1 00:00:33,262 --> 00:00:35,267 Speaker 1: Hello and welcome to the Bootstrapper's Guide to 2 00:00:35,307 --> 00:00:37,932 Logistics, the podcast highlighting founders doing it 3 00:00:37,951 --> 00:00:39,634 the way that doesn't get a lot of attention. 4 00:00:39,634 --> 00:00:42,567 We're here to change that by sharing their stories and 5 00:00:42,606 --> 00:00:44,070 inspiring others to take the leap. 6 00:00:45,200 --> 00:00:47,728 Speaker 2: It's a roller coaster ride that you might ultimately 7 00:00:47,748 --> 00:00:47,989 fail. 8 00:00:48,600 --> 00:00:50,567 Speaker 1: That's when I kind of knew I was on to something. 9 00:00:50,567 --> 00:00:52,146 It was very hard. 10 00:00:52,146 --> 00:00:56,986 It truly is building a legacy the more life you live, the more 11 00:00:56,986 --> 00:01:00,064 wisdom you have, Because we are where we're supposed to be. 12 00:01:00,064 --> 00:01:01,751 Kind of answering the call. 13 00:01:02,280 --> 00:01:04,706 Don't shoulder entrepreneurship on your own. 14 00:01:04,706 --> 00:01:06,611 I'm your host, Nate Shoots. 15 00:01:06,611 --> 00:01:09,668 Let's build something together from the ground up. 16 00:01:09,668 --> 00:01:14,686 Hello everybody, and welcome back to the show. 17 00:01:14,686 --> 00:01:18,194 For those that can't tell by my accent, I am from the Midwest. 18 00:01:18,194 --> 00:01:20,885 If you've been listening for any length of time, you figured 19 00:01:20,926 --> 00:01:21,026 out. 20 00:01:21,026 --> 00:01:23,912 It's distinctly Minnesotan and nearly Canadian. 21 00:01:23,912 --> 00:01:27,484 So I'm really happy this week to get to talk to one of my 22 00:01:27,585 --> 00:01:31,411 neighbors to the south, Chris Brewer, who is the CEO of River 23 00:01:31,450 --> 00:01:33,174 City Logistics, based in Iowa. 24 00:01:33,174 --> 00:01:34,456 Chris, do I have an accent? 25 00:01:36,902 --> 00:01:39,802 Speaker 2: I am not from the Midwest and I can pinpoint the 26 00:01:39,822 --> 00:01:40,703 Midwest accents. 27 00:01:40,703 --> 00:01:44,231 I think Minnesotans have a distinct accents and I think 28 00:01:44,371 --> 00:01:46,246 folks in Wisconsin have a distinct accent. 29 00:01:46,347 --> 00:01:48,760 Speaker 1: Oh yeah, wisconsin, for sure, that's right, I forget 30 00:01:48,760 --> 00:01:48,760 . 31 00:01:48,760 --> 00:01:49,864 You're from California. 32 00:01:49,864 --> 00:01:52,337 You moved to the Midwest at some point and now you've got 33 00:01:52,397 --> 00:01:54,242 offices around the country a couple of different places. 34 00:01:55,025 --> 00:01:55,305 Speaker 2: Yeah. 35 00:01:55,305 --> 00:01:59,135 So I moved here to go to college, played baseball. 36 00:01:59,135 --> 00:02:03,606 I met my wife like the first weekend we were in school and 16 37 00:02:03,606 --> 00:02:05,010 years later, three kids. 38 00:02:05,010 --> 00:02:05,751 Here we are. 39 00:02:06,760 --> 00:02:08,867 Speaker 1: First week of freshman year of college. 40 00:02:09,507 --> 00:02:09,728 Speaker 2: Yes. 41 00:02:10,150 --> 00:02:10,591 Speaker 1: Tell me more. 42 00:02:12,099 --> 00:02:13,200 Speaker 2: Oh man. 43 00:02:13,200 --> 00:02:16,365 Well, there's a lot to that story. 44 00:02:16,365 --> 00:02:21,610 I'll try to keep the specific details out, but I got invited 45 00:02:21,631 --> 00:02:25,574 to this house party, mind you, I flew to Iowa, having never 46 00:02:25,634 --> 00:02:38,622 visited the campus or the state in California, and coach, uh, 47 00:02:38,643 --> 00:02:40,169 coach of a coach, friend of a friend, set my tape to a couple 48 00:02:40,188 --> 00:02:40,591 different schools. 49 00:02:40,591 --> 00:02:42,418 Um, I get a call, they fly out, they watched me throw and they 50 00:02:42,479 --> 00:02:45,348 offered a full ride education, and it's pretty hard to say no 51 00:02:45,368 --> 00:02:45,651 to that. 52 00:02:45,651 --> 00:02:49,645 So, uh, say goodbye to all my family, packed up, uh, flew to 53 00:02:49,806 --> 00:02:50,127 Iowa. 54 00:02:50,127 --> 00:02:51,313 Uh, this is a true story. 55 00:02:51,354 --> 00:02:54,705 When I was flying into Dubuque regional airport, um, I 56 00:02:54,784 --> 00:02:57,471 legitimately thought the plane was crashing because I could see 57 00:02:57,471 --> 00:02:58,212 nothing but corn. 58 00:02:58,212 --> 00:03:04,764 I tell that story all the time as a proud Iowan. 59 00:03:04,764 --> 00:03:06,269 Now I love this place. 60 00:03:06,269 --> 00:03:11,026 It is the best place for me to be, it fits my character, my 61 00:03:11,086 --> 00:03:13,780 culture, it's the best place to raise a family. 62 00:03:13,780 --> 00:03:17,306 But to go back to the original topic, I just had to share that 63 00:03:17,347 --> 00:03:20,112 story because when I do share it with people they generally do 64 00:03:20,193 --> 00:03:20,413 laugh. 65 00:03:20,413 --> 00:03:25,187 But a city kid flying into the middle of corn and cornfields 66 00:03:25,227 --> 00:03:28,673 everywhere, you could kind of feel my sentiment there. 67 00:03:28,673 --> 00:03:29,253 Like it was a little. 68 00:03:29,253 --> 00:03:31,006 I thought we were going down. 69 00:03:31,006 --> 00:03:34,407 But no, I met my wife the first weekend. 70 00:03:34,407 --> 00:03:37,328 We didn't date until the following year, we were just 71 00:03:37,389 --> 00:03:37,901 friends she. 72 00:03:37,901 --> 00:03:39,627 She played on the softball team . 73 00:03:39,627 --> 00:03:43,147 So we we kind of intermingled with friends and stuff for a 74 00:03:43,187 --> 00:03:46,981 long time and um kind of gave it a go the next year and we've 75 00:03:47,002 --> 00:03:48,007 been together ever since. 76 00:03:48,881 --> 00:03:50,222 Speaker 1: Well, congratulations it's. 77 00:03:50,222 --> 00:03:52,680 We got a bunch to unpack there already. 78 00:03:52,680 --> 00:03:54,647 First, glad you made it to the Midwest. 79 00:03:54,647 --> 00:03:58,441 It's God's country. 80 00:03:58,441 --> 00:03:59,362 We love it here. 81 00:03:59,362 --> 00:04:04,875 To be a scholarship athlete requires a whole lot of not only 82 00:04:04,875 --> 00:04:07,000 skill but sacrifice and effort. 83 00:04:07,000 --> 00:04:10,930 That I'm 100% sure is connected to how you run your company and 84 00:04:10,930 --> 00:04:12,662 why you chose to start it in the first place. 85 00:04:12,662 --> 00:04:14,829 So we can certainly unpack that . 86 00:04:14,829 --> 00:04:19,062 But we can also unpack the family impact of 87 00:04:19,962 --> 00:04:23,229 entrepreneurship is not a individual pursuit, it's a whole 88 00:04:23,229 --> 00:04:24,771 family endeavor. 89 00:04:24,771 --> 00:04:28,891 So my first question is how would your kids describe what 90 00:04:28,951 --> 00:04:29,354 you do? 91 00:04:29,354 --> 00:04:30,879 What would they say to other people? 92 00:04:31,000 --> 00:04:36,204 Speaker 2: your job is so my son tells people that I'm a truck 93 00:04:36,223 --> 00:04:39,265 driver, which I think is awesome . 94 00:04:39,265 --> 00:04:45,990 My daughter, she's seven she just says that daddy is the boss 95 00:04:45,990 --> 00:04:50,494 of River City and she knows that we have warehousing, asset 96 00:04:50,553 --> 00:04:52,956 based operations and brokerage. 97 00:04:52,956 --> 00:04:59,721 So she at least has the concept down in brokerage. 98 00:04:59,721 --> 00:05:00,461 So she at least has the concept down. 99 00:05:00,461 --> 00:05:01,084 The funny thing I travel a lot. 100 00:05:01,084 --> 00:05:02,286 I'm still very involved in the business development side. 101 00:05:02,286 --> 00:05:06,322 I travel on average about 120 to 150 days a year, sometimes 102 00:05:06,401 --> 00:05:08,067 less, sometimes right at that number. 103 00:05:08,067 --> 00:05:12,661 But anytime my kids see an airplane in the sky and I'm not 104 00:05:12,781 --> 00:05:15,067 home, they tell mom that dad's on the airplane. 105 00:05:15,067 --> 00:05:17,964 Um, but they're little, they don't know any different, right? 106 00:05:17,964 --> 00:05:19,892 So I just think that that's really cute. 107 00:05:19,892 --> 00:05:24,427 Um, but yeah, I'm, I'm a truck driver and then I'm just the 108 00:05:24,466 --> 00:05:25,310 boss of river city. 109 00:05:25,310 --> 00:05:26,312 That's what the kids say. 110 00:05:26,500 --> 00:05:27,903 Speaker 1: If you had a seven-year-old who knows the 111 00:05:27,944 --> 00:05:29,127 phrase asset based. 112 00:05:29,127 --> 00:05:30,451 I mean, we're making progress here. 113 00:05:42,319 --> 00:05:42,600 Speaker 2: You got it. 114 00:05:42,600 --> 00:05:44,564 You got a future head of sales in your house or you know she's 115 00:05:44,584 --> 00:05:46,069 going to be running the financials or something one day. 116 00:05:46,069 --> 00:05:46,810 Yeah, she's super type A. 117 00:05:46,810 --> 00:05:48,314 Um, she, she's definitely got like the CPA in her, maybe, 118 00:05:48,334 --> 00:05:49,958 maybe some form of dentistry or maybe medicine. 119 00:05:49,958 --> 00:05:51,781 Um, my son, um, he's very much a little bit different than her, 120 00:05:51,781 --> 00:05:53,103 a little bit of a rule follower . 121 00:05:53,103 --> 00:05:55,249 The youngest one is the one you got to look out for. 122 00:05:55,249 --> 00:05:59,478 So my youngest Sophia she's two She'll tell you exactly what 123 00:05:59,517 --> 00:06:01,802 she wants, when she wants it and how she wants it. 124 00:06:01,802 --> 00:06:05,872 So if I had to pick one of the three to be the future CEO, if 125 00:06:05,911 --> 00:06:07,401 and when I step away, it's probably her. 126 00:06:08,002 --> 00:06:12,370 Speaker 1: That's good insights on birth order as future 127 00:06:12,411 --> 00:06:13,733 predictor of jobs too. 128 00:06:13,733 --> 00:06:16,002 I mean, I'm tracking with everything that you're saying 129 00:06:16,023 --> 00:06:16,202 there. 130 00:06:16,202 --> 00:06:19,367 So you've got a freight brokerage. 131 00:06:19,367 --> 00:06:22,432 Now you do warehousing services . 132 00:06:22,432 --> 00:06:24,656 You've got around 100 employees or so I believe. 133 00:06:25,279 --> 00:06:30,884 Speaker 2: Yes, Yep 100, give or take between all three entities 134 00:06:30,884 --> 00:06:32,427 something like that. 135 00:06:32,706 --> 00:06:33,788 Speaker 1: You didn't start with 100. 136 00:06:33,788 --> 00:06:36,690 You probably started with far humbler origins, and 137 00:06:37,071 --> 00:06:41,535 conventional wisdom financially is get a job, save for 138 00:06:41,574 --> 00:06:51,961 retirement, do all of the things , follow the prescribed path for 139 00:06:51,961 --> 00:06:52,942 your life as dictated by the powers that be. 140 00:06:52,942 --> 00:06:54,223 And yet you shared with me that you cashed out part of your 141 00:06:54,244 --> 00:06:56,406 401k just to even get started, which goes against all 142 00:06:56,487 --> 00:06:57,507 conventional wisdom. 143 00:06:57,507 --> 00:07:00,713 Help me unpack for me. 144 00:07:00,713 --> 00:07:02,555 What was that conversation like ? 145 00:07:02,555 --> 00:07:05,045 And do you remember depositing the check and being like all 146 00:07:05,084 --> 00:07:08,461 right, I'm literally risking my future for something that I 147 00:07:08,500 --> 00:07:08,901 believe in. 148 00:07:09,661 --> 00:07:13,906 Speaker 2: I remember the 30 to 60 days that kind of preceded 149 00:07:13,947 --> 00:07:14,767 that decision. 150 00:07:14,767 --> 00:07:21,261 I started my career in the space and I worked for two 151 00:07:21,300 --> 00:07:24,187 really good organizations, took some time away. 152 00:07:24,187 --> 00:07:25,853 I knew I wanted to be an entrepreneur. 153 00:07:25,853 --> 00:07:28,607 I didn't know how much time I was going to take away from it. 154 00:07:28,607 --> 00:07:31,180 It took a little over two, two and a half years. 155 00:07:31,180 --> 00:07:35,490 I was selling packaging materials for, at the time, one 156 00:07:35,509 --> 00:07:40,584 of my clients and it was, it was fine, it did well, um, and I 157 00:07:40,644 --> 00:07:45,574 came home from work one day and I told my wife at the time, um, 158 00:07:47,524 --> 00:07:51,776 my daughter was three months old and I said I quit my job and I 159 00:07:51,815 --> 00:07:57,072 cashed into my 401k and I'm going all in and you could have 160 00:07:57,093 --> 00:07:59,100 heard a pin drop in that kitchen . 161 00:08:00,480 --> 00:08:03,043 And I don't say this lightly but like. 162 00:08:03,043 --> 00:08:07,088 I am incredibly blessed to have married somebody that loves me 163 00:08:07,168 --> 00:08:10,891 unconditionally, that supports my dreams and aspirations. 164 00:08:10,891 --> 00:08:11,651 Who knows that? 165 00:08:11,651 --> 00:08:14,475 I'm a bit psychotic when it comes to building and 166 00:08:15,295 --> 00:08:16,836 specifically building a business ? 167 00:08:16,836 --> 00:08:20,009 But my wife has been my biggest supporter since day one. 168 00:08:20,009 --> 00:08:24,161 I've shared this a couple of other times, but when I started 169 00:08:24,182 --> 00:08:28,572 the business, I knew that I was going to bootstrap it and I knew 170 00:08:28,572 --> 00:08:31,685 that I wanted to bootstrap it the whole way through and I 171 00:08:31,706 --> 00:08:36,586 drove Lyft and Uber for 15 months before I took a penny out 172 00:08:36,586 --> 00:08:37,168 of the business. 173 00:08:38,300 --> 00:08:40,821 So I drove between like 5 and 8 am in the morning and then I 174 00:08:40,880 --> 00:08:43,670 worked my freight gig between like 8 and 4. 175 00:08:43,670 --> 00:08:47,120 And then I drove between like 4 and 8, sometimes 9 or 10 pm and 176 00:08:47,120 --> 00:08:52,151 I drove all night on the weekends, sometimes taking 177 00:08:52,310 --> 00:08:55,597 operations calls while I've got a couple of drunk college kids 178 00:08:55,617 --> 00:08:57,947 in the back of my Honda operations calls while I've got 179 00:08:57,968 --> 00:08:59,675 a couple of drunk college kids in the back of my Honda. 180 00:08:59,675 --> 00:09:04,083 So I did that for 15 months and it really afforded me the 181 00:09:04,104 --> 00:09:05,326 ability to be able to hire people a lot quicker and I 182 00:09:05,346 --> 00:09:06,489 didn't take a lot of money out. 183 00:09:06,489 --> 00:09:08,734 I didn't pay myself anything the first year. 184 00:09:08,734 --> 00:09:11,726 I didn't pay myself very well the first, probably three or 185 00:09:11,767 --> 00:09:15,904 four years, but that allowed me to reinvest all the capital back 186 00:09:15,904 --> 00:09:17,730 into the business and then start to build out the team. 187 00:09:18,734 --> 00:09:22,302 Speaker 1: So that ability to delay gratification is also 188 00:09:22,342 --> 00:09:23,885 another huge predictor of success. 189 00:09:23,885 --> 00:09:27,620 If you can put the work in for no short-term gain, knowing that 190 00:09:27,620 --> 00:09:30,750 there is a long-term payoff, potentially if things go well, 191 00:09:33,222 --> 00:09:34,405 is rare. 192 00:09:34,405 --> 00:09:36,971 I mean, it sounds like a simple phenomenon, but if it were 193 00:09:37,032 --> 00:09:39,227 simple, we wouldn't have credit cards. 194 00:09:39,227 --> 00:09:40,091 They wouldn't exist. 195 00:09:40,091 --> 00:09:42,841 As a basic example, people would only be able to pay for 196 00:09:42,881 --> 00:09:44,245 things with the money that they had. 197 00:09:44,245 --> 00:09:49,426 Um, have you always been financially responsible that way 198 00:09:49,426 --> 00:09:51,451 , or were you taught that? 199 00:09:52,780 --> 00:09:55,385 Speaker 2: I would say I have always been financially 200 00:09:55,446 --> 00:09:56,067 responsible. 201 00:09:56,067 --> 00:09:59,214 So my dad was also an entrepreneur. 202 00:09:59,214 --> 00:10:01,163 He was in the jewelry business. 203 00:10:01,163 --> 00:10:05,673 He forced me I say forced because early on it was forced 204 00:10:06,240 --> 00:10:08,488 as I got into high school I actually really enjoyed going to 205 00:10:08,488 --> 00:10:13,888 the jewelry shop and so I worked around his clients and 206 00:10:14,188 --> 00:10:18,619 his clientele cleaning jewelry, doing simple stuff, running 207 00:10:18,678 --> 00:10:19,780 repairs around town. 208 00:10:19,780 --> 00:10:25,171 But he taught me how to be financially responsible and he 209 00:10:25,230 --> 00:10:31,249 taught me the ability to really look way beyond today, tomorrow, 210 00:10:31,249 --> 00:10:34,261 the next week, the next month, and I think that all those 211 00:10:34,322 --> 00:10:37,768 lessons when I was a lot younger completely translated to my 212 00:10:37,868 --> 00:10:38,929 entrepreneurial journey. 213 00:10:39,772 --> 00:10:45,403 And I remember when I hired the first major executive hire we 214 00:10:45,442 --> 00:10:49,292 made outside of myself and my partner and one of his questions 215 00:10:49,292 --> 00:10:52,269 was like, hey, I need to make sure you're financially sound, 216 00:10:52,370 --> 00:10:54,860 and at this time we only had about 18 employees. 217 00:10:54,860 --> 00:10:56,994 We were doing roughly $40 million a year in annual revenue 218 00:10:56,994 --> 00:10:57,600 and we this time we only had about 18 employees, we were 219 00:10:57,557 --> 00:11:01,070 doing roughly $40 million a year in annual revenue and we sat 220 00:11:01,090 --> 00:11:02,753 down and went over the finances and he goes. 221 00:11:02,753 --> 00:11:06,456 That's kind of impressive and I'd never forget that because at 222 00:11:06,456 --> 00:11:09,004 this point in time we were kind of in a bit of a dungeon for an 223 00:11:09,004 --> 00:11:12,721 office, getting ready to move into what is now our really nice 224 00:11:12,721 --> 00:11:14,446 space in beautiful downtown Dubuque. 225 00:11:14,446 --> 00:11:18,043 But I say this jokingly like I'm surprised, he even took the 226 00:11:18,083 --> 00:11:19,827 interview when I brought him into our office. 227 00:11:19,827 --> 00:11:24,432 He was an insurance director, a recruiting director for a large 228 00:11:24,432 --> 00:11:27,803 insurance firm in Chicago, had a really nice office, did really 229 00:11:27,803 --> 00:11:30,471 well there and I was able to bring him to small town Iowa. 230 00:11:30,471 --> 00:11:35,746 But yeah, that kind of takes me back to one of our core 231 00:11:35,787 --> 00:11:38,633 memories was like I'll never forget him. 232 00:11:38,633 --> 00:11:40,585 Looking at me he's like okay, yeah, you're definitely. 233 00:11:40,585 --> 00:11:41,808 You know what you're doing with your money. 234 00:11:41,808 --> 00:11:42,924 All this makes sense now. 235 00:11:44,461 --> 00:11:48,128 Speaker 1: Well, and that's a testament to your father and 236 00:11:48,207 --> 00:11:51,073 also to your own values as well. 237 00:11:51,073 --> 00:11:54,866 I mean, there's a lot of easier ways to make money than freight 238 00:11:54,866 --> 00:11:59,134 brokerage and easier ways to do it than bootstrapping it. 239 00:11:59,134 --> 00:12:03,868 But I'm also just picturing the jewelry store too, getting to 240 00:12:03,927 --> 00:12:07,133 watch your dad and other grownups interact with clients. 241 00:12:07,133 --> 00:12:11,547 Yes, and the customer service element and how you have to 242 00:12:11,626 --> 00:12:14,173 listen because you're selling a high-end piece of jewelry to a 243 00:12:14,212 --> 00:12:14,793 specific clientele. 244 00:12:14,793 --> 00:12:15,174 Did that shape? 245 00:12:15,174 --> 00:12:16,697 I know you're selling a high-end piece of jewelry to a 246 00:12:16,717 --> 00:12:17,178 specific clientele. 247 00:12:17,178 --> 00:12:17,759 Did that shape? 248 00:12:17,759 --> 00:12:20,970 I know you're very effective at sales. 249 00:12:20,970 --> 00:12:23,991 Is that embedded in there somewhere too? 250 00:12:24,796 --> 00:12:25,460 Speaker 2: 100%. 251 00:12:25,460 --> 00:12:29,530 I remember my first real memory of being in the shop. 252 00:12:29,530 --> 00:12:33,928 Obviously, christmas season is the fourth quarter is always 253 00:12:34,009 --> 00:12:35,393 busy in the jewelry business right? 254 00:12:35,393 --> 00:12:38,207 You go and get your wife a pair of earrings or a nice tennis 255 00:12:38,248 --> 00:12:41,860 bracelet or a necklace or whatever the case might be, and 256 00:12:41,921 --> 00:12:45,229 so my dad taught me from about eight or nine how to shake 257 00:12:45,830 --> 00:12:49,605 somebody's hand the right way, how to look them in the eye, how 258 00:12:49,605 --> 00:12:52,640 to say their name once out loud and three times in your head, 259 00:12:52,682 --> 00:12:53,625 and you'll never forget it. 260 00:12:53,860 --> 00:12:57,650 That's something that, like I will never forget where I was 261 00:12:57,740 --> 00:13:02,245 when he taught me some of those things, and that is absolutely 262 00:13:02,306 --> 00:13:05,966 translated into how I carry myself, not only as a leader but 263 00:13:05,966 --> 00:13:09,504 as somebody who I would consider myself a very effective 264 00:13:09,504 --> 00:13:10,187 salesperson. 265 00:13:10,187 --> 00:13:12,889 But it's authentic, it's genuine. 266 00:13:12,889 --> 00:13:14,787 There's nothing fake about it. 267 00:13:14,787 --> 00:13:16,504 That's just kind of my style. 268 00:13:16,504 --> 00:13:19,046 Who you see today is who you get tomorrow. 269 00:13:19,046 --> 00:13:21,557 I've had the pleasure of meeting on several different 270 00:13:21,798 --> 00:13:23,884 occasions and I think I've been the same person every time. 271 00:13:23,884 --> 00:13:28,041 I think that's what makes me unique to myself, maybe not 272 00:13:28,482 --> 00:13:30,470 unique to everyone else, but at least unique to me. 273 00:13:31,179 --> 00:13:32,962 Speaker 1: You are a sincere person, chris. 274 00:13:32,962 --> 00:13:34,904 That's one of the things that I appreciate about you. 275 00:13:34,904 --> 00:13:38,649 I mean, when we met a couple of years ago at the Bitfreighter 276 00:13:38,669 --> 00:13:42,375 golf event, we had an hour-long conversation. 277 00:13:42,375 --> 00:13:44,765 At the end of the event it was probably 10 or 11 o'clock at 278 00:13:44,806 --> 00:13:47,482 night just sitting out on a patio having a beer, and I 279 00:13:47,543 --> 00:13:49,509 walked away and I thought, man, I could have kept talking to him 280 00:13:49,509 --> 00:13:52,525 for two more hours, because what you see is what you get. 281 00:13:52,546 --> 00:14:00,490 There isn't any fake polish or you were also interested in me 282 00:14:00,629 --> 00:14:03,035 and what I had to say, and so to be able to have a dialogue and 283 00:14:03,076 --> 00:14:08,885 not just somebody talking at you for ever is engaging, and 284 00:14:09,807 --> 00:14:13,100 getting to see you again just a few months ago at the event 285 00:14:13,120 --> 00:14:14,182 again this year was great. 286 00:14:14,582 --> 00:14:16,868 I also know you're the title sponsor. 287 00:14:16,868 --> 00:14:19,398 Now, of course, there's a commercial element to being a 288 00:14:19,498 --> 00:14:21,140 title sponsor of any kind of event. 289 00:14:21,140 --> 00:14:23,644 You get reward and benefit from that. 290 00:14:23,644 --> 00:14:29,004 But this is also a charity event and nobody listening knows 291 00:14:29,004 --> 00:14:29,164 this. 292 00:14:29,164 --> 00:14:33,940 But I am also aware that you won the tournament in terms of 293 00:14:34,019 --> 00:14:37,066 golf and then you donated the prize that you won from the golf 294 00:14:37,066 --> 00:14:39,457 tournament back to the ALS society. 295 00:14:39,457 --> 00:14:42,557 So, aside from just being sincere and I'm not just trying 296 00:14:42,577 --> 00:14:43,341 to flatter you, chris. 297 00:14:43,341 --> 00:14:48,057 Having spent time with you, I'm acknowledging part of what I 298 00:14:48,097 --> 00:14:51,644 believe makes you special and effective as an entrepreneur, 299 00:14:52,505 --> 00:14:56,798 and those aren't skills, they're characteristics, they're traits 300 00:14:56,798 --> 00:15:02,826 of a person, and to be effective over the long term in 301 00:15:02,885 --> 00:15:07,191 business, you have to build a reputation that is real. 302 00:15:07,191 --> 00:15:11,066 Otherwise we're pretty good at sniffing out BS. 303 00:15:12,677 --> 00:15:19,143 Speaker 2: I would say so, part of my reason for being is it's 304 00:15:19,202 --> 00:15:22,909 not self self gratification, it's how do I bring as many good 305 00:15:22,909 --> 00:15:25,059 people along this journey with me? 306 00:15:25,059 --> 00:15:27,345 Like, that is my. 307 00:15:27,345 --> 00:15:28,788 Somebody asked me what my purpose was. 308 00:15:28,788 --> 00:15:32,184 Matter of fact, this was yesterday and I was interviewing 309 00:15:32,184 --> 00:15:34,433 an executive coach. 310 00:15:34,433 --> 00:15:37,503 Right, I'm, I'm constantly looking to try and improve 311 00:15:37,582 --> 00:15:43,976 myself professionally, looking to try and improve myself 312 00:15:43,996 --> 00:15:45,440 professionally myself in my personal life and then as well 313 00:15:45,460 --> 00:15:45,841 in my faith journey. 314 00:15:45,841 --> 00:15:47,023 Right, and he said what's your purpose? 315 00:15:47,023 --> 00:15:51,999 And I said my purpose in business is to bring as many 316 00:15:52,120 --> 00:15:56,466 good people along this, what I believe is an awesome, 317 00:15:56,628 --> 00:16:00,442 incredible journey as many good people with me as I can and to 318 00:16:00,501 --> 00:16:02,476 take them as far as I possibly can. 319 00:16:02,476 --> 00:16:06,169 And I I've done a pretty good job of doing that thus far. 320 00:16:06,169 --> 00:16:09,759 But but the conversation I had yesterday just reinvigorated me 321 00:16:09,798 --> 00:16:14,034 and I'm like how do I, how do I take all 100 people with me? 322 00:16:14,034 --> 00:16:15,658 Like, how do we keep getting better? 323 00:16:17,380 --> 00:16:19,403 Speaker 1: So these are some of the highlights. 324 00:16:19,403 --> 00:16:22,429 I mean, these are are the the best parts of being able to do 325 00:16:22,509 --> 00:16:23,015 what you do. 326 00:16:23,015 --> 00:16:26,690 When you find your purpose or your calling and your talents, 327 00:16:26,710 --> 00:16:29,017 you're able to leverage that into a vocation that helps 328 00:16:29,077 --> 00:16:31,121 others and and helps yourself and your family. 329 00:16:31,121 --> 00:16:34,956 But that's not the full story either. 330 00:16:34,956 --> 00:16:39,664 There's also, um, really, really hard parts that don't get 331 00:16:39,664 --> 00:16:42,350 talked about a lot about being an entrepreneur. 332 00:16:42,350 --> 00:16:44,062 What are some of those things for you? 333 00:16:48,519 --> 00:16:51,924 Speaker 2: Well, to say that building a business is easy, I 334 00:16:51,965 --> 00:16:55,070 would say that that person has never done it. 335 00:16:57,975 --> 00:17:00,484 Every once in a while you run into the oh it must be nice 336 00:17:00,543 --> 00:17:04,326 people and, uh, sometimes they're your closest friends and 337 00:17:04,326 --> 00:17:08,679 sometimes they're your biggest enemy, and and that that phrase 338 00:17:08,720 --> 00:17:10,826 gets brought up and I just want to clear the air. 339 00:17:10,826 --> 00:17:15,605 There is nothing, nothing easy about being an entrepreneur, and 340 00:17:15,605 --> 00:17:16,387 I mean nothing. 341 00:17:16,387 --> 00:17:20,262 Um, some of the hardest things that I've had to endure is 342 00:17:20,884 --> 00:17:25,280 parting ways with some of my best friends, parting ways with 343 00:17:25,382 --> 00:17:31,215 family members who were going against the grain and cutting 344 00:17:31,355 --> 00:17:34,590 corners when it comes to our culture and our processes and 345 00:17:35,072 --> 00:17:38,980 our procedures, and I think the hardest decision I ever had to 346 00:17:39,099 --> 00:17:43,625 make as a leader was letting go my most productive carrier 347 00:17:43,685 --> 00:17:47,771 operations person who ended up being a childhood friend of mine 348 00:17:47,771 --> 00:17:50,957 , for the greater good of the organization, because it just 349 00:17:51,017 --> 00:17:54,443 started to that negativity just kind of started to spill out 350 00:17:55,666 --> 00:17:59,540 amongst the rest of the group, and that was a very difficult 351 00:17:59,621 --> 00:18:04,279 personal decision, but it was the hardest yet wisest decision 352 00:18:04,721 --> 00:18:08,469 I had ever made to this point as an entrepreneur and a founder. 353 00:18:09,095 --> 00:18:11,840 Speaker 1: What was it like a month later in the room with the 354 00:18:11,840 --> 00:18:12,082 team? 355 00:18:12,082 --> 00:18:16,239 Just like tension is down, communication is up. 356 00:18:16,239 --> 00:18:18,045 What was the vibe like afterwards? 357 00:18:18,555 --> 00:18:20,122 Speaker 2: I would say, the next week it was different. 358 00:18:20,535 --> 00:18:20,796 Speaker 1: Really. 359 00:18:21,638 --> 00:18:23,463 Speaker 2: Yeah, it was almost instantaneously. 360 00:18:23,463 --> 00:18:29,122 It was, it was, and it just then it reassured myself that 361 00:18:29,162 --> 00:18:30,425 that was the right decision. 362 00:18:30,425 --> 00:18:33,454 Right, and it gave me a good amount of reassurance because, 363 00:18:33,516 --> 00:18:35,519 I've got to be honest, I lost a lot of sleep. 364 00:18:35,519 --> 00:18:39,365 Um, I had to hear it from family members on the West Coast 365 00:18:39,365 --> 00:18:41,009 like, hey, what the heck's going on? 366 00:18:41,009 --> 00:18:45,164 We're here and so-and-so, and um, I think the one part of this 367 00:18:45,164 --> 00:18:51,261 journey that most people don't talk about is, uh, it can change 368 00:18:51,261 --> 00:18:53,605 you, right, it can change you. 369 00:18:53,605 --> 00:18:57,718 If you do it well, your life changes monetarily. 370 00:18:57,718 --> 00:18:59,162 That's pretty evident, right? 371 00:19:00,263 --> 00:19:04,520 But I'm not the same person or leader today that I was seven 372 00:19:04,560 --> 00:19:05,021 years ago. 373 00:19:05,021 --> 00:19:08,969 I am far more calm, far more. 374 00:19:08,969 --> 00:19:13,682 I'm quicker to make decisions, but I'm a lot more thoughtful 375 00:19:13,722 --> 00:19:16,896 with them, whereas three or four or five years ago, there would 376 00:19:16,916 --> 00:19:19,101 have been a lot more raw emotion attached to it. 377 00:19:19,101 --> 00:19:22,027 Now it's a little bit more okay . 378 00:19:22,027 --> 00:19:25,653 Detach myself from this situation, potentially go seek 379 00:19:25,713 --> 00:19:29,163 counsel from my executive team or my partners. 380 00:19:29,163 --> 00:19:34,276 In most cases, I do that every time now, and it's okay to 381 00:19:34,316 --> 00:19:37,441 change and evolve in those instances. 382 00:19:37,441 --> 00:19:40,026 But I'm not a different person. 383 00:19:40,026 --> 00:19:41,669 I'm still the same, chris Brewer. 384 00:19:41,669 --> 00:19:46,211 I have just evolved as a leader and I feel like this version of 385 00:19:46,211 --> 00:19:50,482 me today is a lot more effective than the version that 386 00:19:50,542 --> 00:19:52,248 I was three or four or five years ago. 387 00:19:52,976 --> 00:19:55,682 Speaker 1: So you mentioned that getting too emotional was maybe 388 00:19:55,682 --> 00:19:57,528 part of what you had to overcome. 389 00:19:57,528 --> 00:20:00,579 Was there anything else that you had to specifically work on? 390 00:20:00,579 --> 00:20:34,586 For some people, if they've been in charge for a long time, 391 00:20:34,926 --> 00:20:38,596 they're very unaware of how their emotions impact other 392 00:20:38,616 --> 00:20:38,938 people. 393 00:20:38,938 --> 00:20:44,255 So you can be frustrated with a business outcome and that's the 394 00:20:44,255 --> 00:20:47,125 word that you would use but somebody in the room might see 395 00:20:47,205 --> 00:20:51,480 it as anger, and then you're angry at them, and then that can 396 00:20:51,480 --> 00:20:53,616 create a culture of fear, or just. 397 00:20:53,616 --> 00:20:55,200 I'm giving an example here. 398 00:20:55,200 --> 00:20:58,807 I'm not saying that it applies to you, but do you remember, 399 00:20:58,928 --> 00:21:00,859 like what one of your coaches may be saying? 400 00:21:00,859 --> 00:21:04,448 You might have this tendency that you're unaware of and we 401 00:21:04,475 --> 00:21:10,818 need to work on it yes, I actually yes, I would say the 402 00:21:10,899 --> 00:21:12,480 answer to that is yes. 403 00:21:14,182 --> 00:21:17,864 Speaker 2: Relinquishing control , I think, is the right word. 404 00:21:17,864 --> 00:21:27,631 Right, because for so long it was me, the salesperson Chris, 405 00:21:28,251 --> 00:21:34,596 the leader Chris, the boss person, chris, the leader, chris 406 00:21:34,596 --> 00:21:36,621 , the boss Chris was at one time the leading carrier operations 407 00:21:36,642 --> 00:21:36,761 person. 408 00:21:36,761 --> 00:21:38,766 Chris at one time led all of claims and then also handled all 409 00:21:38,766 --> 00:21:40,256 of the commissions and finances . 410 00:21:40,256 --> 00:21:46,751 That was difficult to really put myself out there and go out 411 00:21:46,772 --> 00:21:49,841 and find the right talent and bring them in and then give them 412 00:21:49,841 --> 00:21:53,738 autonomy over those departments . 413 00:21:53,738 --> 00:21:55,701 That's difficult to do. 414 00:21:55,701 --> 00:22:01,930 But the second I gave full control up is the second that 415 00:22:02,055 --> 00:22:04,942 this thing went to the moon. 416 00:22:05,122 --> 00:22:07,147 Speaker 1: I mean that's yeah, it's not Chris Brewer logistics, 417 00:22:07,147 --> 00:22:09,279 it's River City logistics, so you've got to Exactly, got a 418 00:22:09,841 --> 00:22:12,476 yeah, and it took me a lot to get there. 419 00:22:12,937 --> 00:22:14,120 Speaker 2: I would say I'm all the way there. 420 00:22:14,120 --> 00:22:17,928 Now I've got two great partners uh, three partners that they 421 00:22:18,035 --> 00:22:22,264 each have control over their respective um divisions within 422 00:22:22,605 --> 00:22:27,181 all three organizations and I don't really make any of those 423 00:22:27,221 --> 00:22:28,162 decisions anymore. 424 00:22:28,162 --> 00:22:33,317 I'm now solely responsible for the brand, the strategic vision 425 00:22:34,740 --> 00:22:35,803 and M&A. 426 00:22:35,803 --> 00:22:38,709 Those are the three things that I'm really focused on at the 427 00:22:38,775 --> 00:22:39,316 present moment. 428 00:22:39,857 --> 00:22:41,903 Speaker 1: Well, tell me about your partners and what they 429 00:22:42,364 --> 00:22:45,337 uniquely bring to the table that maybe is their God-given gift, 430 00:22:45,778 --> 00:22:49,626 and then also, how have you seen them change on this journey? 431 00:22:50,528 --> 00:22:52,853 Speaker 2: And also, how have you seen them change on this 432 00:22:52,893 --> 00:22:53,134 journey? 433 00:22:53,134 --> 00:22:56,259 Yes, that's good, because they have changed as well. 434 00:22:56,259 --> 00:23:00,106 So my first partner that came with me his name is Josh 435 00:23:00,147 --> 00:23:00,807 Greenbaum. 436 00:23:00,807 --> 00:23:06,739 He oversees pretty much the entire brokerage operation. 437 00:23:06,739 --> 00:23:09,386 He's a really smart guy, really good at business development. 438 00:23:09,386 --> 00:23:14,943 He oversees all the account management team and then he also 439 00:23:14,943 --> 00:23:18,715 oversees the carrier operations manager and then carrier 440 00:23:18,755 --> 00:23:20,965 operations manager is responsible for his team. 441 00:23:20,965 --> 00:23:23,676 So, from a brokerage perspective, josh handles the 442 00:23:23,716 --> 00:23:26,000 brokerage entirely and I want to give him his flowers. 443 00:23:26,000 --> 00:23:29,636 In the worst freight market that I've ever seen, we're going 444 00:23:29,636 --> 00:23:31,981 to double in revenue from 24 to 25. 445 00:23:32,423 --> 00:23:33,264 Speaker 1: Oh, congratulations. 446 00:23:33,745 --> 00:23:36,336 Speaker 2: Yeah, and I don't say that lightly because, um, I 447 00:23:36,398 --> 00:23:39,528 know that people are out there struggling, but I I gotta, I 448 00:23:39,548 --> 00:23:42,458 gotta give my team the respect and the credit that they deserve 449 00:23:42,458 --> 00:23:42,458 . 450 00:23:42,458 --> 00:23:46,475 And I got to stop being afraid of um, pronouncing the fact that 451 00:23:46,475 --> 00:23:50,365 we are successful, cause I kind of get a little, a little gun 452 00:23:50,424 --> 00:23:51,066 shy about that. 453 00:23:51,066 --> 00:23:53,261 It's like, oh, I don't want people to know we're doing well. 454 00:23:53,261 --> 00:23:56,517 But I'm at the point now where we have built something really 455 00:23:56,557 --> 00:23:59,706 good and our processes are good, the way we treat our customers 456 00:23:59,746 --> 00:24:02,201 and our carriers are really good , the way we treat each other is 457 00:24:02,201 --> 00:24:04,875 really good, and so I got to give Josh his credit. 458 00:24:04,976 --> 00:24:08,202 My other partner, jake Shireman, was an outside guy. 459 00:24:08,202 --> 00:24:11,067 We brought him in from the insurance world and I say this 460 00:24:11,107 --> 00:24:16,325 too we were good at what we did, which was customer acquisition 461 00:24:16,365 --> 00:24:17,167 and covering freight. 462 00:24:17,167 --> 00:24:18,856 We weren't a business until I hired Jake. 463 00:24:18,856 --> 00:24:20,160 I like it. 464 00:24:20,160 --> 00:24:25,515 So he's the business guy, he's the finance guy, he is the hey, 465 00:24:25,555 --> 00:24:26,857 we can make this work guy. 466 00:24:26,857 --> 00:24:28,601 He is the risk assessment guy. 467 00:24:28,601 --> 00:24:32,828 Jake oversees everything and then rolls up to me. 468 00:24:32,828 --> 00:24:36,505 I don't think we are anywhere near where we are today without 469 00:24:36,525 --> 00:24:36,746 Jake. 470 00:24:37,635 --> 00:24:38,278 Speaker 1: That's great to hear. 471 00:24:38,278 --> 00:24:43,097 And again, what have you seen, both, of how they evolved, even 472 00:24:43,138 --> 00:24:44,180 just in the last couple of years ? 473 00:24:45,722 --> 00:24:51,561 Speaker 2: I think, compassion and true servant leadership. 474 00:24:51,561 --> 00:24:53,045 I've seen a lot out of those two. 475 00:24:53,045 --> 00:24:59,346 I've seen them lift people up that they were managing and then 476 00:24:59,346 --> 00:25:02,162 move them, and then move those people up in the middle level 477 00:25:02,182 --> 00:25:05,355 management roles, and so that's something that I'm big on, right 478 00:25:05,355 --> 00:25:08,084 I want to continue promoting from within this organization, 479 00:25:08,806 --> 00:25:14,381 and I've seen both of them get as much as they humanly possibly 480 00:25:14,381 --> 00:25:16,365 can out of the people that they lead. 481 00:25:16,365 --> 00:25:20,221 And then, and then more, and then some Um, and I think that's 482 00:25:20,221 --> 00:25:22,875 what makes this place special is the fact that that we have 483 00:25:22,917 --> 00:25:25,985 good leaders who are able to get the most out of their people, 484 00:25:26,166 --> 00:25:29,926 and then, and then a few of those folks, they're able to 485 00:25:30,047 --> 00:25:32,816 rise to the occasion, and then now we're looking at a whole new 486 00:25:32,816 --> 00:25:34,076 level of leadership that we fostered from good culture. 487 00:25:34,076 --> 00:25:35,359 Now we're looking at a whole new level of leadership that we 488 00:25:35,379 --> 00:25:36,460 fostered from good culture. 489 00:25:37,321 --> 00:25:40,004 Speaker 1: And then it multiplies over people and over 490 00:25:40,044 --> 00:25:41,486 time and it starts to compound. 491 00:25:41,486 --> 00:25:44,950 I mean, what a blast, are you having fun? 492 00:25:45,529 --> 00:25:46,691 Speaker 2: I'm having so much fun. 493 00:25:50,585 --> 00:25:52,034 Speaker 1: I tell people all the time I have the best job in the 494 00:25:52,034 --> 00:25:52,154 world. 495 00:25:52,154 --> 00:25:55,548 How do you stay? 496 00:25:55,548 --> 00:25:56,459 Let me think of how. 497 00:25:56,459 --> 00:25:57,125 Do I want to ask this one? 498 00:25:57,125 --> 00:25:58,635 I imagine when you first started you're like you know 499 00:25:58,676 --> 00:25:59,478 what success is. 500 00:25:59,478 --> 00:26:02,947 Success is a $10 million brokerage with eight people and 501 00:26:03,075 --> 00:26:05,220 fill in the blank, and then one day you're like you know what 502 00:26:06,082 --> 00:26:10,856 Success is 50 million and it's a new office or whatever that 503 00:26:10,917 --> 00:26:11,678 thing is. 504 00:26:11,678 --> 00:26:19,645 How do you not constantly chase just the next level but 505 00:26:19,706 --> 00:26:23,129 maintain some degree of contentedness while still 506 00:26:23,789 --> 00:26:26,072 redefining what success looks like for the next chapter? 507 00:26:28,036 --> 00:26:31,181 Sorry that was a long question, that's a good, that's a really 508 00:26:31,221 --> 00:26:31,804 good question. 509 00:26:31,934 --> 00:26:33,059 Speaker 2: I'm going to break it into two parts. 510 00:26:33,059 --> 00:26:41,177 I'm going to break it into two parts. 511 00:26:41,177 --> 00:26:42,721 Any good founder that I've come in contact with in the last 512 00:26:42,741 --> 00:26:43,123 three years. 513 00:26:43,123 --> 00:26:46,813 They have all had goals, and they're personal goals and then 514 00:26:46,833 --> 00:26:49,700 they're generally business goals , that which are measured in 515 00:26:49,760 --> 00:26:50,562 revenue, right. 516 00:26:50,562 --> 00:26:54,459 That's kind of the way that I've encountered some of the 517 00:26:54,479 --> 00:26:56,625 more successful people that I've met in the last three years. 518 00:26:56,625 --> 00:27:02,663 When I first started this in December of 2018, my only goal 519 00:27:02,743 --> 00:27:05,407 and I kid you not was I want to make enough money to go on 520 00:27:05,427 --> 00:27:07,210 vacation once a year and buy a house. 521 00:27:07,670 --> 00:27:07,791 Speaker 1: Yep. 522 00:27:08,496 --> 00:27:09,520 Speaker 2: That was my goal, right? 523 00:27:09,520 --> 00:27:14,746 Well, a year came and went by and I was like, oh, this is too 524 00:27:14,786 --> 00:27:15,187 much work. 525 00:27:15,187 --> 00:27:19,901 Now we're going to start to hire and so for the first time 526 00:27:19,941 --> 00:27:25,629 in 2022, I believe when we hired Jake, we had no goals. 527 00:27:25,629 --> 00:27:26,610 We had none. 528 00:27:26,610 --> 00:27:36,691 So one of his first challenges to me, he said I want a three, a 529 00:27:36,691 --> 00:27:37,475 five, a seven and a 10-year plan. 530 00:27:37,475 --> 00:27:41,478 And I gave him that plan and we're in in year three now and 531 00:27:41,518 --> 00:27:43,621 we're pacing at year seven Just by having goals, even. 532 00:27:44,182 --> 00:27:45,583 Right. 533 00:27:45,583 --> 00:27:51,395 The answer, the long form answer, is it's not what can we 534 00:27:51,456 --> 00:27:51,736 buy? 535 00:27:51,736 --> 00:27:56,989 How can we buy it's, how can I make, and how can I encourage my 536 00:27:56,989 --> 00:28:00,658 group to make, the largest impact on the industry that we 537 00:28:00,698 --> 00:28:04,226 serve Part of the reason why I thoroughly enjoy going out to DC 538 00:28:04,226 --> 00:28:07,581 every year at the TIA Policy Forum with Chris Burrows and his 539 00:28:07,581 --> 00:28:07,862 team. 540 00:28:07,862 --> 00:28:10,807 There is real impact being made . 541 00:28:10,807 --> 00:28:12,719 Last year we spoke about freight fraud. 542 00:28:12,719 --> 00:28:15,647 Well, come to find out when I showed up there on Monday. 543 00:28:15,647 --> 00:28:18,353 Spoke about freight fraud Well, come to find out when I showed 544 00:28:18,373 --> 00:28:19,015 up there on Monday. 545 00:28:19,015 --> 00:28:23,942 We've got a bill on the House and Senate floor that's going to 546 00:28:23,942 --> 00:28:25,107 be kind of looped into the surface transportation policy 547 00:28:25,128 --> 00:28:26,434 that's going to be voted on next month and I think it's going to 548 00:28:26,434 --> 00:28:31,306 pass and like that's cool, Like that's the type of stuff that I 549 00:28:31,306 --> 00:28:32,188 get out of bed for. 550 00:28:33,235 --> 00:28:35,343 Speaker 1: So what will the policy change be, if it goes the 551 00:28:35,343 --> 00:28:35,864 way you would hope? 552 00:28:37,075 --> 00:28:37,276 Speaker 2: of bed for. 553 00:28:37,276 --> 00:28:38,799 So what will the policy change be if it goes the way you would 554 00:28:38,820 --> 00:28:38,900 hope? 555 00:28:38,900 --> 00:28:40,565 So there's going to be civil punishment, punitive damages for 556 00:28:40,565 --> 00:28:41,847 freight fraud and theft. 557 00:28:41,847 --> 00:28:44,916 So people are going to go to jail. 558 00:28:45,557 --> 00:28:48,702 Speaker 1: Yeah, whereas today there's really no consequences. 559 00:28:50,506 --> 00:28:52,150 Speaker 2: There's no consequences whatsoever. 560 00:28:52,150 --> 00:28:53,136 You should go to jail. 561 00:28:53,136 --> 00:28:55,182 You're causing a lot of harm to the American people. 562 00:28:55,182 --> 00:29:03,157 I told lawmakers in Washington DC this week. 563 00:29:03,157 --> 00:29:04,539 I said it is inhibiting the ability for somebody who wants 564 00:29:04,580 --> 00:29:05,342 to buy a truck. 565 00:29:05,342 --> 00:29:08,327 It inhibits their ability to live out their American dream. 566 00:29:08,327 --> 00:29:12,481 One truckload gets stolen, they're bankrupt, they're done. 567 00:29:12,481 --> 00:29:15,758 Their policy is not getting renewed next year. 568 00:29:15,778 --> 00:29:23,769 Speaker 1: And if it does, it's going to be at such a premium 569 00:29:23,788 --> 00:29:25,054 that they can't even afford to pay. 570 00:29:25,054 --> 00:29:28,398 So now you're thinking beyond, still, the business realm, but 571 00:29:28,418 --> 00:29:29,740 of course you're thinking bigger than that industry level impact 572 00:29:29,740 --> 00:29:29,740 . 573 00:29:29,740 --> 00:29:31,264 How do you stay grounded then too? 574 00:29:31,264 --> 00:29:34,798 I mean the opposite side of the question, Somebody in your 575 00:29:34,879 --> 00:29:38,645 shoes with the financial success and the business success. 576 00:29:38,645 --> 00:29:40,548 Hey, sometimes it's tempting. 577 00:29:40,548 --> 00:29:44,120 I'm pretty cool stuff, I'm kind of a big deal. 578 00:29:44,120 --> 00:29:48,686 How does that, or does that not ever for you become an issue? 579 00:29:48,686 --> 00:29:50,960 I would imagine for me it would . 580 00:29:52,304 --> 00:29:56,164 Speaker 2: Oh no, I mean to say that it's not an issue, is not 581 00:29:56,225 --> 00:29:56,446 true. 582 00:29:56,446 --> 00:29:59,218 I mean to say that it's not an issue, is not true. 583 00:29:59,218 --> 00:29:59,718 I mean that's false. 584 00:29:59,718 --> 00:30:06,945 Anytime you start to accumulate some level of success, there's 585 00:30:07,045 --> 00:30:09,508 cars that you want or there's trips that you want to take. 586 00:30:09,508 --> 00:30:11,890 I'm not going to sit here and lie to you. 587 00:30:11,890 --> 00:30:19,456 We've been on some really cool trips there's. 588 00:30:19,456 --> 00:30:20,419 We've been on some really cool trips. 589 00:30:20,439 --> 00:30:21,683 Um, I gotta go back to my rock, my, my, my anchor, and that's my 590 00:30:21,683 --> 00:30:21,945 wife, my wife. 591 00:30:21,945 --> 00:30:23,129 Um, this would give you everything you need to know 592 00:30:23,149 --> 00:30:23,450 about her. 593 00:30:23,450 --> 00:30:27,240 She is your typical midwestern catholic. 594 00:30:27,240 --> 00:30:30,225 Uh, grew up in a farming family . 595 00:30:30,225 --> 00:30:34,277 Um, gal like that's who she is to her core. 596 00:30:34,277 --> 00:30:37,654 She goes to the grocery store and she buys non-main brand 597 00:30:38,056 --> 00:30:43,407 salad dressings and she doesn't buy Heinz ketchup, she buys the 598 00:30:43,606 --> 00:30:43,988 off-brand. 599 00:30:43,988 --> 00:30:45,155 We've now remedied that. 600 00:30:45,155 --> 00:30:49,945 I got to have my Heinz, but that's who my wife is to her 601 00:30:49,985 --> 00:30:53,557 core and she keeps me very grounded in that regard. 602 00:30:53,960 --> 00:30:57,816 And for the first time ever, we went, uh met with our attorney 603 00:30:57,836 --> 00:31:01,144 and our financial planner and we said hey, we need to have a 604 00:31:01,205 --> 00:31:04,022 real plan for what success looks like today and what it looks 605 00:31:04,042 --> 00:31:05,849 like 10, 15, 25 years in the future. 606 00:31:06,451 --> 00:31:07,375 Um and albeit. 607 00:31:07,375 --> 00:31:12,023 You know, putting together a death plan is is scary, but when 608 00:31:12,023 --> 00:31:17,980 , when her and I have, you know, had the been blessed, right I? 609 00:31:17,980 --> 00:31:20,767 I said that we've been blessed by many different avenues. 610 00:31:20,767 --> 00:31:23,622 We've been blessed by people around us, we've been blessed by 611 00:31:23,622 --> 00:31:23,945 God. 612 00:31:23,945 --> 00:31:26,721 We've been blessed by the customers who believe in what 613 00:31:26,741 --> 00:31:28,166 we're building monetarily. 614 00:31:28,166 --> 00:31:31,701 We wanted to just kind of safeguard that and make sure 615 00:31:31,721 --> 00:31:34,347 that, if anything were to happen to us, our children are set up, 616 00:31:34,347 --> 00:31:37,518 they can go to college, they can start a business of their 617 00:31:37,557 --> 00:31:38,240 own if they want. 618 00:31:38,240 --> 00:31:40,894 But those were difficult conversations to have. 619 00:31:40,894 --> 00:31:47,846 But nobody prepares you for that unless you grew up around 620 00:31:48,006 --> 00:31:50,950 somebody who went down that path . 621 00:31:50,950 --> 00:31:55,805 My dad was an entrepreneur but he never went down the path of 622 00:31:55,865 --> 00:31:59,096 planning for us kids because he was still in the day-to-day, 623 00:31:59,177 --> 00:32:03,547 even in his late 50s and 60s right, and so having to learn 624 00:32:03,586 --> 00:32:07,682 all that that's one of those learning curves as a leader that 625 00:32:07,682 --> 00:32:09,005 nobody tells you is coming. 626 00:32:10,366 --> 00:32:12,397 We walked out of that meeting with our attorney and we were 627 00:32:12,417 --> 00:32:15,760 just kind of scratching our heads like, all right, so if we 628 00:32:15,821 --> 00:32:18,904 die we're good, right, and we're laughing about it. 629 00:32:18,904 --> 00:32:23,331 But the name of the game is how do you put your children and 630 00:32:23,355 --> 00:32:25,461 the people around you that are closest to you in a better 631 00:32:25,500 --> 00:32:27,846 position when you're not here any longer? 632 00:32:27,846 --> 00:32:32,403 And that's the largest part of my purpose is my family. 633 00:32:33,365 --> 00:32:36,150 Speaker 1: I love to hear that, because you also have to have a 634 00:32:36,210 --> 00:32:37,352 plan for the what ifs. 635 00:32:37,352 --> 00:32:42,104 That aren't all good my wife and I did a similar exercise 636 00:32:42,124 --> 00:32:45,960 three or four years ago and just the questions that it prompts. 637 00:32:45,960 --> 00:32:50,249 It forces you to prioritize what matters. 638 00:32:50,249 --> 00:32:53,537 You have to put people's names down as beneficiaries, and now 639 00:32:53,616 --> 00:33:00,119 you've got relationship impact plus financial impact, and I 640 00:33:00,159 --> 00:33:03,105 think the public service announcement from all this for 641 00:33:03,164 --> 00:33:05,189 our listeners is don't wait. 642 00:33:05,189 --> 00:33:08,263 The biggest challenges for those kinds of things are for 643 00:33:08,283 --> 00:33:11,583 the people that don't plan, and the impact is actually felt by 644 00:33:11,623 --> 00:33:15,076 the people that are left behind when there isn't a plan and then 645 00:33:15,076 --> 00:33:19,449 there becomes conflict or any number of different things. 646 00:33:19,449 --> 00:33:22,302 And so you've got a three, a five, a seven and a 10 year plan 647 00:33:22,302 --> 00:33:27,139 , but now you've also got an end of life plan and that is a. 648 00:33:27,139 --> 00:33:32,109 It's a different framework for approaching life. 649 00:33:32,476 --> 00:33:36,564 One of my favorite definitions of the word wisdom is simply 650 00:33:37,166 --> 00:33:38,388 living skillfully. 651 00:33:38,388 --> 00:33:44,299 When you are wise, you avoid downside, you maximize the 652 00:33:44,380 --> 00:33:47,757 upside, you learn who you can and can't trust, you avoid 653 00:33:47,817 --> 00:33:52,661 unnecessary conflict, you stay in your zone of expertise and 654 00:33:52,681 --> 00:33:55,326 you don't get out in front of your skis and all of those 655 00:33:55,366 --> 00:33:55,607 things. 656 00:33:55,607 --> 00:34:00,361 To me's that is skillful living , and I don't think that gets 657 00:34:00,721 --> 00:34:02,385 the idea of wisdom gets enough airtime. 658 00:34:02,385 --> 00:34:05,859 We're too focused on flashy, shiny things. 659 00:34:05,859 --> 00:34:11,028 But having the foresight and maturity to make decisions like 660 00:34:11,074 --> 00:34:14,788 that for your family as a result of the way that you've done and 661 00:34:14,788 --> 00:34:17,695 thought about that, for your career first, and then your 662 00:34:17,777 --> 00:34:23,268 business second Um, I could hang out and chat with you for days, 663 00:34:23,268 --> 00:34:26,261 chris, because I like the way you communicate and the way that 664 00:34:26,261 --> 00:34:27,324 you describe things. 665 00:34:27,324 --> 00:34:30,199 Um, you've also got good style. 666 00:34:30,199 --> 00:34:31,925 I'll just say that you got good style. 667 00:34:31,925 --> 00:34:35,199 You're just you're a lot of fun to be around. 668 00:34:36,001 --> 00:34:37,586 Speaker 2: Well, I need to get up there and come fishing with 669 00:34:37,626 --> 00:34:37,706 you. 670 00:34:37,706 --> 00:34:42,264 I want to touch on one thing real quick, because you talk 671 00:34:42,304 --> 00:34:43,728 about planning. 672 00:34:43,728 --> 00:34:50,682 Right, I've been getting I'm talking probably a dozen 673 00:34:51,945 --> 00:34:56,741 solicitations weekly on what's your exit strategy. 674 00:34:56,741 --> 00:34:58,246 Would you like to sell your business? 675 00:34:58,246 --> 00:35:02,688 I've got a group of investors here and River City fits our ICP 676 00:35:02,688 --> 00:35:06,259 and we've got X, Y and Z technology and we can add you to 677 00:35:06,259 --> 00:35:08,143 our group and take your business to the next level. 678 00:35:08,143 --> 00:35:11,177 The answer is this I'm not selling my business ever. 679 00:35:11,177 --> 00:35:17,749 I want my children, I want Sophia, I want the two-year-old 680 00:35:18,470 --> 00:35:23,079 here in 2025 to one day be the CEO or whichever one of my kids, 681 00:35:23,079 --> 00:35:24,844 if they want it, if they're skillful enough. 682 00:35:24,844 --> 00:35:26,626 They're not going to be gifted anything right. 683 00:35:26,686 --> 00:35:28,235 Sure, they got to earn it, they're going to have to work 684 00:35:28,275 --> 00:35:33,804 hard for it, but leaving a legacy and then being remembered 685 00:35:33,804 --> 00:35:38,471 as somebody who was charitable and good and honest, and giving 686 00:35:40,858 --> 00:35:41,700 that's who I believe. 687 00:35:41,700 --> 00:35:45,588 I am to my core, and I want to go out like that. 688 00:35:46,675 --> 00:35:48,179 Speaker 1: You're very easy to root for. 689 00:35:48,179 --> 00:35:52,226 Proud of you also. 690 00:35:52,226 --> 00:35:54,036 Thank you Genuinely. 691 00:35:54,036 --> 00:35:57,184 I don't have any remaining questions. 692 00:35:57,184 --> 00:35:59,938 I'm like fresh out, like that hardly ever happens, but like 693 00:35:59,958 --> 00:36:02,907 you just hit every one of the right notes. 694 00:36:02,907 --> 00:36:06,360 So I'm just going to instead give you the opportunity, if you 695 00:36:06,360 --> 00:36:10,336 would like to reflect for just a moment on who would you like 696 00:36:10,376 --> 00:36:12,838 to express gratitude for in this moment. 697 00:36:14,581 --> 00:36:16,885 Speaker 2: Well, first and foremost, my wife. 698 00:36:16,885 --> 00:36:18,949 My wife is Liz. 699 00:36:18,949 --> 00:36:19,929 She's my best friend. 700 00:36:19,929 --> 00:36:23,802 She's the best partner in life you could ask for. 701 00:36:23,802 --> 00:36:25,346 She's the best mom. 702 00:36:25,346 --> 00:36:26,796 I mean she's such a good mother . 703 00:36:26,796 --> 00:36:29,641 I am so lucky in so many different ways. 704 00:36:29,641 --> 00:36:35,037 My immediate family I've got a brother of mine who now works in 705 00:36:35,037 --> 00:36:37,063 the business and I'm so proud of him. 706 00:36:37,063 --> 00:36:40,539 I was watching him mature in this business. 707 00:36:40,539 --> 00:36:44,615 He moved out here from the West Coast to join our team and I 708 00:36:44,655 --> 00:36:46,981 made him start at the very bottom. 709 00:36:46,981 --> 00:36:52,496 I made him work night shift for a year and now he is one of our 710 00:36:52,496 --> 00:36:55,001 most productive account managers, working some of our 711 00:36:55,523 --> 00:37:00,197 most important accounts at a really high level. 712 00:37:00,197 --> 00:37:01,059 I'm really proud of him. 713 00:37:01,059 --> 00:37:03,605 I love his guidance and his support. 714 00:37:03,965 --> 00:37:06,838 My partners I want to thank all of them as well. 715 00:37:06,838 --> 00:37:09,083 Obviously, my parents. 716 00:37:09,083 --> 00:37:13,157 I oftentimes say I had the best of both worlds. 717 00:37:13,157 --> 00:37:14,880 My parents got divorced really young. 718 00:37:14,880 --> 00:37:16,262 My dad was really successful. 719 00:37:16,262 --> 00:37:19,226 My mom worked three jobs to keep the lights on, so I 720 00:37:19,367 --> 00:37:23,900 understood what it looked like to struggle and so having an 721 00:37:23,981 --> 00:37:27,246 understanding of what a struggling lifestyle looked like 722 00:37:27,246 --> 00:37:32,541 versus what a very well put together lifestyle looked like, 723 00:37:33,483 --> 00:37:35,306 that was good for me to see at a young age. 724 00:37:35,306 --> 00:37:36,327 So I love my parents. 725 00:37:43,335 --> 00:37:44,717 There are so many people that I can thank A lot of good mentors 726 00:37:44,737 --> 00:37:46,983 throughout the way right, and I could name drop probably a dozen 727 00:37:46,983 --> 00:37:49,208 plus people that I've taken great advice from and still 728 00:37:49,268 --> 00:37:50,416 remain in contact with. 729 00:37:50,416 --> 00:37:53,958 But I'm just blessed, man. 730 00:37:53,958 --> 00:37:59,224 I'm blessed that I get to wake up every morning and I get to, 731 00:37:59,885 --> 00:38:02,626 you know, come to either the brokerage office or the terminal 732 00:38:02,626 --> 00:38:05,150 and the warehouse, and I get to interact with people who 733 00:38:05,289 --> 00:38:07,432 genuinely enjoy being at their job. 734 00:38:07,432 --> 00:38:19,237 Logistics as a whole, among all three verticals. 735 00:38:19,237 --> 00:38:20,481 We are in the business of building transportation 736 00:38:20,501 --> 00:38:21,885 professionals, not just offering employment, and I think that 737 00:38:21,905 --> 00:38:26,061 there's a big difference in the marketplace and I use that as a 738 00:38:26,181 --> 00:38:27,384 sales and recruiting tool. 739 00:38:27,543 --> 00:38:31,918 I just hired a guy out of Chicago. 740 00:38:31,918 --> 00:38:35,967 He's been with us for about two and a half months and he told 741 00:38:36,007 --> 00:38:37,398 me on the phone the other day he goes. 742 00:38:37,398 --> 00:38:40,974 You know I was talking to my wife and you know we were 743 00:38:41,014 --> 00:38:44,423 talking about the honeymoon phase and like I'm starting to 744 00:38:44,463 --> 00:38:46,268 believe that this isn't like a honeymoon. 745 00:38:46,268 --> 00:38:48,489 I'm starting to believe that, like maybe this is the way you 746 00:38:48,509 --> 00:38:49,474 guys just do business. 747 00:38:49,474 --> 00:38:53,581 And I said I told you this is how we do things and, um, it 748 00:38:53,621 --> 00:38:58,050 just warmed my heart that, you know he was comfortable enough 749 00:38:58,090 --> 00:39:00,554 to know like, hey, this is a pretty good place for me to be 750 00:39:00,594 --> 00:39:02,862 in my career and I want everybody to feel that way here. 751 00:39:03,796 --> 00:39:05,880 Speaker 1: Well, I have no doubt , if you keep doing what you're 752 00:39:05,900 --> 00:39:10,737 going, what you are doing, that will continue, and I hope to see 753 00:39:10,737 --> 00:39:13,566 you next August back in Nashville with the Bitfreighter 754 00:39:13,586 --> 00:39:13,746 team. 755 00:39:13,746 --> 00:39:16,623 I hope my team beats your team in golf. 756 00:39:16,623 --> 00:39:20,403 Maybe I'd love to go fishing with you up here in Minnesota. 757 00:39:20,403 --> 00:39:24,119 We can get some musky in October perhaps, and it'd be 758 00:39:24,139 --> 00:39:26,199 good to just spend some time together, break some bread and 759 00:39:26,219 --> 00:39:26,721 keep chatting. 760 00:39:26,721 --> 00:39:29,777 But, chris, of course we're all rooting for you and we wish you 761 00:39:29,777 --> 00:39:30,521 nothing but the best. 762 00:39:31,275 --> 00:39:32,441 Speaker 2: I appreciate you having me on. 763 00:39:32,441 --> 00:39:36,085 I'm going to definitely take you up on the fishing and the 764 00:39:36,105 --> 00:39:37,476 golf next year too Should be fun . 765 00:39:38,219 --> 00:39:38,500 Speaker 1: Right on. 766 00:39:38,500 --> 00:39:39,202 Take care, my friend. 767 00:39:39,523 --> 00:39:39,925 Speaker 2: Thanks Nate. 768 00:39:42,536 --> 00:39:44,541 Speaker 1: Thanks for listening to another episode of the 769 00:39:44,581 --> 00:39:47,396 Bootstrapper's Guide to Logistics, and a special thank 770 00:39:47,416 --> 00:39:50,204 you to our sponsors and the team behind the scenes who make it 771 00:39:50,244 --> 00:39:50,827 all possible. 772 00:39:50,827 --> 00:39:54,304 Be sure to like, follow or subscribe to the podcast to get 773 00:39:54,324 --> 00:39:55,126 the latest updates. 774 00:39:55,126 --> 00:39:58,161 To learn more about the show and connect with the growing 775 00:39:58,221 --> 00:40:01,288 community of entrepreneurs, visit logisticsfounderscom. 776 00:40:01,288 --> 00:40:05,423 And, of course, thank you to all the founders who trust us to 777 00:40:05,423 --> 00:40:06,166 share their stories.