Speaker 2: You got it. 114 00:05:11,100 --> 00:05:13,064 You got a future head of sales in your house or you know she's 115 00:05:13,084 --> 00:05:14,569 going to be running the financials or something one day. 116 00:05:14,569 --> 00:05:15,310 Yeah, she's super type A. 117 00:05:15,310 --> 00:05:16,814 Um, she, she's definitely got like the CPA in her, maybe, 118 00:05:16,834 --> 00:05:18,458 maybe some form of dentistry or maybe medicine. 119 00:05:18,458 --> 00:05:20,281 Um, my son, um, he's very much a little bit different than her, 120 00:05:20,281 --> 00:05:21,603 a little bit of a rule follower . 121 00:05:21,603 --> 00:05:23,749 The youngest one is the one you got to look out for. 122 00:05:23,749 --> 00:05:27,978 So my youngest Sophia she's two She'll tell you exactly what 123 00:05:28,017 --> 00:05:30,302 she wants, when she wants it and how she wants it. 124 00:05:30,302 --> 00:05:34,372 So if I had to pick one of the three to be the future CEO, if 125 00:05:34,411 --> 00:05:35,901 and when I step away, it's probably her. 126 00:05:36,502 --> 00:05:40,870 Speaker 1: That's good insights on birth order as future 127 00:05:40,911 --> 00:05:42,233 predictor of jobs too. 128 00:05:42,233 --> 00:05:44,502 I mean, I'm tracking with everything that you're saying 129 00:05:44,523 --> 00:05:44,702 there. 130 00:05:44,702 --> 00:05:47,867 So you've got a freight brokerage. 131 00:05:47,867 --> 00:05:50,932 Now you do warehousing services . 132 00:05:50,932 --> 00:05:53,156 You've got around 100 employees or so I believe. 133 00:05:53,779 --> 00:05:59,384 Speaker 2: Yes, Yep 100, give or take between all three entities 134 00:05:59,384 --> 00:06:00,927 something like that. 135 00:06:01,206 --> 00:06:02,288 Speaker 1: You didn't start with 100. 136 00:06:02,288 --> 00:06:05,190 You probably started with far humbler origins, and 137 00:06:05,571 --> 00:06:10,035 conventional wisdom financially is get a job, save for 138 00:06:10,074 --> 00:06:20,461 retirement, do all of the things , follow the prescribed path for 139 00:06:20,461 --> 00:06:21,442 your life as dictated by the powers that be. 140 00:06:21,442 --> 00:06:22,723 And yet you shared with me that you cashed out part of your 141 00:06:22,744 --> 00:06:24,906 401k just to even get started, which goes against all 142 00:06:24,987 --> 00:06:26,007 conventional wisdom. 143 00:06:26,007 --> 00:06:29,213 Help me unpack for me. 144 00:06:29,213 --> 00:06:31,055 What was that conversation like ? 145 00:06:31,055 --> 00:06:33,545 And do you remember depositing the check and being like all 146 00:06:33,584 --> 00:06:36,961 right, I'm literally risking my future for something that I 147 00:06:37,000 --> 00:06:37,401 believe in. 148 00:06:38,161 --> 00:06:42,406 Speaker 2: I remember the 30 to 60 days that kind of preceded 149 00:06:42,447 --> 00:06:43,267 that decision. 150 00:06:43,267 --> 00:06:49,761 I started my career in the space and I worked for two 151 00:06:49,800 --> 00:06:52,687 really good organizations, took some time away. 152 00:06:52,687 --> 00:06:54,353 I knew I wanted to be an entrepreneur. 153 00:06:54,353 --> 00:06:57,107 I didn't know how much time I was going to take away from it. 154 00:06:57,107 --> 00:06:59,680 It took a little over two, two and a half years. 155 00:06:59,680 --> 00:07:03,990 I was selling packaging materials for, at the time, one 156 00:07:04,009 --> 00:07:09,084 of my clients and it was, it was fine, it did well, um, and I 157 00:07:09,144 --> 00:07:14,074 came home from work one day and I told my wife at the time, um, 158 00:07:16,024 --> 00:07:20,276 my daughter was three months old and I said I quit my job and I 159 00:07:20,315 --> 00:07:25,572 cashed into my 401k and I'm going all in and you could have 160 00:07:25,593 --> 00:07:27,600 heard a pin drop in that kitchen . 161 00:07:28,980 --> 00:07:31,543 And I don't say this lightly but like. 162 00:07:31,543 --> 00:07:35,588 I am incredibly blessed to have married somebody that loves me 163 00:07:35,668 --> 00:07:39,391 unconditionally, that supports my dreams and aspirations. 164 00:07:39,391 --> 00:07:40,151 Who knows that? 165 00:07:40,151 --> 00:07:42,975 I'm a bit psychotic when it comes to building and 166 00:07:43,795 --> 00:07:45,336 specifically building a business ? 167 00:07:45,336 --> 00:07:48,509 But my wife has been my biggest supporter since day one. 168 00:07:48,509 --> 00:07:52,661 I've shared this a couple of other times, but when I started 169 00:07:52,682 --> 00:07:57,072 the business, I knew that I was going to bootstrap it and I knew 170 00:07:57,072 --> 00:08:00,185 that I wanted to bootstrap it the whole way through and I 171 00:08:00,206 --> 00:08:05,086 drove Lyft and Uber for 15 months before I took a penny out 172 00:08:05,086 --> 00:08:05,668 of the business. 173 00:08:06,800 --> 00:08:09,321 So I drove between like 5 and 8 am in the morning and then I 174 00:08:09,380 --> 00:08:12,170 worked my freight gig between like 8 and 4. 175 00:08:12,170 --> 00:08:15,620 And then I drove between like 4 and 8, sometimes 9 or 10 pm and 176 00:08:15,620 --> 00:08:20,651 I drove all night on the weekends, sometimes taking 177 00:08:20,810 --> 00:08:24,098 operations calls while I've got a couple of drunk college kids 178 00:08:24,117 --> 00:08:26,447 in the back of my Honda operations calls while I've got 179 00:08:26,468 --> 00:08:28,175 a couple of drunk college kids in the back of my Honda. 180 00:08:28,175 --> 00:08:32,583 So I did that for 15 months and it really afforded me the 181 00:08:32,604 --> 00:08:33,826 ability to be able to hire people a lot quicker and I 182 00:08:33,846 --> 00:08:34,989 didn't take a lot of money out. 183 00:08:34,989 --> 00:08:37,234 I didn't pay myself anything the first year. 184 00:08:37,234 --> 00:08:40,226 I didn't pay myself very well the first, probably three or 185 00:08:40,267 --> 00:08:44,404 four years, but that allowed me to reinvest all the capital back 186 00:08:44,404 --> 00:08:46,230 into the business and then start to build out the team. 187 00:08:47,234 --> 00:08:50,802 Speaker 1: So that ability to delay gratification is also 188 00:08:50,842 --> 00:08:52,385 another huge predictor of success. 189 00:08:52,385 --> 00:08:56,120 If you can put the work in for no short-term gain, knowing that 190 00:08:56,120 --> 00:08:59,250 there is a long-term payoff, potentially if things go well, 191 00:09:01,722 --> 00:09:02,905 is rare. 192 00:09:02,905 --> 00:09:05,471 I mean, it sounds like a simple phenomenon, but if it were 193 00:09:05,532 --> 00:09:07,727 simple, we wouldn't have credit cards. 194 00:09:07,727 --> 00:09:08,591 They wouldn't exist. 195 00:09:08,591 --> 00:09:11,341 As a basic example, people would only be able to pay for 196 00:09:11,381 --> 00:09:12,745 things with the money that they had. 197 00:09:12,745 --> 00:09:17,926 Um, have you always been financially responsible that way 198 00:09:17,926 --> 00:09:19,951 , or were you taught that? 199 00:09:21,280 --> 00:09:23,885 Speaker 2: I would say I have always been financially 200 00:09:23,946 --> 00:09:24,567 responsible. 201 00:09:24,567 --> 00:09:27,714 So my dad was also an entrepreneur. 202 00:09:27,714 --> 00:09:29,663 He was in the jewelry business. 203 00:09:29,663 --> 00:09:34,173 He forced me I say forced because early on it was forced 204 00:09:34,740 --> 00:09:36,988 as I got into high school I actually really enjoyed going to 205 00:09:36,988 --> 00:09:42,388 the jewelry shop and so I worked around his clients and 206 00:09:42,688 --> 00:09:47,119 his clientele cleaning jewelry, doing simple stuff, running 207 00:09:47,178 --> 00:09:48,280 repairs around town. 208 00:09:48,280 --> 00:09:53,671 But he taught me how to be financially responsible and he 209 00:09:53,730 --> 00:09:59,749 taught me the ability to really look way beyond today, tomorrow, 210 00:09:59,749 --> 00:10:02,761 the next week, the next month, and I think that all those 211 00:10:02,822 --> 00:10:06,268 lessons when I was a lot younger completely translated to my 212 00:10:06,368 --> 00:10:07,429 entrepreneurial journey. 213 00:10:08,272 --> 00:10:13,903 And I remember when I hired the first major executive hire we 214 00:10:13,942 --> 00:10:17,792 made outside of myself and my partner and one of his questions 215 00:10:17,792 --> 00:10:20,769 was like, hey, I need to make sure you're financially sound, 216 00:10:20,870 --> 00:10:23,360 and at this time we only had about 18 employees. 217 00:10:23,360 --> 00:10:25,494 We were doing roughly $40 million a year in annual revenue 218 00:10:25,494 --> 00:10:26,100 and we this time we only had about 18 employees, we were 219 00:10:26,057 --> 00:10:29,570 doing roughly $40 million a year in annual revenue and we sat 220 00:10:29,590 --> 00:10:31,253 down and went over the finances and he goes. 221 00:10:31,253 --> 00:10:34,956 That's kind of impressive and I'd never forget that because at 222 00:10:34,956 --> 00:10:37,504 this point in time we were kind of in a bit of a dungeon for an 223 00:10:37,504 --> 00:10:41,221 office, getting ready to move into what is now our really nice 224 00:10:41,221 --> 00:10:42,946 space in beautiful downtown Dubuque. 225 00:10:42,946 --> 00:10:46,543 But I say this jokingly like I'm surprised, he even took the 226 00:10:46,583 --> 00:10:48,327 interview when I brought him into our office. 227 00:10:48,327 --> 00:10:52,932 He was an insurance director, a recruiting director for a large 228 00:10:52,932 --> 00:10:56,303 insurance firm in Chicago, had a really nice office, did really 229 00:10:56,303 --> 00:10:58,971 well there and I was able to bring him to small town Iowa. 230 00:10:58,971 --> 00:11:04,246 But yeah, that kind of takes me back to one of our core 231 00:11:04,287 --> 00:11:07,133 memories was like I'll never forget him. 232 00:11:07,133 --> 00:11:09,085 Looking at me he's like okay, yeah, you're definitely. 233 00:11:09,085 --> 00:11:10,308 You know what you're doing with your money. 234 00:11:10,308 --> 00:11:11,424 All this makes sense now. 235 00:11:12,961 --> 00:11:16,628 Speaker 1: Well, and that's a testament to your father and 236 00:11:16,707 --> 00:11:19,573 also to your own values as well. 237 00:11:19,573 --> 00:11:23,366 I mean, there's a lot of easier ways to make money than freight 238 00:11:23,366 --> 00:11:27,634 brokerage and easier ways to do it than bootstrapping it. 239 00:11:27,634 --> 00:11:32,368 But I'm also just picturing the jewelry store too, getting to 240 00:11:32,427 --> 00:11:35,633 watch your dad and other grownups interact with clients. 241 00:11:35,633 --> 00:11:40,047 Yes, and the customer service element and how you have to 242 00:11:40,126 --> 00:11:42,673 listen because you're selling a high-end piece of jewelry to a 243 00:11:42,712 --> 00:11:43,293 specific clientele. 244 00:11:43,293 --> 00:11:43,674 Did that shape? 245 00:11:43,674 --> 00:11:45,197 I know you're selling a high-end piece of jewelry to a 246 00:11:45,217 --> 00:11:45,678 specific clientele. 247 00:11:45,678 --> 00:11:46,259 Did that shape? 248 00:11:46,259 --> 00:11:49,470 I know you're very effective at sales. 249 00:11:49,470 --> 00:11:52,491 Is that embedded in there somewhere too? 250 00:11:53,296 --> 00:11:53,960 Speaker 2: 100%. 251 00:11:53,960 --> 00:11:58,030 I remember my first real memory of being in the shop. 252 00:11:58,030 --> 00:12:02,428 Obviously, christmas season is the fourth quarter is always 253 00:12:02,509 --> 00:12:03,893 busy in the jewelry business right? 254 00:12:03,893 --> 00:12:06,707 You go and get your wife a pair of earrings or a nice tennis 255 00:12:06,748 --> 00:12:10,360 bracelet or a necklace or whatever the case might be, and 256 00:12:10,421 --> 00:12:13,729 so my dad taught me from about eight or nine how to shake 257 00:12:14,330 --> 00:12:18,105 somebody's hand the right way, how to look them in the eye, how 258 00:12:18,105 --> 00:12:21,140 to say their name once out loud and three times in your head, 259 00:12:21,182 --> 00:12:22,125 and you'll never forget it. 260 00:12:22,360 --> 00:12:26,150 That's something that, like I will never forget where I was 261 00:12:26,240 --> 00:12:30,745 when he taught me some of those things, and that is absolutely 262 00:12:30,806 --> 00:12:34,466 translated into how I carry myself, not only as a leader but 263 00:12:34,466 --> 00:12:38,004 as somebody who I would consider myself a very effective 264 00:12:38,004 --> 00:12:38,687 salesperson. 265 00:12:38,687 --> 00:12:41,389 But it's authentic, it's genuine. 266 00:12:41,389 --> 00:12:43,287 There's nothing fake about it. 267 00:12:43,287 --> 00:12:45,004 That's just kind of my style. 268 00:12:45,004 --> 00:12:47,546 Who you see today is who you get tomorrow. 269 00:12:47,546 --> 00:12:50,057 I've had the pleasure of meeting on several different 270 00:12:50,298 --> 00:12:52,384 occasions and I think I've been the same person every time. 271 00:12:52,384 --> 00:12:56,541 I think that's what makes me unique to myself, maybe not 272 00:12:56,982 --> 00:12:58,970 unique to everyone else, but at least unique to me. 273 00:12:59,679 --> 00:13:01,462 Speaker 1: You are a sincere person, chris. 274 00:13:01,462 --> 00:13:03,404 That's one of the things that I appreciate about you. 275 00:13:03,404 --> 00:13:07,149 I mean, when we met a couple of years ago at the Bitfreighter 276 00:13:07,169 --> 00:13:10,875 golf event, we had an hour-long conversation. 277 00:13:10,875 --> 00:13:13,265 At the end of the event it was probably 10 or 11 o'clock at 278 00:13:13,306 --> 00:13:15,982 night just sitting out on a patio having a beer, and I 279 00:13:16,043 --> 00:13:18,009 walked away and I thought, man, I could have kept talking to him 280 00:13:18,009 --> 00:13:21,025 for two more hours, because what you see is what you get. 281 00:13:21,046 --> 00:13:28,990 There isn't any fake polish or you were also interested in me 282 00:13:29,129 --> 00:13:31,535 and what I had to say, and so to be able to have a dialogue and 283 00:13:31,576 --> 00:13:37,385 not just somebody talking at you for ever is engaging, and 284 00:13:38,307 --> 00:13:41,600 getting to see you again just a few months ago at the event 285 00:13:41,620 --> 00:13:42,682 again this year was great. 286 00:13:43,082 --> 00:13:45,368 I also know you're the title sponsor. 287 00:13:45,368 --> 00:13:47,898 Now, of course, there's a commercial element to being a 288 00:13:47,998 --> 00:13:49,640 title sponsor of any kind of event. 289 00:13:49,640 --> 00:13:52,144 You get reward and benefit from that. 290 00:13:52,144 --> 00:13:57,504 But this is also a charity event and nobody listening knows 291 00:13:57,504 --> 00:13:57,664 this. 292 00:13:57,664 --> 00:14:02,440 But I am also aware that you won the tournament in terms of 293 00:14:02,519 --> 00:14:05,566 golf and then you donated the prize that you won from the golf 294 00:14:05,566 --> 00:14:07,957 tournament back to the ALS society. 295 00:14:07,957 --> 00:14:11,057 So, aside from just being sincere and I'm not just trying 296 00:14:11,077 --> 00:14:11,841 to flatter you, chris. 297 00:14:11,841 --> 00:14:16,557 Having spent time with you, I'm acknowledging part of what I 298 00:14:16,597 --> 00:14:20,144 believe makes you special and effective as an entrepreneur, 299 00:14:21,005 --> 00:14:25,298 and those aren't skills, they're characteristics, they're traits 300 00:14:25,298 --> 00:14:31,326 of a person, and to be effective over the long term in 301 00:14:31,385 --> 00:14:35,691 business, you have to build a reputation that is real. 302 00:14:35,691 --> 00:14:39,566 Otherwise we're pretty good at sniffing out BS. 303 00:14:41,177 --> 00:14:47,643 Speaker 2: I would say so, part of my reason for being is it's 304 00:14:47,702 --> 00:14:51,409 not self self gratification, it's how do I bring as many good 305 00:14:51,409 --> 00:14:53,559 people along this journey with me? 306 00:14:53,559 --> 00:14:55,845 Like, that is my. 307 00:14:55,845 --> 00:14:57,288 Somebody asked me what my purpose was. 308 00:14:57,288 --> 00:15:00,684 Matter of fact, this was yesterday and I was interviewing 309 00:15:00,684 --> 00:15:02,933 an executive coach. 310 00:15:02,933 --> 00:15:06,003 Right, I'm, I'm constantly looking to try and improve 311 00:15:06,082 --> 00:15:12,476 myself professionally, looking to try and improve myself 312 00:15:12,496 --> 00:15:13,940 professionally myself in my personal life and then as well 313 00:15:13,960 --> 00:15:14,341 in my faith journey. 314 00:15:14,341 --> 00:15:15,523 Right, and he said what's your purpose? 315 00:15:15,523 --> 00:15:20,499 And I said my purpose in business is to bring as many 316 00:15:20,620 --> 00:15:24,966 good people along this, what I believe is an awesome, 317 00:15:25,128 --> 00:15:28,942 incredible journey as many good people with me as I can and to 318 00:15:29,001 --> 00:15:30,976 take them as far as I possibly can. 319 00:15:30,976 --> 00:15:34,669 And I I've done a pretty good job of doing that thus far. 320 00:15:34,669 --> 00:15:38,259 But but the conversation I had yesterday just reinvigorated me 321 00:15:38,298 --> 00:15:42,534 and I'm like how do I, how do I take all 100 people with me? 322 00:15:42,534 --> 00:15:44,158 Like, how do we keep getting better? 323 00:15:45,880 --> 00:15:47,903 Speaker 1: So these are some of the highlights. 324 00:15:47,903 --> 00:15:50,929 I mean, these are are the the best parts of being able to do 325 00:15:51,009 --> 00:15:51,515 what you do. 326 00:15:51,515 --> 00:15:55,190 When you find your purpose or your calling and your talents, 327 00:15:55,210 --> 00:15:57,517 you're able to leverage that into a vocation that helps 328 00:15:57,577 --> 00:15:59,621 others and and helps yourself and your family. 329 00:15:59,621 --> 00:16:03,456 But that's not the full story either. 330 00:16:03,456 --> 00:16:08,164 There's also, um, really, really hard parts that don't get 331 00:16:08,164 --> 00:16:10,850 talked about a lot about being an entrepreneur. 332 00:16:10,850 --> 00:16:12,562 What are some of those things for you? 333 00:16:17,019 --> 00:16:20,424 Speaker 2: Well, to say that building a business is easy, I 334 00:16:20,465 --> 00:16:23,570 would say that that person has never done it. 335 00:16:26,475 --> 00:16:28,984 Every once in a while you run into the oh it must be nice 336 00:16:29,043 --> 00:16:32,826 people and, uh, sometimes they're your closest friends and 337 00:16:32,826 --> 00:16:37,179 sometimes they're your biggest enemy, and and that that phrase 338 00:16:37,220 --> 00:16:39,326 gets brought up and I just want to clear the air. 339 00:16:39,326 --> 00:16:44,105 There is nothing, nothing easy about being an entrepreneur, and 340 00:16:44,105 --> 00:16:44,888 I mean nothing. 341 00:16:44,888 --> 00:16:48,763 Um, some of the hardest things that I've had to endure is 342 00:16:49,384 --> 00:16:53,780 parting ways with some of my best friends, parting ways with 343 00:16:53,881 --> 00:16:59,715 family members who were going against the grain and cutting 344 00:16:59,855 --> 00:17:03,090 corners when it comes to our culture and our processes and 345 00:17:03,572 --> 00:17:07,480 our procedures, and I think the hardest decision I ever had to 346 00:17:07,599 --> 00:17:12,125 make as a leader was letting go my most productive carrier 347 00:17:12,185 --> 00:17:16,271 operations person who ended up being a childhood friend of mine 348 00:17:16,271 --> 00:17:19,457 , for the greater good of the organization, because it just 349 00:17:19,517 --> 00:17:22,943 started to that negativity just kind of started to spill out 350 00:17:24,166 --> 00:17:28,040 amongst the rest of the group, and that was a very difficult 351 00:17:28,121 --> 00:17:32,779 personal decision, but it was the hardest yet wisest decision 352 00:17:33,221 --> 00:17:36,969 I had ever made to this point as an entrepreneur and a founder. 353 00:17:37,595 --> 00:17:40,340 Speaker 1: What was it like a month later in the room with the 354 00:17:40,340 --> 00:17:40,582 team? 355 00:17:40,582 --> 00:17:44,739 Just like tension is down, communication is up. 356 00:17:44,739 --> 00:17:46,545 What was the vibe like afterwards? 357 00:17:47,055 --> 00:17:48,622 Speaker 2: I would say, the next week it was different. 358 00:17:49,035 --> 00:17:49,296 Speaker 1: Really. 359 00:17:50,138 --> 00:17:51,963 Speaker 2: Yeah, it was almost instantaneously. 360 00:17:51,963 --> 00:17:57,622 It was, it was, and it just then it reassured myself that 361 00:17:57,662 --> 00:17:58,925 that was the right decision. 362 00:17:58,925 --> 00:18:01,954 Right, and it gave me a good amount of reassurance because, 363 00:18:02,016 --> 00:18:04,019 I've got to be honest, I lost a lot of sleep. 364 00:18:04,019 --> 00:18:07,865 Um, I had to hear it from family members on the West Coast 365 00:18:07,865 --> 00:18:09,509 like, hey, what the heck's going on? 366 00:18:09,509 --> 00:18:13,664 We're here and so-and-so, and um, I think the one part of this 367 00:18:13,664 --> 00:18:19,761 journey that most people don't talk about is, uh, it can change 368 00:18:19,761 --> 00:18:22,105 you, right, it can change you. 369 00:18:22,105 --> 00:18:26,218 If you do it well, your life changes monetarily. 370 00:18:26,218 --> 00:18:27,662 That's pretty evident, right? 371 00:18:28,763 --> 00:18:33,020 But I'm not the same person or leader today that I was seven 372 00:18:33,060 --> 00:18:33,521 years ago. 373 00:18:33,521 --> 00:18:37,469 I am far more calm, far more. 374 00:18:37,469 --> 00:18:42,182 I'm quicker to make decisions, but I'm a lot more thoughtful 375 00:18:42,222 --> 00:18:45,396 with them, whereas three or four or five years ago, there would 376 00:18:45,416 --> 00:18:47,601 have been a lot more raw emotion attached to it. 377 00:18:47,601 --> 00:18:50,527 Now it's a little bit more okay . 378 00:18:50,527 --> 00:18:54,153 Detach myself from this situation, potentially go seek 379 00:18:54,213 --> 00:18:57,663 counsel from my executive team or my partners. 380 00:18:57,663 --> 00:19:02,776 In most cases, I do that every time now, and it's okay to 381 00:19:02,816 --> 00:19:05,941 change and evolve in those instances. 382 00:19:05,941 --> 00:19:08,526 But I'm not a different person. 383 00:19:08,526 --> 00:19:10,169 I'm still the same, chris Brewer. 384 00:19:10,169 --> 00:19:14,711 I have just evolved as a leader and I feel like this version of 385 00:19:14,711 --> 00:19:18,982 me today is a lot more effective than the version that 386 00:19:19,042 --> 00:19:20,748 I was three or four or five years ago. 387 00:19:21,476 --> 00:19:24,182 Speaker 1: So you mentioned that getting too emotional was maybe 388 00:19:24,182 --> 00:19:26,028 part of what you had to overcome. 389 00:19:26,028 --> 00:19:29,079 Was there anything else that you had to specifically work on? 390 00:19:29,079 --> 00:19:32,645 For some people, if they've been in charge for a long time, 391 00:19:32,986 --> 00:19:36,656 they're very unaware of how their emotions impact other 392 00:19:36,676 --> 00:19:36,998 people. 393 00:19:36,998 --> 00:19:42,315 So you can be frustrated with a business outcome and that's the 394 00:19:42,315 --> 00:19:45,184 word that you would use but somebody in the room might see 395 00:19:45,265 --> 00:19:49,539 it as anger, and then you're angry at them, and then that can 396 00:19:49,539 --> 00:19:51,676 create a culture of fear, or just. 397 00:19:51,676 --> 00:19:53,259 I'm giving an example here. 398 00:19:53,259 --> 00:19:56,867 I'm not saying that it applies to you, but do you remember, 399 00:19:56,988 --> 00:19:58,919 like what one of your coaches may be saying? 400 00:19:58,919 --> 00:20:02,508 You might have this tendency that you're unaware of and we 401 00:20:02,535 --> 00:20:08,878 need to work on it yes, I actually yes, I would say the 402 00:20:08,959 --> 00:20:10,540 answer to that is yes. 403 00:20:12,241 --> 00:20:15,923 Speaker 2: Relinquishing control , I think, is the right word. 404 00:20:15,923 --> 00:20:25,691 Right, because for so long it was me, the salesperson Chris, 405 00:20:26,311 --> 00:20:32,656 the leader Chris, the boss person, chris, the leader, chris 406 00:20:32,656 --> 00:20:34,681 , the boss Chris was at one time the leading carrier operations 407 00:20:34,701 --> 00:20:34,821 person. 408 00:20:34,821 --> 00:20:36,826 Chris at one time led all of claims and then also handled all 409 00:20:36,826 --> 00:20:38,316 of the commissions and finances . 410 00:20:38,316 --> 00:20:44,811 That was difficult to really put myself out there and go out 411 00:20:44,832 --> 00:20:47,901 and find the right talent and bring them in and then give them 412 00:20:47,901 --> 00:20:51,798 autonomy over those departments . 413 00:20:51,798 --> 00:20:53,760 That's difficult to do. 414 00:20:53,760 --> 00:20:59,990 But the second I gave full control up is the second that 415 00:21:00,115 --> 00:21:03,001 this thing went to the moon. 416 00:21:03,182 --> 00:21:05,207 Speaker 1: I mean that's yeah, it's not Chris Brewer logistics, 417 00:21:05,207 --> 00:21:07,339 it's River City logistics, so you've got to Exactly, got a 418 00:21:07,901 --> 00:21:10,536 yeah, and it took me a lot to get there. 419 00:21:10,997 --> 00:21:12,180 Speaker 2: I would say I'm all the way there. 420 00:21:12,180 --> 00:21:15,988 Now I've got two great partners uh, three partners that they 421 00:21:16,095 --> 00:21:20,324 each have control over their respective um divisions within 422 00:21:20,664 --> 00:21:25,240 all three organizations and I don't really make any of those 423 00:21:25,280 --> 00:21:26,221 decisions anymore. 424 00:21:26,221 --> 00:21:31,376 I'm now solely responsible for the brand, the strategic vision 425 00:21:32,799 --> 00:21:33,863 and M&A. 426 00:21:33,863 --> 00:21:36,769 Those are the three things that I'm really focused on at the 427 00:21:36,835 --> 00:21:37,375 present moment. 428 00:21:37,917 --> 00:21:39,962 Speaker 1: Well, tell me about your partners and what they 429 00:21:40,423 --> 00:21:43,397 uniquely bring to the table that maybe is their God-given gift, 430 00:21:43,838 --> 00:21:47,686 and then also, how have you seen them change on this journey? 431 00:21:48,588 --> 00:21:50,913 Speaker 2: And also, how have you seen them change on this 432 00:21:50,952 --> 00:21:51,193 journey? 433 00:21:51,193 --> 00:21:54,319 Yes, that's good, because they have changed as well. 434 00:21:54,319 --> 00:21:58,166 So my first partner that came with me his name is Josh 435 00:21:58,207 --> 00:21:58,867 Greenbaum. 436 00:21:58,867 --> 00:22:04,798 He oversees pretty much the entire brokerage operation. 437 00:22:04,798 --> 00:22:07,446 He's a really smart guy, really good at business development. 438 00:22:07,446 --> 00:22:13,003 He oversees all the account management team and then he also 439 00:22:13,003 --> 00:22:16,775 oversees the carrier operations manager and then carrier 440 00:22:16,815 --> 00:22:19,025 operations manager is responsible for his team. 441 00:22:19,025 --> 00:22:21,736 So, from a brokerage perspective, josh handles the 442 00:22:21,776 --> 00:22:24,060 brokerage entirely and I want to give him his flowers. 443 00:22:24,060 --> 00:22:27,696 In the worst freight market that I've ever seen, we're going 444 00:22:27,696 --> 00:22:30,041 to double in revenue from 24 to 25. 445 00:22:30,482 --> 00:22:31,324 Speaker 1: Oh, congratulations. 446 00:22:31,805 --> 00:22:34,396 Speaker 2: Yeah, and I don't say that lightly because, um, I 447 00:22:34,458 --> 00:22:37,588 know that people are out there struggling, but I I gotta, I 448 00:22:37,608 --> 00:22:40,518 gotta give my team the respect and the credit that they deserve 449 00:22:40,518 --> 00:22:40,518 . 450 00:22:40,518 --> 00:22:44,535 And I got to stop being afraid of um, pronouncing the fact that 451 00:22:44,535 --> 00:22:48,424 we are successful, cause I kind of get a little, a little gun 452 00:22:48,484 --> 00:22:49,125 shy about that. 453 00:22:49,125 --> 00:22:51,321 It's like, oh, I don't want people to know we're doing well. 454 00:22:51,321 --> 00:22:54,576 But I'm at the point now where we have built something really 455 00:22:54,616 --> 00:22:57,766 good and our processes are good, the way we treat our customers 456 00:22:57,806 --> 00:23:00,260 and our carriers are really good , the way we treat each other is 457 00:23:00,260 --> 00:23:02,935 really good, and so I got to give Josh his credit. 458 00:23:03,036 --> 00:23:06,262 My other partner, jake Shireman, was an outside guy. 459 00:23:06,262 --> 00:23:09,127 We brought him in from the insurance world and I say this 460 00:23:09,167 --> 00:23:14,384 too we were good at what we did, which was customer acquisition 461 00:23:14,424 --> 00:23:15,227 and covering freight. 462 00:23:15,227 --> 00:23:16,916 We weren't a business until I hired Jake. 463 00:23:16,916 --> 00:23:18,220 I like it. 464 00:23:18,220 --> 00:23:23,575 So he's the business guy, he's the finance guy, he is the hey, 465 00:23:23,615 --> 00:23:24,917 we can make this work guy. 466 00:23:24,917 --> 00:23:26,661 He is the risk assessment guy. 467 00:23:26,661 --> 00:23:30,888 Jake oversees everything and then rolls up to me. 468 00:23:30,888 --> 00:23:34,565 I don't think we are anywhere near where we are today without 469 00:23:34,585 --> 00:23:34,806 Jake. 470 00:23:35,695 --> 00:23:36,337 Speaker 1: That's great to hear. 471 00:23:36,337 --> 00:23:41,157 And again, what have you seen, both, of how they evolved, even 472 00:23:41,198 --> 00:23:42,240 just in the last couple of years ? 473 00:23:43,782 --> 00:23:49,621 Speaker 2: I think, compassion and true servant leadership. 474 00:23:49,621 --> 00:23:51,105 I've seen a lot out of those two. 475 00:23:51,105 --> 00:23:57,405 I've seen them lift people up that they were managing and then 476 00:23:57,405 --> 00:24:00,221 move them, and then move those people up in the middle level 477 00:24:00,241 --> 00:24:03,414 management roles, and so that's something that I'm big on, right 478 00:24:03,414 --> 00:24:06,144 I want to continue promoting from within this organization, 479 00:24:06,865 --> 00:24:12,441 and I've seen both of them get as much as they humanly possibly 480 00:24:12,441 --> 00:24:14,424 can out of the people that they lead. 481 00:24:14,424 --> 00:24:18,280 And then, and then more, and then some Um, and I think that's 482 00:24:18,280 --> 00:24:20,935 what makes this place special is the fact that that we have 483 00:24:20,977 --> 00:24:24,045 good leaders who are able to get the most out of their people, 484 00:24:24,226 --> 00:24:27,986 and then, and then a few of those folks, they're able to 485 00:24:28,106 --> 00:24:30,875 rise to the occasion, and then now we're looking at a whole new 486 00:24:30,875 --> 00:24:32,136 level of leadership that we fostered from good culture. 487 00:24:32,136 --> 00:24:33,419 Now we're looking at a whole new level of leadership that we 488 00:24:33,439 --> 00:24:34,519 fostered from good culture. 489 00:24:35,381 --> 00:24:38,064 Speaker 1: And then it multiplies over people and over 490 00:24:38,104 --> 00:24:39,546 time and it starts to compound. 491 00:24:39,546 --> 00:24:43,009 I mean, what a blast, are you having fun? 492 00:24:43,589 --> 00:24:44,750 Speaker 2: I'm having so much fun. 493 00:24:48,644 --> 00:24:50,094 Speaker 1: I tell people all the time I have the best job in the 494 00:24:50,094 --> 00:24:50,214 world. 495 00:24:50,214 --> 00:24:53,607 How do you stay? 496 00:24:53,607 --> 00:24:54,519 Let me think of how. 497 00:24:54,519 --> 00:24:55,184 Do I want to ask this one? 498 00:24:55,184 --> 00:24:56,695 I imagine when you first started you're like you know 499 00:24:56,736 --> 00:24:57,538 what success is. 500 00:24:57,538 --> 00:25:01,007 Success is a $10 million brokerage with eight people and 501 00:25:01,134 --> 00:25:03,279 fill in the blank, and then one day you're like you know what 502 00:25:04,142 --> 00:25:08,916 Success is 50 million and it's a new office or whatever that 503 00:25:08,977 --> 00:25:09,738 thing is. 504 00:25:09,738 --> 00:25:17,705 How do you not constantly chase just the next level but 505 00:25:17,766 --> 00:25:21,189 maintain some degree of contentedness while still 506 00:25:21,849 --> 00:25:24,132 redefining what success looks like for the next chapter? 507 00:25:26,096 --> 00:25:29,240 Sorry that was a long question, that's a good, that's a really 508 00:25:29,280 --> 00:25:29,864 good question. 509 00:25:29,994 --> 00:25:31,119 Speaker 2: I'm going to break it into two parts. 510 00:25:31,119 --> 00:25:39,237 I'm going to break it into two parts. 511 00:25:39,237 --> 00:25:40,781 Any good founder that I've come in contact with in the last 512 00:25:40,801 --> 00:25:41,182 three years. 513 00:25:41,182 --> 00:25:44,873 They have all had goals, and they're personal goals and then 514 00:25:44,893 --> 00:25:47,759 they're generally business goals , that which are measured in 515 00:25:47,820 --> 00:25:48,622 revenue, right. 516 00:25:48,622 --> 00:25:52,519 That's kind of the way that I've encountered some of the 517 00:25:52,538 --> 00:25:54,684 more successful people that I've met in the last three years. 518 00:25:54,684 --> 00:26:00,722 When I first started this in December of 2018, my only goal 519 00:26:00,803 --> 00:26:03,467 and I kid you not was I want to make enough money to go on 520 00:26:03,487 --> 00:26:05,269 vacation once a year and buy a house. 521 00:26:05,730 --> 00:26:05,851 Speaker 1: Yep. 522 00:26:06,556 --> 00:26:07,580 Speaker 2: That was my goal, right? 523 00:26:07,580 --> 00:26:12,806 Well, a year came and went by and I was like, oh, this is too 524 00:26:12,846 --> 00:26:13,247 much work. 525 00:26:13,247 --> 00:26:17,961 Now we're going to start to hire and so for the first time 526 00:26:18,000 --> 00:26:23,689 in 2022, I believe when we hired Jake, we had no goals. 527 00:26:23,689 --> 00:26:24,670 We had none. 528 00:26:24,670 --> 00:26:34,750 So one of his first challenges to me, he said I want a three, a 529 00:26:34,750 --> 00:26:35,535 five, a seven and a 10-year plan. 530 00:26:35,535 --> 00:26:39,538 And I gave him that plan and we're in in year three now and 531 00:26:39,577 --> 00:26:41,681 we're pacing at year seven Just by having goals, even. 532 00:26:42,241 --> 00:26:43,643 Right. 533 00:26:43,643 --> 00:26:49,455 The answer, the long form answer, is it's not what can we 534 00:26:49,516 --> 00:26:49,796 buy? 535 00:26:49,796 --> 00:26:55,048 How can we buy it's, how can I make, and how can I encourage my 536 00:26:55,048 --> 00:26:58,718 group to make, the largest impact on the industry that we 537 00:26:58,758 --> 00:27:02,286 serve Part of the reason why I thoroughly enjoy going out to DC 538 00:27:02,286 --> 00:27:05,641 every year at the TIA Policy Forum with Chris Burrows and his 539 00:27:05,641 --> 00:27:05,922 team. 540 00:27:05,922 --> 00:27:08,867 There is real impact being made . 541 00:27:08,867 --> 00:27:10,778 Last year we spoke about freight fraud. 542 00:27:10,778 --> 00:27:13,707 Well, come to find out when I showed up there on Monday. 543 00:27:13,707 --> 00:27:16,413 Spoke about freight fraud Well, come to find out when I showed 544 00:27:16,432 --> 00:27:17,075 up there on Monday. 545 00:27:17,075 --> 00:27:22,001 We've got a bill on the House and Senate floor that's going to 546 00:27:22,001 --> 00:27:23,167 be kind of looped into the surface transportation policy 547 00:27:23,188 --> 00:27:24,494 that's going to be voted on next month and I think it's going to 548 00:27:24,494 --> 00:27:29,365 pass and like that's cool, Like that's the type of stuff that I 549 00:27:29,365 --> 00:27:30,248 get out of bed for. 550 00:27:31,295 --> 00:27:33,403 Speaker 1: So what will the policy change be, if it goes the 551 00:27:33,403 --> 00:27:33,923 way you would hope? 552 00:27:35,134 --> 00:27:35,336 Speaker 2: of bed for. 553 00:27:35,336 --> 00:27:36,859 So what will the policy change be if it goes the way you would 554 00:27:36,880 --> 00:27:36,960 hope? 555 00:27:36,960 --> 00:27:38,625 So there's going to be civil punishment, punitive damages for 556 00:27:38,625 --> 00:27:39,907 freight fraud and theft. 557 00:27:39,907 --> 00:27:42,976 So people are going to go to jail. 558 00:27:43,616 --> 00:27:46,762 Speaker 1: Yeah, whereas today there's really no consequences. 559 00:27:48,566 --> 00:27:50,210 Speaker 2: There's no consequences whatsoever. 560 00:27:50,210 --> 00:27:51,196 You should go to jail. 561 00:27:51,196 --> 00:27:53,242 You're causing a lot of harm to the American people. 562 00:27:53,242 --> 00:28:01,217 I told lawmakers in Washington DC this week. 563 00:28:01,217 --> 00:28:02,599 I said it is inhibiting the ability for somebody who wants 564 00:28:02,640 --> 00:28:03,402 to buy a truck. 565 00:28:03,402 --> 00:28:06,387 It inhibits their ability to live out their American dream. 566 00:28:06,387 --> 00:28:10,541 One truckload gets stolen, they're bankrupt, they're done. 567 00:28:10,541 --> 00:28:13,817 Their policy is not getting renewed next year. 568 00:28:13,838 --> 00:28:21,828 Speaker 1: And if it does, it's going to be at such a premium 569 00:28:21,848 --> 00:28:23,114 that they can't even afford to pay. 570 00:28:23,114 --> 00:28:26,458 So now you're thinking beyond, still, the business realm, but 571 00:28:26,478 --> 00:28:27,800 of course you're thinking bigger than that industry level impact 572 00:28:27,800 --> 00:28:27,800 . 573 00:28:27,800 --> 00:28:29,324 How do you stay grounded then too? 574 00:28:29,324 --> 00:28:32,858 I mean the opposite side of the question, Somebody in your 575 00:28:32,939 --> 00:28:36,705 shoes with the financial success and the business success. 576 00:28:36,705 --> 00:28:38,608 Hey, sometimes it's tempting. 577 00:28:38,608 --> 00:28:42,180 I'm pretty cool stuff, I'm kind of a big deal. 578 00:28:42,180 --> 00:28:46,746 How does that, or does that not ever for you become an issue? 579 00:28:46,746 --> 00:28:49,019 I would imagine for me it would . 580 00:28:50,364 --> 00:28:54,224 Speaker 2: Oh no, I mean to say that it's not an issue, is not 581 00:28:54,285 --> 00:28:54,506 true. 582 00:28:54,506 --> 00:28:57,278 I mean to say that it's not an issue, is not true. 583 00:28:57,278 --> 00:28:57,778 I mean that's false. 584 00:28:57,778 --> 00:29:05,005 Anytime you start to accumulate some level of success, there's 585 00:29:05,105 --> 00:29:07,567 cars that you want or there's trips that you want to take. 586 00:29:07,567 --> 00:29:09,950 I'm not going to sit here and lie to you. 587 00:29:09,950 --> 00:29:17,516 We've been on some really cool trips there's. 588 00:29:17,516 --> 00:29:18,479 We've been on some really cool trips. 589 00:29:18,499 --> 00:29:19,743 Um, I gotta go back to my rock, my, my, my anchor, and that's my 590 00:29:19,743 --> 00:29:20,005 wife, my wife. 591 00:29:20,005 --> 00:29:21,189 Um, this would give you everything you need to know 592 00:29:21,209 --> 00:29:21,509 about her. 593 00:29:21,509 --> 00:29:25,299 She is your typical midwestern catholic. 594 00:29:25,299 --> 00:29:28,285 Uh, grew up in a farming family . 595 00:29:28,285 --> 00:29:32,336 Um, gal like that's who she is to her core. 596 00:29:32,336 --> 00:29:35,714 She goes to the grocery store and she buys non-main brand 597 00:29:36,115 --> 00:29:41,467 salad dressings and she doesn't buy Heinz ketchup, she buys the 598 00:29:41,666 --> 00:29:42,048 off-brand. 599 00:29:42,048 --> 00:29:43,215 We've now remedied that. 600 00:29:43,215 --> 00:29:48,005 I got to have my Heinz, but that's who my wife is to her 601 00:29:48,045 --> 00:29:51,617 core and she keeps me very grounded in that regard. 602 00:29:52,019 --> 00:29:55,875 And for the first time ever, we went, uh met with our attorney 603 00:29:55,895 --> 00:29:59,204 and our financial planner and we said hey, we need to have a 604 00:29:59,265 --> 00:30:02,082 real plan for what success looks like today and what it looks 605 00:30:02,102 --> 00:30:03,909 like 10, 15, 25 years in the future. 606 00:30:04,510 --> 00:30:05,434 Um and albeit. 607 00:30:05,434 --> 00:30:10,083 You know, putting together a death plan is is scary, but when 608 00:30:10,083 --> 00:30:16,039 , when her and I have, you know, had the been blessed, right I? 609 00:30:16,039 --> 00:30:18,826 I said that we've been blessed by many different avenues. 610 00:30:18,826 --> 00:30:21,682 We've been blessed by people around us, we've been blessed by 611 00:30:21,682 --> 00:30:22,005 God. 612 00:30:22,005 --> 00:30:24,781 We've been blessed by the customers who believe in what 613 00:30:24,801 --> 00:30:26,226 we're building monetarily. 614 00:30:26,226 --> 00:30:29,760 We wanted to just kind of safeguard that and make sure 615 00:30:29,780 --> 00:30:32,407 that, if anything were to happen to us, our children are set up, 616 00:30:32,407 --> 00:30:35,577 they can go to college, they can start a business of their 617 00:30:35,617 --> 00:30:36,299 own if they want. 618 00:30:36,299 --> 00:30:38,954 But those were difficult conversations to have. 619 00:30:38,954 --> 00:30:45,905 But nobody prepares you for that unless you grew up around 620 00:30:46,066 --> 00:30:49,009 somebody who went down that path . 621 00:30:49,009 --> 00:30:53,865 My dad was an entrepreneur but he never went down the path of 622 00:30:53,924 --> 00:30:57,156 planning for us kids because he was still in the day-to-day, 623 00:30:57,237 --> 00:31:01,606 even in his late 50s and 60s right, and so having to learn 624 00:31:01,646 --> 00:31:05,741 all that that's one of those learning curves as a leader that 625 00:31:05,741 --> 00:31:07,065 nobody tells you is coming. 626 00:31:08,426 --> 00:31:10,457 We walked out of that meeting with our attorney and we were 627 00:31:10,477 --> 00:31:13,820 just kind of scratching our heads like, all right, so if we 628 00:31:13,881 --> 00:31:16,964 die we're good, right, and we're laughing about it. 629 00:31:16,964 --> 00:31:21,391 But the name of the game is how do you put your children and 630 00:31:21,414 --> 00:31:23,520 the people around you that are closest to you in a better 631 00:31:23,560 --> 00:31:25,906 position when you're not here any longer? 632 00:31:25,906 --> 00:31:30,462 And that's the largest part of my purpose is my family. 633 00:31:31,424 --> 00:31:34,210 Speaker 1: I love to hear that, because you also have to have a 634 00:31:34,269 --> 00:31:35,412 plan for the what ifs. 635 00:31:35,412 --> 00:31:40,163 That aren't all good my wife and I did a similar exercise 636 00:31:40,183 --> 00:31:44,019 three or four years ago and just the questions that it prompts. 637 00:31:44,019 --> 00:31:48,308 It forces you to prioritize what matters. 638 00:31:48,308 --> 00:31:51,596 You have to put people's names down as beneficiaries, and now 639 00:31:51,676 --> 00:31:58,179 you've got relationship impact plus financial impact, and I 640 00:31:58,219 --> 00:32:01,164 think the public service announcement from all this for 641 00:32:01,224 --> 00:32:03,249 our listeners is don't wait. 642 00:32:03,249 --> 00:32:06,323 The biggest challenges for those kinds of things are for 643 00:32:06,343 --> 00:32:09,643 the people that don't plan, and the impact is actually felt by 644 00:32:09,682 --> 00:32:13,136 the people that are left behind when there isn't a plan and then 645 00:32:13,136 --> 00:32:17,509 there becomes conflict or any number of different things. 646 00:32:17,509 --> 00:32:20,362 And so you've got a three, a five, a seven and a 10 year plan 647 00:32:20,362 --> 00:32:25,199 , but now you've also got an end of life plan and that is a. 648 00:32:25,199 --> 00:32:30,169 It's a different framework for approaching life. 649 00:32:30,536 --> 00:32:34,624 One of my favorite definitions of the word wisdom is simply 650 00:32:35,226 --> 00:32:36,448 living skillfully. 651 00:32:36,448 --> 00:32:42,359 When you are wise, you avoid downside, you maximize the 652 00:32:42,440 --> 00:32:45,817 upside, you learn who you can and can't trust, you avoid 653 00:32:45,877 --> 00:32:50,721 unnecessary conflict, you stay in your zone of expertise and 654 00:32:50,740 --> 00:32:53,386 you don't get out in front of your skis and all of those 655 00:32:53,426 --> 00:32:53,667 things. 656 00:32:53,667 --> 00:32:58,421 To me's that is skillful living , and I don't think that gets 657 00:32:58,781 --> 00:33:00,445 the idea of wisdom gets enough airtime. 658 00:33:00,445 --> 00:33:03,919 We're too focused on flashy, shiny things. 659 00:33:03,919 --> 00:33:09,088 But having the foresight and maturity to make decisions like 660 00:33:09,134 --> 00:33:12,847 that for your family as a result of the way that you've done and 661 00:33:12,847 --> 00:33:15,756 thought about that, for your career first, and then your 662 00:33:15,836 --> 00:33:21,327 business second Um, I could hang out and chat with you for days, 663 00:33:21,327 --> 00:33:24,321 chris, because I like the way you communicate and the way that 664 00:33:24,321 --> 00:33:25,384 you describe things. 665 00:33:25,384 --> 00:33:28,259 Um, you've also got good style. 666 00:33:28,259 --> 00:33:29,986 I'll just say that you got good style. 667 00:33:29,986 --> 00:33:33,259 You're just you're a lot of fun to be around. 668 00:33:34,061 --> 00:33:35,646 Speaker 2: Well, I need to get up there and come fishing with 669 00:33:35,686 --> 00:33:35,767 you. 670 00:33:35,767 --> 00:33:40,325 I want to touch on one thing real quick, because you talk 671 00:33:40,365 --> 00:33:41,788 about planning. 672 00:33:41,788 --> 00:33:48,742 Right, I've been getting I'm talking probably a dozen 673 00:33:50,005 --> 00:33:54,801 solicitations weekly on what's your exit strategy. 674 00:33:54,801 --> 00:33:56,306 Would you like to sell your business? 675 00:33:56,306 --> 00:34:00,748 I've got a group of investors here and River City fits our ICP 676 00:34:00,748 --> 00:34:04,318 and we've got X, Y and Z technology and we can add you to 677 00:34:04,318 --> 00:34:06,203 our group and take your business to the next level. 678 00:34:06,203 --> 00:34:09,237 The answer is this I'm not selling my business ever. 679 00:34:09,237 --> 00:34:15,809 I want my children, I want Sophia, I want the two-year-old 680 00:34:16,530 --> 00:34:21,139 here in 2025 to one day be the CEO or whichever one of my kids, 681 00:34:21,139 --> 00:34:22,903 if they want it, if they're skillful enough. 682 00:34:22,903 --> 00:34:24,686 They're not going to be gifted anything right. 683 00:34:24,746 --> 00:34:26,295 Sure, they got to earn it, they're going to have to work 684 00:34:26,335 --> 00:34:31,864 hard for it, but leaving a legacy and then being remembered 685 00:34:31,864 --> 00:34:36,530 as somebody who was charitable and good and honest, and giving 686 00:34:38,918 --> 00:34:39,760 that's who I believe. 687 00:34:39,760 --> 00:34:43,648 I am to my core, and I want to go out like that. 688 00:34:44,735 --> 00:34:46,239 Speaker 1: You're very easy to root for. 689 00:34:46,239 --> 00:34:50,286 Proud of you also. 690 00:34:50,286 --> 00:34:52,096 Thank you Genuinely. 691 00:34:52,096 --> 00:34:55,244 I don't have any remaining questions. 692 00:34:55,244 --> 00:34:57,998 I'm like fresh out, like that hardly ever happens, but like 693 00:34:58,018 --> 00:35:00,967 you just hit every one of the right notes. 694 00:35:00,967 --> 00:35:04,420 So I'm just going to instead give you the opportunity, if you 695 00:35:04,420 --> 00:35:08,396 would like to reflect for just a moment on who would you like 696 00:35:08,436 --> 00:35:10,898 to express gratitude for in this moment. 697 00:35:12,641 --> 00:35:14,945 Speaker 2: Well, first and foremost, my wife. 698 00:35:14,945 --> 00:35:17,009 My wife is Liz. 699 00:35:17,009 --> 00:35:17,989 She's my best friend. 700 00:35:17,989 --> 00:35:21,862 She's the best partner in life you could ask for. 701 00:35:21,862 --> 00:35:23,405 She's the best mom. 702 00:35:23,405 --> 00:35:24,856 I mean she's such a good mother . 703 00:35:24,856 --> 00:35:27,701 I am so lucky in so many different ways. 704 00:35:27,701 --> 00:35:33,097 My immediate family I've got a brother of mine who now works in 705 00:35:33,097 --> 00:35:35,123 the business and I'm so proud of him. 706 00:35:35,123 --> 00:35:38,599 I was watching him mature in this business. 707 00:35:38,599 --> 00:35:42,675 He moved out here from the West Coast to join our team and I 708 00:35:42,715 --> 00:35:45,041 made him start at the very bottom. 709 00:35:45,041 --> 00:35:50,556 I made him work night shift for a year and now he is one of our 710 00:35:50,556 --> 00:35:53,061 most productive account managers, working some of our 711 00:35:53,583 --> 00:35:58,257 most important accounts at a really high level. 712 00:35:58,257 --> 00:35:59,119 I'm really proud of him. 713 00:35:59,119 --> 00:36:01,664 I love his guidance and his support. 714 00:36:02,025 --> 00:36:04,898 My partners I want to thank all of them as well. 715 00:36:04,898 --> 00:36:07,143 Obviously, my parents. 716 00:36:07,143 --> 00:36:11,217 I oftentimes say I had the best of both worlds. 717 00:36:11,217 --> 00:36:12,940 My parents got divorced really young. 718 00:36:12,940 --> 00:36:14,322 My dad was really successful. 719 00:36:14,322 --> 00:36:17,286 My mom worked three jobs to keep the lights on, so I 720 00:36:17,427 --> 00:36:21,960 understood what it looked like to struggle and so having an 721 00:36:22,041 --> 00:36:25,306 understanding of what a struggling lifestyle looked like 722 00:36:25,306 --> 00:36:30,601 versus what a very well put together lifestyle looked like, 723 00:36:31,543 --> 00:36:33,365 that was good for me to see at a young age. 724 00:36:33,365 --> 00:36:34,387 So I love my parents. 725 00:36:41,394 --> 00:36:42,777 There are so many people that I can thank A lot of good mentors 726 00:36:42,797 --> 00:36:45,043 throughout the way right, and I could name drop probably a dozen 727 00:36:45,043 --> 00:36:47,268 plus people that I've taken great advice from and still 728 00:36:47,327 --> 00:36:48,476 remain in contact with. 729 00:36:48,476 --> 00:36:52,018 But I'm just blessed, man. 730 00:36:52,018 --> 00:36:57,284 I'm blessed that I get to wake up every morning and I get to, 731 00:36:57,945 --> 00:37:00,686 you know, come to either the brokerage office or the terminal 732 00:37:00,686 --> 00:37:03,210 and the warehouse, and I get to interact with people who 733 00:37:03,349 --> 00:37:05,492 genuinely enjoy being at their job. 734 00:37:05,492 --> 00:37:17,297 Logistics as a whole, among all three verticals. 735 00:37:17,297 --> 00:37:18,541 We are in the business of building transportation 736 00:37:18,561 --> 00:37:19,945 professionals, not just offering employment, and I think that 737 00:37:19,965 --> 00:37:24,121 there's a big difference in the marketplace and I use that as a 738 00:37:24,240 --> 00:37:25,443 sales and recruiting tool. 739 00:37:25,603 --> 00:37:29,978 I just hired a guy out of Chicago. 740 00:37:29,978 --> 00:37:34,027 He's been with us for about two and a half months and he told 741 00:37:34,067 --> 00:37:35,458 me on the phone the other day he goes. 742 00:37:35,458 --> 00:37:39,034 You know I was talking to my wife and you know we were 743 00:37:39,074 --> 00:37:42,483 talking about the honeymoon phase and like I'm starting to 744 00:37:42,523 --> 00:37:44,327 believe that this isn't like a honeymoon. 745 00:37:44,327 --> 00:37:46,548 I'm starting to believe that, like maybe this is the way you 746 00:37:46,568 --> 00:37:47,534 guys just do business. 747 00:37:47,534 --> 00:37:51,641 And I said I told you this is how we do things and, um, it 748 00:37:51,681 --> 00:37:56,110 just warmed my heart that, you know he was comfortable enough 749 00:37:56,150 --> 00:37:58,614 to know like, hey, this is a pretty good place for me to be 750 00:37:58,653 --> 00:38:00,922 in my career and I want everybody to feel that way here. 751 00:38:01,856 --> 00:38:03,940 Speaker 1: Well, I have no doubt , if you keep doing what you're 752 00:38:03,960 --> 00:38:08,797 going, what you are doing, that will continue, and I hope to see 753 00:38:08,797 --> 00:38:11,626 you next August back in Nashville with the Bitfreighter 754 00:38:11,646 --> 00:38:11,806 team. 755 00:38:11,806 --> 00:38:14,682 I hope my team beats your team in golf. 756 00:38:14,682 --> 00:38:18,463 Maybe I'd love to go fishing with you up here in Minnesota. 757 00:38:18,463 --> 00:38:22,179 We can get some musky in October perhaps, and it'd be 758 00:38:22,199 --> 00:38:24,259 good to just spend some time together, break some bread and 759 00:38:24,278 --> 00:38:24,780 keep chatting. 760 00:38:24,780 --> 00:38:27,836 But, chris, of course we're all rooting for you and we wish you 761 00:38:27,836 --> 00:38:28,581 nothing but the best. 762 00:38:29,335 --> 00:38:30,501 Speaker 2: I appreciate you having me on. 763 00:38:30,501 --> 00:38:34,144 I'm going to definitely take you up on the fishing and the 764 00:38:34,164 --> 00:38:35,536 golf next year too Should be fun . 765 00:38:36,278 --> 00:38:36,559 Speaker 1: Right on. 766 00:38:36,559 --> 00:38:37,262 Take care, my friend. 767 00:38:37,583 --> 00:38:37,985 Speaker 2: Thanks Nate. 768 00:38:40,596 --> 00:38:42,601 Speaker 1: Thanks for listening to another episode of the 769 00:38:42,641 --> 00:38:45,456 Bootstrapper's Guide to Logistics, and a special thank 770 00:38:45,476 --> 00:38:48,264 you to our sponsors and the team behind the scenes who make it 771 00:38:48,304 --> 00:38:48,887 all possible. 772 00:38:48,887 --> 00:38:52,364 Be sure to like, follow or subscribe to the podcast to get 773 00:38:52,384 --> 00:38:53,186 the latest updates. 774 00:38:53,186 --> 00:38:56,221 To learn more about the show and connect with the growing 775 00:38:56,280 --> 00:38:59,347 community of entrepreneurs, visit logisticsfounderscom. 776 00:38:59,347 --> 00:39:03,483 And, of course, thank you to all the founders who trust us to 777 00:39:03,483 --> 00:39:04,226 share their stories.